Psychologically integrated male role models

[Cathy Anderson]

I've added a new page to my website--examples of men whom I think display an admirable combination of masculine AND feminine traits.

Take a look, and feel free to make any other "nominations" here :)

http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/cathytg/models.htm

Cheers,

Cathy

p.s. Dial-up users--sorry about the long load time. Please be patient. I'll see if I can fix that.

[Marla S]

Though I'm not convinced that a suitable role-model would make CDing dispensable I'd add three musicians.

1.) David Bowie
2.) Robert Smith (The Cure)
3.) Martin Lee Gore (Depeche Mode)

[DawnLabelle]

How about Eddie Izzard?. Successful as a CD and as a man, seemingly perfectly comfortable in both roles, and even tries to educate the masses about crossdressing on all (that I've seen anyway) of his stand up shows.

Dawn

[TGMarla]

The way I heard the story of Teiresias, from Ovid's Metamorphosis, was that Zeus and Athena had an argument as to whether women or men enjoyed sex more. Zeus charged that women like sex more, but Athena disagreed, claiming that men liked sex more. So Zeus changed Teiresias into a woman for ten years. Upon his return, he admitted to Zeus that women liked sex more. Athena became enraged, and blinded Teiresias. Zeus took pity on him, and made him a seer, so that his blindness would not be debilitating.

Anyway, it's a great fable.

[Cathy Anderson]

You're cracking me up :cheeky:

Eddie Izzard is not exactly what I had in mind--but I *did* ask for your suggestions, so by all means keep 'em coming.

(So, if you had a son or whatever--would you want him to grow up like Eddie Izzard??)

But I see your point--that he can move in or out of a CD persona easily

Eddie
http://www.born-today.com/Today/pix/izzard_eddie.jpg

Cathy

[Julie Avery]

Cathy, no new nominations here, but you made a great pick with Leonard Bernstein, imho. You mention his Berlin Wall Beethoven performance. He'd be worthy even just for his West Side Story songs, absolute gems every one of them.

They seem "feminine" to me, I think of "sad, pretty love songs" as a whole that way...I think they're a way for many men, even very macho ones, to "get in touch with their femme side" in the sense of feelings of tenderness as distinct from libidinal feelings toward a loved one.

[Rikkicn]

It would be interesting to know how many of those men are gay or bi-sexual. I know one is and maybe others too.

[DawnLabelle]

(So, if you had a son or whatever--would you want him to grow up like Eddie Izzard??)
Cathy

LOL, well, if I had a son and he wanted to be Eddie Izzard #2, I'd like to think that I would support his decision. Then again, when I have kids I'll want to support any decision that they make for their adult lives (i.e., career wise), I'll just make sure to encourage them and give it their all.

Would I *want* him to become Eddie #2?, probably not simply because I realize what a tough life it would be and well, you never want to see those you love go through hardships like that. I can only imagine how tough it must have been for Eddie starting out in the tranny-stand-up business..... hrm..... I wonder if he has an autobiography, or biography written on his life.

Dawn

[Cathy Anderson]

It would be interesting to know how many of those men are gay or bi-sexual. I know one is and maybe others too.
I wouldn't be surprised. I take a strictly "don't ask, don't tell" attitude. ;)

Cathy

[Wenda]

Interesting post. I have no nominations at this point, partly because i dont ascribe to the women are softer, nicer, sweeter theory. One of my Dads sisters welded aluminum in an airplane plant during WWII. She also raised 5 of my cousins. My mom drove tractors and trucks and broke horses, her sisters were equally robust, but NEVER, for one moment, did I question their gender orientation. In my world, they were just tough hard-working, no BS women who could cook, sew or drive a tractor.
On the other side, my best friend all through school (12 years) was a bit fragile, and good at cooking. His father survived in a Canadian tank (inferior to German technology at the time) all the way up Italy, then was the sole survivor of a tank crew who burned to death in Holland. In the macho world, I would think he rightfully earned the right to be considered macho. He never criticized my friend for his somewhat feminine orientation, although he was concerned that, if my friend did not develop muscles as a teen, he would not be healthy in his old age.
I need to contemplate this for some time. Sorry to see the dark side. Thanks for the stimulating idea.

[Julie Avery]

I find Cathy's posts thought-provoking, and I've puzzled over this for a while and I nominate Donovan.

[Marlena Dahlstrom]

Eddie Izzard is not exactly what I had in mind--but I *did* ask for your suggestions, so by all means keep 'em coming.
...
But I see your point--that he can move in or out of a CD persona easily

Also the fact that he's f*ck-all smart -- anyone who learns French and German specifically to do stand-up in those languages (comedy in German :eek:) gets a vote in my book. Plus he's an ardent European Unionist and has put his money where his mouth is along those lines. (Regardless of whether you're pro- or anti-EU, I think you can respect someone who stands up for his convictions.) And of course the sense-of-humor thing that women like in men.

[Cathy Anderson]

Thought of another one: Superman/Clark Kent. Because Superman doesn't walk around macho all the time. He knows he's Superman and doesn't need to prove anything. He's so secure that he presents to the world as "mild mannered" Clark Kent.

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/1/1a/Superman_296.jpg/200px-Superman_296.jpg

Cathy

[Marla S]

Hm, Superman ?
Isn’t he the prototype of a crossdresser ?
Just a regular male while in drab without attracting attention, but needs to “cross-dress” to get his superpower and tries to hide his transformation from the public. He passes as Superhero and fears to be read as his alter ego Clark Kent.
He even has a closet to hide and change the clothing.

[Casey Morgan]

I'll nominate Tom Selleck. "Three Men And A Baby" is obvious, but don't forget "Quigley Down Under" and "Mr. Baseball". At one point in "Quigley Down Under" Cora tells him that when her husband put her on the boat to go to Australia, he never looked back. That's how she knew he didn't love her anymore. When Quigley goes on that trip (3 days?) to get supplies, he starts riding away, stops, and looks at her for a moment. John Wayne would have just told her he would be back and ridden off. Quigley remembered what she said and understood how much that simple gesture meant to her.

[Cathy Anderson]

I'll nominate Tom Selleck. "Three Men And A Baby" is obvious, but don't forget "Quigley Down Under" and "Mr. Baseball"....
Thanks--Tom Selleck is an excellent choice!

Here's another story about Tom Selleck: He stayed with the Magnum PI series several seasons longer than was probably good for his career. He could have made a lot more movies if he left earlier--and if so he might be bigger than say Harrison Ford (BTW Selleck was initially considered for the Indiana Jones role, but that's another story). Anyway, Selleck's motive was to take care of the cast and crew of Magnum. He didn't want to put them out of work. Unselfish guy!

Cathy

[Cathy Anderson]

Regardless of whether you're pro- or anti-EU, I think you can respect someone who stands up for his convictions.)
Well, as a brief aside, you really made me think with this one :)

Basically I think it depends on (1) ones motivation and (2) how one expresses their convictions.

And when Izzy says stuff like:


"Our main energy it seems since Alexander the Great up to World War II has been put into murdering each other. We are the best in the world at murdering. If you need murderers come to Europe."
I have to wonder.

I know this is taken out of context, but it's scarcely a diplomatic thing to say in any case.

Meanwhile there are perhaps some very intelligent political scientists with better things to say whom we never hear about.

Cathy

[HaleyPink2000]

It's like when people had first seen Television. Then on TV they did see everyone had a car, garage and a house with shutters. With also a nice porch with a swing. The Lady of the house standing there waving at the kids and serving Her Husband lemonade.

Ok then all the women wanted what they did see on television. What they had was not good enough. The days of outside plumbing was gone. The days of inside plumbing was here. No more water closets.

Ok today! Like you have ample picks of. Men on Television and the women want men like that. The evening news anchor or the Rambo guy. Maybe even like you say Super Man. My Ex loved the Super Man guy from the first movie, what's his name , Chris something????

I'm not like Chris Something! I'm just a slob that has worked all their life trying to pay my kids way and my wife's. I've worked 3 jobs and slept 4 hours and back at it for years just to have the Wife tell me she wants the Chris something's " Super Man" and divorce me.

So It's like this , maybe we are better off without Television and the rag mags. For our Wives to compare us to some image that is not real.

[Cathy Anderson]

I thought of another one -- Jackie Chan!

He's got a really good sense of his body (you can tell this is something about women I really respect/admire etc.), plus a really sense of humor.

In general I think a many martial artists have a lot of "anima" (chi?),
[except for Chuck Norris :cheeky: and Stephen Segal :cheeky: :cheeky:]
But Jackie's got the best attitude IMO.

Cathy

[sherri]

Also the fact that he's f*ck-all smart ... And of course the sense-of-humor thing that women like in men.

I agree wholeheartedly.

[kathy gg]

Cathy, first off good work on your webpage. I thought you choose some very good people.

Now nominations....hmm well I am prety sure I have read that Eddie Izzard is not into being a tg poster boy for the movement. But I still nominate him ....purely for sexual reason! :drooling:

I have one though....Andre Agassi. He is a very good husband and father, devoted to causes like AIDS and helping under privlidged children get involved in tennis. Is defidntly not a homo-phobe as he often enlists Eltons Johns help as well. He is also been known to shave his chest and leg hair when he was trying to get a woman who suppoably did not like body hair! No, not me! haha! he also is not one to get angry on the court like say...John macho-Mcenroe. And he also went agaisnt wimbletons tennis dress code and refused to play there for a long time because he did not like their rules. I do like a rule breaker. Anyway, I am sure there is unplesant stuff, but I always have found him soft spoken and polite in interviews and nothing but classy and down to earth. Masculine but also kind and sweet. Always will be one of my tennis heros. :D :cheer:

[Joy Carter]

Cathy you did a fine job here and I'd like to put a little more information into your post if you don't mind. George Clooney is a Fashist Liberal and has not the gut to keep his word. He stated that he was leaving the country if "W" had won the first election he's still here. Please someone show that nimcompoop the door. Thank you may peace and love follows all who visit this forum.0.02

[Teresa Amina]

Fashist Liberal

Now THAT is a concept! And I thought being a guy who loved to dress up as a woman was a contradiction:D

[Cathy Anderson]

Joy,

Thanks for your reply. Yeah, I've heard some questionable things about George Clooney's political statements, etc., and even considered not incuding him for that reason.

But on balance, I decided other factors outweighed that.

Concerning where he lives--I heard he has a villa in Italy and spends a lot of his time there when he's not making movies.

Cathy