Wife drops the hammer

[Gaz]

Well, last night was interesting.

My wife has known about my sporadic dressing since before we were engaged. It's always been a topic she's gone back and forth on - sometimes acceptance, sometimes veering into DADT. Because I only get the urge to dress a couple of times a year (usually during stressful periods at work/home) and it generally lasts just a few weeks, its been an easy topic to avoid. She has always done her best, but I know there's lingering discomfort, so I don't dress around her. I'm fine with that - I don't wear things for her or anyone else, it's more "me time". But since our daughter was born, I still get the urges but have just ridden them out for the most part - I have other outlets for stress, so hasn't been an issue for me, really, and its not something I really want her exposed to.

Several weeks ago, the urge returned strongly though, and I succumbed. Busted out my gear out of the boxes, and it was... a rush. I let her know what had happened, and she seemed 100% fine with it - to the point she even commented that she couldn't understand why I suppressed it since our daughter came. The fog was stronger than usual though - probably because I hadn't breathed it in for four years or so - and I ordered some dresses on Lands End. I told her about it, since to that point my purchases have been strictly underwear and shoes, and now was buying actual clothing. She seemed surprised, and I reassured her that aside from ordering different things, nothing had changed in that even wearing what I had it didn't make me feel girly or feminine, and that the urge to be such wasn't something I had experienced, or felt I was likely to. She seemed fine with that, and when the dresses arrived she had me try them on. (Cue laughs when one of them turned out to be one she already owned herself!)

Suddenly last night though, it came out.

The sight of me in womens clothing was repellent to her. A massive turn off, and she admitted she viewed me as less of a man when doing so. And that despite all history with me pointing to the contrary, she is waiting for "the other shoe to drop" - because I didn't tell her about it immediately when we began dating (Took me several months to work up the courage) and therefore she can't trust me.

I am, the following day, decimated. I got zero sleep last night, and finally at 5am I got up and purged. It dawned on me that my stress outlet was now gone - that I could never wear any of those things again without her judgment ringing in my ears. She woke up and asked me to stop, that I was crazy to throw everything away, that she knew I needed it but I honestly couldn't answer. Undies went in one garbage bag, sleep stuff went in another, and my shoes and clothing went in a box for donation. The garbage bags are now in the trash.

Can't adequately put into words how I'm feeling. Betrayed? Let down? Disappointed? No clue. I am 100% MIAD, and have never given her any reason to even begin to potentially suspect any of the societal stereotypes about the fact that I'm a crossdresser, but there they were. Despite the fact that I work my ass off and am a good husband and father, I'm less of a man. Despite the fact that I've never shown the remotest feminine trait (well, beyond occasional clothing preferences!) I am a massive turnoff, and a ticking girly timebomb that can go off at any time.

Took me years and hard work to break down those stereotypes in my own head, and get myself to the point where I was comfortable with it, that it was just clothes. Ot took her sixty seconds to put 'em all right back.

[giuseppina]

Maybe a chat with a duly qualified and licensed mental health practitioner is in order for both you and your wife.

There may be other issues lurking beneath the surface.

[Mary Lawrence]

Welcome to the closet, Gaz. Not all wives are forgiving and/or participatory. You have been able to go further with your wife than I could with mine. I guess that's good. You must figure out your own navigational route through the stormy sea of marriage. I met with a pretty much instant barrier and elected not to push as I did not want to chance destroying an otherwise excellent situation. Hence, I am in the closet along with many others. I dress when opportunity arises and don't hope for more.

[Marianne S]

If I were you I'd grab those bags back PRONTO, before they get collected! Otherwise you never know when you'll regret throwing everything away! I've regretted purging too, in the dim and distant past. I learned never to do it again. Granted, your situation is different, but even your wife thinks you're crazy to throw everything away! NEVER do anything major on impulse that you can't undo!

Give it time! You can work this out!

[Crissy 107]

Gaz, First take a deep breath and slow things up. I absolutely can understand you being upset but I would retrieve the items even if it is for a short period of time. I think you need some time to let the dust settle and in a few days or a week have a talk with your wife. Maybe the dresses put her over the top but you need to find out what if anything you can do. If it is only panties then so be it.
Please do not throw anything away yet. I hope you can get at least a partial resolution in your favor. Hang in there and we are here for you. Hugs, Crissy

[Kelli_cd]

I agree with the others - don't discard your items. Situations may change, your favorites may be irreplaceable. The last time I purged I threw away so much and just pictured all the money I had spent.
And of course, I started again. I will never throw everything away again.

[Bobbi46]

Many wise words here all I can say is in accord with tje others hold off throwing everything way and try and talk some more with your wife, there has to be a way through this.

[Sandi Beech]

Gaz

I feel your pain. You are not alone. Although it?s not the only driving force for me, stress can certainly trigger a sudden return of the desire to dress. Understanding that is important to keep it at bay. Sadly , my wife would never give an inch so my dressing is in complete hiding. For me it?s better that way because I hated the scolding. It only works for me because I travel a LOT. I am not recommending my method as it has its own risks. I had to overcome the guilt associated with being dishonest about it, and that does take it?s toll. I was just not willing to pursue dressing in the open which would have ultimately doomed my marriage for sure. Good luck, you may want to seek counseling as others suggested because it?s a lot to get your hands around. Trust me though when I say I feel your pain.

Sandi

[Gaz]

The problem (or lack of problem, I dunno) is that I look at all those things are purely clothes now. They're no longer taboo objects, or things I felt I needed to keep hidden. They're things my wife has always known about - hell, she bought me a fair chunk of them. And now, after her broadside, they're not even that now.

I don't have a feminine drive. I know a lot of people here do, and I've always assumed I had it as well. Maybe I was repressing it, maybe I was in denial about it. (Am sure that there are some who will say that's still the case.) But I've spent years of reflection, on who and what I am and I don't see it. My dressing comes from a different place - its about escapism and a form of coping mechanism for me. But even so, the "stigma of the crossdresser" still applies - that I'm weird, deviant. That I'm a sissy, that I long to be a woman, and dream about sex with men. I've never felt a scrap of that, and finally got to a place of peace. Now though, knowing that my wife still has that stigma means that any time I wear any of it, it'll echo in my ears. I didn't dress around her because I knew I could never fully relax, there was always a nagging voice knowing there was some level of disapproval. Now that I know just how titanic that level is, even wearing it in private I don't think I'll be able to relax in it.

Am sure in the coming days/weeks/months that there will be a lot of talking. At least on my part - her way (and her family's) is to avoid conflict at all costs, and pretend the next day like things never happened (likely the reason that she was in disbelief that I was purging).

[BLUE ORCHID]

Hi Gaz :hugs:, I think that you are trying to punish your wife by trashing all of your things,

You will soon see and feel the error of your ways. >Orchid .oO:daydreaming:Oo.

[donnalee]

May I suggest an alternative?
Take all those things you bagged and put them in an area you'really not likely to go into; out of sight, out of mind (both you [U]and[U]your wife). Purging is a former of suicide, in my opinion and, like suicide, is a permanent solution to a temporary problem. It is also a way of hurting your wife in a similar manner " you'll be sorry when I'm dead". Many things said and done in the heat of the moment are wished undone in more sober reflection, and this is one of them.

[Tracii G]

Why are you letting her control the narrative? You are the man of the house right? Well maybe not.
Sounds like you are trying to get back at her and trying to make her feel guilty about things she said.
All you are doing is hurting yourself to try to make her feel bad.
Thats the old martyr syndrome. Guys do that a lot.
Why not stand your ground and tell her to back off its just clothes right?
Some here claim to be men but they sure don't act like it.
What I would do is go get my stuff out of the trash and drop the hammer on her for once.

[Jodie_Lynn]

To the OP:
1 - reclaim your stuff. All purging does is cost you money.

2 - You and your spouse need to find a counselor.

3 - Re-read points 1 and 2 until you do them.


A woman falls in love with, and marries, a MAN. She has her own expectations of what that means. If one fails to meet those expectations, one can expect consequences.

And people change, over time. What she once found tolerable, can become intolerable.

Back when I was on The Job, there was a saying: "There are 3 sides to every story: yours, theirs, and somewhere in the middle, is the truth" We are hearing your side of the story, but we ( and you!) don't know her side. What is she feeling, thinking, worrying over?

Someone recommended standing your ground, delivering your own ultimatum. Go ahead, just be prepared for the worst, when she calls your bluff, or worse, raises and calls.

[Maid_Marion]

Hi Gaz,

I hope you keep the clothes. Who know, maybe you may have more freedom to dress openly. I've done feminine Fridays, in which I'll wear florals or heels to work.

When I was in a relationship we would talk every day, but I didn't ask permission to crossdress. Instead, I just got some VS PJs and wore them to bed the same day I got them. :)

Marion

[Tracii G]

Jodie standing your ground is not delivering an ultimatum or even close.
Basically standing your ground is not giving in to pressure from others especially your spouse.
She said for better or worse just like he did they do need to work things out no doubt about that.

[Leslie Langford]

Welcome to the wonderful world of DADT, Gaz, or its evil twin...DWTSI ("Don't Want To See It").

There are many members of this forum who can relate 100% to what you have expressed here...in fact, many of us could actually have written the same post verbatim. I know I could have...especially the part about being so uber masculine in all other aspects of our lives, so why is this crossdressing quirk of ours such a "no fly zone" for our wives and SO's, totally overshadowing all of our other admirable traits? I guess for some women, given their 'druthers, they would rather be married to a shiftless, wife-beating, unemployed, porn-addicted drunk instead...I mean, that's more "manly" and more "normal" by current standards, and that behavior probably carries less of a social stigma than the "perverted" crossdressing activities that we engage in, right?

The older (and hopefully - wiser) I get, and the more I think about it and try to rationalize this dichotomy in my mind, the more convinced I am that more than just the typical heterosexual biological male-female sexual attraction is at play here. A huge part of this is also the way males and females are conditioned socially in what is still an inherently binary and gendered environment in the Western world. Add to this the fact that we also still live in what is essentially a patriarchal society where the "real" men still call the shots, and some of this toxic masculinity rubs off on women as well. How else to explain their propensity to fall for the "bad boys" because they are "dangerous" and "exciting"? Trouble is, once they realize what bad news these "bad boys" really are, they inevitably settle for us benign dwebs to establish safer, more protective relationships, procreate, and eventually ease into a comfortable old age. Of course, when we benign dweebs turn out to be crossdressers, this whole vision of a "safe", stable, and "normal" relationship crumbles before their eyes, and then the proverbial excrement hits the ventilator.

Funny thing about clothing, though - and to get back to my original point about social conditioning...for a man to prefer what is considered to be "feminine" clothing by today's standards often makes him seem to be less of a man in many peoples' eyes. And yet, back in the 1700's the men populating the higher social strata routinely wore high-heeled shoes, elaborately embroidered lace-trimmed waistcoats, breeches, stockings, and powdered wigs tied back with ribbons as well as makeup. Kind of what passes for female (or female-inspired) clothing today. Yet no one thought to call these 18th century men "sissies". If anything, they conquered and settled vast tracts of lands and newly discovered continents far beyond Europe's traditional borders.

Eminently "manly", by all conventional standards. Go figure...

[HelpMe,Rhonda]

Wondering if your wife would be willing to discard an important aspect of herself at your command.

[Jean 103]

Sorry you are going through this.

Not so much the cost but I is an empty jester unless you are able to close the door on it and not look back.

That is if her can't be moved to accept the way you are. To me you sound like a typical CD.

[ColleenCD]

Hi Gaz,

Long time member, rarely posting these days but have been through much of your dilemma. I understand purging as your answer to her reaction, I too have regrettably tossed items after feeling attacked. IMHO, your frustration rings of confusion to your wife's reaction varying from acceptance and support to demeaning statements. The only solution appears to be to not dress (purge), then she will have to accept you. But will you accept you?

I've found that wive's often wander on their level of "Okayness." One day they buy something for you and the next criticize you for it. For me, this is a deeply sensitive area for which I don't need her against me, so I don't dress around her. Maybe your answer could be consistent ground rules? You're a solid provider, but she voiced her struggle of the absence of your masculine presentation. Talking with her will show her she matters most, but Gaz time is also essential to you. If this is not a relationship breaker, then find some middle ground that does not demean you.

Very best wishes Gaz,

Colleen

[

[Gaz]

Why are you letting her control the narrative? You are the man of the house right? Well maybe not.
Sounds like you are trying to get back at her and trying to make her feel guilty about things she said.
All you are doing is hurting yourself to try to make her feel bad.
Thats the old martyr syndrome. Guys do that a lot.
Why not stand your ground and tell her to back off its just clothes right?
Some here claim to be men but they sure don't act like it.
What I would do is go get my stuff out of the trash and drop the hammer on her for once.

Wow, ain't you empathic.

Am I the man of the house? That's not really a thing anymore, is it? I'm comfortable in my masculinity, but that doesn't mean I live in a house where the attitude where "do as I say, woman" doesn't actually happen. How should I "act like a man" in this sense? Slap her about a bit and tell her to get me a scotch?

I've said in other threads, a marriage is a partnership where crossdressers can (and often are) selfish to the point of only caring about their own wants and needs, and often ignore their wives' wants and needs in the process.

Which is why I'm currently fuming.

I've spent our marriage specializing in compromise and finding the happy medium with this. She's know about it since before I popped the question - she said yes anyways. She had ample opportunity to decide that she didn't want to hitch her wagon to a guy who crossdresses, she chose to anyways. She's bought me lingerie, she's bought me heels. She's offered me hand-me-downs from stuff she's outgrown or doesn't wear much. In return I don't shove it down our throat (my decision) and don't wear around our child (my decision). For that to now turn into it disgusting her and deciding that apparently its only a matter of time before I come out of the closet or begin MTF transition frustrates the hell out of me.

An I martyring myself? Possibly? My motivation to wear is dealing with stress and escapism. Last night I went to bed (angry) and got my PJs on. Instead of feeling comfortable, they filled me with the old feelings of shame, frustration, and a modicum of self-loathing - I stripped them off and threw them in the trash. I tossed and turned all night struggling with it. I went into my closet and the sight of my shoes made me angry. I picked one up, and once again a flood of self loathing. She didn't order me to purge, but I think she knew what to say/do to trigger me. It no longer feels like they will do their "job" since the feelings they trigger aren't positive ones. It might be down to it being fresh and raw, but... it doesn't feel the same now.

It does make me wonder... she went away for a girls' weekend with two of her friends, and came back with this. I wonder if she had a chat with her friends about the fact that I'm now buying clothing, and she got some advice. Not sure. Due for a chat tonight - she's avoiding me like the plague though.

[Tracii G]

Maybe her girls weekend had a little something to do with it that is possible indeed.
I martyred myself all thru my two marriages and always compromised to keep my partner happy and that was my mistake.
My first ex didn't like the fact I wouldn't stand up for myself and gave in to her every time no matter how ridiculous the reason was. Hence I worked 16 to 18 hours a day trucking then came home did the laundry and took care of the kids plus took the kids to school she did nothing because I was stupid enough to put up with her lazy ness.
Second wife God knows she would leave for months at a time while I was working so no respect from her either.
I don't make comments to be a smart a$$ or to hurt any ones feelings I just can see things in people comments describing their situation and I have been there twice so I know exactly what I am talking about.
Sorry if you got offended but thats on you because I didn't say it to offend you.
If I had just stood up to them and their demands and said no sometimes and stood my ground I might have two women that actually respected me and not walked all over me.
Remember Mr nice guy always finishes last.
Why do you suppose women always hook up with the bad boy types? Because they say no and act like what they think a real man acts like.
I can be and am empathetic a lot of times but I don't sugar coat things as you can see.

[Leslie Mary S]

Hi GAz. Like it or not, you presently no longer feel a need to CD. I warn you the urge WILL return. It is like a heavy smoker giving up smoking and then eventually they start smoking again. Just put everything into a wooden box or footlocker. If you don't return for them in about 5 years then move the box farther away.
Unfortunately, I think your SO is being guided away from each other by her "friends", who either don't know anything about your lives together, or one or more of them has been hurt or taught wrong. You need to know, in depth, about what was said during that weekend your SO was away, because that was what triggered your SOs change of mind.
If you two do not talk this out and come to some understanding, then this will be the start of a separation. seen it before.

[alwayshave]

I've spent our marriage specializing in compromise and finding the happy medium with this. She's know about it since before I popped the question - she said yes anyways. She had ample opportunity to decide that she didn't want to hitch her wagon to a guy who crossdresses, she chose to anyways.
Gaz, I spent my former marriage attempting to make my ex-wife happy by compromising on everything. In the end I got nothing and was miserable. Eventually I left. My point, is you have taught her that she gets to make the decisions and you will just go along.

[Teresa]

Gaz,
Purging clothes or not won't remove that part of your brain that has this need to be satisfied, whether it's everyday or once a year it will surface again .

Oddly stress is a two way thing , OK to dress does appear to relieve that stress but then we pile it back on again with the fear of being caught and outed .

Maybe it's time to get a little professional input , you may not have dysphoria or if you do it's not overwhelming like some but you need to be honest with yourself and find what drives that need . At the moment you will be going round in circles , wondering who is right and who is wrong and you said it all in commenting you didn't sleep at all after your wife made her true feelings known .

You need to work on the fact that you are no less of a man , she has you on a male pedestal or as I use to call it a male straightjacket . I burnt myself out trying to prove that point but it turned out there was no point to prove no one suffered or went without apart from me who be then was being torn apart mentally .

You say you are ONLY A MIAD but that label is irrelevant you still have something driving that basic need , denying that need can at times be mentally destructive and if that need really takes hold which for many of us it does , eventually you may cease to function . This is not BS because I've lived it and worse .

[emma30]

This post is so important to discuss, this forum is right for this debate. Im well and truly in the closet and your post Gaz has hit home with me as im really petrified of my wife knowing. Ive been crossdressing for 34 yrs and with my wife for 27 years. Shes knows nothing about it so in some ways i could be in a worse situation at some point.
I do have strong feminine feelings that i find impossible to shake off so I've learned to love and enjoy it.
I agree with keeping your clothes as you paid good money for them and like you i am a great husband and dad and thats what your wife needs to separate and thats only achievable by her truly understanding how your mind ticks and conversely you understanding her worries about the situation. The only reservation i have with a third party mediation is that its chosen carefully with someone who is completely conversant on the subject and not a standard psychologist.
I truly hope it works out for you.

[Stephanie47]

Gaz, I will concur with others that counseling is needed. Counseling for yourself to reconcile your feelings of shame, guilt and any other negative feelings. It is obvious to me you are not comfortable with yourself otherwise you would not have purged your belongings. Your wife also needs individual counseling so she can freely express herself without worrying about your reaction. Couples counseling usually occurs after both parties have the opportunity to let it all hang out.

My wife and I are in a DADT marriage. We had "The Talk" in the early 1980's. We even had gone the route you and your wife went through. There was some bedroom play with lingerie. We shopped together for nightgown for me. She bought me hosiery and garter belts. When my interests went deeper, i.e., that vivid red Vanity Fair bra was pulled out of my armoire draw by our three year old daughter, all things changed. It was more than a little kinky sex. It was something she could not deal with. She married her idea of the ideal man who now had a kink in the armor. I decided to make my cross dressing a private affair. I decided it was akin to spousal mental abuse to force my needs upon her. Of course, since my cross dressing was too relieve stress, to make the situation more stressful would be counterproductive.

My wife has taken to be an ostrich. She does not make any snide comments. She has found some articles of clothing on occasion that I overlooked (bra or panty) which she just folds and puts it out of sight from visitors. She has found this site open on my browser. All she said was to be more careful in case a visitor were to notice. When we had "The Talk" she told me if she had known things were headed down this path, she would not have married her. She also realized she had told me of her sordid past before we were married. Although she said she wished she had no told me of her past because it would have made it easy for her to just rationalize leaving our marriage, she also realized she had imperfections.

Yes, I would love it if I would be able to prepare dinner a la June Cleaver in dress and heels, but, that is not going to be. In some sense it would be boorish male behavior to force myself upon her? Or would it be interrupted as being a 'class A bitch?"

[Micki_Finn]

Honestly it sounds like she was just saying that she felt less attracted to you when you are dressed. It sounds like you are somewhat invested in your “manhood” and were hurt by her words that you felt cut you to the core of who you are. She tried to stop your purge. I don’t think she’s saying she thinks less of you. So she isn’t attracted to you when you’re dressed, so what? Best case scenario is that you make a gorgeous woman, but she’s straight and not really into women. Worst case scenario is that you look completely ridiculous, and that’s why she’s not attracted to you when you’re dressed. She’s not the only one. My wife isn’t attracted to me when I’m dressed either. That doesn’t mean she loves or respects my any less.

As for the not trusting you thing, you admitted you had never purchased outerwear before. It’s logical for your wife to see you take that step and assume that your dressing had become something it never had been before, and in a way she was right. Why buy dresses bless you’re planning to go out in public right? She doesn’t know where your dressing will take you, and it’s already taking you to new places so of course the trust is going to be a little shaky.

I don’t know you personally, or your relationship, but my take is that you over-reacted. Your wife expressed her feelings, but because they were the bed-of-roses you were hoping for, you decided to punish her by making yourself miserable and making it clear to her that she was the cause of your misery. I think you need to revisit this conversation and do more listening than reacting. Honestly I think your wife just used a poor choice of words to express herself.

[Gaz]

The issue I have with being forceful about my needs in this specific aspect is that she's not the only one who buys into the social stereotypes about crossdressing, I do as well. It's something I'm nervous and shy about, I feel its very private. When I did the therapy thing, it took me 6-7 sessions before I worked up the courage to tell my therapist about it. With my wife, it took me six months to work up the courage to tell her. (And aside from people on a forum, they're the only people I've ever told). So yeah - as a self-proclaimed "manly man" it's been serious effort to shed the stigma I have about myself, let alone before I can deal with shedding it in others. And as the old adage goes, nobody's gonna love you until you can love yourself.

Anyways. Finally had a talk last night, where she basically walked everything back after a day of pretending like the previous night never happened. She apologized, but claimed I took it all the wrong way. Her comments about the dressing being disgusting was purely sexual in nature - that the sight of me in any sort of lingerie isn't something that "gets her motor running" but not meant to say that the notion of crossdressing is disgusting, she's absolutely fine with it and wouldn't have married me if she wasn't. Her comments about being worried about what's coming next weren't in reference to crossdressing, but that when I pick up a "hobby" I go full bore into it, so she was concerned about "the next one." She implored me to get the bags of stuff out of the trash, assured me that she knew my dressing was a coping mechanism as opposed to a step on a path to me transitioning, and she fully supported me.

So kind of an apology, but kind of a "its your fault for taking the statements that I made to you at face value rather than reading between the lines."

The assumption on my part is that there's something else going on. I did finally have my revelation last month of "stop fretting about this, its just clothes - stop the shame and the guilt, its just clothes. You know who you are, accept that its a small part of the whole and goes into making me who I am." and as a result I've been more... vocal and "excited" about it? (Excited's not the right word... maybe more "very comfortable"). But whatever about that, I'm not copping the blame for HER meltdown. I'll own my own at 5 in the morning and in reading some of the responses above I'll hold my hand up and admit my behaviour was childish. But she said what she said. I heard her out, told her I appreciated the apology but there was an element of "look, you rang that bell, and you can't really unring it." At no point have I EVER tried to sexualize my dressing, at no point have I even TRIED to instigate anything physical with her in that mode. Heck, I keep it away from her with the exception of her seeing me put panties on in the morning while getting dressed, or me in pajamas at night if its cold, so was confused as to why she'd think she needed to reinforce a notion that if the panties are on, the door is shut. I don't question that she loves me, I don't question that she has my back, but communication seems to be severely lacking and and think we would seriously benefit from talking to a professional about our marriage as a whole. That clearly upset her, I think the notion of therapy to her means an acknowledgement that something is wrong, and as I mentioned before her (and her family's) preferred method of dealing with issues is to bury their heads in the sand and hope they go away.

So the bags were retrieved, and now need to do a pile of laundry.


Best case scenario is that you make a gorgeous woman, but she’s straight and not really into women. Worst case scenario is that you look completely ridiculous, and that’s why she’s not attracted to you when you’re dressed.

Oh, it's the latter. Definitely the latter!!!

[Joyce Swindell]

Love isn't something you say, it's something that you do.
She has hurt you and cut you with her words. Does she realize how deep she has hurt you?
Is this what love does?
You two need to talk to each other from that level.
If you love each other you can get through it.

[Teresa]

Gaz,
Maybe it's a case of letting the dust settle, you both appear to be on a different page and need time to adjust to the current situation .

The great thing is she is talking about the sitaution so you're not totally in a DADT situation , it is far harder talking to a brick wall .

The therapy aspect well I've been through that situation , my wife refused point blank to even consider it , I was the one that was broken and needed fixing , the problem was she thought a cure might come out of it .

I do feel you are putting yourself down too much there is a hint of denial in your wording , at the end of the day the fact I was totally honest with everyone gained me more respect . Perhaps you do need to open up a little more and openly talk , holding back with your therapist wasn't really helping anyone , OK I was desparate and just needed to let go with someone .

I feel Micki is being a little harsh on you , it is the hardest thing for a man to admit he isn't all male , there is another side to him which CDing releases , some people have done desparate acts rather than admit it . There are no rule books or instruction sheets , I still remember the feeling of a millstone being lifted off my shoulders when I finally came out to my wife , after so many years it was like a floodgate opening , that is the one point very few women appreciate , coming out is life changing .

[Kelly DeWinter]

Gaz;

I think you are the one looking at things wrong, and you have had a knee jerk reaction to a bit of marriage honesty. A lot of people go through this exact same "cards on the table" conversation. In therapy they would call it a break through. Your wife is NOT shutting you down, she's actually communicating with you. letting you know how she feels. Embrace the fact that shes willing to talk to you and DON"T do crazy purges. You both can work through this as long as you both are willing to compromise a little.
Give her a chance to find her voice. The two of you are ripe for couples counseling. Right now you are adding to YOUR stress by acting like a volcano ready to blow.

The hardest thing about marriage is that we spend 3% of our time before marriage dating someone thinking we know them inside and out. Then we get married and really find out what they are like and spend too much time wishing they were still the person we dated.

I think you will do well and i'm confident you have the ability to build on this.

I met a CD once who's wife told me she had two previous marriages where her 1 husband handled stress by drinking and the other by gambling , When her CD husband gets stressed at work, she can tell and lays out a peignoir for her.

[Stephanie47]

Kelly, "her 1 husband handled stress by drinking and the other by gambling. When her CD husband gets stressed at work, she can tell and lays out a peignoir for her."

That woman has insight into her husband and her marriage.

[Joan58]

And yet, back in the 1700's the men populating the higher social strata routinely wore high-heeled shoes, elaborately embroidered lace-trimmed waistcoats, breeches, stockings, and powdered wigs tied back with ribbons as well as makeup. Kind of what passes for female (or female-inspired) clothing today. Yet no one thought to call these 18th century men "sissies".


They were called Fops and Dandys

[NancyJ]

Gaz, I totally get this. I have so much wanted acceptance and understanding from my wife about this part of me, and when she has rejected, or dismissed, the importance of this feminine part of me I have been devastated. I’ve wanted to erase it from our marriage — like it would be better if I’d never told her than to ask for acceptance and be rejected.

Thing is, though, whether or not she likes it, accepts it, or is disgusted by it, it is in fact part of me — and it is not going away. Although I continue to view this as a great loss for our marriage (because it creates distance where there could be intimacy), I no longer view this as my failing or something to hide from her, purge, or pretend isn’t me. I now see this as her problem. For the sake of keeping the peace and being her friend, I don’t flaunt my femininity, and I do not dress in front of her — but she is quite aware of my daily underdressing and that I have other women’s clothes that I wear when she is not around.

If you try to give it up for her you may end up resenting her and/or be driven into secrecy...because the urge to crossdress ain’t going away just because you purged. Don’t kid yourself. Been there, done that. Nancy

[Tracii G]

Joan58 that was the style back then and men of status dressed that way.It was not seen as feminine in any way.
To try and equate this to today's society is a moot point and the argument does not hold water.

[Alice Torn]

Donnalee, A few yrs ago, i was near actual suicide for several painful reasons. I actually did purge 99% of all my Alice things, and said i would never dress again. I regret purging all those great dresses i had paid for and had alterations done on. Lots of money spent, many skirts, tops, shoes, wigs all given to charity. I wish now i had not given all of them away. i could have at least sold some of them. But i miss some of the gorgeous dresses, shoes and wigs now. Like you said, it is a form of suicide.

- - - Updated - - -

Kelly. What is a peignoir?

[Marianne S]

Hi again, Gaz!

I'm glad to hear you're "undoing" the purge, and starting to get things sorted with your wife.

A few comments. First, when it comes to your being the "man of the house," I don't believe anyone is suggesting you should act like some caveman and start slapping your wife into submission! That's reading too much into a post! The point is rather that you detach your own needs from those of your wife, and consider them separately. This is not a matter of "dominating your wife," or "who wins and who loses." It's only a matter of not letting your wife's perceptions ride roughshod over your own--particularly when they may not even be "her perceptions," but your perceptions of her perceptions!--which is a different matter entirely.

Oh yes, marriage is indeed about compromise. All I'm saying is that you need to have as much respect for your own needs as you no doubt do for your wife's needs. You can't let your life be dictated by your wife's notion of "the kind of man she thinks you ought to be," any more than you'd try to force her into becoming "the kind of woman you think she ought to be." That route would only lead to stiflement of the Self, frustration, conflict, anger, depression, and everything unhealthy you can think of.

That leads me into the second and far more important point. The real problem here is not even about your wife's perceptions, which could be seriously mistaken if she believed you were homosexual, transsexual, or whatever. The problem is the way you reacted to her remarks, with undeserved feelings of shame about "who you are" and "what you're like"--and the way you responded, based on these feelings.

At bottom, this is not just about how she feels about you, as important as that is. It's about how you feel about you, which is even more important!

I am not "blaming" you for this reaction, and I don't believe you were being "childish," or (as some have suggested) trying to "punish" your wife by putting a guilt trip on her for what she said to you. The point is, you would never have felt such undeserved shame if your wife had not triggered EXISTING feelings of shame residing within yourself!

We should never forget that famous saying attributed to Eleanor Roosevelt:

NOBODY CAN MAKE YOU FEEL INFERIOR WITHOUT YOUR CONSENT!

That saying ought to be framed and hung on the wall! At bottom, this is not about a conflict between yourself and your wife. That may be a problem, but it's one you can probably resolve. The greater problem is about a conflict between yourself and all the garbage beliefs about crossdressers that people at large (I hate that overworked word "society") have imposed on you--which you have internalized as though they were gospel truth! You've bought their judgments of you and their shame.

Unfortunately this needless shame is universal to one degree or another. I dare say nearly everyone here has struggled with it at some time. Many, I'm sure, still do. What I do want to point out is that this toxic shame can be OVERCOME!

I can say this from personal experience, because I used to suffer from it myself. Unlike you, my crossdressing started off as fetishistic and sexually motivated--though I later found there was a somewhat more to it than that. I dressed secretly in my teens, but on finishing what might be called "pleasuring myself"--a euphemism I believe is acceptable on this board ;) --I immediately felt horribly embarrassed to be dressed in the same female clothing that had excited me so much just a short while before. I couldn't wait to get out of it and back into "boy clothes."

This is much the same reaction of embarrassment that you had when your wife's remark triggered these feelings of shame. What I do want to say is that over the years this needless shame went away. I won't try to explain how or why right now, but it did happen, so that after a few years I could enjoy and feel comfortable wearing a dress or a blouse and skirt, bra and panties at any time--well, not in public but certainly in private--and exploring my "feminine side."

You can do the same. given time. All you need is SELF ACCEPTANCE! I don't doubt therapy can help, though I never sought any myself. But somewhere along the way, I learned to mentally tell these imaginary critics "I yam what I yam," as Popeye would say, and to stuff their stinking opinions where the sun don't shine, because I don't give a damn what they think of me for loving to wear women's clothes. I admit that doing this at an emotional (as opposed to a simple cognitive) level takes work, but it can be done.

Don't be afraid to tell your wife you're "sensitive" about your predilection for crossdressing. She'll probably appreciate your honesty about that, and understand your reaction.

One other point. It disturbed me that your wife seems to have done an abrupt volte face about your crossdressing after going away for a "girls' weekend." Unfortunately certain gangs of females can be toxic and downright destructive to a marriage, especially when they're wanking off about issues of their own that have nothing whatsoever to do with what another wife's "problems" (like your own) might be. I've never forgotten a classic quote from Eric Berne, writing back in the 1960s about cliques of housewives getting together to bitch about "how awful" their husbands are--and when a new wife brightly announces that "her husband is a jewel," she will not be welcome in the group!

Not, that's to say, unless she "empathizes" with them, falls into their destructive line of thinking, and starts focusing the same way herself: not on her husband's merits, but on his shortcomings.

While female friendships can of course be life-affirming to any woman, they can also be destructive to marriage. Some women, bitter about their own romantic failures, are jealous of other wives who have succeeded, eager to project their own problems and situations onto other women whose "problems" are not the same, and gratified if they can "bring another woman down" to a situation similar to their own--a failed marriage--where they can delight in saying "See, I told you so!" And "You're just like me!" And where they no longer have to be jealous, because after encouraging another woman to destroy her own marriage, they're now on the same level.

Of course I can't know whether or not your wife's women "friends" fall into this category of corrosive females, but it does seem suspicious that she "turned on you" right after that weekend. If they did influence your wife in any way, it's likely to be because they're ill-informed, prejudiced ignoramuses about crossdressing and our reasons for doing it. Malign influences of this kind need to be resolutely opposed and countered at every opportunity. So I would urge you to explore--diplomatically of course!--what kind of garbage these women may have been pouring into your wife's ears, and if so, doing your best to correct these misperceptions.

I'm a great fan of marriage, having had a good one myself, so I hope things go well for you. Good luck!

[Crissy 107]

Gaz, Good you had a talk with your wife, communication is so important, also very good you recovered the items you were purging. I think nobody who has purged, and many of us have, has later on thought it was still a good idea.
I am very happy the way things have turned around.

[Leslie Langford]

And yet, back in the 1700's the men populating the higher social strata routinely wore high-heeled shoes, elaborately embroidered lace-trimmed waistcoats, breeches, stockings, and powdered wigs tied back with ribbons as well as makeup. Kind of what passes for female (or female-inspired) clothing today. Yet no one thought to call these 18th century men "sissies".


They were called Fops and Dandys

Close, but no cigar...

What you are referring to is a historically perjorative description of a person who is overly concerned with fashion, outward appearances, and being a trend-setter. Those are archaic terms, and the modern day equivalent would be "metrosexual". But while some metrosexuals might veer towards wearing clothing that is of a more effeminate nature than normal, they are not crossdressers per se, and not even MIADS in the strictest sense of the word.

What I was talking about in my post was a style of clothing that was typically worn by men of certain social standing in the 1700's, and by today's standards would be akin to what a well-dressed woman would wear (minus the skirts or dresses, though - I'll leave that to the Scotsmen and their kilts, or the Roman soldiers of antiquity with their skirt-like tunics).

Yet these men never considered themselves to be crossdressers, nor did their female companions...it's just what some people wore in those days. Better yet, these men never had a problem getting laid either despite wearing what we nowadays would consider sissified or effeminate clothing. Casanova for one is proof positive of that. ;)

[ReineD]

Try not to take it too personally. Yes, she did have her say, but in the morning she relented and asked you to not throw the things out. I'm a GG so maybe I can help translate.

Excluding you, your wife has had no frame of reference for a man's desire to wear women's clothes, other than all the general misconceptions in the media (and in most people's attitudes) that she has been exposed to her entire life. She is familiar with men in dresses from knowing about Drag Queens (whom most people assume are gay). She is familiar with the stereotype of effeminate gay men wearing not-masculine clothing, even if they don't actually crossdress. In most people's minds, the crossdressing is associated either with effeminate men or men with fetishes, or both. And few wives want to compete with any fetish their husbands may have. I'm guessing your wife grew up in a family where no one was a crossdresser, and she has no crossdresser friends.

If you continue to react out of anger when your wife is being honest with you about her misgivings and/or her fears, she will learn to keep them to herself. This is not good because eventually you will buy more panties and shoes, and eventually you will buy more dresses. And the two of you will have the proverbial unspoken elephant in the room, which will eventually drive a wedge between you. Resentments will follow along with a loss of emotional intimacy.

You need to sit down with your wife and talk things through NOW. Don't wait.

Edited to add:
I hadn't read your follow up post and see that you did talk it through with her. That's good. If the two of you still need to resolve things, you might go ahead and see a marriage counselor who is familiar with crossdressing. The counselor will help the two of you get on the same page.

[Gaz]

Try not to take it too personally. Yes, she did have her say, but in the morning she relented and asked you to not throw the things out. I'm a GG so maybe I can help translate.

Excluding you, your wife has had no frame of reference for a man's desire to wear women's clothes, other than all the general misconceptions in the media (and in most people's attitudes) that she has been exposed to her entire life. She is familiar with men in dresses from knowing about Drag Queens (whom most people assume are gay). She is familiar with the stereotype of effeminate gay men wearing not-masculine clothing, even if they don't actually crossdress. In most people's minds, the crossdressing is associated either with effeminate men or men with fetishes, or both. And few wives want to compete with any fetish their husbands may have. I'm guessing your wife grew up in a family where no one was a crossdresser, and she has no crossdresser friends.

If you continue to react out of anger when your wife is being honest with you about her misgivings and/or her fears, she will learn to keep them to herself. This is not good because eventually you will buy more panties and shoes, and eventually you will buy more dresses. And the two of you will have the proverbial unspoken elephant in the room, which will eventually drive a wedge between you. Resentments will follow along with a loss of emotional intimacy.

You need to sit down with your wife and talk things through NOW. Don't wait.

Edited to add:
I hadn't read your follow up post and see that you did talk it through with her. That's good. If the two of you still need to resolve things, you might go ahead and see a marriage counselor who is familiar with crossdressing. The counselor will help the two of you get on the same page.

Appreciate that, Reine. I have zero problems with her opinions, wants, or needs. I think what hurt was that it came out of nowhere - again, I don't dress around her, and the last time I'd even brought it up was several days prior to say that I'd felt the urges were subsiding again.

Earlier that day we had a fairly minor argument - the past several weeks she's been doing quite a bit of "putting herself first", and I'd asked her to help out a little more around the house (I do pretty much 90% of the stuff around here, and while I'm fine with shouldering the majority I'd said in the past I'd prefer it more like 75%) and that it'd be nice if we could spend a bit of time together. I'm wondering if there was some resentment from me saying that which simmered and led to the broadside at dinner.

There just seems to be different rules for us - not specifically when it comes to dressing, but our marriage in general. When she takes time to herself its because she works hard and its needed; when I take time to myself I get questioned on why I don't want to do things as a family. When she says anything that's hurtful to me its because she's being honest, and marriages are built on honesty. If I say anything hurtful to her, it's because I'm being deliberately spiteful. I love her to the moon and back, but there's definitely an element of selfishness to her that's been crept in the past few years (and I'm not the only one who's noticed it.) Perhaps selfishness is too harsh - the inability to accept blame or be wrong is a bit closer to it, I think.

For that I fully maintain that despite our talk and resolution I think that's just a band aid, a temporary fix. We'd talked about counseling in the past, and she'd (grudgingly) agreed and said she'd find a counselor, but never did. After the talk the other night, I implored her again to find someone since there seems to be an occasional inability to see things from the other's point of view, and she agreed. When I asked this morning if she'd had a chance to look, she seem surprised that I'd asked and felt we'd already "sorted things out."

(BTW, we both actually suspect her brother crossdresses, likely for similar reasons I do as opposed to any form of latent femininity!!)

[Teresa]

Gaz,
Your last reply reads very much what I experienced , once the dressing is out in the open there's no going back , the damage is done . The image of you has changed in your wife's eyes she may never see you the same way again .

I took over completely the domestic situation as my wife was out earning more than me but instead of treating it as an equal partnership she resented me becomming domesticated , she later commented that she felt I was trying to take her place .

It is very easy to see it as an unequal situation , a wife is permitted to make any comment she chooses while the man cannot . The problem is now you maybe walking on eggshells , do you let the dust settle or try and keep the communication going if so are you just fueling the fire ?

[Tracii G]

I see a lot of what I went thru in your words Gaz.
With my 1st wife she was extremely pampered when she lived at home and always got her way.
If I asked for help with house work it was denied because I had been away from home ( trucking on the road) therefore I had not been at home so in her eyes I was driving which to her was not working.
I would get home early on Sat worn out from 3000 miles I had driven that week.If I fell asleep anytime Sat she would yell at me. 100 hours a week roughly is what I worked but because I wasn't home it didn't seem to matter.
Late Sunday night or early Monday morning I would get my load schedule for the week and have to head back out.
She many times would throw a fit and say I loved the truck more than her but the truck is what fed and clothed us,kept a roof over our heads.
Many times she thru my clothes out in the front yard or my hunting gear which got stolen several times because she would throw it in the yard after I was gone.
I finally figured she was bi polar or just plain crazy so I kicked her out and filed for freedom.
I did win my divorce case and kept my kids,cars and houses.so she basically got her clothes.

[Jenny22]

Gaz, married 5 years, together for 8. You describe yourself as bearded, and hairy. Do you think that every time you look in a mirror and see your male self that that will make your CDing go away? No way, Gaz!! No way!! It will come back with a vengence. Don't purge! If you do, you will regret it when the vengence comes.

[Leslie Langford]

"There just seems to be different rules for us - not specifically when it comes to dressing, but our marriage in general. When she takes time to herself its because she works hard and its needed; when I take time to myself I get questioned on why I don't want to do things as a family. When she says anything that's hurtful to me its because she's being honest, and marriages are built on honesty. If I say anything hurtful to her, it's because I'm being deliberately spiteful. I love her to the moon and back, but there's definitely an element of selfishness to her that's been crept in the past few years (and I'm not the only one who's noticed it.) Perhaps selfishness is too harsh - the inability to accept blame or be wrong is a bit closer to it, I think."

You may not want to hear this, Gaz, but based on what you have written here you may need to accept the fact that you have married a narcissist. The narcissistic tendencies certainly seem to be there from what you have divulged here. It's all about her needs and wants. And isn't that a good chunk of what DADT is all about for many of us? - where the wife or SO makes the "rules" because they don't like it and don't want to see it, never mind that they are forcing us to suppress an integral part of who (and what) we are for their own benefit. I would never try to impose a similar set of circumstances on my wife...would you?

Yes, my wife sounds a lot like yours...very giving in some ways (especially when it comes to our children and her family), but in other ways it's always "I", "me", "my", "mine" etc. Add to that a very controlling nature, the inability to take "NO" for an answer, never being wrong, and unable to accept even the validity of another person's POV - never mind agreeing with it - if it differs from her own.

Yes, I have come to the sad realization after many years of marriage that my wife's narcissism is at the root of many of the problems in our relationship, coupled with the fact that I am also unwilling to be a doormat and put up with this kind of B.S. Doesn't make it any easier to accept this unfortunate reality, but at the same time it puts a lot of things that we have struggled with in the past into perspective.

Take a step back, Gaz, and think about what I have said here. It might just lead to your own "Aha!" moment as well.

[Eemz]

The degree of anger seems out of proportion to the story, so I don't think this is about CDing; it's about control. I was holding off from replying because I have strong views in this area, having been married to a narcissist myself. But since Leslie has opened that box...

It seems to me that this is the one area of the OP's life where their SO has not insisted on total control - to date. So it's been your one degree of freedom that helps to balance all the other sh..ty areas where the narcissist already holds absolute power. But now they are asserting control over this area too. Hence the anger. It's a bridge too far.

It's not about the actual CDing (for either of you). It would be the same if you played the banjo and she's suddenly saying she hates the banjo and you are never to play it again, whether she is there to hear it or not. That's about control, not musical sensibility.

[Teresa]

We may be drifting off the thread but it is a big problem living with a CONTROLLING person . Maybe we are jumping the gun with GAZ but as Eemz comments the dressing isn't the crux of the problem it's losing control that hurts them . My wife slammed the phone down when I pointed this out to her but she admmitted it before she did so .

[Tracii G]

Oh the old control thing yep been there too and yes I have to say I see that too in your words Gaz.
Still to this day after 26 years of being divorced from the woman I resent her and what she did to me and to our kids which she has very little contact with.
I still despise and hold contempt for her.
One holding complete control over the other is a recipe for trouble.

[Gaz]

While I'm obviously none too happy at her behaviour the other night, and not exactly over the moon at her apology-non-apology the evening after, my intent was to not start a wife bashing thread.

She is far from perfect, there are definitely issues in our marriage that stem from how she acts from time to time, but I feel there are a lot of assumptions being made and some are a bit over the top.

She is, by some measure, the primary bread winner. We both work, but she makes considerably more than I do - at a cost. While I work about 35 hours a week (from home), she usually puts in about 50 and that's not including a 90 minute round trip commute each day. Hence me shouldering the vast majority of the housework. (Partially out of empathy, partially out of necessity - if I left it, it would NEVER get done, hah) She is a serious workaholic, this was a known entity going into the marriage on my part (just as my crossdressing was on hers). As such, while I'm not thrilled at the fact that she's often not here (either physically, or when she is she's on her phone checking emails and whatnot) that's not a stick I can possibly beat her with.

As such, she gets drained quite a bit. As such I'm cool with her taking time to herself. Not to the extent she's been doing the past month or so, which included a weekend away (which she discussed with me prior to agreeing to go on said trip, and she did so with my blessing). This coupled with the wildfires, power blackouts, and our kid being off school for large chunks of time has led to tensions being higher than normal in most every house, ours included.

THIS IS NOT AN EXCUSE TO ATTACK ME REGARDING CROSSDRESSING, but after a couple of days to cool down and attack it rationally provides some context.

Regarding her control over me - there is an element of that, but not as many as quite a few are making out. I get my way quite often. Too often, in fact - this was something that came up in the "aftermath discussion" where I have had a habit of asking for forgiveness rather than permission. (Which I pointed out I didn't really feel like I should require either for every action, while I recognize we're partners, we're beholden to each other, which she said was fair enough actually.) She will often attempt to kick me out of the house to go on a motorcycle ride or beers with the boys, although should be noted there's not a ton of time to actually DO those things.

I've been around here long enough to have read the war stories many of you have had with your wives over the years. I know where quite a few are coming from and sympathize massively, but while many of you have had some horrible experiences, I can't honestly agree that my wife has acted in the same way. That is not in ANY way saying she's perfect or that I have issues with the way she occasionally acts or treats me, but these instances are far from the norm. (And yes, I can already sense a few eye rolls at me saying that, I get it!) She's my wife, I love her, and 99.9% of the time she's got my back. (Which might be why when the 0.1% of the time she doesn't, it comes as an absolute blow)

Still draggin' her contrarian backside to counseling, though!

[Kelly DeWinter]

Wow Gaz,

you don't want to start a wife bashing thread , then the next sentence proceed to bash your wife ?????????

No marriage is perfect.

If my wife's work week was 65 hours compared to my 35 hours I would not complain about a few hours of house work including cooking dinner EVERY day.

There is more going on with you then just cross-dressing.

Sit down examine what is really going on in your head during these high stress times and figure out a way to deal with it.

So many times in your posts you say things like "As such, she gets drained quite a bit. As such I'm cool with her taking time to herself. Not to the extent she's been doing the past month or so, which included a weekend away (which she discussed with me prior to agreeing to go on said trip, and she did so with my blessing)" So are you cool or are you not ?

Just like YOU have high stress times that you get relief by cross dressing your wife has peak stress times too. Allow her to have them.

[Gaz]

Just like YOU have high stress times that you get relief by cross dressing your wife has peak stress times too. Allow her to have them.
I do, and I am fine with it - to a point, of course. The difference is that when it gets past that point, I don’t refer to it as repellent, make it personal, or question her motives. That’s what infuriated me, and that was after weeks of taking time for spa visits, mani-pedis, binge watching Bachelor Australia (don’t ask!) nights out with the girls, and a weekend away.

When it comes to her work hours, they’re often by choice. Again, she’s a workaholic, and admits to having an inability to saying no to her boss. (Not to say her job doesn’t require more hours by default though, it most certainly does)

But point taken. In the heat of the moment, and prior to the after talk, I vented when she was behaving like the night before never happened. After a bit of time, and reading input from others, I'm taking a step back from the anger. She's asked for forgiveness, and I've given it of course, but forgetting it will take a little longer.

[SaraLin]

after weeks of taking time for spa visits, mani-pedis, binge watching Bachelor Australia (don?t ask!) nights out with the girls, and a weekend away.


I'm sure others are thinking it, but I'll come out and say it...

Are you SURE that there isn't something else going on - with her?

"working late", increased interest in personal grooming, girls' nights, weekends away, suddenly finding fault with (and personal attacks on) you, etc. etc. etc...

If it were me, I'd be worried.

just saying - It might not be your dressing that's the real issue... but I hope I'm way off base here :praying:

[Maid_Marion]

A common problem with any relationship is trying to balance individual time versus time spent together. CDs get lost in the pink fog and relationships suffer. Add a kid to the mix and you have a difficult situation.

[LingerieLuvr]

Honestly it sounds like she was just saying that she felt less attracted to you when you are dressed. It sounds like you are somewhat invested in your ?manhood? and were hurt by her words that you felt cut you to the core of who you are. She tried to stop your purge. I don?t think she?s saying she thinks less of you. So she isn?t attracted to you when you?re dressed, so what? Best case scenario is that you make a gorgeous woman, but she?s straight and not really into women. Worst case scenario is that you look completely ridiculous, and that?s why she?s not attracted to you when you?re dressed. She?s not the only one. My wife isn?t attracted to me when I?m dressed either. That doesn?t mean she loves or respects my any less.

As for the not trusting you thing, you admitted you had never purchased outerwear before. It?s logical for your wife to see you take that step and assume that your dressing had become something it never had been before, and in a way she was right. Why buy dresses bless you?re planning to go out in public right? She doesn?t know where your dressing will take you, and it?s already taking you to new places so of course the trust is going to be a little shaky.

I don?t know you personally, or your relationship, but my take is that you over-reacted. Your wife expressed her feelings, but because they were the bed-of-roses you were hoping for, you decided to punish her by making yourself miserable and making it clear to her that she was the cause of your misery. I think you need to revisit this conversation and do more listening than reacting. Honestly I think your wife just used a poor choice of words to express herself.

This is the most objective and realistic reply I've seen, and I agree 100% with the assessment.
Good comments, Micki!

[Bea_]

Suddenly last night though, it came out.

The sight of me in womens clothing was repellent to her. A massive turn off, and she admitted she viewed me as less of a man when doing so. And that despite all history with me pointing to the contrary, she is waiting for "the other shoe to drop" - because I didn't tell her about it immediately when we began dating (Took me several months to work up the courage) and therefore she can't trust me.



Before I make much of a comment, I'm curious just how accurate the quoted part of your original post is to the conversation. But, I'll say up front that I've heard similar things and the reaction I had was one of total rejection. If you ever told your wife that ANYTHING she did, the way she looked or the things she liked about herself was "repellent" and a "massive turn off" she'd feel totally rejected too.

I ask about the accuracy because I know that we tend to take much that's said to the worst interpretation rather than the actual words.

[ReineD]

Appreciate that, Reine. I have zero problems with her opinions, wants, or needs. I think what hurt was that it came out of nowhere - again, I don't dress around her, and the last time I'd even brought it up was several days prior to say that I'd felt the urges were subsiding again.

Things don't come out of nowhere though.

I'll give you an example from my own relationship. Last week my SO walked away from me in the middle of a conversation. I got really upset and told him so. He thought the conversation had been over. Just to let you know, my SO and I on the same page 99% of the time. We very rarely argue about anything! So we talked about it and as I was trying to explain why his walking away had bothered me so much (my reaction had been pretty strong for something seemingly so insignificant), I realized something that I had not been consciously aware of up until that minute. And this was that over the last year or so, I've been perceiving that he has wanted to spend less and less time with me. He's been spending a lot more time at work, or in his office downstairs, or when we're together he is buried in a book and he seems to resent it when I try to connect by commenting on things I'm reading on my laptop.

We did resolve it and I won't get into all the details, but it's just to show you that a reaction on my part that seemed to have come out of nowhere actually had been brewing, without me even being consciously aware of it, for about one year! :eek:



There just seems to be different rules for us - not specifically when it comes to dressing, but our marriage in general. When she takes time to herself its because she works hard and its needed; when I take time to myself I get questioned on why I don't want to do things as a family. When she says anything that's hurtful to me its because she's being honest, and marriages are built on honesty. If I say anything hurtful to her, it's because I'm being deliberately spiteful. I love her to the moon and back, but there's definitely an element of selfishness to her that's been crept in the past few years (and I'm not the only one who's noticed it.) Perhaps selfishness is too harsh - the inability to accept blame or be wrong is a bit closer to it, I think.

The balance of power between any husband and wife is never 50/50. In some areas, one person will always give more than the other, and in other areas this is reversed. The idea is that it should all work out over all. Yet, as human beings, most of us seem to be only aware of what more WE ourselves give that we feel is not reciprocated. Or we expect our spouse to react or behave in a way that we deem suitable, and when they don't we become upset or feel put upon.

That said, when it gets to the point where one or both partners become resentful because they think they're giving too much or they're not getting what they need, and talking about it together doesn't produce any satisfactory results, it definitely is time to seek a marital counselor ... who, as I mentioned in my prior post, will help you BOTH get on the same page - if he or she is any good at it. You may have to go through one or two counselors before you hit on the right one for both of you, but it's really worth the effort.

Please don't listen to armchair psychologists here who will diagnose your wife and tell you how deficient she is. lol. They don't know her, they don't live at your house and they don't understand the hundreds of subtle dynamics that constitute your marriage. Just see someone who can talk to BOTH of you (preferably someone who also understands the crossdressing since this is one of the issues in your marriage).

Good luck! :)