Beware The Backlash!

[Tamara Barclay]

I was out in our fabrication building at work today and heard people discussing John Karr and the Ramsey case.
Since it seems like he had "gender issues" I am afraid we are all going to get lumped in with the child molesters. At least that was the opinion I was hearing. I tried to add my two cents into the conversation that just because someone is gay or wants to be a girl or dress like one does not make them want to kill or have sex with children. But my silly opinion was overturned by the "common knowledge" that "fags, transvesties and transsexuals" molest kids all the time.
Just a thought

[Melanie R]

Yes, there will be a backlash. Society expects everyone to fit into two boxes. Since most of us go between the boxes many in society will see that we are a danger to society. All this proves is that we have a lot more educating to accomplosh before there is permanent change in societies opionions.

Hugs,

Melanie

[Melissa Jill]

Since when has cross dressing had anything to do with molesting children? I really wish people would think out their arguments.

[Talon DeRojo]

Tamara - Your post reminds me of Bev06GG's current post about a Dad whose wife divorced him after she caught him wearing women's panties. She's convinced that he's a pervert and a threat to their 12-year-old daughter. The court agreed and the girl can't visit her Dad and doesn't understand why. As a member of a racial minority group, I know all too well how people can associate all sorts of inaccurate notions with other groups of people, form a stereotype, and behave in a discriminatory manner.
Talon:sad:

[Kate Simmons]

Hmmm, Sometimes you wonder who the pervs really are. Ain't us for damn sure!! Ericka Kay

[vbcdgrl]

Someone said the real reason Karr was in Tailand was for GRS. Not good PR for the transgender community, that's for sure.

Vikki

[Sage GG]

I agree if it comes out that he really was there for the surgery the news media will make a big hairy deal out of it. It will not be a good thing for anyone who is transgendered. As soon as I saw the eye makeup I just knew what was coming next.

Any body think he didn't do it?

[GG Vanya]

At least two doctors have said he was their patient. One for lazer surgery to remove his sideburns (I've looked closely and they do appear altered.) and the other reports he had a conference visit in preparation for SRS.

Do I think he did it? not really. There is a news report that seems to indicate he may be the little fish in the much larger pond of child pornography and that quite possibly he's only the first in more, much bigger arrests. If I remember correctly, he's had 4, maybe 5, child porn charges against him in the past, his first wife was 13? and his second wife was 16. His current ex has stated emphatically she wants *nothing* to with, or about, him. She has also stated there was *no* way he was at the Ramsey house when the murder happened, that he was home with her that entire Christmas season.
http://www.rr.com/flash/index.cfm
All the hooplah over the handwriting analysis doesn't impress me either. They've showed samples of his, and the writing on the ransom note, and I really don't see the comparisons they're all yakkin about.

[Melissa A.]

Just Terrible-the whole deal. A little girl, who was treated like a trophy by her parents, murdered, an inept police investigation, and now this. A sociopath child porn nut being lumped in with nice girls like us, who wouldn't hurt a fly. One step foward, two steps back.

Hugs,

Melissa:happy:

[Sage GG]

I read that his first wife was 13. I think this is his fifteen minutes and it will come out that its just his sad little way to get attention.

[joanlynn28]

I was afraid of what the drive by media was going to do to make a complete circus out of this case and it has become true. And to make matters worse a couple of weeks ago a met a crossdresser who just happens to live in Thailand and ended up losing his passport. Now this person is accussing me or someone else from our bar of stealing his passport. And then on Tuesday this person leaves me a long message that he knows John Karr and thinks that whoever has his passport is trying to use it to make money off of it by selling it or his name to the media. I only know this person by their first name and it scares me to think how and what way does this guy know Karr. As far as Karr is concerned I am not sure if he actually killed Jon Benet, I think that maybe he did something horrorable over in Thailand and just admitted killing her to his butt out of Thailand at us US taxpayers expense. If this case falls apart the later is probable the truth. And yes we the transgender community are beiing mocked of in the local talk radio programs specifically on the Roger Hedgecock Show in San Diego.

[Jennaie]

People who are not accepting of others who are "out of the social norm" are the ones that scare me the most. I can't help but wonder how they can be so uneducated in todays world.

I have to admit that I have very few friends, but the friends I do have are very accepting of alternative life styles.

It's a little like religion, there are hundreds of them out there and they all believe that they are the only ones that have it right.

[Jillian310]

Hedgecock, great name for a homophobe

[Charleen]

Since when has cross dressing had anything to do with molesting children? I really wish people would think out their arguments.

THAT'S THE PROBLEM, THEY DON'T THINK!!!!!!!!!

[terza]

it is a matter of laking in public role models.
i think the comment of redneck 3rd grade dropout is naive.
higher education has nothing to offer a positive view of the transgender.
it is only by moral compass that people will accept or reject the transgender.
the need for public examples of crossdressing with attributes of honorability, tastefullness, and moral hi grounds are desperately needed. by moral, i don't mean the religious kind -- which is a futile battle -- but more in line of common decency, kindness, and mutal considerations.
face it the public thinks we are child molesting pornographic pervs because there are some of that that obviously exist, even w/in the members of this site, and unfortunately that news of crossdressers have never been of the positive nature. and especially 0 news on the straight crossdressers that wants to stay male.


ps. i hate kids, and most of all, child stars and child star wantabes. it is not news worthly. alot more important things going on than a creepy little kid that died long ago.

[ArleneRaquel]

Americans are by and large very ignorant people. I'm afraid that they can be easliy aroused and be made to cause great harm to the " sexually incorrect " and others. Political and sexual ' McCarthyism " may be on its way. I hope that I am terribly wrong.:love:

[tekla west]

I don't think he did it anyway. Too many holes in the story. DNA will tell.

[GG Vanya]

it is a matter of laking in public role models.
i think the comment of redneck 3rd grade dropout is naive.
higher education has nothing to offer a positive view of the transgender.
it is only by moral compass that people will accept or reject the transgender.
the need for public examples of crossdressing with attributes of honorability, tastefullness, and moral hi grounds are desperately needed. by moral, i don't mean the religious kind -- which is a futile battle -- but more in line of common decency, kindness, and mutal considerations.
face it the public thinks we are child molesting pornographic pervs because there are some of that that obviously exist, even w/in the members of this site, and unfortunately that news of crossdressers have never been of the positive nature. and especially 0 news on the straight crossdressers that wants to stay male.


ps. i hate kids, and most of all, child stars and child star wantabes. it is not news worthly. alot more important things going on than a creepy little kid that died long ago.


Be thankful your parents didn't feel this way about kids. :thumbsdn:

That "creepy little kid" was a dearly beloved child to her parents. Do I agree with how they pushed her into what I consider to be mild kiddie porn? Absolute NOT. The promiscuous strutting on stage was coached by an adult. So if you want to lable someone as "creepy" slap it on whoever created that on stage image in her.

[Rachel Morley]

I don't really have time for people like that.

[tekla west]

I find that stuff darn close to kiddie porn, its not normal, or healty for a five year old to be strutting like that. Too much odd stuff about this case, too much not looked into. Still, I do not think the odd ball in custody now did it. All the profile stuff would indicate it was a family member.

[Kimberley]

Flunked? Best 8 years of their lives....

Seriously, we have a long way to go and it will change but not likely in our day. Each younger generation is becoming more tolerant in general. Still and all, bigots and religious zealots will always be there. One cannot change their minds... especially if they have seasons tickets to Jerry Springer.

The real problems with these clowns is that they have NEVER had to face diversity. The other problem they have of course is misinformation and innuendo spread by the media. Wow, look at the mileage Fox and CNN got out of that little tidbit which has absolutely zero to do with anything.

I am waiting for someone to sue the networks and hold them accountable for yellow journalism. Murrow isnt dead, he was reincarnated in Bill O'Reilly. Funny how the Canadian networks didnt carry this bit of crap; at least not to my knowledge. Why? Because it has nothing to do with the case. I dont know, maybe we are more tolerant toward diversity and careful about who we offend. Or maybe we just do better journalism and send the rejects south of the border. (It is a long list) Of course they also got some damned good ones (like Peter Jennings and Morley Safer.) I digress here.

Want to set me off? Get me onto the media. :D

I think the backlash is minimal because believe it or not most people can see through this sort of thing. I just hope the media are prepared to swallow if the investigation shows Karr wasnt there and he is just a media hound.

Just my opinions that mean nothing.

Kimberley.

[julie w]

I think there is more to this story than we know , I am not sure he did it?
take a look at his picture if he hasnt even shaped his eye brows or grow his hair, which is strange for sombody that wants a sex change ! but you are right we are all grouped into pervert by narrow minded people

[GG Vanya]

Tekla, we really have to stop agreeing like this. People will start talking! :tongueout

Besides, my post number was at 666! No way I was going to bed and leaving *that* number! whew

[Marlena Dahlstrom]

Actually it turns out it's a bit hazy whether Karr was actually seeking GRS (vs. seeking plastic surgery for other reasons, such as changing his appearance).

http://www.abqtrib.com/albq/nw_national/article/0,2564,ALBQ_19860_4933305,00.html

But regardless of the facts, most people will probably think he did.

Part of the problem is that it's often the "weirdo trans" (to paraphase Eddie Izzard) who tend to make the news, so that's who the public sees. Which is compounded by some people's equating any "deviance" with "sicko."

Or why it's all the more critical that the pubic sees that there's "next-door neighbor" trans folk as well.

[GG Vanya]

Actually it turns out it's a bit hazy whether Karr was actually seeking GRS (vs. seeking plastic surgery for other reasons, such as changing his appearance).

http://www.abqtrib.com/albq/nw_national/article/0,2564,ALBQ_19860_4933305,00.html

But regardless of the facts, most people will probably think he did.

Part of the problem is that it's often the "weirdo trans" (to paraphase Eddie Izzard) who tend to make the news, so that's who the public sees. Which is compounded by some people's equating any "deviance" with "sicko."

Or why it's all the more critical that the pubic sees that there's "next-door neighbor" trans folk as well.


I agree that the SRS rumors could be sheer sensationalism. My feeling is that it's more conceivable that he was in Thailand because pedophilia is more prevalent there.

There have also been questions relating to how he financed his extensive travels for the last seven years. Reportedly he held very few jobs during that time. That information was connected to the possiblity that he is involved in a very extensive child pornography organization.

A very good friend of ours had SRS in Thailand, and no, she did NOT have to have been on hormones for 10 years. That's bull caca. In fact, she went from "just a CD" (I detest that demeaning phrase) to post op within 2 years.

[Lilith Moon]

Seriously, we have a long way to go and it will change but not likely in our day. Each younger generation is becoming more tolerant in general. Still and all, bigots and religious zealots will always be there. One cannot change their minds... especially if they have seasons tickets to Jerry Springer.


I must beg to differ with your opinion that each generation is becoming more tolerant. I believe that America is currently in freefall toward the political right, led by extremist neocons and Christian fundamentalists.

This happens to be relevant to me right now because I've just had a session in a newsgroup with a group of Christian fundamentalists. They are implacable in their hatred of "Liberals" and any others who are "different" and their support for the Republican party is absolute and utterly uncompromising. "Compromise" is not a word in their vocabulary. Many of them are rubbing their hands in glee at the prospect of the coming Armageddon in the Middle East and they are in positions of authority in government at all levels.

These are scary, ruthless, people and tolerance is *not* on their agenda.

[mecloset]

I was out in our fabrication building at work today and heard people discussing John Karr and the Ramsey case.
Since it seems like he had "gender issues" I am afraid we are all going to get lumped in with the child molesters. At least that was the opinion I was hearing. I tried to add my two cents into the conversation that just because someone is gay or wants to be a girl or dress like one does not make them want to kill or have sex with children. But my silly opinion was overturned by the "common knowledge" that "fags, transvesties and transsexuals" molest kids all the time.
Just a thought


These are the kind of things a person like me has the most to worry about. If I lived in a bigger town I might come out more, hence the name I chose. Around here any time something bad is in the media, such as this Ramsey case all the talk relates back to Gay, Homo, TV, TS, ect and they are very reluctant to see that just because someone wants to express their feminine side does not make them do these kind of things. I mean I am a TV or CD depending on how you look at it, and while yes I am in the closet, I still have never had and urges to do these kind of unspeakable thing, especially to children. I have two daughters of my own and I am very protective of them even though they do not know why or know that I CD. It just seems that when something bad like this happens everyone is looking for someone to blame or something to blame and if the media mentions sexual orientation or CD'ing everyone jumps the gun and thinks, yep that is the reason so if that person does it everyone does it. Kinda like steriotyping, its a cruel harsh world at times.

[CaptLex]

Americans are by and large very ignorant people. I'm afraid that they can be easliy aroused and be made to cause great harm to the " sexually incorrect " and others. Political and sexual ' McCarthyism " may be on its way. I hope that I am terribly wrong.:love:
Bigotry and narrow-mindedness is not a uniquely American trait. I think you'll find it in all parts of the world - in some more than others, of course. :p

[Lauren B]

Bigotry and narrow-mindedness is not a uniquely American trait. I think you'll find it in all parts of the world - in some more than others, of course. :p

So is gullibility, but I think that's one trait you find a lot of here in America.

Not to turn this into a political rant or something, but really all it takes to shape opinion in this country is to have the media convey a message over and over again, no matter how ridiculous it seems on its surface. You've seen this happen in the whole Iraq fiasco, for example. But the whole "transgender people are freaky and creepy" theme is a message that has been played over and over again for quite a long time now. Jerry Springer really got that ball rolling, and mainstream media knows that it's a great way to add spice (and ratings) to a story, no matter how much or how little the TG angle actually has to do with anything relevant.

I get so upset at the American media because I think in general they have abdicated their responsibility to fair reporting and providing unbiased information in favor of selling newspapers and advertising slots, but I also get upset at the millions of people who choose to allow their opinions to be shaped by this irresponsible journalism instead of doing their own thinking.

[Jenny Beth]

I get so upset at the American media because I think in general they have abdicated their responsibility to fair reporting and providing unbiased information in favor of selling newspapers and advertising slots, but I also get upset at the millions of people who choose to allow their opinions to be shaped by this irresponsible journalism instead of doing their own thinking.


Couldn't agree more, and CNN has to be the worst offender. But the bottom line here is ratings and as long as people are glued to such "sensationalism" there won't be any let up. It's sad really when so much is going on elsewhere in the world.

[julie w]

everything in america has to have a money angle ,so if putting down alternative life styles to to sell news they will do it ,I personally dont watch
cnn try getting news from canada or europe you will get a different story

[ReginaK]

I must beg to differ with your opinion that each generation is becoming more tolerant. I believe that America is currently in freefall toward the political right, led by extremist neocons and Christian fundamentalists.

This happens to be relevant to me right now because I've just had a session in a newsgroup with a group of Christian fundamentalists. They are implacable in their hatred of "Liberals" and any others who are "different" and their support for the Republican party is absolute and utterly uncompromising. "Compromise" is not a word in their vocabulary. Many of them are rubbing their hands in glee at the prospect of the coming Armageddon in the Middle East and they are in positions of authority in government at all levels.

These are scary, ruthless, people and tolerance is *not* on their agenda.

I'm glad someone else sees it. It seems like the whole nation has gone into "gay panic" over the past 3 years. And by gay, they mean anything not "Leave It To Beaver" perfect even if it isn't gay. It's like some of these people have no life and just spend all their idle time looking for any single deviation from what's considered normal. Like the incident with the Barbie website where they had a 3rd option for gender. All of a sudden, the neo-con groups come out saying Barbie is promoting homosexuality and transgenderism. Why should they care? If their kid becomes a transsexual just because of a choice on a website, maybe they were probably gonna be a transsexual anyway.

[ArleneRaquel]

ReginaK - - You are so right. But how do you suvive in ultra - conservative Oklahoma ? :love:

[Gunda]

Bigotry and narrow-mindedness is not a uniquely American trait. I think you'll find it in all parts of the world - in some more than others, of course. :p

Thankyou CaptLex, I would agree. Yes, there are narrow minded people in these United States that will make all kinds of wrong leaps of judgement but look at much of the rest of the world: in some quarters gays, TGs, TVs or CDs might be imprisoned, or worse, for being themselves. Yeah things could be better here too but it is helpful, I think, to look at the level of intolerance here in comparison with other areas of the world.

Best,
Gunda

[gennee]

People who make blanket comments like that know nothing about TGs, gays, or any other group of people beside their own. I don't worry myself about it.

Gennee

[ReginaK]

ReginaK - - You are so right. But how do you suvive in ultra - conservative Oklahoma ? :love:

With a fast car and quick hands.

Being a pretty big guy doesn't hurt either. ;)