I think I saw one of our sisters today

[Linda Stockings]

I will admit it, I didn't know that today is Nov. 20 -- Transgender Day of Remembrance.

I was at a large sporting goods show at the Dulles Expo Center today and saw someone impossible to miss. She was about 6 feet 2 inches or so tall (no heels), very thin, wearing a leather pants outfit, boots, and a leather wasp waist, steel boned, laced up the back, under bust corset. She exaggerated her hip sway when she walked, even though her hips were very narrow. She had long, straight, thin brunette hair, an androgynous face with a beautiful, sort of wry, coquettish smile. She took very long steps and walked way faster than I could so I never had the chance to ask her where she got her corset and that I thought it looked beautiful on her. I couldn't tell if her bust line was naturally small and narrow and would never have asked had I been able to catch up to her. Her overall figure was very tall and VERY thin. Either way I would have liked to just pay her a compliment. Some of the men (and women) gave her an enthusiastic thumbs up.

So did I see one of our sisters or simply a beautiful cis lady?

Thanks, Linda

[Jazzmin]

Perhaps you saw someone who was enjoying their life, living in the moment, and just being themselves.

What difference does it make if they are cis- trans-, or CD?

[Linda Stockings]

I don't think it makes any difference at all. Whether or not she was one of our sisters, I simply would have liked to talk to her long enough to just pay her the compliment. If I were to have learned she WAS one of or sisters, I would have enjoyed talking to her maybe even more. That's assuming she would have wanted to talk to me at all.

[MarinaTwelve200]

I have learned to not even try to MAKE a CD. even the most "manly" looking suspects could possibly STILL be ggs, and the reverse is also true. I have seen it. Oh, I might "suspect", but I can never be sure.

[Jazzmin]

Ah, OK, I see what you mean.

[SaraLin]

She looked good. Her smile suggests that she was enjoying herself. What difference does it make what the plumbing looks like?
As to chasing strange women down to compliment them - uh, no. I wouldn't recommend it.

[Linda Stockings]

SaraLin, as I said in a previous post, it doesn't matter at all what she is, at least not to me. I think by the way she interacted with many of the people who noticed her, she was happy and liked being noticed. No, I did not try to chase her down. I thinks she made it obvious that she enjoyed receiving attention, but other than waving and smiling back she did not want to in interact with people. I would agree...not the time to communicate. That seems to be quite the over sensitive subject these days.

[Di]

Perhaps you saw someone who was enjoying their life, living in the moment, and just being themselves.

What difference does it make if they are cis- trans-, or CD?

This is how I feel as well.
Whenever I see these posts I am torn from
YES someone is going out and enjoying life
To ….I wish it was normal and not something to post about ….it’s just another day.

Please do not take offense you said it did not make a difference to you …..just saying in general .

[Shelly Preston]

There is a you tube video going around that shows a CIS woman in a toilet accused of being trans.

Which proves you just never know.

The woman who made the accusation got banned from the store for a day. Not much of a punishment but it may make her think before opening her mouth next time.

[Linda Stockings]

I wish to thank all of you for your responses, points of view, and showing me a better way of looking and thinking about certain situations. I meant no offense to anyone (including who I saw), and you've all helped me see how we view things a bit differently now. I recall many posts on here, with lots of responses, centering around recognizing a fellow individual who may have been a CD or someone somewhere on the trans spectrum. Now, I think we all are, even those of us who only CD and have no desire to transition.

I'm happy that I simply let the lady I saw interact the way she wanted with the people who noticed her.

[char GG]

It's very nice that you saw someone who you thought was a sister and admired what she was wearing.

However, personally, I would never say anything to a CDer, whether I knew for sure not. The reason is that some think they are "passing". Pointing out that they are a CDer, no matter how well they present themselves, signals to them that they are "not passing" - which could have a devastating effect.

[Raychel]

This is how I feel as well.
Whenever I see these posts I am torn from
YES someone is going out and enjoying life
To ….I wish it was normal and not something to post about ….it’s just another day.

Please do not take offense you said it did not make a difference to you …..just saying in general .

I will totally agree with you there Di.
It is totally great that they are getting out and just enjoying life.
But it would sure be great if everyone was at the point where no one looked and nothing to post about.

And Char brings up a good point,
I am not sure how I would feel if someone came up to me and said something.
If I thought I was passing and they made me, that would be devastating
I guess it would depend on the comment they made.

Personally I have seen other out, and have not said anything, just thought to myself.
They look good, or jealousy that they are brave enough to step out and I am not.

[Linda Stockings]

I can see I should have explained a lot more in my initial post. If I had been able to speak to her, I simply would have done just that, speak with no assumptions. If SHE CHOSE to say anything about herself, I would have complimented her either way. I made no assumptions and would not have asked anything about CD'ing. What I noticed more than anything was her reaction to the attention she was getting. I've simply not noticed anyone, CD, cis, etc., reacting so positively to so much attention. I AM NOW THINKING, YES SHE WAS DRESSED IN A VERY NOTICEABLE WAY, SHE APPEARED TO ENJOY BEING NOTICED, I AM HAPPY FOR HER THAT SHE ENJOYED HERSELF. I am very glad I did not interfere, or bother her in any way.

[Krisi]

It's fine to think you saw a crossdresser in public and it's fine to post about it here. I don't understand why a few people seem to be giving you a bunch of grief about it. If people post and get a bunch of grief, they may think twice about posting again and eventually, we will not have an active forum.

That said, while you might suspect a person you see in public of being a crossdresser (or transwoman), it would be a really bad idea to try to talk to them about it. First of all, it might be an actual woman and saying that she is a crossdresser would be pretty insulting. Second, if this person really is a crossdresser, you have just told her that she didn't pass as a woman. Again, an insult, but not as bad as in the other case.

There is really nothing good that can come from saying anything to this person that you wouldn't say to any other stranger. "Good morning", etc.

Also, many women are really uncomfortable with a strange male attempting to strike up a conversation with them. Many are paranoid.

[docrobbysherry]

Reading threads like this reminds me: The only certainties in life r death and taxes!:devil:

[Linda Stockings]

Thank you, Krisi. To a large extent, I think you've read my mind. To reiterate, I would never speak to ANYONE and assume I know whether they are cis, trans, CD, etc. Maybe, now, I would smile a little and simply say hello.

The initial responses I received did leave me wondering a little. I admit I have not been keeping up to date with any sticky posts about the philosophy guidelines of this site. After all, it is titled "crossdressers.com". I tend to agree with those who say anyone who CD's is somewhere on the trans spectrum. I don't claim to know or really care where. If they choose to explain where, I'll read what they have to say. Some voice it in a polite way, some in a challenging way, some in an accusative way, etc. I thank the moderators and you for grasping most accurately what I was trying to express in the first place.
I saw someone attractive, who was interacting openly, I admired, I was left thinking and wondering.

I guess I need to be more careful and cognizant about how I word things in a post, maybe not post in a spur of the moment set of thoughts.

Thanks, Linda

[Debra Russell]

Linda, your post was real and factual I have been in that same circumstance and it's a normal reaction to wonder and want to know more - weather you act on it or not, and still nice to relate the expierence ........................Debra

[Rhonda Jean]

Nothing wrong with what you posted.
I have no idea how you'd initiate a conversation with her, but I've found that being on the receiving end of a compliment was always nice, even if it meant that I didn't pass as well as I thought. I had a lady once ask, "Do you prefer to be referred to as male or female?" Probably not a great way to start a conversation, but we went on to have a nice conversation. Turned out she was a hairdresser, and I went to her several times after that. Kind of felt like we'd already gotten through the difficult beginnings.

Sometimes the simplest is the best. I was at a restaurant and a lady who had been seated facing me about 10 feet away walked by on her way out, leaned over and whispered, "You are just beautiful!" Guess that meant I didn't pass, but it was still such a nice thing to say. I still remember it 30 years later, so it must've been memorable.

[Fiona_44]

Linda,

Your post was fine. Sometimes people tend to make too many assumptions about what someone was thinking when they wrote a post.

Fiona

[Jacqueline Vivaldi]

Linda-
Both your response to see this attractive female as well as your post were both dignified and spontaneous. Please don't change anything. If you see some one attractive, I think it is fine to make a positive comment. I often go out to elegant events and always a half dozen people, mostly but not always female, will come up to me and compliment me on my beauty. Initially, I thought that I was just passing well in my elegant outfit. However, then I realized that the general public does not approach gorgeous women or men and make a pointed compliment about their looks. I suspect that the female that you saw was an attractive trans woman enjoying being seen by people who think her to be attractive. This is just as it should be, and even today when I get compliments on my looks, I give them a big smile and say thanks and you look good as well. Enjoy the situation!

[alwayshave]

Linda, there are plenty of us in the DC area, so very well could have been a sister.

[Linda Stockings]

Jaime,

I've heard that, but hardly ever see any that make me think "there's one of our sisters". From the avatars, etc., I see posted on here, I suspect most are better able to blend than me. I generally don't try to assume that what I think I see is the same as the image I think I'm seeing. And that makes just about as much sense as the shellacking I took from my post the last couple days (from some responders). Some are very understanding, many give me the feeling that this is sure not the safe place I used to think it was.

[GaleWarning]

A person came into the OpShop on Monday. I could not decide if they were male or female. They bought clothing of both genders.
I treated them like simply another customer.
We had a brief discussion re the prices of the article and how payment might be made.
Still no definitive decision was possible.
They left a happy customer and will hopefully return!

[Jazzmin]

A funny story which I think is relative to this conversation.
Full disclosure: I am living/working full time as a transwoman. At my job there Is a very tall (we are approximately the same height), young cis woman who works in my department. We'll call her "Claire", obviously NOT her real name.

Recently, I had an older customer (a cis woman, for reference), inform me that there was a man in the lady's room and that she felt extremely uncomfortable. I rushed into the Ladies', only to find my co-worker Claire. We both realized the absurdity of the situation and laughed our butts off!

Synopsis:
Old Lady mis-gendered a cis woman,
then complained to a REAL woman (me) and demanded that I correct the situation.
Old Lady was then confused when me and Claire exited Ladies room, arms wrapped around each other, laughing hysterically!
Old Lady then doubled down and declared that we were a pair of "lesbian perverts", and she would never shop in our store again.
Claire and I were in tears at that point- tears of uncontrollable laughter!

As to approaching anyone who you think MIGHT be a crossdresser, or Trans, I would STRONGLY suggest that people curtail their desire to 'bond' with a sister, and if you MUST say something, then keep it simple, and say nothing that you would not feel comfortable saying to a cis woman.

Try, for a moment, to understand how YOU would feel if, after all your hard work at trying to blend in, someone walked up to YOU and said, "Hey 'sister', I think you look great! You ALMOST pass as a cis woman!" Congrats, you just clocked a CD/Trans woman, AND let them know that they aren't "100% passable".

I hope you feel good about yourself for that.

Please note that this comment is NOT directed at any particular individual.

[Natalie5004]

In honor of our trans holiday this week. I was grocery shopping at 3 PM. The store was packed for the Thanksgiving holiday. I did not see you there Linda.

I did all my shopping and had a few small exchanges with folks. I kept my head up high walk walked slowly though the entire store filling up my shopping cart.
Down side, my heels hurt my feet 1/2 way through the store. Then I had to walk 50 yards away to my car in the expanse of the parking area.

I am sure I was clocked by those that really looked, because I pass in my mind only. But I did not care. I did not have any comments or dirty looks from anyone. I just shopped. Maybe I fooled someone.

[Jazzmin]

Many are paranoid.

I agreed with everything you wrote, until you said the above.

There is NOTHING paranoid about a woman's behaviour in public, especially since women are more likely to be victims of violent assaults from MEN. Before spouting nonsense, why not ask the women in your life (Mom, wife, sister, daughter) how THEY would feel if some random guy approached them and made a comment about their appearance, clothes, or "sexiness". More importantly, ask them if they have ever been approached by a man, that they felt unsafe. And then tell me that they are being 'paranoid'.

I don't mean to be dismissive or insulting to the CD community, but for god's sake, y'all don't really get the picture! YOU (general pronoun) just don't realize how dangerous the world can be towards cis or trans women!

A crossdresser may love the feel and sensations of feminine clothes, they may strive to achieve the perfect make up and then stroll around an empty parking lot, taking selfies. At most, they may worry about being exposed and found out. If they are smart, they would be more worried about being discovered by a group of homophobic men...

But for women (cis or trans) EVERY encounter with a male has the potential for acceptance or violence. Hell, women and girls have to be cautious about rejecting advances from guys, due to the violence that may result!

The statement "Many are paranoid", does nothing but show how entrenched YOU are in male entitlement, and how clueless you are to the reality of life.

[AngelaYVR]

Over the summer I stopped visiting this site, partly because I felt my needs had outgrown it and partly because some of the discussions are, quite frankly, asinine. I popped in to see if I was missing anything and some of the responses in this thread are definitely the latter.

I have had loads of people come up to me to say something wonderful. Men and women. What a depressing little world some must live in to say human beings must never interact with a stranger and pass on a compliment. If you want to be little toads living under rocks then go ahead but I certainly hope you never influence anyone else to be like you. Suspicious minds always make me wonder about the instigator and what they are compensating for.

If you have something nice to say to someone, say it and make their day!

[Deborah G]

I make sure to compliment a sister on her appearance, but knowing some wish to remain below the radar, I am very discrete. I don't want to make someone feel threatened or uncomfortable; I try to place myself in there shoes, literally. We are all in this together, after all.

[KristyPa]

Linda,
Good gosh what you posted is just fine. I feel the same when seeing a person like myself in public, please anyone have it to also pick on me for what i said, "a person like myself".

A girl like me out in public is NOT that common, if I see someone like me I do try to figure out if it is a girl like me or not, whats the harm. I wouldn't ask the person but I would check her out like i do most women.

When I first started going out in pubic as Kristy around 1995 I honesty thought I was the only person like myself. I ran into a couple other girls like myself one night and was surprised there was other girls like me I made good friends with the one.

[Jazzmin]

I see several people who state that if they saw a 'sister', that they would comment or compliment them 'discretely', and I am genuinely curious how one would go about that, without letting the 'sister' know that she has been outed or doesn't quite cut the standard of "passing".

If one is in 'male mode', in a vanilla setting, how would you approach a woman, cis-, CD, or trans-, and pass commentary on her appearance without coming off creepy? I mean do you (general pronoun, no one specific) walk up to random women and comment on how good or bad they look? Comment on their outfit, shoes, etc.?

For myself, I'm out 24/7 as a transwoman and I take compliments as they come, I KNOW I will never 'pass' as a cis-woman, but many others might be somewhat in the closet and sensitive to comments by strangers.

Compliments can be real ego boosters, and perhaps YOU (general pronoun, no one specific) feel a need to establish a tenuous bond with another who shares your proclivities, but for the love of god, try to respect another's boundaries! MAYBE, that 'sister' you think you've spotted is a ciswoman and feels very uncomfortable/threatened by your approach. Or maybe it's a CD/transwoman who just soiled herself because she was 'clocked' by a random stranger!

YOU know that your intentions are friendly and meant to be supportive, but the target of your 'support' doesn't know that, or you, from Adam!

Let's take CD-ing/Transfolk out of the equation for a second. If you saw a woman, smartly dressed, coifed, and made up in a store, would you approach her and make comments about her shape, her clothes, her make up? If yes, why? If no, why not?

[Fiona_44]

I think it's time to put this thread out of it's misery. No need to keep rehashing the same points over and over.

[Linda Stockings]

Thank you, Fiona. I've been wanting to say exactly that. It's gone on way too long, been misunderstood way too much, used as an excuse to bash way too much, and it's been INTENTIONALLY, misunderstood way too much.

Thanks for understanding,

Linda

[DianeT]

A funny story which I think is relative to this conversation.
Full disclosure: I am living/working full time as a transwoman. At my job there Is a very tall (we are approximately the same height), young cis woman who works in my department. We'll call her "Claire", obviously NOT her real name.

Whoa, whoa whoa, hold on there. "We'll call her Claire". Then "obviously NOT her real name". Mmmh, double denying equates confirmation. Now we all know her name definitely is Claire. Which, supposing you are living in the United States of America, leaves only 121,538 Claire possibilities. With 5.3% of the population working in retail, that leaves us with just 6,441 candidates. Shaving off 1,6% for trans or non-binary, we end up with just 6,338 individuals. You say she is tall, which implies she is over the median size of the genetic female population, ergo down to 3,169 people. She has a transwoman colleague (you), a rough 0,004% probability. Here we are. 13 individuals. Nothing a sunny afternoon and a few phone calls and internet searches wouldn't sort out. I tell you, privacy is a thing of the past!

[Kitty Sue]

If I see a "sister" I treat them like anybody else. I don't compliment them on their appearance anymore than I would a GG I do not know. I usually just say hi and smile. Of course part of me wants to yell out at "Hey Girl Friend I am just like you too!" I do wish we had a secret hand shake or something though that only we all knew.:daydreaming:

[Linda Stockings]

Maybe we could invent such a handshake, but I can't quite figure out how to create a handshake situation easily. Maybe certain color coordinated things in our outfits or jewelry.

[closets]

If I see a "sister" I treat them like anybody else. I don't compliment them on their appearance anymore than I would a GG this is the best practice

[Krisi]

I agreed with everything you wrote, until you said the above.

There is NOTHING paranoid about a woman's behaviour in public, especially since women are more likely to be victims of violent assaults from MEN. Before spouting nonsense, why not ask the women in your life (Mom, wife, sister, daughter) how THEY would feel if some random guy approached them and made a comment about their appearance, clothes, or "sexiness". More importantly, ask them if they have ever been approached by a man, that they felt unsafe. And then tell me that they are being 'paranoid'.

I don't mean to be dismissive or insulting to the CD community, but for god's sake, y'all don't really get the picture! YOU (general pronoun) just don't realize how dangerous the world can be towards cis or trans women!

A crossdresser may love the feel and sensations of feminine clothes, they may strive to achieve the perfect make up and then stroll around an empty parking lot, taking selfies. At most, they may worry about being exposed and found out. If they are smart, they would be more worried about being discovered by a group of homophobic men...

But for women (cis or trans) EVERY encounter with a male has the potential for acceptance or violence. Hell, women and girls have to be cautious about rejecting advances from guys, due to the violence that may result!

The statement "Many are paranoid", does nothing but show how entrenched YOU are in male entitlement, and how clueless you are to the reality of life.

Well, personal insult aside, you just posted the very reason many women are "paranoid" if a strange man approaches them and tries to start a conversation. Look up the definition of "paranoid".

Apparently, you have an axe to grind and have chosen to grind it at my expense. You are, of course, entitled to your opinion, but that doesn't include insulting me. Try to make your opinion stand on its own without the insults. :Pullhair:

[Kitty Sue]

Maybe we could invent such a handshake, but I can't quite figure out how to create a handshake situation easily. Maybe certain color coordinated things in our outfits or jewelry.

I know. Could you imagine all the commotion that would cause as we all put argued over what the handshake should be!