Got my picture taken today

[hosekid]

I dont usually care if people take my picture because public photography is legal and if I go out then I know people may snap a photo. BUT, I was walking into the store today and had walked about 50 feet down the parking lot so this guy in a car had plenty of time to get his phone out and take a picture. He stopped driving and hung his phone out the window to do it and it was OBVIOUS what he was doing. As luck would have it, I just happened to have my phone in my hand and at the same time i seen him taking pictures, i noticed i had hit my camera icon and turned it on, so instead of going right and into the store, I made a sharp left and stepped right up to his window and snapped a few photos of him! He did NOT like this and quickly rolled up his window and sped off nearly running over other pedestrians. I laughed and laughed at how he was obviously embarrassed by his behavior and knowing he'd been caught. I believe that this is going to be my new response when people photograph me without my permission. Ill just get a few snapshots of them too.

And before anyone starts saying that its a good way to start a fight, I say so what. Why should I let people be rude to me because of the clothes I am wearing. Besides fighting a crossdresser is a lose lose situation for most men. If they win the fight, so what, people will say you beat up a "sissy" but if they lose the fight then they are the guy that got their arse kicked by a man in high heels. LOL

[Thelise]

Nice work sweetie. Bet you gave his fantasy a little unexpected extra spice!

[alwayshave]

Turning something back on someone is a great response in my book.

[Crissy 107]

I think what you did was a good response to this jerk but any of us should do so with a certain amount of caution. Just be aware of the situation you are in/facing.

[Tracii G]

You did fine in that situation now he is worried you might post his pic all over social media.
I had a guy grab my shoulder as I walked out of a store as he was calling me names and I socked him hard grabbed his wrist and took him to the ground.
I told this story here a while back.

[Amy Lynn3]

hosekid: I think you did well in confronting this a&88^. A thought crossed my mind and wondered if this guy had an interest in you or thought you were a guy in a dress. Either way... good on you girl. That is the way I approach things when I'm out and about.

TraciiG. You get a ...you go girl for decking the guy. Words are one thing in my book, but putting hands on me is a no, no.

[Micki_Finn]

I’ll warn you that this won’t work with everybody.

[Stephanie47]

It may not work with everyone.....nothing ever does. However, I think your approach was appropriate. You could always upload his picture to a local site alerting people to John's who pickup hookers. Just kidding??? Anyway I would also recommend if this occurs to anyone try to take a picture of his license plate. At least in my state a person can go down to Department of Motor Vehicles and get the registered owner's name and address.

[Thelise]

Important point Micki, but hk's instincts were spot on. This guy now has himself to confront. Doubt there'll be much soul searching, but there's now a worm in his head!

[Robertacd]

I have been thinking the same thing. With Android phones you can even set them up so you can just shake your phone to launch the camera app.

That way you can grab it quickly out of your purse and shake it and it is ready.

[Jean 103]

I have had the picture taken a few times that I know of.

At the local dirt track, I'm there with friends supporting my friends husband. The two of us are walking back form the pits, this guy asks to take my picture. I said yes , My friend didn't like it.

This was at the bar, a guy asks to take my picture. I'm not feeling it, bad hair day. I say no and he takes it anyway. I start crying. My friends want to know what happened. I told them, well they lit into the guy. The bouncer asked me if he should throw the guy out. I said no, he came over and apologised.

Someone took pictures of me and sent them to the owner of the company I work for trying to get fired. It didn't work. I'm out, besides I grew up with these people.

[Tracy Irving]

It's great that he got a taste of his own medicine.

Stephanie's recommendation that you also photograph his license plate makes sense. It might help him to think about the can of worms he opened.

[Tracii G]

Yeah Amy I draw the line at strangers putting their hands on me.
The policeman that hauled him off said he was pretty embarrassed a "homo" laid him out with one punch and broke/sprained his wrist.
I just reacted is what I told the policeman and said I totally understand.

[docrobbysherry]

I'm not a TS. So, when I go out dressed it's with the intention of BEING photographed!:battingeyelashes:
Usually, just by me. But, occasionally Muggles will want a photo of or with me. I'm flattered!:)

Would I want someone taking pics of me at Walmart? No! But, that's only one reason I rarely go to vanilla venues dressed. I don't enjoy stress. And, no one wants pics of a homely old man!:D

I think hose kid handled it quite well!:thumbsup:

[Teresa]

Hosekid ,
First of all taking pictures of strangers in public isn't legal without their permission , that's infringing their human rights .

Did you do the right thing ? Well maybe but he still had the pictures to do as he wished with , which is the basic issue for any TG person out in public . Getting into a physical confrontation isn't a good idea the outcome may be more serious than you suggest , sadly some people don't always live to tell the tale !

OK some suggest you can also do what you wish with his pictures but outing him won't have the same impact as him outing you if you're still not totally out to everyone .

[Tracy Irving]

Hosekid,
As far as I know, and without a law or signage to the contrary, taking a picture in public is legal. If a stranger ends up on that image, oh well.

Correct me if I am wrong but someone can be standing on a public street and take a picture of a stranger through an open window in the living room of their private resistance without consequences.

Just don't publish the pictures.

[Tracii G]

There is no way they can "police" someone taking pictures in public Teresa.
Its totally legal to take pics of anyone or anything except maybe a military installation.
I wouldn't worry about that guy because if he posts pics you can out him just as a CD admirer.

[LydiaL]

A Model / Media Release form should (must?) be signed if your photograph is intended to be published by the photographer. Applies for someone that is easily recognized in the photo; folks in the back-ground or just passing by not so.

Such a legal gray area now with the ease of posting photos on the Internet.

[Crissy 107]

At some point a person taking your picture without permission is harassing you and that person could be charged for that.

[AllieSF]

As Tracii said above Teresa, here in the USA if you are out in the public other people can take your picture. As a courtesy, many news programs ask your permission before taking your pictures up close. However, when doing street interviews they never stop filming when people walk behind the person being interviewed unless they stop there and start interfering with the interview. As far as I know, people cannot take your picture and use it for commercial reason without your permission.

[Stephanie47]

In Washington State there is no expectation of privacy in public. You can take all the pictures you want. It is illegal to record someone's voice...two party consent state...unless the circumstances suggest the person has waived privacy. If you get on a soap box and preach there is no privacy. There are some narrow exceptions. Also, you cannot use someone's image for personal gain without permission.

[Robertacd]

Steph is right, in Washington state up to only like 5 years ago it was perfectly legal to take "up skirt" photos of GG's in public as there is no expectation of privacy in a public place.

They actually had to make a special law just to outlaw "up skirt" photos.

Every year they have an contest/exhibition of Gingerbread houses around Christmas here. A few years ago a registered sex offender was seen taking pictures of children during this exhibition, and that caused a big ruckus. Even though he was a registered pedophile there was nothing anyone could do to legally stop him from taking pictures of children in a public place at a public event.

[Shelly Preston]

I was once being approached by a film crew as I went to lay flowers at the site of a murder.

I just shook my head to indicate I did not want to be interview and they stop filming immediately.

Which I took to mean they would not be using the footage especially under the circumstances.

I don't believe the taking pictures is illegal. What you do with them after that might be.

[Stephanie47]

To add to Roberta at #22 there was another instance of a different creep/offender taking pictures of young kids playing organized baseball. Sickening.

[abbiedrake]

Teresa, I'm a little surprised at your claim, you being a photographer and all.
Taking pics without permission is NOT illegal on either side of the Atlantic.
Even photographs for publication are largely untouched. Photos on private property are, naturally, another thing but hosekid was well within her rights as was the creep.

Personally I say good for you, OP. Even if you do nothing with the pictures you took it's a hood way to cause a pause in the creep's thinking. He might, possibly, reflect on him not liking the worries he's going to have about what you may do with your snaps. Maybe. We can hope.
Well played, in any case.

[Micki_Finn]

A Model / Media Release form should (must?) be signed if your photograph is intended to be published by the photographer. Applies for someone that is easily recognized in the photo; folks in the back-ground or just passing by not so.

Such a legal gray area now with the ease of posting photos on the Internet.

Not THAT grey. Releases basically only apply to commercial photography. If they aren’t selling the image they’re perfectly fine. Also, if the person is in public there is absolutely no protection. This is why paparazzi are able to exist.

[Tracii G]

You go out in public you will be photographed by someone or a security camera out on the street or in a building.
Thats just the reality of it get used to it.

[Jodie_Lynn]

A good response to a RL troll, although I'd advise against getting within arms reach of the offender.

Taking pictures in public spaces, as has been stated is NOT illegal. Think about the times any of have gone on vacation and snapped a pic of our loved ones, or local landmarks. Did anyone here chase after all the people caught in your pic and ask permission? No, I didn't think so.

I've had my image captured, in public venues, and only, very occasionally, has the picture taker asked if it was ok. Usually, only when someone wanted to take a pic with me.

[Tracy Irving]

I recently visited some theme parks in Orlando. Probably (accidentally) ruined a few hundred strangers photographs while there. Nobody approached me about it and I never felt that my human rights were infringed upon.

[hosekid]

I could see that this guy was definitely taking my pic and I dont care about that, he was just being really weird about it. I would never be one of those people who get upset at being photographed in public, but his running away when I turned the tables tells me that he was just being rude. If he would have asked, I would have let him get a much better picture.

[docrobbysherry]

Interestingly, cd.com does not allowed u to post pictures without permission of every, recognizable person in the photo!:straightface:

That is why u never see photos with a crowd of people in them here.:brolleyes:

[Teresa]

Abbie,
I had to be extra cautious as a professoional photographer , also it was common courtesy to ask but it was easier to avoid the problem , also extra caution has to be made when photographing minors . I still feel it's a grey area with the law on human rights , I do feel the modern use of cameras on mobile phones borders on rudeness and lack of consideration .

Tracy ,
Thed fact that it didn't bother you doesn't mean we should ignore the rights of others .

[Tracii G]

Things seem to be way different in the UK.

[Teresa]

Tracii,
I'm afraid you'll always get some people who don't give a **** ! I guess we're lucky we have an open society but it should also mean we still respect others . I can't say how I would have personally reacted to this situation myself and who knows it's happened anyway . I know some guests at an open party were steaming videos on their mobile phones while we were on the dance floor , surprisingly it was a GG in our group who stopped them by telling them where she would put their phones if the continued !!

[Tracy Irving]

Tracii, I also get the impression that the expectation of privacy in public is different over there.



Tracy ,
Thed fact that it didn't bother you doesn't mean we should ignore the rights of others .

Teresa,
Nobody is ignoring anyone's rights. I took over 2,000 pictures while on my vacation and there are strangers in many of them. I didn't experience one instance where a stranger told me their rights were being violated.

Your expectations of what people should feel and what I've experienced in the real world are clearly two different things.

I don't think that what creepy guy did rises to the level of a human rights violation nor do I think the response by Hosekid was egregious. You and others may disagree and I respect your right to do that.

[Teresa]

Tracy,
I depends on his motive for taking the pictures he could easily infringe human rights issues depending where and how he chose to use them .

I agree I've taken many pictures on holiday with strangers in them but it still doesn't mean we ignore their rights . I took some photographs in Egypt around the Pyramids and that proved problematic , they chose to exerciuse their rights admittedly for financial gain .

[Tracy Irving]

Teresa,
All we know is that creepy guy took some pictures. We have no clue what will happen with them so let's not make assumptions. Based on what we do know, please explain how the taking of these pictures infringes human rights. I don't see it.

I am going to highlight and agree with Super Moderator Shelly Preston...


I don't believe the taking pictures is illegal. What you do with them after that might be.

[abbiedrake]

Points of law are not matters of opinion. There is no law prohibiting pictures being taken that include you, or indeed even those that make you the sole subject when in public. You are, by definition, in the public domain.
Nor does any human rights law (AFAIK) enshrine a right to privacy in public places. Quite simply because it's unenforceable.

Police guidance to the public is quite clear, even here in the UK. There as nothing one can do about having one's picture taken in public, however distasteful one may find it.

The exceptions are extremely few and far between.

Very different, specific legislation exists to cover uses of said pictures in an injurious fashion, for example harassment potentially, or for the protection of children. The standards required by law are not usually met by the simple taking of a picture. And for the most part simple commercial publication is typically insufficient to constitute a crime. This even includes photographs of individuals on private property taken from a vantage point that is public.

For example an upcoming retrospective of Linda McCartney's work features a snap taken of a mother and daughter at the beach. Paul McCartney has no idea who they are, and says Linda took the shot candidly whole the pair were themselves on holiday. It's subsequent publication poses no legal contention.

Teresa, you say you took pictures around the pyramids that proved problematic. How so?! The locals may have claimed you can't do so without paying but that's bs and anyone who falls for it has been played.

As for your saying we shouldn't ignore others' rights I'd say for the most part, and crucially for the photographer in the OP no rights were infringed. A friendly cop might warn the creep to move on if he felt the pics constituted harassment of Hosekid, but it'd have to be way more specific and egregious before he'd be arrested with any expectation of charges being successfully prosecuted.

As I stated to begin with, these are not matters of opinion.

[Teresa]

Abbie,
I saw a very funny incident at the Pyramids where someone refused to pay . I also was tugged by the sleeve to take some pictures when I looked round it was two local policemen holding weapons , yes it could have been problematic .

So you've checked on the point of law but how would feel if you were outed or otherswise by someone exercising their right to take pictures of you totally ignoring your rights to privacy and respect ?

I guess I'm more sensitive to the issues as I had to take care as a professional who I could include or needed to exclude from pictures , I know how sensitive people can be about this problem and always tried to respect their wishes , I'm sorry more people don't consider that . The rights of individuals is a two way situation not a one way one .

[abbiedrake]

Teresa there's simply no such thing as a right to privacy when in public. What you're alluding to is a polite presumption of mutual respect, not a right.

Your own respect for the public as a photographer is to be commended but it's not something they had a right to.

Since Hosekid's anecdote was the subject of discussion the point remains that she nor any of us can reasonably object unless we feel an actual offence has occurred, such as harassment as mentioned but I'd suggest law enforcement would likely not. approach Hosekid's encounter as such.

That may be something we lament but it's not something we have legal recourse over. 🤷*♀️

As for your Egyptian encounter well that's the definition of a shakedown surely.

[Tracii G]

Teresa you used the term open society but to me it seems far from an open society if you can't take pictures because you would be violating a civil right. Huh ??
Over here you are free to take all the pics you want and people don't cry that someone is violating a civil right.
Seems the USA is a more open society.
I have had people remark oh look a tranny and I am sure they snapped a pic with a cell phone but I could care less I wasn't doing anything illegal so what do I have to worry about?

[abbiedrake]

Comparisons between the US and UK are unnecessary Tracii. The law is virtually identical. Admittedly we don't have things like Fair Use of copyrighted material enshrined in law but we don't need it as a rule, courts take a common sense approach to such uses.

If anything the US is somewhat harsher when it comes to photographing government buildings or police officers and the like but the difference generally is negliable.

As I've said there's no such thing as a right to privacy here in the UK.

I'm unsure why this is such a big debate. The law's very clear.

Hosekid was within her rights to what she did, as was the creep. No 'rights' were violated but the creep was embarrassed into a retreat. It's a great outcome, I think.

[char GG]

This thread has taken a wrong turn. No need to debate the laws of different countries. Closing the thread.