Accepting (or not) GGs

[JudeGG]

I read a lot of relies to intro's about, for example, " maybe you can get your wife on here (the forum) - that may help her with her acceptance".

I wonder if it ever occurs to people that some GGs/Wives don't have to accept. I agree being here can give varying perspectives on it but I don't believe it "helps" people to accept. If anything - I just beat myself up more because I can't accept like so many other GGs on forum. (and I have to say I take my hat off to them - utmost respect)

I believe wives/SO's know their boundaries of acceptance - and that maybe that they only accept the knowledge that it (CDing) happens.

I am a member here and another great forum and have met (online) wonderful people, but my level of acceptance is still the same - virtually non-existant.

I accept that my hubby CDs but I don't want to see it or be part of it and I can't get my head around the concept at all.

Don't yell at me - it is, after all, only my thoughts on the subject

Jude xx

[Kate Simmons]

You have to be true to yourself after all, Jude. I respect you for that and really am glad you are open and honest about it. The reasons men like us do this are various and sometimes complex. I, for one, don't expect everyone to understand and/or accept it. It usually ends up having nothing to do with our SO and is part of an expression of this part of ourselves. The important thing is that we control it and not vice versa, otherwise it becomes out of control in some cases. I know, I was there.It took a great deal of therapy and work for me to get back on the "ground". Take care, Ericka

[Julie York]

A lot of the time the GG involved has no understanding of the subject so is in a state of anxiety and fear about the whole thing. This forum doesn't help people to accept a situation once they know the facts, but it does help them to better understand what the subject is about and so help them to deal with it from an informed point of view.

It's the difference between an uninformed loathing and an informed loathing. One promotes anger..the other should command respect, sad though it may be.

[JudeGG]

A lot of the time the GG involved has no understanding of the subject so is in a state of anxiety and fear about the whole thing.

Agreed - but not easy considering the CDer doesn't always understand either.




This forum doesn't help people to accept a situation once they know the facts, but it does help them to better understand what the subject is about and so help them to deal with it from an informed point of view.

It's the difference between an uninformed loathing and an informed loathing. One promotes anger..the other should command respect, sad though it may be.

Again - agree so why is it that so many CDers mention this forum to other CDers as a way of getting their SOs to accept.
My point is the same I guess - it won't help acceptance - it will help understanding of the knowledge of the subject matter but that's all. Levels of acceptance won't change just by being here - that's a matter of time and communication...........and then there's no guarantee.

[Anita Mae GG]

Jude you are right. Cd'ers don't understand things from our point of view as we can't FULLY understand their point of view. We each know how limits and have to do what we can with our own comfort levels. I commend you for being so up front and honest :hugs:

[Marla S]

One important point is that GGs get the chance to realize that neither them nor her husbands aren't the only ones. That might not contribute to acceptance, but might be a bit of relieving for both.

Though I have no clue what is talked about in the GGs-forum, this is for sure a valuable source for a better understanding.

Saying this, I wouldn't have invited my ex-SO to a forum like this, because I have the feeling a lot of her resentments would have been approved, as she wouldn't have taken the time to read carefully.

Probably acceptance can't be achieved by visiting the forum, but it might lead to a better understanding.

IMO very important to understand is that CDing is no desease but a part of the identity. Denying or surpressing it might lead to a crippled identity, that might indeed work in the social accepted range but has to suffer.
Another thing that can be learned is to separate the non-acceptance due to the social pressure (same trap why CDs feel miserabel most of their life) from that part of the identity that is expressed by CDing.
I am not sure if a lot of GGs are willing to take that step, but shut down afore.

A completaly different question is if you find CDing attractive. This is in the eye of the beholder.

[Shelly Preston]

It's all about information and communication

Most CD's would think it was useful to have their wife / SO be here to enlighten them on the subject or at the very least be able to communicate
with other GG's who have probably had the same experience.

It only a suggestion that may prove useful.

I would only say that acceptance can mean different things to different people.

As long as a suitable compromise can be found for each couple.

[Julie York]

Again - agree so why is it that so many CDers mention this forum to other CDers as a way of getting their SOs to accept..

Because if you are Autistic you want people to reject you because they KNOW you are autistic, and have read about it, been informed on the subject but reject you because you are just a prick anyway or simply don't like autistic people.

Because, if you are colour blind you want people to know you can't see red from green and reject you, not because you go through red lights but because you leave the toilet seat up.

If my S.O. was repulsed by what I do I would hope that she did it as a matter of personal taste, rather than ill informed assumptions about the subject of crossdressing.

I don't think people genuinely think they will 'convert' their girlfriend or wife by asking them to read the forum...they just want a fair hearing. They want the repulsion and loathing and hate to be based on something solid.

If someone hasn't the chemistry or brainset or whatever to cope with a partner who crossdresses then that is fair and reasonable. I personally wouldn't like my partner to grow her hair legs and fart in bed. I might desperately try to understand. I might even fully appreciate her mind set. But I wouldn't like it. Therefore you have every right to 'not like it' too.

But the reason people want their SO to read the forum is stated above.

Conversion is maybe the an issue with some...but informed rejection is probably higher up the scale.

[Rickie]

If your doing the best you can with this situation. Then no one can ask more of you. Your husband is lucky in he knows your feelings. And you didn't go running out the door.

As far as wanting SO to come here. I think its hope that they can find we're not sick people.

[Julie Avery]

Well I'm just tickled to death that a GG named Jude has posted here and basically said, she thinks CD's stink.

It's an open forum.

[Kerry Owens]

All I am going to say is my source of information primarily is Lawren, and I trust Lawrens honesty. Acceptance, trust, and understanding are from those talks that we've had. I am glad Lawren has been patient with my questions.

[Tamara Croft]

I've grown to accept my partners cd'ing, but not just because I joined this forum, but because of the friends I've made along the way and the hours we spend chatting about different points of view etc. I think most would like their partners to join, not to help them become accepting, but more to find other GG's to talk to and make some friends, instead of feeling deeper inside the closet than their partner. That's how I felt for 5 years.

This forum may never help you become an accepting partner, but hopefully you will make a lot of friends.

[GG Vanya]

From a different perspective:

I AM the proverbial accepting SO. I'm sure you're all sick of hearing how I not only accept it, I absolutely revel in Trudi's duality.

However, IF I had come here as a confused, uninformed SO, and after reading how so many of the CD's here place so much priority on their femme time, to the detriment of their jobs and family, I'd most likely have run screaming for the hills.

Jude GG: I wonder if it ever occurs to people that some GGs/Wives don't have to accept

Jude, I was pondering this today. It is my belief, that in some religions this would be grounds for having a marriage annuled. (those in which the SO did not know until AFTER the "I Do's". The reason being, that the husband did not honestly represent himself prior to the marriage.

In spite of the fact that I was allowed informed consent prior to becoming emotionally involved with Trudi, I can so VERY well empathize with the SO's who get this thrown at them out of the blue. Then comes the pressure to accept. "If you really love me you'll accept this." From a woman's view point, it's not that simple.

I've thought at times, that many CD's encourage their wives to come to this forum for the explicit purpose of showing them the SO's here who do welcome this aspect of their husband's entity. If I felt that was the case in my relationship with Trudi, I'd feel it was emotional blackmail and balk like a Blue Nosed Missouri Mule!

Just as there are so many degrees of CDing, from those who don't CD at ALL, to those who CD 24/7, there are degrees of wives' acceptance, from no acceptance at ALL, to those who not only accept it, but encourage it.

Just as there is no right or wrong on the varied degrees of CDing, there is ALSO no right or wrong with the degrees of acceptance.

BTW, Julie Avery,I checked, and I fail to see where Jude said CDs stink. Sometimes attitudes stink though.

[Rachel Morley]

I've thought at times, that many CD's encourage their wives to come to this forum for the explicit purpose of showing them the SO's here who do welcome this aspect of their husband's entity.
I agree...it's probably 1) to help them try to better understand the subject matter (lets face it men are woefully bad at opening up) and 2) to show their wives (in an act of desperation) that there are some women in the world that accept it and even some that like it. :eek:


Just as there are so many degrees of CDing, from those who don't CD at ALL, to those who CD 24/7, there are degrees of wives' acceptance, from no acceptance at ALL, to those who not only accept it, but encourage it.
Again, you're on the money. We can't and shouldn't make our SOs feel bad about something that they might have no control over. Just as we have no control over our will to dress they might have no contol over their will to dislike.

I find it all rather sad. I know it depends on the CDer and also the state of the relationship, marrige or whatever, but can it (cding) be really all that bad? I know some people might be thinking it's alright for you, you're married to a woman who loves it, but I just wanted to say I just wish we could all get along. :(

Lastly here's a thread my wife started back in January on her thoughts about what makes accepting GGs different.
http://crossdressers.com/forums/showthread.php?t=21159

[GG Vanya]

Angel,

Even though I wasn't a member when that thread was created, I felt so much like those could have been MY posts.

A common thread, it seems, with those of us who are "happily accepting" is that we chose to educate ourselves IN DEPTH, on our own, not being pushed to do so by our SO's.

Another commonality seems to be that we're married to very caring men; men who have arrived at a very peaceful place with their duality, and have achieved that elusive 'balance' that makes our lives with them "level" and not a roller coaster.

I know that had I met Trudi when I was much younger, I would not have been as accepting. I'm the mold breaker when it comes to the trend of accepting SO's being raised in families that were out of the box thinkers. I am a pentacostal minister's daughter, and as such, was taught that ANYone in an alternative lifestyle was gonna bust hell wide open. I was always the "black sheep/rebel" in my family, and when I turned 18, I kicked the traces and jumped the fence on religion. I decided it was high time I began to think for MYSELF.

Time, age, and life experiences (a hell of a lot of hurt and pain) have facilitated my arrival at a place that is much more accepting of differences in people. I must say though, breaking that ingrained habit of being judgemental was difficult. The price I paid was high, but I can look back on it and say it was all worth it.

It has been said that the person we are is a sum of the things life has thrown us, and how we chose to deal with them.

I like the person I face in the mirror each morning. :D

[Cherry Lynn]

Vanya, I think your ststement about liking the person you face in the mirror each morning is what a lot of people do not get. In my opinion a lot of people do not like themselves because they try to live their lives in a way society accepts and therefore they are unhappy. Our lifestyle may not be mainstream but if it makes us happy we are way ahead of the game. I was raised in a Christian home and all my dads family are Pentecostal though my moms were Methodist. I am still a Christian, CD'ing one maybe, but one nonetheless. By the way it sounds like you and my wife have a lot in common from your previous posts so Trudi is a very lucky "girl". Have a happy 4th.

[JudeGG]

My point is - it won't help acceptance - it will help understanding of the knowledge of the subject matter but that's all. Levels of acceptance won't change just by being here - that's a matter of time and communication...........and then there's no guarantee.

Thanks for all the replies - an interesting thread from my point of view. I agree - being on forums help educate people, helps gain perspective from others, helps people see that people are just people at the end of the day.



Well I'm just tickled to death that a GG named Jude has posted here and basically said, she thinks CD's stink.

Julie - at no point did I say that or in fact do I think that.

If you're going to try and have a jibe about what I said - at least have it about something I did say rather than something I clearly didn't.

I have my own level of acceptance with my husband and do not think that either he or other CDers stink.

I have met lovely people on this forum and another one that I'm on - people who I accept as they are - and in fact, have met some of them.

[PinkDressLover]

I came out to my SO couple years ago, she doesn't accept..and wont accept..so we kinda decided to go separate ways.

I agree with Jude on some points and others..one thing I do not suggest it going and telling your SO to get online and come to this forum, it's a double edged sword, they might freak out even more. If your SO is truely accepting and not faking it like mine was, you can tell, I could. That's why all my stuff is here and not her place, and why I never had her come to the website either. I don't think it's any persons right to push things on people, especially not if you truely love them. I know people think that because the person loves them they have to accept them..not so. from my past experiences, both mine and of friends, telling people things like this is...delicate. It's as volatile as telling them you slept with another woman, or multiple women, or their sister depending on the person, or they might take to it like a fish to water. since we became just friends she even helped me pick out new shoes, and lingerie, something that while we were together she just couldn't handle.

[EricaCD]

Jude - as one of the CDs who strongly suggested that his wife join this forum, I have absolutely no problem whatsoever with your unwillingness to encourage your husband's crossdressing and your inability to fully get your head around it. You seem to think that by "acceptance", crossdressing spouses are really looking for encouragement/participation/enjoyment on your part. While that would of course be a very nice benefit, that is emphatically NOT what I consider acceptance.

It appears that you have done everything that we can legitimately ask of our SOs: you took a look, educated yourself and decided that this is simply something that does not work for you. That is fine!

Hopefully along the way you were able to learn some things that will make your life with a crossdresser easier: that your husband is not necessarily gay, that he is not necessarily transgendered, that his crossdressing is absolutely not about you and what you do/do not bring to his life, and so on. If so, and you have come to a point where you can go on in your life (even without ever participating or encouraging your husband's crossdressing), then this site has fulfilled its purpose.

Erica

Sorry - thoughts above are a bit jumbled. Shouldn't try to write before my 16th cup of coffee. Hopefully the basic idea came though.

[Lawren]

Hi, Jude

I applaud your honesty and strength.

I am very thankfull that Kerry accepts my CDing but I agree that expecting other people, (GGs, SOs, Family, etc.), is unreasonable. Telling people that they MUST accept CDing is like telling them they MUST eat their Brussel's sprouts. EWWWWWWWWW!!!!!!! I cannot advocate telling some one how to live their own lives. I hate it when people do that to me so what gives me the right to do it to them? It is, in essence, a violation of one's Freedom of Choice. Everyone is an indivdual and must be allowed to make their own choices.

[HaleyPink2000]

Jude:

Thanks for being honest with us all on here. I'm sure your a lovely person and your in the A+ category in my book. Your open, honest and say what you believe. That's cool. I'm the type that I want my Wife and people around me to be honest but not mean. Be wordy if you like on here, but watch out for the one's that want to read things into what you say. I've been there. I'm now trying to watch every word I put on here, so they can't be misconstrued.

My Wife also does not like it at all that I dress. But puts up with me. I’m glad She does. I'm retired and do most of the house work now that I can do. I dress most of the time. I'm not pretty like some on here but I feel pretty when I dress. Feel ugly when I'm not.

Jude, you keep saying what you feel on here please, and it will help us all.

HGz.:hugs:

[LanaLana]

Theres a lot of talk about religion and hell out there.
My idea of hell is being unable to express your self and live a lie.
which ultimatley causes mental and physical stress disease.

CD is a healthy creative form of expression which will eventually become accepted as a valid and normal alternative.

Women may feel threatened by men who express themselves in this manner
but it seriously has been encouraged by women urging men to communicate their feelings. Hope the feminine side of men doesn't scare the crap out of women. CDs must be careful not to upset those around them but should never stop what they want to do.

[BeckyZ]

Acceptance takes different paths throughout one's life for differenet movitvations. My wife and I married fairly young but looking back here is a short trail of one womans ability to accept:
-a struggling student who did nothing but study-accepted because we came together at this time and knew there was an end
- Naval officer who worked all the time and was gone the rest-accepted because it was a debt required to be paid
-young family with husband/father who was a workaholic-not very accepting but understood
-drunk-not accepting
-middle aged man heading to grumpy old man-not accepting
-middle aged cross dresser who strongly desires to let the feminine side come out-accepting because the previous disappeared

So what I have learned is that most people will respond if the incentives are correct. My wife would absolutely not accept Cding if it lead to sexual liasons outside the marriage. Fairly easy to understand. She does accept now because her life got better when the grumpy old man disappeared and her husband became happier. Life is an adventure and we should live it as such. She always knew I was an oddball but could never pin it down.

[Jean GG]

I too had hoped my husband would learn something from this forum!!! You see, he too needs education as to how far to go and the balance needed for both of us to possibly be happy!!!

So I showed him my threads/responses hoping he would then read similar ones and learn a bit more that would be of help to both of us. But, he chose to focus solely on the superficial ones, the ones that have to do mainly with heels and stocking.

Unfortunately I thought he did NOT need more encouragement in that area and was rather annoyed that he had not bothered to do a bit of both: entertainment and educational reading. Assuming that it's only GG's that need to be educated is obviously wrong. jean

[Dragster]

Jean, your husband does not know how lucky he is! If there was a magic pill I could give my wife to give her the same atitude to my CD activities as you have to your husband's, I'd pay a small fortune for it.
You are one of a small minority (just check out comments from many others here who have wives who probably will never come to terms with their husbands CDing) who seem to want to understand and come to an agreement where both partners are comfortable with the situation.
Tell him from me, it's time he wised up. He's got a gem of a wife, and it's time he treated you with the respect you deserve. Acceptance, when it comes at all, comes slowly. He's got to go at your speed if he wants you along for the ride. You sound like you'd be happy to move on from one level of CDing when you'd got used to it, in a continuous process until either one of you reached your limit. What more could he want? Sadly, he may only find out what Joni Mitchel sang in Big Yellow Taxi "You don't know what you've got till it's gone".
It's plainly not only GGs who need educating about this subject, I've learned a hell of a lot from this site in a little over a year, about how to treat my wife if I stand any chance of getting her to accept my CDing, and I'm still learning. And the most useful input has come from GGs themselves. Long may we encourage them to play a full part here. Sadly, it's not helped in my situation so far, my wife does not look like accepting any of it. Will I try to change her for another who is more accepting? Not a chance. I love her far too much for that. Even if I have to spend the rest of my life in the closet, which is where your hubby will be too, unles he starts to realise that if he wants your acceptance, he has to earn it by taking your feelings into consideration and not being so selfish. He'll destroy your relationship otherwise.
I wish you luck. It seems like you're going to need it if your marriage is going to survive.

Tony

[dancinginthedark]

Jude I take my hat off to you for your candor. However, I have to admit I am one of the ones who suggest that newbies encourage their S/O to come here some time and maybe consider joining the GG forum. I sometimes also include links to threads I think may be of help to both the CD and the GG involved when I do welcomes or posting in general. I am not seeking to convert the masses so much as lend a helping hand to someone who needs some guidance in talking with and/or understanding their S/O’s POV by reading threads like the one made by Marla GG on the Acceptance Pendulum. My hubby didn’t encourage me to join this forum though. I encouraged him to join. ~ I learned a lot from the ladies here and I am talking the CD-ing ones because it took me some time to get into the GG forum. I do credit them a lot in my coming to terms quicker with my hubby’s CD-ing. I look at acceptance as an on going thing since we all grow and evolve and yes, I believe being here has helped me. I can see where not every one would feel the same way I do. Don’t feel you have to compare yourself with anyone else here GG or otherwise Jude. In the end it doesn’t matter what all the ladies (GG/CD/TS/TV) here believe or how they live their own life. I don’t have all the same experiences or the same level of acceptance as everyone else does…no one does. We are all different like others have pointed out before me. But for me I needed and wanted the CD POV to help me better understand and come to terms by learning as much as I could. Plus, getting comfortable being around the ladies helped me too. In very short order they stopped being just “guys in dresses” and became my friends and ladies at heart. I found out that for some it really isn’t about just dressing they are TS and it isn’t a life style so much as their life. I found out that it really isn’t just the clothing for most like I thought at first. And I got to know them through their words, kindness and sense of humor just like you have. ~ I asked the same old questions many before me had asked and damn if they didn’t answer them all and more. Yes, it matters very much what my own CD thinks yet if talking with the ladies here helps me understand and know what questions to ask him myself then I say, "bravo ladies and thank you." I hope you can understand how being here made a tremendous difference for me. Later being in the GG forum helped me see I was not alone that others are out there and I have made some very good friends there. It's a safe place for me to vent or ask questions. The ladies in the GG forum are quick to support me when I have a legitimate gripe and quick to tell me when I have my head up my ass about something too. Some times it helps to have other POVs and to have others in the same or similar situations to turn to for advise too. God love em' all for being honest and loving and being there when I need a friend. :hugs:

[KrazyKat]

Jude, I'm so glad you have the trust to ask this question. :thumbsup:
I'm also very proud to be a part of such a wonderful forum that can support and help each other, no matter how the "community's" opinions differ. :happy:
That said, I can only add that personally, when I was "hungry" for info to help myself and my SO, this was one of the places we looked. It was not as friendly a support tool for GG's one year ago, and I felt that, as stated in above posts, for GG's who are totally scared of all that CDing might be, this is a good place to understand how to not be afraid of CD/TG. ACCEPTANCE? That is something partners have to "talk amongst theirselves", something that is impossible when fear has frozen your brain, as many of you know!
So, Jude, the fact that you posted this thread makes me smile!!:D I feel that many forum member's consistent and persistent efforts have paid off!! :love:

Kat

[CDsWifey GG]

When my fiance told me a few weeks ago he was dressing I had so many misconceptions about what that might mean for him, our relationship, our future. What did it say about him? I assumed so many things that are simply not true. I had no idea how he could be feeling the way he was feeling and didnt understand how he could be the same person and still have the same feelings about me that he always had. This forum HAS helped me to accept. When I dont understand something I automatically go to the net or to the library and find out all I can. That is exactly what I did this time and this forum is exactly what I was looking for to help me understand what exactly my new situation is what it could mean for me and my guy. It gave me an opportunity to share with others in the same situation and explore my own feelings with ppl who really understand. I got my guy to join too to help him better understand what is happening and how to cope with it on his side of things. I learn more everyday I am here, and everyday I feel closer to him and closer to understanding who he really is and who we really are together. I am so grateful there are places like this.

[sparks]

Yeah know what I bounce often between the areas of do I want my wife to accept or not. I find it a rather pickle of a situation. She is the only one I've ever shared this with openly. Others have discovered but I've never talked to them about it. My wife on the other hand I did tell and often wish I hadn't. It has reeked havoc on our relationship. OFten we will go for what seems forever without discussing it and our relationship begins to grow again and the rift begins to heel but as usual I will do something like shave some man hair and boom the rift opens up again. She will probably never accept which is fine with me usually. She doesn't have too! It's part of her like cding is part of me. Just something that we can't change.
Cding has always been a very secretive personal thing with me that there are times that even if my was totally accepting and supportive I wouldn't want to reveal it to her.
Hope it makes sense. Very difficult to put into words.

[KimberlyS]

JudeGG, Hi and I am proud of you for accepting your husband as a CDer. And I also think you have posted a very good point and I do agree with your prospective. And I think there are many CDers that expect too much acceptance out of their wife or girlfriend. To me there are two levels of acceptance, IMHO.

The first level of acceptance, which is what is sounds like you have, which is that the wife/gf accepts that being a CD is part of this person. I like to compare it to gals who really do not understand why guys get into some sport so much, as guys can really be obsessed about it. Do the gals like this? No, not usually. But they allow them to do it because it is who they are. It is part of the relationship. They let the guys do their little sport stuff when they need to and afterwards it is back to the normal relationship. To me if I only had this from my wife it would be great. There would be no hiding and lieing need, just tell her it is a CD thing. She may need to know a few things like time, date, schedule stuff, but she does not need to know more if she does not want to. I told my wife at one point that this is what I would like out of her for acceptance and that I would like more because I like her being part of what I do, but if she did not want to give more than that for acceptance that was ok with me.

The second level of acceptance is more of an optional thing IMHO. Because it is not needed if level one is achived and both are comfortable with it. This level is a wide range of acceptance ranging from knowing more about the CDing and/or partaking in some little way with the CDing, all the way to full acceptance of the CDer which includes things like partaking in the CDing, as in going out with their CDer; helping with clothes makeup and other things; encouraging their CDer like they would do with other parts of the relationship. And once again both partners must be comfortable or accepting with the point of this acceptance to make things work better. And often the point of acceptance at this level is constantly changing and challanging the relationship. This second level is where I think many of us CDers push too much for acceptance.

Jude you wrote:


I read a lot of relies to intro's about, for example, " maybe you can get your wife on here (the forum) - that may help her with her acceptance"

I know from my point of view when I say acceptance in this context, I say it to hopefully get her to level 1 acceptance. And I also know what it is to have a wife who has no one to talk with. IMHO, getting a wife/GF someone to talk with is very importain. As most of the information people know about only relates to the bad stuff out there about it, what is seen on the news, tv, radio, or papers. And a spouse ususally going and talking with someone that knows nothing about CDers only makes the situation worse.

Good Luck with finding an acceptance level/point that is agreeable by you and your husband.

KimberlyS - CD

[bgirl]

It would seem that you have a lot in common with a lot of CD's! Some of us have had a difficult time accepting this as well. Every time I've purged I said in effect I don't want to see any part of this stuff around here as well.
My wife does not want to see 'it' either. She doesn't understand the whole thing. Neither do I . It is beyond logic and explanation. I give up on trying to accept 'it'. I am trying my very best to accept myself. I am just a normal guy that has an illogical unexplainable desire to dress. I am just a normal guy that has an illogical unexplainable desire to dress. I am just a normal guy that has a desire to dress.