Crossdressing and GG Relatability

[Elaina]

Have your crossdressing habits made you more relatable to GGs? Do GGs seem to respond differently to you, and discuss things differently than they do with men who present themselves as men, simply because you crossdress? (Edit: I should specify that I am referring to your interactions with GGs when you are not dressed up, as opposed to interacting with them when you are.)

I have always found that I am more comfortable being around women than men. I often have GGs tell me that I communicate like they do, and that I am much more empathetic and in tune with them than their male companions. Although I believe that I am likely to fall within the trans spectrum, I also think that my years as a crossdresser have made me more emotionally and psychologically akin to the female perspective than GMs who present as men. There is something about the divine feminine within that makes me feel like I am more open, receptive, and synchronized with GGs in my interactions with them than the GMs that might be present.

Do you all have similar experiences?

[Sherrii]

Yes, Sherrii

[GretchenM]

I see that you are new here. So WELCOME to the forum.

You have asked a really good question. I don't go out in public, but many of the members here do or have. I think as you dig deeper into past posts by people here you will find that many have had very good interactions with GG's. You might try to use the search function, but it is complex question so that might not work real well. But it should not be difficult to find some of those threads.

GG's tend to be more accepting of gender variance. Sadly that often does not extend to husbands. Even some GG's with quite traditional views of gender are tolerant. There are lots of very complex reasons why this exists with GG's but not GM's. It has to do with people adhering to the traditional gender thinking that society has followed for the last few thousand years. But that is changing and shifts in attitudes in both males and females are occurring and spreading quickly, more so in Europe than the U.S., but it is happening in both places. And also elsewhere including Australia, New Zealand, Japan and other countries around the world. But everywhere it seems the males lag in acceptance of crossdressing and general gender variance while females are more accepting. That said, society has a long ways to go before that is a general attitude and it can go backwards at times.

[Jean 103]

Yes.
Most of my friends are women and I'm accepted or at least treated as one. With my friends it doesn't matter how I am dressed it's female pronouns all the time.

With the general public it goes more to how I am representing. Generally women will assume that if you are dressed like a woman you want to be a woman and will treat you accordingly.

Whether you do or don't want to be a woman, don't know what you want it doesn't matter. Unless you are looking for a mate what does it matter?

So for a casual relationship it may not but if you are like me and making close friends it does.

[Krisi]

I don't think my crossdressing has changed how I relate to other people, male or female. It's just something I do.

[DianeT]

Hi Elaina, I suppose (and that's a guess from a guy like me who doesn't go out dressed so maybe a pinch of salt there) that crossdressers in female mode meeting with GGs are less keen to hit on them for one thing, and that fact alone changes the type of relation you can have.

[Paulie Birmingham]

My wife and her female friends used to hang out with a group of gay men. They shared a lot of interests with my wife and her friends. I guess you can say they related to each other. It's not the cding but the personality whether real or clothing induced.

[Teresa]

Elaina,
You've asked a slightly confusing question because you ask if your relationship is different with GGs when not dressed so unless you've told them how do they know ? If they don't know perhaps you're behaviour may come over as slightly weird . If they do know it's a different matter evenso the interaction when presenting as female is still different . On the whole most CDers /TG people are more comfortable with women , men on the whole do have more hang-ups but then most people when dressed aren't looking for a male relationship so the disomfort maybe a two way thing .

The dressing process or the thought of it can release certain chemicals in the brain the outcome being your feelings are different , we can feel more intune with women but let's not forget women won't always feel the same way .

Personally I feel more in tune with both men and women because I'm not struggling with an inbalance anymore , the highs and lows of dressing have gone .

As for GG reaction , the one thing that has surpised me is being told they prefer me as Teresa when they've known me in both modes simply because I'm a calmer, happier person .

[char GG]

I think Paulie Birmingham is on the right track.


It's not the cding but the personality whether real or clothing induced.

I have been involved with many different types of groups (CDers, motorcycle, sailing, work-out, etc) and it definitely comes down to personality. It doesn't matter what they are wearing.

My question to the OP would be whether or not there are conversations with the same women when not CD'ed? Are the results the same or different?

[Teresa]

Char,
Could that situation be more to with trust ?
I agree though a basic personality doesn't change that much , maybe I notice it more with my driving , I feel I don't have to prove anything as a woman , I don't speed , I'm more courteous but I do have more minor bumps !!

[bridget thronton]

I think I have become a little more empathic and have become a slightly better listener and I think women often have more interesting things to say - so yes

[Devi SM]

Elaine,
As you're new in this forum I had read all your post.
I can see several interesting elements in your post and I can say you're looking for acceptance. That's a common need for any human being more when one is "weird" or different from the common "normal".
Answering your question, yes. Without knowing I was trans all the time I had more affinity with women than men, but I'm not sure if that is a trait of trans people. You mention to think you're more in the spectrum of being g more trans than crossdresser. There's a section in this forum where mostly trans people post and comment because with them time, some learn that life for us is more than just dressing g as the opposite sex.
So again I'd like to ask you for a more deeper answer what made you think that your life is not falling with being openly trans?

[char GG]

Teresa,

I'm not quite sure what you mean by "trust"?

To me, trust is not immediate. Trust is built over time no matter what people are wearing. I would never trust a stranger with any in depth conversation, however, I would trust a friend with the same comversation after a period of time.

I'm not sure, to what level the OP's knows the people that she is talking about. I don't think the type of clothes people wear would cause me to trust anyone more or less if I just met them.

Not sure why you drive differently when CD'ed Teresa. I guess that would be a personal mindset.

[jacques]

hello Elaina,
I think that I agree with you, but I am not sure why. Women do not know that I crossdress, but I know what it is like to dress in women's clothes. Perhaps that makes me empathetic?
luv J

[laura.lapinski]

Elaina, I would say that GG relate to you more because you are who you are, and not because you CD. The CDing, along with your great communication skills and easy-going relating to females in conversation both come from your personality and being.

I too have always worked well with women and found it easy to earn their trust, and get along with them, but I'm not sure that it is any greater than my ability to do that with men. I kind of relate to every one and can see the good or bad in everyone, including in myself.

[Micki_Finn]

To echo what some have said here. Women don’t open up because of what you’re wearing. They open up because they feel safe. If you treat women respectfully, and they are comfortable with you, they’ll be open regardless of how you dress.

[Stephanie47]

My cross dressing has nothing to do with relating to women or men. I tend to gravitate towards women and men who offer some intelligent interaction or conversation. I find many men to be totally boring. Many men seem to be dismissive of women. Many women seem to be subservient to men. I hang out with men and women who treat each other with respect and on an equal playing field.

I will say being a cross dresser has reinforced my acceptance of all others. Growing up in the 1960's I had a tough time with self acceptance of my desire to wear women's clothing. There was a lot of self loathing and self hatred. If I came to accept who I was, although I do not know why I do what I do, then it follows I should be accepting of others who do not fit the "traditional" roles of society.

[AllieSF]

I and my friend Rachael Sloane from this site used to comment to each other how it was so interesting that we could meet GG's, total strangers, and end up getting into deep conversations with them. We figured out that as Micki says, they feel safe when communicating with one or two CDing men, strangers. We used the term, disarming, as in, we disarmed their defences so that they would share a lot of personal information to us, as we shared our information with them. We were not the typical male who would normally be hitting on them for a date or whatever. We met and continue to meet hundreds of strangers like that in restaurants, wine bars and at some type of event. Some of those strangers have become friends as we bump into them regularly.

I also agree that our personalities and communications skills also come into play. I am very extroverted and have no problem now to walk up to a table of women, or men, or mixed, and start a conversation with one or all of them. I am also naturally curious about everything, so I continually ask questions about careers, whether they are dating, whatever. I have found that most people do want to share who they are with someone, because among friends sometimes the other friend doesn't ask one about a lot of things that they would like to share with someone, and this applies to men too.

[Robertacd]

We all like to think we are "so in tune" with GG's because we dress like them...

But IMHO, that's just wishful thinking.

Sure, there are few conversations I could have with a GG that most GM's probably would not feel comfortable having. But those would tend to center around clothes, hair, and makeup or their related issues.

But after that, there's really nothing...:sad:

[Devi SM]

We all like to think we are "so in tune" with GG's because we dress like them...

But IMHO, that's just wishful thinking.

Sure, there are few conversations I could have with a GG that most GM's probably would not feel comfortable having. But those would tend to center around clothes, hair, and makeup or their related issues.

But after that, there's really nothing...:sad:

wow! I never thought that between us, people with a higher femenine sensitivity I would hear a comment like this.

Roberta, with that derogatory macho comment I would be sure that you have no wife and if you shes6an angel living g with you.

If you don't know, there had been great women in history with great achievements that today men can achieve.
I won't give you examples here to not embarrased you more.
Women can be more intellectual than me because they don't have the strong load of sex that men have with testosterone. That let them be more sensitive and stupid men had created the myth women have a sixth sense, there's no such thing but just the use of the brain.
Your comment prove my theory that a man that dress as a wiman still being a man, a crossdresser but just the real one can move forward and get the shot with hormones that really make the change in a man's brain and soul to understand better a woman.
Mho

Devi

[rachaelsloane]

Oh, where to begin. I'm Allie's friend Rachael and I have her to blame for all the trouble (not really) we have gotten into over the years. Yes, we do unarm them in many ways, although I believe they do not have that "hitting" on them (little do they know) feeling. Over the years, Allie and I have been invited to Weddings, New Year's Eve party, Dance events, etc and all because we were Allie and Rachael. There have been evening when I have met someone new and the conversation has been about their relationships that would never have occurred if I was out as a male.
Hopefully this helps your curiosity?

[Elaina]

I am sorry if I was not clear when I posed the original question. I will try to clarify:

I don't dress up in public, and the women that I work with are not aware (I think) of my crossdressing activities. However, they tell me that they can relate to me better than any men that they have known, and that I am able to "hang with the girls" because I show empathy and compassion. As a result, they often have conversations with me that they say they don't have with the men in their lives.

I think that part of the reason is simply because being an open, kind-hearted, compassionate person can allow for strong connections to be made. If you put a group of such people together, then really have a wonderful dynamic both emotionally and socially. So, personality really has a lot to do with it.

But at the same time, I think that my crossdressing lifestyle has made me more aware of what it is like to be feminine, and consequently, I feel like I can relate to women (and they can relate to me) better than if I were not a crossdresser.

It is interesting to see that some of the respondents here have pointed out that crossdressing can have such an impact, and others believe that personality is the key. It goes to show that there are many different paths that people can take that can still bring them all to the same point. So, to each her own! :)

[Robertacd]

wow! I never thought that between us, people with a higher femenine sensitivity I would hear a comment like this.

Roberta, with that derogatory macho comment I would be sure that you have no wife and if you shes6an angel living g with you.

If you don't know, there had been great women in history with great achievements that today men can achieve.
I won't give you examples here to not embarrased you more.
Women can be more intellectual than me because they don't have the strong load of sex that men have with testosterone. That let them be more sensitive and stupid men had created the myth women have a sixth sense, there's no such thing but just the use of the brain.
Your comment prove my theory that a man that dress as a wiman still being a man, a crossdresser but just the real one can move forward and get the shot with hormones that really make the change in a man's brain and soul to understand better a woman.
Mho

Devi

LOL okay you don't know me at all. I am not sure where you picked up the feeling that I somehow think GG's are a lesser species, but you are so wrong.

I am sorry if the truth hurts, but one thing I have learned in my TG journey is to stop lying to myself most of all.

GG's being able to open up to a GM and talk to them like they would talk to another GG has nothing to do with the GM being CD or TG. It has everything to do with the GM's personalty and their ability to listen and empathize with GG's.

[Star01]

Crossdressing aside my wife has always said that for a guy I'm emotional and react to things more like a woman than a man. She would get frustrated and comment that she felt like she had to be the protector rather than the other way around which is the typical male role. I have a relative who runs a shop where she gives lectures, has palm readers and that sort of thing in and she claims to have clairvoyant powers. One day out of the blue years ago they were talking about me and my cousin said "he has gender issues". I'm not sure if the "spirits" told her that or if she just picked up on it but even though I think I'm projecting a male image apparently others are picking up different signals. I don't know if that's indicative of me being a closet crossdresser but I have gotten that type of reaction unsolicited.

[Teresa]

Char,
On the whole do women feel safer or trust a gay man more because they don't appear to be an obvious threat ? Perhaps Micki made it clearer .

Elaina,
Perhaps you should have made your presentation clearer in your opening thread , so the women you feel more empathy with don't know your background , it's really down to your personality in that case and nothing to do with CDing . A nice person will always be a nice person and people pick up on that .

[char GG]

@Teresa,

I have gay male friends but I don't feel any safer or trust them differently than any other friends.

It all comes down to compatible personalities, not gender, CD, or sexual orientation.

[Teresa]

Char ,
Thanks for that , it was something I'd seen a GG comment on here on the forum , so I asked the question .

[GretchenM]

Elaina, your second post is most significant in my mind. You say, "However, they tell me that they can relate to me better than any men that they have known, and that I am able to "hang with the girls" because I show empathy and compassion. As a result, they often have conversations with me that they say they don't have with the men in their lives."

Your identity is linked to and derived from your social mind which regulates your behavior. In other words, at least when associating with women, you turn on your more feminine skills to interact with them in a way that is socially acceptable. So, at those times they sense, in reacting to you, that you are more like them than like most of the men they interact with. Therefore the interaction becomes more female-like.

That is the very essence of gender identity. Our gender identities are not linked to our sex as evidenced by the way the genitals are configured. That has virtually nothing to do with whether you are male or female like in identity. Our brains communicate with each other by linking through our sensory channels that feed information to our social brain and our social brain utilizes whatever neural networks that are appropriate to properly react in a fashion that creates a comfortable communication with another person that your brain has quickly read and developed a presumptive picture of the way that person is. From there on it is simply adaptive communication as you learn and sense more about the person you are communicating with.

Many women can very comfortably communicate with men that are weak in feminine gender skills because that woman's brain is configured to allow for that kind of communication. Most likely they have had to do a lot of communicating with those kinds of men and their brain has developed, through brain plasticity, the proper circuitry to allow them to interact in that way. One would say that such women have a male-like gender identity they can utilize when they have to but they also have a female-like gender identity that they turn to when communicating with women. Or perhaps they have the male-like identity as a dominant identity and are less adept at female communication. It all depends on how our brains have configured themselves consistent with the experiences the person has had.

So your gender identity is a part of your sense of self which guides everything you do. But that identity and your sense of self which also defines the properties of your personality is always changing through brain plasticity. The brain is constantly rewiring itself to fit together many method of interaction with others and the changes in the brain come from new information you learn and new experiences you have. That is the most marvelous property of the brain - its ability to mold itself through constantly rewiring things to gain new talents and perceptions and incorporate those things into future interaction with the environment the creature lives in. It is above and beyond the world of instinct which is pretty inflexible because that contains the basic tools we need to survive.

[Vickie_CDTV]

Hi Elaina, I suppose (and that's a guess from a guy like me who doesn't go out dressed so maybe a pinch of salt there) that crossdressers in female mode meeting with GGs are less keen to hit on them for one thing, and that fact alone changes the type of relation you can have.

Likewise, the vast majority of GGs don't want to be hit on by men in dresses. Unfortunately for guys like me.

[Aunt Kelly]

I expect that I will get skewered for my view, but I have seen enough on this forum to be convinced of it's accuracy...

Most of the self-identified crossdressers here will readily point out that they are "still men", regardless of their occasionally non-gender-normative behavior. At the same time, many will relate how "...wonderful it is to feel like a woman..." I am sorry, but that's not possible. They know what it feels like to be a man wearing women's clothes (cosmetics, etc.). That's it. I have never heard a GG remark about how giddy they get when putting on their underwear (girls and the "first bra" event being the notable exception). Mind you, I am absolutely not judging. If it makes a guy feel good to crossdress, that's great, but let's be real about this - for many, it's all about that feeling and has nothing to do with identity.

All that said, I also recognize that there is a spectrum of gender identity. Not every genetic male identifies exclusively as such. For them, the clothes have much less importance.

[Paulie Birmingham]

I mostly agree with you Kelly. My wife is the epitome of femininity. She has a professional job that requires that requires on occasion dresses and skirts and pantyhose. In 8 weeks of lockdown, I have never heard her say she needs to put on a dress or skirt. The only time she has worn pantyhose is when I asked her. ;) No makeup. No bra. No heels. Some lingerie :)

Most CDs here have worn more dresses than my wife in the last 8 weeks. I've worn pantyhose more than she has. Pretty sure my wife still feels like a woman.

Some cds attach a lot more weight to clothes than gg do.

[BLUE ORCHID]

Hi Elaina :hugs:, Welcome to our forum, When you are here You are home. >Orchid .oo:daydreaming:oo.

[Ressie]

Do you all have similar experiences?

I don't really remember. I haven't had much contact with anyone since the first week of March!

[ellbee]

It doesn't matter what they are wearing.

I'm sure you already know this, but there are studies out there which show that people, in general, can & *do* view & treat people differently, depending on how the other person is dressed.

Man in a suit & tie? Woman dressed provocatively? Somebody wearing old ratty clothes? Etc., etc.


Why should it be any different for men who wear women's stuff? :strugglin


And as long as we're talking about personal experiences? Yes, I've been treated differently.

So that negates yours. :p

[Dutchess]

Also some cd-ers and some trans don't realize that some women are really open and friendly and complimentary to you because they feel like they should . I saw this with my SO who really floated in between genders, beautiful guy/girl absolutely . When he was dressed more femme or COMPLETELY femme, women would bend over backwards to make him feel comfortable. Like surely this poor person has had such a hard time , we need to make sure he/she knows she looks just fine , s/he is so brave we need to make sure he knows this , we must make him/her feel like s/he is one of us , no judgement here ! etc, etc , etc .
S/he used to say some of the same things OP and some posters are saying also and I had to tell him , these ladies are doing this for a reason but its not for the reasons you think .

One approached us once and asked him if "it hurt" . We did not know this lady at all . He asked- what hurts ?? She said , Being like that . I though oh good grief . S/he laughed of course and said nothing hurt but I told him see some of these folks think this is some kind of affliction .

I also agree with Aunt Kelly's post , the only thing I cared about with my first bra was to make sure I had one with a pink rose at the center and one with a blue one if I had to have one at all .

[LilSissyStevie]

Like I said recently, wearing women's clothes makes me relate to women like eating pizza makes me relate to Italians. To think otherwise is absurd.

[Sometimes Steffi]

When I'm not dressed up the GGs I meet don't even know I'm a CD, except for the SA's I encounter.

When interacting with GGs when I am dressed as a woman, it's a whole new world. I could fill this page with experiences.