It's just clothes!

[StayceeCD]

THIS is what kills me!! What is the big deal??? My wife found out a couple years ago not in a good way.. She found a credit card receipt after me buying some shoes. She thought I was screwing around, wouldn't talk to me, then she got to a place where she actually said it turned her on!! THEN, a COMPLETE about face saying she "can't have this in her life".. Our daughter deserves her Daddy. I've assured her I am the same person.. I've been doing this all my life and have felt the guilt, & ashamed feelings thinking I was a freak. It wasn't till I found sites like this that I realized I wasn't doing anything wrong or freakish..
So there I am back in the closet! We don't talk about it cuz everytime I bring it up, she gets insulting and re-inforces she doesn't want it in her life.. I'm not about to lose my family, and I know I can't stop, so back in the closet I go. It sucks that I can't be open with her about it. I've suggested seeing someone but she says "I'm the one with the problem".. It would be great if she got back to the place where she said it turned her on, but I'd take simple acceptance. Just allow me to dress from time to time! Thats all I need!:sad:

[KarenSusan]

I feel for you, Staycee, be strong.

[My Lady Marsea]

Maybe you're lookin' too good girl. Looking at your Avitor (whatever its called) I would have thought you were out and full timing LOL. It's really too bad she can not accept you, she might be missing some fun "girl" times out. At least you were out for a while which is a good thing I guess but it will tug at your heart and tear you apart. I feel for you. Best of luck & hoping for only the best.:hugs: Hang in there girl

[Linda C]

Wow you have gone though a scenario that I fear - I hope my wife never finds out and if she does I hope she is cool and if she ain't I am not about to give up my family for dressing - wow I truly feel for you - hope things work out for the best :happy:

[Jazzmine]

Well you know your CD won't go away. I'm 50 and I know. It goes underground for a while then screams to come back at any cost. And that can get you into trouble.

I wish I could give you a magic answer but there isn't one. But (hopefully) you still have your own dignity and self-acceptance and that's your starting point.

Next you have to realise you are not two people. You are what you are. Period. Not a schizo! Not a weirdo! No labels! Just YOU!

No one here can give you a logical explanation of why you are a CD to help you explain to your family what it is all about. You know what I mean, a clear well thought out logic that makes sense to all. Oh to have that! Save us all a lot of trouble, that would!

But still here we are. Gathered in a subset of society. The best you can do is stand up for what your heart tells you to do. If family is more important right now then go with that. If closet CD is an option...sigh...join the club. Just always know you are OK and every decision can be over-turned as needs arise and as circumstances change.

Above all have fun!
Hugs Jazzmine

[ErikaLeigh]

I totally undrstand where you are coming from. My wife just found out a few months back, and doesnt really want to talk about it. I only get to go out to the tri-ess meeting once a month, and she knows I go but doesnt know I dress for the occasion. I cant stop either, so I guess this is what I will have to do. I guess the only bright side is neither of us are keeping a secret from the one we love anymore, well for the most part.

Oh, and by the way......... You look AWESOME in that avatar pic!!!!

[noname]

This is the kind of thing I will never understand. It would be like a man telling his wife he just can't allow her to wear pants. It's unacceptable and I just can't have that in my life. I always say, practice what you preach.

[Joanne f]

I feel for you both as it is a big deal for your wife and it is a big deal for you, cursed if you don`t tell and cursed if you do, your wife has had a big shock in her eyes at the moment you are not the man that she married so she is no doubt having a hard time trying to cope and understand that,and on the other side you need to express your feminine side, so as i have thought some times in the passed it is not just clothes for some , it hits at their inner feelings like , i am a woman and you are a man and nothing should interfere with that when it doe`s some can`t cope with it, yet the odd thing is you are the man she married but at the time did not no all of what made you that man she loves.
I hope that you can both work some thing out that will make you both happy.

joanne

[RachelDenise]

Welcome to my life. I really understand. Good luck and I hope you find solutions that work.

[Lilith Moon]

I know how you feel hun.

I had a lot of freedom to dress at work and used to dress several times each week as well as getting out&about sometimes. Since I have been working from home dressing is problematic and I miss it dreadfully...every single day. Being forced back into the closet is a bummer.

[Alice B]

I think that htere are some other insecurities that she is dealing with and counciling would be the answer, but how you get her to go is something that I can't advise on. I wish you luck.:hugs:

[Carol A]

I also understand your problem very well. Took my wife a long time to come around but in the end she told me "I was still the same man she married no matter what cloths I'm wearing".

I believe her problem was she was jealous of me as I wear makeup, earrings, and try to be a proper looking women which she has never done in her life.

I dress everyday and will do so till the day I die.:thumbsup:

[battybattybats]

But is it just clothes?

Or is it differance?
Is it unpredictability?
Is it the terrible freedom of others?
Is it a loss of stability?
Is it change?
Is it making of different choices?
Is it a loss of control?
Is it the consequences to us of the choices of others?

All common sources of fear.
Every day I learn new ways that many people fear and try and restrict the free will of others. Especially those they care about. I know sometimes it can be hard to watch another, especially someone you care about, making choices you think are bad, foolish or even dangerous.

However, beyond expressing our own opinion do we not have an obligation to respect the freedom of others, especially those close to us, to make choices that are not the ones we would have them make.

[Tree GG]

Go read this http://www.crossdressers.com/forums/showthread.php?t=67279

If that doesn't break your heart, nothing will.

And if you believe it is "just clothes" then you really are in a denial that I would be proud to call my own. Face it, crossdressing is a very intimate thing that involves sex and attraction - to varying degrees, of course, but still a factor.

Could it be, and I'm just going out on a limb here, that for whatever reason your wife is perceiving the dressing, your woman within, is more important to you than she? Have you jumped at every opportunity to immerse yourself in the TG community and your femme self while she stands by and continues holding the home fort?

For one week, just one week, make every effort to show by action that your wife and family is the love of your life and no wig, garter or g-string is more precious. Say that one sentence to her, and that's all, but walk the walk for a week. Live it, don't just say it. I'd bet good money her rejection will ease if not subside.

I don't think you all realize just how much your behavior does change. You go about the motions of your daily lives but you start changing things - shaving, eyebrows, posture, reading materials, etc. Admittedly it could be a perception and over sensitivity by the wife but I believe it's a combination of both. We start looking for changes, and darned if we don't find them.

IMO - it is up to the crossdresser to keep this on a positive, non-threatening note. Wives usually don't want to control you, but they want to be confident that your piorities are still in line with their's. Breastforms full steam ahead does not instill a feeling of fun or well being for most wives. :D

[Sheila]

No it is not just the clothes .................... it's the lying, the deceipt, the need to be constantly on your gaurd even in you own home, worrying if the kids, family neighbours find out ..................... and even when we are struggling mentally with those things, having to come to terms that what we thought we had bought into was an exclusive MALE/FEMALE realtionship ........ was in actual fact a lie from the get go (for the majority of us) ..... is in itself tough ............... we try or at least some of us damned well do................. do you have any idea how many times we (BECAUSE WE LOVE YOU AND FOR NO OTHER REASON) actually push ourselves beyhond our own mental comfort zone just so that we can support you in your journey to be free to express your inner being ..... and you insult us by just saying "it's only clothes" :lame::lame:

I love and support My guy, but sometimes you really are sefish inconsiderate idiots.

I could go on but no doubt I will already have got myself into bother .......... Give us a break sometimes

[Joanne f]

No it is not just the clothes .................... it's the lying, the deceipt, the need to be constantly on your gaurd even in you own home, worrying if the kids, family neighbours find out ..................... and even when we are struggling mentally with those things, having to come to terms that what we thought we had bought into was an exclusive MALE/FEMALE realtionship ........ was in actual fact a lie from the get go (for the majority of us) ..... is in itself tough ............... we try or at least some of us damned well do................. do you have any idea how many times we (BECAUSE WE LOVE YOU AND FOR NO OTHER REASON) actually push ourselves beyhond our own mental comfort zone just so that we can support you in your journey to be free to express your inner being ..... and you insult us by just saying "it's only clothes" :lame::lame:

I love and support My guy, but sometimes you really are sefish inconsiderate idiots.

I could go on but no doubt I will already have got myself into bother .......... Give us a break sometimes

Well said as it needed saying ,

joanne

[Tiffy]

It will never just be about the clothes. But it seems that many wives are slipping outta their minds. We have been living with this since birth. Not like we chose at 5 years old to dress in womens clothes because it was gonna p*** everyone off and get our asses kicked. My wife cries each time I read her a story like this and it amazes her how blind many of the SO's are. Like it or not, our SO's married us because we are TG wether they like it or not too. It is what makes us us. And the clothes just are like putting the icing on the cake. Damn cake looks funny with no icing.

Tiffany

[Rosaliy Lynne]

THIS is what kills me!! What is the big deal??? My wife found out a couple years ago not in a good way.. She found a credit card receipt after me buying some shoes. She thought I was screwing around, wouldn't talk to me, then she got to a place where she actually said it turned her on!! THEN, a COMPLETE about face saying she "can't have this in her life".. Our daughter deserves her Daddy. I've assured her I am the same person.. I've been doing this all my life and have felt the guilt, & ashamed feelings thinking I was a freak. It wasn't till I found sites like this that I realized I wasn't doing anything wrong or freakish..
So there I am back in the closet! We don't talk about it cuz everytime I bring it up, she gets insulting and re-inforces she doesn't want it in her life.. I'm not about to lose my family, and I know I can't stop, so back in the closet I go. It sucks that I can't be open with her about it. I've suggested seeing someone but she says "I'm the one with the problem".. It would be great if she got back to the place where she said it turned her on, but I'd take simple acceptance. Just allow me to dress from time to time! Thats all I need!:sad:

I feel for you sister mine, and I do wish there was an easy answer or quick fix but alas, there is not one. BTW you look great. I think women and men have similar feelings when they see a man dressed en femme. BOTH are, or feel, threatened by that person. Seemingly they both reach the same first impression - he is gay. This is where they diverge though. Men feel threatened that they might be gay themselves if they were attracted to the lovely woman they perceived. Women feel threatened that they will lose their man to some other man. That may or may not apply in your case and it is certainly not the entire picture either. Regardless, you have to overcome your wife's very real fears, slowly, patiently, and at the same time reinforce that you are still the man she married and that part of that man is the woman inside. The sum total is who you are and who she loved and still loves. Good Luck and I do hope it works out for you in the long run.


Wow you have gone though a scenario that I fear - I hope my wife never finds out and if she does I hope she is cool and if she ain't I am not about to give up my family for dressing - wow I truly feel for you - hope things work out for the best :happy:

I would not either but I think that the dressing, and the need to hide it, have always worked against me in the long run. Perhaps that is part of the reason I am 3x divorced and currently single.


I feel for you both as it is a big deal for your wife and it is a big deal for you, cursed if you don`t tell and cursed if you do, your wife has had a big shock in her eyes at the moment you are not the man that she married so she is no doubt having a hard time trying to cope and understand that,and on the other side you need to express your feminine side, so as i have thought some times in the passed it is not just clothes for some , it hits at their inner feelings like , i am a woman and you are a man and nothing should interfere with that when it doe`s some can`t cope with it, yet the odd thing is you are the man she married but at the time did not no all of what made you that man she loves.
I hope that you can both work some thing out that will make you both happy.

joanne

Well said Joanne.

[audrey-lynn]

Sorry to hear about your problems. But hang in there. Your wife used to approve of it maybe she'll come back around. I know mine has changed her feelings many times. Just keep a low profile and see what comes of it.

[tommi]

:hugs:I think alot of us are in that boat with you I know I am.
That is what is so nice about this site it gives me a chance to feel normal and feel acceptence.
We can be here for one another with a kind word and I thin it helps.:hugs:

[Desiree2bababe]

It's difficult but you will be happier in the long run if you let family take predecent in your life at this time. One day, you're child will be grown and gone and these days of her needing a Daddy will be sorely missed.

You are a very beautiful cd and I'm sure a handsome man. It would be sad to see a family parted due to the love of clothes. With you understanding her view at this point, it's likely she will understand yours later in life.

I speak from experience.............

Good luck.

[Karren H]

Yeah... Geting discovered sucks for sure.... And going from semi acceptence to complete intollerence makes it even worse.. My wife had simular swings after she found out, also two years ago, but she had turned a blind eye and though she knows I still crossdress, she doesn't want to know.. So I keep it out of her face.. Which I almost like being in the closet.. But it has driven me to find other wats to dress... Still on business trips but on half day vacations around here locally, and it forced me out in public more.. Probabbly more so than I would have on my own.. Out of necessity...

Karren

[JoAnnDallas]

Sorry to hear about your problems. A few weeks ago, my wife found out that I am a CDer. After all the usual questions, she came to the conculsion that me dressing as a woman was really no different than me dressing in custome and going to SciFi cons or playing D&D.

[Melinda G]

Makes me glad I'm not married.

[AlanaBCD]

There are a lot of us that are in the closet. I drop hints to my wife all the time. I do not know if she knows for sure, or she thinks I am just kidding.
When we talk about crossdressing directly (without any hints) she is not happy. So in the closet I stay.
I am able to dress at home when she is gone. It is what it is, if it ever changes, I do not know. I love her and accept that she does not seem to want me to dress, so I leave it where it is. If she ever found out for sure, I could tell her of all the hints I gave her.

[LaFem]

Thanks again Tree, your reply was great. Many times men do not want to accept what a big deal their crossdressing is to their wives and family. Of course there is a sexual component to dressing and acting like a woman. What else would you call it? What else could you call it? How could you possibly deny it?

I see too much "I" and not enough "her." It sounds like someone needs to send the acceptance and tolerance and understanding to the poor woman. Many of us on this forum seek advice on how to gain your SO's understanding and acceptance. Often times it seems to be lessons in spousal manipulation. (Sickening)

If your wife cannot accept your feminine side, well, deal with it and make some changes. If you don't want to lose your family, stay in the closet! Simple! Force the issue and you'll be alone. And don't be mean about it, it's not her fault!

Hey Jess- I understand exactly how you feel, your frustration is totally understandable. I hope some of the "girls" on this forum read and re-read your post. You nailed it.

[TerriM]

I told my wife 25yrs ago after 10yrs of marriage. She still doesnt want to talk about it. But I get out about 1 or 2x if I am lucky a month. The answer for me is balancing the two sides of me. It has been difficult at times, but it can be done. You have to realize that most women do not like their men to look like women. I go away each year to Fantasia fair for 3 days and nights. She hates me going away but we work things out.

Yours Terri

[christina marie]

(scooting over) c'mon in hon,closets a little tight,but it sure is comfy!

[Wendy me]

Staycee hugs first .... my wife knows abought my dressing totally unsupportive ...if it was just clothes god that would be so easy lol.... some times i want to scream your killing me .... see half of me (some times more sometimes less ) is Wendy and she (my wife ) is clue less to that.. i love her truly i do ...

i wonder if our SO'S truly took the time to know more abought this would so many turn a cold shoulder / be accepting??? i hope and i dream that one day my wife understands more of who this person she dose not know and how much this part of me is part of who we are together ..... and i pray for every one out there that ... one day the rest of the world might just get it we are not some freak show but we are your lovers , your family , your Friends , your coworkers .... we are as normal as the rest of the world .... that we belong and we are ok....

i will keep you in my thoughts .....

[MJ]

Go read this http://www.crossdressers.com/forums/showthread.php?t=67279

If that doesn't break your heart, nothing will.

And if you believe it is "just clothes" then you really are in a denial that I would be proud to call my own. Face it, crossdressing is a very intimate thing that involves sex and attraction - to varying degrees, of course, but still a factor.

Could it be, and I'm just going out on a limb here, that for whatever reason your wife is perceiving the dressing, your woman within, is more important to you than she? Have you jumped at every opportunity to immerse yourself in the TG community and your femme self while she stands by and continues holding the home fort?

For one week, just one week, make every effort to show by action that your wife and family is the love of your life and no wig, garter or g-string is more precious. Say that one sentence to her, and that's all, but walk the walk for a week. Live it, don't just say it. I'd bet good money her rejection will ease if not subside.


I don't think you all realize just how much your behavior does change. You go about the motions of your daily lives but you start changing things - shaving, eyebrows, posture, reading materials, etc. Admittedly it could be a perception and over sensitivity by the wife but I believe it's a combination of both. We start looking for changes, and darned if we don't find them.
IMO - it is up to the crossdresser to keep this on a positive, non-threatening note. Wives usually don't want to control you, but they want to be confident that your piorities are still in line with their's. Breastforms full steam ahead does not instill a feeling of fun or well being for most wives. :D

this is so true thank you tree , somehow there must be a way to show our S.O that they are more important than the clothes

but come on tree ***shaving, eyebrows, posture, reading materials, etc *** comes with the Territory don't you think .. balance is the key

[Tree GG]

Admittedly it could be a perception and over sensitivity by the wife but I believe it's a combination of both. We start looking for changes, and darned if we don't find them.

Don't forget that part.....I fully accept my share of the irritation in the relationship. Takes two to succeed & two to fail. But there is change and since "he" brought me into this particular change, it's "he" that needs to accept the responsibility of how he introduces and maintains those changes. Either with me or apart from me (and family). And if I don't like or feel uncomfortable with something, I have the obligation to speak up (hopefully without resentment). If I don't, it festers and I'll see "her" as the cause of my turmoil and out she goes.

Figuritively, it's unfair to redecorate my house to look like his closet. Would he take kindly of me coming into his closet & rearranging it? :heehee: Don't even want to go there!

[Jamie001]

It is also not the fault of the crossdresser that s/he is a crossdresser! Also, for many CDs it is not sexual. I CD to be at peace with myself and to relax. It is like taking a vacation to de-stress. There are two big fallacies that we must loose:

1. Guys that CD are Gay. (FALSE)
2. Guys that CD do it for sexual gratification. (FALSE) Some CD do it for sexual gratification, but a lot of them do it to relax.

Don't you think that if the person could just flip a switch and turn-off the CDing that he would just do it in order not to cause strife for his wife and family? It is not that simple!! It is like being left-handed or being gay. It is part of your core being. Asking someone to completely suppress a major part of their personality can only result in severe depression. Believe me I have been there and would never go there again! It is dangerous to completely suppress this part of your personality.



Thanks again Tree, your reply was great. Many times men do not want to accept what a big deal their crossdressing is to their wives and family. Of course there is a sexual component to dressing and acting like a woman. What else would you call it? What else could you call it? How could you possibly deny it?

I see too much "I" and not enough "her." It sounds like someone needs to send the acceptance and tolerance and understanding to the poor woman. Many of us on this forum seek advice on how to gain your SO's understanding and acceptance. Often times it seems to be lessons in spousal manipulation. (Sickening)

If your wife cannot accept your feminine side, well, deal with it and make some changes. If you don't want to lose your family, stay in the closet! Simple! Force the issue and you'll be alone. And don't be mean about it, it's not her fault!

Hey Jess- I understand exactly how you feel, your frustration is totally understandable. I hope some of the "girls" on this forum read and re-read your post. You nailed it.

[Rhonda Jean]

[QUOTE=StayceeCD;1014581]"I'm the one with the problem".. QUOTE]

I heard the exact same thing. You may want to read my recent posts. Good luck. Big decisions ahead.

[erickka]

Staycee, Been there done that. I still deal with those same problems. Be strong and focused, and hopefully everything will settle to a point that you can cope with.

[LaFem]

I like to dress like the opposite sex.
I like to dress like a woman from the inside out.
I wear artificial breasts.
I wear women's makeup.
I shave my legs and all my body.
I like to act like the opposite sex.
I like to act like a woman.
I try to feel like the opposite sex.
I try to feel like a female.

All of the above are true for me.

Does anyone agree with any or all of what I have just said above?
Does anyone else see that each line has a sexual component?
It seems to me that the "sexual component" of crossdressing is the biggest part of crossdresssing, at least I can't find a way take it out of the definition. (My definition: Crossdresser- A man who dresses like a woman and acts like a woman, at some level.)

How can crossdressing be defined without using sexual terms? The fact that a man dresses like a woman is the essence of crossdressing and is itself a sexual component.

Does it make sense that a wife or SO might see the obvious "sexual component?" Does it make sense that the SO might worry about their partner's true sexuality? Do you think she wonders what you are thinking about when you are fully dressed? (Yes!) Does it make sense that a GG might NOT enjoy or NOT be willing to accept crossdressing as part of a relationship?

I have lots of experience with all aspects of SO crossdressing relationships. I've been there too. I have learned the hard way also.

Many people on this forum have had to make adjustments to their crossdressing because their SOs cannot accept it. There are lots of ways to work around this. Members of this forum do it all the time.

Just as you cannot change your gender issues Staycee, your wife probably cannot change either. If you push your agenda, you may end up with no wife, or you may end up with an angry, disgruntled, falsely accepting spouse. Children and family are strong factors for a woman to feign acceptance of her husband's crossdressing, and
keep a marriage together, even though she hates it. You are in a tough spot Staycee, but you can find a solution.

Good Luck!

[sfwarbonnet]

I read an article on what is accommodation in InsideMS Magazine (Multiple Sclerosis). I think men should be as comfortable wearing women’s clothes as women are in wearing men’s clothing. After all, it's just clothes, right? I usually wear women's clothes in "boy mode," and am comfortable doing so, as women's clothing often offers suitable accommodations for men who are handicapped. Through experience I have found the following:

!) Slacks: Women’s pull on pants are much easier to put on than men’s belted pants. They do not need a fake fly, as the absence of it is usually not apparent, but I prefer non-figured and solid color, non-pastel pants so they are not readily identified as women’s clothing.

2) Briefs: Underwear with a fly is unnecessary with pull on pants. Although there are no-fly men’s briefs, women’s full-cut cotton briefs work just as well, and are cheaper.

3) Slips: Shirttails tend to readily pull out of pull on pants and a bare back is usually uncomfortable when seated. A “solution” is to wear a tank top full slip that is short enough to be worn with slacks. Also they are usually made of a slippery material that makes it easier to pull on pants.

Another lingerie option is an all-in-one shaper with a crotch closure to preclude a pulled out shirttail. Since briefers usually include a bra, finding a large size with a small cup is a challenge so the bra isn't apparent under a shirt.

4) Pantyhose: An MD suggested that I wear support pantyhose to avoid the indentation in my lower legs that mid-calf or knee-high socks make. Pantyhose do not require anything that is not also needed with pull on pants. I expected that opaque ones would be best, so they wouldn't be readily identified as women's hosery, but that isn't necessary and non-opaque pantyhose are more available (especially in summer). I have both off-black and beige nylons.

Another hosiery option is support thigh-highs, but they need to be worn with an equally hard-to-find garter belt, which may be lacy and/or part of a short skirt. However, since a garter belt is an undergarment, feminine characteristics really don’t matter and I would be wearing women’s hosiery and a slip anyway.

5) Skirts: I noted with the short skirt on a garder belt that it is much easier to put on a one holer (skirt) than a two holer (pants) but a skirt would be an outer garment and is not usually part of a male’s wardrobe, so it would need to look like pants when the wearer is seated. I haven’t found a suitable one yet.

6) Purse: Keeping a wallet, comb, notepad, phone, and keys in pants pockets is awkward as it is hard to extract them when seated, and pockets in women’s pull on pants are often not very deep anyway. My “solution” is to use a small shoulder purse, which can either be worn or secured in a basket when that is available.

I posted these suggestions on a forum for for ideas for those with Multi[le Sclerosis. I have summarized the results therefrom as they may be relevant to other CDers..

1) A few people thought that my suggestion for men to wear women's clothkng as an accommodation was "interesting" znd agreed that there is gender discrimination in what is "appropriate" clothing. Some people found the same "problems" that my accommodations addressed, but they suggested alternative solutions that they found more PC.

2) Women posted repiies sayings that they found restrictive clothes uncomfortable. A post confirmed that it is often necessary for both men and women to wear over-the-knee support nylons for swolen lower legs. Also, exposed skin can "stick" to a chair, and that is s uncomfortable.

3) However, the overwhelming response asserted that my motivation was an attempt to justify cross-dressing and that men should only wear menswear and avoid "girl things". Apparently society is not ready to accept a man wearing women's clothing, although they can offer "solutions" for difficulty due to limited flexibility, lousy balance, exposed skin, and swelling of the legs.

Jamie

[sobe1ove GG]

Please... I can't believe you would say they are just clothes and that she shouldn't have a problem.

If they were just clothes, then you wouldn't need to wear them. Obviously she can tell that you need them and that the clothes have bigger meaning. Don't belittle her feelings like that, sheesh.

[Colleentg]

This is a hot topic and it seems to affect so many in the same boat. I was married to a semi-accepting female until she 'got tired of it' and wanted her man back. To put it in a nutshell, I lost everything and more to grant a divorce from her. All I got to keep was my wardrobe! I thought I wanted her more than the clothes, but in truth, I didn't. While I was married, I purged everything three times. But it always came back. If you took all my clothes, it would not change how feminine I feel inside. Clothes can be replaced. You cannot change the person who wears them. If you're wondering, I made several sacrifices. For one, I have not seen my daughter for over eight years. :eek: She accepts her step-dad as her real dad. I'm no longer a part of her life. Of course there is that void in my life, but my happiness comes before anything else. I've accepted defeat.

[battybattybats]

Don't forget that part.....I fully accept my share of the irritation in the relationship. Takes two to succeed & two to fail. But there is change and since "he" brought me into this particular change, it's "he" that needs to accept the responsibility of how he introduces and maintains those changes. Either with me or apart from me (and family). And if I don't like or feel uncomfortable with something, I have the obligation to speak up (hopefully without resentment). If I don't, it festers and I'll see "her" as the cause of my turmoil and out she goes.

Figuritively, it's unfair to redecorate my house to look like his closet. Would he take kindly of me coming into his closet & rearranging it? :heehee: Don't even want to go there!

That is still, in existential terms, bad faith.
You and only you can be responsible for how you handle the choices and actions of others. It's casting blame and/or responsibility upon the CD for being a CD and for your own reactions to external changes. People have a moral duty to recognise and accept and tolerate the differences, different choices and different circumstances of others, not just even if they are close loved ones but especially if they are close loved ones.

Yes it's difficult for people to do but everyone has an obligation to do so. Some people aren't capable of some moral or ethical actions, that doesn't make it any less wrong not to do so though. Many people leave their partners when their partners become disabled or when their looks fade or when they gain weight. Quite a few don't. Many people try and force others to wear certain clothes or buy certain products or follow certain religious beliefs or a whole cornacopia of things. Quite a few don't.

It doesn't matter if it's clothes or eating habits or belief or how one votes. It should be simple. It should be easy to accept. It isn't though. Who has never judged another on such pathetic shallow things as clothing or skin colour or gender or job or income or IQ or attractiveness? To be human is to exist with a limited mentality that works by making swift short-cuts. It was a neccessary survival mechanism when we had to deal with sabre-toothed cats. But it is totally incompatable with advanced notions of fairness, of right and wrong and so we must stretch our thinking, our capacity and we must always fight the lazy and inaccurate ways of thinking that form the basis of all bigotry. We must also remind ourselves that humans are flawed, that we make mistakes.

I listened to a very good program on radio today about forgiveness in South Africa following the atrocities during apartheid. There was a really good point made about how people were able to do horrible things to other people because they were able to de-humanise them, to label them as 'other'. The point was made that by simply calling such atrocities 'evil', by just considering the perpetrators of such crimes 'inhuman' we make them 'other' and we can turn a blind eye to our own reflection.

Tribal thinking.. CDs Vs GGs.. it's emotional, it's rhetorical.. it's evil.
Where has gone simple empathy and compassion?

Crossdressers? Yes we are an oppressed and maligned minority and we have every right to be who we are and no-one... no one has a right or a good reason to oppress us. Neither do they have a right or reason to hate, dislike fear or resent us... but it's human to do so. There aren't any good reasons I've yet heard for people to reject or fail to accept crossdressers either. 'It's hard' sure it is, 'it's not normal' it is very different. I'm sure plenty of white parents whose daughter brought a black man home to dinner wen't through similar emotions.
Significant Others? Yes you were lied to by your upbringing. You were lied to by Sleeping Beauty and Snow White and Cinderella and everything else that showed you what to aim for, what to expect. Prince Charming didn't wear stockings and suspenders in the fairy tale. Then for many you were lied to by someone you care about more than anyone else in the world. Someone who was suposed to be the focus of your life. Your anchor and your foundation. The thing that was supposed to complete you. Whether you were lied to or not still there is that person who has shattered the illusion and shown you that the world is not how you always thought it would be.

Now, everyone go back and re-read the paragraph that applies to their partner. Think about your partner for a second. Imagine what it must be like to be in those circumstances.
GG's, it doesn't matter why he needs to dress just think how horrible and tough it must be to be so desperatly alone and different in a world that has hated that difference for so long that they felt they had to hide. Not that they wanted to but felt they had to or no-one would ever love them, no one would ever care about them.
CD's it's true that you deserve to be free to be who you are, it's true that you should be loved unconditionally... but that's not easy to do. The lies and fear that have oppressed you are the lies and fears that oppress her. The social conditioning that led you to hide, to perhaps scrounge amongst a relatives clothes at first or that made it scary to buy a simple pair of panties, the forces that drive people to 'fit in' that caused so much shame and resentment and purges and likely led you years before you dared even tell yourself you were a crossdresser all that which you have been struggling with for all those years are still operating on her. It's not easy.

It's just too easy to be angry at the other side, to think they have it easy, to think they are selfish, to think that it is their fault. Their fault for bringing it into the relationship.. their fault for not accepting.. their fault for lying... their fault for not understanding... this is all a cop-out, an excuse of self-justification to avoid the personal responsibility for compassion and understanding.

There is not one side who are victims.. both sides are. Neither side is the enemy and neither side is at fault. There is one cause: A hostile and bigoted culture that has demonised and ostracised a significant yet harmless minority and driven them into hiding. This same culture has left all these women unprepared for the possibility that there may be straight men who will love them but who like dressing like women sometimes. The solution? Compassion, knowledge, patience, understanding, advocacy, activism, change.

[Veronica Fallon]

Wow, quite a powerful point you so eloquently made "BattyBats"! I see it as society being the arrogant, egotistical, (but weak & frightened) Army General, who's calling the shots from a safe, protected place, while we (CD's and S/O's) are the hapless grunts on the front lines. It doesn't matter how many of us get destroyed, as long as the General is able to maintain his illusions of normality, piety, & superiority.

Thank you Bats,

Veronica

[Lilith Moon]

Batty,

I'm speechless. Thank you and hope you don't mind me printing out a copy for reference. :hugs:

[Mitch23]

All the real girls I've met have no problem at all with my crossdressing and are very supportive ... but then they don't have to live with it. They can pat me on the head and hand me back - my wife has to live with it and its consequences for her, our relationship, friends family and neighbours ...

Mitch

[Lisa-like]

I'm so sorry to read about your situation with you wife. So many of us struggle with the need to be seen, the need to express our true selves openly to those we love and to the world. Your gender, your "maleness" is comforting to your wife. The expression of your sexuality scares her. But I think people make the mistake of separating gender and sexuality. They're all wrapped together in all kinds of different variations. You're still genetically male, and your sexuality -- which has always included your strong yearning to be female -- was there from the beginning of your relationship. I hope you can stay true to your real self and find ever more ways to express yourself, and with a little luck your loved ones will hopefully realize that their love for you includes not only your gender but your sexuality.

[Rachell]

Tree GG,
Well said, you must keep some balance even with an accepting wife. I can feel when mine is not in the mood for my dressing, dosn't happen much but you can tell. So a little advice to Staceecd is to keep some balance.
Rachell
Go read this http://www.crossdressers.com/forums/showthread.php?t=67279

If that doesn't break your heart, nothing will.

And if you believe it is "just clothes" then you really are in a denial that I would be proud to call my own. Face it, crossdressing is a very intimate thing that involves sex and attraction - to varying degrees, of course, but still a factor.

Could it be, and I'm just going out on a limb here, that for whatever reason your wife is perceiving the dressing, your woman within, is more important to you than she? Have you jumped at every opportunity to immerse yourself in the TG community and your femme self while she stands by and continues holding the home fort?

For one week, just one week, make every effort to show by action that your wife and family is the love of your life and no wig, garter or g-string is more precious. Say that one sentence to her, and that's all, but walk the walk for a week. Live it, don't just say it. I'd bet good money her rejection will ease if not subside.

I don't think you all realize just how much your behavior does change. You go about the motions of your daily lives but you start changing things - shaving, eyebrows, posture, reading materials, etc. Admittedly it could be a perception and over sensitivity by the wife but I believe it's a combination of both. We start looking for changes, and darned if we don't find them.

IMO - it is up to the crossdresser to keep this on a positive, non-threatening note. Wives usually don't want to control you, but they want to be confident that your piorities are still in line with their's. Breastforms full steam ahead does not instill a feeling of fun or well being for most wives. :D

[battybattybats]

Batty,

I'm speechless. Thank you and hope you don't mind me printing out a copy for reference. :hugs:

By all means.
Just as long as it isn't for publication, I'd want to rewrite it a little and neaten it up a mite if it were.

:hugs:

[Rosaliy Lynne]

By all means.
Just as long as it isn't for publication, I'd want to rewrite it a little and neaten it up a mite if it were.

:hugs:

it is properly clear as it is. A blind person can read it and understand.

(ok so it would have to be in braille)

[Satrana]

Where has gone simple empathy and compassion?
They were thrown out of the window when the point scoring began.:sad:


this is all a cop-out, an excuse of self-justification to avoid the personal responsibility for compassion and understanding. Taking personal responsibility is the hard way as it means you have to acknowledge your own faults and change yourself. Why bother when you can take the easy route and just blame the other person as a selfish loser and sit back and bask in self-righteousness.

Good post! :drink:

[sfwarbonnet]

Go read this http://www.crossdressers.com/forums/showthread.php?t=67279

If that doesn't break your heart, nothing will.

And if you believe it is "just clothes" then you really are in a denial that I would be proud to call my own. Face it, crossdressing is a very intimate thing that involves sex and attraction - to varying degrees, of course, but still a factor.

Could it be, and I'm just going out on a limb here, that for whatever reason your wife is perceiving the dressing, your woman within, is more important to you than she? Have you jumped at every opportunity to immerse yourself in the TG community and your femme self while she stands by and continues holding the home fort?

For one week, just one week, make every effort to show by action that your wife and family is the love of your life and no wig, garter or g-string is more precious. Say that one sentence to her, and that's all, but walk the walk for a week. Live it, don't just say it. I'd bet good money her rejection will ease if not subside.

I don't think you all realize just how much your behavior does change. You go about the motions of your daily lives but you start changing things - shaving, eyebrows, posture, reading materials, etc. Admittedly it could be a perception and over sensitivity by the wife but I believe it's a combination of both. We start looking for changes, and darned if we don't find them.

IMO - it is up to the crossdresser to keep this on a positive, non-threatening note. Wives usually don't want to control you, but they want to be confident that your piorities are still in line with their's. Breastforms full steam ahead does not instill a feeling of fun or well being for most wives. :D

This is indeed a sad story, but I can see how it can happen, particularily if a spouse unexpectedly finds women's clothes, and they exceed her limits. I would describe my wife as reluctant, and it it virtually impossible to discuss this matter with her. As a result, I CD in "boy mode" and ask her to buy women's clothes for me. I wear a slip and support pantyhose (or support thigh highs and a garter belt) several times a week, but I asked for panties, and she sail hello no! Ah ha, a limit, as would be impersonating a female and appearing with her en femme. I am wearing a bra now, as she is at work, but it will come off later - I'll keep the slip and pantyhose on though.

[Tree GG]

Batty,

We're going to have to agree to disagree. Yes, I believe he and he alone is responsible for how he expresses his CDness. He didn't ask to be CD, he didn't ask to be born at all, but there it is. How he expresses it is his choice. My choice is whether to accompany him on that expressive journey.

I take exception to you insinuating that my "problem" with CDing is a socially based construction and my husband should be free to do whatever he wants to make himself happy and the rest of the world should go along la-dee-da with him just because he wants it. In a perfect world, maybe. In the real world, not likely.

I am a closet naturist (I like to run topless in the woods, OK?) By your reasoning I should be allowed that freedom in the supermarket, at a school function or in my profession. But I'm NOT an exhibitionist or nudist. When it's super hot, and I'm alone with nature, I like the freedom and feeling of nearly total nudity. I don't have to do it in front of everyone or anyone to express myself and enjoy the feeling. Expressing it for myself when appropriate and comfortable is enough.

Also, I do not require that my husband follow me around spouting how wonderful it is that I am topless. Quite frankly, he's afraid of it - feels it may lessen the importance of nudity for intimate purposes so doesn't approve. (Now who's the prude? :heehee:) Do I stop? Do I scold him and scorn him for not feeling what I feel? Do I label him as unsupporting or unaccepting for not jumping in and playing along as well? NO. This is my thing - and expecting him to validate my actions for me is absurd. Same with his CDing. However, out of courtesy for his feeling, I do tone it down and try not to overdo it. I don't feel that is oppressive or unfair to me - it's a choice I make out of consideration for his feelings.

In a perfect world we could all do whatever the heck we felt like and everyone would feel the same. But then where's the challenge in that? Then there'd be nothing to rebel against by crossdressing or how would the young buck the establishment and on and on. I simply do not agree that all social constructs and restrictions are bad. Many are wrong, but requiring everyone to accept unconditionally and approve of everything is in some ways taking away as much individuality as suprressing the thoughts/ideas you disapprove of.

[Carin's Wife GG]

this board wouldn't even be needed. As an SO I found your post insulting and demeaning to your wife.

BOTH of you need understanding for the other person.


Louise.

[Jamie001]

Hi TreeGG,

I do believe that equating partial public nudity with CDing is not an apples-to-apples comparison because public nudity is illegal according to most local laws. On the other hand, CDing does not harm anyone unless the person is "indecent" and displaying parts of the anatomy that are illegal to display in public. Women incorporate masculine items into their wardrobes on a daily basis (neckties, large men's watches (my wife borrows one of my large watches), men's shoes, baseball caps, etc) and they are not CDing. Do you believe that it is ok for your SO to reciprocate and incorporate items from fem fashion into his appearance, or is it full-on crossdressing that is a problem if he adopts a female presentation, mannerisms, and a female personna?

:2c: Jamie



Batty,

We're going to have to agree to disagree. Yes, I believe he and he alone is responsible for how he expresses his CDness. He didn't ask to be CD, he didn't ask to be born at all, but there it is. How he expresses it is his choice. My choice is whether to accompany him on that expressive journey.

I take exception to you insinuating that my "problem" with CDing is a socially based construction and my husband should be free to do whatever he wants to make himself happy and the rest of the world should go along la-dee-da with him just because he wants it. In a perfect world, maybe. In the real world, not likely.

I am a closet naturist (I like to run topless in the woods, OK?) By your reasoning I should be allowed that freedom in the supermarket, at a school function or in my profession. But I'm NOT an exhibitionist or nudist. When it's super hot, and I'm alone with nature, I like the freedom and feeling of nearly total nudity. I don't have to do it in front of everyone or anyone to express myself and enjoy the feeling. Expressing it for myself when appropriate and comfortable is enough.

Also, I do not require that my husband follow me around spouting how wonderful it is that I am topless. Quite frankly, he's afraid of it - feels it may lessen the importance of nudity for intimate purposes so doesn't approve. (Now who's the prude? :heehee:) Do I stop? Do I scold him and scorn him for not feeling what I feel? Do I label him as unsupporting or unaccepting for not jumping in and playing along as well? NO. This is my thing - and expecting him to validate my actions for me is absurd. Same with his CDing. However, out of courtesy for his feeling, I do tone it down and try not to overdo it. I don't feel that is oppressive or unfair to me - it's a choice I make out of consideration for his feelings.

In a perfect world we could all do whatever the heck we felt like and everyone would feel the same. But then where's the challenge in that? Then there'd be nothing to rebel against by crossdressing or how would the young buck the establishment and on and on. I simply do not agree that all social constructs and restrictions are bad. Many are wrong, but requiring everyone to accept unconditionally and approve of everything is in some ways taking away as much individuality as suprressing the thoughts/ideas you disapprove of.

[jennifer41356]

I agree with Melinda......though...and I hate to say it, you have been keeping it from her and she feels betrayed, its a bombshell in her mind, maybe not a large one, but you cant help to see her point....unfair, hell yes....but you have to accept her decision now ...sorry about your pain, hope eventually she will see how much fun it can be to have someone who absolutley loves everything she loves :love:

[sobe1ove GG]

Man, tree's my girlfriend. Everything she says is right in my eyes. She gave great examples.



From Jamie001:

Women incorporate masculine items into their wardrobes on a daily basis (neckties, large men's watches (my wife borrows one of my large watches), men's shoes, baseball caps, etc) and they are not CDing. Do you believe that it is ok for your SO to reciprocate and incorporate items from fem fashion into his appearance, or is it full-on crossdressing that is a problem if he adopts a female presentation, mannerisms, and a female personna?

First: Most women don't incorporate men's shoes and so fourth. Although that wouldn't be a bad thing, it isn't as common as you insinuate.

Second: Conversely, men can wear lady shoes. My boyfriend does in male mode all of the time. He wears lady watches. In guy mode. And no one is the wiser. Those things can happen and it's no big deal. A girl wearing a man's watch isn't the same as a man wearing a woman's dress. Watches to watches.

[Satrana]

My choice is whether to accompany him on that expressive journey. This may not apply to you personally Tree, but discussing this as a matter of choice is misdirecting. The issue is that many women struggle with crossdressing because they think it is WRONG so it is not just a preference of wanting to be with a masculine man over a feminine man. The issue is that feminine men are socially taboo and are discriminated against, including in personal relationships with their SOs. Discrimination and preference are not the same issues.


I am a closet naturist (I like to run topless in the woods, OK?) By your reasoning I should be allowed that freedom in the supermarket, at a school function or in my profession. If men could be nudists and women not then you could claim a double standard. Since society bans everyone from being nude in public then everyone has to play by the same rules. If there are enough nudists in society they can try to change attitudes and get the law changed.

The issue is not freedom of expression, it is there is a double standard where one gender has a relatively large freedom to wear whatever garment they want without social/employment consequences while the other gender has limited freedom to wear garments without social/employment consequences.


This is my thing - and expecting him to validate my actions for me is absurd. Same with his CDing. You are correct, it is not the job of the SO to validate the feelings of the other. In the same vein it is not the job of the SO to control and restrict the actions of the other.



I simply do not agree that all social constructs and restrictions are bad. What rules are considered good or bad is subjective and changes over time. However when one gender is discriminated over another then this is always bad. So long as everyone is being treated equally regardless of gender, race, wealth etc then people can accommodate the rules. It is the unequal treatment that should be eliminated.

We may never reach perfect equality but that is no excuse not to make this our goal and do everything in our power to continue to move towards this goal. The worst thing we should do is just shrug our shoulders and accept discrimination.

[battybattybats]

Batty,

We're going to have to agree to disagree. Yes, I believe he and he alone is responsible for how he expresses his CDness. He didn't ask to be CD, he didn't ask to be born at all, but there it is. How he expresses it is his choice. My choice is whether to accompany him on that expressive journey.

His choice there may not be limitless but it is true that you always have the choice to leave or not.


I take exception to you insinuating that my "problem" with CDing is a socially based construction and my husband should be free to do whatever he wants to make himself happy and the rest of the world should go along la-dee-da with him just because he wants it. In a perfect world, maybe. In the real world, not likely.

By that point in my post I was speaking generally to the subject rather than to you specifically and I apologise for any offense I may have inadvertantly caused. However as many societies through history have had CDers as a respected, loved and welcome part of society any notion that most have a problem with CDing that is innate is easilly and imediately dismissable. What your personal problem with it is, you would have to tell me.
Now, if his action is ethical (in that it infringes the rights of no-one else) then yes he should be so free. In fact, if the world resists that freedom there is a moral obligation to oppose that resistance. For example, when slavery was accepted within societies 'mores' it was still unethical and therfore it was right for it to be opposed and wrong for it not to be opposed. The same is true of segregation or the lack of womens sufferage. Those changes happened in the real world, through blood sweat and tears, because they were right and the opposite was wrong even though many at the time did not understand the higher philosophy that determined it as such.


I am a closet naturist (I like to run topless in the woods, OK?) By your reasoning I should be allowed that freedom in the supermarket, at a school function or in my profession. But I'm NOT an exhibitionist or nudist. When it's super hot, and I'm alone with nature, I like the freedom and feeling of nearly total nudity. I don't have to do it in front of everyone or anyone to express myself and enjoy the feeling. Expressing it for myself when appropriate and comfortable is enough.

There are arguments for the freedom of naturists in general public spaces, however they are controvertial. However so long as they are comfortable in doing so in clearly marked areas then they can do so without needing such justifications, as is the case in many countries that have nudist beaches and resorts. So even if you needed to be nude in public there are ways you may, depending on your location, morally and ethically do so.


Also, I do not require that my husband follow me around spouting how wonderful it is that I am topless. Quite frankly, he's afraid of it - feels it may lessen the importance of nudity for intimate purposes so doesn't approve. (Now who's the prude? :heehee:) Do I stop? Do I scold him and scorn him for not feeling what I feel? Do I label him as unsupporting or unaccepting for not jumping in and playing along as well? NO. This is my thing - and expecting him to validate my actions for me is absurd. Same with his CDing. However, out of courtesy for his feeling, I do tone it down and try not to overdo it. I don't feel that is oppressive or unfair to me - it's a choice I make out of consideration for his feelings.

You have every right to expect him to not interfere with your nudism and to accept your nudism when it is in private. You have no right to expect him to participate in it nor share your feelings about it nor understand it. This is simple really.. your body is yours, your possesions are yours, and his are his. In between is shared space and shared activity. If he were to join in he would need to be consenting to do so and it would occur within the shared space. If he did not want to be around you when you were nude that is his right, however he could not impose his will over the shared space so that requires negotiation.. and either person should be able to leave and practise the nudity elsewhere or be away the shared space from to allow the private practise. If it is difficult or illegal to be nude outside of the privacy of the home the moral onus would be on the husband to allow sufficient space for the private practise so he could go and be elsewhere during such times.


In a perfect world we could all do whatever the heck we felt like and everyone would feel the same. But then where's the challenge in that?

Umm... everyone would be the same? Surely everyone would have the same freedom but there would be greater diversity as not everyone would use their freedom the same way. Challenge? There would still be the challenge to be original, to improve... In fact there would be little to no change in the scope of either Art or Science.


Then there'd be nothing to rebel against by crossdressing or how would the young buck the establishment and on and on.

Why would people need something to rebel against? And even with freedom respected so long as there are trends their will be iconoclasts. In plenty of fields that have little enforced restriction there are still plenty of paradigm shifts.


I simply do not agree that all social constructs and restrictions are bad.

Indeed, and I do not suggest all are. However the ones that are unethical are. Social constructs and restrictions that harm the rights and freedoms of the individual are bad, such as slavery, segregation, bigotry etc. Some, such as road rules, fair democratic political systems that have enshrined protections for minorities from the potentially abusive tyranny of majority etc are not.


Many are wrong, but requiring everyone to accept unconditionally and approve of everything is in some ways taking away as much individuality as suprressing the thoughts/ideas you disapprove of.

I should make something clear.. people, to a point, have the right to do things that may be wrong. There is a moral obligation on people to extend the rights they enjoy to everyone else and to accept the free use of such so long as it doesn't conflict with the rights of others no matter how immoral it may be. For example, a racist has the right to be racist and their freedom of speech means they can express their views, even though their views are demonstrably wrong, inconsistent and stupid. If you believe in freedom of speech you must be prepared to defend the right of people you disagree with to disagree with you. However there are some things you do not have to accept or defend but that you are obligated instead to oppose.

I'll continue with the example of the racist.. lets say that an anti-semite is making anti-semitic statements.. a Jewish person who believes in the principle of free speech would be prepared to defend the right of the racist to make those statements so long as others have the same right to make counter statements. To defend the right of one they must defend the same right for all. However if the racist was to comit an act of racism beyond his imediate person and immediate possessions, say by hitting a jewish person or by sacking them because they were jewish then the racist has extended beyond their rights and abused the rights of another and anyone who believes in individual rights are therefore morally and ethically obligated to oppose that. (This example is based on a real event!)

The obligation comes merely from considering all rights equal.

Accepting the rights of others does not in any way diminish and individuals rights or their individuality, it merely ensures that they cannot abuse the rights of others. What would be lost? Traditions like circumcision and female circumcision? People could still elect to go through the procedure when they came of age if they wanted to. The stoning and burning of heretics? People could still denounce them in words and then individuals could make their own mind up about whjo is right. The repression of minorities? The majority would still be the majority but the minority would be free of abuse. Marriage? If gay people can marry how would that hurt the marriage of straight people? Can anyone name one good thing that would actually be lost? Just one?

As I said before, accepting the rights of others isn't easy... especially of those close to us. But we do not like it when others deny us our rights so we are obligated to allow, respect, defend and fight for the rights of others, especially those who would use those rights in ways we would want them not to.

[StayceeCD]

http://www.crossdressers.com/forums/showthread.php?t=67279

This is a very sad story and I have seen it already.. However, I have not been on this board in a while and see that I have been getting mostly support from CD's and slammed by GG's... Let me elaborate a little more on my situation.. I have been married 15 years to my wife who by the way I love more than words can describe! We have been together since I was 20 & she was 18! I'm now 44 & she is 42.. We have had a great relationship.. And still mostly do.. We love each other, we have FUN!! We have the sweetest most beautiful little 4 yr old girl that I would lay my life down for.. At 20, if I had told her about my CD'ing?? Who knows? I still had not come to terms with it myself!! I thought I was a freak! I didn't know "guys"did this!! So.. No.. I did not tell her.. I also didn't tell anyone else! I have friends that I've known since grade school who do not know! This is not something you casually tell your friends!! So please don't slam me!! If I was given the opportunity to "make it go away" and not have these "urges".. I would take it! .. That being said, I DO have the urge to dress from time to time and can not suppress it.. I've tried the "purge" and saying to myself I'm not going to do it anymore.. I know from experience that I CAN NOT STOP! It ALWAYS comes back!! Well, just great isn't it? I've got a family that I love more than BREATHING!! AND I can't stop doing what may drive my wife, and daughter away? Well.. THANKS GOD!!! Anyway, my wifes initial reaction from "being turned on" to saying "she can't have this in her life" was only about a week and a half.. She has NEVER seen me dressed, nor seen ANY pictures of me.. SO.... "JUMPING at EVERY opportunity to be in the CD community while she holds down the Home fort" Does NOT apply to me!! I have not in ANY WAY made her feel that a "wig, garter or g-string is more precious".. Nor would I if she were to be accepting... So, although I can never know how much of a major shock it must be to find out that your SO is a CD.. We have lived out whole lives with it. Most of us growing up in a time when we felt like freaks! NEVER to tell anyone!! I never asked for this.. It has caused me much pain and confusion, and now my wife... I love my wife VERY VERY dearly.. The LAST thing on earth I would ever want to do is hurt her.. If I could make it go away, I would.. But I can not make it go away any more than I can change the color of my skin.. I'm stuck with it for life.. I only hope that I can find a happy medium that we both can accept.. :straightface:


Go read this http://www.crossdressers.com/forums/showthread.php?t=67279

If that doesn't break your heart, nothing will.

And if you believe it is "just clothes" then you really are in a denial that I would be proud to call my own. Face it, crossdressing is a very intimate thing that involves sex and attraction - to varying degrees, of course, but still a factor.

Could it be, and I'm just going out on a limb here, that for whatever reason your wife is perceiving the dressing, your woman within, is more important to you than she? Have you jumped at every opportunity to immerse yourself in the TG community and your femme self while she stands by and continues holding the home fort?

For one week, just one week, make every effort to show by action that your wife and family is the love of your life and no wig, garter or g-string is more precious. Say that one sentence to her, and that's all, but walk the walk for a week. Live it, don't just say it. I'd bet good money her rejection will ease if not subside.

I don't think you all realize just how much your behavior does change. You go about the motions of your daily lives but you start changing things - shaving, eyebrows, posture, reading materials, etc. Admittedly it could be a perception and over sensitivity by the wife but I believe it's a combination of both. We start looking for changes, and darned if we don't find them.

IMO - it is up to the crossdresser to keep this on a positive, non-threatening note. Wives usually don't want to control you, but they want to be confident that your piorities are still in line with their's. Breastforms full steam ahead does not instill a feeling of fun or well being for most wives. :D

[StayceeCD]

OK, Well.. I suppose it IS more than JUST clothes.. BUT I was frustrated and upset when I did my initial post.. HOWEVER... I would NEVER "Insult" or "Demean" my wife!! You do not know me, and have NO way of knowing the depth of my love for her! My wife & daughter ARE my life!! BUT I am intelligent enough, and truthful enough to know I can not ever stop crossdressing! I DO not want to become a woman.. I am not gay or attracted to men in any way. I do not want to alter my body in any way! Once or twice a month is all I need to satisfy the "urge"! Most guys golf or watch football more than that! I do neither! My wife is welcome to indulge the things she finds enjoyable any time.. Shopping, massages, nights out with the friends. Whatever.. I only want her to be happy.. Next week, we will all be in Italy visiting her family for 2 weeks. I try to do my best.. I am in no way perfect.. Who is? I know CD'ing is out of the realm of "normal" but.... We will see how things go... Thanks to all the girls who gave me support (and compliments):heehee: And to the ones who slammed me.. Like I said.. You DO NOT know me and can not equate your situation with mine.. It's never a "one size fits all" scenario!! Think before posting!



this board wouldn't even be needed. As an SO I found your post insulting and demeaning to your wife.

BOTH of you need understanding for the other person.


Louise.

[rachellenicole]

It's unfortunate that opinions were formed about you without regard to actual knowledge of your situation. I'm sure assumptions were made as to the frequency of your dressing, just looking at your avatar, which is very pretty by the way, it would appear that you spend a lot of time dressed, hence the assumption that you were abandoning your family in favor of crossdressing. It sounds like you are a dedicated and loving husband and father, it sad that your wife, and many other wifes/SO's are unaccepting.
I am VERY fortunate that my wife is accepting, and supports me. I too am a very dedicated husband and love my wife and children unconditionally.

In occasional posts I have noticed that when a shot is fired at someone, it can become a feeding frenzy where both sides are at odds. This is not the reason the majority of us are on this site...... How about some compassion, tolerence and humility.

I wish you the best and hope you and your wife can work things out.

Rach.

[docrobbysherry]

My wife found a strange bra in our bedroom and assumed it was another woman's. I confessed my secret fetish. Which only started after our marriage was already in trouble. Stacee, here's the part you need to know. My wife and I went to a licensed psychologist to deal with our problems. We went to her for many months. My crossdressing was dealt with in less than an hour. What I did; hurt no one, was a secret to everyone but my wife and was innocent role play. That was what the psychologist said! Throw out everyone's oppinions! Go talk to a professional. Get valuable help you can really use. I promise you will feel better afterwards. Best money I ever spent! If you could get your WIFE in also, you both might benefit. I also loved my wife and have never looked at men. We ended up getting a divorce. But there's a happy ending! I can play dressup to my hearts content, and my sex life has never been better! Oh, my ex has been dating women since our breakup. So, no one has all the answers, honey.

[JazmyneCD]

You know, a lot of wives think their hubbies look better in their clothes than they do. That's certainly the case w/ my wife and I.

Fortunately, my wife also adhered to the "just clothes" theory and lets me do it to this day. Hopefully you can work this out w/ your wife. I'm pulling for you both.

[KatrinaAshley]

To anyone who hasn't - don't marry. Saves a lot of trouble down the road.

[Tree GG]

Hmmmm, I really don't see how I "slammed" you but OK. I will apologize for the incorrect perception that this change of attitude occurred over a longer period than 1-1/2 weeks. I notice you've been a member here since 2006, that's over a year. I will not presume when this 1-1/2 week period you speak of began or ended. But you have been exploring the TG community for longer than that.

So I stand behind my original post. Have you reassured your wife that the love you feel for her & your family is priority #1 and CDing is just an aspect of yourself that has to come out now (for whatever reason)? You didn't ask for this, no one said you did, but you have to accept the responsibility for how you express it and be considerate of how it affects those who love you. If both parties stay in "poor me the victim mode", nothing gets worked out. (I find taking turns works best :D) Sorry, most of us just don't jump on that bandwagon 1st thing. We just don't know what it means, and as you & my husband both state, you don't really know either. Hence the importance of emphasizing those base, non-negotiable priorities AGAIN (I know, after that many years together it seems redundant and why would we question it, but we do.)

BTW, we've been together since we were 16 & 17, both in our mid-40s now, and I just learned of CDing in the past 1-1/2 yrs. I believe I have a similar perspective and experience to your wife.

Best of luck to you

[MsJanessa]

Maybe you're lookin' too good girl. Looking at your Avitor (whatever its called) I would have thought you were out and full timing LOL. It's really too bad she can not accept you, she might be missing some fun "girl" times out. At least you were out for a while which is a good thing I guess but it will tug at your heart and tear you apart. I feel for you. Best of luck & hoping for only the best.:hugs: Hang in there girl

If you look as good as your avatar photo, your wife is probably jealous---lol

[Sheila]

If you look as good as your avatar photo, your wife is probably jealous---lol

you know it is comments like that that make me want to
a ) throw up
B) throw my hands in the air and scream
c) go and slap HIM yes HIM

:Angry3::Angry3::Angry3:

[Dee Talbot]

A lot of what goes on here on the forum is fantasy based. We who are married or are in commited relationships all have and ideal in mind of what our relationships should be. But, the ideal really is a fantasy. Reality is a lot harder to deal with.

Barbara wanted to come out to me in Las Vegas on our 15th anniversary. In the fantasy, I would be swept away by her beauty and would be immediately accepting. After all, it's just clothes...right?

The reality is, had Barbara gone through with her plan, I would have been upset for a myriad of reasons. Some logical....some clearly illogical.

Her fantasy didn't jibe with reality. But, at the time she came up with the idea...it made perfect sense to her. My fantasy of our time in Vegas (more family oriented) would have been at odds with Barbara's. The end result?? Two people, married, hoping for what didn't happen.....very dissapointed.

My point is this: We, all of us...regardless of gender, orientation, creed, color, religion, etc..... carry with us little fantasies about what we would like our lives to be. You Staycee, would clearly like your wife to be more accepting than she is. But, she clearly isn't. Maybe your fantasies of what your marriage should be, could be, will be, aren't always in synch. That's normal. That's what marriage is. I feel empathy for you that you feel you cannot be who you are. But, even if they are "just clothes" to you....it may not be that simple to your wife.

I want to echo docrobbysherry's recommendation for counseling. It sometimes helps to have and unbiased third party guide you to a place where your fantasies and hers, come closer to each other's and to reality. I only suggest this option, because of the love you have for your wife. Give her (and yourself) the opportunity to express feelings in a safe environment. You may find that it can't be worked through. You may find that you get everything you ever wanted in this marriage.

Dee

[noname]

Second: Conversely, men can wear lady shoes. My boyfriend does in male mode all of the time. He wears lady watches. In guy mode. And no one is the wiser. Those things can happen and it's no big deal. A girl wearing a man's watch isn't the same as a man wearing a woman's dress. Watches to watches.

Great, glad to know you only wear dresses or skirts since pants are a mens item. There are still many people today who believe this, my wife being one of them. She has never worn pants in her life. I don't understand why it is difficult for people to practice what they preach.

[Marcie Sexton]

Stacey, perhaps you should approach her about joining this forum...

My wife when I first came out to her wasn't a very happy camper, however for some unknown reason she deceided that I wasn't a freak or pervert...

Perhaps she found this site, I really don't know or do I care...All I know is she has come to accept me as I am...she is a member of the forum and I think a member of the GG only section too, she hasn't really said, nor have I ask...

She has said to me on more than one occasion that it is in deed only clothes, that I am in deed the same person, just slightly different clothing...

I hope this helps, good luck, and God bless...

If its any help, I too did and would again quit dressing if needed to protect the family. I commend you for your stand...

Again good luck in your life...

[battybattybats]

you know it is comments like that that make me want to
a ) throw up
B) throw my hands in the air and scream
c) go and slap HIM yes HIM

:Angry3::Angry3::Angry3:

And the same thing could be said about others possible response to your response to those comments.
A) just cause you don't like it doesn't make it wrong, either factually incorrect or morally wrong.
B) fair enough, but what does that reveal?
C) violence is wrong. Violence because of an opinion or speech is even more wrong. Sure you may just want to slap him and I assume you'd restrain yourself from doing so but... isn't wanting to commit violence for something that doesn't deserve violence demonstrating something?

Having had one masculine GG who saw me dressed exclaim that she was jeolous as I looked more feminine than she did might say more about how masculine she looked naturally, but it does show that some do feel that way sometimes.

You don't have to agree with such comments, but why get so upset over it?
:hugs: