SO in need of advice

[Corrine GG]

Hello all, I am the SO of a man I just married in October. I found out about his CDing in January so imagine my surprise. I am very open about this (he told me it was only panties) but I am discovering more things he is hiding from me. It hurts me.
I guess I can be one of those "as long as it's not in front of me or the kids" SO's. I'm not sure how to be anything else. He came in from a business trip and I found his heels before he could hide them.
Here is the major issue I have with it...I am a very sexual woman...He doesn't seem to need the same level of sexual activity so I am wondering if the CDing is sexual for him. This makes me feel slighted in that area. He has expressed that if I ever cheated on him he would kill me...but if his CDing is sexual for him, isn't that cheating on me? He is getting fullfillment somewhere else and I have nothing.
I don't know how to BE, I want to be accepting, I love him. I hope I came to the right place, I can't imagine going to a therapist about this.
Maybe I need to talk with SO's of other CDers. Who the hell knows? I am so confused about my feelings about it all.

[battybattybats]

Well he could just have a lower drive, that's not unusual. It's not always sexual for everyone or all the time either. Do you consider self gratification cheating? If not then I doubt you should consider it cheating at all.

That he is still hiding things is likely an habitual behaviour..

However this line:
He has expressed that if I ever cheated on him he would kill me...
Sets off a lot of warning bells for me.

[CharleneCD]

First I want to tell you what a special person you are. To find out after the marriage and still be accepting puts you in the one in a million catagory.

As to your concerns about weather his dressing is sexual or not only he knows. For some of us it is, and for some it is not. You will have to ask him. But I think you have a bigger problem. The problem is will he tell you the truth. In this day and age there is no excuse for him not telling you before the wedding, and he even has less for not coming completely clean when you found out. Trust is your first problem and he has totaly broken yours.

[Kate Simmons]

Wow Corrine, I can't imagine how all of this makes you feel. My wife will never accept my CDing but, even so, I would never treat or talk to any woman like that, especially my wife. I have too much respect for her and I'm not like that anyway. I'm hoping you can talk to some of the GG SO's here and maybe get some ideas on what to do. You do need to talk to someone though because the issues you bring up are very important ones. I hope you can work things out my friend. Take care, Sal

[Sandra]

A lot of Cders in the begining get sexual relief from dressing they dress do the business and the clothes come off, as time goes on for some they find that just the dressing is enough and the sexual aspect dimishes.

This was the case with my SO and like you I felt "slighted" wonder if I was doing something wrong etc but I talked about it with her and was re assured that I hadn't done anything wrong it was just the feelings she had. As for cheating to me if our SO's get sexual relief it's not cheating so long as there is no other human being involved, some may have a diferent view.

I would suggest that you talk to your husband and explain your worries feelings and also join the GG forum that we have here.

[gmss]

Hi corrine:

I think that CDing should not be considered as "cheating" on you, but certainly, it needs to be addressed. (No pun intended.)

From your post, it sounds like it is not an infrequent and unobtrusive issue. My own thoughts: To CD is a personality trait, and like the say, "you can take the girl out of the country, but ... "

Anything that affects your relationship to the point of such frustration as your post indicates, should be dealt with head on, and the sooner the better.

And I would also add that your SO needs to be 100% honest and open with you about his collection, desires, and how it affects your relationship. It sounds like he isn't.

If you can sit him down and get more than a "it's nothing; don't worry" conversation - that's great. But don't rule out third party help. (i.e. maybe a therapist.)

Having said that, you might also want to consider that he may not be hiding it for malicious reasons. He may just be embarrassed or self-conscious.

If you can be completely understanding about his CDing to him and in front of him and make him understand that, he will probably be much more open about his collections, and interests in the subject.

Just my 0.02.

[uknowhoo]

First off, Corrine, welcome. I applaud you for seeking out information about CD'ing. While feedback from us CD'ers will hopefully be helpful, I do believe that chatting with other wives/SO's would also be very good for you. After you have made 10 posts here in the open forums, you can be admitted into the GG's forum, which is only open to genetix women (i.e. wives SO's).

While I agree with Batty about the warning bells, I'll defer to other members as far as how to approach your situation. I'm sure you'll have many thougfhtful and helpful responces in short order.

I wish you the best of luck going forward.

:hugs:

Tammi


EDIT: It seems as though your husband may still be struggling with his own feelings about the dressing, which is verrry common. Perhaps you could invite him to join here as well. Many of us have come a very long way from the shame and isolation we felt before coming to a greater understanding ands acceptance of our female sides through participation here.

[lexygirl]

Hi, I told my wife just before we got maried. She had accepted me but we where so focused on the wedding that it took a back seat to everything. My wife did not know all of what I did at first but as time went by I told her a little at a time.

I think that of all the advice you can get here, you are going to have to sit and talk to him about this. Listen to him and tell him that you will stop him when you need a break. He might just be trying to not overwelm you with the extent of his dressing.

I do think batty has a point though. That is a little scarry.

[Sheila]

corrine,

:hugs:first of all welcome, when you have made your initilal 10 posts you can ask to join us in the GG only section.

Many of us can relate to the hurt of finding out and espcially so soon after your marriage. For many of the cdr's, it is a shock when their partner discovers their cding .......... mine wouldn't talk to me about it for ages ........ found it difficult to accept that somebody else knew about his cding, then when he did talk it was just as hard, he couldn't explain to me how and what ...... not that he didn't try, but he was having difficulty in making me understand, or I was having difficulty in understanding we are still working on it and I have known for 10 months now. Sometimes it is easier than others and like you I love my partner, and he loves me, so we keep trying and keep communicating.

And yes you have come to the right place, there is an amazing bunch of people on here:hugs:

Jess

[Corrine GG]

I think the issue is that his first wife cheated on him. She started cheating on him before she found out about the CDing. We talk...isn't THAT WEIRD. But after I found a pair of panties and he said they were hers, I had to call her. That is when I found out.

I am sure that his denial comes from years of hiding...he doesn't even buy his own stuff, he alters things he finds. I notice my panties (i like very sexy stuff, thongs, etc.) missing, then they reappear. I don't think he knows that I know so much.

How many men do you think CD? I heard 1 out of 10. I was in a sex shop not too long ago and this very mach guy was just pulling things off the rack and placing them on the counter. When I glanced at the sizes, they were "plus" etc. I knew they were for him. I never would have guessed by looking at him. I resisted the urge to talk to him, ask him questions...

[suchacutie]

Welcome and know that you are a terrific person!

What I'm hearing in your postings is that he has an immense amount of fear and inability to really trust that he can open up about his "en femme" life. You may find that this ingrained fear will take a while to break through, but I can just about guarantee that if you are successful in convincing him that his CDing is something that the two of you can share (especially sharing the adventure of finding out who "she" is) you will have a loyal and loving husband for life who cannot do enough to show you his love.

On his side, however, he must level with you, and that will be hard for him because he may not have leveled with himself, nor may he understand enough to explain everything to you. Regardless, he should bring you into his CDing world as much as he can if he even hopes to have you become a part of it and to free himself from the guilt/fear that he has!

My suggestion would be to approach this as one more thing a husband and wife can share like no two others can! Express your hope that he can understand what an emotional hi it would be for you to have him share such a personal and vulnerable set of emotions with you. After all, you are a GG and, as such, offer him more than just emotional stability, but years of understanding and knowledge to share with him.

This can be a win/win situation like no other! My best wishes for both of you!

Tina

[Dixie]

Corrine, hello and welcome. I think you should talk with him. His reasons for hiding it have been covered ,but you need to stick to your guns and talk, as he denies just give him the facts of what you know, what you have discovered ie the high heels, your disappearing/reappearing panties, and draw the truth out of him, but do try to maintain a nonconfrontational attitude so that he doesn't feel threatened. I wish you luck , and remember honesty and communication are essential, get him on this site and we can tell him the exact same thing.:hugs: Dixie

[Corrine GG]

If he is in denial about it all, do you think he would freak if I brought him here?

[Sheila]

You could tell him that you came here to learn and that he would be welcomed if he decides to join ........ he may just want to come have a look ..... it is a suggestion and he may take you up on it ........ you could write the address down on a piece of paper and he may feel more comfortable looking on his own ???????

[Dixie]

I was excited to find that ther were so many like myself. My wife likes to tease me when she gets home from work she'll ask, "So, what did you and your Gurlfriends talk about today?"
I think he will find the support helpful, and we will tell him to be straight with you.

[Mitch23]

Tricky issues - I've been the 'cheating' husband and it's interesting to hear how it feels from the other side. Be assured you're in the right place, just spend time getting to know us and our partners and you will soak up so much information that will help you. Good to hear you are communicating - your relationship is a young one so you've probably got lots to find out about each other anyway. Just go gently with each other and remember that you've got the rest of your lives to sort this out - if you can, it will make you both stronger!

Mitch

[Chantelle CD]

Its my guess from what i have read so far, that he is in denial over his cross dressing, Giving him this forum is a good idea, but would like to caution you first, maybe he hasn't dressed totally, and only little items at a time, but desired to for probably as long as most of us here have, since they were small kids. If you accept it in him, and he dresses more than he ever done before, it may blow up in him and become rather compulsive, and addictive, be ready for this!! Its very important for you to understand, how far he wants to go with it, does he feel like he wants to become a TG/TS or is dressing as far as he wants to go, Understanding this part will ease your fear of it. Then its just a matter of understanding. The hurt about his secret, not telling you, is because we have fought it so much and kept in all in the closet for so long, and thinking that it will just go away, but it doesnt, it keeps comeing back, and we get mad at ourselves for it, and try to push it away more, he loves you, and doesn't want to lose you over this thing he as been fighting with, that is why the big secret, try to understand though it not right to hide things from your SO, but al ot of it tells me he is fighting it now.

BTW welcome to the forum, you have come to the right place, what i have said here mostly comes from personal experience, not speaking from all CD points of view

Chantelle

[Stephanie-L]

I urge you to get counselling, now, not because of his CD issues but because of the trust issues in your relationship. His hiding things even after you know and are somewhat accepting, his previous history, and his statement about what would happen if you cheated are all red flags to me. You are a wonderful person for being accepting and he needs to understand what a great gift that is. His CDing may be sexual, for me it occasionally is, though much less now as I get older, or it may not be. Again, counselling will help that for both of you. I hope things work out for you....Stephanie

[Andi]

..........He has expressed that if I ever cheated on him he would kill me.......

Corrine, I'm not a professional therapist, but IMHO this reaction, if quote is accurate, should not be dismissed lightly. This is most certainly a symptom of something deeper, maybe insecurity or control freak or etc. I wouldn't rule out you seeing a counselor (if it's possible) to understand how to read the behaviors and how to interact accordingly. I've never said anything like this to anyone, not even jokingly, and most certainly not to the one I've professed eternal love for. Words hurt very deep.

I wish you the very best and hope you find some answers.

[GypsyKaren]

Hi Corrine

I would like to welcome you to our family, the fact that you are here shows that you are a caring person who wants to understand, and that is always welcomed here. I think the others are giving you enough advice, so I just want to make sure you know that we have a private GG Forum, here (http://www.crossdressers.com/forums/faq.php?faq=pf#faq_gg_forum), where you can find lots of support and kind listeners, please do look into it.

Karen

[Sheri 4242]

Corrine,

I am the husband/wife of very suppotive GG. You bring up a lot of issues; fortunately you are -- being in the early stages of discovery -- in a good position to investigate, learn, and make decisions on what you can and cannot accept and/or tolerate and/or support.


A lot of Cders in the begining get sexual relief from dressing . . . (but) as time goes on for some they find that . . . the sexual aspect dimishes.

As for cheating to me if our SO's get sexual relief it's not cheating so long as there is no other human being involved, some may have a diferent view.

It is true that there is a sexual component to a lot of CDers dressing, but not necessarily in the beginning. Too many CDers begin dressing before a sexual component is realistic. For example, I have been dressing to some degree (as have many) since I was 3-4 year's old.

For those for whom a sexual component is attached, it is quite true that with many, it is frequent to see such diminish with time.

As to "cheating," what I am going to say is simply MHO, but sexual gratification sans a live partner is still cheating. My wife is here with me and agrees 110%. Why? Any sexual act that detracts from, or in some way substitutes even in a minor way from, the true and essential elements of a vibrant marriage, is cheating. There are hundreds of books that address this, but for now, let me leave it as our personal beliefe!


Anything that affects your relationship to the point of such frustration as your post indicates, should be dealt with head on, and the sooner the better . . . your SO needs to be 100% honest and open with you about his collection, desires, and how it affects your relationship.

. . . don't rule out third party help. (i.e. maybe a therapist.)

Having said that, you might also want to consider that he may not be hiding it for malicious reasons. He may just be embarrassed or self-conscious.

I agree that you two must address this issue, and the sooner the better. I would suggest you make such talks at times when there won't be interruptions or distractions. And, regardless of what is said, that you remain calm and try and absorb all that he tells you. Often you will have more questions the next day or the next. Often you will ask the same questions again months down the road to help in your comprehension. You MUST get it across to him that you are trying to understand and that you need/require honesty. This may result in the establishment of boundaries on which you both can compromise -- knowing that boundaries are moveable as time goes along.

And ABSOLUTELY YES!!! You may both may want/need to seek out the help of a therapist for you both!!! That said, "IF" you do, please, please, please be certain it is a therapist who has experience in -- and in fact, as part of their practice, specializes in -- gender issues!!!!


I think the issue is that his first wife cheated on him. She started cheating on him before she found out about the CDing.

I am sure that his denial comes from years of hiding...he doesn't even buy his own stuff, he alters things he finds. I notice my panties (i like very sexy stuff, thongs, etc.) missing, then they reappear. I don't think he knows that I know so much.

How many men do you think CD? I heard 1 out of 10.

My first wife cheated on me many times -- and my wife's first husband cheated on her many times. My first wife NEVER knew about the CDing, of that I am POSITIVE!!!! (Trust me on this, had she known she was mean enough that it would have come out in our divorce, in re giving her some advantage. As it was, I got the house, children, furniture, and cars. My first wife -- and you can talk to my second wife about this -- was a real piece of work!!!!)

To your next point, far too many CDers are in denial and/or hiding. It most often comes from guilt that extends back to childhood.

As to numbers and statistics, there are no reliable sources -- b/c of the very real sense of guilt we were just speaking of, and the tremendous fear of discovery. Ten percent is one of the major numbers floating out there. I have also heard it put at 20%-25%. I, personally lean more toward the latter, but won't go into my thoughts on this at this point except to say that my wife agrees with me based on independent research.


Here is the major issue I have with it...I am a very sexual woman...He doesn't seem to need the same level of sexual activity so I am wondering if the CDing is sexual for him.

That is common - and it may or may not be related to CDing. It could just as easily be related to a medical condition -- anything that causes ED. That can be a psychological problem in and of itself to a lot of GGs. The good news is that it can be successfully treated these days!!!


He has expressed that if I ever cheated on him he would kill me . . .

That is a very serious statement he has made and sounds as if it could come from some deep, unresolved emotions -- even if he would never do such a thing, that it is in his mind to any degree speaks volumes!!! PLEASE: Find a therapist (and one who specializes in part in gender issues. While this statement is NOT a gender issue, it is one any competent therapist can help address.

Yes -- I thik you came to the right place when you came to this site. We're here for you!!! We can be here for your SO, too, if he'd like. PLEASE: get your ten posts quickly so you can join the GG-only group. IMHO, you need advice from all angles, especially your GG peers.

Once you've gotten past your 10 posts, PM me or my wife if you want. There are dozens upon dozens of us here that are ready, willing, and able to help!!! I am certain any number of us would be glad for you to PM us if you feel a need for private Q & A.

[Fab Karen]

I don't know if this is the case here, but talk like "I'd kill you if I caught you cheating" sounds a bit like the anger that some people cheating express to distract their partner, sometimes even accusing THEM of cheating.

[kerrianna]

Hi Corrine welcome! I hope we can help you out here.

It would be great if you two could talk it out. CDing means a lot of different things to different people, and it's not unusual to go through different phases of it. It can be purely sexual to purely mental/emotional. It can be a sign of gender identity misplacement or confusion. Pretty much anything...and the only way you will know is if you talk to him.

He may not know exactly, but at least you can explore it together. If it is drawing his sexual energy away from you maybe you guys can find a way to use it as a couple? Whatever works for BOTH of you. But you have to try to be honest and communicative.

Hope we can help. :hugs:

btw I don't like the 'kill' threat either, even if he was kidding. Partners shouldn't be saying things like that. It happens all too often still. :(

[Kerry Owens]

Welcome to the right place Corrine, and yes, getting into the counseling is needed. That threat he made to you, scares me....and rightly so.
Bringing him in here won't hurt, the CD side of the forum understands and there is awareness of how large a difference there is between each individual CD'r and the approach to the life. No two approach it the same way really.

[Ema1234 GG]

First of all Corrine I really feel for you. In some respects your situation is just like mine. :hugs:

I also found out about my partner's CDing through me finding his dressing items and it also has a very sexual aspect for him. But do I think this is cheating just because it is something that I don't share? Not at all. For me, in order for a person to cheat there must be another human being involved. If this is just something that he does privately then he really isn't cheating hon, honestly. Perhaps ask yourself this, does he share every last little thing that turns you on?

You also mention that he is in denial, again I can also relate to you here. My partner is also most certainly in denial. Perhaps less so as I've tried to encourage him out of it. I personally would far rather take an active part as much as I can in his CDing, or atleast know about it, than have it hidden away. In my eyes if it's hidden away it's somehow so much more sordid. Hell, I was even teaching him how to walk in high heels today. :o

Yes it's hard to deel with and yes it really is a shock. But if you love this man then you really can get through this. The most important part is to talk to him. That also can be hard, particularly if he is embarassed as he probably won't want to discuss after years of hiding it. But make it clear that you're there for him. Perhaps even buy him some items of his own that actually fit? I know my fella couldn't get over the fact that I'd bought him his own pair of shoes in his size. He said it proved to him that I really am trying to accept his CDing and shows how much I love him.

I think the most important part to remember is that he is still your man, he is still your husband and most certainly is still the man you married. Just because he has hidden his CDing doesn't mean he has been cheating on you. He may well have done it out of respect for your feelings.

Hang in there, it's a bumpy road and may take a long time to fully resolve but if you love each other you'll get there. You just need to find a compromise in which both of you are happy.

If you ever want to PM me feel free, I'd love to chat and offer you any advice I can. :hugs:

[Raychel]

Hello Corrine. First let me also say welcome to the family. Now for my :2c: on this subject. Like you have heard beforee. It is very possible that your husband just has a lower sex drive than you. It is also possible that his dressing is sexual. Either way you should talk to him about this. This is a very important time in your marriage to really to get to know each other. This will not happen if you do not talk to each other.

Sit him down and tell him what you know. Tell him that you have done some research on the subject And want to know his true feelings. Be warned he may say things that you may not like. Do not start an argument over this. Take the time to absorb what he says and have another talk at a later time.

There are alot of great women here who have been thru the same thing that you are. I am sure that they will do anything possible to help you out.

Remember Communicatiion is the key to a great marriage.

Good Luck
Raychel

[Sheri 4242]

I don't know if this is the case here, but talk like "I'd kill you if I caught you cheating" sounds a bit like the anger that some people cheating express to distract their partner, sometimes even accusing THEM of cheating.

Wow, Karen!!! Is that ever the truth!!! I have seen this numerous times -- more than I care to recall.

[Tree GG]

Welcome, Corrine. You've come to a good place if you want to explore the Wide, Wide, World of TGness.

And being a Wide, Wide, World, there are many opinions. I agree with you. The sexual aspect of CDing - even when it does not involved another human - is a form of cheating in my opinion. Especially when the SO's physical needs are not being met. Is it cause for ending the relationship - no, I don't think that. But I do believe it is indicative of the narcicism that most closeted CDers develop. Funny, it also seems that coming out of the closet...going full femme in public...sharing their TGness with someone else...reduces and/or removes that desire. Of course not in all cases, but in the few I've spoke with, that seems to be the natural progression. Only your husband can speak to his desires.

I do agree with the opinions that communication has to start. It's really, really hard for them to talk about it at first, and he didn't want to hear some of my thoughts (like my opinion above) but eventually you find the common ground. And his dressing will change for him once he's aware you know and are willing to explore...so what has comes before may not be what it continues to be.

So confusing...and in the end you and he need to find what works for you. Counselling helped me (and it doesn't take many sessions); coming here helped; listening helped; and talking helps. Death threats do not - my 1st question would be WTF is that?

[Stephenie S]

Well Corrine, I am not going to answer any of your questions right now. Many people have given you good advice, some of it contradictory. Think about it all before you act.

What I am going to say may not be what you want to hear, but here it is. DUMP this guy. NOW! ANY partner who would make a threat of physical harm against you (much less DEATH), for some behavior on your part, is not worth the time or effort. Plus, the danger is very real. Partners who talk about physical violence are already thinking that it is OK. So he thinks it's OK to beat, or even KILL you if you cheat? You may say, "Yes, but I'm not gonna cheat." Well, how about if he just thinks you cheated? Is it OK then? How about some other infraction?

This guy is bad news. Move on.

With concern,
Stephenie

[Corrine GG]

I think a few of you have taken what he said a little too literally. I actually told him the same thing, "you cheat, I'll kill ya" Not really KILL you...you would just WISH you were dead...lol!!!
Maybe we just live a little too far south (alabama) Remember, we are a few decades behind the rest of the world.

[Dixie Darling]

Hello Corrine,

First, my most sincere admiration for your intelligence to seek out some reputable information regarding crossdressing. It's a subject that's misunderstood and misinterpreted by the majority of our society and is seldom researched the way YOU have elected to do.

In regards to your husband's crossdressing, from what you've told us here in the forum it appears that he's never accepted the realization that he IS a crossdresser. You seem to have accepted it even though you've stated ''I guess I can be one of those "as long as it's not in front of me or the kids" SO's.'' Maybe some of the previous posts from the members here as well as those in the archives can be of benefit to you in your situation.

It is possible that, as you suspect, he is "getting fulfillment" from his dressing. My personal opinion is that if he IS doing so, then yes - it is a form of cheating on YOU. His failure to sit down and have some long serious talks with you about this need to dress enfemme that he has is a big part of the problem. Marriage is a TWO-WAY agreement and if you are willing to discuss this with him in a calm and serious manner (which it seems that you are), then he needs to put his male ego aside and do just THAT! Not all crossdressers are fortunate enough to have a wife who is willing to have some civil discussions this way so he should consider himself very lucky to have someone like you who isn't prone to making snap judgments and issuing ultimatums concerning his need to dress.

The mention of the threat of violence in your initial post is (as others have already pointed out) something that shouldn't be taken lightly. He's probably making his statements due to the experiences he had in his previous marriage, but NO ONE should make idle threats such as this if they are in a loving and trusting relationship.

Finally, in your efforts to learn more about crossdressing, I offer you AND YOUR HUSBAND the material on my web site. There is material there that's applicable to each of you individually as well as collectively. It's clean so you need not have any concerns about seeing anything that would be offensive or embarrassing to you. I would suggest that if you can get him to do so, have your husband sit down WITH you and read through the material TOGETHER and discuss it as you go. Doing so can help clear the air quite a bit.

Dixie -- http://www.geocities.com/senorita_cd

[Ashleigh]

I urge you to get counselling, now, not because of his CD issues but because of the trust issues in your relationship. His hiding things even after you know and are somewhat accepting, his previous history, and his statement about what would happen if you cheated are all red flags to me. You are a wonderful person for being accepting and he needs to understand what a great gift that is. His CDing may be sexual, for me it occasionally is, though much less now as I get older, or it may not be. Again, counselling will help that for both of you. I hope things work out for you....Stephanie

I must ditto here what Stephanie said. When I read your post I immediately got very concerned with his threat to kill you if you cheated. This may have been just a statement, but for anyone to say that, especially a newlywed husband is a real serious warning sign.

I am a retired law enforcement officer and you can believe me when I tell you that when someone says something like that, it is to be taken seriously. Seek out a COMPETENT counselor. Communicate with your husband openly and without accusation or anger. Express your feelings honestly. As for the sexual differences, that is something that only competent counseling can help you and he deal with. We here on the forum can only speculate since we have such limited information. It sounds to me, just on what you wrote, that he may have a self control problem: for example, the threat, the apparent inability to be totally honest with you even though you know what he is doing, and so on.

I, too, applaud your accepting nature and willingness. It is a rarity. Please take care of yourself and don't wait long to get the help you both need. It is not a slam or indication of anything negative to seek out professional help on a problem, especially one such as this.

I am not trying to panic you, in fact don't panic, however if the situation is allowed to escalate through time, the results could have a negative result. I have investigated too many domestic disturbances in my time and have seen way too much to say otherwise.

Also, feel free to keep us up to date and although we are not licensed counselors, we will help the best way we can.

Take care.

A :doll:

[Alice B]

I think you need to sit down and talk to him. Let him know what you have found and what your concerns and how you feel are. It may be that he wants to dress and have sex with you and if you can handle that (asking a lot) the problem may go away. It will be a difficult talk, but if done openly, without hostality it could prove very productive for both of you. You are very special to accept what he has told you and to come here fro advise. The opinions in this group will be deverse and give you a lot of options, but the final decision will have to be yours.:hugs:

[Corrine GG]

I really appreciate all the kind words and advice. I didn't really expect it.

There was one post I read about how someone treated women with a certain disdain out of guilt for what he was doing. I think my husband does that. He has a horrible relationship with his mother, he basically hates her but talks to her or about 5 minutes everyday. He is so disrespectful to her. When he starts talking to me that way or they way he talks to his exwife...I immediately put a stop to it.

I wish he would accept his female side and become how most of you are...more loving and kind. I once thought that extra testosterone would help with his drive but it worries me that the angry side of him might be more prevalent.

[Mary L]

Some CDers are mightily embarrassed by the fact that they do so. I am one. My wife knows, we talk about everything, but I find it excruciating to talk about this because it is so out of character for me. And, my wife does not really want to know details because my femme side is not what/whom she married. Regardless, some of us are just plain embarrassed about being CDers. If your husband is embarrassed, maybe you can use that by playing sexual games with him that include some small element of crossdressing by him or both of you. Then, maybe you could help him with clothes for future games.There is a very high likelihood he'd enjoy that.
Good luck.
Mary

[Kerry Owens]

Connnie, 2 more posts and you can join the ladies forum, it's our li'l corner of the community!

[Corrine GG]

We talked a little last night about "extracurricular sexual activity". He said that he doesn't get it on alone anymore since we got married. I know all guys say that though....here is the part that worried me, he said, "I would never have sex with another woman, you are all I need." Now that I am taking everything so LITERALLY, does that mean that he might still have sex with another MAN? I think I am so over the top about all of this I can't think straight anymore.

[Sheri 4242]

We talked a little last night about "extracurricular sexual activity".

Well, I say never assume!!! Two things you mention make it incumbent that you ask for clarity!!! First, he "doesn't get it on alone anymore since (y'all) got married" isn't an absolute statement that he is monogamous. Second, neither is his subsequent statement that you gave about him saying he never would have sex with any other woman but you. While these "sound" good, they have obviously raised questions in your mind. That said, you deserve the truth b/c without it "trust" cannot exist. Since those could be carefully worded "on purpose," and as such, self-serving, your best option is to ask him!!! He might act wounded at first, but you are dealing with a great deal and now is the time for some plain talk!!!

[Corrine GG]

I guess I am as afraid of asking the questions as he must be of me asking him. You are right,trust is everything and I have to figure out a way to rebuild that trust.

He is coming in from a business trip tonight. He thought he might have to spend the night so he packed a bag. I wonder if he took some things with him. Sometimes it feels surreal.....

[sandra-leigh]

The sexual aspect of CDing - even when it does not involved another human - is a form of cheating in my opinion. Especially when the SO's physical needs are not being met.

Tree, I notice you were careful to state that this was your personal opinion. Most of the time when people are clear on that, I don't reply, because it's an opinion, and we all start from different knowledge bases and experiences, so your opinion is correct and true to you.
Still, I find that I would like to ask that you reconsider that particular opinion.

I have no basis to give a GG viewpoint on this particular matter, because other than this poster and one other poster, I don't think I've ever had any GG tell me that they weren't getting as much "makesexytime" as they wanted. There might be plenty out there, but they don't talk to me about it, so I have little to go on in that regards. Thus, of necessity, I can only present from the male perspective.

What I have found in following a number of threads, is that there are a number of male posters who have indicated that their physical needs are not being met. For some of those, that difficulty started (or became acute) when they revealed their crossdressing, but others have reported that it predates their crossdressing completely, or that their wives don't suspect a thing about their crossdressing but the physical component is missing in action. A small number have reported that their wives would if they could, but have some malady that makes it impossible/impractical. There are also some posters who report having live seperately from their wives for years, while still remaining married.

You used the phrase, "Especially when the SO's physical needs are not being met." But "Especially" implies that the conclusion would still be true even if the antecedant is false. Thus, you have included in your opinion the cases where the SO's physical needs are being met, but the CD's aren't.

The time frame we are talking about is years. 3 years with no nooky, 5 years; as I recall, one of the well-known posters indicated 7 years. I have a vague and uncertain memory that one poster indicated 23 years doing without, but I might be confusing that with another time-frame altogether.

In the opinion you expressed, the person who "took care of themselves" once a decade of circumstantial abstainance, would still be "cheating". Is that fair, that someone who isn't getting any and isn't likely to get any for months or years more, must, "morally speaking", hold it in? Even if that's what allows the marriage to survive, since the needs of the body can be hard to repress? Are you aware that there are health risks associated with getting excited but not expelling, fluids produced in that case that are better not re-absorbed?

As I recall, one of the posters hinted feeling of an implied insult, "Aren't I enough woman for you?". Unfortunately the honest answer for a number of posters would apparently have to be "No; we don't even do it on my birthday anymore, let alone any other time." :(

[megan163]

Hi Corina,
You are very sweet simply for making the attempt to accept on any level - like "just not in front of me or kids" type. I think most of us can understand your initial shock at the discovery of this side of your man. He really should have told you before marriage. I noticed you got married in October. Halloween is a common "coming out" time. How long did you date for prior? Did he ever give any clues? I agree with you that he should be more attuned to your desires for intimacy and if the reason is he is withdrawing into his CD, that doesn't make for a healthy relationship. I would definitely seek a counselor's help.

[CarolDonna]

Hello all, I am the SO of a man I just married in October. I found out about his CDing in January so imagine my surprise. I am very open about this (he told me it was only panties) but I am discovering more things he is hiding from me. It hurts me.
I guess I can be one of those "as long as it's not in front of me or the kids" SO's. I'm not sure how to be anything else. He came in from a business trip and I found his heels before he could hide them.
Here is the major issue I have with it...I am a very sexual woman...He doesn't seem to need the same level of sexual activity so I am wondering if the CDing is sexual for him. This makes me feel slighted in that area. He has expressed that if I ever cheated on him he would kill me...but if his CDing is sexual for him, isn't that cheating on me? He is getting fullfillment somewhere else and I have nothing.
I don't know how to BE, I want to be accepting, I love him. I hope I came to the right place, I can't imagine going to a therapist about this.
Maybe I need to talk with SO's of other CDers. Who the hell knows? I am so confused about my feelings about it all.
{{{{{Corinne}}}}}
I started to read some of the comments. I didn't finish them because I didn't want to bias my opinion.

Being a CD is a stressful thing. Most people probably think we are freaks. It's something we enjoy, yet it's something we rarely can share with others.

It's a bit different for every CD. For me, some of it is a feeling-thing. I like women's clothes. I mean, look at what men are supposed to wear! Grey suits, white or blue shirts, black or brown shoes. I like the feeling of silk against my thighs.

Some of it also is sexual. It's a turn on for me.

However, the turn on pales in comparison to how my wife turned me on. She's my ex-wife now, partially due to the cding. She never understood that my cding wasn't in competition with her. I love women and I love the female body. All I am when I am dressed is a poor facsimile of that.

I hope you and your H can come to terms. I also am troubled by his veiled threat about if he ever finds you cheating. I suppose it's possible that he's just overreacting to his CDing and trying to show you he's a man. Whether he is or not, I don't think it's cool.

But stop and look at the situation. From my perspective (which won't mirror his because all humans are unique), if I found a woman who would accept me the way I am, and who really jazzed me, and if I really jazzed her, I'd be in heaven. I didn't want to be a crossdresser. However, I am what I am. I'm scared, because I know so many women will not accept me. It makes it difficult to open up. My troubles don't excuse my past behavior or your husband's behavior in terms of not opening up to you sooner. Still, I feel it's important to consider what we have had to go through.

Picture waking up one day and finding that your religion had been banned. You know if you practice your religion you will be ostracized, yet you still want to practice it. You know that if your spouse finds out about your religion, your marriage will suffer. That feeling is a little like what some of us feel, which makes it difficult to open up to people.

I loved my ex-wife, and still do; deeply. She thinks I am flawed because I am a crossdresser. I'm not angry with her because of that; I merely accept the reality. But it is tragic that our marriage had to end over something that in my mind was not an issue. She was the love of my life. I, no matter how feminine I try to be, never would be able to compete with her femininity. I miss her.

I hope you two can reach a better resolution than did my ex-wife and I.

Carol

[noname]

I believe what's good for the goose is good for the gander. Basically, don't ask him to do anything that you don't.

[kittypw GG]

[QUOTE=tess-leigh;899491What I have found in following a number of threads, is that there are a number of male posters who have indicated that their physical needs are not being met. For some of those, that difficulty started (or became acute) when they revealed their crossdressing, but others have reported that it predates their crossdressing completely, or that their wives don't suspect a thing about their crossdressing but the physical component is missing in action. A small number have reported that their wives would if they could, but have some malady that makes it impossible/impractical. There are also some posters who report having live seperately from their wives for years, while still remaining married.

:([/QUOTE]


Tess-leigh,
You say a "number of threads" and a "small number have reported". It is my expirence that MOST of the women who are wives of cd's have the complaint that their husbands have a seemingly lower sex drive than their own. A lot of wive's also complain that their cd partners indulge in fantasy and porn frequently. If this takes away from a MUTUALLY satisfying sexual life then I am in total agreement with Tree that it is a form of cheating. If either partner is over-indulging in a sex life for one and there is no energy left over for the partner then yes I would definately call this a form of cheating because that is essentially what you are doing. Cheating your partner out of an intimate sexual relationship. Kitty

[Angie G]

HI Corrine how are you well it's not always sexual hun some of us dress just
Because we like womans things like skirts and house , heel you get the ieda
hun :hugs:
Angie

[Tamera]

What one CDer done does not reflect the actions of another CDer. Our levels of CD are different depending on the person.

Seems he has kept his CD a secret for a LONG time and does not quite know how to handle, or tell you how much involvement there is.

Seems a talk is needed to open the air.
LOL
Tamera

[countrygirlGG]

Well, I can't speak for anyone else & I don't try too! I found out after we had married for 10 yrs. I confronted him & he didn't try to hide the fact that he was CDing but also didn't care to open up & talk either. Yes, I was supportive,very willing to work on our relationship, the CDing wasn't what bothered me, it was all the lying,deciet & hiding that hurt me. It's been about 6 months since I found out,we don't talk,he hasn't been intimate with me since he started do all this behind my back in well over a year. He lies about "going to work", working ALL weekend long, day & night. Not coming home for days on end. No, you have every instinct to think he's being sexually excited else where & by some one else.Again I'm not speaking for ANYONE else here but just be careful.Try to get him to talk, open up, get professional help,what ever works for you but yes, I would be apprehesive of his actions & attitude.I wish you more luck than you know.

[kristine239]

... might be to atteding, together one of the many CD/transgender conferences located all over the US at various times. Check out a few that are listed in the Up Comming events on this board.

At almost all of the conferences you will find many SOs with similiar points that you cover as well as very experienced health care professionals that are able to make some suggestions that may be of help.

I do not know where you are located, but if I did I might know of a conference in your general area.

You are not alone and others have walked the path that you are on now.

Love Kristine
www.transeventsusa.org

[battybattybats]

Tess-leigh,
You say a "number of threads" and a "small number have reported". It is my expirence that MOST of the women who are wives of cd's have the complaint that their husbands have a seemingly lower sex drive than their own. A lot of wive's also complain that their cd partners indulge in fantasy and porn frequently. If this takes away from a MUTUALLY satisfying sexual life then I am in total agreement with Tree that it is a form of cheating. If either partner is over-indulging in a sex life for one and there is no energy left over for the partner then yes I would definately call this a form of cheating because that is essentially what you are doing. Cheating your partner out of an intimate sexual relationship. Kitty

Well from my personal experience, my drive has been very high, a lot higher than my partners and porn never prevented me once from fulfilling her needs. Now being emotionally upset, that has devestated my drive. Being insulted without a later apology (for being a CD and for non CD things) also devestated my drive. Resentment at having someone else impose their views over me, prevent my dressing, censor what I view or read.. that really devestated my drive.

I wonder if some of the other SO's might be suffering because of these causes rather than because the CD's needs are met other ways?

Considering how much more satisfying intimacy with a human being you are emotionally attached to is I'd expect that there would be something else wrong if any self-satisfaction were affecting the rest of the sex-life.
Now it could be exhaustion from work or illness (the degree of effort is a lot different), back pain or other physical problem (most men just keep these to themselves and don't tell anyone about them), emotional upset that the CD doesn't want or isn't able to articulate, a strong sexual desire fetish or need that the SO doesn't want to fulfil or that the CD isn't comfortable in asking for, stress that the CD doesn't know how else to relieve (so uses it as a coping mechanism).. etc

I'm also disturbed by the notion that there is a particular level of performance that the husband is obligated to achieve. That idea alone is enough to drive many men to self-satisfaction out of fear stress and pressure (I don't think women have any clue how big an issue that can be for some guys!). Also it seems very unsound idealogically.. I mean the idea that any level was required of women was strongly attacked by the early feminist movement for reasons I strongly agree with. I don't think it's ok to say that a wife has a claim on the body of the husband or a right to expect a certain standard or to allow or disallow behaviour that might effect it.

That said clearly a mutually satisfied sex life is a good ideal for both partners to aspire to but I don't think it's a right. If CDing is sexual in nature then keeping that out of the mutal sex life might stop it from being wholly satisfying to the CD. It'd be wrong to force it into the mutual life to the detriment of the SO's satisfaction so it'd be wrong to exclude the self satisfaction side of it for the same reason surely?

Where things are demands, where there is expectations or notions of ownership of spouses bodies and behaviour, those things seem to me to be hostile, possessive, fearful and emotionally toxic. Likely to breed resentment. The same problems could be addressed by tolerance, acceptance of needs, talking without judging, requesting without expecting and exploring.

For example if a CD husband has bi fanatasies are they going to feel comfortable expressing those to their SO? They may not want to stray and there could be ways that they could safely explore some aspects of those fantasies within the safe confines of a monogamous relationship if their SO could be comfortable with that but how many would be willing to take that risk and express that? How many SO's would just react to that out of fear and insecurity with outright hostility?

As most straight non-cd men regularly view porn and masturbate, and 1 out of 3 viewers of porn are women the degree that this has to do with CDing is very slight indeed except that the activities are often concurrant and the dressing an additional turn-on in an otherwise common activity.

I think fear of infidelity and maybe a lack of ownership of responsibility for personal sexual satisfaction could be a problem for many SO's. I've met a number of GG's who had high sex drives but because of a guilt issue with satisfying themselves they put unfair pressure on their partners as they made their partner obligated to provide them with all their sexual satisfaction.
This destroyed at least one relationship I know of that would have survived if only the GG could have overcome her guilt issues with owning her own pleasure. She ended up cheating because for her it was more wrong to give herself that pleasure than to get it from someone outside the relationship! She felt that keeping her satisfied was her partners duty and when he couldn't keep up she felt that it was his fault that she was forced to look elsewhere for it! If she had just looked at porn and satisfied herself once in a while they could still be together now.

[Sheila]

Hello all, I am the SO of a man I just married in October. I found out about his CDing in January so imagine my surprise. I am very open about this (he told me it was only panties) but I am discovering more things he is hiding from me. It hurts me.
I guess I can be one of those "as long as it's not in front of me or the kids" SO's. I'm not sure how to be anything else. He came in from a business trip and I found his heels before he could hide them.
Here is the major issue I have with it...I am a very sexual woman...He doesn't seem to need the same level of sexual activity so I am wondering if the CDing is sexual for him. This makes me feel slighted in that area. He has expressed that if I ever cheated on him he would kill me...but if his CDing is sexual for him, isn't that cheating on me? He is getting fullfillment somewhere else and I have nothing.
I don't know how to BE, I want to be accepting, I love him. I hope I came to the right place, I can't imagine going to a therapist about this.
Maybe I need to talk with SO's of other CDers. Who the hell knows? I am so confused about my feelings about it all.

Just a reminder of what this thread was originally about

[Corrine GG]

HI Corrine how are you well it's not always sexual hun some of us dress just
Because we like womans things like skirts and house , heel you get the ieda
hun :hugs:
Angie


I hate to say this but I am hoping like hell that is how it is for him. I do feel that if he is getting his 'kicks' from this while leaving me hanging saying that I am 'insatiable' then he is "Cheating" on me. Even if it's with his hand. If he leaves my bed after I ask him to have a little fun (rejecting me) and then he gets up to go shower but puts on some little something then jacks off in the shower....how am I supposed to feel?

I am not sure about the shower part but I know he sneaks around before he showers in the morning.

[sandra-leigh]

Tess-leigh,
You say a "number of threads" and a "small number have reported". It is my expirence that MOST of the women who are wives of cd's have the complaint that their husbands have a seemingly lower sex drive than their own.

Like I said in the paragraph before that,
[QUOTE=tess-leigh]There might be plenty out there, but they don't talk to me about it, so I have little to go on in that regards.

I summarized what I've read in the postings, and what I've read in the postings is that there are a notable number of CDs who haven't been intimate with their partners for years; most of them seemed disappointed that that was the case.

Does the average male CD have lower drives than their spouse? I don't know -- I haven't seen sufficient evidence one way or another. There might perhaps be lots of such evidence in postings I haven't happened to see (e.g., because the postings are in the GG forum). I don't think I've seen more than two males come out and say that their wifes have stronger drives. I can't assess whether I've just missed those postings, or if guys just don't usually say such things even when true -- or if I'm not seeing many such postings because possibly their aren't many such guys here. (And there's also the statistical possibility that there are tons of such male CDs but that they tend not to find or post here.) Absence of evidence is not evidence of absence.

All I can report on is what I do see.

You reported, kitty, a bunch of circumstances under which you thought certain actions would constitute "cheating", but you did not indicate any circumstances under which you would agree that the actions are not "cheating". Tree GG's statement as phrased, the one I replied to, didn't allow any leeway: in her phrasing, any self-satisfaction during a relationship was "cheating", even if there had been no intimacy for years (e.g., medical reasons, lack of drive by the SO, or SO couldn't accept an intimate relationship once they knew the partner was a crossdresser.)

[Tree GG]

One of Corrine's original statements: "...but if his CDing is sexual for him, isn't that cheating on me? He is getting fullfillment somewhere else and I have nothing."

I have read Tess & Batty's well expressed comments and did reconsider, but in all honesty my opinion remains the same. I have felt what Corrine is expressing.

Batty's point is well taken that no-one can "demand" physical performance of another. However, in a traditional marriage (pick almost any ceremony), there is a promise there, both stated & implied, that the couple has a physical committment to each other. "...Keeping yourself only unto him/her..." I am not demanding of him - he willfully promised that. It is definitely a 2 way street full of compromise and grey area but I believe my sexual energies should be primarily directed toward him - and vice versa.

Here Tess has a good point - should a CD partner "do without" if the partner is unwilling/unable? I have known of relationships that were not physical for years - most ended. I think those that stay together are doing it for reasons other than love. There may be a valid partnership of some kind, but it is not the intimate partnership that I have known and want to continue having with my husband. To each his own, and I will not 2nd guess anyone's decision to stay in their relationship for whatever reason - and those abstaining relationships have made a mutual agreement to dismiss the physical portion of the agreement. That wouldn't be cheating, IMO, but I don't believe Corrine to be in that situation.

I do not want to "control" his body or what he does with it, as I would not relinquish my personal control. And I am not taking the position that self-satisfaction is 100% wrong all the time. From a GG SO perspective, when it is discovered that your partner is a CD and that CDing has a sexual component for him that he is unwilling/unable to bring into the couple relationship, the "woman in the mirror" becomes very real. Skewed, inaccurate, incomplete understanding, insecure, justifiable - maybe all of the above. I am not saying one is right or one is wrong - I'm just saying the feelings of being "replaced" or "2nd choice" are very, very real for the SO.

At the risk of sounding needy, vulnerable & insecure (probably true but let me have a shred of denial left), one of the greatest things about the life partner relationship is knowing he was attracted to me physically as well as emotionally. He wanted me and I want him. CDing can throw doubt onto that belief, and that's a sad, bitter reality to come to terms with. A beautiful naivete of "happily ever after" is in danger of dying. It being dismissed as unrealistic and therefore irrelevant can't be good.

As almost always, good honest, direct communication of these feelings will usually fix the expectation and doubt problems. But newly out CD's aren't really known for wanting to talk about such things and seem to retreat quickly when approached with a sensitive issue.