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CaptLex
05-31-2007, 02:17 PM
Today I received an e-mail about a new movie, The Gendercator, that will be shown here this coming weekend, which many find to be transphobic. The movie was pulled from a similar film festival in San Francisco and will be protested here when it opens. I was just wondering what you ladies and gents (and undecided) think about the subject matter or film's message.

Here's some info about the film from the director's (Catherine Crouch) webpage:

The Gendercator

The Gendercator is a short satirical take on female body modification and gender. The story uses the “Rip van Winkle” model to extrapolate from the past into a possible future.

In 1973 a group of hippie women are celebrating Billie Jean King’s victory over Bobby Riggs. They are partying in the rural woods outside of Bloomington, Indiana. Our heroine Sally is a simple minded, sporty type who overindulges at the party and passes out under a tree. Sally wakes up 75 years later in 2048 to discover (amongst other social changes) that feminism has failed utterly and completely. Sex roles and gender expression are rigidly binary and enforced by law and social custom. When Sally rejects the feminine hairdo and short skirt she is given, the doctor at the emergency room calls in the “Gendercator”, a government official who informs Sally that butch women and sissy boys are no longer tolerated – gender variants are allowed to chose their gender, but they must chose one and follow its rigid constraints.

Sally is baffled by this brave new world. All she wants is to “do her own thing” – but her own thing is no more. Sally is a simple-minded stoner, indoctrinated into 70s feminism. She is no poster girl or freedom fighter, just a gentle tomboy dropped into the future with a tendency to respond in slogans such as “sisterhood is powerful”.

Nurse Nancy locates some of Sally’s former friends – they are 100 now, but because of advances in the medical profession (cloning spare parts), they are still healthy and thriving. The friends tell Sally they heard she moved to California and that’s why they never looked for her. One of her friends appears to be a man and tells Sally, “They made me do it. They’ll make you too.” They explain to Sally that in the early 2000s the evangelical Christians took over the government and legislated their strict family values, legally sanctioning only “one man, one woman” couples. Advances in sex reassignment surgery have made it possible to honor an individual’s choice of gender AND government policy. Sally is comfortable in the middle of the genders, an unacceptable choice in 2048.

Director’s Note

Things are getting very strange for women these days. More and more often we see young heterosexual women carving their bodies into porno Barbie dolls and lesbian women altering themselves into transmen. Our distorted cultural norms are making women feel compelled to use medical advances to change themselves, instead of working to change the world. This is one story, showing one possible scary future. I am hopeful that this story will foster discussion about female body modification and medical ethics.

And here's an article on the controversy surrounding the film and it being pulled from the film festival in San Francisco:

Frameline yanks film

Published 05/24/2007
by Matthew S. Bajko
m.bajko@ebar.com

Executives at Frameline, San Francisco's LGBT film festival, made the unprecedented decision this week to yank a film from this year's schedule due to community outrage after the movie had already been accepted into the lineup.

The brouhaha over the 15-minute short, The Gendercator by acclaimed lesbian filmmaker Catherine Crouch, erupted last Thursday, May 17 after members of the city's transgender community accused the film and Crouch of being transphobic and asked the film festival to pull the movie.

Crouch refutes such claims against her and her film, which she describes as "a short satirical take on female body modification and gender." But within four days more than 130 people had signed on to a petition denouncing the film and Frameline's decision to screen it.

Caught off guard by the controversy, Frameline management scrambled over the weekend to determine how to address the film's critics. The festival had already planned to roll out the lineup for this year's two-week-long celebration of queer cinema on the morning of Tuesday, May 22.
By late Monday, Frameline staff, after talking to transgender community leaders and festival board members, opted not to screen the film and to issue an apology to the community, which they announced several hours after the Tuesday news conference.

"We are sorry this film was programmed," Jennifer Morris, Frameline's director of programming, told the Bay Area Reporter in a phone interview Tuesday. "We made a mistake in programming this film and judging how it would affect the transgender community."

Frameline Artistic Director Michael Lumpkin said he could not recall another film being pulled due to concerns about its content in the 31-year history of the festival.

"It was an extremely difficult decision," said Lumpkin, who did not screen the short film himself until after it had been selected.

Crouch said she was "very disappointed in Frameline" and felt the removal of her film from the schedule "is a bad decision that will reflect poorly on them."
"It is a short-term solution, but I know they are in a difficult place," said Crouch, who lives in Indianapolis. "They accepted the film on its merits but it did not match their community's standards, apparently."

According to a write-up on Crouch's Web site, her film is a science fiction story about a lesbian who falls asleep in the 1970s then wakes up in the future to find "a brave new world" where "butch women and sissy boys are no longer tolerated – gender variants are allowed to chose their gender, but they must chose one and follow its rigid constraints."

In a director's note published on her Web site, Crouch wrote that "Things are getting very strange for women these days. More and more often we see young heterosexual women carving their bodies into porno Barbie dolls and lesbian women altering themselves into transmen. Our distorted cultural norms are making women feel compelled to use medical advances to change themselves, instead of working to change the world. This is one story, showing one possible scary future. I am hopeful that this story will foster discussion about female body modification and medical ethics."

Crouch does not hide the fact that she suffers anxiety over seeing fellow butch or tomboy lesbians opt to transition into transmen and undergo reconstructive surgery.

"My anxiety is about the amount of women I see transitioning into men and how fast it seems to be happening. I wonder about this sudden escalation. They are women, or they were women, and now they are not," said Crouch. "They seem like me, so I am not understanding what is the difference between them and me."

She told the B.A.R. that she always knew her movie "would be a flash point" but didn't expect such condemnation of her or her film.
"If this film is a flashpoint between lesbians and trans people, shouldn't it happen at Frameline? Shouldn't it happen in San Francisco?" asked Crouch. "This is one way to do away with gay people totally in the future if the politics of the world go the way I describe it in the film."
San Francisco filmmaker Mary Guzm n, a friend of Crouch's, provided a copy of the film to the B.A.R. after Frameline declined to make its copy available. In an interview Guzm n, a butch Latina lesbian, said she did not consider the film transphobic.

She said it is a science fiction movie and feels it is a mistake for Frameline not to show it. "What is concerning me about all of this is we are not allowed to have a conversation. Either you accept it or your film gets shanked from the film festival," said Guzm n, whose own film Mechanics Daydream is to be shown at Frameline. "They should screen the film. Where is all this fear coming from? So nobody gets to talk? This is a perfect opportunity to have a conversation."

Crouch is mystified at how her film has been pegged as a trans or anti-trans film when she set out to make a film that would speak to lesbians about an issue she said is gaining more attention within lesbian circles.

"I thought I was making a film for women and that they would talk about what is happening in our community," she said. "It speaks to people looking at you, deciding what you are and deciding what you should be and how you can be fixed."

Yet a statement released by Lumpkin said that "given the nature of the film, the director's comments, and the strong community reaction to both, it is clear that this film cannot be used to create a positive and meaningful dialogue within our festival."

Transgender scholar and filmmaker Susan Stryker, a former member of Frameline's board, agreed. After watching a copy of the film this week, Stryker said it would have been inappropriate for Frameline to screen Crouch's movie.

"After watching the film and hearing the director's comments, I do feel like it is a classically transphobic film. It repeats all of these stereotypes that have been kicking around for 40 years now," said Stryker, who also corresponded with Crouch via e-mail after learning about the controversy. "It is basically the same stereotypes of trans people articulated in The Transsexual Empire by Janice Raymond in 1979 that said transsexuals are in collusion with politically reactionary forces."

The film, like Raymond's book, is based on this notion that "it is an anti-feminist, anti-queer thing transsexuals are doing," said Stryker.
Jules Rosskam, a queer filmmaker who is trans, saw the film at a screening in Chicago earlier this month and found it appalling.

"I think the film is created based on a na vet or ignorance around what the real issues are or struggles are for trans people," he said. "I find it dangerous because it feeds into people's ignorance and misconceptions of the trans community."

After meeting Crouch at the Chicago screening, Rosskam said he doesn't believe she is being truthful about wanting to spark a discussion.
"I think she is disguising a vehemently anti-trans film by saying it is starting a dialogue when at best it is a personal vendetta by her against the trans community," said Rosskam. "She was honest about the fact it was her own paranoia about a world where evangelicals and the trannies can get together and create a world where everyone had to choose male or female and that was in some way a backhanded way of erasing gay people. She really believes the evangelicals and the trannies could actually come together as a political movement, which is unbelievably ironic to me."

Rosskam said he is astounded that LGBT film festivals in New York, Los Angeles, San Francisco and Miami, where it premiered earlier this month, have accepted Crouch's film. But he is also apprehensive of asking the festivals to censor another filmmaker's work.

"To be honest with you it is beyond my comprehension," he said. "On one hand I want to demand film festivals not show this work, on the other hand morally or ethically I feel trepidatious participating in censorship."
He added, "One does wonder how the film got past the screening committees."
Stryker, whose film Screaming Queens: The Riot At Compton's Cafeteria not only received funding from but also is being distributed by Frameline, nonetheless questioned the festival's commitment and understanding of the transgender community.

"Frameline has actually tried over the years to be trans-inclusive. I don't think it has always gotten it, it's been more of a liberal accommodationism," she said. "As an organization Frameline still imagines gay and lesbian as the center of what it is they are doing and that intersex or trans or kink or fetish or whatever initials are in the queer alphabet soup are add-ons to the central focus."

That lack of institutional culture around trans issues, said Stryker, is evident in the decision to accept Crouch's film. "In this instance trans and other people I have talked to who are upset about the Gendercator film there is this kind of shock. How can you not see this film as deeply offensive to trans people? Don't you know these are the stereotypes that have been hurled at trans people?" she said.

Lumpkin disagreed with such characterizations of the festival. In their statement, Frameline staff said they are "deeply committed to promoting the work of transgender filmmakers and films about transgender issues."
They pointed out that Frameline Distribution distributes over 20 transgender themed films and over one third of its free monthly Frameline at the Center screenings have been transgender themed.

Through the Frameline Completion Fund, the organization has also given funding to the films The Brandon Teena Story, Southern Comfort, A Boy Named Sue, By Hook Or By Crook, Red Without Blue, The Believers, Cruel & Unusual, F. Scott Fitzgerald Slept Here, and Maggots And Men.
Rabbi Levi Alter, president of Female-to-Male International, is also quoted in the statement as saying that his organization has "enjoyed our association with Frameline and welcome their timely and community-minded response to the concern we expressed on this issue."

Yet there are no transgender members on Frameline's board and only two people on the selection committee are from the transgender community. Morris could not say if either of them had raised objections to Crouch's film.
She did say Frameline is committed to including more of the trans community in its selection process and organizational leadership.

"If anything comes of this, all of us in the LGBT community need to be greater aware of issues that affect the transgender community," said Morris.
But Crouch, who was set to fly in for Frameline, wonders how that can happen if films like her's are censored. She said Frameline's decision means the audience loses the chance to have a conversation in San Francisco.
"We will have the conversations in other cities," she said.

I don't think I can make a completely informed decision about this unless I see the movie, but it sounds to me like the director got it wrong: I don't think transitioning is about conforming - especially not to evangelical Christians (I wonder if they'll be protesting the film too). But just 'cause she doesn't get it, that doesn't mean the director is transphobic, necessarily. I'm against censorship, but I can see why people want to protest this - some people will undoubtedly walk away from a movie like this with a completely false idea that will not do us (especially transmen) any favors and can set us back in fostering understanding and acceptance with the already-confused masses.

Opinions, please?

TV Wannabe
05-31-2007, 02:28 PM
I appreciate the work that lesbians have done for our cause but I can't pass judgement until I see this, I also wonder if she thought about whether or not that those tomboy lesbians wanted to transition in the first place, rather than forced to do so by society.

Felix
05-31-2007, 02:37 PM
Wow!!!! I feel to comment I too would have to see the film but from what I've read above it does seem a tad or even more than that trans phobic so I can understand why people are reacting this way!!!! xx Felix :hugs:

ZenFrost
05-31-2007, 02:55 PM
I'm really against censorship but this film sounds rather misinforming. If it helps spread misinformation (like it sounds like it does) than I'd agree that it shouldn't be shown, but since I haven't seen it myself I can't say anything for certain.

Cai
05-31-2007, 03:19 PM
I mostly have a problem with the director's point of view.

"My anxiety is about the amount of women I see transitioning into men and how fast it seems to be happening. I wonder about this sudden escalation. They are women, or they were women, and now they are not," said Crouch. "They seem like me, so I am not understanding what is the difference between them and me."
It sounds like she hasn't put a lot of effort into understanding transgendered people. The answer to her question is that even though the transguys may seem like butch lesbians, they aren't. They're guys. The increasing number of transguys she refers to (if the numbers are actually increasing, I don't know) are probably due to people becoming more accepting of TG people and more transguys realizing who they really are.

The film seems to spread the idea that transguys and butch lesbians are the same thing, and that all transguys want to be with women. The director seems to hold the opinion (and spread it in her movie) that transguys only become guys in order to be with women.

Kate Simmons
05-31-2007, 03:44 PM
Science fiction? I guess. It seems to take place in a fictional future world where people have given up their freedom of individuality and sense of self in favor of conformity and acceptance(by religion, no less:rolleyes:), either willingly or unwillingly as a premise. This is fictional indeed and will never happen(at least not as long as I live). Sounds like a Borg mentality to me:"You will comply, resistense is futile, freedom is irrelevent, individuality is irrelevent, yadda, yadda." Just looking at the whole idea, I'm thinking:"If it ain't broke, why attempt to fix it?" Most of us are capable of making informed life decisions and are not easily swept along by floods of thinking by the masses. We know what we have to do to be ourselves, it's an individual thing. My thinking, maybe but from what I've seen here, the members of this Forum are certainly not dummies and if this were a race, I'd bet on you folks each and every time.:happy:

happyfish
05-31-2007, 05:38 PM
Yeah, I've heard about this from the _ftm_ community on livejournal. Even though I know I should perhaps watch the film to get a better idea about what its saying exactly, I really don't want to. The more I read about this film the less I want to do with it. The director may or may not be transphobic, but I think she's still completely missed the point, and any so-called 'conversation' that could be stirred up about this would probably not be the mind-opening, intelligent conversation that a film festival like Frameline would want to support. The entire concept of the film seems so utterly ridiculous anyway. How could she honestly believe that society could evolve into something like that?
I also get kind of ticked when people put me in the same category as butch lesbians. I am not. a. butch. lesbian. Get over it. :Angry3:

Tristan
05-31-2007, 09:35 PM
I can't really say too much without having seen the actual movie either. Although I can see how the plot line has the potential to be offensive. From what I've read with straight transmen who come out as trans in a lesbian community it can be rather rough on them. However, I think her perception may be a little out of whack. I can see how it's easy for straight transmen to identify in the lesbian community before they realize that they are transgendered.

Sharon
05-31-2007, 10:19 PM
She appears to just be one more person who thinks that being trans is a choice.

jsoto81
05-31-2007, 10:57 PM
the story sound okay to me until I read the comment about to many lesbian women becoming transmen.

I have never considered my self a lesbian. In my mind I am completely straight and I don't like the way she portrayed me in the comment. But I'm not sure if that is a view that will come across in the movie, or if it's just something that she spured out. She, above all, should know that this is not a choice, just like being gay/lesbian/bi/ or anything in between is not a choice.

RevMoonSerpent
05-31-2007, 11:34 PM
I agree with what Cai was saying about not putting in the effort to understand transpeople and about the increase in numbers of transmen discovering who they are.
This makes me think about a scene I remember from an episode of The L Word where it generalized that lesbians are tired of seeing so many of their butch members transition and give up their woman hood.
People don't realize that an FtM is not a lesbian. Take a look at our FtM community here. I remember a year ago when I first joined we hardly had anyone in our section but, the longer I've been the more our numbers have grown and I think it's just a matter of there not being enough information out there about female to male transition.
In the beginning most of us guys needed a place to go where they could feel like they belonged and the lesbian community was the only thing out there at the time. Now that female to male transition is out in the media, more of our guys can actually look and think that's me and I now know where I really belong.
People just need to see transitioning for what it is and stop trying to look at it as if it's an attack on any one section of the community. Just like with outsiders hate against gay marriage, it shouldn't matter to them it's not like those narrow minded people are being invited to the wedding or the marriage bed and transmen are not telling lesbians they need to transition. I'm going to stop here before I go crazy.

Laurie909
06-01-2007, 03:54 AM
I have to agree with those above who said "they'd have to see it first." I'd never criticize or praise a movie without having seen it first. It sounds interesting but I wonder how "professional" or "amaturish" it turns ot to be.

CaptLex
06-01-2007, 09:10 AM
transmen are not telling lesbians they need to transition
Maybe we should . . . just to show the close-minded ones how silly their argument is. Maybe we should say that all lesbians need to embrace their masculinity or something and transition. Then maybe they can see that we're different and to each his own. :p

Dasein9
06-01-2007, 10:35 AM
I also can't judge the movie without seeing it. And I do think it's a bad idea to bow to pressure from protest in this particular way. In another thread, most of us were upset that a course on gender was cancelled because of the protests of the local religious right. The same thing's happening here, other direction.

Maybe a more effective strategy would be for the movie to be shown, with a panel on gender afterward, where transmen and lesbians could answer questions from the audience about the issues covered, or not covered, in the movie.

Robin Leigh
06-01-2007, 02:39 PM
(I hope nobody minds me throwing my :2c:)

I really don't like censorship by authority. But a mature & responsible artist needs to exercise some self-censorship. Certainly, an artist should be free to express themselves. But with freedom comes responsibility. Good art should expand our consciousness & help us to grow. Art should not be a vehicle for spreading it's creator's negative energies.

Even from the short descriptions given, this film maker clearly has issues with TS. We don't need her negativity to be propagated. Screening this film would be opening a can of worms. Trans people & trans friendly people will just get mad. Others will have various erroneous stereotypes reinforced. Dialogue will be hampered, not facilitated.

She is upset because she feels that transmen are betraying the lesbian feminist sisterhood. I also get the impression that she may subscribe to the theory "If you really accepted yourself, you wouldn't need hormones or surgery".

Of course, it's hard to expect someone who doesn't have trans feelings to know what it's really like. But maybe such people shouldn't make films they don't have the expertise to do properly...

OTOH, we must remember that there are plenty of films out there that have portrayed trans people horribly (true, mostly MTF). On the night of the Sydney Gay & Lesbian Mardi Gras, half the free to air channels were showing movies involving psycho trannies. :( A great way to make LGBT people feel accepted by the wider community. Not. :mad:

We've only just started getting a tiny bit of acceptance & tolerance. We have a long way to go.

:hugs:

Robin

MJ
06-03-2007, 08:35 AM
never judge a book by it's cover , i would need to see the movie ..we get judge by our looks and labled without that person getting to know us ..so it's best to see it first

Pink Person
06-03-2007, 11:30 AM
Hi Lex,

I think the movie should be shown. It seems to address a legitimate area of concern and raises issues that should be discussed freely, without censorship.

Not every transgender person is transsexual. Most transgender people are masculine females or feminine males who have not made physical changes to their bodies and are not planning to do it. Perhaps the director has an irrational fear of masculine females having sex changes for artificial reasons but more likely she is responding to real concerns about how society and social expectations affect everyone. I believe that there is a real social presumption and expectation that females will be feminine and males will be masculine in our society. Consequently, masculine females and feminine males are not accepted or understood in a positive manner by many other people. I believe that social hostility does influence the way that masculine females and feminine males think about themselves and can cause some people to consider having a sex change in order to relieve themselves of external and internal conflicts that arise because of the sex/gender stereotypes that are constantly promoted by most of the people around us.

I agree that most transsexual people have sex changes for valid personal reasons and support their choices. However, there are many transgender people who struggle with their gender identities and I think that this is the audience that the director of the film in question is trying to reach. I believe that the director probably intends her movie to be supportive of the majority of transgender people who don’t have sex changes. I don’t think her intent was to offend transgender people who are also transsexual. Regardless of her intent, however, I think the queer community as a whole should be open to the freedom of all of its members to express themselves in diverse and legitimate ways that can’t possibly be pleasing to everyone.

Pink

bi_weird
06-03-2007, 12:06 PM
Mmm yeah I'll finally get un-lazy and weigh in.
I guess, because I'm so very much against censorship, I'd have the movie shown. I'd just have a forum immediatlly after discussing it, and have transpeople set up as loud voices in that forum, as well as a butch lesbian to say "Dude, I'm not a man". I understand where the director is coming from, but it's such a touchy subject seeing as how there are lesbians who seriously have problems with anyone being trans.

Kimberley
06-03-2007, 04:15 PM
"Methinks the lady doth protest too much."

I agree Capn, seeing the film is necessary to form an objective opinion. However, just from reading the director's notes I think I would probably view it in the same light she intended; tongue in cheek. Maybe we transfolk take ourselves just a little too seriously sometimes?

I dont think ppl outside the main of our LGBT community are going to see this film so the fuss is protesting ??? I think the director "gets it" and is simply having a bit of fun. Still, I would like to see it to make an informed decision.

Personally I find far more objectionable, or rather upsetting material in the mainstream. I find where we are victims of violence, discrimination, etc to be far more upsetting; even if it is presented in a friendly light.

Okay, now I'll go back to my tissues in the corner. :tongueout

:hugs:
Kimberley

CaptLex
06-03-2007, 11:46 PM
Wow, so many wonderful responses here. I really appreciate everyone's input and point of view - and Robin, your :2c: are as welcome and as valuable here as everyone else's (especially since you make so much sense).

After reading all your opinions, I realize that I'm probably too biased to be as open and objective about this subject as I'd like to be. I know it's 'cause I've heard these kinds of comments about us from the lesbian community before. I know not all lesbians are close-minded and misinformed about transmen, but it certainly seems to be a common theme among many of them. And it hurts, to be honest. It hurts to keep hearing this stuff. All I want is for the misinformation and negativity to stop, and I don't think a movie like this would accomplish that (and may make it worse). However, I agree with those that said the movie should/could be shown if it was followed by an honest discussion. It's the only way to bridge the apparently growing chasm between us.

Again, thank you all for your opinions. It's always a learning experience for me. :bow:

Sharon
06-04-2007, 12:10 AM
After reading all your opinions, I realize that I'm probably too biased to be as open and objective about this subject as I'd like to be. I know it's 'cause I've heard these kinds of comments about us from the lesbian community before.


Well, one of the closest people in my life is a lesbian, and she also is rather biased against transmen, as well as transsexuals in general, which is the only hangup that exists between the two of us. She knew me for many years before she found out about me being trans, so the relationship has survived, despite me preaching to her at every opportunity. :p

We, as a species, seem incapable of overcoming biases against other cultures or sub-cultures. You would think those of a sexual sub-culture would have no difficulties accepting those of us who are transsexual, but it isn't so. Heck, look how many in our own trans community have a prejudice concerning homosexuality, and these are people you would also expect to be more accepting of others.

I'm going to be looking for The Gendercator so I can see it and make my own decision about the author/filmmaker, but I won't be surprised if it isn't as negative towards us (trans-folk in general, not just transmen) as it appears to be.

Marlena Dahlstrom
06-04-2007, 02:55 AM
FWIW, I did an outreach panel Saturday, which included a transguy who'd been a lesbian separatist. He said it took him 8 years to transition (after realizing he was really an FTM) because it took him that long to get over becoming the thing he'd been taught to hate.

As far as The Gendercator, I think context matters a lot. I haven't seen it myself, but two trans people whose opinion I trust have seen and felt that it was pretty offensive on it's face -- it's rehash of "Transsexual Empire" transphobic rhetoric combined with panic over "butch flight." Apparently, the director really believes that trans people are somehow going to team up with social conservatives to stamp out anyone who doesn't fit the gender binary -- overlooking the number of gender fluid/gender queer folks within the trans umbrella. Plus contrary to what the director said, she was unwilling to engage in discussion at at least one prior festival.

So while I'm pretty anti-censorship, it wasn't an appropriate selection for Frameline's "sci-fi" night. Nor does it sound like it should've passed the initial screening, but it's one thing to not to include it, it's another to kick it out after the fact. (Context again...)

It would be another thing is Frameline or other festivals present in the context of: "we know this is controversial and we're presenting it to encourage discussion/debate about the issue." Sadly, the whole notion of FTMs are just misguided/sell-out butches is taken seriously in some quarters.

Apparently the Frameline festival isn't set up to do that sort of discussion, so I can understand why they choose to pull it. While I'm not wild about that, at least it does send a signal that prejudice within our communities shouldn't be encouraged. After all, I can imagine the reaction if a FTM filmmaker made a film arguing lesbians were just FTMs who were afraid to come out.

Pink Person
06-04-2007, 06:54 AM
Hi Lex,

I am sympathetic to the pain that you feel. There are two monthly groups in Milwaukee that discuss the concerns of transgender and transsexual people (one FTM and one MTF with SOFFs in both), so I am familiar with your feelings based on personal experience and what I hear from people like you and me.

It certainly does feel like some queers can't tolerate or accept other queers very well sometimes. It can be a real challenge to cope with hostility where you least expect it. Many queers just don't seem to understand that they have more things in common with each other than not. It does hurt to be rejected by people that should be more supportive.

I think that all queers should be sensitive to the fact that all queer behavior is primarily personal. If we are not willing to respect the personal decisions that other people make then why should we be surprised when other people don’t respect us. The key to queer unity is personal respect and the respect for personal freedom. Unfortunately, this message is lost on many people inside and outside of the queer community.

Pink

CaptLex
06-05-2007, 04:57 PM
I'm going to be looking for The Gendercator so I can see it and make my own decision about the author/filmmaker, but I won't be surprised if it isn't as negative towards us (trans-folk in general, not just transmen) as it appears to be.
Sharon, I'd love to hear your opinion of it, if you get to see it.


After all, I can imagine the reaction if a FTM filmmaker made a film arguing lesbians were just FTMs who were afraid to come out.
My thoughts exactly, Lena, but maybe that's what needs to happen to shake things up a bit, get their attention and open their minds. :clap:


It certainly does feel like some queers can't tolerate or accept other queers very well sometimes. It can be a real challenge to cope with hostility where you least expect it. Many queers just don't seem to understand that they have more things in common with each other than not. It does hurt to be rejected by people that should be more supportive.
Hi, Pink and welcome :wave: . . . love your music, btw :cheeky:

I agree with you . . . I think. It depends on how you are using the word "queer". I've heard different people define it different ways, so I'm curious about which way you mean it.

Pink Person
06-05-2007, 09:59 PM
Hi Lex,

I feel relatively confident defining a queer as anyone who isn't a feminine heterosexual female or a masculine heterosexual male, but I don't want to offend any queers that don't fit this definition. Basically what I was trying to say was that people who are atypical are not abnormal and that transgender, transsexual, and homosexual people share many common issues because of their minority status in society and they also have many similar personal concerns.

P.S. I was kicked out of the band and choir in the seventh grade, so you probably wouldn't like my music, unless you are a fan of people who can't sing or play an instrument (many who appear on American Idol).

Pink

CaptLex
06-05-2007, 10:13 PM
Hi Lex,

I feel relatively confident defining a queer as anyone who isn't a feminine heterosexual female or a masculine heterosexual male, but I don't want to offend any queers that don't fit this definition. Basically what I was trying to say was that people who are atypical are not abnormal and that transgender, transsexual, and homosexual people share many common issues because of their minority status in society and they also have many similar personal concerns.
That's what I thought . . . and I agree.


P.S. I was kicked out of the band and choir in the seventh grade, so you probably wouldn't like my music, unless you are a fan of people who can't sing or play an instrument (many who appear on American Idol).

Pink
Ha, ha . . . say hi to Simon for me. :lol2: