Freedom of speech .

[Teresa]

I find I'm using certain words I wouldn't have used often or the same context as I do when out as Teresa . I wondered if others find they do the same thing ?

It's a simple enough story that made me think about this , I was out doing some jobs and had to pop back to Matalan to change a sweater for a larger size , the SA didn't have a problem and asked me to try the larger size on to double check . I had a little time on my hands so ended up checking other items out , before I knew it I had a basket full before heading for the changing area . The size 14 sweater was a better fit but I'd also picked up a pale blue version as well which looked OK . I then had a nice voile top to try on and finally a short sleeved dress in a nice tan shade . I was checking the fit of the dress in the full length mirror when a mother helping her daughter glanced over and admired the dress saying how stylish it was and how great it would look with boots , I agreed saying I had a suitable brown pair , the half naked daughter stuck her head round the curtain and agreed with us .

When I was checking them through at the sales counter the SA picked up the voile top and I said , " it's so pretty " she agreed it was a lovely fabric in blue with flower motiffs .

As I walked away I had to think if I'd ever used the phrases about clothes like " it's so pretty " and then thinking back to the changing room comments no one had ever said my clothes looked stylish in male mode and then gone on to say what would would team up with it to make a nice outfit .

Being TG we are so lucky having this aspect of our lives , having far fewer inhibitions than in male mode , I could imagine the look on my wife's face if I told her an item of clothing was pretty or suggesting what items to put together to make an outfit , now it feels so natural .

[Beverley Sims]

I am always using feminine embellishments for descriptions and expressing myself.

Sometimes it is tricky when I use a feminine description for some garment or product I like dressed in drab.

That is rare these days tho'.

[Marianne S]

That's interesting, Teresa. I recall buying a nice half slip with a lacy hem--I forget the brand, but it had a label attached with those very words: "It's So Pretty!" And it was!

I have to say that I think some men are needlessly inhibited in expressing themselves--as if "masculinity" sternly required them to make no display of emotion whatsoever! Or at least never to "gush" about anything. I myself never felt awkward telling my own wife that something was "pretty." It just seemed natural to me. I'd guess a lot of men are thinking it, but not saying it.

However, when it comes to suggesting what would team up with something to make a great outfit, that calls for "thinking ahead" in terms of clothing coordinates, and I agree that most men are probably not thinking along those lines!

Speaking of "speech" in general, we learn a new word every day. I had no idea what "Matalan" was. Marks and Sparks, yes, but not Matalan. Luckily we have the Web and Wikipedia to inform us about these things today. Unlike the venerable M&S, I gather Matalan didn't expand in a big way until the mid-90s, and I've only been in the UK once since then, which accounts for my unawareness of their existence. The British chain whose name I found most appealing was "Knickerbox." I'm not clear if they're still in business, but that sure was the cutest name!

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I could imagine the look on my wife's face if I told her an item of clothing was pretty...

Oh, I have to add something about that. Why are many men so needlessly inhibited about expressing themselves?

Some of it may be an innate male personality trait. Some of it may be "taught" or modeled by their fathers or other men: "This is how to be 'manly': the 'strong, silent' type." But some of it may be about women's reactions as well.

My own wife would never have thought it odd for me to say something was "pretty." However, before she and I were together I was in a relationship with another woman whose reactions were very different.

The most extreme example of this, which still sticks in my mind so many decades later, was when we went together to rent a U-Haul truck. I told the guy at the desk I had some goods I needed to move from such-and-such a place, which in any case was relevant to the size and type of truck I needed. After we left the place, she scolded me purely for being so "chatty" with the guy and telling him "unnecessary" things. The message I got was that in her mind, "men (unlike women) don't 'chatter' needlessly; it's 'unmasculine.'"

Well, screw that! "I yam what I yam," as Popeye would say. If I'm chatty, I'm chatty, so don't call me "Cathy" on that account!

That wasn't all. There were other examples. I recall her talking about an event that made the news some years earlier, way back in 1972, involving Senator Edmund Muskie's campaign for the Presidency. I can do no better than quote verbatim from Wikipedia ("https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Edmund_Muskie):


[The Manchester Union Leader] released an article that contained accusatory reference to [Muskie's] wife, Jane, as a drunkard and racially intolerant. On the morning of February 26, Muskie gave a speech to supporters outside of the Manchester Union-Leader offices in Manchester, New Hampshire. His speech was viewed as emotional and defensive; he called the newspaper's editor a "gutless coward." Muskie gave the speech during a snowstorm which created the appearance of him crying. Though Muskie later attempted to claim that what had appeared to the press as tears were actually melted snowflakes, the press reported that Muskie broke down and cried, shattering the candidate's image as calm and reasoned.

I have no idea whether the guy was really crying or not. But her comment was scathingly contemptuous: "What a wimp!" she said.

Yeah, "men don't cry," right! How would she have reacted if she'd seen me crying at my mother's funeral, say? Once again, screw that crap!

Another incident I recall was rather "intimate," so to speak. We were lying naked on our backs on the bed, and I idly crossed my legs in such a fashion as to hide "you-know-what." She was horrified! "Don't do that!" she shrieked. Anything that seemed to detract from "masculinity" in her eyes was cause for horror.

I'm not saying she was a "bad woman"--she had many good qualities--though we did have other incompatibilities as well, especially a lack of "child-mindedness" on her part. But I can only be thankful that I had the lovely wife I did have, and not this particular woman, who I know would never for one moment have accepted my crossdressing! She would have hit the roof and run out the door screaming!

To what extent are women responsible for keeping men straitjacketed in stereotypical "male" roles? I'll leave that question open to the floor! :D

[MeshelleCD]

Maybe it is just me, but I can see using the phrase, "It's so pretty" for women's clothes, but not men's clothes.

[Teresa]

Marianne,
I have a funny incident related the the Matalan store in my new home town , at the time when I was seeing my gender counsellor her office was on the oppoite side of the road . I had some time to kill before the appointment so I went for a walk round the store , the first thing I picked up on was a guy checking out some heels and when I reached the changing area a teenage boy was looking round the curtain of the ladies section calling to his mother to pick a larger size and she was returning with a blouse and skirt . During my consulatation I mentioned she will never be stuck for clients judging from what I had just witnessed in the store , she had quiet a laugh about that one .

As for the male straightjacket , I've often referred to that in the past , what a boy / male is and isn't allowed to show or say . I'm not sure if something is changing in my hormones but I have become more tearful , which I don't think is a bad thing . At Xmas my daughter gave me a framed picture of me as Teresa with my granddaughter sitting on my knee , I was very touched with that geture and did shed a tear .

That Popeye saying is very apt men are what they're told to be , TGs can be what they want to be ! My wife always said , "I could talk the hind leg off a donkey " because I chatted to everyone and I also recall an incident some years ago where I was playing around and tucked my parts under , my wife went balistic !!

Bev ,
It's good to see you back .

[Dutchess]

To what extent are women responsible for keeping men straitjacketed in stereotypical "male" roles? I'll leave that question open to the floor! :D
None .
I dont know what your GF's problem was but I couldn't even be friends with someone like that .
I have always liked creative sensitive guys so mine have always cried , laughed , had emotional moments , said whatever I had on was pretty - I met my companion over a lilly pulitzer dress we both thought was pretty . No inhibitions . I am sort of surprised since Teresa was a photographer that you have not been that way as well .
Back in the very late 1979-80 still in the south I had a pimp come into a clothing store at the same time I did and I let him TOTALLY dress me because he WANTED too and I was game and it was great. He was in there getting clothes for a "GF" and happened upon me .
He put me totally together for a week straight of clubbing with a different outfit for every night and made sure I KNEW was the most beautiful thing alive and wore those clothes like no ones business. They were gorgeous clothes and we BOTH said so . Granted he worked in womens minds for a living but if he could say it and make it stick then ANYONE could . He pretty much had zero inhibitions and did whatever he wanted on a daily basis anyway .

Anybody can be what they want to be emotionally , you don't have to be a TG . Not at all . 99% of that is in your head and how you are raised - then still most of it is in your head . It is certainly not your woman's fault .

[Teresa]

Dutchess,
I guess I'm from an age group and background that had boys/men stuck on that pedestal , I spent much of my adult life trying to live up to and prove it so . My photography was just seen as a job , or to my wife something that made money , she never really connected why I was good at it besides I spent all my spare time renovating my homes or my son or daughter's homes . As long as I was doing men's work in my wife's eyes that's all that mattered .

[Helen_Highwater]

Isn't the pivotal point from Teresa's original post that women communicate far more freely with others, people they've never met before and engage. It's seen as socially acceptable for women to do this whereas if it were two males and one commented to the other how good he looked the recipient is likely to think te guy's gay and hitting on him.

The language used is immaterial. It's the very fact that females feel free to do it is the notable point.

[Teresa]

Helen,
So right , when was the last time you saw a guy in the male changing area and told him he looked , stylish , butch, macho whatever ? I wonder what the response might have been ? Now I've had to stop and think when was the last time I needed to use a male changing area , even when I had to buy some male jeans I tried them in the ladies side along with some women's items .

[Dutchess]

We just do not compliment each other constantly like you all seem to think we do . That has been discussed here before . I don't engage with anyone I don't know . If some woman told me that in the changing room it would make me feel like she wanted something . That HAS actually happened to me in wal mart very recently. I was in the restroom ( against my better judgement ) and a woman complimented me on a kimono I had on and I thought great , whats next and I tried to wash my hands and get out of there but nope not before she hit me up for some cash .
I hated it . I try not even to make eye contact anymore .

I had to laugh though that this made me think of my dear fiance , when he was younger , a young teen , he lived in Mammoth Ca. A ski town full of either movie folk or local rednecks and he had such an eye for hot colors and loved all kinds of fashion , This was in the mid 70's and he had no problem wearing a pair of hot pink satin pants and a red velvet shirt out on the streets there on his BIKE or walking . He was so bold . He loved it and yes thought it was pretty . I did too and even now that hes been gone two years still call him my fancy pants .

[docrobbysherry]

U kinda lost me on this post, Teresa. However, it reminded me of the week we spent in my youth, surfing off Cannon's Point in Mazatlan!:D

[Tracii G]

I don't even think about things like that anymore.
Saying its so pretty is just a normal thing for me.

[Teresa]

Dutchess,
It was something I didn't expect but it is as descibed in my opening thread , as are all my previous threads where these comments have been made , I've no reason to BS anyone I relate my stories to give others confidence should they need it to try the RW .

Tracci,
Exactly my point , in male mode we often don't have the freedom of speech that GGs have , I also agree it's not something I give a second thought to anymore .

[Dutchess]

U kinda lost me on this post, Teresa. However, it reminded me of the week we spent in my youth, surfing off Cannon's Point in Mazatlan!:D

LOL I am glad you said that , I actually thought of that too Sherry !

Bottom line is that you can say or think whatever you want too , you may have to watch the company you say it in sometimes but you certainly don't have to be trans or have on certain clothing to think something is pretty , lovely , FANCY , hot , whatever . You do you - you BE you , don't limit your words or thoughts as long as they aren't harmful - whatever you identify as .

[Lana Mae]

At my last endo appointment, I told the doctor that her outfit was cute! When I was the other gender, I never would have said something like that! Yes, I was being truthful! I am basically the same person, but Lana Mae is a little more forward! LOL Hugs Lana Mae

[Stephanie47]

Maybe one of the reason my marriage is approaching fifty years is because I have always complimented my wife on her appearance; physical and clothing. And, I have shown interest in what she does. On the other hand I have seen too many marriages fail because both the husband and wife seem to ignore each other, except when either wants something. It's a rare day when I see a woman approach another woman and compliment the other on her appearance or attire without knowing her. I think there is an unwritten rule in a store that it is alright to offer an opinion, especially when it appears someone is on the fence. Check out the mannerisms and facial expressions. They're clues. Yes, it's a rare day when a guy is going to compliment a guy about attire. But, talk about a fishing rod in Bass Pro Shop or wheel covers, etc, they'll strike up a conversation.

If the occasion does arise I will compliment a woman on her looks. An observation I have made over the decades is, if a woman's husband does not acknowledge her attributes, a compliment is more than welcome. If some asshole of a guy thinks I'm an somewhat unmanly for noticing something or making a compliment, I am more than willing to swap some stories of the ultimate "manly" activities.

[Marianne S]

We just do not compliment each other constantly like you all seem to think we do . That has been discussed here before . I don't engage with anyone I don't know .

Well, we have to be reasonable about gender differences like these. They're rarely radical or absolute. But they are differences in kind and in degree. I'm sure that women are more likely to compliment a woman they know than a woman they don't know. And it's not as if men "never" compliment one another. A guy might say to guy he knows, about a smart new jacket, say, "Hey, that looks sharp, man!" And I've had compliments myself from guys I didn't know--like a male cashier at a checkout, say--but it was typically about the design of a T-shirt I was wearing. Led Zep, Pink Floyd, and Jurassic Park among others do attract many fans, not to mention my Alfred Hitchcock T-shirt with the famous silhouette outline in white on black.

However, that kind of male compliment is subtly different in being a comment on the clothes themselves, or approving one's choice of clothing, without any risk of "gay" implications about how "attractive" the wearer himself may be. And certainly I've never been told as a male that anything I was wearing was "pretty"! :D


If some woman told me that in the changing room it would make me feel like she wanted something . That HAS actually happened to me in wal mart very recently. I was in the restroom ( against my better judgement ) and a woman complimented me on a kimono I had on and I thought great , whats next and I tried to wash my hands and get out of there but nope not before she hit me up for some cash .
I hated it . I try not even to make eye contact anymore .

I'm sorry you had that experience. But WalMart is WalMart, after all.


I had to laugh though that this made me think of my dear fiance , when he was younger , a young teen , he lived in Mammoth Ca. A ski town full of either movie folk or local rednecks and he had such an eye for hot colors and loved all kinds of fashion , This was in the mid 70's and he had no problem wearing a pair of hot pink satin pants and a red velvet shirt out on the streets there on his BIKE or walking . He was so bold . He loved it and yes thought it was pretty . I did too and even now that hes been gone two years still call him my fancy pants .

Well, I'm sure he was a cool guy! He had to be bold to do that. The trouble is, the mere mention of those pants just cracked me up. It reminded me instantly of Allan Sherman's classic "You Went the Wrong Way, Old King Louie" (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ohom8t0O-bg):


To you King Louie we say Phooey!
You disappointed all of France.
But then what else could we expect
From a king in silk stockings
And pink satin pants?

Isn't this a FUN thread that Teresa started? ;)

[Amy Lynn3]

Teresa, I have gotten to the point I use words I would never used in my youth. My son reminds me all the time to not say that, because I sound like a girl.

[alwayshave]

Teresa, I don't know that I have used the term "That's so pretty." However, I have discussed with my wife different clothing and how I prefer one over the other. Which is something I have never done before. Even my wife has commented I can't believe I'm having this conversation.

[Jenny22]

In drab, I will compliment a woman's nails, but that's it. Shopping, I may say to myself "that's so pretty". Because of those reactions, I lived in a Pink Fog for a loooong time.

[Dutchess]

I'm sorry you had that experience. But WalMart is WalMart, after all.

Actually I saw her few weeks later over at Home Depot then a month or so later over in the Nordstroms Parking lot




Well, I'm sure he was a cool guy! He had to be bold to do that. The trouble is, the mere mention of those pants just cracked me up. It reminded me instantly of Allan Sherman's classic "You Went the Wrong Way, Old King Louie" (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ohom8t0O-bg):


To you King Louie we say Phooey!
You disappointed all of France.
But then what else could we expect
From a king in silk stockings
And pink satin pants?

Isn't this a FUN thread that Teresa started? ;)

S/he was not only cool but also the love of my life ..very bold and not afraid to go out dressed anywhere and present how she wanted anywhere to anyone while giving me lots of very public kisses /affection and had no issue telling anyone that anything was pretty . Alot of people here could take a lesson from her ....
S/he was not on this site but a old member here introduced me to her .
S/he choked to death on accident while alone two years ago last Wednesday .

[Sometimes Steffi]

My wife got me a red plaid flannel shirt for my birthday. But, she said that I cold exchange it if I wanted to. I told her that, "I just love the colors." After I said that, I thought, "OMG. I just told my wife that I love the colors. If that isn't such a femme thing to say, and that's what I said to my unaccepting wife." I think she didn't call me on it because my daughter, who doesn't know, was there.