Labels

[Diane Taylor]

I've never been one for having labels attached to us such as TG, TV, Transvestite or whatever. Why then do some of us put the "GG" label on women? I welcome your opinions on this.

[Patience]

I thought it was shorthand for "girl-girls" to differentiate them from girls like us.

[GracieRose]

Genetic Girls

[Patience]

Yeah, that.

[Robertacd]

It's ultimately what's behind the label.

GG = Genetic Girl
GM = Genetic Man

[Hell on Heels]

Hell-o Diane,
The simple fact that you don’t understand why we use labels surely doesn’t mean you don’t understand the labels.
I agree the labels are kinda rediculous. Basically, GG is a gender clarification, and yes...some here might have gender issues, but labels do have relavance in some conversations.
Much Love,
Kristyn

[Ineke Vashon]

I find labels often confusing. As to GM for instance - are we talking about a Genetic Man or General Motors?:eek:

Ineke

[AllieSF]

Seems logical to me. Since most of our members here are MtF CD's to full time women, what do we call a member here a cis-woman (actual technical dictionary word), "real" woman? Then what to we call a Transsexual woman? It was created to help clarify and simplify communication here and everywhere else as a shortcut. Kinda like OMG - Oh My God, and LOL - Laugh Out Loud, and finally my favorite, WTF - Why the Face? Most of us use those in our daily text messages and Tweets and stuff. It is only confusing for a short time if you make an effort.

[colleen ps]

Hmmm. Labels? Who needs em. I like being GM though, Genetically Modified LOL.

[Vicky_Scot]

Society (whatever that is) needs to label or pigeon hole people otherwise they have no one to aim their anger at or justify their ridicule towards certain groups.

People are so caught up with taking sides these days that they feel they need to label everything.

The real label we should all have and the only one is being a human being and all the different aspects that brings.

x x x

[Cheryl T]

Labels, unfortunately, are a fact of existence. Since language was created labels have been used necessarily.
Without them we could not identify anything.
Car. Bank. Pencil.
How we use the labels is the issue. Do we use them for identification, humiliation, clarification?
Personally I don't like labels, especially in our world. There are too many, they are too confusing and they really don't help us. TV, TG, TS, CD, Cis, Poly (wanna cracker?? :) ).

Just be careful how we use them among ourselves. Others will take care of using them against us.

[Laura912]

Was corresponding with a friend here about transgender issues and just started using the words genetic females and non-genetic females to explain a point. One could argue that a non-genetic female is actually a genetic female because the hard wiring that occurs to drive the transition is determined by DNA. Then we could have a genetic non-genetic female. Add in the abbreviations...actually beating my head against a brick wall sounds easier if the wall is not damaged.

[CONSUELO]

They are just descriptions. Sometimes they are accurate such as when you are called a woman as that means you have two X chromosomes. Then they are just partial descriptions of you such as transvestite. Yes indeed I am a transvestite but I am also so much more than a transvetite. So if someone looks as me and sees Transvestite and then reaches into their internal dictionary for their understanding of what that means, they are missing a huge part of what I am.

Unfortunately the labels as you call them come with a variety of pre-conceived notions that determine how people look on you and treat you. Those who know a transvestite and count one as a friend will have a completely different notion than someone who got their understanding from a joke or a one-sided representation of a transvestite.

Sadly we live in a world of labels and no amount of kicking back is going to change things quickly. However we can all do our bit. Take Teresa who has almost created a diary here of her coming out and living full time as a transvestite. In her interactions with the people she meets, she is contributing to a positive image of transvestites. So when someone like the many SA's she runs into thinks of a transvestite, what comes to mind is a pleasant, polite member of society.

[Micki_Finn]

Short explanation: Trans women are women also. However, their experience may be different than those who were born with all the requisite parts. “Labels” aren’t always bad. Sometimes they’re necessary for clarity of communication.

[ClosetED]

labels carry emotional baggage with them - it is better to be accurate, but that is often very long winded.
a person born with a Y chromosome [this includes the XXY Klinefelter people] who wears clothes that in their cultural environment are worn by people with only X chromosomes [this includes Turner syndrome who are XO].
or you could say male crossdresser.

Using GG is a way to identify those people born with just X chromosomes. Those with 5 alpha reductase deficiency are not GG - they look female until puberty and then they start to be able to make testosterone, but they are XY.
How do you refer to the FtM people on the site? When are they GG and when Transmen? The most accurate is to describe their actions and exacting state, but hard to do that and be readable.
Hugs, Ellen

[KatrinaK]

Labels, unfortunately, are a fact of existence. Since language was created labels have been used necessarily.
Without them we could not identify anything.
Car. Bank. Pencil.
How we use the labels is the issue. Do we use them for identification, humiliation, clarification?
Personally I don't like labels, especially in our world. There are too many, they are too confusing and they really don't help us. TV, TG, TS, CD, Cis, Poly (wanna cracker?? :) ).

Just be careful how we use them among ourselves. Others will take care of using them against us.

I couldn’t agree more. Every time I see a thread about “labels” I cringe because the question is loaded. These are words that convey specific meaning linguistically. I also find they help us understand where we fit in through better understanding the collective experience of those who came before us.

I will say (and I know how popular my comments on THIS subject usually are) that those who are most resistant to “labels” tend to identify as “hobby CDs” who believe they have absolutely no “gender issues.” I will avoid elaborating on that thought today.

[Beverley Sims]

I think the GG label is good as it denotes knowledge about a particular situation when replying to a thread.

I for one could never speak with authority about bearing children and child birth.

No I may be a lot of things but I do not profess to being a GG. :-)

[Jenny22]

I use GG to distinguish an XX chromosome person from any XY chromosome person who says, " I am a woman."

[GeorgeA]

I actually like GG label as it informs that the poster is an actual woman and not a woman impersonators, or like I, a MIAD.
Some expressions and ideas can be seen in a different light depending on the person professing them.

[Diane Taylor]

I couldn’t agree more. Every time I see a thread about “labels” I cringe because the question is loaded. These are words that convey specific meaning linguistically. I also find they help us understand where we fit in through better understanding the collective experience of those who came before us.

I will say (and I know how popular my comments on THIS subject usually are) that those who are most resistant to “labels” tend to identify as “hobby CDs” who believe they have absolutely no “gender issues.” I will avoid elaborating on that thought today.
So if a woman was resistant to being labeled a "GG" that would make her a "hobby" something or other?

[Georgia K]

Great I've always wanted to know what GG stood for

[Lydianne]

@Georgia:

Here's a whole list of abbreviations and *ahem!* labels :whistling: that you can learn without having to wait for a bust up for ;).

https://www.crossdressers.com/forums/showthread.php?162497-Some-Common-Trans-Related-Definitions-and-Abbreviations&p=2636716&viewfull=1#post2636716

- Lydianne.

[Dontknowy]

I also am not a fan of labels. I'm new to dressing, have ALWAYS. had the desire, but never said anything or did anything about it until October. My wife is amazingly supportive shops for me, helps pic cloths to wear etc. I've only "dreased" once back in October, but have under dressed a few times. My wife asks multiple times a week why I dont dress, and doesnt understand my trepidation, as well as guilt, disgust, and every other emotion associated that I'm feeling, and then slapping a label on dressing, like trans or what ever just adds extra stress and angst making it harder for me to just relax, do it, and enjoy it, because although sexuality, behavior, etc has become so much more accepted, for me, giving it what has been percieved as a "taboo" title for so long, it makes me feel more abnormal, unusual, disgraceful, and most of all confused. I understand the GG title on these forums and appreciate it, because it helps me see a genetic womans prospective, however, why cant we just be crossdressers, which we are, unless someone IS trans, let us have a less invasive name, but not a title or label. I have 2 sons that are bisexual, they arent my bisexual sons, they are just my sons. Maybe as a group it would behoove us to take a step back and look at how we label ourselves as well.

[Krisi]

A world without labels:

You've got a pantry full of cans with no labels. You're hungry but you have no idea what's in the cans. Beans or peaches? Soup or dog food? Well, that's ridiculous. Labels are a necessary part of life.


The assumption here is that the members are male crossdressers. Knowing that a comment is coming from an actual woman can be important and it certainly clears up any confusion we might have when the poster mentions "my husband".

[Periwinkle]

Personally, I wish I could get through life with minimal labels. However, I do understand that many people find comfort in labels, and that's fine! I just don't like to overcomplicate things. As far as everyone needs to know, I'm just a guy who loves fashion in a wonderful, committed relationship with another guy. And I just treat those things as normal parts of my life.

[Diane Taylor]

A world without labels:

You've got a pantry full of cans with no labels. You're hungry but you have no idea what's in the cans. Beans or peaches? Soup or dog food? Well, that's ridiculous. Labels are a necessary part of life.


The assumption here is that the members are male crossdressers. Knowing that a comment is coming from an actual woman can be important and it certainly clears up any confusion we might have when the poster mentions "my husband". We're not talking about canned peaches here. Yes, cans need to be labeled....people do not.

[Robertacd]

The part everyone seems to be missing is, if it weren't for all these labels, we would not even need GG or GM.

GG and GM are the anti-labels.

You label me, I'll label you...
So I dub thee unforgiven...

BTW: Krisi: What about jars? :P
GG and GM are the clear glass jars in your pantry, you can put any labels you want on them and still know the exact physical contents.

[sometimes_miss]

I use GG to distinguish an XX chromosome person from any XY chromosome person who says, " I am a woman."
^this. We really want the input here from females who have been living as females all their lives, as opposed to those of us who have grown up male with male genitalia and at some point felt they were female. If everyone here is identified as female, we won't know who is what.
While I understand those males who desperately need to feel identified as female, at the moment there simply is no other way to know who we're discussing things with; a MTF person simply does not have all the knowledge and experience of a female's life that someone born as a physical female and who grew up as one, does.
This is related to the very same problem on the dateacrossdresser website. Everyone identifies as female. So there's no way for a straight crossdresser to search for those who currently have, and always have had, female genitalia.

[Diane Taylor]

^this. We really want the input here from females who have been living as females all their lives, as opposed to those of us who have grown up male with male genitalia and at some point felt they were female. If everyone here is identified as female, we won't know who is what.
While I understand those males who desperately need to feel identified as female, at the moment there simply is no other way to know who we're discussing things with; a MTF person simply does not have all the knowledge and experience of a female's life that someone born as a physical female and who grew up as one, does.
This is related to the very same problem on the dateacrossdresser website. Everyone identifies as female. So there's no way for a straight crossdresser to search for those who currently have, and always have had, female genitalia.

Regarding your comment about input from females who have lived as females all their lives...…….back when I was in a couple of support groups there were many spouses and girlfriends who attended the meetings. They were all aware of the term "GG". A poll was taken by show of hands and it was unanimous in both clubs that the FEMALES did NOT like to be referred to as a "GG".

[char GG]

by Diane Taylor

A poll was taken by show of hands and it was unanimous in both clubs that the FEMALES did NOT like to be referred to as a "GG".

Personally, I don't mind being referred to as a GG. What I don't like is being referred to as a muggle, lol!

[Robertacd]

it was unanimous in both clubs that the FEMALES did NOT like to be referred to as a "GG".

I would be very interested in knowing what theas GG's (for lack of a better term) prefer to be called, that differentiates them from someone born male that is now living as a woman.

Char_GG: I agree muggle is often used as a derogatory term in many groups towards people outside the group.

[Diane Taylor]

I would be very interested in knowing what theas GG's (for lack of a better term) prefer to be called, that differentiates them from someone born male that is now living as a woman.

Char_GG: I agree muggle is often used as a derogatory term in many groups towards people outside the group.


by Diane Taylor


Personally, I don't mind being referred to as a GG. What I don't like is being referred to as a muggle, lol!If that works for you....that's great but not everyone shares your opinion. The women in the groups quite simply wanted to be referred to as a woman. It's not their concern what those born male now living as a "female" call themselves or want to be called by others.

[AllieSF]

Char, I agree with you 100%.

PS: Diane, you make a good point. However, the acronym GG was created to clarify and simplify communication on sites like this and within groups of people where making that differentiation and simplification of that differentiation helps overall communication. I and a lot of GG's outside of this subset of humanity had and have not ever heard of GG. Why? It is very simple since they do not need to use it. It was not created for communication everyone else. It is understandable that the general population of women once introduced to the term may, or may not like it.

Many professions, sub-groups use words and abbreviations and acronyms for themselves and sometimes used to refer to others outside of their group that most of the general population do not use nor even know about. If someone outside the group learns of the term the group uses for them they may, or may not, like it either whether the meaning of the new term is not derogatory.

And finally, based on your informal small sized survey, your conclusions only represent the opinions of that small group and may, or may not, be indicative of the larger group as a whole. So, I would not say that your findings/opinion truly represents everyone.

[Krisi]

We're not talking about canned peaches here. Yes, cans need to be labeled....people do not.

Our government (USA) takes great pains to not only label people (White, black, Hispanic, male, female, etc.) but to compile statistics on the different groups. Education, health, wealth, employment, incarceration, etc.

You will not avoid labels regardless of how you feel about them. They are part of out language and part of our culture.

[Lydianne]

I can't remember having ever used 'muggles' other than when referring to a post where somebody else has ( like in this one ). I wasn't sure how derogatory it is, so I tried to avoid it. I like 'general public' when I'm referring to non-community. I have used 'Joe Cool', though.

Nevertheless, despite being unsure of the usage, I would be very shocked if a supportive SO is included in a group of people referred to as 'muggles', even if she is physically within the group. I don't know that for sure, but I would be shocked.

- Lydianne.

[CynthiaD]

Labels like GG are used to simplify communication. The label GG is instantly understood, saving you the trouble of giving a ten-word explanation. There are no hidden sinister implications.

[rhonda]

Everyone needs to be called something , guess you get called by what you do , seems like everyone and or almost everyone , needs a shortcut when spelling , hence letters for words , then some people cant spell, some days I can wear out a spell checker , then on the other hand it could be a code to confuse folks 😊 ,aint life grand