dose any one have any idea why we a not accepeted in the real world

[Shining Star]

dose any have any idea on why we aren't realy acepetes in the world.
i just think it come down to most of the others a to jelous or just to pigheaded in this world to accepet us for who we are

[Richelle]

People are afraid of change and that is what we represent but challenging the status queue by wearing dresses and makeup.

At least that is my humble opinion.

Richelle

[Priscilla1018]

Hi Star,

I think it has more to do with wanting to place people in categories. If you can be put in this group or that group,society is happy. We don't belong to any one catagory, we cross gender lines which scares the shit out of some people(usually the narrow minded).We blur gender because we are both male and female. So many are not willing to accept us for that reason.

Love and Hugs,
Priscilla

[StephanieCD]

We are all taught as early as kindergarten:

Boys go in this potty and girls go in that one.
Girls like pink boys like blue.
etc.

I was a preschool teacher for a year or two pretty recently... it occurred to me often... sometimes boys would dress up in the girl clothes... when they were early 4s or older 3s it never occurred to any of them. But as they progress through the 4 year old group the boy/girl thing is really driven home. They become aware of gender differences and seek friendship with those they understand. As they approach 5 it now becomes funny or even not cool to dress up in the girl clothes - they start saying things like "girls do that" or "that's a girl job". Sometimes parents (particularly obviously homophobic males) would scoff, ridicule or even scold their child when they saw them crossing gender lines in play... As a male in the field I made it a point to set an example and tell them my favorite color is pink (it's not), I like to cook, and girls can do anything boys can (even pee standing up - I was shocked to be proven wrong once). I even dressed up in the pink dress in my class and always made a point to include the girls in the "boy" games - gender was, for reasons only 'we' know, a big issue for me in my class.

I'm proud to say that the kids in my class asked "why" when a new kid yelled "BOYS AGAINST GIRLS" on the playground! And they didn't even know what cooties were ;)

It begins early. We are, after all, simply grown up children - teach a child tolerance and you build hope for those to follow us.

[donnie123abc1]

Star, honey, haven't you figured it out yet?!!
We ARE the REAL WORLD!!!
Everybody else is just an imatation of someone else!
We are the only truely real people here. Just us few.
The few....the proud...The CROSS DRESSED!!


Dawn Marrie "Thats WHO i BE!"

[KatieAnne]

Honey, we are accepted in the world, just not in this part of the world. Stereotyping is typical in the U.S. Whereas europe on the other hand has accepted cd, tg, gay, lesbian, lifestyle a long time ago. There are a lot of communities in cities where we are accepted and it's getting larger every day. Get out there and see for yourself. ;)


KatieAnne aka: Bitch-in-Boots :) :rolleyes:

[StephanieCD]

Honey, we are accepted in the world, just not in this part of the world. Stereotyping is typical in the U.S. Whereas europe on the other hand has accepted cd, tg, gay, lesbian, lifestyle a long time ago.

I think some of our friends from across the pond might disagree with you. Though, I'll admit - they're MORE accepting by far than the US.

[Julia Legs]

I think it all depends on where you are,as in the city or town you live in.I have found that some of those who don't accept us is because they think we are living in a fantasy world and trying to act on it.I feel the most important thing is We Accept who we are and not let others tell us how were supposed to be.Their not us,if they were,they might feel diferently.In my opinion.

[crispy]

I have found that some of those who don't accept us is because they think we are living in a fantasy world and trying to act on it. I feel the most important thing is We Accept who we are and not let others tell us how were supposed to be.
Underneath I am living in a fantasy world, and I don't want or expect the 'real world' to accept that. Anyway much of the satisfaction is doing something forbidden, something different, something kinky. I love it. :cool:

[Rachel Ann]

Are you kidding, Star?

In the USA, most people seem to feel threatened by lesbians, gays and transsexuals. We non-op TGs are even more marginalized. I grew up being warned about "perverts" coming on to me - as though all straight men are irresistably attractive to all gays! Then there was "Oh God, one of them was using our shower room!"

Maybe it's different in Australia, I don't know because I haven't been there in 30 years.

Where these fears come from remains the subject of much debate. Throughout history, people have wanted to contain and control that which they don't understand. Also, in a patriarchal society the notion of a woman wishing she were a man is considered reasonable, but the idea of a man wishing he were a woman - or just more like one - is thought of as a pathology. There are many others theories, most probably equally valid. But, I don't want to write a book here.

My area is about as accepting of GLBT folks on a public level as any, but what people say publicly to be PC and what they say when they think none of "them" are around ain't always the same. :rolleyes:

The funny thing is, my wish to keep this from family and friends is not really about about what they would think of me - most of them would try to at least appear to be accepting. I just don't want to put them through those changes. Especially my son.

Good thread. I'm looking forward to hearing from more of the family.

[Marlene4a]

I think because we are crossdressers. Male to female that is.
It is accepted Female to male, because they are coming up the social ladder. Male to female is going down the social ladder.

Real Truth. It is a man's world. Face it.

[christine marie]

i was jst tellin a close friend the otherday that i wish we lived in a world where i can walk out the door dressed however i want.but unfortunatly some people in society do not accept our lifestyles.i believe deep down in evry guy,when they do see a cd,that their own fantasies run wild.
luv christine marie

[RhondaLynn]

My perception of our lack of acceptance by 'society' is two-fold, but shares a common foundation - intimidation.

Most men are attracted to women's clothes, and most men have dressed in them at some point in their lives. However, the act or thought of the act causes most men to question their sexuality, and in the homophobic turmoil that society instills upon us during our primary socialization, they cannot accept the fact that we all have masculine & feminine traits, and to express and explore ourselves without fear of compromising our sexuality is beyond their grasp. So, they are unaccepting, since accepting us would mean they would have to accept themselves, which they can't do.

Women in our society are socialized from an early age to go to great lengths to assert and accentuate their sexuality. They go to great lengths to find the right makeup, the right hair style & color, the right clothes for every occasion, to identify & correct any flaw in their appearance, etc. They constantly compete with other women to 'keep up' with the pack. The thought of having men to compete with as well threatens them, and makes them question their own sexuality. Why would a man choose to express himself as a woman? What is wrong with their sexuality that would drive a man to this extreme? The concept sends them into a wingspin of self-doubt and confusion. So they tend not to accept us - we are a threat that they don't know how to deal with.

However, I would say that some women are far more capable of acceptance of us than are men. Women who understand that we are not a threat to their sexuality, and identify with our desire to experience their side of the gender fence. I have known a few, and they can become close friends with the knowledge of your acceptance of your other side.

But most men, even if they have a secret desire to dress, will shun you, afraid that they will begin to question their own sexuality if they accept you.

I've known a few guys who have discovered my acceptance and expression of my feminine side and had no problems accepting it A few were crossdressers themselves (although we never 'shared'). A few just stated that 'yeah, i've heard of it - i've read that most men who crossdress are heterosexual', and they drop it.

One friend I've known for over 20 years just outed himself that he's gay. I just outright told him one day about Rhonda. He was kinda shocked (had never suspected it), but was totally understanding. He's into men though, and Rhonda is a woman, so there's no attraction on his part. When I told him I had pictures, he seemed interested - when he saw them, he said "OMG - those are YOUR legs??? They're amazing !!!". (refer back to the women being jealous & threatened part).

anyway, i've rambled enough for now. Sorry I took up so much space on your thread.

[Tristen Cox]

Truth? Sex. Not only do people not want change, they always think it's a sexual thing attached that they can't comprehend. And why not? When you go surfing on the net all you see mostly is she-males, tranny sex and the like. All people take us for are sex crazed and pointless. They think we live in a fantasy that lasts as long as it takes to get off and then it's over til the next time we get horny. For those with serious gender disphorias and people who don't dress to arouse themselves or others, things are stiffled by the ones who do announce how 'turned on' they get. The few who take themselves more serious and try to make our image better, get buried by the public who has been given the impression it's all for sexual release. Sex may sell magazines or movies, but sex doesn't make someone believe in a certain lifestyle unless they want to in the first place. And how can understand the rest of us when they first hear about someone who likes to masturbate while dressed? We won't be taken seriously until we take ourselves seriously. We have to live twice as hard and be twice as smart as the rest of the world. It's not about educating them, it's about educating ourselves. So far we've only made a small dent. It will work better when we can separate the truth from the fantasy. Ok soaps melting, time to step off now.


Love
T

[Wendy me]

ok why we are not accepeted in the real world real easy .no it is ...
we all of us know why many real good thoughts here. yes thay are.........but we are missing the real reason................................
ok the real reason is that we don't accepete us ..........you know oh ok you don't ..........is this you or some one that you know?????????.........that for what ever reason hates or dislikes anouther girl ???????put your hand down ........yes we have to accepete each outher ....from the girl jerking off in pantyhose to the girl on her way to s.r.s..........................yes if we fight and be close minded then we can't and won't ever be accepted as who we want to be as we are not together .......so start with your selfe ........and accepete your selfe as who you are love you and when you got that ....step up and be a sister you don't have to swap spit you just got to accepete all your sisters for who and what thay are ..................pass no judgements.......after all sister your a guy in a dress..........all by your slefe ...........all to gether we are sisters ...........

[Amelie]

Truth? Sex. Not only do people not want change, they always think it's a sexual thing attached that they can't comprehend. And why not? When you go surfing on the net all you see mostly is she-males, tranny sex and the like. All people take us for are sex crazed and pointless. They think we live in a fantasy that lasts as long as it takes to get off and then it's over til the next time we get horny. For those with serious gender disphorias and people who don't dress to arouse themselves or others, things are stiffled by the ones who do announce how 'turned on' they get. The few who take themselves more serious and try to make our image better, get buried by the public who has been given the impression it's all for sexual release. Sex may sell magazines or movies, but sex doesn't make someone believe in a certain lifestyle unless they want to in the first place. And how can understand the rest of us when they first hear about someone who likes to masturbate while dressed? We won't be taken seriously until we take ourselves seriously. We have to live twice as hard and be twice as smart as the rest of the world. It's not about educating them, it's about educating ourselves. So far we've only made a small dent. It will work better when we can separate the truth from the fantasy. Ok soaps melting, time to step off now.


Love
T

Tristen, what you say here is so right. As Cds, most here are not just wearing the clothes of the opposite sex while in public. Most are also showing thier sexuality, out in the open, this is what society fears. Read some of the threads here at this forum, you will read that most Cds get off while wearing womens' clothes. Some even get off while wearing these clothes in public. These stories are all in the threads of this forum, they are not only in the She-Male sites. This is what the public sees, when a CD is out in public, someone who is getting a sexual thrill while walking around. You can understand why they don't want to accept CDing. To them it is similar if someone into S&M was to walk around town in bondage gear and a ball stuck in his mouth. For most CDs, dressing is sexual, it's written in these forums. For some it is not, this is the CD spectrum. We have many different types of people on this spectrum. But society only views the sexual aspect of the spectrum. And they don't want it walking around the streets.
As someone said here already, there are places that are more accepting than others. If a CD really wants to live a life where he would be more tolerated, it might be better if he moved to a more tolerant city and stop complaining how he can't go out where he lives. Many immigrants have moved from their homelands for a better life, so can a CD.
My personal opinion:
Piss on society, I don't look for acceptance. I don't care what others think of me, I will do what I want. Sometimes one must stand up for what they believe. All I want are the laws of the land to be enforced. If someone bashes me, I want him to go to jail. Living in the city, this is what is done to the bashers.
Amelie

[Deborah757]

Non-acceptance of TGs is ingrained from 3000 years of cultural development.

Our western society evolved from ancient Greek and later Roman culture. To this was added ancient Jewish values in the form of Christianity. None of these were accepting of those like us. In ancient Greece homosexuality was practiced but only between men and boys and sometimes men and male slaves. Any hint of passiveness or effeminacy in an adult male was ostracized. Rome condemned homosexuality even more than Greece, notwithstanding the behavior of a couple of the emperors. To this was added Jewish cultural values that only reinforced what the people already believed.

I don’t believe crossdressing will ever be accepted in the west because its non-acceptance is embedded. It may be tolerated to an extent, but not accepted. Transsexuality however probably would be accepted if science can ever demonstrate there is pre-birth causality in brain development.

I also agree that the sexual component mentioned by others weighs heavily against acceptance of CDs. If people think we are all perverts they will want nothing to do with us.

[crispy]

Most men are attracted to women's clothes, and most men have dressed in them at some point in their lives. However, the act or thought of the act causes most men to question their sexuality, and in the homophobic turmoil that society instills upon us during our primary socialization, they cannot accept the fact that we all have masculine & feminine traits, and to express and explore ourselves without fear of compromising our sexuality is beyond their grasp. So, they are unaccepting, since accepting us would mean they would have to accept themselves, which they can't do.

..................

But most men, even if they have a secret desire to dress, will shun you, afraid that they will begin to question their own sexuality if they accept you.


Rhonda, that's the best explanation I've ever read. No need to apologise for that. :)

[crispy]

Amelie and Tristen: your assessments are probably honest and accurate, but this discussion is in danger of segregating the sheep from the goats - the sex-kick brigade from the gentle girly girls.
Of course there is a wide spectrum, and I guess most of us share some of both characteristics. Are there any CDs out there who do not (or did not in the past) get a sexual thrill out of dressing, in public or in private?

[Fallen Angel]

its simple homophobia, my feelings are this when men make comments about us they have a proublem with there own masculinity

[trinity24]

People fear the unknown, and then they hate what they fear. Closeminded views, religions, politics - all a bunch of BS, made up just to control mindless sheep. There should be one rule, and one rule only: live and let live, as long as you don't hurt anyone else, do whatever your heart desires. I know I won't see it in this life, but who knows what happens when we die.

[Rachel Ann]

Of course there is a wide spectrum, and I guess most of us share some of both characteristics. Are there any CDs out there who do not (or did not in the past) get a sexual thrill out of dressing, in public or in private?Well said, Crispy. For me that's a yes-and-no. When I was younger, there was a strong sexual component in dressing for me, nobody had heard the word "transgender" yet, and I thought that I was just a pervert.

Many of us tend to become less sexual as we get older, and in my case the many medications I take have eliminated sexual craving altogether. I hope this isn't a permanent state of affairs. :p

On the positive side, when Rick heard Rachel calling to him more strongly than ever, it was obvious for the first time that this was something far more than a fetish or a sexual kink. The Internet has changed everything. I then read everything I could find about TG and discovered that was me! :) And, coming to boards like this and discovering how many of us there are was just mind-blowing.

So, I think that the answer is "it depends". Some are sexual around this, some aren't, some change over time, and some don't. I know some TG/CDs for whom it was never sexual in any way.

Some CDs consider themselves to be TG, and some don't. Since gender is "percieved sexual identity", I guess it's a matter of self-awareness and personal choice. Of course, there are people who like to quibble about it. Some TSs say that we "vanilla" CDs aren't really TG, or that we are TSs in denial. I am not going to wander in to that swamp. I know what I am and that's enough for me. :cool:

What I treasure about our community is that everyone picks a place to be on the spectrum, but we all treat each other as sisters. :D

[Rachel Ann]

Of course there is a wide spectrum, and I guess most of us share some of both characteristics. Are there any CDs out there who do not (or did not in the past) get a sexual thrill out of dressing, in public or in private?Well said, Crispy. For me that's a yes-and-no. When I was younger, there was a strong sexual component in dressing for me, nobody had heard the word "transgender" yet, and I thought that I was just a pervert.

Many of us tend to become less sexual as we get older, and in my case the many medications I take have eliminated sexual craving altogether. I hope that this isn't a permanent state of affairs. :p

On the positive side, when Rick heard Rachel calling to him more strongly than ever, it was obvious for the first time that this was, for me, far more than a fetish or a sexual kink. The Internet has changed everything. I read everything I could find about TG and discovered that was me! :) And, coming to boards like this and discovering how many of us there are was just mind-blowing.

So, I think that the answer is "it depends". Some are sexual around this, some aren't, some change over time, and some don't. I know some TG/CDs for whom it was never sexual in any way.

Some CDs consider themselves to be TG, and some don't. Since gender is "percieved sexual identity", I guess it's a matter of self-awareness and personal choice. Of course, there are people who like to quibble about it. Some TSs say that we "vanilla" CDs aren't really TG, or that we are TSs in denial. I am not going to wander in to that swamp. I know what I am and that's enough for me. :cool:

What I treasure about our community is that everyone finds the place on the spectrum that's right for them, but we all treat each other as sisters. :D