American Family Assoc.

[lynn27]

Some one just sent me an email from this oganization [about a recent "dirt" episode]. then i found this link in their website.

http://www.citizenlink.org/fnif/A000003454.cfm

"During a recent discussion about families in a Newton, Massachusetts public school, a third-grade student spoke up and said “some men like to become women.” The teacher, then, affirmed 8-year-old pupils that transgenderism is a viable option for some."

article goes on to imply a link to TG and homosexuality and finished with;

"He says the last thing you want your local educators to do is tell your child that transgenderism is normal."

this group really sounds scary :mad:

[susie evans]

we are the only normal people any way the others are just jelous:heehee:

susie

[Tasha Meredith]

It don't totally agree with their approach, but I wouldn't call it "scary." "Scary" to often replaces "people with opposing views." When parents are unnerved about child transgenderism, they're typically distressed over the gender dysphoria, depression, and social harassment associated. A lot of us went through most of that ourselves or are currently experiencing it. Emotional development is always a hot-button issue in the schools--that's no secret. The hostility to child transgenderism is rooted mainly in it's negative aspects and the fact that it's an under-researched and rarely-understood facet of child psychology. I say this as both a member of family.org, and the TG community.

[lynn27]

It don't totally agree with their approach, but I wouldn't call it "scary." "Scary" to often replaces "people with opposing views." When parents are unnerved about child transgenderism, they're typically distressed over the gender dysphoria, depression, and social harassment associated. A lot of us went through most of that ourselves or are currently experiencing it. Emotional development is always a hot-button issue in the schools--that's no secret. The hostility to child transgenderism is rooted mainly in it's negative aspects and the fact that it's an under-researched and rarely-understood facet of child psychology. I say this as both a member of family.org, and the TG community.

NJ Parents Urged to Protest Rehiring of Transsexual Teacher
http://headlines.agapepress.org/archive/3/afa/62006g.asp

"Deo believes the school board's approval of the transsexual teacher is a by-product of the growing push to normalize same-sex "marriage" and other immoral behavior."

again, equating TG with being gay. what is immoral about being Transgendered? :Angry3:

they might be good for cleaning up childrens' TV but overall i think they are narrow minded bigots.

[Joy Carter]

Lynn you have to make allowances for those who don't know. I wouldn't be to concerned they are only a few with "face time" in the press. Those parents who claim such an upheaval in their lives because of what the teacher said are just big fakers.

[Helen MC]

The hard line religious right under a new name YEUCH!

[Michelle 51]

we are the only normal people any way the others are just jelous:heehee:

susie

Susie I don't know if i'm 100% normal but i hope i'm close...Justabit

[lynn27]

Susie I don't know if i'm 100% normal but i hope i'm close...Justabit

I agree with Susie, too. compared to AFA we are all normal.

[marie354]

I know I've said this before... Just what is normal? What is normal to one may not be for another.

[Salina]

When someone can come up with a clear cut definition of normal please let us all in on it. I've never considered myself "normal" and the CDing plays a very small part in that.

[Teresa Amina]

Not scary as individuals, they can be pretty frightening when they choose to speak for "normality". I've known quite a few right-wing loonies and liked them a lot as people, but would never bring up my Teresa-ness in their presence. They're just too fragile to handle diversity.

[linnea]

Not scary as individuals, they can be pretty frightening when they choose to speak for "normality". I've known quite a few right-wing loonies and liked them a lot as people, but would never bring up my Teresa-ness in their presence. They're just too fragile to handle diversity.

I think that this is a good image to keep in mind: many of the people who feel disgust, fear, or hatred for crossdressers are people who are simply too fragile to handle diversity. Their own sense of self-understanding and identity totters precariously on a perpetual brink, and they tremble in fear that they may fall.
I think that it is sad that so many people live in fear of so many non-aggressive and non-threatening things and people. Usually, crossdressers are not predators awaiting or seeking an opportunity to confront passers-by with their gender-bending. It is silly to think that hiring a transsexual teacher leads to or promotes the idea of gay marriages, just as it would be silly to think that hiring a bald teacher promotes the idea of hairlessness.
There's not much any of us can do about the closemindedness of our fellow citizens, except perhaps to work individually when we have opportunities to explain crossdressing to others.

[Lauren B]

Just remember that groups like the American Family Association and Focus on the Family are the same bunch that give you Ted Haggard "family values"- preach against homosexuality and transgenders in front of your mega-congregation as you're sleeping with gay hookers while you're tweaked on meth. These loonies are literally obsessed with gays and gay sex- they think about it more than gay people themselves do. And of course, there is no getting across to these people that sexuality and gender identity have nothing to do with one another.

Keep your eye on these groups to know what spew they are spewing, but always remember that they are the lunatic fringe. They are not open-minded, rational people.

[Tasha Meredith]

"Yeah, these family groups are wackos, idiots, and lunatics. They should be rounded up and treated like the closed-mined animals that they are. They are all bigots. They are all the same. They should be sent to labors camps and use seperate schools and water fountains. They should..."

This thread is sounding just as bad as our opposition. IMHO

[marie354]

I know... Doing the "guy" thing at work or whatever, it looks "normal"... But put on a dress??? Well that really is a grey area isn't it. Women don't have a problem wearing a suit and a tie, do they?
So I ask again... What is normal?
:hugs:
Shrinks of the world unite.... We need a defination now!

[Vanessa Sheridan]

The American Family Association is run by a right-wing religious extremist named Donald Wildmon. He's anti-everything that doesn't line up with his exclusive version of pseudo-Christianity. (I say pseudo-Christianity because these types have no clue about the true message of Christ, which has a lot more to do with welcoming the stranger in our midst than it does with automatically condemning anyone who may be "different".) My humble advice is to simply consider the source, be aware that the AFA is a wacko organization, and focus on living a life of truth, honesty, and integrity. The AFA and groups like them can't counter the truth if it's lived out by trans folks. Their extremist version of religion is a smokescreen designed to hide their hatred while they consolidate power through promoting a fear of difference. I encourage all my trans sisters and brothers to demonstrate the futility of the radical religious right by living lives that shine brightly in opposition to the fear-based tactics of our detractors. Blessings to you all.

[trannie T]

I checked their website. The American Family Association appears to be another conservative "Christian" group that preaches hatred in the name of Jesus.

[Kate Simmons]

I feel as educators, teachers should remain neutral on issues like this and just do their job which is teach. If people or their children have gender issues, it should be handled privately or with school administrators as needed. The point is not to highlight it but to treat it no differently than any other social issue. Undue public exposure to anything like this is counterproductive to not only the point of education to begin with but the emotional and spiritual growth of the children involved as well.:happy:

[marie354]

I sent that paper a comment on just what I thought. Keep an eye out for it.
It probabally won't be published, but here's hoping.
:hugs:

[Kimberley]

This is a publication of Focus on the Family, a neo conservative right wing christian organization. It was founded by Dr. James Dobson and while it is viable for its members, it obviously oversteps its bounds on a regular basis in promoting its views. The real irony is that they dont recognize that in promoting their views they are often acting in contrast to the very beliefs they purport to uphold.

Arguing with them or attempts at persuasion are futile, dont waste your time. They are just one of a number of such organizations.

Our efforts are better spent promoting the positives through receptive audiences wherever we can find them and at every opportunity.

:hugs:
Kimberley

[janet p]

What I don't see is where the teacher said it was normal. All she said is that it's an option.:love:

[amanda barber]

"If there's one word that sums up the essence of Focus on the Family, it is commitment. Using time-tested, Biblical principles and common sense, our founder Dr. James Dobson opened the doors of Focus on the Family with a commitment to helping families worldwide."

Any organisation that combines the terms "bible" "family" and "Common sense" in their mission statement wants to ban something, take away someone rights or worse and Dobson is one of the worse.

some his worst statements include:
My observation is that women are merely waiting for their husbands to assume leadership.

One of the problems with sex education... is that it also strips kids - especially girls - of their modesty to have every detail of anatomy, physiology and condom usage made explicit

State Universities are breeding grounds, quite literally, for sexually transmitted diseases (including HIV), homosexual behavior, unwanted pregnancies, abortions, alcoholism, and drug abuse.

He's against equality and against education.

[Tasha Meredith]

Any organisation that combines the terms "bible" "family" and "Common sense" in their mission statement wants to ban something, take away someone rights or worse and Dobson is one of the worse.
My mom is in that organization. Are you saying she is the worst? :(

[Tasha Meredith]

Answer me already.

[marie354]

This is a publication of Focus on the Family, a neo conservative right wing christian organization. It was founded by Dr. James Dobson and while it is viable for its members - Kimberley

You must watch the same things I do... I must have missed this one though. They usually show his comments daily on our local station. I must have slept in that day. Oh well... I can always that I saw it here!
:hugs:

[Joanie B]

This is a publication of Focus on the Family, a neo conservative right wing christian organization.

Our efforts are better spent promoting the positives through receptive audiences wherever we can find them and at every opportunity.

:hugs:
Kimberley

Kimberley,
1 Just for the record, altho they may have similar views, Focus on the Family and AFA American Family Association are NOT the same. The article under discussion is from AFA, not Focus on the Family.

2 Having said that, I do agree with your premise of being positive role examples ourselves and speaking up for our cause when we have the opportunity to do so.

Joanie B.

[amanda barber]

Answer me already.


The organisation speaks for itself. If she is a member or supports it in any way, then yes.

[sterling12]

Every time I talk to a CD who is politically on "The Right" and calls herself one of these Fundamentalists, what I always hear is: "Oh no, we Christians love you and you have nothing to fear." Sure doesn't look like that in this case, does it?

This American Family/Values Group has been around for quite some time. as I remember, it was started by The notorious David Capon, a notorious Right-wing lunatic and preacher.

Of course the article indulges in the worst types of hyperbole, I'll bet the only complaints came from the few parents who belonged to The American Family Association, you get the impression from the article that the whole school district was up in arms.

If it were The Onion, I would call it a lampoon. Unfortunately, it's not and these people make their living out of squeezing donations out of the feeble-minded. What better way to do it..."The evil Trans gender people are trying to corrupt little children, give them nightmares." "Send us your money, so we can be your fearless defenders."

Any child with a brain bigger than a Walnut can likely figure out that Daddy isn't going to change his sex. If the child can't, I reckon he or she could just ask Dad about it.

I guess I shouldn't be so critical of these people and they are probably laughable, but remember in Germany in The 1920s, they thought all those strange little men, running around in brown shirts were laughable too.

Peace and Love, Joanie

[noname]

Ah James Dobson. IMO that guy is one of the most sexist jerks I've heard. He's done radio shows on raising boys. Apperantly he believe in corporal punishment, espeically for boys. He also covers on how to make sure your son is not gay. You know, perhaps his organization should change it's name to, focus on gay.

You know, I really have much much more to say about this guy, but I don't have the time or enery and he doesn't deserve it. Just do a google on James Dobson and be amazed.

[Lauren B]

Ah James Dobson. IMO that guy is one of the most sexist jerks I've heard. He's done radio shows on raising boys. Apperantly he believe in corporal punishment, espeically for boys. He also covers on how to make sure your son is not gay. You know, perhaps his organization should change it's name to, focus on gay.

You know, I really have much much more to say about this guy, but I don't have the time or enery and he doesn't deserve it. Just do a google on James Dobson and be amazed.

You mean the James Dobson who thinks it is healthy and normal for men to take showers with their sons every day? That James Dobson?

Like I said before- this group thinks about gay sex more than gay people do. It's not exactly hard to figure out what they're repressing.

[Samantha Lough]

Ok I read the article and I also emailed them.... Now my question is this how many of us who read the Article responded to it and or did something about it sent them a link on transgenderism or a copy of some information so they can learn.... I am sorry but if we do not stand up and or educate them even if anonymously then how do we have the right attack them or flame them for their opinion also is this not the pot calling the Kettle black? This is the second Post I have seen on here and all of us up in arms about but did any one do anything or did we allow our panties to get in a bunch and then bury or Heads in the sand??? sorry but if you did do something YEAH and no I am not tooting my own horn.

[Marcie Sexton]

Perhaps if we looked close enough I'm sure they have a UDA Grade A approved Dumb Ass blue ink stamp on them...

Jeeze,

excuse my language girls, but stupidity gnaws at my butt...

[Tasha Meredith]

The organisation speaks for itself. If she is a member or supports it in any way, then yes.

wikipedia:
A bigot is a prejudiced person who is intolerant of opinions, lifestyles, or identities differing from his or her own.

This sounds exactly like the say you speak of them. You're just as bigoted is your opposition and don't even realize it. :lol: What a hilarious and tragic irony.

[lynn27]

My mom is in that organization. Are you saying she is the worst? :(

Tasha, I think you are taking this way too personal. Not knowing you or your mom it is impossible to say if you are "the worst". Your association with this group doesn't make you bad, but I do wonder about your defending them like they are your hero's.:( I don't think anyone called you a bigot. Would you agree that Archie Bunker was a bigot?

Imagine if you loved you mom unconditionally, shared everything with her and thought the world of her. You told her about being a CD'er and she completely rejected you and refused to ever speak to you again because of her beliefs. Would you feel her beliefs were wrong?

I think every one of Us is looking for the same things, love, acceptance, to treated like a person no matter who we are and not to be treated like a diseased animal that should be banished from society.

As I said, these people are scary because that is exactly what they advocate and that makes them bigots, IMO. But that has not reflection on you or your mom. :hugs:

Somebody once said "Austin is a great city, the only problem is it is surrounded by Texas. :tongueout

[lynn27]

wikipedia:
A bigot is a prejudiced person who is intolerant of opinions, lifestyles, or identities differing from his or her own.

This sounds exactly like the say you speak of them. You're just as bigoted is your opposition and don't even realize it. :lol: What a hilarious and tragic irony.

No I don't agree, calling someone else a bigot doesn't automatically make them a bigot, too.

Wiki goes on to say:
The origin of the word bigot in English dates back to at least 1598, via Middle French, and started with the sense of "religious hypocrite", especially a woman. Bigot is often used as a pejorative term against a person who is obstinately devoted to their prejudices even when these views are challenged or proven to be false.
1) I don't believe studying and researching the group's belief before forming an opinion of them is prejudical. So, I for one, am not prejudice. I have made an informed decision they are "scary".

2) I, for one, have listened [read] with open mind to your defense of them. So I am not obstinate.

3) Finally, You have not proven my views false. Therefore, your premise is false and I must not be a bigot.


Transphobia refers to various kinds of aversions towards transsexuality and transsexual or transgendered people, often taking the form of refusal to accept a person's expression of their internal gender identity (See Phobia - terms indicating prejudice or class discrimination). Whether intentional or not, transphobia can have severe consequences for the object of the negative attitude. Many transpeople also experience homophobia from people who incorrectly associate the medically recognised condition of gender identity disorder as a form of homosexuality (see Homosexuality and Transgender)[1].

Like other forms of discrimination such as homophobia, the discriminatory or intolerant behaviour can be direct (such as harassment, assault, or murder) or indirect (such as refusing to take steps to ensure that transgender people are treated in the same way as non-transgendered people.) However, direct forms of transphobia can manifest themselves in ways that are not related to violence.

[Marianna Julianna]

There's always someone, all you can do is to prove them wrong and hope someone takes notice. If you have freedom of speech you have to accept that everyone is a free to speak as the others, education is where it causes problems, get the wrong people or group doing that then you can get trouble. Answers, I have none, I just do my best to educate anyone I get a chance to, even in an oblique sort of way.

[lynn27]

There's always someone, all you can do is to prove them wrong and hope someone takes notice. If you have freedom of speech you have to accept that everyone is a free to speak as the others, education is where it causes problems, get the wrong people or group doing that then you can get trouble. Answers, I have none, I just do my best to educate anyone I get a chance to, even in an oblique sort of way.

I believe that group has a right to exist just as this group does. They have the right to believe whatever they believe and to freely express it, but they don't have a right to "use" transphobia or homophobia to "rally" the troops. And they don't have the right to turn the public against us, encourage hate and impose their beliefs on the unwilling. That is what the Taliban and Hitler did.

[Julogden]

My mom is in that organization. Are you saying she is the worst? :(
Hi Tasha,

While I didn't post what you're referring to, I'll contribute my thoughts on the matter.

No, your mother probably isn't the worst. I suspect that she's a very nice lady, but I also feel that there are many nice people being led by people who aren't nice in some of the more extreme Evangelical churches in America, and the followers all need to stop blindly following the haters, and stand up for true Christian values, as hatred isn't a Christian value.

Most people trust their church to be "good", but there is currently a movement among some of the more extreme "Christian" conservatives to move away from traditional Christianity toward a militant, divisive form of "religion", if you can call it that, and many people are turning a blind eye to the fact that their churches are actually turning away from Christianity when they do that.:2c:

Get a copy of the documentary film "Jesus Camp" to get an eye-opener. I just rented it this week, and it's a very interesting and scary film.

Sorry if this is going off-topic a bit, but I had to respond to this.

Carol:hugs:

[amanda barber]

I believe that group has a right to exist just as this group does. They have the right to believe whatever they believe and to freely express it, but they don't have a right to "use" transphobia or homophobia to "rally" the troops. And they don't have the right to turn the public against us, encourage hate and impose their beliefs on the unwilling. That is what the Taliban and Hitler did.

Exactly. These groups don't just beleive, they take action, both small scale and large scale political action to deny freedoms, diversity and choices. Opposing them is not bigoted. Allowing them carte blanche to act without even lip service to opposition due to fear of them parroting the term bigot is unconscionable.

[John]

Hi. I don't mean to intrude, but I feel it may be worth mentioning something:

Most transphobic (and homophobic) people are taught from childhood that being trans or gay is bad the same way that we are taught that rape is bad or that the sky is blue (I've met such people). I doubt anyone that came to the subject with an open mind and weighed all the evidence would reach homophobic conclusions, but the simple fact is that no one can ever come to any subject completely unbiased. I'm sure that many of them are pleasant, reasonable people, who are simply the product of their upbringing.

I'm not trying to justify any type of persecution here (after all, everyone has a mind to think for themselves), but prejudice often comes from fear and ignorance, and I'm sure this is the case with this organisation (I mean, how many of these protesters do you think have ever sat down and (knowingly) talked with a transsexual). I apreciate the anger felt (belive me you're not alone there!), but these people need to be educated, not degraded in turn.

[Melora]

Most transphobic (and homophobic) people are taught from childhood that being trans or gay is bad the same way that we are taught that rape is bad or that the sky is blue (I've met such people). I doubt anyone that came to the subject with an open mind and weighed all the evidence would reach homophobic conclusions, but the simple fact is that no one can ever come to any subject completely unbiased. I'm sure that many of them are pleasant, reasonable people, who are simply the product of their upbringing.

I'm not trying to justify any type of persecution here (after all, everyone has a mind to think for themselves), but prejudice often comes from fear and ignorance, and I'm sure this is the case with this organisation (I mean, how many of these protesters do you think have ever sat down and (knowingly) talked with a transsexual). I apreciate the anger felt (belive me you're not alone there!), but these people need to be educated, not degraded in turn

I thought I might add on to the quotes, as stated by Julogden as well as Joshua above.. What makes so many people afraid? They are afraid of what they do not understand, as well as fear of prosecution from their peers, associates as well as religous beliefs and leaders. However prejudice IS, what it is and is usually caused by one underlying factor.. = IGNORANCE. I still totally believe that Religion keeps many fine people from looking upon a great many things with an open eye, at least from what I have seen. As history has shown time and again, if religion goes the way it usually does, and proceeds unchecked, it can and will turn into a very dangerous thing when power and money is involved. Especially Christianity, despite all of the Good that it does for many.
P.S. Pat Robertson is the devil and he scares me. :)

[Tina Dixon]

Nothing but opinions, and you know what they say about opinions, there like a** holes every one has one:heehee:

[ReginaK]

The hard line religious right under a new name YEUCH!

But it's for the children! We must protect the children! Heaven forbid our children don't grow up to be as narrow-minded as us.





That's sarcasm by the way.

[ReginaK]

Every time I talk to a CD who is politically on "The Right" and calls herself one of these Fundamentalists, what I always hear is: "Oh no, we Christians love you and you have nothing to fear." Sure doesn't look like that in this case, does it?

This American Family/Values Group has been around for quite some time. as I remember, it was started by The notorious David Capon, a notorious Right-wing lunatic and preacher.

Of course the article indulges in the worst types of hyperbole, I'll bet the only complaints came from the few parents who belonged to The American Family Association, you get the impression from the article that the whole school district was up in arms.

If it were The Onion, I would call it a lampoon. Unfortunately, it's not and these people make their living out of squeezing donations out of the feeble-minded. What better way to do it..."The evil Trans gender people are trying to corrupt little children, give them nightmares." "Send us your money, so we can be your fearless defenders."

Any child with a brain bigger than a Walnut can likely figure out that Daddy isn't going to change his sex. If the child can't, I reckon he or she could just ask Dad about it.

I guess I shouldn't be so critical of these people and they are probably laughable, but remember in Germany in The 1920s, they thought all those strange little men, running around in brown shirts were laughable too.

Peace and Love, Joanie

Bad things always start with just a few people:
The Munich Olympic hostage situation
9/11
The Holocaust
The Taliban
The Ku Klux Klan
etc ad nausum

These people need to be curbed before it's too late.

[GypsyKaren]

I think this has been covered well enough, and it's starting to drift a bit, so it's now closed.

Karen