Is The Mobile Phone A Deterrent For Us?

[Vicky_Scot]

Going on a break with my wife and said i wanted to spend some time as Vicky. she was ok with that but did make a valid point.

There are people from our city whom we do not know going on the same trip and she brought up a valid point. If we meet someone
from our home town and what if they decide to take a photo of us or me for their own comedy value or just to have a photo.

Got me thinking that years ago we did not have to worry about snap happy people using their phones to take sneaky snaps and also the worry that
30 seconds later it can be all over social media.

So is this a new deterrent for us? x

[Robertacd]

We'll there's nothing you can do about it, other than tell them not to take your picture or stay inside your home.

You can't have it both ways. If you are going out in public then you have to be prepared for running into someone you know or being seen and outed.

You can not expect privacy in public.

[Teresa]

Vicky,
I'm inclined to agree with Roberta , you do take that risk . Some may say this is the problem of being with someone who may be instantly recognisable even if you're not .

[Crissy 107]

I do not think it is a big deal. The chance that this would happen I think is very small so I would not let it put a damper on your good time with your wife.

[April Rose]

Out in public is OUT in public. There is no explicit, constitutionally mandated right to privacy in the U.S. It is implied in the fourth amendment; The right to be secure in one's person.

As far as video is concerned if you are out in public, you can ask them not to take your picture. You can Tell them not to. It doesn't mean they can't.

[Sandi Beech]

Hi. I have had women take selfies of me with them at drag shows and bars. They don?t know my real name so looking for me on social media would not be so easy. I decline when they ask for my social media contact info. So I am not that worried about it. Even if they posted a picture, I am not sure I could ever find it.

Sandi

[Star01]

This conversation brings to mind the memes that go around about people of Walmart. They're slide shows about the way some people are dressed in the stores and most include people that are dressed but are not passable. There is no guarantee that we won't see ourselves in those memes if we tend towards the MIAD end of the spectrum. Everyone today walks around with sophisticated cameras in their pocket so it could happen to anyone and there is little we can do when we don't even realize someone might have taken our photo.

[Angela Marie]

I have been going out for years and have never run into someone I know (knock on wood). But the more I go out in public the more likely that this will happen. I have often thought about this and I guess if it happens my response would be an honest one. As people have pointed out that is the risk you take.

[Majella St Gerard]

If you don't want your picture taken in public by strangers, stay inside.
Only a problem for people in the closet.
I don't happen to care, I am actually proud of myself and who I am. I don't care what other people think. I post my own pictures on my own social media sites.

[Patience]

While it's not necessarily a deterrent, it's definitely a concern, if not a nuisance. I was once sitting quietly in a bar once when I saw two giggling girls pointing a phone at me from 30 or so feet away. I covered my face with my fist, giving them the finger. On another occasion, I was leaving a museum and while I was going down the steps, I had a funny feeling, so I let the guy behind me go by and sure enough, he was holding a phone which happened to be in cam mode.

While I have come to terms with the fact that some folks see us as a novelty (and a humorous one at that), I do my best not to show my face, which is I usually have a pair of sunglasses on hand when I'm out and about en femme.

[Robertacd]

there is little we can do when we don't even realize someone might have taken our photo.

In Washington state there is nothing you can do even if you catch someone taking your picture in public beyond asking them not to.

Believe it or not even taking "upskirt" photos was legal in Washington state up until just a few years ago because Washington state voyeurism law only protects people in places where they have a reasonable expectation of privacy. (When you are out in public you have NO reasonable expectation of privacy) So they actually had to make a separate law just to outlaw taking upskirt photos.

[Pumped]

"In Washington state there is nothing you can do even if you catch someone taking your picture in public beyond asking them not to."

Pretty sure in the USA anywhere out doors in public anyone can video and take pictures of you without consent. They can generally not sell or use the pictures for financial gain, unless they are an actor, reality star or some other sort of famous.

Some places getting caught trying to take an "up skirt" might get you convicted as a sexual predator. There was a man that got charged and convicted for that very thing not long ago. Pretty serious charge for such a silly thing to do.

[Tracii G]

Well what can they do?
They don't know you so why are they going to take pics of you for comedy?
That makes no sense.
Its obvious you are not "out" and you are scared that someone you don't know "might" take a pic? Come now.

Kind of like the police arresting you in a sports car because you "might" speed.

[southerngirl]

I have gotten makeovers done and sat there for an hour while they performed their magic on me. The first time I began to get really nervous that someone may take a picture with their cell phone and I would not even know it. By the end of the makeover no one had taken a picture. I then began to realize that no one really cared either. Even if they did, the internet is a great big place. Where would they post the picture? How long will it take to make the rounds through cyberspace to get to your friends and family. In reality, I don't think there is much concern. I never really worry about. I'm much more concerned within seeeing someone I know face to face.

[JessikaSometimes]

Pumped~ There are a couple states that require 2 party consent for video.
If I remember the Washington thing correctly was a 16yo kid taking upskirt pix of girls his age. The girls parents wanted to press charges but it wasn't illegal. So they made a law.

Tracii~ The OP is in danger of being spotted by people they DO know. I don't like the analogy.
A better way of looking at it would be skydiving. Its beautiful and heart pounding excitement. But if things go wrong, it could ruin your life. Its safer to stay on the ground, but if you do, you miss the experience.
Be aware of the danger, but don't let it stop you from living.

[docrobbysherry]

It is my opinion that if u r concerned about people who don't know u taking your photo when out?:eek:

U aren't ready to go out yet. If ever!:brolleyes:

[Helen_Highwater]

Some years ago I was out enfemme but sat in my car at the time, parked up at a local beauty spot. Two GG's turned up and read me, goes with the turf, and pretended they were going to take a picture or two of the scenery. It just happened I was in the scenery. I just stared hard at them, the sort of "I know what you're doing, I wouldn't if I was you" look.

If they did take a pic and post it who knows but there's probably more likelihood my car registration would be recognised than me.

[Tracii G]

Jessika she said there were people going from her city that she didn't know so maybe you read what she said incorrectly.
My point is if you are afraid to be recognized maybe you aren't ready to be out.
Sorry you don't don't like my analogy but you don't have the right to change it to fit something you like

[AngelaYVR]

Whether you are wearing a skirt or trousers, the world is full of witless clowns. Nothing will change that so decide what you are willing to accept.

[Asew]

Before someone might see you and start gossiping. Pictures and social media just make gossip easier and larger audiences.

When mall trick or treating in a femme costume, both years I got asked for pictures and other's trying to inconspicuously take pictures. Never an issue any other day I go out dressed femme or non-binary.

[Tracy Irving]

Going on a break with my wife and said i wanted to spend some time as Vicky.

If you aren't in a group setting 24/7 while on break, you should be able to find some Vicky time. Either way, have fun!

[Jean 103]

Yes it could happen.

I have had strangers ask and take my picture a few times. Most of the time I don't mind.

There was one time I was at the bar with my friends. This guy asks to take my picture and I say no. This is the only time I have said no, I was like having a bad hair day. He takes the picture anyway, I started crying. My friends didn't see, we are playing pool , so their attention was there. They ask what's wrong, than lite into the poor guy. He apologized.

[MiniRock]

I love up-skirt pictures; they're so sexy. The whole point of wearing a skirt, surely, is that there's somehow a secret path to the pleasure regions.

[Patience]

Do you encourage strangers to take upskirt pics of you without your permission for their own enjoyment (and who knows who else's), MiniRock?

[Helen_Highwater]

Mini rock,

I have to call foul on this one. Upskirting without someone's prior agreement is a form of sexual abuse. Utterly deplorable. Where do you draw a line? Grown men upskirting teenaged girls? Is that acceptable in your view?

The point of wearing skirts isn't, repeat isn't to provide a "Secret path to the pleasure regions". Women are not sexual objects solely there for the sexual gratification of a bunch of sad men.

If I were to catch anyone upskirting me I'm afraid they're in for a hard time. They might quickly find their phone being used as an anal endoscope.

[alwayshave]

Vicky, the world has changed and there are cameras everywhere. So while you are with people from your home town you run the risk they snap a photo and post to Facebook, you are be videoed constantly.

[Krisi]

Once you step out your door, you can expect pictures or video to be taken of you. Go to a bank or ATM, you are on video. Go to a store, you are on video, Gas station, same thing. Some of the major cities have video cameras rolling 24/7, especially in high crime areas. And pf course, 95% of the population is walking around with a cell phone with picture taking capabilities.

That said, if you are still recognizable as your male self while dressed as a female, you need to work on your look. A different wig perhaps, one that covers more of your face and is a different color than your natural hair. Better makeup skills, a better selection of clothing, etc. And if you dress to blend in, people aren't as likely to really examine you.

The thing that may give you away is association. If you drive a unique car, folks may put two and two together. Same thing for being out with your wife. If folks know your wife, they may figure out that that tall blonde with her is actually you in drag.

You have to decide if the risk is worth it, then do what you or your wife thinks is best.

[Teresa]

Helen,
I would say it is an infringement of privacy possibly bordering sexual abuse .

If I can turn this one round , I was photographing a wedding , the groom , best man and ushers were all wearing kilts . During the reception with drinks flowing freely in the hotel grounds two of the bridesmaids crept up behind the groom and best man and took " UPKILT " pictures ! I'm not sure what the outcome was but it did raise some smiles at the time , I found it quite funny seeing the flash go off inside their kilts .

[Tracii G]

I agree with Krisi 100%.

[kayegirl]

I also agree 100% with both Kristen and Tracii.
Teresa , all I can say is that it was a good job that I or any of my Scots relatives were not at the wedding, or upkilted , otherwise those bridesmaids would have been travelling home with their phones in the same place that Helen suggests.

[JenniferMBlack]

I don't personally find it a deterrent. But then I know I was in the video on the news during pride week here in Vegas, as well as several pictures for publications. Yes know and while everyone involved was given the opportunity to exclude themselves I opeted not to. I will add the was at the LGBTQ+ center so everyone was polite about it and always asked if they could do or take pictures.

[Helen_Highwater]

Helen,
I would say it is an infringement of privacy possibly bordering sexual abuse .

Teresa,

I disagree, it crosses the border, it is a form of sexual abuse. Would you tolerate a man doing it to say a daughter of yours? I doubt it.




Helen,

If I can turn this one round , I was photographing a wedding , the groom , best man and ushers were all wearing kilts . During the reception with drinks flowing freely in the hotel grounds two of the bridesmaids crept up behind the groom and best man and took " UPKILT " pictures ! I'm not sure what the outcome was but it did raise some smiles at the time , I found it quite funny seeing the flash go off inside their kilts .

Yep I can see the funny side and as an example it does differ in that this is a group of people who know each other. If you want to find out just how unfunny it can get, go to Scotland and try it with a regular kilt wearer. I hear the Scottish NHS will look after you just fine.

[Vicky_Scot]

Thank you all for your informative and honest responses x

[Stephanie47]

I am a Washingtonian. Yes, there is now an "up skirt" law. There have been instances of men taking pictures of young kids at all sorts of venues without any parental permission. Nothing can be done about it. There is no expectation of privacy in public, especially at a news worthy event. However, there is common courtesy. If you're a tourist and you want to take a picture of an individual you should be asking for permission. When I was a Viet Nam Memorial (Wall) in Washington, D.C. with two platoon mates and wearing tee shirts and baseball caps of our infantry brigade a group of Japanese tourists asked if they could take pictures of us with the Memorial as a back drop. I suspect the three of us ended up on numerous Japanese Facebook pages. The group was cordial enough to ask for permission and not violate our privacy. As a person I have never taken pictures of anyone without their permission. Heck, when visiting in eastern Washington my wife and I asked the homeowner of the house my wife lived in sixty years ago if it was alright to take a picture of the house.

Unfortunately, when you're out en femme expect the worst.

[JenniferMBlack]

Stephanie47
While I did not expect privacy at the event it was always extended to us. I am aware a news crew will normally just record what they feel fit. I dont know if this was at the request of the center or because we were in what is perceived as a safe space although it is public area. We were simply asked if it was ok to take pictures or film and if you were not comfortable with it you could move to another area. Personally I was not concerned and only elected not to be interviewed.

[Judy-Somthing]

Sometimes I worry about someone my wife knows sees me dress shopping.
I also worry about getting into an accident close to the place where I buy most of my dresses which is far from anywhere I would be at that time of day!

[Vintage4sarah]

You are so correct Krisi. I support your thoughts 100% also !

[lingerieLiz]

There is more to it than we tend to think about. Today with artificial intelligence (AI) your picture may be linked even if someone who does not know you and takes a picture. Most of the major social sites are already scanning and linking pictures. China is very strong in the capability.

[Krisi]

I was thinking about this thread last night and there's one thing I want to add:

If your dressing in public prompts people to whip out their camera or phone and take a photo of you, you're doing it wrong. Maybe you need to tone it down a bit. Lose the micro mini skirt and the stripper heels. Tone down the makeup and jewelry.

If you don't want to be a target for photos, dress and act like the women around you even if that means a knee length skirt or dress and flats. Or jeans and a blouse.

[AngelaYVR]

Krisi, if you think a knee length skirt saves you from attracting attention then you might need a little more real world experience. And yes, let's shift the blame away from the cretins with the cameras and evolve to suit the lowest common denominator.

[HollyCD]

I've never been in a situation to be able to dress en femme, so have only been able to go the MIAD route. When I was in my 20's I would have a few occasions to drive a couple hours from home and dress feminine in short sexy skirt, pantyhose, short heeled but cute shoes or sometimes a black leotard and tan dance tights with a short crop t-shirt and ladies tennis shoes. While I did get looks it was before the proliferation of cell phones with cameras and social media, so only had to worry about what people saw while "in the act". Last year I went into a small department store in tan dance tights with black lycra volleyball shorts and waist length ladies athletic hoodie. Caught a kid trying his best to snap a pic of me but I managed to evade. I think I'll have to dial it back a bit going forward. Shame, enjoyed those outings from the past. So yes, sadly, cell phone cameras will force me to change my behavior.

[SHINY-J]

I think this may have been an issue 10-15 years ago. At that point, it was a perfect storm for a massive technology advance. It was then that just about everyone had finally gotten a mobile phone... phone technology had just advanced to the point that every phone had a camera and most of them had internet/WiFi capability which in turn meant that you could take pics and post to MySpace or Facebook... it was a new craze that people were discovering... at that point, it would be easy to have a picture of someone hit the internet and go worldwide quickly... simply because everyone on the entire planet wasn’t doing it at that time.

Fast forward to the present and with Facebook, Instagram, Snapchat,kik, Flickr, etc... it’s beyond ridiculous how many pics are taken and uploaded every single second... there’s so much out there that it’s essentially impossible for a random, innocuous picture of someone to really get noticed.. you’d have to be doing and/or wearing something really outrageous for a picture to truly get “out there”. Add in that if they aren’t taking your picture with your consent, they’re probably at a distance and it isn’t going to be very clear and it would be really difficult to recognize you fully dressed en femme.

Also, you are constantly on video... surveillance technology is so cheap and has advanced so much that it’s not just ATM’s, banks, and late night gas station cash registers with cameras... they absolutely everywhere. I worked in bars/clubs for years both in college and after.., there wasn’t a single one that didn’t have cameras set up covering every angle... the office I work at now has cameras all around both inside and out... every single building that’s near my office has cameras all around. Pretty much every store is going to have cameras in it... same with malls, movie theaters, etc.. parking garages and many parking lots have cameras,.., not to mention all of the cameras set up at stoplights and many busy intersections... also, don’t forget about how many people have dashcams set up in their cars ... I see them much more frequently these days.

The fact is, one way or another, there’s going to be pics of you somewhere... they may not be up close drivers license photos, but somewhere, you’re on a video or picture in some capacity. The good news is that unless you’re doing something crazy or wearing something wild and outrageous, then it’ll probably be deleted or be buried away deep in someone’s phone that’ll never e uploaded and never see the light of day.

[susan54]

In Scotland, the home of the kilt, it is illegal to upskirt. The law does not distinguish kilts from other skirts or mention the gender of the victim. When I go out fully dressed I dress very smartly in appropriate places and no one has ever photographed me with a mobile phone or camera - as far as I know. When I dress as a man in a skirt or dress I would expect it to happen more but it has not. Maybe Scots are just more tolerant and polite - a man in a skirt or a fully dressed crossdresser is just part of life not something to record and put on social media. It is not something I worry about. The only exception is the guy sitting at the entrance to the women's changing room playing with his phone. He is bored and might just take a picture of the guy carrying the dresses into or out of the changing room. I have only seen this once and simply waited until he had left.

[AllieSF]

As others have already said, when you are out, you are basically outing yourself, yes, hopefully to strangers that will never communicate anything about you back to someone who knows you. That being said, to make it safer for you, you need to consider location, location and location first and then how possible/probable it may be that you would run into someone who knows you and your wife. Then it boils down to is the enjoyment of the moment worth the risk. Good luck and enjoy.

[Stephanie47]

If your dressing in public prompts people to whip out their camera or phone and take a photo of you, you're doing it wrong. Maybe you need to tone it down a bit. Lose the micro mini skirt and the stripper heels. Tone down the makeup and jewelry.If you don't want to be a target for photos, dress and act like the women around you even if that means a knee length skirt or dress and flats. Or jeans and a blouse.

It's not a matter of doing it wrong. You can do it totally womanly with a knee length dress, flats, simple makeup and run of the mill hair style/wig. It's the physical features that will draw attention. I'm six foot and 195 lbs. With all the "encouragement" on this site do you really think I would fly under the radar? Not hardly. Maybe, I should just "do it" and throw all caution to the wind, but, that will not stop somebody from taking a picture and posting it on some website or Facebook page. And, just hope the person does not take a shot of your car's license plate.

[BobbiJo C]

Earlier this week I was at a bridal salon trying on dresses. I tried on 12, with at least 3 pic taken of each one.
In the background on the pics were numerous women and teens viewing dresses on themselves, as I.
Each one was having some pics taken. I'm sure I'm in the background of a few of them.
When out in public you have to own it.
By the way, I only pass to a blind person from a very long distance.

[faltenrock]

Big risk, I never let anyone take a picture of me dressed, only with my own mobile phone.

[Krisi]

Going on a break with my wife and said i wanted to spend some time as Vicky. she was ok with that but did make a valid point.

There are people from our city whom we do not know going on the same trip and she brought up a valid point. If we meet someone
from our home town and what if they decide to take a photo of us or me for their own comedy value or just to have a photo.

Got me thinking that years ago we did not have to worry about snap happy people using their phones to take sneaky snaps and also the worry that
30 seconds later it can be all over social media.

So is this a new deterrent for us? x

Yes, mobile phones can be a problem. Many years ago, most people did not carry cameras with them everywhere they went (including the bathroom). Smart phones have made everyone a photographer (skilled or not). And of course, these days, there are video cameras in stores, banks, ATMs gas stations, and in some cities, on every street corner. If you leave your home, dressed or not. you will be photographed.

The issue is, Does it matter? Hopefully, when you get yourself all dolled up, you won't be recognizable. People may realize you are a man in woman's clothes but they won't say "Oh, that's Jim from our church." So out by yourself, away from your neighborhood, friends and co-workers, you're pretty safe.

The problem is, if you are with your wife, if someone knows or recognizes your wife and sees you standing by her side, they may put two and two together and you've been outed. You should have this planned ahead of time, you being her friend, neighbor, cousin, whatever, but they may see through it. And photos are a bigger risk because you have no control over who sees them.

In the end, you and your wife have to analyze the risk and make your own decision. Best of luck and enjoy your trip.

[Amelie]

When I use to go to night clubs in NYC back in the day, there were always guys with cameras. They worked for magazines and other stuff. I am on sites today looking at these photos that these guys took hoping to see me back then. I found some people I know but not me.

The only problem today is someone taking a picture of me not ready for the camera. Sort of like how paparazzi take pics of actresses without make up. I wouldn't like a picture of me throwing up in some alley with my wig on backwards. And today, everyone is the paparazzi.

[Angela Marie]

I am extremely cautious when I go out dressed; change of clothes, makeup remover, etc. But realistically at some point in time I will see someone I know. Maybe they won’t recognize me; but if they do I?m going to have to own it. The expression of my feminine side is important to me. If someone judges me simply on my gender expression; oh well.

[Suranne]

To me, personally, this isn't a worry. I go out, and I'm seen. It makes no difference if that 'seen' is wirh eyes or a camera. That's what going outside is all about.

[Micki_Finn]

When I dress, I EXPECT people to want to take pictures. I LOVE having strangers come up and say “omg you look amazing can I take a picture with you?” So definitely not a deterrent.