Transitioning and Marriage??

[Tracy Lynn]

There are so many days when I wish I could just transition and be female full time. Then I think about everything that has to be done in preparation and the telling of family and loved ones.
The first thought that comes to mind is guilt. How would my wife handle this? I am a happily married man and if I did transition I think I would probably still like to be with a woman, can't stand the thought of being with a man sexually.
What would make her in her right mind want to stay with me? When we were married she thought she was marrying a man. She didn't know about the crossdressing back then. I feel like I would be ruining her life to make mine better. Is this selfish?

Has anyone here actually gone through the transition and kept thier marriage intact? I would like to here your thoughts if you have or haven't.

[~Dee~]

im married and im in the process of transitioning.
i held off on telling my wife about me for so long, convinced that it would end our marriage and be the end of us totally.
afterall, i 'lured' her out here to the land of oz, while she was quite happy in MN with offers of a mans love and affection.

but, to me, i couldnt take it anymore .. it wasnt that i couldnt not transition anymore .. it was that i couldnt stand the lies that were holding in my secret.
i wanted a relationship without the lies .. i wanted total honesty from both parties,. so i just had to tell her. simple as that.
my kitty took it so so at first, cause she didnt know what it meant or anything about it. but as we both researched, things slowly cleared up until now - shes my biggest supporter of my transition.

our marriage has improved 10 fold. and i believe we can directly relate it back to the telling.
ive not had to lie or mislead at all since that day .. and i feel like a much healthier and positive person too.

your spouse married you .. you. so if you dont share you with her, then is it really a marriage?
yes, there might be some misunderstanding or some hurt feelings .. but if you are there to discuss it with your wife and help her understand - its surprising how many people can accept just about anything for love.

i was certain that telling my wife would end us totally .. instead, it was the thing that kept us together and saved our marriage. theres irony for ya. :happy:

[heather_nouveau]

Hi Tracie:

Boy, did you hit the mark with this post! I'm going through the exact same thoughts right now! I really feel strongly that transitioning is what I need to do, but my marriage and my job are both so important. It's very hard. My wife does not yet know, just started seeing a therapist about this, so I'm just beginning the whole emotional, pyschological, and physical process.

It's very overwhelming! I guess the best advice I could give at this point would be to try and figure out what you need to do; get your head straight first. The rest will follow.

Hope this helps,

Heather

[Tracy Lynn]

im married and im in the process of transitioning.
i held off on telling my wife about me for so long, convinced that it would end our marriage and be the end of us totally.
afterall, i 'lured' her out here to the land of oz, while she was quite happy in MN with offers of a mans love and affection.

but, to me, i couldnt take it anymore .. it wasnt that i couldnt not transition anymore .. it was that i couldnt stand the lies that were holding in my secret.
i wanted a relationship without the lies .. i wanted total honesty from both parties,. so i just had to tell her. simple as that.
my kitty took it so so at first, cause she didnt know what it meant or anything about it. but as we both researched, things slowly cleared up until now - shes my biggest supporter of my transition.

our marriage has improved 10 fold. and i believe we can directly relate it back to the telling.
ive not had to lie or mislead at all since that day .. and i feel like a much healthier and positive person too.

your spouse married you .. you. so if you dont share you with her, then is it really a marriage?
yes, there might be some misunderstanding or some hurt feelings .. but if you are there to discuss it with your wife and help her understand - its surprising how many people can accept just about anything for love.

i was certain that telling my wife would end us totally .. instead, it was the thing that kept us together and saved our marriage. theres irony for ya. :happy:

Dee,
Thanks for the reply. I'm glad things are working out for you. You're wife must be SOOO understanding. I just get so overwelmed somedays it almost makes me crazy. Don't know if I'll ever do it but things change.



Hi Tracie:

Boy, did you hit the mark with this post! I'm going through the exact same thoughts right now! I really feel strongly that transitioning is what I need to do, but my marriage and my job are both so important. It's very hard. My wife does not yet know, just started seeing a therapist about this, so I'm just beginning the whole emotional, pyschological, and physical process.

It's very overwhelming! I guess the best advice I could give at this point would be to try and figure out what you need to do; get your head straight first. The rest will follow.

Hope this helps,

Heather

Thanks Heather,
Get my head straight....I don't think its ever been, but I get your point. Life can be so frustrating.

[Caitlintgsd]

My wife tolerates dressing and my going out 3 nights a week dressed and such. She says that if I fully transition she's leaving. She has her mind set that when our kids graduate high school I'll completely transition.

[~Kitty GG~]

Tracie~

I certainly wouldn't be so supportive if Dee had written this..


if I did transition I think I would probably still like to be with a woman, can't stand the thought of being with a man sexually.


If you're not POSITIVE that you'd want to stay with YOUR WIFE, and stay with her because she's her.. not because of the sexual angles. Then this whole conversation is moot.

Now as to the rest of your questions.
I figure that if you love the whole person you can get through just about anything. For me the whole CD/TS thing is a piece of cake compaired to the hell we were going through before.

If one partner is unhappy, and Dee certainly was.. then the other partner is very affected. I don't see much difference between having a bad marriage because one is hiding and the other is wondering why things aren't good.. or just coming out with the truth and still having a bad marriage.

Every couple has things that are givens and are absolutely necessities to the marriage. For me its the things that make us "us". Our lifestyle. Its not whether or not Dee plays the masculine role. If her personality changes and her likes and dislikes change too far from that line.. then I would probably have more trouble with this.

If it means that we have nothing in common because she lstarts to like totally different music, movies, activities.. then we've lost "us".

If it means that we still enjoy being together. That every day we look at other couples who complain about eachother and need to get away from eachother.. Then I couldn't care less that she's wearing skirts and changed her male parts for female.

It was because we do enjoy being together that we made it through those bad years. So now that we've figured out what the problem was. The problem is no more.

Love & Hugs
~Kitty~

[Kayla Smith]

Tracie,

I am glad that you posted on this subject, My wife has know about my CDing for the last 17 years and through talks that we have had(lately) she thought that it was more than just the clothes for me.

In March of this year I finally told my wife that I am not a CD and that I was really a TS, well up until about a month ago she has had thoughts of leaving me and taking our duaghters with her but she told that there was something about me and our relationship(15 years of marriage) that she just could not walk away from. We are both in therapy and it is helping alot, as for myself I have been living full time since April of this year and feel that there is a good possiblity that my wife and I will stay together but the more I become the real me, I think that it will be more of a roommate situation especially after I start HRT, hopefully by this summer.

[Tracy Lynn]

Tracie~

I certainly wouldn't be so supportive if Dee had written this..



If you're not POSITIVE that you'd want to stay with YOUR WIFE, and stay with her because she's her.. not because of the sexual angles. Then this whole conversation is moot.

Love & Hugs
~Kitty~

Sorry about that. Yes I definitely would want to stay with my wife, that didn't come out right. What I was trying to say is that I wouldn't leave her for a man or another woman, she is my life. I am concerned about how SHE would feel being with another woman instead of her husband. I don't know how she would handle that.

[~Dee~]

I don't know how she would handle that.

then, make it about being with YOU.
it wouldnt matter if Kitty was a squirrel .. i love her madly and if shes happy being a squirrel, then thats good with me... just so long as she doesnt bite.

people seem to get unhappy about labels... :
"if im with a TS, then that makes me a lesbian.. omg!"
but this sometimes can be overcome with time and maybe some councelling intervention.

afterall, if someone loves you .. they should be loving YOU... not the gender or, say, not the social status that you provide the family.
im not saying that it is easy .. or that it works 100% of the time either .. so, please dont litter this thread with stories of heartache and divorce... i do understand that its hard out there.
but if you are truly thinking that you are TS .. then id want the help and support of my wife to help me through it .. afterall, it can be tough at times to figure out just who you are.
so long as the SO gets the support and love they deserve in return that is.

[Tamara Croft]

Just one thing about transitioning and marriage.... isn't it correct that if you transition, you can't actually stay legally married?

[~Dee~]

Just one thing about transitioning and marriage.... isn't it correct that if you transition, you can't actually stay legally married?

i cant speak for all places in the world ..
so i will just talk about what i know .. WA law.
Da Man says that no two people of the same gender can marry .. so when i undergo SRS and if i change my birth cert. to female .. then our marriage would be anulled ..
SO - even though im going to undergo SRS and all, im never going to apply for them to change my birth cert. so i wont ever be legally female.
i dont see any benefit for being female on paper, so it doesnt really bother me too much .. afterall, i know what gender i am - who cares what the govt. thinks?

so that way, i still get to keep my marriage to kitty ... which is more important.
:happy:

[~Kitty GG~]

Just one thing about transitioning and marriage.... isn't it correct that if you transition, you can't actually stay legally married?

That is a very good point.

I know that I stumbled on the info by accident and was floored by it.
Got mad as hell. LOL
Not mad at Dee. She didn't make the rules.

I do think that soon "The Man" will come to his senses and allow same sex relationships to have legal status. Might not want to call them marriage cuz that offends religious groups.

But the political power of the GLBT is amazing.

So when that happens we'll have another "wedding" and this time Dee can wear a gender appropriate outfit.

I have no probs with her going for the legal gender change now. I am proud that she'd rather be legally married to me then have that "F" on her passport.

Thanx for pointing that out T

Love & Hugs
~Kitty~

[purple_spider GG]

Just one thing about transitioning and marriage.... isn't it correct that if you transition, you can't actually stay legally married?

Currently in the UK if you transition and have a gender recognition certificate but wish to stay married to your now same-sex wife, you have to agree to have your current marriage annuled but then you can have a civil partnership straight away. The GRC is a legal certificate that recognises your new gender.

If you choose to not have the gender recognition certificate then you stay legally married because under law you are still your birth gender.

CPs are more or less the same as Marriage, you lose nothing if you have a CP. The only reason they agreed to have CPs rather than legalise same-sex marriage on paper was because of the rampent homophobia and moralistic conservatism that stiffles our country and upper chamber in law. But basically we do have a legal same-sex marriage in the UK just under the name of civil partnerships. Personally I support human rights and therefore support the legalising of same sex marriage, never mind pandering to the fuddy duddies in the house of lords by calling it civil partnerships.

XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX

[Katrina]

I'm coming in on this from a different angle. I'm divorced and considered myself somewhere between CD and TS although I hadn't done much in the way of TS other than working on the mindset. I had been teetering on the edge leaning like I was TS, but then I got to thinking about what was important to me. Turns out, my GF (now Fiancee', yay!) is more important to me than being a complete woman (or a reasonable facsimilie of one), so I'm going to remain a CD. We both made some concessions and came to a mutually agreed upon solution to our relationship that I think we both can live with. Thus, I will not be transitioning due in part to marriage.

I guess this is the last time I can post in this section... ;)

[Sarahgurl371]

What a thread.

Dee & Kitty, you two seem like such great people! I am sure that this wasn't always easy for either of you, but you seem to have come thru well together. I think that is just great.

I know that this is about transitioning and marraige. I have not even begun to transition other than to dream of it everyday for quite a while now. Making all the preparations in my head. What will change in my life etc. My wife and I are on the verge of divorce. I am not happy about that. No way around the fact that this whole TG thing is the straw that broke the camel's back. I guess there are other problems, but like Dee and Kitty seem to say so often, I believe that love can conquer all. Apparantly my wife does not see it that way. She says that she married a man, and that is what she wants in her life. This is important to her, why I do not know. But as much as I feel the way I do inside, so does she. In the end, no matter how much we love each other, I guess some things are too much. And apparantly labels do matter because she insists she is not a lesbian. And since she views me as a female, she cannot stay with me if I engage in any of this. Rather, I am free to CD when she is not around, She does not want to see me femme, At no time is there to be intimate experiences, and she does not want to talk about it. If I wish to remain married to her these are her rules.

Well for me, I don't think I can accept that. Like it was mentioned above, I am ME. I have hidden for years, I cannot live that way anymore. Whether I transition fully or live part time, or even occasionally, its all the same to her. I need to be able to express myself. I have tried the whole repression/guilt/fear/anxiety thing for so long and know that it doesn't work. My marriage is holding me back, and I am causing her pain by merely existing. So the choice is live this way into the future, causing me pain and upset in order to spare her feelings, or to forge ahead alone. Causing us both pain.

I am well aware that marraige is about compromise, and am willing to compromise on my activity level and such. But how can I compromise on being who I am? I mean basically, just me being me, feeling the way I do, is unacceptable to her. Despite my feelings for her, how can I live that way, and why should she? 15 years is what makes the decision so hard.

Tracie, you are not alone in your history, or your feelings of guilt. Take my situation as an example of what could happen should you decide to go forward. It may very well cost you those closest to you. All I have done to disrupt my marraige was explore the questions within, questions that she wanted the answers to, after I told her that my dressing was more than a bedroom activity. Its kinda like once you start down the road to self awareness and acceptance, you can't go back. There have been so many times in the past two years, where this all has caused so much pain for us both that I start to think I should try again to repress it, kill it, purge it all, try again to be normal at all costs. I know that it will not work. I know that I will be back. This is not an easy journey so far. And having to deal with a failing marraige on top only worsens life everday. Good luck.

[joanlynn28]

This thread just seems to hit me so close to home. I iniatially tried to suppress my desire to have transition because I was commited to my wife. I did take a vow to death till us part, and I intended to honor that vow. But having been outed by my not hiding all of the evidence of my transgendered issues my wife found out my true self, which she does not approve of. God knows that I have tried to make our marraige work but the need to live as one's true self take precedence over anything else. Having lived as I am ment to be means to me that there is no going back to the old lying person I was. Having come out of the closet I have no intention of ever going back into it. I do have one TS friend whose wife is supportive about the whole transition thing, but I have my doubts about her relationship with her wife once the SRS becomes final at the end of the year. I just want to share that I do agree with TammyTG's post to this thread. To all of you that do have SO's that are supportive of transitioning my hat is off to you, you guys are the exception when it comes to this. Me, I find myself in the majority of failed relationships trying to make this work out. To close I would rather live alone as my true feminine self than to live out a lie as a dishonest husband to a woman who deserves better than living with someone who cannot be honest about they're feelings

[~Dee~]

Turns out, my GF (now Fiancee', yay!) is more important to me than being a complete woman (or a reasonable facsimilie of one), so I'm going to remain a CD.

hiya Katrina,
conga-rats .. and i wish you all the best in your marriage together.

for me it wasnt something that i actively chose to do to us .. i mean, i totally thought that i was now ending our marriage by telling kity all about me ..
afterall, what fool would go through all this stuff if there were another choice so readily available.

for me it was something that i realised .. it was something that i looked at and went "oh crap.... i better tell kitty about this"
so i did... it wasnt a choice as much as a realisation that i was TS and then i had to either figure on doing something about it .. or just trying to keep on ignoring it.

well, our marriage was hurting the both of us .. so the current 'ignore it' battleplan just wasnt working .. so it seemed to me that i now had a viable option that i could try.
luckily, it worked for us.
but if you do a comparison, its easy to see why ..
im not moody and grumpy all the time or stomping around depressed and dont have a reason for it all .. instead, im happier and lively and im more in love with my wife than i could of actually thought possible for me, in the past.
what wife wouldnt want that for their partner?
:happy:

[~Dee~]

What a thread.
Dee & Kitty, you two seem like such great people! I am sure that this wasn't always easy for either of you, but you seem to have come thru well together. I think that is just great.

tammy,
thanks for the kind words .. we try our best in our marriage and we try our best to try to get it across over this medium, some manner of advice that might help others get out of where we were. cause that just plain sucks at times.


She says that she married a man, and that is what she wants in her life. This is important to her, why I do not know.

yup ... ive heard this more than a few times ..
and yes, your wife is fully allowed to have that as a thought or reason.
but the thing that gets me about this sort of remark is - who exactly is she a lesbian to?
i dont mean who is she with .. i mean who is she worried will find out that shes in this great big lesbian relationship?
i know people who are having a hard time with this because "what will the neighbours think???" :eek:
ok .. i mean this in a loving manner .. but, if they are that worried about what the neighbours think.. 'then why dont you marry them?'
in my relationship i value kittys needs .. i try to attend to everything that she expresses to me, because she is the most important person in my life ..
i dont care to please other people .. it would take lots and lots of time and would end up probably costing me lots and lots of money ... phew, who needs all that?

your wife has closed off negotiations and probably thinks you very selfish for wanting to move ahead AND BE HAPPY ... im sorry, but that seems a little bit of the while pot ... kettle .. black .. kinda thing.
and again, i dont mean this is a nasty way by any means .. im sure your wife is a lovely person in all otehr respects - afterall, there was good enough reason for you to be together all this time .. 0.02
if its gotten to the point where the marriage is failing because there are such strong opposing emotions there, then something has to be done, surely.
for some its a compromise .. but the compromise being 'ill go into the other room and ignore you and you get dressed up and so whatever it is that you do' is not what i would call a healthy compromise.

ive been in the pain, hurt, guilt, depression and anxiety part of my life and tell you what, its really crap .. i wanted to just end my life so many times ive lost count.
going through this sort of thing wont help this .. if anything it breeds more guilt and shame ... and that can be very destructive.

15 years is a long time, but if you are at an impass and all other options are exhausted .. then what choices do you really have?
i mean, id prefer to stop the pain sooner rather than later.
and again, im by no means trying to get you to leave your wife .. its just my 0.02 thoughts.
i wouldnt pay much more for them. 2c seems a good value to me :happy:

i know that it hurts and im really sorry when anyone has to go through pain in order to be happy or to grow .. but it seems to be the compost that feeds the growth, in the end... its just that sometimes it smells just as rotten in that given moment.

[Tracy Lynn]

Thanks so much for all of the input. You have answered alot of the questions I was going to add.
I never really gave much thought to transitioning in the past but lately it has hit me like a freight train. I feel like I am at that point in my life where I can no longer supress who I am inside. I have been cding for as long as I can remember and through the years the thought of it has crossed my mind but never as forceful as it is now. I am 41 and I think it is time I am true to myself about who I am.
My wife is aware of my cding and I dress around her all the time and she is great about it. When I first told her I got all usual questions. One of the questions she asked is do you want to have surgery and be a woman. At the time I told her no. Now I feel as if I am going to drop another bombshell on her by telling her this but I think it is soon time. Kitty I just hope she is as understanding as you. You are a very special woman.
I admire so many of you on this site for your courage and conviction of being true to who you really are. I just hope that one day I can.

[~Kitty GG~]

Kitty I just hope she is as understanding as you. You are a very special woman.
I admire so many of you on this site for your courage and conviction of being true to who you really are. I just hope that one day I can.

I think people are getting the wrong idea about me. I'm not this always understanding sappy thing.

Here's how I see it:

I know what I want out of my life and out of my marriage. Absolutely. I know what is important to me and what doesn't matter at all.

If Dee wasn't providing what I need/want then I couldn't stay and be the martyr.

There are two people in every marriage. Here at this forum we go on and on about how the CD/TS needs to accept themselves.. figure out who they are and what they want. But that's only half of the equation. If the wife doesn't know what's important to her life .. then how can she possibly make decisions about all this?

I think, ultimately, that's what I have against the whole secrecy thing. By the time the wife finds out what's going on she's already been left in the dust. She trying to play catch up. The CD/TS has faced each possible problem one at a time as they were inching a toe or foot out of the closet.. But for the wife its like stepping out into traffic.

What will others think? What does this make me? What does this mean for us? What about the kids? What will the family think? Is it my fault? What if he wants to dress all the time? What if he wants to take hormones? What if he wants surgery? What would it be like if he's a she? What the hell is TS anyway???

Luckily for me I already knew what I wanted and needed from Dee from day one. And so I only had to ask a few questions. Are you SURE you WANT to spend your life with ME? And .. You're not gonna turn into a weenie girl on me and listen to sappy music are ya???

After we figured those two things out we could learn about all the other aspects of transitioning together. Explore all the options, talk about our feelings and what the future holds for us.

That's much better than stepping into traffic.

Love & Hugs
~Kitty~

[OniKoneko]

Kitty makes me proud to be of the same species as her, even if I am just a kitten... Myan~

She is right, though. Most transsexuals, crossdressers, or even the transgendered community in general is concerned with moving forward comfortably for them while their loved ones end up caught with their pants down (sometimes quite literally) as they hop after their previously untroubled (as far as they saw it) significant other, trying to catch up to them to understand things better.

My girlfriend learned that I was transsexual before we started dating. In fact, they learned I was transsexual and then in the beginning of the next year of high school we both started to show interest in each other. October thirteenth was when I finally gathered the courage to ask her and a few days earlier she, much to my surprise, confessed she had a crush on me too. Even though I was still scared I eventually slapped myself straight (or pleasantly not straight) and I asked her and she said yes. June thirteenth will be our eight-month anniversary, actually.

What I really found enjoyable, however, is that she was (and still is) interested, concerned, and involved in the whole aspect of my transition. Today we both mused that we didn't know why we were dating in the first place, just that we were and that we both loved (and still love) each other very much and that that was probably why we were dating. I don't think anyone really knows why they are dating their significant other, and it is possible that no one really knows why they are married to their significant other as well. Other than love, that is. I digress though, however mushy and touching the tangent may be... :P

She has been asking me questions and learning more and more about me and the whole process from day one. She seems very excited that I am naturally growing breasts, even if it is slower than normal development. She and our sister-friend (friend who is like a sister, but better and not blood related :P) are both worried about my depressive episodes and have suggested antidepressants, even though if I go on antidepressants then that might destroy any chance I have to get on hormones ASAP. They both worry about me and get pissed at me when I don't talk to them about problems I have.

When you have a significant other and you are transitioning it is not just for you anymore, and it should not be. Now you are transitioning so you can be your true self and so you can be with your significant other in the way you want to be with them. To your significant other you are transitioning so you can be your true self and so they can be with you in the way they want to be with you. Of course, this will vary on how accepting your significant other is, but if you really "love" each other for more than physical lust then there should be no problem.

I've accepted myself and know I always was and always will be female. My girlfriend obviously has accepted who I am and knows that I always was and always will be female, even if my body was male at one point. Now it is not a struggle for acceptance, but a struggle to continue onward and to get through this together.

But I must comment on the legal issues surrounding transitioning and marriage... If you get your birth certificates changed, then yes, your marriage is nullified. If you undergo SRS but don't change your birth certificates, however... I am not sure, but I remember reading something somewhere about your certificates eventually being automatically changed and your marriage summarily nullified. Again, I am not sure but I distinctly remember a case where SRS nullified a marriage. :\

However, what does it matter between you and your spouse if the government has papers stating you are married or not? I mean, in the long-term absolute, of course. You are fully entitled to propose and have a symbolic marriage cerimony if you want. You can say "This is my wife" and mean it. I do think, however, that same-sex marriages should be allowed... Do not take what I'm trying to say the wrong way, please. I was trying to lessen the pain the threat of a nullified marriage could cause by presenting solutions and such...

If you've ever played Katamari Damacy in cooperative mode, then I think you know how a relationship with a transsexual or a crossdresser is supposed to work. You need to move in the same direction at the same time at the same pace, otherwise you'll end up off-target and wondering what went wrong.

[~Kitty GG~]

.

However, what does it matter between you and your spouse if the government has papers stating you are married or not? I mean, in the long-term absolute, of course.

The piece of government paper can mean a lot.

Property:
Without it, a couple are considered to be nothing more than room-mates. If one partner dies, everything that was legally owned by them is now owned by their family. And the partner is not considered family.

So that could be devastating to the surviving partner who may be left with little.

Taxes:
Without it, we would pay much more in taxes. It would significantly cut our take home pay. I prefer to have to work longer just to bring in the same amount. We would also not qualify for the benefits other families get. We would be considered single in the eyes of the medicare system etc.

Personal:
The fact that we did choose to marry and would prefer to stay married kind of makes it a sore point against "The Man". Dee and I are very vocal about how the individual should be the ones in control of their own lives. We rant against gov'ts that act like nanny states and telling the citizens what they can and can't do "for thier own good". We can't fathom it when we hear someone say they can't do this or that cuz someone else won't approve. So we resent the idea that the gov't can take this from us.

When we actually get to the point of SRS and changing or not changing Dee's legal gender, she may feel that its very important to her to have "female" on her papers.

Here in Oz, right now, the law is that if you change your gender and become a same sex couple. The marriage is nullified.

These laws are different in other places. These laws are also probably gonna change. Its important for anyone who could be affected to get the facts, and be able to make an informed decision.

The only real definate in all of this for us: That when the time comes we'll make the best choice for us. We won't hide our heads in the sand. We won't let this be a conflict between us. We're in this together.. its the external factors that are our enemy.

Love & Hugs
~Kitty~

[tori-e]

There are so many days when I wish I could just transition and be female full time. Then I think about everything that has to be done in preparation and the telling of family and loved ones.
The first thought that comes to mind is guilt. How would my wife handle this? I am a happily married man and if I did transition I think I would probably still like to be with a woman, can't stand the thought of being with a man sexually.
What would make her in her right mind want to stay with me? When we were married she thought she was marrying a man. She didn't know about the crossdressing back then. I feel like I would be ruining her life to make mine better. Is this selfish?

Has anyone here actually gone through the transition and kept thier marriage intact? I would like to here your thoughts if you have or haven't.

Hi Tracie,

I told my wife about 16 mos ago after 27 years of marriage. I had just read "She's Not There" by Jennifer Boylan and realized there might just be some hope for me. After that, Brenda and I went through many tough weeks. Finally, one night I dressed for her. Something clicked that night. I think all of sudden she saw the girl in me. Since coming out our relationship has improved a billion times. I have a kind of hope and happiness I've never had before. We have never been so honest in our relationship. Brenda is truly amazing!

But, It's not all roses. I've come out to a number of people recently and there is lots of stress in our life. I believe she has accepted the "Tori" in me as being the real me. But is afraid of the how the rest of the world will react to me, us and our family. And hasn't really figured out if a full-time Tori is something she can live with.

As far as transition goes, what is transition? How far do you need to go? There are lots of non-ops that live full time. I have a friend that is a full time crossdressers. No hormones, no surgery. She is happy as she is.

For me, like you, keeping my life intact is very important to me. My job (well I need the money), my family and most importantly Brenda, are things I'm not willing to loose. At the same time I've taken a lot of transition steps, and, I've crossed Brenda's line and started HRT.

So far so good? I guess I've started to transition and kept my marriage intact. I have an accepting spouse but still don't know if there is a happy ending in it for us.

You could take my example or Dee's and say, "Hey this works, go for it!" The big unknown is how your wife will respond. Maybe it'll be "I've always wanted you to have breast! Oh, and get rid of that gross stuff in your pants!" (Ya think?) Or it could be "Get the %#%! out of my house you freak!" (More common?) Reality will be somewhere in between.

I've come out to a number of people and have been luckily successful so far. I think the way you present your problem is key. So I would do your homework before you proceed. The thing that never occurred to me (this is a stupid man/MTF thing I guess) is that I had been hiding something (ie: lying) for many years. So out of the gate there is (will be) a big trust problem.

You'll just never know what will happen. But at the very least you won't be lying anymore.

Please PM me if I can be of any help.

Tori

[Tracy Lynn]

I've been doing lots of research lately to help with the process of telling my wife. She is a very kind and understanding person but this is not your average situation. I hope and pray she will be supportive and choose to be with me through this. It is very hard for me to think that I may loose her. We have been together for 17 years and I would be lost without her.

I may have a talk with her this evening. My stomach has been in knots the past 2 weeks. I haven't been sleeping much and overall not feeling well. I think my nerves are shot. I have to get this off my chest and tonight I want to try. I'm hoping for the best. Thanks for all the responses and support, it means so much too me.

[HaleyPink2000]

When I told my Wife of my going to a support group Gawd the house came down. Are you wanting to have Surgery, Gay? There were tons of questions and tears on both our sides. You know what I mean. Slowly things have come to a level. We both are still in love, and I try to answer all Her questions as honestly as I can. Still I have questions of my own everyday. Do I really want to do this or that? You know I'm sure. It's a hard way to be. But I want total honesty with my Wife, no secrets ever. :D

[OniKoneko]

The piece of government paper can mean a lot.

Property:
Without it, a couple are considered to be nothing more than room-mates. If one partner dies, everything that was legally owned by them is now owned by their family. And the partner is not considered family.

So that could be devastating to the surviving partner who may be left with little.

Taxes:
Without it, we would pay much more in taxes. It would significantly cut our take home pay. I prefer to have to work longer just to bring in the same amount. We would also not qualify for the benefits other families get. We would be considered single in the eyes of the medicare system etc.

Personal:
The fact that we did choose to marry and would prefer to stay married kind of makes it a sore point against "The Man". Dee and I are very vocal about how the individual should be the ones in control of their own lives. We rant against gov'ts that act like nanny states and telling the citizens what they can and can't do "for thier own good". We can't fathom it when we hear someone say they can't do this or that cuz someone else won't approve. So we resent the idea that the gov't can take this from us.

When we actually get to the point of SRS and changing or not changing Dee's legal gender, she may feel that its very important to her to have "female" on her papers.

Here in Oz, right now, the law is that if you change your gender and become a same sex couple. The marriage is nullified.

These laws are different in other places. These laws are also probably gonna change. Its important for anyone who could be affected to get the facts, and be able to make an informed decision.

The only real definate in all of this for us: That when the time comes we'll make the best choice for us. We won't hide our heads in the sand. We won't let this be a conflict between us. We're in this together.. its the external factors that are our enemy.

Love & Hugs
~Kitty~

Very good responses, and things I have talked about before with various friends who have decided to debate me on the whole same sex marriage issue. His basic response was that marriage gave benefits to procreation and heterosexual couples were highly more likely to procreate than homosexual couples. I pointed out that that was stupid and a cover-up for people just plain discriminating against homosexual couples because they think it is wrong somehow.

It just really pisses me off that if my girlfriend and I wanted to we couldn't get married and be... uhh... wife and wife? :P I like to use these heteronormative terms because... Well... We are both girls. I mean, we aren't in the grey sections of gender, really. :\

What I don't get, though... Is why, exactly, feminists say "womyn" and "womon". It's kind of silly to be doing that, in my opinion. I mean, how far is this "separating women and men" thing going to go? We're all human and, yes, I feel that most (but not all) males are... lacking... in the head... :P But soon we'll be saying "weather-person" instead of "weather-man/woman", "repair-person" instead of "repair-man/woman", "congress-person" instead of "congress-man/woman". It's all just semantics and it is stupid to say "womyn" when the "man" in "woman" is the old way to say "human". That's what "man" means. Human. "Man" is rather gender-neutral, actually... It is just that males are called "men" and "man" that confuses things. So, if anything, I think the male terms are the ones that need to change. If you want to look at it from a different angle, then isn't changing "woman" and "women" to "womyn" and "womon" kind of like running and abandoning your ground, in a sense? In feminist views, females are not the problem, mostly. The problem is all on the male side of the spectrum, so why should females need to change their terms and words?

Also, the word "woman" is kind of... Well, I like it... and it seems like "wo" is a prefix to "man". So I think males need a prefix, too. That way, everything can be happy and males will sound funny because we can give them a really hilarious prefix... Or something completely unpronouncable. :P

But you know what? I dunno... I don't really care, much. I was just voicing my opinion on the whole feminist view of changing the word denoting "a female human" around. It's just kind of silly and is, basically, arguing over semantics. But I agree with many other feminist views and every ideology has its silly bits, so I guess it's all okay.

[tori-e]

I may have a talk with her this evening. My stomach has been in knots the past 2 weeks. I haven't been sleeping much and overall not feeling well. I think my nerves are shot. I have to get this off my chest and tonight I want to try. I'm hoping for the best. Thanks for all the responses and support, it means so much too me.

This evening! :eek: Now my stomach is in knots!

I wish you the best! I'll be thinking of you.

Let us all know how it goes.

Hugs, sincerely,
Tori

[Tracy Lynn]

Well, I brought the subject up last night at 9PM and we didn't talk till today at 11:30 in the morning. Things were pretty shaky. Lots of crying and little sleep. She is going to join the forum to get a better insight.
It is a start down a very long road. I don't know how things will end up but at least we are talking about it. I pretty much broke her heart with the news which I was sure was going to happen and I feel terrible. She should'nt have had to go through it. I should have been upfront years ago. If I could go back in time I would change that but I can't.
She is feeling left out right now. She really doesn't understand the whole thing. I suggested she join this site. She has agreed and registered so you can expect to hear from her soon.
Thanks again girls.

[tori-e]

Well, I brought the subject up last night at 9PM and we didn't talk till today at 11:30 in the morning. Things were pretty shaky. Lots of crying and little sleep. She is going to join the forum to get a better insight.
It is a start down a very long road. I don't know how things will end up but at least we are talking about it. I pretty much broke her heart with the news which I was sure was going to happen and I feel terrible. She should'nt have had to go through it. I should have been upfront years ago. If I could go back in time I would change that but I can't.
She is feeling left out right now. She really doesn't understand the whole thing. I suggested she join this site. She has agreed and registered so you can expect to hear from her soon.
Thanks again girls.

Hi Tracie,

Congratulations girl! That was one huge step.

When Brenda was at college she studied a book called "On Death and Dying" by Elisabeth Kubler-Ross. The book details the stages that people go through as they deal with death. A few months after I told Brenda she was saying that she went through all of that with me. She said it was like losing a loved one.

For us coming out has been so good for our relationship. I am in transition, but I still do not have firm (or any) plans that work toward full time RLE. Brenda still has bad days, and good ones too. But now we have a completely open relationship.

I came out to my son (age 26) a month or so back. He took it very well. But I guess is was all just conceptual for him. Then, last week Brenda showed him a picture of me. Head and shoulders, portrait photo. It really hit him hard. I think it suddenly was a lot more real for him. I had dinner with him last night. No talk of TGism. I had a great time with my grandson. Things will get better again. We have lots of love in our family.

Hope your journey heads in a positive direction.

most sincerely,
Tori

[Tracy Lynn]

Well, it has been about 3 weeks since I have come out to my wife. The first week we talked about it a lot. Then we had relatives here for a week so not much talking. I think that slowed things down a little because we haven’t talked about us a lot since then.
.
But I have noticed that she is much more aware of TG issues. Some evenings after work she will bring up things she has heard or seen during the day that will spark conversation. I can tell she is trying to learn about transgender people. I must say she has handled this part of it very well. We have a long road ahead of us as far as we are concerned and many decisions about where our future will go.

The desire I felt 3 weeks ago to transition is still there and as strong but now her feelings are involved as well. Her feelings are more important right now than my own. It is going to take some time for her to decide what she can or can’t live with

At this point in time I will be content with the way things are right now. At least I can be me some of the time instead of never. I am not going to push this too quickly. I would like to have time to make sure we are financially sound before I come out to everyone completely anyway. I would definitely lose my job and we could never make it right now. I just wanted to give you all an update as to where things are right now.

[~Kitty GG~]

That's wonderful Tracie.

Thanx for updating us & please keep updating.

Love & Hugs
~Kitty~

[jamie_44]

Tracie, first of all thanks for a "high interest" thread and to all the girls that have given their views. I am in a similar situation. Married 17 years and have been very open with my wife about transitioning. She has told me that maybe I should because of how I struggle sometimes with life as a guy. I have similar fears, family, kids, work etc. I actually spent ten minutes discussing my situation with an SRS Doctor in person. She told me some families are ok with it and there are some that have transitioned and lost everyone. Like you, I love being a girl and have so much (or seem to have) more confidence. I have been considering talking to a professional that has experience with transgender issues. So anyway, you have a sister here that can totally relate to your situation.

[tori-e]

Hi Tracie,

Glad to know things are ok with you. I was thinking of you and was wondering how it was going.

Tori