Inquisitive new member

[phate30a]

Hey,

I'm new to this website, I dont mean to cause offence to anyone so please let me know if i'm stepping out of line. I'm here because i'm ignorant to cross dressing / transgender / transvestite culture and would like to know more about it.

I have no desire in cd/tg/tv myself but i am interested in what attracts people to it. I have some questions that i hope you can answer.

I have encountered a few cd/tg/tv people in my day to day life, shopping, working, socialising etc. my first question is how do you like people to react to you if they notice, would you prefer people were supportive and approached you with their questions or indifferent to you and left you alone?

Also if someone was rude to you publicly would you appreciate a strangers support or would you find their involvment embarrasing?

Any answers would be appreciated.

Thanks,

Darren.

[Marla S]

Welcome.

Just treat them like you want to be treated.
There is nothing special about TG folks, except that they are usually treated differently.

There is no special culture, at least it shouldn't be. If it is, its the result of being treated differently.

Maybe your dad is TG. What and why would change if you would know ?

[Chrysoprase]

Hey,


I have no desire in cd/tg/tv myself but i am interested in what attracts people to it. I have some questions that i hope you can answer.

I have encountered a few cd/tg/tv people in my day to day life, shopping, working, socialising etc. my first question is how do you like people to react to you if they notice, would you prefer people were supportive and approached you with their questions or indifferent to you and left you alone?

A simple hello goes a long ways. and I don't mind a question or two in person.


Also if someone was rude to you publicly would you appreciate a strangers support or would you find their involvment embarrasing?

I'd never turn down a kind word and anyone that stands up to bigotry is fine by me.

[Holly]

Well Darren, I would just as soon people treat me as me. I've been stopped more than once by people that have had genuine questions. I always relpy in a courteous manner. But I am just a scontent to be left alone and go on about my business. The most fulfilling times for me are just being out and about shopping, buying gifts, getting my truck washed, enjoying a meal with friends... just normal everyday things.

As for your second question, I would hope the kindness of people would come through. There is nothing like having a bit of support when rude people feel that they have to act out. Don't you agree?

[chucks]

react as if you didn't have to think about how to react. i'm the same as anyone.

[Kate Simmons]

We are just people being ourselves my friend. As far as expectations, I respect and accept everyone for who they are as a person. I only expect the same consideration in return, simple as that. :happy:Sal

[sandra-leigh]

Also if someone was rude to you publicly would you appreciate a strangers support or would you find their involvment embarrasing?


Now, that's going to depend on how it's handled. For the most part, standing up for people is good -- but not if it comes out wrong. For example, I would not like it if the wording came out like, "Leave them alone; you aren't better than they are; you probably have your own perversions!" -- because that would imply that my crossdressing was a perversion. Similarily, if the wording came out patronizing it wouldn't be good -- think of the history of men sticking up for "the little lady".



how do you like people to react to you if they notice, would you prefer people were supportive and approached you with their questions or indifferent to you and left you alone?


That's going to differ a lot between people. We've had a couple of threads here in which people, crossdressers themselves, have said, "I saw another crossdresser; I wanted to approach them but I didn't; do you think I should have?" It seemed to me that the overall response to that was, "No, don't, not in public". Reasons given include that it might embarrass the other person if others notice the conversation or overhear (brings attention to them), or that (as one person said above) that they just want to be treated like everyone else. Another factor is that to some people, "passing" is very important: if you see someone who looks a lot like a female but something twiggs and you realize they are male, then they might be mortified to have been found out, especially if they are very much "in the closet" and don't want anyone to know.

A couple of weeks ago, one of the regulars here was chased by other crossdressers twice in one week; in one case, the other person just wanted to talk, and in the other case they wanted to talk and (as I recall, possibly incorrectly) also made a sexual proposition. But in both cases, the regular was frightened, because the efforts made by the other people amounted to a lot more than just a quiet approach in a grocery store -- at the time it seemed more likely the admirers were setting up for attacks or robbery. (I thought I remembered who this happened to, but I was mistaken, so I am unable to post links to these incidents, sorry.)

But not everyone is the same; some of us enjoy polite interaction with others who have noticed us.

Speaking just for myself on this point:

There is something about me that makes me easily recognizable to those who have met me in guy mode. For example, there is a club that I've gone to on and off for several years; the first time I went in "presenting" as a woman (dress, wig, makeup, different glasses), the (female) bartender immediately recognized me at a glance, from at least 30 feet away in a lowly-lit active club, and immediately started making my regular (non-alcoholic) drink. I didn't "fool her" in the slightest: she knew exactly who I was. And she isn't offended in the least. I've interacted with a number of the women who tend to be at that club, in both my "male mode" and fully dressed; none of the women have stopped talking to me due to my dressing, and a number have openned up and started talking to me (no matter how I'm dressed) now that they know I crossdress. It interests them, or amuses them, or somehow transformed me from "someone they've seen around" to "someone who is safe and comfortable". If I had the attitude of "Don't approach me if you notice I'm a crossdresser", then I would have missed out on a number of enjoyable conversations, and would have missed out on the acceptance implicitly offered by those women.

I am a bit different than the majority of posters here (but am by no means the only such person here), in that I am relatively open to the public about being a crossdresser: for example, three times this past week, I went out in public as "a guy wearing a skirt". If you see someone obvious in their dressing, then you know that they aren't someone afraid of being "caught". Such people might (like me) be fairly open to talking to other people... but not necessarily. Some people who are obvious just want to be treated like anyone else, as if there was nothing special about them, and would dislike being singled out as being a crossdresser. You could try the compliment approach ("That's a nice skirt") and see if they seem willing to talk or if they move on, but ask yourself: would you approach a female stranger and compliment her on her skirt? If not, then the crossdresser might "hear" that they are being singled out, and might not be too pleased. But you never know.

Possibly the key is to see whether the crossdresser is actively interacting with other people; I don't mean that you should approach them in a crowd, but rather that if they appear to be keeping to themselves then they might not be in much of a mood to be sociable, whereas if you've seen them chit-chatting with other people, you have the clue that they enjoy talking.

For an example of an occasion when I didn't mind being approached, see my thread from yesterday, "Happiness being myself"

[Rachel Morley]

Hey Darren,

To be totally honest with you, there is nothing particularly special about us. We are businesspeople, teachers, truck drivers, lawyers, government workers, and retail employees. We are parents, children, employees and bosses. You may find yourself sitting next to one of us in church, or serving beside one of us on the local school board. In other words, apart from our gender gift, we are no different from anyone else.

To answer your questions:

"how do you like people to react to you if they notice, would you prefer people were supportive and approached you with their questions or indifferent to you and left you alone?" - I can only speak for myself, but I would prefer that people were (somewhat) indifferent to me, in the sense that they treat me exactly like they would anyone else. If it's obvious to them that I am a guy presenting as a woman, then I would rather be addressed as the gender I am presenting. Meaning refer to me as a "she" not a "he".

"If someone was rude to you publicly would you appreciate a strangers support or would you find their involvement embarrassing?" - What would you do? To me, a stranger being rude is just a stranger being rude, regardless of what clothes I'm wearing. I don't think I would require another strangers support as I can take care of rude people myself. I'm not totally helpless :devil:

[TxKimberly]

As others have said, the answer to this is different for different people. Myself, I would be more than happy to talk to someone if they had honest questions and approached in a decent and courteous fashion. I honestly think I would enjoy that conversation. The catch is, someone with less confidence might be scared to death of approached in any way shape or form.
Short answer - no way to know - we are all going to be different.

[sandra-leigh]

I don't think I would require another strangers support as I can take care of rude people myself. I'm not totally helpless :devil:

But do you charm them, or do you "put them in their place"? Because if the latter, that you tell them off (or similar) until they back down, then they are left thinking, "That cross-dressing twerp insulted me; I should have popped him one!" -- that is, you leave them angry and possibly even more likely to "act out" in the future or to try to put down the next crossdresser to attempt to re-establish their mental superiority-complex.

If, though, a total stranger from the crowd steps out and says, "Leave them alone, they aren't harming anyone and they have a right to dress how they want!", then that's a peer talking to them, setting the general-society acceptance out. What's said by a cross-dressing twerp doesn't count nearly as much -- it's "backtalk" from someone thought to be inferior -- but when someone else in society applies a clue-by-four, then the lesson is more likely to stick.

[Sheri 4242]

To be totally honest with you, there is nothing particularly special about us. We are businesspeople, teachers, truck drivers, lawyers, government workers, and retail employees. We are parents, children, employees and bosses. You may find yourself sitting next to one of us in church, or serving beside one of us on the local school board. In other words, apart from our gender gift, we are no different from anyone else.

Darren,

I agree with Rachel, but would express it in a slightly different sense . . . we do, indeed, cover the spectrum from educators to lawyers, truck drivers to doctors, CEOs to mechanics, ministers to law enforcement officers, and almost every occupational field. We are husbands (and some consider ourselves to be part/both husband and wifes), parents and grandparents. But, where I phrase it differently is, IMHO, we are special! (Of course, Rachel DID call it a "gender gift," so I think it is a matter of how we are expressing it.) At any rate, my sense of attitude about CDing comes from having reached a point where I no longer purge, self-loathe, and feel guilt b/c of what I am! If you, our inquiring friend, will take the time to research the many threads, you'll find that some of us feel a deep and abiding sense of guilt -- and it is not uncommon to purge our clothes and swear oath upon oath that we will "give it up." Then, you will see that some of us have reached a point where we are comfortable with who and what we are, if not absolutely happy with it. For those of us especially in the latter category, I think we represent, for the most part (and this is my opinion), those who have come to realize that whatever makes us who and what we are, is a special quality and attribute. When we were seriously dating, I know my wife learned (early on) that many of the qualities that she really liked about me the best were dircect extensions of the femme side or aspect to my dichotomous personality.

[Karren H]

Don't know why I'm driven to crossdress.... Just something I've always done.. And I could carless when anyone notices.. I have a right to dress like I want... Just want to be treated like another human... And no one has been rude to me since I started going out in public enfemme.. And I wouldn't be embarased at all.. If I were I think I'd go find a new hobby... Most likely would ignore them unless they presist. Then who knows...........

Karren

[Rachel Morley]

But do you charm them, or do you "put them in their place"? Because if the latter, that you tell them off (or similar) until they back down, then they are left thinking, "That cross-dressing twerp insulted me; I should have popped him one!".
I have no clue what you are like, but I guess if you don't know me you might think that I would be capable of this. There have been many times I've written on this forum that I don't like confrontation, and I don't. What I am good at is being assertive and standing my ground and talking my way out of a situation. I can usually "think on my feet" and usually have an answer to diffuse a situation. I always take a defensive but assertive standpoint against bullies.

[Paula Wilder]

Hi,

I was approached in the parking lot of a Salvation Army Thrift Shop last year by another CD (in drab), while I was fully enfemme and traveling that way for a week. He was very polite and careful not to cause me any fear, and I didn't mind at all. In fact, I ended up giving him a pair of high heels that were too big for me, and he let me know about some events in the Hartford, CT area that I was passing through. We had a very brief chat, I was complemented on how I looked and he said I was passing fairly well, so I appreciated the feedback. Depends how it's handled, I guess.

Paula

[O2B Barbara]

We are all different people in some way or another. We all have strengths and weakness. With that we not all act the same in a given situation. I would imagine most people, not just CD's, would like to be treated with respect and consideration at all times. No reason not to be treated that way by all.

As for rude people, I on most occasions will at least make a comment to let them know that their behavior is just that, rude. The more people that come out and tell someone that their behavior is not polite and considerate, that behavior just may change.

[phate30a]

Thank you to everyone who responded, i appreciate the time taken to do so.

Again, i wish to express that i dont mean to cause offence to anybody here at all, it is my genuine wish to try and learn about something that i currently dont understand and anything i write is never meant to cause offence.

I understand that you want to be treated the same as everybody else, but the vast majority of people are going to see cd/tg/tv people as unusual and in my opinion its going to take a relatively long time for societies view to change in regards to this.

To be honest when i see a man who is dressed as a woman, i myself see it as unusual, i also feel elements of curiosity which makes me want to approach the person but i also feel an element of caution as i worry that the person will react badly to this, hench my earlier question. Of course, it stands to reason that each person is different and will respond to somebody approaching them in different ways.

My next question is for the men who are married to women. When you are in your feminine persona how does your relationship with your wife change? Is there still a sexual element involved in regards to your relationship or does this give way to a temporary close friendship situation? (I hope this question makes sense :o )

Thank you

Darren
~x~

[Shelly Preston]

Hi there

In regards tow you second question i think that is something for each couple to decide between them

As you are only inquisitive here and have no interest in crossdressing

I am curious as to what really interests you

It does seem a litte strange but there must be something which has made you inquisitive about our lifestyle

[Marla S]

To be honest when i see a man who is dressed as a woman, i myself see it as unusual, i also feel elements of curiosity which makes me want to approach the person but i also feel an element of caution as i worry that the person will react badly to this, hench my earlier question. Of course, it stands to reason that each person is different and will respond to somebody approaching them in different ways.

Most of us struggle from the very same feelings like you most of their life. (Let me tell you it is pain in the a**).
TG folks are children of our society too and we imbibed from our infancy the rules and standards of our society too.

Assuming you are not TG, try to imagine that you are in a prison and have to wear pink convict uniform for many many years and you are not respected as a person. How long could you stand that ?

The unusual look, well yeah it looks unusual sometimes (sometimes even odd), but that's a question familiarization and practice.
How unusual does fashion from the 80's looks today. People liked it those days.

How unusal (funny, odd) todays fashion will look in 5 years ?

[phate30a]

Shelly,

There are several reasons for my inquisitiviness, i have an interest in the differences between people and what drives people to do certain things and behave in certain ways, please dont read this to mean that i am "studying" you, because im not, im just interested.

I hate not understanding or knowing about something, so i ask these questions to try and understand, ignorance is never a good enough mistake when it comes to dealing with important aspects of peoples lives so i endevour not to be ignorant about the big things.

Artistically, i find androgeny and the blurring of gender lines quite beautiful.

When i encounter cd/tg/tv people in my daily life, i would like to know the appropriate way to behave so as to not embarass them, as my over eagerness to show that im not going to be hostile about the way you choose to dress or live your life may be embarrasing or unnecessary to you, while some people may think that if i am completely indifferent this may be seen as being rude or hostile.

Lastly and possibly most honestly, im just really nosey :heehee:

Darren
~x~

[Tamara Croft]

<snip>i endevour not to be ignorant about the big things.I'm sure you aren't and I'm sure you like learning about the bigger things in life too ;)

So, how did you find this forum? do you join a lot of forums?

[phate30a]

:o :heehee:

Oh! How did you find out i was a member of that site?

To answer the question though, no it wasnt through that site that i developed an interest in cd/tg/tv. I found this site by searching "cross dressers" on google.

That site i use as i have a sexual interest in its ..uh...theme :heehee:

I joined crossdressers.com as i genuinely want to understand a different lifestyle.

As for how many forums i join? A few, here and there, anything that peaks my interest in one way or anouther.

Darren
~x~

[Tamara Croft]

:o :heehee:

Oh! How did you find out i was a member of that site?Google is your best friend ;)

[rose382832]

it's amazing what a person can find with just a few seconds of research. did you think that no one else might think to use the computer for research? some of us are a little smarter than your average pet rock.

[chucks]

info is the commodity for a new age

[Stlalice]

"When i encounter cd/tg/tv people in my daily life, i would like to know the appropriate way to behave so as to not embarass them, as my over eagerness to show that im not going to be hostile about the way you choose to dress or live your life may be embarrasing or unnecessary to you, while some people may think that if i am completely indifferent this may be seen as being rude or hostile."

Believe it or not when I'm doing what we call the "Transgender 101" class at my church this is one of the most frequently asked questions. And the answer is quite simple - treat us the same way you wish to be treated. Nothing more than the golden rule really. If you are polite and behave in a non threatening way many if not most of us will have no problem talking to you. Some simple guide lines -

First, use the pronouns that match the way the way the individual is presenting - female forms for those presenting as femme - male forms for those presenting as male.

Second, if you are unsure of the above stick to gender neutral forms - you may also ask in a polite way in conversation a question phrased such as "Hi - I'm so and so - what is your name?" as a way to get a clue as to their preferred manner of address. If that doesn't work - a name like Terri/Terry for example - you may politely ask "How do you prefer to be addressed?" and then honor their choice. Some will prefer the gender neutral reference.

Third, avoid any terms that might be considered insulting - things like he/she, *******, tranny, transvestite, etc.

Fourth, don't stare - that would make anyone nervous!

[phate30a]

Having typed my username into google, i'm now a little concerned about how much information is available about me there. :(

Can i ask why you felt it was necessary to research me though?

Darren
~x~

[Shelly Preston]

omg

I must lead a sheltered life :sad:

I had no idea there was a support group like that :sad:

[Tamara Croft]

Having typed my username into google, i'm now a little concerned about how much information is available about me there. :(

Can i ask why you felt it was necessary to research me though?

Darren
~x~Well, just like you came here to research our community, we sometimes like to do the same thing ;) and yes, it is amazing at what information is out there about a person no?

[rose382832]

what i think is scary is that some people cant seem to even remember teir age from forum to forum!:devil:

[phate30a]

Thank you Alice for your response it was most helpful :happy:

I also understand your need for security, but what have you learnt from googling my name other than my sexuality, turn ons, and e-bay comments?

I dont mean to sound defensive, but whilst im interested in your community, your taking an interest in who i am specifically, which makes me feel a little exposed and vulnerable, if you have any further concerns or questions about who i am, please ask me, i will answer as truthfully as i am able :happy:

Darren
~x~

[shybutcurious]

Honestly, treat them like a normal person. Dont have to ask questions or anything. When i am out as a guy, i would always stand up for another cd/tv/tg person if they are being abused or something like that. we are kind and caring just like everybody else. so there is no reason to treat us differently.

[Kate Simmons]

Don't take it personally Darren. Folks are just as naturally curious about you as you are about them. I took you at your word myself and answered the question simply. You have to be prepared to be visible on a Forum such as this one especially the public parts. Don't worry, if anything, we realize you are trying to understand and that is a very positive thing. That puts you above and beyond the "average" person in my book.;):happy: