I don't want to see . . .

[Elizabeth Ann]

How much of our life is our own? What do we owe to others? We sell a few thousand hours each year for a salary. We never knew, as children, how much of our parent’s lives they gave to us, and we make the same commitment to our children. And how much of our lives must be shared with our spouses? What is the cost?

I know many here equate honesty with lack of privacy, but my wife and I have always defined marriage as only a single important dimension of each individual. We have crafted a marriage that is precious to us and perhaps odd to some.

After 32 years and two children, several careers, wonderful adventures and a few tragedies, a certain malaise has settled over our lives. The long silences, which used to be a sign of comfort with each other, are now pregnant with unspoken issues.

She came back Sunday from a week in Texas, closing up the house where her mother died last year, the last of her family. We talked about life, about unhappiness, about dwindling dreams. Mine have become small and selfish: no more saving a world which hardly seems to deserve it. Her’s barely exist: getting our son through college was all she could articulate.

The conversation lagged, and then, quietly, she said, “I don’t want to find women’s clothes that are not mine when I am packing for a trip.” And just like that, all the air went out of the room. Another silence descended, and after a while, I left for Home Depot to get materials for a bathroom remodel, and to decompress.

That evening as I sat working on something, she came and put her arms around my head, and mine went around her waist. No words. What could be said? Tomorrow I will gather my things from the spare bedroom and move them down to the basement workshop. The panties, which she has tolerated for a while, will stay in the dresser, but I will continue to honor an agreement not to be seen in them.

I don’t know why I tell you this. Many of you are too righteous or too childish to help me. I don’t care about morals or rights, or your cute dress, or your daring escapade. Right now my wife is upstairs pretending to sleep and I am down here pretending to work.

Unlike many of you, this is a new indulgence for me. I have been cross dressing for less than a year. I can survive and continue, but at what cost? A sweet and cherished pleasure is our shared lifetime of experiences, to look at each other and smile at a common remembrance. What will I pay for that look? What do I owe for that smile?

[DawnL]

Your marriage only needs to be precious to you and your wife. How "odd" others may deem it to be is not a major concern. I think you are being a little hard on the members of this forum as being "too righteous or too childish to help..." Everyone here, from my experience, is open to everyones feelings and situations. We understand that everyone's experience and situation is unique. We are always here to be a sounding board or to offer advise. I have never seen anyone too righteous or childish to listen and offer advise.
I was married for 31 years when I lost my wife. She was understanding but not necessarily supportive. She didn't mind my dressing and even made me an outfit but there was never a need to understand or to delve deeper into it. I have been blessed enought to find another woman that is understanding and tries to find out what she can and even help when she can. My point is that it is your marriage and your relationship. It is not good or bad it is just yours. It is sacred and should be protected. If that means that you have to keep your "stuff" downstairs then so be it. Maybe in time she will come to better understanding of it and be more accepting. It seems that she has other things going on in her life right now. Hang in there, don't judge us so hard and continue to be willing to sound off or ask for advice here. That is what a forum is for.

[AmberTG]

MAN, that's some Heavy thoughts! I really don't have any words of wisdom for you on this. I can, however, see just how difficult this is for you right now. Maybe you just need to find some common ground with your spouse, something that you have both enjoyed together in the past and try to bring some life back into your relationship. Hide your stuff in a place where she won't accidently find it. She probably won't go looking for it.
I wish you the best in getting through this.
Amber Darlene

[AllieSF]

Hang in there. I think you have made the correct decision. Only time will tell, and time normally heals too. Take it easy and do what you think best. We will still be here in the future, maybe a different mix of people, but probably a mix as similar as today. Good luck.

[Carin's Wife GG]

even though my SO and I have reached a very different arrangement that your own. my heart just breaks for both of you. Your love and respect for your wife is palpaple and that will see both of you through these troubled times.

With fondness,


Louise.

[RobertaFermina]

You found yourselves embracing each other, though not everything about each other. You are living up to your commitments as a husband.

I think you are a great gal, and a great guy, and you have a wife who wants to hold on to you.

I sense ache, and restlessness. Yours? or just what your story inspires in me?

Whether you find new dreams, or renewed life for your old dreams, I wish you serenity and happiness as rewards for your integrity and courage.

:rose: Roberta :rose:

[Carin]

I feel your anguish, conflict and confusion. You are looking for your space, her space and the bilateral space of the relationship - of 31 years. It seems from your words that you both have completed most of the (formidable) challenges of a relationship and raising family. The spark is still there but maybe not too many fires.

Yet you have found your own fire and you want to share that energy in the relationship.

Your wife has had a fire put out last year, and it still smolders. Her mother passing, then going to complete the details of closing up the house. Emotionally challenging in the best of circumstances. She may see live closing down around her. She may see your new interest as another part of her life closing down. The GG SOs here can attest to the challenges of dealing with crossdressing from their perspective.

I don't know you or your SO, but I do understand "A sweet and cherished pleasure is our shared lifetime of experiences, to look at each other and smile at a common remembrance." I'm sure you can still light her fire. You could plan a vacation, a cruise. Leave Elizabeth Ann behind. Do that for her. Enjoy Elizabeth Ann by your self for now. There is still newness to be found in the relationship. From there comes growth.
:2c:
When you stop living, you die.

[Carin's Wife GG]

I feel your anguish, conflict and confusion. You are looking for your space, her space and the bilateral space of the relationship - of 31 years. It seems from your words that you both have completed most of the (formidable) challenges of a relationship and raising family. The spark is still there but maybe not too many fires.

Yet you have found your own fire and you want to share that energy in the relationship.

Your wife has had a fire put out last year, and it still smolders. Her mother passing, then going to complete the details of closing up the house. Emotionally challenging in the best of circumstances. She may see live closing down around her. She may see your new interest as another part of her life closing down. The GG SOs here can attest to the challenges of dealing with crossdressing from their perspective.

I don't know you or your SO, but I do understand "A sweet and cherished pleasure is our shared lifetime of experiences, to look at each other and smile at a common remembrance." I'm sure you can still light her fire. You could plan a vacation, a cruise. Leave Elizabeth Ann behind. Do that for her. Enjoy Elizabeth Ann by your self for now. There is still newness to be found in the relationship. From there comes growth.
:2c:
When you stop living, you die.

you need to let her know that she is an intregral part of your life. She is special and will always be so.



Louise.

[Elizabeth Ann]

I want to apologize for my harsh remarks about members of this forum. It was very judgemental for someone who claims not to be judgemental. I was in pain, and you were my only safe target.

[Tamara Croft]

The conversation lagged, and then, quietly, she said, “I don’t want to find women’s clothes that are not mine when I am packing for a trip.” And just like that, all the air went out of the room. Another silence descended, and after a while, I left for Home Depot to get materials for a bathroom remodel, and to decompress.

That evening as I sat working on something, she came and put her arms around my head, and mine went around her waist. No words. What could be said? I've highlighted a couple of sentences that I feel are important. Your wife has said she doesn't want to see you packing womens clothing, but later on in the evening, when you both had ample time to discuss it, no words could be said.

Can I ask why you feel no words could be said? Nothing is ever resolved with silence, it just pushes you further and further away from each other. You say she tollerated you wearing the panties, have you ever sat down and dicussed crossdressing with your wife? I ask, because you say you've only been doing this for a year... Did you start cd'ing for a reason? did you discuss it with your wife? did you give her any websites or information about it? or did this all evolve with no words? Do you talk to each other about anything? or is it just silent all the time?

I'm sorry for all the questions, but I'm just confused on what advice to give you. I mean, if you don't talk to each other, how will anything ever be resolved? You give the impression that you don't talk at all!?!

[melissacd]

This is a very poignant post. It echoed many of the things that have happened in my past when I tried to deny who I was, when I tried to be whom she wanted me to be. It is a sad and lonely life. In as much as I wished I could be otherwise, I am who I am and she is who she is and all the history and all of the love cannot change that. In the end I could not not be me and she could not accept that version of me. We agreed to end it.

We still have the history, we still have the memories, we still have the children. None of that is lost, but now there is renewed hope for a more enriching life for both of us, just not with each other. Perhaps sometimes that is just the way that it has to be.

When I look at the way things are now, they are still reasonably friendly. Had we tried to continue, the pain of our polarized positions would poison and destroy what can still be a good friendship. I recognize that sometimes the best answer, for some of us, is to leave.

I really feel for what you are going through, I empathize and wish you well on your journey.

Huggs
Melissa

[rpservices1]

my wife passed away just a few weeks ago she hated my crossdressing and now I only wish that I had the since to have given it up

[Angie G]

I can see you love your wife as il should be and thats a goog thing :hugs:
Angie

[Eva Diva]

I want to apologize for my harsh remarks about members of this forum. It was very judgemental for someone who claims not to be judgemental. I was in pain, and you were my only safe target.



Well now, there we go. There are two basic ways to look at these things. The first, and more common in our society: Something came over you, you weren't being yourself, aliens kidnapped you, temporary insanity, low self-esteem, ADHD, alcoholism, split personality, the cat ate your homework.... and now you've apologized, so it's all over. My personal take? The truth came out. And now you want to pretend it didn't happen.
How often have you seen this - someone says, "I didn't mean it, I was drunk"? Of course, the truth is that being drunk doesn't make you say things you wouldn't otherwise say. Being drunk makes you say the things that you usually hold in. It is precisely when you are under stress that you tell the truth. And in this case, the truth came out the first time, for all to see.

Apology not accepted. You spoke from the heart the first time.

[Kate Simmons]

I want to apologize for my harsh remarks about members of this forum. It was very judgemental for someone who claims not to be judgemental. I was in pain, and you were my only safe target.No apology necessary, EA, at least to me. Real friends take the "good" along with the "bad" and realize when a person is hurting. You became my friend when you joined the Forum and it took courage to do that. You have to get the feelings out, otherwise you suffer in silence. I often mention the cost of doing this in terms of time, resources, energy and emotionally. What are we trying to accomplish? What are we trying to gain? Is all of this worth whatever little satisfaction we derrive from it? What is the cost to our loved ones? In retrospect, if I knew what this would do to my marriage and my family, I would never have done it, despite the cost to myself and despite my own needs. It's done, now, however, and no amount of regret is going to fix it. Even if we got back together, it would never be the same and she would never trust me fully. I have to live with that but don't let it dominate my thinking. Life goes on in spite of any of us and we all have to make our own choices. I always respect my friends' choices as that is their freedom and their privelage. They are always my friends, nonetheless.:hugs: Sal

[Elizabeth Ann]

I've highlighted a couple of sentences that I feel are important. Your wife has said she doesn't want to see you packing womens clothing, but later on in the evening, when you both had ample time to discuss it, no words could be said.

Can I ask why you feel no words could be said? Nothing is ever resolved with silence, it just pushes you further and further away from each other. You say she tollerated you wearing the panties, have you ever sat down and dicussed crossdressing with your wife? I ask, because you say you've only been doing this for a year... Did you start cd'ing for a reason? did you discuss it with your wife? did you give her any websites or information about it? or did this all evolve with no words? Do you talk to each other about anything? or is it just silent all the time?

I'm sorry for all the questions, but I'm just confused on what advice to give you. I mean, if you don't talk to each other, how will anything ever be resolved? You give the impression that you don't talk at all!?!


Of course I talk, and we did. I didn't give you a transcript of the hours because it wouldn't have been very useful. I have often heard that most communication is non verbal, and the touch, the almost indecernable tear, the soft and tentative kiss were our means of communication yesterday. It was pure emotion. The thoughts, and the words, will come later.

Both my wife and I are in the habit of thinking carefully before speaking, a practice I regret breaking when I went on line last night. I don't think I am asking for advice. Thanks, anyway.

[Elizabeth Ann]

Well now, there we go. There are two basic ways to look at these things. The first, and more common in our society: Something came over you, you weren't being yourself, aliens kidnapped you, temporary insanity, low self-esteem, ADHD, alcoholism, split personality, the cat ate your homework.... and now you've apologized, so it's all over. My personal take? The truth came out. And now you want to pretend it didn't happen.
How often have you seen this - someone says, "I didn't mean it, I was drunk"? Of course, the truth is that being drunk doesn't make you say things you wouldn't otherwise say. Being drunk makes you say the things that you usually hold in. It is precisely when you are under stress that you tell the truth. And in this case, the truth came out the first time, for all to see.

Apology not accepted. You spoke from the heart the first time.

I never said it wasn't true. But truth is no excuse for rudeness. It is a bit like being gracious and generous when an apology is offered.

[Valerie Nicole]

I am young, and inexperienced. I've only ever had one relationship in my whole life. I don't consider myself qualified to offer any advice on this matter. I'll just tell you that I'm sorry for things how are going now, and I sincerely hope that everything works out for you. :hugs:

[Tamara Croft]

Well now, there we go. There are two basic ways to look at these things. The first, and more common in our society: Something came over you, you weren't being yourself, aliens kidnapped you, temporary insanity, low self-esteem, ADHD, alcoholism, split personality, the cat ate your homework.... and now you've apologized, so it's all over. My personal take? The truth came out. And now you want to pretend it didn't happen.
How often have you seen this - someone says, "I didn't mean it, I was drunk"? Of course, the truth is that being drunk doesn't make you say things you wouldn't otherwise say. Being drunk makes you say the things that you usually hold in. It is precisely when you are under stress that you tell the truth. And in this case, the truth came out the first time, for all to see.

Apology not accepted. You spoke from the heart the first time.Don't be so mean :Angry3: Often a person will lash out when they are hurting, I've done it so many times on this forum and it's been a cry for help. I hope members aren't so mean to you when and if you ever need help :thumbsdn:

Nasty :mad:

---------------------------------------------------------------
---------------------------------------------------------------

Elizabeth, if you don't need any advice, that's ok too, just know that we are here if you need to talk. And hey, if you need to yell, scream or shout, you can PM me anytime :hugs:

[Elizabeth Ann]

Elizabeth, if you don't need any advice, that's ok too, just know that we are here if you need to talk. And hey, if you need to yell, scream or shout, you can PM me anytime :hugs:

Tamara,

Thanks. I knew that renowned GG empathy would kick in. I don't really know what I need, other than an antidote to the pain in my wife's eyes.

What I really need is in about a week, when I go to Florida to help bring a sailboat up the East Coast. For me, there is nothing that puts the universe in perspective like a starry night at sea in a small boat.

I know that sounds cold and distant, but we have always thought our marriage was strongest when was two individuals. In our marriage program, we quoted Kahlil Gibran:

But let there be spaces in your togetherness,
And let the winds of the heavens dance between you.
Love one another but make not a bond of love:
Let it rather be a moving sea between the shores of your souls.
Fill each other's cup but drink not from one cup.
Give one another of your bread but eat not from the same loaf.
Sing and dance together and be joyous, but let each one of you be alone,
Even as the strings of a lute are alone though they quiver with the same music.
Give your hearts, but not into each other's keeping.
For only the hand of Life can contain your hearts.
And stand together, yet not too near together:
For the pillars of the temple stand apart,
And the oak tree and the cypress grow not in each other's shadow.

Elizabeth

[paulap]

Personally, I believe you have identified the right priorities for your life. While dressing may be an aspect that you crave to gain some attention or personal gratification, it clearly should not be consumed at the expense of your marriage. Your wife needs you in the way she needs you. There is no substitute and the unwanted diversions cannot be helpful now. I would support wholeheartedly your decision to do what you must to reconnect with your wife on whatever level she is at right now. If you love and cherish her, which is apparent to me, you will do what is best. Best of luck to you:thumbsup: .

[susiej]

EA,

Your wife just lost her mother. Grief, according to the wizards who are supposed to understand this stuff, takes a year or more to work through, and goes through a bunch of different phases. What phase is she in right now -- denial, anger? if you don't know, then you're not working hard enough.

My suggestion is, be what she needs right now, rather than what you need or want. Her lover. Her friend. Her brother. Or, if you must, her sister :). But empathize with her for a while, because she's going through the pain of losing a parent.

This will benefit you in two ways. One, you'll earn immense karma, because it's the right thing to do, no matter what. Two, she'll see you as caring and empathetic, which are not only good things, but also typically associated with girlfriend things :).

Don't forget what's truly important.

Hugs,
Susie

[Tree GG]

EA,

Your wife just lost her mother. Grief, according to the wizards who are supposed to understand this stuff, takes a year or more to work through, and goes through a bunch of different phases. What phase is she in right now -- denial, anger? if you don't know, then you're not working hard enough.

My suggestion is, be what she needs right now, rather than what you need or want. Her lover. Her friend. Her brother. Or, if you must, her sister :). But empathize with her for a while, because she's going through the pain of losing a parent.

This will benefit you in two ways. One, you'll earn immense karma, because it's the right thing to do, no matter what. Two, she'll see you as caring and empathetic, which are not only good things, but also typically associated with girlfriend things :).

Don't forget what's truly important.

Hugs,
Susie

:iagree: I've lost a brother (unexpectedly) Nov 2005 & a father Nov 2006. Found out about his CDing interest in the middle somewhere. I'm not sure I'm on track with that 1 yr time table but coping as best I can. Some days she may just need to feel sad. IMO the best thing to do on those days, is give her that non-verbal hug and patient cuddle until the saddness eases up. Maintaining your individualism is good, but sometimes your partner's needs don't coincide with sch'd individual time. She is now "the last man standing" as far as the family of her childhood is concerned. When you're having to re-define your world, it's nice to know who wants to be in the new definition and what role they will play.

[Daintre]

Elizabeth Ann, I have read with interest, your posts, and as you say, you really are not looking for help, just a relief valve at that time. I can only speak for myself, and I have written here and expressed myself in an angry way. As Tamara said, when you are hurt, it can come out as anger.

I will not offer advice to you, but just let you know, if you want someone to talk to for any reason, please PM me anytime.

[Diana West]

You're doing exactly the right thing for the right reason.

[Michelle 51]

Elizabeth A marriage is always moving.It's evolving all the time.Hopefully it's alway's positve and after 26 year's your's is one of the lucky one's.The fact that you can keep the panties tell's me she hasn't closed the book on it but is probaly still confused after all these year's that this thing has come up from nowhere.I would just coast along with the panty thing and see if thing's change.It took my wife 10 year's to get from pantie's to me wearing a skirt in front of her and i still wouldn't dress in a wig or heel's in front of her and may never get there.For what's it's worth that's my 2 cent's Good luck juatabit

[Stephenie S]

Dear Elizabeth,

I, for one, was not offended by your first post. I would guess that not that many others on this forum were either. No apologies needed, hon.

I do think you need to make room for more verbal communication. While non-verbal communication can convey real warmth and support, sometimes we need the specifics of direct speech.

Are you ABSOLUTELY sure that your wife knows you are not gay? Or having an affair with another woman? Or planning a sex change? Her quote, "I don't want to find women's clothes that are not mine when I am packing.", leaves many asumptions unsaid. This is a difficult time for her and she may be hurting for some real support. I wish I could offer more.

MHO

Lovies,
Stephenie

[JulieC]

my wife passed away just a few weeks ago she hated my crossdressing and now I only wish that I had the since to have given it up

I'm sorry for your loss :(

I'm sensing something in your post that I hope is not the case. I would not attach any aspect of your crossdressing to guilt over whatever the nature of your relationship with your wife was. You can not change it now. It just was. You did the best you could, both of you, with the tools at your disposal. There are few, if any, perfect answers.

[JulieC]

Tamara,

Thanks. I knew that renowned GG empathy would kick in. I don't really know what I need, other than an antidote to the pain in my wife's eyes.

What I really need is in about a week, when I go to Florida to help bring a sailboat up the East Coast. For me, there is nothing that puts the universe in perspective like a starry night at sea in a small boat.

I know that sounds cold and distant, but we have always thought our marriage was strongest when was two individuals. In our marriage program, we quoted Kahlil Gibran:

Gibran can be potent, thought provoking stuff.

So can a star-lit night at sea. Been there, done both.

You're on a journey. Even if you're expected to die in six months, you are still on the journey. You can choose to engage your wife on that journey, or exclude her from that journey.

My wife is supportive. She's not as supportive as I would like (few of us can say our wives are as supportive as we'd like). I find myself angry at times, wanting to push to make space for myself, wanting to build little walls to craft out some space for all of me. But, the struggle isn't with her. It's with me. I have fought myself very strongly over building walls between us. We always could talk about anything, and still can.

Sometimes, people in a long duration relationship are unwilling to give up that relationship simply because there's 30, 40, 50 years under the bridge. They can't imagine giving it all up. What they would have been happy to turn their backs on after year one they now find themselves feeling they have to accept it. I can readily imagine this generating a situation where they are very sad, but don't want to talk about it because they don't see any other option.

Reminds me of a scene in a movie where a man secrets a sip of whiskey from a flask hidden in a bookcase. His wife is fully wise to what he is doing. They both know the little game being played, and both are saddened by it, yet both lack the energy/willpower to do anything to make it different.

Take the time on your journey to sit up on deck and reflect on everything that's been and everything that will be. Being immersed in the immensity of God's creation is often very therapeutic. Fair winds and following seas for your journey (both on water and in your relationship).

-BB

[Stephenie S]

I know it's just a saying, but "following seas" are actually quite uncomfortable in a small boat at sea. Fair winds, now that's something we can all wish for.

Steph

[JulieC]

I know it's just a saying, but "following seas" are actually quite uncomfortable in a small boat at sea. Fair winds, now that's something we can all wish for.

Steph

That depends on where it's quartering, the speed with which it is doing so, and on where the wind is :)

Also, I kinda meant a double entendre with the fair winds, following seas bit.

[Elizabeth Ann]

What a marvelous group this is, generous and insightful. Many of your comments have that vague familiarity that comes from talking to someone who has been down the same path.

Our home is quiet now, but I do not think the storm is passed. Rather, we are setting in the eye of it. Soon, I think, she will ask the question that brought me to this very forum: why?

This thread seems to have run its course, but I intend to enlist your help in exploring the question of why we do this. I know there are many here who will reject this question as unknowable or irrelevant, but I know there must be a few here who will struggle with me to find whatever answers there may be.

I have read enough in this forum to see some systematic patterns in cross dressing evolution and behavior, which makes the "why" both knowable and relevant. I'll soon start a thread to explore this. If you are my future history, I need your help.

Elizabeth

[linnea]

Unlike many of you, this is a new indulgence for me. I have been cross dressing for less than a year. I can survive and continue, but at what cost? A sweet and cherished pleasure is our shared lifetime of experiences, to look at each other and smile at a common remembrance. What will I pay for that look? What do I owe for that smile?

Elizabeth Ann, I too am wondering why you're writing your lament. If it is too vent your frustrations and other feelings, you've done well. If it is rationalize a decision to hold your wife and your marriage above all else, including your newly found crossdressing indulgence, you've written well. Since you have dismissed most of us as too righteous and childish to help, I doubt that anything we can say will influence you. But I don't think that you want advice. I think that you might want the support of empathetic sisters. You probably have won that (I think that many of us have carefully and frequently weighed the costs and the debts incurred by our crossdressing).
And many of us, like you, cherish the sweet pleasures of lifetimes shared with a loved one.
All that I can do is to read your words, feel a deep sense of the gravity that pulls at you and others like you, and tell you, with a gentle look and nod of my head, that I understand.

[Elizabeth Ann]

Dear Linnea,

Ouch! You and many of the others have a very uncomfortable ability to "read" me, to use the language of cross dressing. No "passing" here.

I suppose this forum is my version of thinking aloud. When you are in the closet, you can't pull a trusted few in and brainstorm, so I turned to you. But right off the bat, I violated the first rule of brainstorming, and that faux pas has haunted me since.

I started writing a long apologetic, but decided it best to save for another time. Instead, just let me say that over the years I have abandoned most concepts of right and wrong, immutable rules, God given rights, or social mores that take on the cloak of morality. The universe is not good or evil. At most it is indifferent. It is wrong for me to demean anyone’s sense of right and wrong in cross dressing, including absolute dictums about honesty, but the honest truth is that they have little appeal to me.

“Childish” was a very ill chosen word. I am still completely baffled by my attraction to cross dressing. I take pleasure in the clothes, but as I said in another recent thread, I don’t feel particularly feminine in them. I don’t know what I am doing, but I don’t feel like I am finding the woman within me. Thus, much of the discussion about lipstick and nail polish and how to sit like a woman, etc. seems alien to me, but to characterize is as childish was unfair of me. That said, my wife, upon viewing my selection of panties, pronounced them “something an eighth grader would wear.” Not practical like hers.

Anyway, yes I do want your empathy. I want your thoughts. I want your pointing out my nutty statements and confirming those you agree with. I want an accepting and supporting social group, and I will try harder in the future to be more respectful of you all.

Elizabeth

[Sheri 4242]

I've highlighted a couple of sentences that I feel are important . . . I'm sorry for all the questions, but I'm just confused on what advice to give you. I mean, if you don't talk to each other, how will anything ever be resolved? You give the impression that you don't talk at all!?!

I think Tamara GG has hit on somethig important when she asked questions designed to elicit more information. Without the "larger picture" that more details would have provided, it would be quite impossible to not be confused regarding what advice or personal insights we each might add. We'd be


In the main, you don't need to appologize for what is being termed as your "harsh comments." EVERYBODY needs to just ramble, and/or vent, and/or rant every now and then -- and do so without nesessarily requiring others to add their two cents. Sometimes it is imortant for a person to just articulate what's on their mind. This forum can certainly serve as such a sounding board when necessary! It is sort of like the person who has significant issues with another -- and sometimes a counselor will tell them to write the person a letter, but to not mail it, but rather bring it to the next counseling session. Often when you do this, you'll find that, when the circumstances are right, the counselor will tell such a person to not mail the letter -- that the goal of the exercise was met simply by writing your feelings out.

Frankly, I don't think you intended to insult any of us -- at least I didn't think that such was your intention; I simply thoght you were simply saying you needed to write out what is going on. Doing so certainly is an initial step in the process of critical and/or analytical thinking.

Here's hoping for the best for you and your wife! Give her support, time, and patience!!!!

Barbara

[Shelly Preston]

Hi Elizabeth

We allhave days when our thought when put into words dont come out quite right
We are all different and needs different things from this forum and occasionally people get upset sometimes.
The vast majority know mistakes get made and are willing to help as they recognise a cry for help.
You and your wife still have a lot of talking to do.
I hope we can provide the answers to help you marriage.

[Along4TheRide GG]

As a GG, my heart goes out to you.

You mentioned that the CD experience is new to you. It has to be very difficult to finally gather the strength to make yourself vulnerable, only to be rejected shortly thereafter.

Is there a possibility that in processing that pain, you may have overlooked something you may have noticed before? You said she was packing to go close her mother's place... That sounds like it may be a highly emotional project also. Maybe she was just dealing with all she could handle at the time.....

There is a distinct possibility that she was not rejecting you, but needed you, her husband. Something she could count on while maybe just needing a soft place to fall. After so many years together, your relationship is changing.

This is big change for both of you. You may need to step back for a minute, take a breath, and just tread softly until you reach a point where you are comfortable and healing from this wound.

That's the time to take another look at the whole picture. When you are not dealing from a place of hurt, but from a place of heart.

I truly hope you can find a way to connect again and support, share, and strengthen your relationship.

Until then, I hope this forum provides some comfort for you. Everybody needs a soft place to fall.

[JulieC]

This thread seems to have run its course, but I intend to enlist your help in exploring the question of why we do this. I know there are many here who will reject this question as unknowable or irrelevant, but I know there must be a few here who will struggle with me to find whatever answers there may be.

It is indeed a question that has puzzled me many times. I eventually learned to step past the question. Asking why I crossdress is similar to asking why I am right handed, or why when I type "from" I often find myself typing "form". There are mysteries within my brain that I'll never understand. There might be value in understanding "why", but getting to "why" is very likely impossible.

Even if you were able to get to "why", you might find yourself with a less than satisfactory answer. Is the answer biased? Am I really certain that's why or are there other aspects to consider that contribute to the why?

In the end, I found pursing "why" didn't contribute to happiness.

-BB