A true crossdresser?

[bgirl]

Hello girls,
Recently I recieved a magazine from a cd group that had an article in it that set me off. It said that the only true crossdressers do everyting possible to present as a women, and those that wore only a garment or two under their clothes where only fetish dressers. First let me admit there is a fetish aspect to my dressing at times,with or with out full atire. Other times it is just an acceptance of a part of myself that I am starting to love. Not just the clothes, but the feminine side of myself. I know that person was only expressing her opinion. But coming from a cd group that extends a welcome to all of us, its not very welcoming.
My opinion, it doesn't matter if you only wear panties or if you can look like the girl next door. It doesn't matter if you only think about dressing and don't wear one feminine thing. What does matter is that you are true to yourself and if your not there yet, practice. This crossdresser is true to herself and I promise never to think you have to be like me, to be you. From the heart,
Beth

[Stephenie S]

Dear Beth,

Please don't obsess too much about labels. Society wants to put a label on everything and when it comes to us there is just too darn much variety. That seems to be the one constant here on this forum; that we are all different with different views and needs.

Thank goodness we all have the "value" of acceptance.

Lovies,
Steph

[MsJanessa]

darling---a rose is a rose by anyother name

[Paula Thomas]

Beth - I would love to have a copy of that magazine (because I disagree strongly with the premise of the article).

Is there a "Letters to the Editor" section.

If so, you could argue that their definition is faulty, and that it could be equally argued that if you "do everyting possible to present as a women", and not go through SRS, then those they define as "true crossdressers" are really "only fetish sexers."

[Marla S]

It is always astonishing how a fringe group is able to "fringe-group" others and to seek for acceptance by non-accepting others.

Similar to Stephanie: Label-obsession only leads to absurd results and conclusions.

One easily could call those trying everything to present as a woman Gender-Tourists (great term, Daytripper !) or female-impersonators, because it is possible only for a very limited amount of time, wheras those that dress only partly but every day are the "real crossdressers" because the try to incorporate their feminity in their day to day life.;)

[Vivian Best]

Dear Beth,

Please don't obsess too much about labels. Society wants to put a label on everything and when it comes to us there is just too darn much variety. That seems to be the one constant here on this forum; that we are all different with different views and needs.

Thank goodness we all have the "value" of acceptance.

Lovies,
Steph

Very well stated Stephenie!

[nishababe]

This society ,says this ,that one says that ,its just ''their opinion''

Its like religion ,every religion thinks that they are the right one who knows all the answers and everyone else is wrong when in fact no one knows for certain the truth of who's interpretation of God is right and even as to whe'ther God or Gods exist at all except in the mind of the believers .

So do what ever you enjoy doing and as long as you are not hurting anyone dont worry too much about other peoples opinions and theories .

Learn to be an individual and not a collective !!

Love Nishababe xx:heehee:

[bgirl]

Beth - I would love to have a copy of that magazine (because I disagree strongly with the premise of the article).

Is there a "Letters to the Editor" section.

The publication is called the Mirror and the article is called "About crossdressing and passing" Published by tri-ess

[AprilMae]

As a result of searching the internet, I have found as many definitions of Crossdresser and Transvestite, as there are sleazy Congressmaen. There definitely is an All the way or nothing group out there, that sometimes will be downright hostile to those of us who just do it part time, or in partial dress, somehow believing we are taking their struggle with identity too lightly, which is far from the truth. This is part of our identity as well. If the fact that I don't try to go out and pass, or don't dress fully all the time means I am no a true crossdresser, fine. I don't get hung up on labels. You do that and the Transvestite Terrorists win.

[Paula Thomas]

Bgirl - I am not a member (yet) of tri-ess, so I am not sure if I can get a copy.

I noticed your "Boy/Girl Yin/Yang" and immediately thought "Boy/Girl/BoyGirl Yin/Yang/Yummy".

[Karren H]

Let them call it what they want.....I call it FUN!! :)

Love Karren

[Erica007]

:hello: Beth, That's what I like about this forum everyone is welcome here no matter if you want to go the full bit to look like a woman or just like to wear sexy panties and lingerie like myself. I was made to feel at home here :hugs: from the first post I put here, and have seen the welcome others have got, it's just a great friendly place that I'm glad I have become a member. So don't worry about what any other groups think, just enjoy the friendship here where you know you are welcome. As long as I'm happy with what I'm doing, as long as you are happy what your doing, and as long as everyone else on this forum is happy with what they are doing who cares what others think or say, thats their problem not ours. :love: Erica.

[hotbobbie]

Tri ess that says it all.

[ashlee chiffon]

i wouldn't sweat the small stuff...there are about as many different kinds of opinions of cd's and why they do it as there are different kinds of panties in my pantie drawer!!! *LOTS!*

[Robin Leigh]

One easily could call those trying everything to present as a woman Gender-Tourists (great term, Daytripper !) or female-impersonators, because it is possible only for a very limited amount of time, wheras those that dress only partly but every day are the "real crossdressers" because the try to incorporate their feminity in their day to day life.;)
Another excellent post, Marla! "Give the lady a kewpie doll!" :D


I noticed your "Boy/Girl Yin/Yang" and immediately thought "Boy/Girl/BoyGirl Yin/Yang/Yummy".
I like the way you think, Paula. :D


TrisEss like to say they are all inclusive, but they do seem to have a habit of making these statements that fragment our community. I wouldn't bother arguing with them, it'd only increase the antagonism.

Some people are searching for the perfect theory to explain CDing, mostly so they can be more comfortable with themselves, IMHO. This tends to lead to theories which single out only one of the many forms of CDing as "true" CDing. Such theories can't explain the other forms very well, so they tend to discount them in various ways .

Any true TG theory must recognize that many factors contribute in various ways to make a person TG. The total number of different combinations of these factors is astronomical, so there is huge variety across the TG spectrum. Actually, the term "spectrum" is probably a bit misleading. The possibilities inherent in the TG universe are more like a wild kaleidoscopic fractal than a simple rainbow. :)

Robin

Speaking of Yin/Yang...

[bgirl]

Speaking of Yin/Yang...

Thanks for the image, I have started a small collection of Yin/Yang symbols.

[KarenSusan]

Let them call it what they want.....I call it FUN!! :)

Love Karren

Absolutely!:iagree:

[Elly]

just a little interjection...wouldn't crossdressers alude to 'anyone' that wears the clothing of the opposite sex no matter how many articles of clothing they are wearing, i always thaught the people that went all out full time were refered to as transvestites plain and simple, but that's yet just another label, anyway labels are bad unless they're designer Italian labels on fine clothing... i don't know much about these Tri-Ess people but i always got the feeling they were nothing more than a bunch of elitist who like to put themselves on a pedistle above anyone that isn't a member of their group, i'm not hateing but stating an observation from my point of view...

[Robin Leigh]

Hi Elly,


...wouldn't crossdressers alude to 'anyone' that wears the clothing of the opposite sex no matter how many articles of clothing they are wearing, i always thaught the people that went all out full time were refered to as transvestites plain and simple,

Well, a crossdresser wears the clothes of the opposite sex because they are the clothing of the opposite sex. Thus a guy wearing tights purely for warmth isn't a crossdresser. Transvestite is really a synonym for crossdresser, but it has more erotic & fetishistic connotations, whereas crossdresser is the more general term. Your dictionary may disagree. :)



i don't know much about these Tri-Ess people but i always got the feeling they were nothing more than a bunch of elitist
They do have a tendency to come across as elitist. TrisEss members are mostly well-to-do, married CDers. It is a major part of the TriEss mission to assure the wives that their CDing husband isn't gay. So anyone who doesn't fit their "ideal" model is some kind of fetishist, not a "true" CD.

Robin

[Robin Leigh]

Thanks for the image, I have started a small collection of Yin/Yang symbols.My pleasure, bgirl! I can send you the Postscript source (via PM) if you want, so using a program like Ghostscript, you can print this pic (or a traditional Yin/Yang) at a huge resolution with no loss of detail.

We shall now return you to your regularly scheduled program. :D

Robin

[Sky]

It said that the only true crossdressers do everyting possible to present as a women, and those that wore only a garment or two under their clothes where only fetish dressers.

Well, it makes sense, doesn't it? Otherwise, where do you draw the line? Are you crossdressing when you wear panties under a full masculine attire? Don't think so. Or how about when you paint your toenails, hidden under male shoes? Even when you wear something feminine in public, I wouldn't call it crossdressing unless there is a conscious effort to look as a female. Yesterday I spent most of the day in 2 1/2" heel mules (all the rest as male) and I wouldn't say I was crossdressing.

[Snookums]

well then I'm just a man who likes to wear womens things,I have never tried to make myself pass as a woman,I never will,I see no point.

[Elly]

yup my 'dictionary' where i got my info many years ago was a book on health and sexuality, but it seems no two 'experts' have ever come to an agreement on what the varying degrees of CD & Transexualism consist of... the sourse i read just simply stated that a Closet CD wears the clothing of the opposite sex for emotional or sexual satisfaction, a Transvestite want's to portray themselves as the opposite gender in public but still have the freedom to change back unlike a Post-Op TS (of course this has been convoluted due to the portrayal of transvestite hookers in the media to also include sexual gratification), a Drag Queen does it for fun and proffit and is entirely tongue in cheek performances with much exageration, and Transexuals basicaly know from as far back as they can remeber that they were not born the sex that their gender dictates (classic woman traped in a mans body and vice-versa)... personaly i believe myself to be TS as i know i am not a guy yet i am cursed with this male body, yet i have CD'd most of my life in private due to my upbringing in a strict non-understanding situation, if i ever said "dad i want to be a girl outside to match myself inside" he would have beat me bloody thus i lived as a closeted CD out of fear, now i'm glad my wife accepts me and has no problems with me living as a woman and accepts that i'm TS... the lines are so blurry at this point i'm begining to believe labels to be pointless and only there for people to validate themselves as different from someone else in the same group as them...

[SherriePall]

I would call it being me! because that's what it is to me no matter how dressed I am.

[bgirl]

Well, it makes sense, doesn't it? Otherwise, where do you draw the line? Are you crossdressing when you wear panties under a full masculine attire? Don't think so. Or how about when you paint your toenails, hidden under male shoes? Even when you wear something feminine in public, I wouldn't call it crossdressing unless there is a conscious effort to look as a female. Yesterday I spent most of the day in 2 1/2" heel mules (all the rest as male) and I wouldn't say I was crossdressing.

Hello Sky, A lovely name. We seem too disagree. Are crossdressers only crossdressing when they dress? And why have a line? For me the part of me that comes out when I crossdress, comes out even when I am dressed in drab. So what is it then, an action? or a state of being? perhaps an attitude? What if I'll never look like a girl? If I wore my heels around the house when my wife was home ,she would say I was crossdressing. Whatever you call it. Whatever it is, it is with me always, fully drab or fully femme.
I know we have many different views and deal with this in many different ways and all have our opinions. On this site at least on this site we all seem to be able to find space to be who we are.
So I will agree that when you are at home wearing your heels you dot not feel you are crossdressing. I hope that you can agree that when I am home wearing my heels I feel that I am crossdressing. Maybe we should try each others shoes. I'm an 11

[myMichelle]

It can indeed be frustrating, but in the end I think it all boils down to variations on a theme. Call it what you will, but it doesn't change the facts!
As so many others have pointed out here, I'm just being myself, however you'd care to label me!

[Anne Evans]

Don't worry about names and labels. Let everyone be what they want to be.
Anne

[Jasmine Ellis]

one says one thing, another says something else, you know who you are and we know who we are we are crossdressers and love it. :hugs:

[Sky]

Are crossdressers only crossdressing when they dress?

Yes indeed! Because your choice of words was referred to an action. But I think you might have meant "Are crossdressers only crossdressers when they dress?" and if that was the case, I'm with you.


What if I'll never look like a girl?


And why have a line?

That's not what I meant. I never said only passable cds are "true cds". But I do believe that when you apply a label -such as "crossdresser"- there is a line implicit with the definition. Mine is, those who try to look like a woman, at least in part, are crossdressers. Any definition leaves plenty of gray areas, such as people who wear female clothes but don't use makeup: I'd be glad to call them crossdressers. But again, I sincerely don't believe a guy wearing a bra under a business suit is a crossdresser: in that case the label "fetish lover" seems more adequate to me. Of course your definition may be different than mine: but, like it or not, labels are useful for people to communicate. Otherwise we'd spend our lives asking "whaddayamean?"


Maybe we should try each others shoes. I'm an 11

I'm in! I'm a 10 / 11 depending on the maker. Mine are a bit worn out as I walked a lot in them, and not inside my house. I'm sure most of the airport passengers did label me as a crossdresser (and so did the security controllers, but only because they found my steel clad working boots in my backpack and that triggered a questioning...)

:love: !

[MelissaAndProudOfIt]

Hi all, Well what does it matter what you wear so long as what you wear isn't technically obcene and hurting absolutelly no one. True Crossdresser mmmm I thought there was only the Crossdresser... We are given various names lol, what does it matter... The truth is that those who consider themselves to be a real Crossdresser I guess reckon they are totally out, scene and fully in control of their lives, when the truth is, that no matter how much experience we have, we really never have enough as we are always learning. The danger of believing we know all makes us complacent and that's not good. I like to think that although I have been out of the closet and out daytimes now for a long time, I am always on my guard to present my best, never becoming complacent as that's where mistakes happen... thats where you get clocked... The best term i have heard meaning Crossdresser is "Eonist" as the definition for this word i believe more fits the person a crossdresser is. I agree that some consider dressing a fetish, ladies wear jeans and call it trend.. well maybe we can call ourselves trend setters too lol... whatever, the fact remains.. we hurt no one, we live our life on our terms.... if everyone were like us, this world would be a far safer place..

[Snookums]

don't you think if all cothes,undergarments,and shoes were unisex,our backwards society wouldn't label us or give us derogative names nasty looks,and get violently confrontational.

[bgirl]

[QUOTE=Sky;585370] "whaddayamean?"



Whaddayamean, whaddayamean? It has been fun cummunicating! I do enjoy having a place to discuss these things.

And thanks for the flowers, they made me smile. Truly, Beth

[Angie G]

Who cares we are what we are I'm a corssdresser no mater what I have on :hugs:
Angie

[Marlena Dahlstrom]

In the words of ultra-groovoi transman Jamison Green (http://intraa.tgcrossroads.org/connections/story/?iid=39&aid=951), there's no one way to be trans (or a CD).

[trannie T]

When I am dressed I thought I was an artifical woman, now it turns out I'm an artifical crossdresser.
What a load of crap!

[Penny]

I love it when someone tries to define crossdressing when in fact, Websters doesn't even define it at all. Websters does, however, define transvestism as
individuals wearing clothing of the oposite sex. It doesn't say how much or how little so I guess that makes all who do that definitive. I have said this before " transvestism is a convient way for the mental health professionals
to lable us so as to gain fame and fortune" so as an alternative, we use crossdressing. So while many may choose to define it, crossdressing is not defined no do I think it can be because the extent to which we participate varries emensely and that's as it should be given our enormeous size.