tounge in cheek politics

[ubokvt]

I sorry girls I can't help my self. It appears that we cross dressers are included in that great umbrella of transgender and as such seen politically with the GBLT community. Being a confirmed hetro and no plans to do more than dress this is at times disconcerting. I was wondering with the way we honor and fallow a feme tradition wouldn't we do better aligning with the feminest, Do you think they would accept us a sisters in the struggle. :devil:

[Snookums]

I sorry girls I can't help my self. It appears that we cross dressers are included in that great umbrella of transgender and as such seen politically with the GBLT community. Being a confirmed hetro and no plans to do more than dress this is at times disconcerting. I was wondering with the way we honor and fallow a feme tradition wouldn't we do better aligning with the feminest, Do you think they would accept us a sisters in the struggle. :devil:

no,feminists see all men as grunting neanderthals,weather we are in a dress or pants,maybe if we burn our bras that will send a message:lol: :lol2: :lol: :lol2:

[Dominique Melt]

no,feminists see all men as grunting neanderthals,weather we are in a dress or pants,maybe if we burn our bras that will send a message:lol: :lol2: :lol: :lol2:

I think we'd have to castrate ourselves -- painfully -- and burn our jockstraps before some feminists change their mind. But why bother getting our knickers in a twist over them?

[Marlena Dahlstrom]

no,feminists see all men as grunting neanderthals

Ya know.... feminists are as diverse as the trans community, so it's silly to tar them all with the same brush.

Try reading Naomi Wolf's "Fire with Fire" or bell hooks "Feminism is for Everyone" or Nancy Friday's recent works and you'll find feminists who are quite sympathetic to the way stereotyped gender roles also hurt men. Even an implicitly "difference feminist" like Norah Vincent developed quite a bit of sympathy for men (after posing as one) in her "Self-Made Man." As she said:


Yet as Paul, who has spent years in the men's movement trying to defend it to angry feminists, once put it to me, "It is women who are paying the highest price for men's dysfunction. We are not in opposition to them at all." And he's right. Men's healing is in women's interest, though for women that healing will mean accepting on some level not only that men are--here is the dreaded word--victims of the patriarchy, to be (and this will the hardest part to swallow) that women have been codeterminers in the system, at times as invested and active as men themselves in making men in their role. From the femininist point of view this sounds at best like an abdication of responsibility, an easy way out for the inventor, and at worse an infuriating instance of blaming the true victim. But from Paul's point of view it means that men and women are finally agreeing on something: the system sucks.

No bra burning required...

ubokvt, I understand that you're uncomfortable being lumped in with "those people." Being "out of the norm" is disconcerting. OTOH, I'd point out that those who hate us don't seem to be terribly concerned with the distinctions we keep trying to draw among ourselves. And while the GLBT communities haven't always allies who see exactly eye-to-eye, I haven't really seen CDs getting out there and trying to gain social acceptance, legal protections, etc. for ourselves. So we might want to think twice before we distance ourselves from them.

As far as aligning ourselves with feminists, just be aware a number of CDs seem to present themselves/behave in ways the reflect a very stereotypical idea of what being a woman is like. If that floats your boat, hey whatever... but just realize that's probably not going making allies.

[MsJanessa]

Although, as I've mentioned in another thread, some gay males don't accept us most do and I will say that I feel more comfortable with Gays(and lesbians) as a group than I do with the straight world----sorry snookums and ubkvt---the GBLT community is much more accepting of C-dressers than any body else---if you don't want to be associated with them, that's your own business but unless you are femme enough to actually pass 100% of the time as a real GG, then your going to spend most of your dressing time by yourself because in actual fact, gay venues are one of the few places where Crossdressers are welcomed and accepted.

[AprilMae]

Feminists with their bra burning, man hating agenda, or the moronic men's movement, who go out into the woods eat raw meat and howl at the moon. I have no use for either. I am me. I don't want to belong to any type of movement or special interest group.

[27th Jennifer]

I am straight, however, gay people are mostly very accepting, so don't worry about it. A lot of hetero people don't realize it, but trying to infringe on homosexual rights by certain groups also leads to infringement of straight rights, too. I recommend Dan Savage's column, "Savage Love."