My wife said emphatically no!

[Sometimes Steffi]

Please excuse me for the delay in posting an update, but I’ve been very busy the past couple of days, but not crossdressing.

Tuesday, I told my wife about the job offer at Lane Bryant. And asked her if she would “give me permission” to do it. She said emphatically no.

She also said, “If you do take the job, don’t bother coming home.”

We didn’t even get to the discussion part, about pros and cons. I was not able to tell her that:

1. It would get me out of the house.
2. It would give me something to do.
3. It would bring in some cash, but not very much.
4. It would exercise a different part of my brain, which is probably the first thing experts say that will eliminate or postpone dementia.
5. It would make me very happy, and she has said that she thinks I’m depressed about the search for a job in my engineering field (and I am depressed, but not clinically, from time to time).

In retrospect, I probably never had much of a chance of her acceptance, this in spite of the fact that several people I told in the RW were very accepting.

I’m not sure what the difference between being dressed as a girl in a bar versus being dressed as a girl in a retail shop, except that drinking is involved in one of them.

I’m not sure what the difference between buying a dress in a retail shop versus selling a dress in a shop.

I actually considered Option 2, that is not coming home, but it’s not the right time.

But I am starting to wonder if I can or should continue living this way in a DADT relationship. As many have said, we only have one life to live, and we should live it as we desire. I’m getting along in years, and it’s clear that my wife’s attitude is not going to change. I’m starting to wonder if I should Teresa’s approach to living as a girl more often.

[Tracii G]

Well you got your answer.
I would like to hear what her actual reasons for saying no was.

[Micki_Finn]

I wonder if it had gone better if you had discussed it before you went out and found a job to dress at.

[Robertacd]

Well you did put the cart before the horse.

And the horse is not happy about it.

[kimberly c]

We're you really surprised by her answer. You should have started this process by asking her first.

[Tracii G]

Could we say its another case of a CD doing their best to mess up a relationship?
We all said you should have asked first but my guess is you didn't find her input important enough.

[Joan_CD]

I’m sorry this happened to you, but in all honesty I feel badly for the LB personnel that spent their time interviewing and discussing you as a candidate. I’m wondering if someone else was given a rejection letter as a result. Best of luck with your wife.

[Joyce Swindell]

Personally my opinion is to call her bluff. As long as you've been married is it all worth her giving you up over the clothes you wear?

[AndreaCalifCD]

The way things are going, the job at LB might not be around for long anyway?
Two local(ish) to me have closed of the past few years.
Wouldn't surprise me if they go the way of Dressbarn as well...

[cdsamswife]

Im sorry it's come to this.... I would be quite angry though if Sam came home and told me he got a job offer while being dressed without telling me beforehand that he was contemplating doing that.. and Im usually supportive of his dressing to begin with....

So maybe it's not that you would be dressed while at the job but because you didn't discuss with her beforehand as others have said? Good Luck! Hope it works out whatever you choose...

[NancySue]

I’m sorry to hear of your dilemma and agree with bits and pieces of other posts. In my post, I suggested you never “assume” anything until the deal is done...final. Not to be viewed as taking sides, however this whole episode, pros and cons, should have been discussed with your wife before moving forward. Most of us, male or female do not appreciate being “blindsided” and the dishonesty that usually accompanies it. This, not the dressing, could be the real issue. With her response, I sense you’ve got a big mountain to climb. Good luck.

[Teresa]

Steffi,
I can't rub salt in the wound , it was a brave attempt to step out in the RW , so sorry with the outcome .

I'm not sure if you realise the big difference between going out occasionally for a social drink and stepping out full time to hold down a job .

So I guess now you've taken a big step back with your wife , maybe it's time to let the dust settle , perhaps even a gentle conversation won't go down well at the moment .

I can only speak now from my own experience but somehow you have to know if you have taken a step too far , as I found once the damage is done there is no going back , it could well be finding workable compromises but as I found they were one sided . You have to really decide which direction you want your road to go , how much is the dream or dysphoria driving you ? Again from my own experiences I knew I couldn't backpedal , as I'm sure you're aware separation had to happen she couldn't live with my TG needs and I couldn't live without them . Now the dust is beginning to settle we are both happier and I might add I have lost very little in the process . My biggest problem has been deciding what to believe from my wife but now I have full control of my life and she doesn't .

[Sheren Kelly]

Now I know I made the right decision to never marry.
As an adult, I could never accept having to "ask for permission" to do something that I wanted to.

[Teresa]

Sheren,
It's all swings and roundabouts ! I wouldn't change those years of my life for anything ! I have no regrets .

[char GG]

Personally my opinion is to call her bluff. As long as you've been married is it all worth her giving you up over the clothes you wear?

I disagree, Joyce. There seems to be more to the entire situation than "clothes". Secrecy and lack of communication seems to play into this.

Steffi, Do you think your wife would be comfortable with the job if you worked in "man mode"? Was it a "requirement" that you work cross dressed? Or do they want you, as a person. I realize that it was exciting to you to think you could work dressed as a woman but in reality, work is work.

[Bobbi46]

In the words of the late great laurel and Hardy "That's another fine mess I have got into" I think the time to talk of your intention was before you went down the road of interviews, behind her back all the way now your good wife could be thinking what other secrets are you holding back? withdrawing from the job could have an impact on how LB look at future TG/CD people. Sure it was a great success to get the job but I think you have dug a bit of a hole for yourself, how you get yourself out of this I have no idea at all I only hope you will be able take the job offer up it would be a huge boost for our community all round.
good luck let us know how the "talk" goes.

[Crissy 107]

Steffi, I am sorry to hear that the talk, however long it was, did not go well at all. I think it is a good point made by Char about doing the job dressed as a male if that is possible.

[Joyce Swindell]

My suggestion is merely to stay out later to get your wife's attention. If she isn't open to discussion then I would feel a lack of love and well-being for me and our relationship.

Sometimes people need a little "jolt" as in we don't realize what we miss until it's gone. Love isn't something we say, it's something we do.
We are all human, we all make mistakes. Stephanie now knows, beyond a shadow of a doubt, she made a mistake in following the DADT rules.

How deeply does she love you and your relationship?

I agree if it's ok with DB to work in dude mode then if she will talk about it that is.

[Micki_Finn]

You’re not missing much tbh. Retail is pretty miserable. It’s less “playing dress-up with customers” all day and more “getting yelled at by strangers for no reason”.

- - - Updated - - -


My suggestion is merely to stay out later to get your wife's attention. If she isn't open to discussion then I would feel a lack of love and well-being for me and our relationship.


You mean like how Steffi wasn’t open to discussion BEFORE she went out and got a job behind her wife’s back?

[Jean 103]

Well you have your answer, don't think anyone is surprised.

According to you if she said no that would be it.

It doesn't matter what, she gave her answer.

Working as a woman means you are basically full time. That alone should be a big problem for your non accepting wife.

I am sorry , I know the pain of having your dreams crushed.

Maybe it is time to settle things. See what you each want and can live with.

I hope it works out for you two.

[BTWimRobin]

Sorry to hear this. Maybe you can do it in guy mode.

[Tracy Irving]

You probably aren't surprised by your wife's response as I chronicled in your "yes, yes, yes" thread.

[Aunt Kelly]

Steffi,
I can't rub salt in th wound , it was a brave attempt to step out in the RW , so sorry with the outcome .

Sorry... Which "real world" would that be? The one where deception, in pursuit of our selfish ends is effective? Please...
Stef, I don't mean to be unkind. I was rooting for success, truly, but I also saw this coming. I won't say that the outcome would have been an different had you been open from the start. It probably wouldn't, but you'd have had a better chance than hiding it until the last minute. Relationships require trust. That something that must be built, over time, like a bank account. You seem to have made an overdraught.

[Rhonda Darling]

Steffi:

First, an adult asking permission from someone who does not respect them seem loke folly. Your wife hates your crossdressing, and may well hate you when you do it. That said, she is very unlikely to tell anyone because that would reveal that she has stayed married to a crossdresser, which would embarass her to death.

Have you considered what the real consequences would be if you told her you were going to accept the job, and that you were going to dress at home, including makeup, wig, forms, the whole nine yards, and slowly leave the house every day in full view . . . . and if she has a problem with your doing that, then you are agreeable to a less drastic approach than that, but only if she withdraws the threat about YOU not bothering to come home, and further agrees to shut up and sit down. It’s your home, too, and your life.

Is there any joy between the two of you any more? If not, why do you let her control you? What is the point? Tell her this is you, and you’re not leaving!

YMMV. I wish there was some way to really help you. My heart is heavy because of your pain.

[Macey]

My heart goes out to you Stef, and I just can't compute.

Are you and your wife determined to make each other cosmically unhappy? Can you and she not find common ground with each other? I'm not speaking about the job specifically or the solely the crossdressing.

[mbmeen12]

Did you do your critical thinking 101 A-Z?

I agree with Layne Bryant worker's comment, they took the time to show you respect and to work with you at the store. Steffi question, what happens for the next crossdresser wants to apply? You should take the job out of respect for them.

As far as your wife is concern.....


You mean like how Steffi wasn’t open to discussion BEFORE she went out and got a job behind her wife’s back?

Marriage is supposed to be a team effort.

[alwayshave]

Steffi, I am sorry that this was a no go with your wife. Not to jump on, but given your wife's dislike of your crossdressing are you at all surprised at her response?

[pamela7]

sometimes humour can ease situations. "as you've told me 'no', you're clearly wearing the trousers, so someone here has to wear the skirts!"

xxx Pam

[Crissy 107]

Pam, Pretty funny!
Stef, I really think you need to ask LB about working in male mode, if it works you get the job you wanted and the income, also I don’t see how your wife could say no to that.

[Sometimes Steffi]

When I had the interview at Lane Bryant, the interviewer said that I could come to work either in boy mode or girl mode. I said, "You mean 'gender fluid'". and she (the interviewer said, "Yes".

However, I did ask my wife if I could work in male mode. She said, "Now you're just trying to manipulate me to get what you want."

Since my wife didn't know of the job application to LB, nor the interview before "The Talk v2.0", I could have started with "asking permission" to apply for the job, then a couple of days later,telling my wife I had scheduled an interview, and the telling her a couple of days later that I got the job. I know, not truthful. But based on how emphatic she declines me, I don't think asking in advance would have changed anything.

as for the income, the pay rate was $9.75 per hour, for 3 to 4 hours per day for 3 to 4 hours per week. Best case, that comes out to $160 per week, before taxes. That's probably barely enough to pay for my quarterly wardrobe upgrades to continue to be "fashion forward".

As for wasting the manager's time, my interview lasted an hour, and she probably worked another hour "doing paperwork",

[MonicaPVD]

Sorry to hear. I can understand her apprehension, though. I'm sure she can make a clear distinction between you engaging in a leisurely occasional activity (going out dressed) and living a significant part of your day in a very public, very conventional context (working a real retail job during the day). If I were her, I would interpret this as a backdoor way of starting your transition. The fact that you waited u til you had the job to tell her about it only confirms that suspicion. Good luck!

[cdsamswife]

I wish you all the best in your crossdressing journey if thats what you want to choose. All I can say is, even if I eliminate crossdressing from the situation completely, if I wanted to change jobs or Sam wanted to change jobs we would discuss it together beforehand. We wouldnt "ask for permission", but we would discuss it to see the pros and cons and how it would impact our family. This has already happened in the past and I think thats why I didnt feel offended when he ended up applying for the other job because I wasnt blind-sided. Sam is the one that doesnt want to dress outside in public and especially not during his work, but if he wanted to do so, I would want him to discuss it with me as well. I am very supportive of him dressing usually. It is not about asking for permission per se but as a common courtesy so I wouldnt learn he was doing it from someone else. In the real world currently where we live, it's still not 100% completely accepted and especially in the field that Sam works in... it would potentially not be acceptable to do that so I would bring that up with him and see if he still wants to dress in the end. If he still chose to dress at work I would accept that decision because he already knows my worries and I would have listened to why he would want to dress at work.

Yes, it is ultimately your decision on whether you take the job or not..... I wish you all the best in both continuing to dress and with your relationship with your wife (if thats what you want). I hope what I said gives you a tiny bit of insight in to why she was upset?

[Kelly DeWinter]

You could always work in a model train store. Right ?

[susan54]

Many comments about discussion have already been made. I am not married but in relationships I have had there have been tensions caused by lack of discussion about all sorts of things but the tensions about crossdressing have never been about lack of discussion as I have been open with my partners about this. Rightly or wrongly, status in the community is partly partner-related, or people think it is which amounts to the same thing. For a woman, having a husband who is working in a clothes shop presenting as a woman (not just wearing a skirt or dress) is a huge deal and she would be mortified if her friends found out - they would probably be sympathetic towards her, but putting your wife in a situation where she feels pitied is not part of a good relationship. I am not the first to say that if you want your clothing choices to be treated with respect then you have to lead by example and treat your partner with respect. The money at stake here would not even be legal in the UK and is a trivial amount to risk your relationship for - and if the experience is what you are after then you are being a bit selfish thinking you are the only one affected by this work situation. Interviewing is not something people like doing and to have selected a candidate on the basis of information they supplied and then they withdraw because the information was inaccurate (that you would like to work for them ideally dressed as a woman) then the manager has every right to be annoyed - they were misled. This is no way to treat a company that is going out of its way to be supportive to LGBT applicants. This is also going to make it difficult for the next gender fluid job applicant, who will now begin at a disadvantage. Your wife might have told you that if you had discussed it with her before going down this route. I don't feel good about putting the boot into people on this site, but life would be improved for all of us if we stop being so self-centred and considered those we interact with, especially those who go out of their way to be supportive. Be fair, people. And be nice.

[Sometimes Steffi]

Susan54

I did not mislead Lane Bryant about the interview. I applied for the job as Steffi, I set up the interview as Steffi and I interviewed completely as a girl, in a current-style dress, with a wig, makeup, jewelry and sandals -- the whole works.

I did mislead them because I wasn't sure if my wife would let me take the job.

CDSamsWife

It's not like I'm changing jobs; I was laid off in March and I am currently unemployed. I don't usually run my engineering job opportunities through my wife, except the one that would require relocating to Syracuse, NY.

I hear your comments, and I'm properly chastened. But, I still don't think that it would have turned out any different with my wife, even if I asked for permission instead forgiveness, at least with my wife. YMMV

I also don't think that any expansion of my DADT boundaries will ever happen, so I need to figure out how to address that.

[Teresa]

Aunt Kelly,
My comment was meant for Steffi , who attempted to free herself from the closet and find some recognition in the RW . I said I wouldn't rub salt in her wounds , I'm sure she knows it was a bad decision , OK it was a hard lesson to learn but the gamble could have paid off I don't think the odds were 50/50 but now she knows what she needs to do next time .

[Stephanie47]

You need to relocate to Washington State and work at a Lane Bryant or elsewhere en femme. The minimum wage here is $12.00/hour with it going to $13.50/hour in 2020.

I really did not think your wife was going to say, "Yes! That's great! Take the job!" Have you ever had a sit down discussion with your wife when it comes to cross dressing? Even with acceptance of a wife, there is always the issue of non acceptance by those who surround us. Sure, you may cast her opinion to the side and work en femme. Have you considered the possible negative consequences? That's the rub. A husband wife can pile into a car for a weekend getaway to a venue more accepting for expression of sexual identity without the potential for negative consequences. You cannot really guarantee a neighbor or acquaintance or family member will not shop at LB and spread the word. The potential is to lose any control over the negative outcome. Sure, if you were single you can cast everything aside and do what you want. The truth is your wife (and mine too) is along for the ride too.

[Shelly Preston]

Steffi I am sorry it did not work out the way you hoped

Now you really have to ask objectively with your wife do you need the money. This might enable male mode working.

If she still says no then be very careful not to raise the question of that job again under any circumstances. You would not want your wife thinking you sere blaming her for not having a job.

Many have give her reasons so there is no point in repeating them.

Lastly make extreme apologies to LB if your not taking the job.
I am sure you don't need to tell them the real reason, but that's your choice.

[mykell]

So, I counted the results of all the posts: 22 positive, 9 negative, the rest neutral.

Since the vote is over 2 to 1 positive, I'm going to keep my positive attitude, and move forward.

I still haven't had "The Talk v2" with my wife. There were interruptions and unscheduled events all day long. I hope tomorrow will be a better day.

Some quick responses to the naysayers:

1. I have not accepted the job yet. The LB hiring manager was fine if I took a few days to decide.
2. I did dress at for the interview at the consignment shop
3. I will be very professional and will abide by the extensive dress code that changes season to season. Some shopping may be required.
4. As for shaving, I definitely know what you mean. I used to max out at 3 to 4 days, but my beard is lighter, so I think I can make it.
5. As for bra fitting, I'll gladly pass on any customer who is uncomfortable to a GG SA. It's not about me, but it's about the customer experience.
6. If my wife is dead set against it, I'll abide by her wishes. There's no way to pull this off without her consent, even if it's grudging consent.


you seemed to know the answer would be no ahead of time, you sought our input and summed it up to negative and positive but for mine i will say i shared real world instances that i have lived and read here from others in other coming out to spouces threads and things the GGs who water here share.


However, I did ask my wife if I could work in male mode. She said, "Now you're just trying to manipulate me to get what you want."

objectively thinking is she right ?


As for wasting the manager's time, my interview lasted an hour, and she probably worked another hour "doing paperwork",

since the onset of this endevor i think you knew it was a waste of time by what you shared in the series of threads youve started, the manager now has to call back the second choice if they are still avalible or worse start the process from scratch if the other qualifying candidates have moved on, we will never know, i would hate to be the trans person to apply for a job there especially if i really needed it cause she may not take them seriously the next time, we will never know if that happens either. retail is a necessary evil and peeps who make theyre living with it are not any less than anyone who is self employed or working in a different field.


snip.................

I also don't think that any expansion of my DADT boundaries will ever happen, so I need to figure out how to address that.

this worked for me.....YMMV....i explained to the mrs. that i did not want to assume things were ok to do just because she did not want to know about this thing i do, so i took the initiative and made the hard choice to have conversations with her, i did not like the feeling i would be sneaking around behind her back because it was DADT, i told her it would be uncomfortable to do that. i ran off a list of a few things i would like to do....support group, shaved legs, conference, makeover, and Christmas gathering. well i met you at keystone, ive attended several support functions including a Christmas party......still have not done the photoshoot/makeover thing but i have started a failed meetup (jersey girls are pretty shy) and i volunteer and host a trans social group.

as i right this i am at the corner of main and main in ocean grove NJ and if you told me any of this would be true 5 years ago i'd of called you a crazy person, i dont know your wife but i know you just mucked up the water and if your objective you know that too. with all the talk of engineering i'd think this would of been planned out better to be honest, not judging....ive been rooting for you from the beginning and you technically got the job but you also pissed off your wife....my advice for the interim is buy her her favorite flowers and let her know you know you put the cart before the horse because of the reason only you know for sure....fear of disapproval would seam the most logical.

take it slow, be brutally honest....earn her trust and respect back and it should work out, best of luck turning your DADT into "i dont want to see it" thats what i have and call it "half in the closet"
it could be better and it could be worse but it works for "us"

[Allison Chaynes]

I’m sorry this happened to you, but in all honesty I feel badly for the LB personnel that spent their time interviewing and discussing you as a candidate. I’m wondering if someone else was given a rejection letter as a result. Best of luck with your wife.

This. 100%.

[AngelaYVR]

Gosh, I wonder if Steffi got the message yet? Do we really need any more dogs on top of this pile?

[Tracii G]

I hope she did Angela.

[Vickie_CDTV]

It does seem silly for an adult to have to ask permission... but the wife has leverage against Steffi. The wife can file for divorce and walk away with at least half (probably more) of everything.

[Tracii G]

Been married twice so I understand how things can be with a spouse.
If you have to ask permission you did something wrong earlier in the marriage to the point she doesn't respect you.

[char GG]

I believe enough has been said. Closing this thread.