Kids are just so honest, it's scary!

[Natasha Anne]

I took my children to a friend's birthday party. There were a lot of children present, as one would expect at a child's birthday party http://rosesforum.tv/forums/images/smilies/happy.gif

Things took a turn towards awkward for me, when my son mentioned to one of the girls there that Natasha was his daddy, and that he was changing into a woman.

The girl approached me a few minutes later and asked, "are you a real woman?" I struggled to find an answer, and eventually said, "no". I could not lie, because I understood the context of the question. This got followed by another question, as kids are prone to do. She asked, "so then why do you wear women's clothes?" I pondered that one for a little bit, because all I was wearing was flat boots, brown corduroys, and long sleeved T-shirt and a pigskin jacket, and then replied quietly, "because I'm changing into one." She seemed fairly satisfied with the answer, so I moved quickly along onto other things!

A few minutes later she approached me again and said, "are you a guy?" I gave her a smile, bent down to her level and put my finger on my lips and said humorously, "shhh." So she accepted it was a bit of a secret. I can't help but wonder what the conversations in the car on the way home with her mom will be like. I did warn the mother though. Fortunately she works with me and knows all about my transition.

Oddly enough, after all I've faced to do it was a difficult moment for me. The questions just weren't like the ones I'd faced before. They were wonderful in both their honesty and simplicity, but incredibly awkward to answer. How does one explain to a 7-year old one barely knows in a couple of moments what it is that is going on?

Just when I thought I'd faced it all, along came another reminder that transition is never going to be simple.

[Shelly Preston]

Hi Natasha

I think you handled the situation very well.
Your right kids can be too honest at times.

[Sarahgurl371]

Natasha I guess you handled it as best you could. Kids do say whatever is on their mind that is for sure.

Its great that her mom works with you and "knows" what is going on. And you told her about it too. Honesty is always hard I guess, but you are honest. Although sometimes it seems that honesty isn't the best policy.

[Maria D]

Yeah, kids seem awkward don't they? I think maybe it's because we ourselves don't know how to break things down to a 'kids will understand' level, and we worry that kids won't accept the truth too. Kind of like the uncomfortability of explaining sex to a kid, it gets turned into something unreal because the adult can't deal with it, or assumes the kid won't understand.
I also know some parents who were worried that if the idea was mentioned to their son, he might 'want to do it too'. Such is the lack of understanding of the human mind. Needless to say, he was fine with me, completely normal, until his Mum told him off for calling me Greg, at which point he became upset and shy at having done wrong. As if I cared, a name's just a name!

Anyway, it seems you faced that moment well, you have to love the honesty don't you? If only adults were like that... :)

Take care :)

[tori-e]

Hi Natasha,

Kids have phenomenal curiosity and can be so brutally observant and honest with their observations.

I have four kids and a grandson. If you have kids you must have had to deal with coming out to children and their parents. My wife and I have been trying to figure out how to deal with this. Our big fear is that our kids will become the neighbourhood pariah. How have you been dealing with this?

thanks,
Tori

[Natasha Anne]

I understand your reasoning, but I personally disagree. If someone asks me if I am a "real" woman, my answer is going to be "yes" without any reservations.

I'm not a genetic woman (though neither are women born with CAIS). I wasn't raised as a girl, so I don't qualify as a "woman born woman" by the standards of some old school feminists. But that doesn't make me any less a woman, and I reject the notion that it makes my womanhood any less valid. I don't think that answering that question with a "yes" would have been untruthful, though I suppose that this is a question that only you can answer for yourself.

I don't have any children. I don't know how I would handle it if my 7-year old outed me to another child, so I'm not criticizing how you handled it (you seem to have done reasonably well).

But for me, admitting that I was a "guy" or denying that I was a "real woman" would be the untruthful answer. I guess it is just a matter of perspective.

I think you're over analyzing. Kids don't do that.

She was asking if I had the right parts and stuff. She would not have asked the question if she thought I was a "real woman", and if I'd said "yes" that would have led to more questions and possibly her feeling lied to.

[Clare]

Young Children are great. They ask direct questions, you give them an honest answer and they move onto the next thing of interest in their lives. No criticisms, no judgments, just acceptance of the situation.

I think you responded approriately Natasha.

[Natasha Anne]

BTW, I am aware that it may seem like I'm nitpicking.

The thing is, I don't consider this "nit" to be a minor point. I've seen sentiments like "I'm not a real woman" or "I'll never be a real woman" expressed several times on this forum (in various ways) in just the brief time I've been here, and it annoys me no end.

I *don't* see a similar sentiment being expressed nearly as frequently on other trans boards. It seems to be a common viewpoint here, but I think that it is very much a minority opinion on the boards with which I am most familiar.

Anyway, your post just happens to be the one to which I responded. Probably not the most appropriate choice, since I'm sure that wasn't really the main point you were trying to make with your post. No offense intended, and I'll just go back to lurking now...

Oh gosh, no offense was taken. I was just trying to clarify.

I dearly wanted to answer yes, because I do identify as a woman, and I am full time. I just don't remember him anymore.

I just knew that her question was simplistic and could not possibly contain all the nuances and adult might have intended with exactly the same words.

As for your point about "I'm not a real woman" or "I'll never be a real woman". Good for you for pointing it out. I notice that a lot, and did spend some time a few months (as I started RLT) thinking like that. The wording then did not express my inner identity, it was more related to passable presentation. So I think you're right, if people doubt their core identity, that's scary and perhaps more therapy is required. If the questions are attached to whether they're passable, that's something different entirely and really something that is easily overcome mentally as one lives as a woman full time. RLT has been magnificent for my mental state in that regard.

[Kimberley]

I think the bottom line answer here is not that anyone was lying to anyone. A child has a child's comprehension; limited at best. An adult has considerably different capabilities. This was no sin of ommission.

I would not try to explain the Theories of Quantum Physics to a 7 year old. Would you? However, am I lying if I put it in terms they might understand by leaving out detail?

Natasha, you handled it right in my opinion. You gave an answer that was honest and well thought out for the circumstances. I am sure your answer to an adult would have been entirely different. This is a simple situation with a question posed by a simple mind. Why does it have to be made complex?

Just my opinions.
:hugs:
Kimberley.

[~Dee~]

Natasha ~

a funny situation you found yourself in :happy:
im glad you had fun with it instead of letting it get to you.

i think you did a great job from the sounds of it and as far as what you said, i think you did what was right for you .. and i think thats the main point.
how you see yourself or how you would answer this question is a personal matter on how You see Yourself.

i know that my answers to this question would be totally different from a lot of people here .. but i dont think that makes me wrong. just means i see myself differently from others.

if only you had the kids car bugged for the travel home .. that really would be a nice conversation to be a 'fly on the wall' for :D

[Maria D]

Kimberley, Terry Pratchett refers to the phenomona you mention as lies-to-children. For example, that light passing through a raindrop splits and that's how rainbows are formed. From one point of view, a simplistic version for the child to understand, from another point of view, a lie that the child will have to unlearn at some point later in life. A sort of onion of truth, perhaps.

Personally, I don't think 'Yes I'm a woman but my body was wrong and needed fixing' is ANY more complicated than 'no but I'm changing into one', and I don't see either as being harder to understand. It's up to the individual to decide which tack they wish to take. :)

Take care :)

[Natasha Anne]

With each post this thread becomes more interesting.

So to add more...

It is commonly referenced by body language experts that at best 17% of our communication is verbal and the rest is carried across by body language, particularly micro-signals i.e. those characteristics we're not as in control of, instead of the obvious signs we've all learned about and may interpret as someone lying.

I think children are more able to pick up those signals. Given the discussion thread here, I think either yes or no would have been okay, as long as it was said with integrity and respectfully. Children would pick up they were not being lied to and would be happy with either answer.

Of course, this is one woman's opinion 0.02

[Kimberley]

An interesting point Natasha. I think this is something most parents learn very quickly, that is to explain in simple terms that a child can understand. Children are also very perceptive as any parent knows. As Natasha pointed out they will pick up on body language even more quickly than most adults. I think that to underestimate a child is a huge mistake. Understanding them is the greater good.

My own experience has been to give them simple answers first. They will come back in later years and expect the more complex answer.

To draw an analogy. 5 year old Suzy asks "What is a penis?" Do you give her the complete dissertation of male physiology and sexual performance or answer it simply by telling her it is a part of every boy. That is probably enough to satisfy her curiosity. A few years down the road she will want more and then she will be prepared to accept that more detailed answer. (Of course by the time she is 15 we as parents will wish she had never heard of one...LOL)

In that light she is not unlearning anything, only building on what she already knows. It still comes down to being honest with the child first in terms they can understand. Overloading a child with information can be just as bad as dismissing them.

Ms. Donna also encountered a similar situation and handled it very much the same way with the same results.

I think it is essential to give an answer the child can comprehend and s/he will be satisfied just as Natasha has experienced.

:hugs:
Kimberley.