how does one fight depression

[carolbitv]

hi all, my name is Carolbitv and i am fighting a bout of depression. Would like to know how one overcomes this. Just frustrated with my lonelyness and my desire to dress and have no one to share with. Thank you Carol

[clarissa3d]

Sorry to hear about you depression, I can say it is not easy to get past. it does help to talk, Even though you feel like everything is comming down on you, remember that it will pass!. Find something to talk about in the forum and focus on that.

[JennyCD]

Welcome Carol!

I, and some others here, know exactly how you are feeling. I also battle depression.

First: It helps to stay busy. I know that sounds corny, but it IS true. Physical activity, especially if you don't feel like it, does wonders. Take walks, clean house, work, whatever. Just do something.

Second: Write. This is the single most important part for me, and I know it works for many others as well. Write down what you are feeling in a journal, a notepad, or hey! how about a forum? Writing these things helps to get it outside of yourself in a way that makes it easier to deal with. When I was in depression treatment, we had an exercise where we would have some nice soft intrumental music playing.

We would then sit quietly and imagine a nice safe place that makes us feel happy. A warm sandy beach, our favorite hammock, a quiet pond whatever. After about five minutes of this we would then begin writing.

The rule was, you just write whatever comes to your mind, no matter what it is. Don't worry about spelling or any of that, and NEVER make any corrections. Just write it out. Write for at least 30 minutes. Don't stop. Just write.

Afterwards, you put it away. Don't read what you wrote until the following day. You'll be amazed at how much you don't even recall writing. It really does help one examine their own mind quite well. It also allows us to express these feelings and thoughts. Get them outside.

Third and most important: IF you are feeling severly depressed for a long time, seek medical attention. I mean it. It could be a chemical imbalance that is easily corrected. I was on meds for two years. It really did help. I am off of them now, and yes I do still get down once in a while. But we all do dear.

Please seek help if you can't work through this in a few weeks. The longer you allow it to go on, the longer it takes to treat. The meds aren't magic bullets, they take time to work.

And if you have any thoughts of harming yourself, get help NOW! We want you around for a long time to come.

OK, enough long-winded answer. Sorry, is just something I have experiecne dealing with from a personal perspective.

By the way, I am glad you found us. You're home now.

[SherryAnn]

well here's something I do know a little about cause I was diagnosed a few years back with clinical depression, by-polor, excessive angziaty, extream mood swings, panic attacks, & a bad speller. It got so bad I would crawl under the table all day. There were times I couldn't even stand in the express lane at the market without breaking out in a swet & leaving before I got to the check out!!!!!
They tried alot of meds on me & finally ended up on "Zoloft" & for sleeping "trazadone" as I couldn't sleep over 3 hours at a time without waking up in a cold swet. Fun-huh. Yea I even thought of ending it all a couple times & finally went to a local clinic & told them I was about to do harm to me or someone else real quick. That got me to the front of the line real quick-lol,lol.
It took a couple months for the meds to start working where I could see a difference. But you have the first 1/2 of the battle over with, you know something's amiss in yo noggin so go talk to someone who can steer you in the right direction. There's nothing wrong with someone who has the common sence to know "a little help is called for, doesn't mean your nuts. There's about 3 million people here in the USA who have serious problems with themselves & dont even know it or are to proud to admit it & seek some help. Dont be 1 of those, depression doesn't get better by itself, it gets worse, like a black cloud hanging over your head 24/7. Yea I still get bouts of feeling like crying (freakin Carol Carpenter cd didn't help last week) & sometimes I just feel like laying in bed all day but its nothing like it used to be. I go out to dinner by myself now, shop, can walk around in a mall un-afraid, everthing is ok most of the time & when it gets a little cloudy in me head at least I know now what it is & what to do (have a shot or two of "Jack Danials" put on a sexy dress, some rock & roll & dance with meself around the trailer) who cares if I'm alone-a couple more gulps of "JD" & I'll be passed out anyway-lol,lol,lol,lol,lol. Just go see someone, even if ya cant afford it I'm sure there gotta be some sort of clinic around there

[SherryAnn]

you can email me to if ya want when ya feel like just talking cause I know exactly where your coming from-- bob-moore@sbcglobal.net

[maryjanecapri]

i can only speak from my own personal experience. when i'm feeling depressed i do two things: i ride more (i'm an avid cyclist) and i write more (also an avid writer).

when those things don't work i turn to my friends and chat about it.

if you don't have a healthy physical outlet or emotional outlet, talking is the best thing.

[Wenda]

Congratulations for this posting, Carol! I was first made aware of depression when our oldest child, a very intellingent young man, was finally diagnosed in grade eleven. I now recognize depression that was experienced by my father and myself. I am on a zoloft derivative. When I stop taking it, I get more aggressive, less patient, and become more impulsive.
All of the previous advice is supported by the evidence. more excercise, more rest, less stess.
The most important thing is: DO NOT BEAT YOURSELF UP!! Our societies have taught us to "overcome" depression. That is not possible. Just like you cannot overcome a broken leg or diabetes. This is a medical condition.
All that said, don't be unneccessarily open about the condition. If you report it as 'burn-out' or 'fatigue' it raises a lot less red flags than 'depression". PM me if you feel like it.
take care of yourself, you are the only one who can! luvs, wenda.

[DonnaT]

Just frustrated with my lonelyness and my desire to dress and have no one to share with.

I wouldn't jump to the comnclusion of depression. A clinical evaluation may be in order.

However, taking omega-3 supplements (at you local store/pharmacy) has been shown to fight depression and bipolar disorder. See:

http://www.mcmanweb.com/article-15.htm

http://www.pslgroup.com/dg/fdb3e.htm

[Chrissycd]

to comfort myself with music, reflect by writing down my concerns and thereby getting them out of my system, and reading. I eat "soul" food, which, to me, is soup, maybe pizza or ramen, just stuff that is easy to make and warming. I love to drink tea. It quiets me inside. Also, when I have an extended down time (which is rare in my life now), I did yoga. It is a gift to experience if you are experiencing depression. Even if you just go once a week, it will lighten your spirit. Just give it a chance. Just as important, chat with understanding friends who don't think it's their duty to give you advice, but with those who just want to talk with you and listen to you.
Beyond that, seeing a professional therapist is very helpful in many situations.
Hugs,
Chrissy

[Bonnie-OR]

Carol. Listen to these girls. They know from whence they speak. These are some of the smartest people I've met in my life. I'm sure I'm one of the ones mentioned that pass it off as burnout or fatigue. When I do get down, I try to hang out with my more cheerful friends, or get out and ride my motorcycle or atv. I just can't be down when I'm doing that. One of the worst things for me is to be around other depressed people. That has a real snowball effect. If you do find yourself down for more than a day or two, you might be best to go see a pro. Not that kind!!! A doctor or councilor. Anyway, I don't think I've said Hi to you yet so HI. Huggs, Bonnie

[Marlene4a]

Carole:

I know how to fight this evil.

I have been there once.
Many may hate me for saying this, but accept Christ as your Saviour now.
Tell him you are tired of sinning.
Tell him you repent.
Ask him in your heart.
You will then be saved.

Believe me, you will never regret this.

Love

[carolbitv]

i wish to thank you all. i wl read more and contact some members thanks again i am not going to hurt myself. members you are awesome. :)

[Marlene4a]

Carole:

Contact me anytime @ Marlene9018@yahoo.com

After that, if necessary, I will give you my phone number.

[Stormgirl]

The gun range. :mad:

[JamieNZ]

hi all, my name is Carolbitv and i am fighting a bout of depression. Would like to know how one overcomes this. Just frustrated with my lonelyness and my desire to dress and have no one to share with. Thank you Carol

As someone who has suffered depression all of their life, I recommend "Doing". Do anything... walk, dance, drive, go to a movie, go to the gym, read a book, engage in anything you can. Force yourself to do something... whatever it is. Depression causes inaction... Doing helps... just DO anything. It works. Trust me on this.

[samanthajay]

find out what wrong in your life. get some tesculerforatude (is that right to say here? :confused: ) and change it. if you want to know more from me just go to wacotxgurls tread about her problems. im sorry but im not typing it all again. that last post i did on that tread was a lot :)

[Alayna]

Wow, it seems Wellbutrin and Trazodone are the flavor of the week for depression. I'm on both (only take the T rarely) as well as dextroamphetamine for ADD. As another lifelong depressive I'm all too familiar with those down times. When I'm down I have a hard time doing anything at all. Depression affects everyone differently. For me it helps to just have a good long talk with someone I'm close to. The subject doesn't matter, just talking and getting stuff out does worlds for bringing me out of a funk.

[Celeste GG]

Yes sometimes it is difficult.. being here should help... It always cheers me up to see what wonderful support you girls are!

There is one drug free remedy that they are trialling on children now. A herb called Sam-e bottled as a natural remedy called "mood Lift" it is a seratonin uptaker... I dont' get major depression just the "It's all too hard blues.." sometimes. It works well

I was ver out of sorts before I found BDSM and Mistressing. I knew I was different but diddn't quite know what it was.

Now I know "I am special" :p

[kimlove57]

i find talking with others helps find someone you trust and open up what on your mind i had to get on meds to help i deel with guilt like even stuff i have nothing to do with and feel lower then drit sometimes talk to someone see if that helps if not kept trying things to find what works for you

[Teddie]

One very simple way. By dressing. It brings me right out of my funk.

[Wendy me]

if your depressed and it dosen't go away get some helpe sometimes a little helpe goes a long way too easy to lose it......... crashing is not pretty ........i got the tee shirt........life is way to short to let it eat you up

[carolbitv]

i am taking meds also getting professial help. but some days seems nothing helps. for some reason i can't come out to my shrink. just a block i quess. also live in a small town in southern interior of Bc Canada. where everyone knows everyone. not ready for that much of a outing. that could hurt big time also destory any chance for a job if i came out of retirement. thanks again you are a great group. hugs Carolbitv

[JoannaDees]

i am taking meds also getting professial help. but some days seems nothing helps. for some reason i can't come out to my shrink. just a block i quess. also live in a small town in southern interior of Bc Canada. where everyone knows everyone. not ready for that much of a outing. that could hurt big time also destory any chance for a job if i came out of retirement. thanks again you are a great group. hugs Carolbitv

Perhaps you should change the meds. All meds work differently for different people. And you can trust the professional community, it is their oath to not divulge what you say. If you don't feel comfortable with "the shrink", who is probably the med pusher with short appointments anyway, sign up to a therapist. They'll give you more time for talk, and that does help.

Keep trying ...
Joanna

[Wenda]

i am taking meds also getting professial help. but some days seems nothing helps. for some reason i can't come out to my shrink. just a block i quess. also live in a small town in southern interior of Bc Canada. where everyone knows everyone. not ready for that much of a outing. that could hurt big time also destory any chance for a job if i came out of retirement. thanks again you are a great group. hugs Carolbitv
Hi again carol, any mental illness is likely to get short shrift in the medical system. I spent a summer in the royal university hospital, orthopeadic unit, after spinal surgery, and I think the med system can fix any physical problem if they want to. Mental issues are a whole different matter. A family friend from university days was my MD. she just kept referring me to different specialists until we found one that worked. She finally referred me to a dr. who specialized in meds. He was south african, very clinical, not interpersonal, but spotted the problem with my meds, even things such as the time of day that I took them.
My eldest son just spent a year off on med absence. He couldn't sleep and couldn't wake up. fell asleep at the wheel of his car en route to work. His problem and frustration is that, if you 'appear' functional, the system doesn't take you seriously... in the waiting room at the clinic, there you are, with the guy in a fetal position being harangued by the guy with the conspiracy theory, then in comes the old guy who collects lost hub caps, with some dandelions for the receptionist...So,,, what's your problem?? can't sleep????wwwwhoooaaahhh call us when you are thinking of jumping!!! Keep looking, outside your community. the help does exist. Please. wenda.

[Georgette]

Carole:

I know how to fight this evil.

I have been there once.
Many may hate me for saying this, but accept Christ as your Saviour now.
Tell him you are tired of sinning.
Tell him you repent.
Ask him in your heart.
You will then be saved.

Believe me, you will never regret this.

Love
I agree with Marlene I was in a deep state of depression before I found this forum, I would go out to take the dog for his morning walk and I would be crying the whole time I knew that I had to do something so one morning I said George you really do believe in GOD why not look to Him for guidance, so instead of crying for the next 2 or 3 weeks I wolud pray as I walked the dog and then one after noon I was on this computer and typed in crossdresser and lo and be hold I found this site and it sent me on a whole new trip, the GIRLS here are wonderful and I can't get enough of them. Any way if you still are needing clinlcal help please GO FOR IT. :)
HUGS :rolleyes:
Georgette ;)
PS: Marlene I don't hate you I embrace you like a sister LOVE
Georgette

[StephanieCD]

I've been diagnosed and drugged more times than I care to mention - are there a lot of us? Does CD come with it or vice versa?

For depression, not anxiety which is another ball o wax, I suggest...

Go buy "The Artist's Way" - read the book and follow the plan. **** everything else but you and this book - except if you have family and stuff. This book is a creativity exploration thing. Self help ish but not. In the program you MUST write every day. You must take yourself on "dates" there's a lot of good stuff in there. As a depression survivor, anxiety-ridden social freak, codependant, part-time alcoholic, and closeted cross dresser I highly recommend this book. In fact, I think I'm going to go dig it out and do it myself since my ADD probably contributed to putting it down before I finished... probably why I haven't been doing so hot lately.

Also - music. Outside of my own experience - the lead signer of Rusted Root was suicidally depressed when a friend "prescribed" a guitar... he obsessed over it instead of his suffering. I personally have found depression to be a very obsessive cycle - break the cycle by finding something to redirect that obsession.

I had a ton other things to say but I'm so happy with the first one I decided to stick with this.

Feel free to PM me as well - always willing to help someone scrape themselves up :) Many have done it for me.

[Marlene4a]

Thank you Georgette.

You are on the correct thinking pattern.
People think that God hates them or wants to punish them all the time, but that is simply not true.

Others think that by accepting the Lord that died on the cross for them, that they must give up this world, become a monk, or go to New Guinnea as a missionary and get boiled in a big pot or something.
Simply not true.

The God of my salvation (Jesus) has brought me eternal life (by his grace, not by my works), and peace of mind.
He allows me to be myself, no matter what clothes I choose to wear.

Love

[Georgette]

Thank you Marlene I know your feelings God does forgive us all we have to do is ask.
God also loves each and every one of us, maybe sometimes we seem to think things don't go fast enough for us but God has all eternity to answer us and the answer usually is there all we have to do is look for it.
LOVE & HUGS
Georgette

[Marlene4a]

You are right Georgette.
Flesh and blood did not reveal this to you.

Me.

[KewTnCurvy GG]

Hi,
Well this is a subject to near to me than I care to admit. I've struggled with depression and and off since around the age of 7. I wasn't officially diagnosed and treated until I was in my early 20's but looking back I can see that I was quite depressed a significant period of my life. I eventually went on meds in my 30's. And with medication, therapy, friends/loved ones and my own will and determination; I have been able to cope and live with my depression. You may or may not know that I am a clinical social worker, so I've been on both sides of this coin. I think many here have offered some good suggestions and words of wisdom. Although from my own experience both personal and professional; I would argue that it is easier said than done to just 'will' yourself to get up and out and do things. Yes, you need take care of yourself and do those things over which you have control. I've had many a well intentioned friend try to encourage me to just 'get up and go out and walk' or what have you when I'm lying there trying to think of the reasons to take my next breath. Depression is exhausting! Absolutley soul-suckingly exhausting. So when or if you find yourself in that deep, dark black hole; do try and crawl out. However, if you can't do it by yourself, then by all means reach out for help. I hope this is helpful. Feel free to contact me and I will try to be of help in whatever way I can. Also, there is a forum called http://www.wingofmadness.com/forums/; don't let the name scare you. It's for ppl with depression and other mood disorders and such. Lots of good information and support there. Good luck!

hugs
kew

[Alayna]

I would argue that it is easier said than done to just 'will' yourself to get up and out and do things. Yes, you need take care of yourself and do those things over which you have control. I've had many a well intentioned friend try to encourage me to just 'get up and go out and walk' or what have you when I'm lying there trying to think of the reasons to take my next breath. Depression is exhausting! Absolutley soul-suckingly exhausting.
It's hard for people who don't have depression to understand this. Even for people who've had temporary or situational depression sometimes don't understand. You can't just "cheer up" or "look on the bright side". Depression can take so many forms, and it's very hard to diagnose especially when so many people view it not as a disease but as a condition or even a cop-out. For me, the task of paying a bill seemed as exhausting as running a marathon. I was only diagnosed a year ago, but my life and attitude have changed dramatically since I started anti-depressants and therapy.

One of the biggest reasons people (including myself) don't get the help they need is because they feel silly seeing a doctor for what seems to be just a funk when there are so many people out there with cancer or whatever. Don't fall in this trap if you can avoid it, it just makes things worse.

[Marlene4a]

Believe me gang. I know a lot about this hateful thing. I know how to combat it with something more powerful than "it".

It can be overcome.

email me at Marlene9018@yahoo.com

Love

[Wen4cd]

Yes, I must agree.

Pills. Pills are the answer.

*guffaw guffaw*

[Marlene4a]

I had a very good friend that I have known for many years.

He and I were close from the sense that we were in the same profession, and not only, from a professional standpoint, but we would associate "off line"if you will, with his family and ours.

One day, he admitted to me that he and his wife were getting a divorce. I was taken aback, I mean they had everything in the world, money, cars, 2 homes, property, I could go on and on.

I noticed him getting quieter and not talking as much as he used to , no more smiles, whispering sort of voice, etc.

Confronting him with this out of concern, he stated that he could not imagine himself to go on without his wife whom he loved. He said that she wanted to "play the field, etc"

I said "play the field"? "She is over 50, and you guys have been married over 20 years, and she wants to "play the field"?

"I know" he said..."I don't know why she wants to do that. I thought I was a good husband to her, and a good father to my kids"

I knew this man well, he was a good husband and an excellent father, in my opinion.

To make a long story short. He started taking Prosac. And I noticed he kept getting worse, and would slurr his words now and then.

NO matter what I said, would fall on deaf ears.

I did'nt see him for about a week, then I got a phone call that he committed suicide.
I could'nt believe it.

He had "extreme" depression, but it all started from him thinking his self worth was very low.
Nothing could be further from the truth. He listened to a lie.

That was 2 years ago. We miss him.

Me

[KewTnCurvy GG]

Well, Marlene, not all of us believe as you. I'm agnostic and if there is a G(g)od it is neither female or male. It is also not the only one spoken of in the Bible. It is what Buddha taught, what Muslims believe in and the God of the Jews as well. It is nameless and faceless. This IS what I BELIEVE. No one can sway me and my heart is at peace. As for medication, for me they saved my life. You do not know what led that man specifically to suicide. It may have nothing to do with his medication. He could have gone off them or what have you. You also do not necessarily know what other risk factors he may have had; such as substance abuse, additional health problems and/or a history of depression and/or suicide in his family. I am a strong believer that depression should NOT just be treated with medication but should be used in conjunction with therapy. Everyone here needs to make their own decision as to what speaks to their heart and for them what the best course of action is. I am sorry for you about the loss of your friend. That is horrible and very sad. But please don't assume that everyone thinks or believes as you do.

Meant in peace,
hugs
kew

[Rachel Ann]

Hi, carolbitv

I suppose I should weigh in on this one because I have had what they now call "major depression" all my life.

A lot of confusion comes from the fact that in English the word "depression" is used for a mood that everyone sometimes has, and also for a hereditary neurochemical disease that only some of us have. For the rest of this post I will be talking about the second kind.

A lot of things can trigger a bout of depression but once it gets its teeth in it has a life of its own and is no longer "about" anything. You can't just "cheer up". What Kew and Alayna describe is very real and very scary, and an "episode" usually takes its own sweet time to run its course. For a coping strategy I have usually tried to make the most of the "remission" periods and avoid things that can trigger a fresh onset.

And, as Alayna points out, an awful lot of people think that we are just a bunch of malingerers.

Available treatment still has one foot in the dark ages but is better than nothing. Some of the stuff they used to do to us beggars belief. Most of us have to try several Anti-Depressent drugs before finding the one that is "right". I settled on Effexor as the one with the "least objectionable" side effects. I also get Wellbutrin, Trazodone, Ambien, Valium and Provigil. (Add 8 cardio meds to that and you can see why hormones are out of the question for me :p )

Kew and Joanna are right about "talk" therapy being important as an adjunct to drugs but this is the USA and I just can't afford it. A good psychologist can usually diagnose depression, although it takes a psychiatrist to prescribe drugs. Many physicians only have a superficial knowledge of this and don't necessarily know which drugs are right or how much to prescribe.

There are also a lot of good depression support boards. http://www.wingofmadness.com/forums/ isn't for everyone (sorry, Kew) but there are others. I presently hang out at http://www.beatingthebeast.com/ (I'm not "out" there yet so if you somehow recognize me please don't say anything). http://www.walkers.org/, http://spiritofwisdom.ipbhost.com/ and http://www.depressionsupport4all.com/ are all worth a look.

If you are blessed with a spiritual belief, that's good - prayer helps me - BUT faith has to be given to you, it isn't something that you can achieve. So if you don't have it at the moment this is not the time to struggle to find it.

I was very scared because I am in the deepest and longest bout of depression I have ever had and was starting to give up on ever getting better this time. Surprise! Finding this board and "unleashing" Rachel has for the first time in years given me something to live for and look forward to!

Blah blah blah I suppose I should cut to the chase.

DON'T ISOLATE YOURSELF. Talk to us, see if you can find people to talk to on other boards. If you can't talk to a shrink, look for a better one.

Good luck and lots and lots of love. Keep us posted.

Hugs and kisses

[Wen4cd]

Word of caution:

I would stay away from any message boards dealing primarily as a support group for depression, or anything you might find when googling for "depression"

Make your support group one like this one -- one dealing with something other than the subject of depression or mental health. I have a lot of reasons for this, but if you try google, or depression boards, you'll see what I mean.

If you actively go out looking for help with depression on thew web, you'll find nothing but quack psy people, goofy cults, drug companies' prop sites, message boards full of emotional vampires, mental predators, etc. All looking at you as easy weak prey.

But if you go into a "hobby" or special interest oriented board, you'll make friends that don't look at you that way, and then when you're feeling depressed, you have friends to cheer you up. Some benign 'mickey mouse fan club' board is probably less dangerous than even this board is. You'll at least have something else to talk about besides sorrow, pills, and suicide. And you really don't need to ruminate on that any more than necessary.

If I ever wanted to start a cult, or prey on my fellow man, the very first thing I'd do is make sure my site was top-ranked when anyone googled "depression."

[Rachel Ann]

If you actively go out looking for help with depression on thew web, you'll find nothing but quack psy people, goofy cults, drug companies' prop sites, message boards full of emotional vampires, mental predators, etc. All looking at you as easy weak prey.
Some are, Wen, but some are good. I had to go through a lot of them before finding the one that works for me. Like anything else on the net, you will always find bogus stuff, and have to use your judgment.

Boards that stress up front that they are just support groups with no professional help available tend to be free of the kind of stuff that you mention. Of course there are always members who will suck the life out of you if you let them - never chum up with a borderline!

The board I go to has some nice folks on it and I'm glad to have it. We get to compare notes (there is a lot of misinformation in the medical world), keep each other company, and discuss our disease, which is not really understood by those who don't have it. The board Kew mentioned didn't work out for me but I made some great friends there and am still in touch with most of them.



and then when you're feeling depressed, you have friends to cheer you up.
Sorry, "clinical" depression is not something that people can "cheer you up" from.



You'll at least have something else to talk about besides sorrow, pills, and suicide.
There are folders for such topics but it hardly dominates our conversation.

[Wen4cd]

It's my opinion only. I refuse to debate the existence of clinical depression here. My post was just what I said it was -- a word of caution; nothing more.

[MiaPink]

Two things I do: Occupy your mind and talk about it.

[Wen4cd]

Just to play 'devil's advocate" here for a minute (pun alert)......

You say the God thing is 'her trip." But then you say you were treated with drugs and therapy. Is that not "your trip" as well? Not that I agree with christianity, but Marlene4a is only in the minority here, not in the wrong.

Many people get away with advising medication and therapy as a combatant to depression -- nobody questions them, though the result is essentially the same.

Advising somebody to abdicate their free will to a school of medical thought is no different than suggesting they do so to their own deity.

People who spout the benefits of therapy and drugs sound exactly the same to me as people who spout the benefits of Jesus, only the Jesus people don't have clinically engineered, mood altering chemical compounds coursing through their veins.

Just because your 'side' is enjoying more popularity right now doesn't make it better. Marlene4a found her answer, and wants to share it. Just as lots of people found drugs and psychiatry as their answer, and they also share it. Whether you believe it is a 'crutch' is entirely subjective. They both are a crutch.

[Julie]

Depending on the type of depression try this link.

http://www.thinkyourselfhappy.com

JJ

[Wendy me]

dealing with depression your slefe or with the help of outhers is ok if finding god dose it thats ok .........if you are all cousmed by it ........or even think of killing your slefe......whether that seams like a possablity ..............run don't walk get help if you have a freind or family member that is in this way of thinking help them help themsleves

rember that after your gone you leave your family to pick up the peices
killing your slefe kills a part of all you leave behinde

love your slefe and your love ones enough to get some help

[Rhonda Callahan]

To one and all, I was a counselor for years, always supervised by a Dr. of Psychiatry, and I think maybe one thing was missed on the threads about depression.That of alcohol use, the biggest depressant of all! It makes us feel better, for awhile, and then works to do the opposite, over the long term.I drink, always have , always will, but you have to be aware of the long term effects.This is a chemical agent that we gladly induce into our bodys, readily, and for specific uses. We drink to get happy, to comfort ourselves when we're down, to get more happy, to fit in, to cry, (as in our beer), to get high, to support the lows,etc. , etc. , etc. !!!The chemical reaction that takes place in the brain, will over time produce a depressed reaction to most things in life. I could go on, and on. Just making us all aware of the prices we pay for getting high, and , also, hopefully all of the therapists out there tell us of this effect, especially with the use of antidepressants, one drink reverses the positive effects of one antideprssant pill ! And this isn't true for everyone, people react differently to alcohol, but it's something to think about, and to be aware of, LOL. ;)

[Marlene4a]

I respect your posture on this.
I am not going to make this a long rebuttal.

However, I am telling you what worked for me. Period.
I know every time I bring up my faith it raises "hackels" and I knew that going in.

The person starting this post was asking a question, not making a statement of their posture on this subject.
After the thread is done that person, can review all the information here and make their own decision for themselves.

My God, is not an "enforcer" of you or anyone else.
He is there stretching his hand out, not grabbing you by the throat.

It is up to the person searching to make the decision. I don't open up someones mouth to stuff pills down their throat, just like I do not open their brain, and stuff information in their head.

In some cases pills, medication, and therapy work just fine.

This is how I feel now, and I am not pushing anything......I can only tell what I see. I am a scientist, and have been taught that what is physical is related to physical laws, not spiritual, and further taught, there is no spiritual side. (Nothing could be further from the truth. Sometimes I disagree with my own profession)
But I have seen people that were destitute and have tried everything this world has to offer. When they have given up, and take that hand that is outstretched by God, then something happens that is good. I have SEEN it work for other people besides myself.

Now you can yell at me all you want, but I know what has worked for me.

I remain....a Christian, saved by grace through Jesus Christ paying the price for me, and it was He, who took away my depression.
I know what that is, and Kew described it to a "T", it is a black hole, sometimes so deep, you cannot get out.

[Marlene4a]

I am not talking about RELIGION here.
I hate religion, and so does My Lord.

[Wen4cd]

It sounds like the better living through chemistry isn't working out too well. I'm no chemist, but maybe the prozac isn't reacting too well with the LSD and the communism.
Something in that mix is making you sound all confused and angry and incoherent.

[Wen4cd]

But to get the subject back where it belongs. I'll share one of my favorite coping mechanisms.

I call it the "Tom T. Hall Analogy Model of Taking Responsibility"

Hypothetically: You are a hog farmer who is laid up in the hospital, the doctors say you are dying. (This is analogous to your stifling depression or complex or whatever you feel like whining about.)

Now, you (as the farmer) repeat to yourself the following:

400 hogs, they're just standing out there
My wife can't feed 'em, and my neighbors don't care
They can't go out and roam around like my old hunting dogs...

Now answer yourself truthfully, while you lay in that dang bed: Who's gonna feed them hogs?

[Amelie]

I can see what Allison is saying. Christianity does more harm than good. When a priest or Minister is found abusing children, the church turns a blind eye. Yet, they are dam quick to condem my lifestyle, even though I am not a christian. It is Christian Zealots that keep most of you in the closet. They feed the hate in the idiots who bash Cds. I find it bizzare that CDs can actually call themselves christians. If christians are so loving and caring, then let's see you go to church in drag, we''ll see how much the church loves you. I know some here will say, i am not part of a religion, it is between me and my god. But if you claim to be a christian then you are also pert of this group that allows children to be abused. If you were real christians you would demand the church clean up it's act, but most christians remain silent.
Amelie

PS-Where are the Romans and lions when you need them

[Wen4cd]

Can't argue with you there, except to say that zealots will be zealots, no matter what the faith.

[Amelie]

I agree Wen, I only had troublr with christian zealots, I haven't met the others yet, I don't look foward to meeting them.
Amelie

[Rachel Ann]

Compulsively saying this over and over:

5% of the people make 95% of the noise everywhere.

The good ones you never hear from - they are drowned out by the handful of others.

p.s. Amelie, I have always loved that av! Nice to see it back.

[Wendy me]

it struke me "how doese one fight depression" you don't fight it you aren't at war with it if you are you will lose you deal with it accepte it in your hart for what it is explore it deal with it get help if you need it but rember if you fight it the war is in you someone going to lose. no i don't think you can fight it..............right??????

[Sharon]

I think what's missing here is that when we are dealing with depression, or any debilitating disease, we need to keep searching until we find what works for us. What helps one person won't necessarily be right for the next. Does that mean we shouldn't consider them? Or offer what has helped us?
I didn't see where anyone was "pushing" anything. All I saw were a couple suggestions on how they dealt with it.
Relax ladies. Let's be open to all legitimate courses, and yes, religion is legitimate. Just not for everyone.

[Rachel Ann]

Well said, Sharon and Wendy.

There is no sense in fighting something that's bigger and stronger than you - ever try to "fight" the flu?

My big mistake was to get cocky during remission and think that I had "beaten" depression. You never do. As with addiction, you can just strive for "recovery".

Available medical treatments are still half-a**ed but better than nothing.

If God wanted to heal me I'm sure that He would, but I guess my condition is part of some overall plan. I think it has to do with Karma - and genetics.

Love

[Marlene4a]

People get religion mixed up with a "personal relationship with God"
Also, they assume priests, and all people of the cloth are such "angels" because they talk of "Gawwwd"

Not true.
You have to really know what a Christian is , before you can properly understand this magnitude of definitions.

Even Hitler referred to himself as a "Christian" doing God a favor by cleaning up things. Now do you go along with this?. Do you really think "Christians" are like this.?

Again, I am talking about relilgion. I am not "selling" something, I don't want you to join my "church", give me money, or me even tell you "hey, you are wrong, and I am right". First of all I did'nt invent what the Bible says. I did'nt write it !!!.

If my Bible did'nt "work" and help people, including myself, then I WOULD THROW IT AWAY. !! I don't have time for nonsense !!.
But it works.

If you want an opposite contrast read the Quaran.
See how those words can help people in a depression/suicidal state.

I hate religion ( I will say it again)
Religion was started by man , not God.

Think what you will. If you don't want to call me a Christian, then fine. Call be a "believer" or a "teller" or whatever, but don't lump me into the category that has, in history indicated , pervert priests who point the finger at you, and tell you , that you are going to hell because you don't go to church. That is baloney. And I am not talking about all priests either.

And not just priests. Remember Jim Jones and the followers he had ? Well that was a RELIGION. Would you call him a Christian.?

I think not.

[Wendy me]

Well said, Sharon and Wendy.

There is no sense in fighting something that's bigger and stronger than you - ever try to "fight" the flu?

My big mistake was to get cocky during remission and think that I had "beaten" depression. You never do. As with addiction, you can just strive for "recovery".

Available medical treatments are still half-a**ed but better than nothing.

If God wanted to heal me I'm sure that He would, but I guess my condition is part of some overall plan. I think it has to do with Karma - and genetics.

Love

i aggree with you at beast i need a little work (helpe) i know this so i can't fix myslefe dame near crashed and burned just a short while ago every now and again it slaps in the face just have to keep running that game till you get it right what works works thats it just make shure you can hear her telling you to help we tend not to listen to our own thoughts

[Marlene4a]

Wrather I crossdress or not, makes no difference to the god I serve.

People are another thing.
I am not a people pleaser in front of the god I serve. He looks into the heart, and the motives. Not the clothes you wear.

As for going to Church dressed ? It would not make any difference to God, but he said be sensitive to the feelings of others. Some would understand, and some would not, because we are all different, even though we serve the same god.
So, I respect the feelings of those that would not understand, and therefore keep it to myself.

That is why I am on this forum. People here understand my crossdressing wrather they be Christian or not.

If we look at people the way the God I know does, we get a whole new perspective on people, and see what "good" we can do for them, not what "hurt"

I am not angry with anyone, the way they think, talk, smile or don't smile. (See previous paragraph)

Like I said, I am a "teller", and can only tell what I see.

I am NEVER depressed, I always feel great, and always look on the positive side, and love people in general. Try to help them if they are having difficulty with anything. That could mean being there to pull them and their car out of a ditch, buy someone dinner If I felt they have not eaten in a while, be there for my neighbor if their battery is dead and cannot start their car, etc.

That is the complete OPPOSITE!! of how I used to live before I met Christ.

As a matter of fact, I would drink to the excess. If you looked at me crosseyed, I would smak you across the room.
I would sometimes "punch " people for no reason. I was heavier then, about 270, young and cocky. Had a full beard, and hair everywhere. All exterior. This was about the 2nd year in college.
Oh I was good schoolastically, but had no patience with anyone. And yes, I was mostly DEPRESSED !!, I know what Kew means about the "blackness" and a feeling of being in a "hole" in the dark.

I wanted to be "macho" on the exterior, because I knew I wanted to "dress" but could not come to grips with it. ( Many Many years ago now)

No-one would mess with me, and I had few friends. I did not like myself either as a matter of fact.

What I am getting at, is "what changed me"? or who?

It was impossible for me to turn over a new leaf.

I know what it was'nt. And that was RELIGION. ( I hate that word)

[Marlene4a]

Hi Allison:

As I was going through the thread again, I noticed that you and I agree on one major thought.
That is, we both hate religion, and hate the things that some people do under that quise.
And, that is a good thing.

(By the way, I like that red dress in your Avatar. You look great in it)

Me

[Jerry]

Hi, Carol.

I'm right there with the other gals, and their advise is superb. Often times I get "depressed" when I procrastinate. If there is something I need to do or don't want to do it builds and builds and builds. The longer I go, the harder it is to get started. The cycle down is awful. Sometimes it's because I want to do something so perfect I can't get myself around the project to get started.

And the only thing that makes it better, is to start.

Accept that not everything will be perfect. Progress lifts the burdens remarkably.

Hang in there.
Hog Hugs.
Jerry

[Sweet Susan]

Wow! That was some discourse!

[Marlene4a]

Hi Susan:

Good to see you again !!!
I have missed your posts and excellent threads lately.

Me

[KewTnCurvy GG]

Whether you believe it is a 'crutch' is entirely subjective. They both are a crutch.

So, Wen dear, does this mean someone who takes high blood pressure medicine has a crutch? Or that someone who's schizophrenic and takes antipsychotic medications to diminish their mental demons has a crutch too? And you feel religion is a crutch? So this implies, this crutch metaphor of yours, that something is broken inside the person they need to fix and that they are relying on an artificial means of fixing it--correct?

Please clarify.

hugs
kew

[KewTnCurvy GG]

I respect your posture on this.
I am not going to make this a long rebuttal.

However, I am telling you what worked for me. Period.
I know every time I bring up my faith it raises "hackels" and I knew that going in.

Marlene I respect and would defend your right to believe as you do. I am trying to point out that your message of jesus may fall on deaf ears. For if it were me asking for help and reaching out I would be turned off. You would fail to reach me. So, I suppose the point I'm trying to make is IS YOUR MESSAGE REALLY FOR THE ONE WHO IS ASKING FOR THE HELP OR DOES IT SERVE SOME INTERNAL NEED FOR YOU? I think the latter and this is my point in raising an eyebrow and questioning what you say. Do you not care about those who do not believe as you do and therefore don't care if your message reaches them or not? This is an honest not sarcastic question. And, Wen, I do not preach medication or therapy. I believe that is a very personal decision. There is nothing wrong with therapy though. And one of the hardest lessons we all have to accept in life is that we are interdependent and that there are times we must humble ourselves and lean on the other. That's my message. Simple as that, believe it or not.

hugs
kew

[Sharon]

Marlene I respect and would defend your right to believe as you do. I am trying to point out that your message of jesus may fall on deaf ears. For if it were me asking for help and reaching out I would be turned off. You would fail to reach me. So, I suppose the point I'm trying to make is IS YOUR MESSAGE REALLY FOR THE ONE WHO IS ASKING FOR THE HELP OR DOES IT SERVE SOME INTERNAL NEED FOR YOU? I think the latter and this is my point in raising an eyebrow and questioning what you say. Do you not care about those who do not believe as you do and therefore don't care if your message reaches them or not? This is an honest not sarcastic question. And, Wen, I do not preach medication or therapy. I believe that is a very personal decision. There is nothing wrong with therapy though. And one of the hardest lessons we all have to accept in life is that we are interdependent and that there are times we must humble ourselves and lean on the other. That's my message. Simple as that, believe it or not.

hugs
kew

I'm not someone who follows any one "brand" of religion Kew, but I try to be respectful of those who do, especially those who appear to have nothing to gain from stating their beliefs. Religion is a legitimate alternative for many, and who am I to discount it? Isn't it a form of therapy after all?
Medication may indeed be the best cure for someone, but I would leave it as a last resort after non-drug therapies have been first explored.

[Julie]

How are things going Carol, get back on and let us know how you are.

JJ

[Wen4cd]

So, Wen dear, does this mean someone who takes high blood pressure medicine has a crutch? Or that someone who's schizophrenic and takes antipsychotic medications to diminish their mental demons has a crutch too? And you feel religion is a crutch? So this implies, this crutch metaphor of yours, that something is broken inside the person they need to fix and that they are relying on an artificial means of fixing it--correct?

Please clarify.

hugs
kew

The crutch 'metaphor' wasn't mine. You sha'nt trap me with bad analogies. I gave up debating this dookie last week.

The spirit of reason came to me and said: "Wen, if people want to do that kind of icky stuff to themselves, what do you care?"

And I said: "I guess I don't."

[MissBosie]

hi all, my name is Carolbitv and i am fighting a bout of depression. Would like to know how one overcomes this. Just frustrated with my lonelyness and my desire to dress and have no one to share with. Thank you Carol


Carol, come into the CD chatroom. It's not a cure for depression, but you will find company and people willing to listen to you.

Hope you feel better soon honey, *hug*.

[Rachel Ann]

Medication may indeed be the best cure for someone, but I would leave it as a last resort after non-drug therapies have been first explored.
The reality of the HMO/PPO-based health care system in the USA is that few forms of therapy without drug therapy are covered.

[Julie]

The reality of the HMO/PPO-based health care system in the USA is that few forms of therapy without drug therapy are covered.

For the past couple of days over here the Government are telling the medics they are prescribing too many tranquilisers to treat depression, they are suggesting councilling as a first option. Quite clearly the only reason they are suggesting this is because they feel it is costing too much giving out the tranquilisers.

JJ

[Alayna]

I remain....a Christian, saved by grace through Jesus Christ paying the price for me, and it was He, who took away my depression.
This might just be me, but maybe one of the reasons Christians as a whole are disliked by some is the language they use. When I talk to some (not all) Christians, they tend to use this mysterious, scriptural language that kind of throws me off balance. It sounds a little too preachy to me, and that's not a good thing for a faith that is well-known for its aggressive recruitment tactics.

I don't have a problem with Christians, or even the organized religion "Christianity". Some people prefer to leave their spiritual lives in the hands of another, and some of those people like an organized, formatted system and routine to go with it. The only problem with it is that it's the ultimate double-edged sword.

One of the biggest problems is that it's (organized religion - not just Christianity) easily abused by those with the power. Religion can mobilize the masses for false causes and wars in the name of g(G)od. It can also be abused by molestors and embezzelers who have a huge amount of trust placed in them.
My biggest gripe with organized religion is that it allows people to absolve themselves of any personal responsibility. For example, the minimum criteria for a Christian to get into heaven is to believe that Jesus Christ is their personal saviour. They can be an axe-murderer but they can convert and ascend to heaven just by faith. Or they can live miserable, unfulfilling lives and be FINE with it - because they know they will go to heaven....And what is heaven anyways? Eternal reward - as opposed to Hell, which is eternal damnation. I know nothing in life that is this black and white.

I'm not saying all Christians are like this, but anyone can fall into this trap because it's inherent in the system. Religion is a VERY dangerous thing, and there are far too many people who aren't able to handle such a thing responsibly.

I agree with you Marlene, in that one's personal relationship with their spirituality is really the important thing. But by telling people about your relationship with Jesus-Christ-the-saviour-my-lord-in-heaven, you're making a loaded statement. When I'm telling people about my belief in Karma and spiritual energy I'm also making a loaded statement.;) We all have reactions to certain buzzwords like Jesus (religious nut) and Karma (dirty hippie). We just have to remember when and what they are.

*steps off soapbox*

[Marlene4a]

All I am telling the one that posted the thread is what worked for me to remove depression.
Not pills, chemicals, therapy, or anything like that.
Only my faith in Jesus worked for me, and how he has removed my sins, and wrote my name in the book of life.

If you don't believe this, that is fine with me.
I am not forcing you, or anyone else to believe what I believe.

So, why are you getting so upset with me?
I think it is un-called for.

Should I get upset with you for what you believe in, that eliminates depression ??

Whatever you believe is fine.

I think you should re-read my thread before you answer my thoughts, and really know what a Christian really is, before you start throwing stones !!

[Marlene4a]

Let me tell you all something further about this "crutch" I need, that you speak of.
Jesus is not my "crutch". HE IS MY WHOLE STRETCHER !!!.

Did'nt you GET this from what I said.?

I am not trying to reach anyone KEW !.
I am simply telling those that need to be rescued from this "black hole" as you call it, I call it "spiritual oppression" from an outside world. , that there is hope other than filling your body with dangerous chemicals, that might cause the problem to be worse. " My God, you can't all be that ignorant of what the bible says."

Re-read all my previous posts.
I am not trying to sell you anything, but trying to tell you what has worked form me. And there is help available if you allow it to happen.

Look....Maybe you can understand this.

If you were my neighbor, and I saw the back of your house on fire, and did not run next door to tell you about it, and later after your house burned down, and you KNEW, I saw your house on fire, and did not say anything that could have saved your house, if you would have known earlier, what would you think of me ?? As a good neighbor??
You would probably grab me by the throat and say, WHY DID'NT YOU TELL ME ??? I COULD HAVE SAVED MY HOUSE !!!

If you want to stuff pills down your throat, go ahead.

But, I can say the same to you, " quit trying to give ME!! your philosophy, on pills, and therapy" that is "your trip" not mine.

You want to pick a fight with me...come on !! I have more ammo. I will just "stand there".

No, I did not lose my senses. I came to them.

[Marlene4a]

This is for you personally Kew:

If I did not care about anybody, I would keep silent. Just like you.

Did Jesus die on the cross for no reason ? Did he keep silent? Why did he do what he did? Who was he anyway? Did he offend people ?? Oh yes.

All I know is what he did for me, and I cannot help sharing what he has done for me, and I am no one special. He will do the same for others if they ask him.

The one asking for help reagarding depression, is like someone I see on my way sinking in quicksand.
What kind of person would I be, If I did'nt offer them a "stick" to pull them out of the mire ??

More than most, or all, you understand what I am saying. I know you do.

This is not a hostile post. But one of love.

I can see something coming that others cannot.

[Marlene4a]

I forgot to mention Kew. I have no internal needs.
I don't need to spout off to make myself feel good.

If you don't like the way I come across, then so be it.

[KewTnCurvy GG]

The crutch 'metaphor' wasn't mine. You sha'nt trap me with bad analogies. I gave up debating this dookie last week.

The spirit of reason came to me and said: "Wen, if people want to do that kind of icky stuff to themselves, what do you care?"

And I said: "I guess I don't."

Granted you didn't invent it but you used it to express and clarify what you meant. I just wanted to find out if you felt it was applicable to other situations as well. Are ppl who take high blood pressure medication using a crutch? Or diabetics by taking insulin? And I wanted to find out what you meant by crutch? Do you view it as a weakness, the use of a crutch? Or as something needed, necessary to help one through a situation? Just asking for clarification here to better understand.

hugs
kew

[KewTnCurvy GG]

I am not trying to reach anyone KEW !

What kind of person would I be, If I did'nt offer them a "stick" to pull them out of the mire ??

Not trying to 'reach' but then extending a stick to help pull someone out of the mire, sounds like reaching to me.

And Marlene, don't get me wrong, I think you're a good person with a good heart. I think I've said this quite clearly. However, I only ask. Should your message turn someone off, fail to reach them; do you care? Does it matter to you if the 'stick' you extend is not broken, weak or 'inadequate' in some way? Because if it were me who was depressed and asking for help THIS IS THE WAY I WOULD EXPERIENCE your extending a 'stick' to help pull me out of the mire. So, this being the case; would you care if you failed to reach me? That was my question to you.

hugs
kew

[Wendy me]

hi all, my name is Carolbitv and i am fighting a bout of depression. Would like to know how one overcomes this. Just frustrated with my lonelyness and my desire to dress and have no one to share with. Thank you Carol

hi all this is realy going hold on for a quick sec. ...........Carol......???anyone rember carol?????????so carol dear did you get your question answerd?????????are you sorrry you asked???????

dear sister carol i hope this is helping you out as many are trying to do but if it dosen't help rember that god ,druggs ,shrinks or what ever works is most importan that you get to the place were you need to be.......were ever that may be it is diffrent for us all and we can be shure as diffrent of a place it for each of us their is no one map to get their

huggs to you girl and a safe trip i hope you arive safely

[Vickie-CD]

carolbitv, I wish I had an answere for you. I have been on antidepressents for years. Some days are better than others. I can promise you that you have a friend in me . I have been fighting clinical depression for years and dressing longer than that. I have an idea what you are going thru. Hang in there and do not give up.
Wishing you the very Best,
Vickie

[Rachel Ann]

Remember, all, that this time of year is a big hazard for acute depression, especially in the Northern Hemisphere.

May everyone have a safe, happy, *realistic* holiday season.

Love

[Marlene4a]

Not trying to 'reach' but then extending a stick to help pull someone out of the mire, sounds like reaching to me.

And Marlene, don't get me wrong, I think you're a good person with a good heart. I think I've said this quite clearly. However, I only ask. Should your message turn someone off, fail to reach them; do you care? Does it matter to you if the 'stick' you extend is not broken, weak or 'inadequate' in some way? Because if it were me who was depressed and asking for help THIS IS THE WAY I WOULD EXPERIENCE your extending a 'stick' to help pull me out of the mire. So, this being the case; would you care if you failed to reach me? That was my question to you.

MY ANSWER TO THE ABOVE:

You missed my point entirely. You have only skimmed over my entire posts and I believe, only saw what you wanted to, and blocked out the real "meat" of my discussion.
Sometimes this message I take to the world, turns people off. Some embrace it quickly, and apply God's word (not mine, I have no words, or any ideas of my own) to their lives. And they live changed lives !!.
This is all given out of love.
As I mentioned earlier, I am only a "teller". I can only tell what I see.

Why do I extend a stick ? TO SAVE THEIR LIFE!!
What if the stick is weak or broken ? I THROW IT AWAY IMMEDIATELY AND GET A STRONGER ONE BEFORE THEY DIE!!!.

You miss my point entirely. Please re-read my posts if you want to, and you can find the answers to your questions here.

In the meantime, I rest my case. I am DONE talkin.

I just want to wish everyone, a very Merry Christmas this year, and a Happy New Year!! ( Can you imagine 2005? wow!)
When I was a kid, I thought we would all be walking around in silver type space suits by now, and driving bubble cars.
( I guess they do in some places of the world I guess.)

Love (AND I MEAN THAT TOO!!)

[KewTnCurvy GG]

Not trying to 'reach' but then extending a stick to help pull someone out of the mire, sounds like reaching to me.

And Marlene, don't get me wrong, I think you're a good person with a good heart. I think I've said this quite clearly. However, I only ask. Should your message turn someone off, fail to reach them; do you care? Does it matter to you if the 'stick' you extend is not broken, weak or 'inadequate' in some way? Because if it were me who was depressed and asking for help THIS IS THE WAY I WOULD EXPERIENCE your extending a 'stick' to help pull me out of the mire. So, this being the case; would you care if you failed to reach me? That was my question to you.

MY ANSWER TO THE ABOVE:

You missed my point entirely. You have only skimmed over my entire posts and I believe, only saw what you wanted to, and blocked out the real "meat" of my discussion.
Sometimes this message I take to the world, turns people off. Some embrace it quickly, and apply God's word (not mine, I have no words, or any ideas of my own) to their lives. And they live changed lives !!.
This is all given out of love.
As I mentioned earlier, I am only a "teller". I can only tell what I see.

Why do I extend a stick ? TO SAVE THEIR LIFE!!
What if the stick is weak or broken ? I THROW IT AWAY IMMEDIATELY AND GET A STRONGER ONE BEFORE THEY DIE!!!.

You miss my point entirely. Please re-read my posts if you want to, and you can find the answers to your questions here.

In the meantime, I rest my case. I am DONE talkin.

I just want to wish everyone, a very Merry Christmas this year, and a Happy New Year!! ( Can you imagine 2005? wow!)
When I was a kid, I thought we would all be walking around in silver type space suits by now, and driving bubble cars.
( I guess they do in some places of the world I guess.)

Love (AND I MEAN THAT TOO!!)


Will happily reread; however, I did read what you wrote. Some ppl give up so easily. Interesting. I will reread and see if I missed anything. I get it though. God saved your life and you want to share this and you want to share that "he" can do the same for them. And you feel if they reach out to God they will find peace too. Right?

hugs
kew

[Marlene4a]

That is exactly right Kew.
But the right God.

The word is given out of love, not hate !
No inner needs on my part. I just love people in general.

It was the complete opposite for me at one time.

But yes, you are entirely correct on this one.

[Marlene4a]

I don't give up easy. I just said, all there is needed to be said, for someone to make a decision for God.
Jesus is holding out the stick.
I was the one sinking in the mire at one time.

I had to grab on to the stick, in order for him to pull me out.
That simple.

Me

[KewTnCurvy GG]

Yea, I heard you from the beginning but you're not getting what I'm saying and it sounds like you don't care. I love challenges. I like to think. What can I say. That's me.

hugs
kew

[Marlene4a]

Kew:

Of course I care.
I would be a fool if I did not care.
Please don't get me wrong. I am a listener too.

If I missed what YOU were saying like I accused you of missing what I was saying, I truely apologize.

You posted some good infomation here, and I think you are a very intelligent lady.
In my business I fight challenges all day, every day.

But when It comes to God's word, I can only give it out like it is.

Then it is time to shut up, unless someone has questions regarding His word.
I am never to busy for that !

And you are correct. Jesus has given me peace beyond all understanding, I am never depressed, and consider myself a servant, not a master.

I met Christ 42 years ago. I have never been the same since.

[KewTnCurvy GG]

Kew:

Of course I care.
I would be a fool if I did not care.
Please don't get me wrong. I am a listener too.

If I missed what YOU were saying like I accused you of missing what I was saying, I truely apologize.

You posted some good infomation here, and I think you are a very intelligent lady.
In my business I fight challenges all day, every day.

But when It comes to God's word, I can only give it out like it is.

Then it is time to shut up, unless someone has questions regarding His word.
I am never to busy for that !

And you are correct. Jesus has given me peace beyond all understanding, I am never depressed, and consider myself a servant, not a master.

I met Christ 42 years ago. I have never been the same since.

Well, I met "him" and ditched him and I've been all the better since:D
I know that will probably offend your Christian sensibilities but it's true. Again, I get what you were saying. I heard it. And I would defend your right to believe as you do, though it is not of my beliefs. Truly I would! However, my point was if I were Carol the one who started the thread and your message didn't speak to me and turned me off. Would you care? Would you feel like, "hmmm, maybe I should have just kept my message generic and not said anything about God or Christ?" "Maybe she would have heard me then." Like me. If it were me that said I was depressed and you offered your message. I would have been turned off and felt like you didn't hear me or care. That's exactly how I would have felt. I would think, "she's not got a clue what I'm going through." And if this were in real life and not on a cyber board. You would have become the last person I would go to for help. This has happened in my life SOOOOO many times with the Christians. Have same situation with a 'friend' (I use the term loosely here). She's quite conservative and I don't fit her lil' mold of whatever it is I should be and she's become quite the non-friend. I don't think I'd go to her right now for anything. In fact, I'm moving and normally I would have asked her for help etc. But not this time. Uh huh! Forget it! She also has made little effort to spend ANY time with me knowing I'm moving away to another country and she may not see me at all. Well the story is actually longer and more complicated than this. But what I'm saying, is the more Christians I get to know, the more I don't like them, their religion or beliefs. Most seem to me to be such walking contradictions of the crap that comes out of there mouth I don't know how they sleep at night. This has and is my experience.

hugs
kew

[Marlene4a]

What I just read from you, indicates that you are missing the point of being "saved by grace"

Let me explain: I have been telling others about Christ for over 40 years.
Some will reject. Some will accept.

They don't reject me, when they do, they reject Christ !!
I cannot help anyone. I am pointing to the one that CAN help them. That is all my job entails.

Call it crap if you want, you cannot hurt my feelings. You are not rejecting me Kew. Please understand that.
The problem with most people is, that they get their eyes on "people" who profess they are Christians, and they may very well be.
And they see them be "human" or fall, and think that everyone who professes to be a Christian must be perfect, like GAWWWD, and a white angel with an aura around them, and a halo on their head.
And when they see the human fall, they say hmmmfff!! well...!!! if that is a Christian, then I don't want none of that crap !!! hmmmfff.

Again, you missed it......When I heard someone was depressed, I remembered when I was depressed, and I know the one who helped me. I was pointing to that one that helped me, and said , hey !! he will get you out of your depression, like he got me out of my depression???

And where do you come off, " I don't care"? stuff, I call that CRAP !! because I do care if someone rejects Christ or not, because I KNOW the consequences they will face some day.

Again, and for the last time, you believe what you want to believe, that is your choice, but don't say I did not tell you, what I thought and believe, and is the truth. I am not "hoodwinked" by this world's "fix it" ways with people, and shadowing and scurrying in darkness. I don't need that CRAP!!

You have fixed and sealed your mind against anyone that represents "the light"..

[KewTnCurvy GG]

It seems you and I will not be able to communicate effectively on this subject. I hear you loud and clear. Christ speaks to you. Christ is your guiding light. Christ helped you through dark times in your life. I have not rejected YOU. Did not say that anywhere and I challenge you to find where I did. You say: You have fixed and sealed your mind against anyone that represents "the light". Wrong! Didn't say that at all. You may be surprised to learn that even some of my best friends are Christians.:D You may even be more surprised to learn that when I was in the hospital for depression one of the first ppl I asked to see was the hospital chaplain. Not because of Christ or any message they could give me. But because I have found them to be a rare and unique type of human being: kind, caring, dedicated, willing to help and reach ppl with whatever it takes and non-judgemental. Yes, most Christians turn me off. But I have worked with Hospital Chaplains as a patient myself and as a professional in the hospital as their colleague. They are truly special ppl.

You also said:
They don't reject me, when they do, they reject Christ !! I found this interesting and disturbing if this is how you really feel. I don't think that rejecting you is tatamount to rejecting Christ. Seriously, how can it be. I was a Christian, now I'm agnostic. If someone does not hear the message I'm trying to send; I need find another way to send it. Not say, fine, they're really rejecting my message (i.e., Christ) and oh well their loss. YOU can help others. Christ, if I understand correctly, works through you. You're not the post-messenger just leaving a package at the door. But a conduit, conveying through you heart the message of love. Right? I'm far less clueless than you give me credit for. I have friends and colleagues of all walks of professions: teachers, nurses, ministers, social workers, occupational therapists, doctors, etc. When I speak what I've spoken here amongst those crowds, they seem to get what I'm saying.

Do help me understand what you meant by: I am not "hoodwinked" by this world's "fix it" ways with people, and shadowing and scurrying in darkness. I don't need that CRAP!! I don't want to take your words at face value. I want to understand what you meant here.

And btw, crap appears once in what I said: "Most seem to me to be such walking contradictions of the crap that comes out of there mouth I don't know how they sleep at night." Unlike your posty which has 'crap' in it a four times. The reason I said 'crap' is b/c it seems that what they say contradicts what they do. And I mean in serious and disturbing ways. I walk what I talk! Very VERY much so. Ppl who know me well know this and know they can count on me when the going gets tough. I am above all things LOYAL, tenaciously loyal; if I'm in your corner I will fight til the bloody end if that is what it takes. I opperate from a core set of values. Ppl who know me, know that they can count on me to stand behind these values. What comes out of my mouth jives with the actions I do. I don't talk out of both sides of my mouth (nor am I implying you are).

Open you mind, ears and heart, just a little bit more. Your message you so want to share with others may find itself on less deaf ears if you did. (And I realize there is already many for whom your message reaches; I'm trying to get you to think about the ones it doesn't reach).

hugs
kew

[Tamara Croft]

hi all, my name is Carolbitv and i am fighting a bout of depression. Would like to know how one overcomes this. Just frustrated with my lonelyness and my desire to dress and have no one to share with. Thank you Carol

<RANT>
GIRLZ!!!!!!! See this quote.... its about carolbitv needing advice on depression... and so far all I see is ranting about Christianity... You think she is sitting there thanking you for your rantings?? Or sitting there thinking .....wtf are they on??? I know what I would be thinking... It's coming up to Christmas... it's a hard time for everyone... So can we just stop the ranting and try to give her some good advice eh???
</RANT>

Carol I know how you feel about being depressed, but my depression is for a totally different reason. I'm finding it hard to cope with splitting up with my partner. Even though we got back together after a few months, I'm finding it very hard us living apart. Most nights I can't sleep or I end up crying myself to sleep. My doctor wanted to put me on antidepressants, but I refused them as I don't want them. The only way I find that helps me is talking to my friends online that I have known for a long time. Everyone deals with it and copes with it in their own way and hopefully you will find something that helps you.

Tamara x

P.S. If I have offended anyone by being so blunt... then I do apologise :)

[KewTnCurvy GG]

Way ahead of ya, sent her a pm. Let her know that I am here and that there are grrlies that care about her here too. :D

hugs
kew

[Rachel Ann]

You beat me to it, Tamara. Yes, this is about carolbitv needing help and support with her depression. In fact, Kew, I think I will PM her too.

I don't really have anything to add to my post #37 except, Carol, please do see someone about this and get a proper diagnosis and treatment, sooner rather than later. You can't "fight" depession but there are other things that can be done about it. (You too, Tamara!)

Many if not most Christian priests and ministers recognize the validity of psychotherapy and drug treatments, and are not loath to recommending same to troubled parishioners who seem to need more than counseling and prayer. This is no different than urging someone with an obvious physical problem to see the doctor.

In fact, in these days, when many clergy have to take second jobs because their congregations can't support them, quite a few are psychotherapists.

Love

[Rachel Ann]

Let us *all* be mindful that this is the time of year when more people become depressed or have crises in their lives and relationshiops than any other.

This is even more true for those of us who live in the Northern Hemisphere. The cold and dark of winter aggravates depression. Unrealistic expectations of the holiday season are said to have something to do with it, although I am sure that it is more complicated than that.

So let's all try to have a nice, pleasant, and *realistic* holiday!

OK I'll shut up now. Honest.

Love

[KewTnCurvy GG]

Let us *all* be mindful that this is the time of year when more people become depressed or have crises in their lives and relationshiops than any other.

This is even more true for those of us who live in the Northern Hemisphere. The cold and dark of winter aggravates depression. Unrealistic expectations of the holiday season are said to have something to do with it, although I am sure that it is more complicated than that.

So let's all try to have a nice, pleasant, and *realistic* holiday!

OK I'll shut up now. Honest.

Love

But it is not the time of year of higher suicides. That's a myth. Stats show that that time is around April--though no one really knows why. The holidays are stressful I agree. I'm soooo not in holiday mode though with my move and all--that's like all I'm focused on. Carol, grrl, you know I'm here for ya. :D

hugs
kew

[Rachel Ann]

I didn't say suicides, Kew, I said incidents of depression and other emotional difficulties.

[KewTnCurvy GG]

I didn't say suicides, Kew, I said incidents of depression and other emotional difficulties.

I know; however a lot of folks also think this is the time of year of higher suicide rates. Not so. Just stating a fact. I know you didn't say that.

hugs
kew

[Marlene4a]

I agree, let us all focus on Carols question in the first place.
Excellent thought.

Yes, some will accept my message ( I mean any born again Christian's ministry) and embrace it.
Others will reject. That bothers me. Because what that means to them is that Christ died for nothing. What can I do about it ? Nothing. The more you try to get them to understand, the more you push them away. Yes I care that they reject, and so does the Lord. Even He cannot make them accept. I can (Any Christian) only give them His Gospel. His word.
We all have free will. It is up to them to make a choice and accept or reject. When I say rejecting me is rejecting Christ, I mean rejecting his word, not mine.
The ones that accept it, have peace and freedom.
Cetainly not from me, but from God. Why?
Because they are God's words. And again, not mine.

In one of my earlier posts, I said, after this thread is over, Carole will read all of this advice we all gave her, and choose for herself what is best for her.

"My" words only bring more confusion. His words bring healing.

Love

[Alayna]

So, why are you getting so upset with me?
I think it is un-called for.

Should I get upset with you for what you believe in, that eliminates depression ??

Whatever you believe is fine.

I think you should re-read my thread before you answer my thoughts, and really know what a Christian really is, before you start throwing stones !!
Um, I think you misread my thoughts:confused:. Sorry, didn't mean to offend. I was trying to add to the conversation - Though I apologize to Carol for helping to steer this topic elsewhere...I'll say what I have to and then try to focus on depression posts.

Marlene,
I also feel that whatever you believe is fine. I understand that you personally feel the same way. However, your religion by its very nature contradicts that (non-Christians go to hell and therefore must be saved). Many Christians I've met- friends and total strangers - don't understand that their religion isn't the only way. I've heard contradictory things many times from different Christians: "You are free to your beliefs and I support them....but your soul needs to be saved". "I don't think homosexuality is wrong...but it is a sin". I seem to remember something about women needing to be subservient too. Of course this isn't every Christian, but there are plenty out there who beleve this kind of thing

Christians aren't bad or good, they just are - same as everyone. All beliefs preach the same messages, but go about them in different ways. Therefore we all have nuances about our beliefs that contradict others' beliefts. There are plenty of people who take themselves and there religions too seriously. The problem with Christianity is that those people say things that are very offensive to non-christians.

Once my sister was having a rough time and was not her usual cheery self. A friend of hers gave her a bible and said that she needed to be saved or she'd burn in hell. This so-called "friend" told her that faith is what she needed without considering that what she really needed was just someone to vent to. Whether or not one believes that faith is the answer to everyones' problems, if they offer that as the solution to every problem (especially when it's uncalled for) they won't be taken seriously.

This summer I was climbing a mountain near Mt. Evans and on the way down - high on life from just climbing a mountain - an older gentlemen crossed my path. We made the usual friendly conversation people make when they pass each other on a hike, but at the end he added "and Christ be thy lord". Now he may have had honerable intentions and was just spreading his (and His) love, but that's not how it's received by someone with other beliefs. To me he was saying "have a good hike...and by the way Christ is your lord whether you like it or not". I can't think of a more random and offensive thing to say at a time like that.

You believe that my soul will either be saved by Jesus, or damned and sent to hell. I believe there is no God, and that everyone takes their Karma (good and bad) back to the flow of spiritual energy that surrounds us everyday. We are both entitled to our beliefs but not to force them on others. We don't live in religion, we live in society. A group that doesn't represent 100% of society doesn't have the right to tell all of society what to believe.... Besides, although the methods vary the messages are all the same, so can't we all just get along?:)

You say that I shouldn't throw stones and that I don't know what a Christian is. Well, I was a Christian at one point - and I wasn't born with it. I looked at its message and decided for myself to become a Christian of my own free will. It turned out that it wasn't right for me, so I moved on to find something that could reflect and help develop my beliefs and convictions better. I wasn't throwing stones either - I was just trying to add in more philosophy and personal experience to help enrich the conversation. Unfortunately we can't convey emotion too well through the written word alone, and this kind or thing can happen especially with something as heated a topic as religion. So if I offended you I apologize.

And I apologize to you again Carol, I know this isn't what you expected when you asked your question:cool: There might be a silver lining for the original topic here though. when I'm depressed I feel muddled and confused...Sometimes if I get into an argument like our little tangent here, it helps re-pave the thought-process for my brain. It's as if my normal thoughts are on the road, and when I'm depressed I stray from the road. I have problems saying what I mean and how I feel (I think my A.D.D. has a lot to do with this too), but if I get involved in something I'm passionate about it becomes a guide to get me back on the road. It's not a cure - in fact it might not do anything at all, but just feeling like I'm getting somewhere can help a lot.

[Marlene4a]

I must be missing something here.
Did I FORCE my beliefs on you?

Are you not forcing your beliefs on me?
What is this?

You believe what you will.
I am not your judge. Whatever you believe that is right for you, then no one can tell you otherwise. So, ?

By the way, I don't have a religion.

I am done talking on this thread.

[Alayna]

*sigh*

I'm just trying to answer your argument and respond to your criticisms to me. Either I failed in that, or you insist on taking it personally. Either way I guess we can just agree to disagree.

Although I did unfairly lump you in with organzed Christians. I forgot you distinguished yourself from them earlier. my bad.

[Rachel Ann]

Can we pleeeeaaaaaase leave this thread to Carol's issues and those who want to argue religion start another thread - preferably in the lounge?

[Marlene4a]

Alayna:

That's ok. No problem.

I still enjoyed reading your post. Well written.

And please, you did not offend me at all.

Love