So.... why DO you hide it?

[Bethany_Anne_Fae]

Hi again, girls...

Hers is another of those "UH-OH! Zara's doin too much thinking again" posts.

I've been involved with this for over 10 years now. Small potatoes based on what I've read in these forums recently, but in that time, I've come to learn and grow as an individual because of what I've experienced, witnessed and read. Maybe its the Psychology student in me.. but I'm always curious.

So many threads about having to tell ones S/O about their secret. So much pain that I see people endure either before, during, or after their revelation to those around them.

This question is particularly for the MARRIED/or about to BE, and CLOSETED Crossdressers. It is merely to know more about your mindset, not to judge, ridicule, or to put you on the spot. It is presented in the past tense as well as future tense.

When you go about your days as a single person and exploring your femme side, you KNOW that it is possible that you will someday meet the right person to (presumably) share the rest of your life with. Knowing that you are already a crossdresser... why won't you/why didn't you tell them before you get/got married?

[LindaMarie]

It's a great question and I suspect everyone has different answers. Here's mine:

I've crossdressed off and on since I was about 12. For a long time, I was very ashamed of crossdressing and felt guilty. I thought that wanting to dress made me some kind of pervert. I knew my parents would be shocked if they found out (this is the 1960s and early 1970s). I'm sure I was right. Even now, I don't want them to know. It would just be too much.

I was very shy and unsure of myself with girls. I noticed that when I had a girlfriend or at least was less shy, the desire to dress lessened. I felt like the more success I had with girls, the less I needed to dress. I think that was somewhat true and, in any case, if you believe something to be true, it's more likely to be true.

I continued to date and overcome some of my shyness. I noticed I still enjoyed crossdressing from time to time, but since I was at college and living in dorm, I didn't dress. I'd fantasize about dressing sometimes, but it wasn't an every day thing.

After college, I went through periods where I would dress a bit more. I finally got my own place and would sometimes dress there. It was so nice just to be able to have my own clothes. Still, I was often ashamed and guilty and went through several purges (I've lost some really cute clothes and shoes that way).

I was dating an amazing girl who would later become my wife. After a long time dating, we decided to get married.

I had never told her anything about my crossdressing and thought she would think I was a pervert if she found out. This was 1980 and for the younger girls, you wouldn't believe how much less information and support was available then. The only things I read about cds in newspaper articles that stressed the flamboyant lifestyle they led or in the occasional Dear Abby letter where Abby (to her credit) didn't ridicule crossdressers. However, if someone pointed out a Dear Abby letter about crossdressers, it was always in a mocking way.

In this atmosphere and given my past history, I "knew" that once we were married, the desire to crossdress would go away. Once we were engaged, I think I crossdressed only once or twice and went through a final purge.

I felt bad about keeping this secret from my wife. I decided to talk to a priest about this. I asked him that since I knew my urge to crossdress was gone, did I need to tell my fiancee about my past. He said if I really felt that I wasn't going to crossdress any more, I didn't need to tell her.

For those of you who have read this far, you're probably thinking that that priest and I were kidding ourselves. In fairness to my priest, I don't think he knew much about cds (outside those of us who do this, who still does?) and just wanted to provide comfort to me. At some level, I must have known that marriage wouldn't completely suppress my desires but the story I had always told myself about using crossdressing as a replacement for a real relationship had become somewhat true to me.

So, I didn't tell my fiancee. There was no need. My crossdressing was over. Nothing good would have been gained by her knowing.

Of course, the feelings did come back and eventually, I did tell my wife (badly, but that's another long story). Although my wife doesn't like my crossdressing, she understands why I didn't tell her before we got married. Would things have been better now had we talked about it then? I'm not sure. Maybe we wouldn't have even gotten married. Although we've had our ups and downs, I can't imagine not having shared the last 26 years together.

I'll be interested to read other replies to this thread. Thanks for raising such an interesting topic.

Linda

[Joy Carter]

I stopped dressing at age thirteen and didn't dress until a few months into the marriage. I told her but she refused to listen. So I dressed in secret for all our married life until last year. I can say she now knows that had she faced this early on, we would have been much happier. Something she really ad-mitts to. Not that she's thrilled about it. Just acknowledges it's a part of who I am.

[Raychel]

Great question!

When my wife and I were dating, we had some troubles, We did alot of fighting, why we stayed together I can't tell you. I told her some things that weren't 100% true to hide my dressing from her. I guess I was afraid that she would tell her parents or even my parents.

So I hid it from her for almost 15 years. Then after finding this forum and listening to some oif the other stories. I decided it was to to tell her about the real me. There were some rough time afetr I told her. But not we have a pretty good life. Very hectic at times, but overall a pretty good life. I am glad that we stayed together thru those rough times. Now she is a true friend, Standing by my side thru the good times and the bad. And I am not afraid that she will go running off, if I tell her what is really on my mind.

She truely has turned into the love of my life. :love::love:

[Laurengrl01]

It's a great question and I suspect everyone has different answers.
Yes, very thought provoking Lady Z.
Linda, I can identify with many aspects of your story (nicely conveyed). I too am from the 60's/70's; with all the negative connotations... my parents would have fliped out. I was also quite shy myself and didn't start dating until college. After college, I started working for a hospital. There are so many GG's all around. Now that I had some money, my wardrobe increased. Then one day, I met that one girl. Everything clicked and I lost all desire to dress. I did a purge and thought it was all behind me. We dated for nearly three years and never did I think about dressing. I thought I could remove this character trait or at least control it. After being married for about seven years and two children latter, the urge to dress returned and I can't explain why. I thought "Oh no, this isn't happening... I have to supress it". The more I tried to supress it, the stronger it got. By this time, I was many years into the marriage, many good friends, church groups, colleagues and both of us with good incomes. She never had a clue (and still doesn't); I continue to search for a way to tell her. What little I've touched on the topic, she is extremely against this.
For those that have not made the mistake yet... I've said it a few times here and I'll say it again. You probably cannot control this, it will resurface again. DO NOT enter into a relationship without discussing this. Better to lose a little (not to make light of losing a relationship) in the beginning, then risk losing everything latter.
Since no time has presented itself as "a good time" (it looks unlikely there will be one, at least for a while), I'm thinking of seeing a theripist... but that won't happen either, until my daughter graduates from nursing school and I get her in where I work.

[Jammie 3]

Hello lady z.Very good ?.Ican say my s/o does know and has known since day 1. I've been blessed with her understanding,she helps me alot,she's one of a kind! I'd love to go out in the world dressed, but in my my little corner of the world its not something to take lightly.I guess what I'm saying is I wouldn't want to endanger our normal everyday way of living,as I know it would be a major life changing decision to go public.I guess for now,I just don't want to make her life any harder than it needs to be,because she loves me the way I am.

[melissacd]

I did not tell her at the beginning because I loved her so much that I thought that I could give up cross dressing (and in fact I did for almost 14 years) but in the end I was unable to stop. So in effect I thought there was no need to tell her because I never planned to do it again and somehow I knew that she would react badly to finding this out (and she did).

In therapy she told me that I betrayed her by not saying anything at the beginning. I stated that I did not tell her because I thought that I would never do it again. I asked her what she would have done at the beginning if I told her about this side of me that I would never do again and she said that she would have left me right there on the spot. I said to her that that was the reason that I did not say anything, why would I risk a love interest for something I never planned to do again. Her response haunts me to this moment...because you never gave me the choice to decide what path in life I wanted to take...what she was saying was that my non-disclosure affected the path that her life went.

Now the first 15 years together as a couple were pretty good, pretty normal. From the point she found out, to this day (over a decade) life has been very tough because she has such a binary notion of gender and to her gender lines are not to be crossed. In retrospect I guess I should have recognized that at the very beginning and thrown my cards on the table. Better to have found out at the beginning and end it there than to crash and burn 25 years later.

[Bethany_Anne_Fae]

Ditto, Ditto. All I have to add is the phrase "Coping Mechanism". I dressed from very early and had 3 brothers. Showing any "unmanly mannerisms" was to invite a beating. I developed a very good system of Disassociation ,(What I'm totally boy) , and denial, (I'll never do that again). I kept these going until way into our marriage. The sudden loss of these little helpers at 48 yrs old has left me confused and my poor wife in shock. Please don't take this as an excuse. I know what I have done and how bad it was. This seems to be pretty common story here, later in life coming out. Hopefully the Internet helps more young CD/TV/TS come to understand themselves early on.

Thank you for sharing this Jill. There are no right or wrong answers to my query, and I'm not here to "judge" anyone...only to become more in formed about this area of some of our lives.
We see all too often the painful threads of someone coming out after "X" amount of time being married. We see our friends struggling with keeping it all inside out of fear, shame, and maybe guilt (perhaps a combination of all three).
The answers thus far are incredible to me, because some of them I had not considered before. Therefore I can understand through becoming informed instead of asking myself (as I am sure GGs have done when they find out)

"WHY did you not say anything?"
"WHY did you hide this thing from me?"

I also hadn't considered the generation gap. Since I came into this in the late 90s I consider myself very lucky to have had MORE information available through books, support groups and the internet vs those of you who grew up in a time where this was EXTREMELY taboo.

As one poster stated above, there was also the "it went away for a LONG time" once they married so there was no reason to really bring uit up. I can understand that.

Keep the answers coming as we ALL gain something from your insight ;)

*much Love n hugs*

Zara

[aprilwall1977]

I was afraid she would not marrie me. I would of been right she dose not want to see me dressed or want me to. And back then 1977 evrybody thougt you as gay or some kind of freak nit saying they dont now days.

[Bethany_Anne_Fae]

I was afraid she would not marrie me. I would of been right she dose not want to see me dressed or want me to. And back then 1977 evrybody thougt you as gay or some kind of freak nit saying they dont now days.

Are you still married to her?

[Nadia-Maria]

Why do you hide it ?

First of all, I believe it is a matter of personality. Some people are very confident in others and do not hesitate to come out to others with whatever private information on their own. Other people are much more cautious and do not divulgate willingly private information, if not indispensable.
Both behaviours have their pros and their cons.

It is certainly not the only explanation to hide CDing.
Here is my story.
I am very introverted and, as a rule, I am rather the secret person.

As a child, I used to dress furtively using the skirts and bras of my mother, and used to dream I were older and would live single at my home to be free to dress as long as I want, using my own wardrobe, without that extreme fear of being caught by someone.

Finally the dream turned into reality ! I had a job and enough money to live of my own. Then, I had lived single for many years, as an happy CDer, if not as a really happy man.

I had always believed I would stop CDing as soon as I would have a stable relation with a GG.

So, when I finally get married, I purged my wardrobe and believed it was meaningless to mention to my wife I had been a CDer before.

2 to 3 years later, the quality of the relation dropped (my lazy wife had married me only for my money) and I had to seek consolation in closet CDing again. It was to late to come out to my wife about CDing, since a confrontational divorce was obviously to expect in the future.

After the divorce, I had not yet understood that my CDing would never stop.
I believed it would disappear, if I discovered the proper person to live with.

As a consequence, when I entered a serious relation, I did not mention to my new SO/GG I had been a CDer. And eventually I quasi-stopped CD in the first years. Now, we have lived together for 5 years, all is OK between us but the fact that I have recently understood that my CDing would never cease.
Moreover telling her now I am a CDer would be extremely risky for the relation, certainly putting my SO at much trouble, since she is very far from being open-minded as for the TG phenomenon.

I am now convinced the best thing to do is to mention CD at the very beginning of any serious relation.

However, when it has not been done on time, I believe it is not always the best choice to do it after several years. It's a matter of appreciation, depending on several factors such as the intensity and frequency of CDing among others.

Nadia-Maria

[Jazzmine]

The list of reasons why you would hide being a CD is almost endless.
The reasons why you would tell someone are counted on one hand.

In a practical sense, the more you want to dress the more compelling the argument to tell your partner. Remember though, it's perfectly reasonable and acceptable for people to have interests that are private to that individual. Women don't tell their men everything, contrary to what they say here on this forum. They buy things that "he" never knows about. They won't tell you about "everything" they did with previous lovers or compromising positions they have ended up in because they (some) are serial flirts. They also keep their sexual fantasies in the closet. Should we know all of this? Do we want to know all of this? No! I can do without it thanks just the same! But if you knew some of it you may choose to be with a different partner. Secrets cut both ways!

Since women in general are unaccepting of CDng (a fact not a judgement), why would you rush to tell them? Everyone should assess their own history, confidence, behaviour, intentions, and partner on an idividual basis before telling about their CDng. The downside risks are too great to do otherwise. E.G. if you dress once every 2 months, why tell anyone this? If you dress every day/week then you should definitely tell your partner, the earlier the better!

Hugs Jazzmine

[Alandra]

When you go about your days as a single person and exploring your femme side, you KNOW that it is possible that you will someday meet the right person to (presumably) share the rest of your life with. Knowing that you are already a crossdresser... why won't you/why didn't you tell them before you get/got married?

I guess, if we all thought about it, we WOULD tell our significant others very early in the relationship. But it wasn't about thinking. It was just complete & total fear. And once the fear really sets in thought is pretty much impossible.

We met, sparks flew, it was exciting. It was exactly what I wanted. And I couldn't even consider telling her at that time in 2001. I had spent 20 years hiding this from EVERYone. At all costs. Why should my significant other be any different?

I don't expect it to make SENSE, proper. But like I say, when you're acting out of fear...

TAC

[susiej]

Hmm, seeing a definite pattern in these posts:

1. Introverted young man gets into crossdressing, thinks it's a sexual practice, a "coping strategy" for not having a GG in his life.

2. Finding that special GG at last, he figures, that's it, I can throw out my girl clothes, draw a line in the sand and move on. And, having a real GG to play with is a lot of fun, and for a while, all's well.

3. Time passes. Calendar pages fall off.

4. He finds that crossdressing is not only, or not truly, a sexual practice -- it's more basic to his wiring than that. Sooner or later, the pressure gets too great to resist. But, its years later, he didn't tell her early on, because he didn't think he was going back. He's stuck with the "why didn't you tell me" problem.

I also married at a time, and to a girl, that would have made discussion of my crossdressing passion totally impossible. I'm really stuck. But I do strongly encourage others to realize, as has been said many times here, it's not going away, and wot th'ell, she might actually enjoy having you as her sometime girlfriend! Tell her!

Hugs,
Susie

[marny]

A. Didn't know when I married.

B You are a poet. Please write more!

[Bethany_Anne_Fae]

I guess, if we all thought about it, we WOULD tell our significant others very early in the relationship. But it wasn't about thinking. It was just complete & total fear. And once the fear really sets in thought is pretty much impossible.

We met, sparks flew, it was exciting. It was exactly what I wanted. And I couldn't even consider telling her at that time in 2001. I had spent 20 years hiding this from EVERYone. At all costs. Why should my significant other be any different?

I don't expect it to make SENSE, proper. But like I say, when you're acting out of fear...

TAC

Yes, FEAR can be an intimidating motivator, so I understand completely. As I said above... there are no wrong answers ;)

[Raychel]

Hmm, seeing a definite pattern in these posts:

1. Introverted young man gets into crossdressing, thinks it's a sexual practice, a "coping strategy" for not having a GG in his life.

2. Finding that special GG at last, he figures, that's it, I can throw out my girl clothes, draw a line in the sand and move on. And, having a real GG to play with is a lot of fun, and for a while, all's well.

3. Time passes. Calendar pages fall off.

4. He finds that crossdressing is not only, or not truly, a sexual practice -- it's more basic to his wiring than that. Sooner or later, the pressure gets too great to resist. But, its years later, he didn't tell her early on, because he didn't think he was going back. He's stuck with the "why didn't you tell me" problem.

I also married at a time, and to a girl, that would have made discussion of my crossdressing passion totally impossible. I'm really stuck. But I do strongly encourage others to realize, as has been said many times here, it's not going away, and wot th'ell, she might actually enjoy having you as her sometime girlfriend! Tell her!

Hugs,
Susie

I think you pretty much nailed it Suzie. :iagree::iagree:

[Jasmine Ellis]

i'm married yes she knows and she is on here we are happy and she buys clothes for me too
I go out as Jasmine do shopping as Jasmine I love it when men open shop doors and wait until i go in before they go out

[Kate Simmons]

It depends on the situation and the people involved. Sometimes young people don't think straight. I felt if I told her, I would lose her. I told her after two years of marriage despite my fears and the next 25 years were rocky. I then came out openly and she eventually left. I know better now with 20/20 hindsight. I just need the chance to prove it.

[fireandlace]

I hide it because it would have a terrible effect on my job if I was found out. My marriage hasn't been all I wanted it to be, both of our faults, so I don't think I can trust her with the knowledge. I have had a close call or two and there are sometimes when we are really getting along well that I think I can. In fact I have almost confessed or have almost put myself in a position to be "caught" during those times. Unfortunately those times don't last long and I am reminded of why I hide it.

[EDNA]

Yes! There are Female Mates and a Male wents to have as a Mate. That are Brainwashed. To feel that way. While there are others. That have no problem. With thier mate Crossdressing and live very happy together. That is what I call TRUE LOVE.

I have never been married, but was almost.

Read my story. Years in Vegas and added THE FACTS.
[That is one the same page.]

[JoAnnDallas]

I am 60 and thus grew up before the Internet and such. Also my family was very religious (Baptist) and my wife is a devote Catholic. I grew up feeling that dressing as a woman was wrong and when I died I would end up in Hell. So even when my wife and I got married, I kept it secret. Like most of us, I love my wife and did not want to lose her or have my family think I was a pervert of something. Then in 2005, I had the chance to dress almost everyday for four months, discovered these forums, and Tri-Ess. All of these have helped me come to terms with myself. I know I will always be this way, I no longer live denial, shame, or fear. When I found that I could go out in the public dressed as a woman and was accepted, I knew I had to tell the wife and now she knows. I was surprised how well she has responded, being a devote Catholic and all. Now my older sister suppects, since she has made comments to my wife about it. I am also suprised that my older sister has not gone over it which pleases me. I can do some fem things openly but wife says she is not ready to see me fully dressed and I can live with that. We made an agreement that I could have a Saturday afternoon to do my thing and so far that is fine with me.
I have come to the conculsion that today it is easier for us than it was 40-45 years ago.

[kassandra richard]

Like Marny said, I would not have identified as a CD when I got married. At one point I was more concerned that I might be bi, and I had an addiction to porn that I let my wife know about before we were married. And that led to some rather rocky points in our marriage. It wasn't until a couple of years in that opportunities arose which would confirm that I was probably a crossdresser. That and finding some really great personal web sites like Lowla's Lair :) That was ten years ago (sorry Lowla) and actually resulted in me going out to function en femme :)

It's only in the last four years that I would say my CD'ing has really blossomed. So it would have been impossible to tell my wife about my CD'ing before our marriage because it wasn't a significant factor at the time.

Kassandra

[Vivian Best]

Zara, I think you have an excellent question! Its just 48 years to late for me!!!!

[KatieC]

When you go about your days as a single person and exploring your femme side, you KNOW that it is possible that you will someday meet the right person to (presumably) share the rest of your life with. Knowing that you are already a crossdresser... why won't you/why didn't you tell them before you get/got married? Ah, but that's the rub! I didn't know I was already a crossdresser. I thought I had a minor lingerie kink that was only there at all because I was lonely (my fiancee and I were apart for most of the 3 years of our engagement) and that it would go away once we were finally married. I was pretty successful in (almost) totally repressing it for over a decade of married life, too.

[AmandaM]

For me it was simple. I want her to know me. If I hide half of my personality, she knows a facade.

Edit: I've been outed by a previous girlfriend and lost all my friends. In my current relationship, married, I was willing to sacrifice all my friends again, and willing to completely be out, move to Frisco, etc. if she rejected me. It was my do or die time for a hetero-quasi-normal relationship. I wasn't gonna try anymore. After her, it would have been gg admirers, other CDers, or maybe a man. Point being, I was sick of the hiding, guilt, and ostracism. I drew a line in the sand and said I ain't taking it anymore, either she accepts, or I'll seek my own kind.

[jayelle]

The list of reasons why you would hide being a CD is almost endless.
The reasons why you would tell someone are counted on one hand.

In a practical sense, the more you want to dress the more compelling the argument to tell your partner. Remember though, it's perfectly reasonable and acceptable for people to have interests that are private to that individual. Women don't tell their men everything, contrary to what they say here on this forum. They buy things that "he" never knows about. They won't tell you about "everything" they did with previous lovers or compromising positions they have ended up in because they (some) are serial flirts. They also keep their sexual fantasies in the closet. Should we know all of this? Do we want to know all of this? No! I can do without it thanks just the same! But if you knew some of it you may choose to be with a different partner. Secrets cut both ways!

Since women in general are unaccepting of CDng (a fact not a judgement), why would you rush to tell them? Everyone should assess their own history, confidence, behaviour, intentions, and partner on an idividual basis before telling about their CDng. The downside risks are too great to do otherwise. E.G. if you dress once every 2 months, why tell anyone this? If you dress every day/week then you should definitely tell your partner, the earlier the better!

Hugs Jazzmine

Agreed. Crossdressing is a broad church, and "hiding" it isn't necessarily a bad decision. I have crossdressed occasionally for many years, but did not tell my wife until recently. I never considered telling her. It was a private and personal pleasure.

But recently, she asked me a straight question about my interest in women's clothing (I had apparently shown a bit too much interest in women's shoes in a department store!), so I just told her the truth. And being the great woman that she is, she took it all in her stride - the same day I told her she gave me a make-up lesson and gave me some clothes that she was about to give away.

Does that mean I should have told her earlier? No. Crossdressing remains for me an occasional, private and personal pleasure. If, however, I had ever had the urge to dress 24/7, or go out dressed, the arguments would be very different.

[Nadia-Maria]

I definitely agree with you Jazzmine (and Jayelle). IMO, Jazzmine’s estimation of the clearcut appears very wise as somewhere in between once a week and once in 2 months.

Wickanne’s post was a « ripple effect of paving stones ». I believe she fights for perfect honesty and selflessness. But who can perform them ? Nobody is 100% honest (but you Wickanne ?) and nobody knows herself enough to tell all the truth about so puzzling a matter involving herself as crossdressing, I mean.

Kisses to all of you

Nadia-Maria

[Carly D.]

I think the question is deeper than that.. the question of "why do you hide it?" why do I hide every aspect of my cross dressing? why can't I talk to a family member? why do I feel that if I come out to my family I will be the "odd man out"? why do I think I would be treated as either gay or a pervert or just be left completely alone? as in alone... mostly I think that is my reason for not telling anyone that I cross dress, there is being alone and feeling that you are really alone.. and while I feel like I am alone anyway, that pales in comparison to being alone... and that would be tough to take.. that mindset of being cut out of everybody's life scares me a lot.. I don't think it would happen but there's that inkling of "what if.." that makes me think twice about telling anyone close to me...

[jayelle]

Why present yourself as half of a whole? You present a façade…your life is a lie…you’re a fraud and you know it.

Wickanne, you seem determined to paint this as black and white. I'm fairly new to these forums, so I don't want to wade in too deep just yet, but I can't help feeling that no-one benefits from the notion that "hiding is a lie and makes you a fraud".

There are shades of gray, as I said in my earlier post. If you have an overwhelming urge to dress 24/7, tell your partner, for goodness sake. If you dress up once a month in private for fun, then why bother? Who benefits from sharing your secret?

This does lead on to a bigger question (and this is a discussion I have had with my wife). Can you be too honest? Can there be too much truth in a relationship? Yes there can.

You go to a Christmas office party, without your partner. You have a drunken fumble with Sandra from accounts. The only time you've kissed another woman. In twenty years. No sex. Just a fumble. Do you tell your partner?

Well, if honesty is all that matters, yes you do. But if telling about your drunken snog is all about dumping your guilt on your wife and feeling good that you're so "honest", who benefits? I'm not saying there's a right or wrong answer. I'm just saying that there is such a thing as too much honesty in a relationship.

To use my own example, if my wife had a snog with a guy at her office party, I certainly wouldn't want to know...

And if you only crossdress now and again, then telling your partner may be a case of too much honesty...

[Bethany_Anne_Fae]

And that is exactly the mentality that gets most of you where you are now. Get a grip! There can NEVER be too much honesty. If you don’t like her hair style then tell her. Doesn’t mean she has to do anything about it, but she knows where you stand. Some women do not want their man wearing their panties or any female garments EVER and they have as much right to dislike it and seek out another partner as you do to wear panties!

How many flippin’ times has it be typed on this site…Well, I did not know I was a crossdresser…I thought I just liked to wear panties once in awhile. (Hmmm :straightface: isn’t that also a crossdresser?) Now I want to shave the hair on my arms, have sex with men (most won’t publicly out themselves), get permanent hair removal…blah, blah, blah.

So yes…it is black and white! How can someone expect honesty from anyone when they cannot even be honest with themselves. If it’s just panties, tell her when you meet her. Most don’t because either deep down they know it is more or they are too selfish to let WHAT THEY WANT get away…never minding what she wants.

I guess the bigger question would be, Why would you be at your office Christmas party without your partner? Oh, maybe she is at her office Christmas party doing the same thing :tongueout …that was a rhetorical question.

:love:
Wickanne
Interesting viewpoints Wicked :) Thank you for sharing

[Jazzmine]

And that is exactly the mentality that gets most of you where you are now. Get a grip! There can NEVER be too much honesty. If you don’t like her hair style then tell her. Doesn’t mean she has to do anything about it, but she knows where you stand. Some women do not want their man wearing their panties or any female garments EVER and they have as much right to dislike it and seek out another partner as you do to wear panties!

How many flippin’ times has it be typed on this site…Well, I did not know I was a crossdresser…I thought I just liked to wear panties once in awhile. (Hmmm :straightface: isn’t that also a crossdresser?) Now I want to shave the hair on my arms, have sex with men (most won’t publicly out themselves), get permanent hair removal…blah, blah, blah.

So yes…it is black and white! How can someone expect honesty from anyone when they cannot even be honest with themselves. If it’s just panties, tell her when you meet her. Most don’t because either deep down they know it is more or they are too selfish to let WHAT THEY WANT get away…never minding what she wants.

I guess the bigger question would be, Why would you be at your office Christmas party without your partner? Oh, maybe she is at her office Christmas party doing the same thing :tongueout …that was a rhetorical question.

:love:
Wickanne

Wickanne I cannot believe you think this way. Women like to change their minds endlessly! Cannot a man have the same excuse? LOL

Seriously, many men, like me, had never even heard of the term CD before the internet got in their faces. And you brush over the naivety of our thinking with disdain. You can, because you have hindsight on your side. But that's an arrogant platform to judge from. For those men still naive and puzzled about themselves, they wouldn't dream of talking to anyone until they had "sorted themselves out" first. Men (and yes we CDs are still men) like to sort out our problems internally and alone. Once a conclusion is reached we take action (or none). A woman would seek help and talk about it immediately it came to her attention - that is your way, not ours. We will have to agree to disagree on this. But it is certainly NOT an issue of honesty. It is an issue of enlightenment.

Many CDs upon finding their first CD website express their absolute gratitude for the posts and encouragement they receive. What these newbies don't realise, initially anyway, is that they are number 1,000,001 who have finally been able to make sense of an inner connundrum we call CD. That done, it then raises the issue of how far they are willing to step outside their closet. Baby steps are required as he/she accepts a new enlightenment of their new being. To be landed with guilt and derision at this tentative stage is unhelpful, which is why many CDs decide to continue hiding until they feel their time to venture out has come.

I think I read you correctly when you said all CDs want to dress to attract men? Correct me if I am wrong.
I don't know where on earth you got this thinking from. It is true of some, agreed. But you've got it so wrong for the majority of CDs. There may be fantasies but the equivalent reality is gruesome for most. Anyway, I read women have more gay related dreams and fantasies than men ever do, but not many wives would own up to that one I bet!!!???

Now one last thing, if you think I am going to tell my wife she has ugly hair, even if it were true, you ain't walked a mile in a man's shoes. She may accept my CD under sufferance but that would END IT!

Hugs Jazzmine

[Nadia-Maria]

About 10 days ago, in this thread, I wrote this :


Why do you hide it ?
(...)
I am now convinced the best thing to do is to mention CD at the very beginning of any serious relation.

However, when it has not been done on time, I believe it is not always the best choice to do it after several years. It's a matter of appreciation, depending on several factors such as the intensity and frequency of CDing among others.


Having written that, after a few days of thinking about, I considered the intensity and frequency of my CDing had enough increased in the latest months, so that it was the right time to come out to my SO/GG.

So I have done it : I came out last week.... !!

Lady Zarabeth, your thread was indeed a very insightful one....

Thanks
Nadia

[Kelsy]

I told my wife before we got married. This time around I wanted to be totally up front and honest with who I am and I believed that She deserved the choice. She accepted me as I am! That's not to say that there are not issues! There are, My wife does not like surprises. If I am going to shave something she wants to know and she prefers that I do nothing in secret. If I don't dress with her around she believes that I am hiding something. It is a fine line and she demands total honesty. Today she told me that I should have been a girl and that there are times that I really weird her out! All of this gets discussed in the open. I don't have to hide and to me that is freedom!:happy:

Kelsy

[laura.lapinski]

The list of reasons why you would hide being a CD is almost endless.
The reasons why you would tell someone are counted on one hand.
...
They also keep their sexual fantasies in the closet. Should we know all of this? Do we want to know all of this? No! I can do without it thanks just the same! But if you knew some of it you may choose to be with a different partner. Secrets cut both ways!

Since women in general are unaccepting of CDng (a fact not a judgement), why would you rush to tell them? Everyone should assess their own history, confidence, behaviour, intentions, and partner on an idividual basis before telling about their CDng. The downside risks are too great to do otherwise. E.G. if you dress once every 2 months, why tell anyone this? If you dress every day/week then you should definitely tell your partner, the earlier the better!

Hugs Jazzmine

Exelllent points, I agree 100%. Also, another down side of telling is that she will probably tell a close friend or family member, and that person may tell others too. For me, its an easy decision not to tell.

:2c:Laura

[Mitch23]

i had an underwear fetish

in a new relationship its not so important - i thought i'd dealt with it

if i'd told her she would have finished with me and anyway i'd dealt with it

13 years later i was wrong and i'm more than an undie fetishist, i want to be a part time girl and shes going to divorce me if i tell

but i tell her anyway, she doesnt divorce me but ive betrayed her trust and we have to painfully work it all through

but hey, our relationship is better even though shes unsupportive generally, because she has the real me as a partner

mitch

[Denielleinheels]

Interesting read so far. I was married for 19 years and hid it. We talked about it after the fact because of the kids. When we talked about it she said a lot things of made sense. My S/O and I met online. AFF actually. Her headline was "Wanted, REAL MAN"... well I couldn't let that one go. So I was persistant and we sparred via email for about 3 weeks when she sent her phone number and said iether call or go away. I told her I was like no one she has ever met. We talked on the phone a few times and then met. She was married twice before so I told her "Maybe your version of a real man is just a stereotypical real man and maybe you should try something different". So we started dating on 10/1/06 and have been together ever since. In the beginning I made her promise total honesty about past even if it sucked to get into and I would do the same. I told I want to know now so there are no suprises later. I guess I decided that I would rather be alone and true to me instead of with some one who make me feel trapped. No, this because of a new relationship, but I think that not being able to be who you are is a real way to shorten ones life... the stress and depression with kill you.

[KatieC]

. . .If you had been honest, in the first place then it wouldn’t have happened that way. You only put crossdressing on hold because you wanted her, you did it to get something YOU wanted…or conversely, something YOU didn’t want.

But I believe that the point that was trying to be made was that for some, it was impossible to be "honest in the first place". Not out of a willful attempt to deceive. Rather, because of ignorance and/or self-deception, the CDer honestly did not know "in the first place", so he told the truth as he understood it. When a better understanding came, the CDer found himself stuck in a trap made up from choices made from faulty information.

Shame is such a powerful human emotion. I find it hard to believe that even the biggest proponent of total honesty/total disclosure told their prospective life partner every little detail of his or her life that s/he was ashamed of. It's far easier, and completely human, to think that the shameful activity is past, that the shameful emotions will keep one from ever doing it again, and therefore it is not something that needs to be brought up. I can't speak for how women are raised, but men are taught from a very early age that the correct way to handle things is "I can deal with it myself, there's no reason to involve anyone else." This makes a man especially prone to never admitting to shameful activities, because he believes he can fix it on his own. That he should fix it on his own.

In any event, I do not find it helpful for moving forward in a relationship to put too much stress on "you should have told me in the first place!" The fact is, it was not told in the first place, and for most it was not told because of shame. All "you should have told me" does is add yet more guilt to the CDer trying to make things right, increasing the shame that he is already dealing with. We cannot live in the past if we want to move forward. The Past needs to be acknowledged and learned from, but the Now is where we must live, and the Future is where we must strive to go.

If the CDer, with his new understanding of himself, continues to hide, then that is what needs to be addressed. Not so much the hiding of years past.

[Mitch23]

beautifully put Katie - i couldnt have put it better myself

mitch

[Jazzmine]

It’s amazes me, in this day and age, that people still associate certain behaviours as being exclusive to a certain sex. Behaviours are based on "classical conditioning" usually in relation to the environment.
“Enlightenment” a wonderful sounding word…too bad it is so often misused in conversation.

There is an issue of honesty and lies otherwise this forum wouldn’t be filled with the posts about it.

Crossdressers can continue to make excuses…justifications…rationalizations…keep following that crowd on this train but until you put the BS to one side and get honest about it the world will continue to see something wrong with crossdressing because a majority of you project it as something sinful…some dirty, nasty little secret. You don’t seem to be making the connection between what you project and what you get in return. What you expect but are not willing to give in return. It’s a two way street and just because you’re a crossdresser it doesn’t mean that your needs are put above those around you. Spare me the posts about how you put this, that, and the other thing on hold because of your relationship. It’s just the same old song and dance, repeatedly, not even the tune changes anymore. If you had been honest, in the first place then it wouldn’t have happened that way. You only put crossdressing on hold because you wanted her, you did it to get something YOU wanted…or conversely, something YOU didn’t want.



That is not what I said…go back and read it again.

This isn’t about fantasies darling; this is about the reality that you and many others, male and female, are crossdressers.



You are basing the assumption that I haven’t on what, the “GG” in my screen name? Too bad you have yet to achieve enlightenment :hugs:

Speaking from experience, sometimes the truth is a harsh reality.

:love:
Wickanne

First of all Wickanne, "behaviours" are not all based on "classical conditioning". Research everyday shows more and more that our basic behaviour, and especially our personality type, is based on nature not nurture, scary as that may seem to you. It means we are mostly what we are because we were born that way. Enlightenment followed by postive conscious action is a legimate way to modify behaviour, as is classical conditioning. But neither one "cures" the instrumental cause which is our own human nature.

I accept I am generalising when I say men like to go into their caves and work things out for ourselves. And that a woman's first attempt at problem solving is to seek out someone who is better qualified for a quick solution. However, I know that is the way of most men and women I have worked with over 25 years of employing both men and women in my business and observing how they problem solve at work. Men appear to be secretive to women (don't disclose enough info) and women appear disruptive to men (when deeply focusing on problems), in my observation and experience.

Just because there has been attempts at changing what you call "classical behaviours" by social engineers, does not mean that our basic human nature has responded. It has not. The only thing that has changed is that we now know about it!

You still gloss over the basic tenant that many men have little or no idea what they are dealing with re: CD. If you accepted this I suppose you would have to get off your "honesty" hobby horse. If a person is un-enlightened about their state of affairs, they cannot be deemed to be rightly dishonest. Oh, "ignorance of the law is no excuse" I hear you say!
Is there a law that says "all men are totally centred and wise and know everything about everything?". Well, we know most men are foolish and naive don't we Wickanne! :D Which is why "enlightenment" is effective in helping us understand our individual needs.

One important issue needs to be restated. Until a man accepts himself as he is and makes sense of that self he cannot and will not disclose anything to the outside world. If he cannot sort it out himself he may seek outside help. Then again he may not, and dig himself further into the mire. God bless the internet for coming to our aid.

Just to put you in the picture about my crossdressing. I expect and have asked for nothing from anyone. It is my personal interest. I do NOT have to share it with you or anyone and not asking to. Furthermore, the act of CD impacts on not a single soul except myself. I accept every case is different.

I certainly do not see CD as sinful or dirty. Read my other posts and you will see how I think. The issue of disclosure to others comes down to how you perceive you will be treated after disclosure. Your perceptions could be right or wrong. Also, some people (SO included) can handle the information and others cannot. It is up to the individual CD to assess their circumstances.
E.G. I certainly would not ask you to jump on the back of my racing bike for a downhill thrill if I thought you would kill both of us on the dangerous 100km curve at the bottom of the hill! You would have to convince me you could handle it first. Both of our lives are at stake here.

It should be remembered until a person decides that they are a CD, then up to that point, their reality is that they are not, no matter what anyone else says. They have not accepted it nor do not know what they are dealing with.
Until that matter is cleared up, you cannot be deemed to be "dishonest".

:hugs: Jazzmine

[shirley1]

i still think i'm a borderline trannie - i dont dress every day or week - its a really difficult thing to live with for most guys how the hell do you tell anyone go out publically without fear of being harrassed let alone voilence - i'm joining a tg group soon to try and meet other people and with the aim of going out i dont know how well i'd pass - i'm single and so god knows how difficult it is for married cds they have my sympathy - as a cd all you want to do or at least i do is to be able to go out just like women do in everyday life but you cant do it unless you are extremely brave - its so frustrating and annoying you think why cant i do this - but you know why because you fear being victimised in your local area - i was bullied victiimised by my neighbours not even because of this but because i was alone few friends seemingly came round to visit me at the time - there are nasty people in the world who will try and make your life a misery if they can certainly here in england a lot depends on where you live and i'm safe at the moment ie i think icould go out dressed from wher i'm livin no problem - but other places i'vr lived near on impossible youd be putting yourself right in the firing line - as for relationships i want to meet a girl on the basis of my crossdressing and do believe thats possible

[jennydl]

I too am a single,never married cd 40yrs yng and have struggled with this very question.I don't believe in misrepresenting oneself to a potential SO. My way around this for the past ten or so years has been not to date at all.sad but true.I would be interested in a FABs point of veiw on this subject.When would the best time be to spill the beens,so to speak?
jennydl

[Stephenie S]

Wickanne,

Your clear reasoning and logic are more than a breath of fresh air. They are a tzunami of enlightenment. It is sooo nice to have your opinions here on this forum. Many may disagree with you, please don't be discouraged. We can always use more clear thinking on unpopular points of view.

Lovies,
Stephenie

[Bethany_Anne_Fae]

I agree, and just so that we keep things on an even keel here people... try not to get nasty with each other over this. Its a fairly familair question to many I am sure, but I would rather see honest dialogue here without the flames, and a continuation of the thread ;)

*hugs*
Zara

[Nicki B]

Wickanne,

Life seems so very black and white, to you? :idontknow:

Can I ask, have you always told your SOs absolutely everything about yourself and your past? Is there really nothing you're not proud of that you've maybe 'forgotten', or glossed over?

[Jilmac]

:eek:The first time I wore a dress was age 7, I did it on a dare and as soon as i put the panties and dress on I loved the way the panties felt and the way the dress looked, but at the same time I was scared to tears. I didn't want anybody to see me because I didn't want to be laughed at, rideculed, and called a sissy.

For the next eight years I experimented wearing the panties and clothes of my three older sisters. I was still scared and ashamed, but I was still hooked on the feeling and look. I hid from everyone because I thought I was the only boy in the world who loved wearing girls clothes. I had terrible feelings of guilt and shame but still dressed every chance I could.

When I was 15, my second sister died of a cerebreal hemorrage incurred in a horseback riding accident. In my grief I wore her clothes so I could have her spirit as part of me. I have been dressing ever since,but still in shame. I didn't know why I loved wearing feminine clothes but I knew I didn't want to stop. It was still a deep dark secret until age 24 when I told the woman I was planning to marry.

Her reaction was disgust:naughty and when she talked about it she refered to it as "my problem" so I still hid and dressed. She never caught me dressed, but at times I would get careless and leave evidence. whenever she found evidence and confronted me it would be another guilt trip and a whole load of shame. I wondered if being up front with her had been in my best interest. I didn't want to lie but hiding was the only alternative if I were to continue dressing.

I divorced her after 10 years and when I started dating the woman who would be my second wife, I wanted to be truthful with her so again, I told her that I enjoyed dressing. Her reaction was sadness:sad: and she was convinced that dressing would turn me gay. I also felt guilt and shame with her and I kept it hidden. It seemed that every time I tried to be honest and open, I suffered the consequences.

My second wife was never mean or vindictive, she just couldn't understand how a heterosexual loving husband and father could want to "be a woman". My frustration kept me in the closet and I still had to sneak to dress and kept on living a lie. So for me, telling my so twice only caused me to be more decietful. I lost her to breast cancer in August but now I still have family that doesn't undrestand so I'm still hiding.

I now have a new so who is also a love interest and I plan to tell her that I dress. I also plan to stick with her no matter what the future holds but If I have to continue to hide and dress, so be it. I want to be truthful but I don't like the results when I am. All I wish to gain by being truthful about my dressing is the ability to dress without shame, and not be forced into hiding.

Luv AND HUGS, :hugs: Jill

[Jaydee]

Okay, I'll jump in.
I started wearing my mom's discarded pantyhose around 10 or 11. This was in the dark ages of the mid-sixties. I had never heard of "Crossdressing". I thought I was the only boy in the world to feel this compulsion. The guilt and shame was overwhelming, but I couldn't stop. Eventually as a later teen, my Cding tapered off. I thought I was done with it. Some time later, in college, I started dating the woman whom I would marry, and have been married to for 31 years. Should I have told her my dirty secret then? At the time we were married, I still did not know that others did it, I thought I was the only one in the world, and besides I no longer had an interest in CDing. I thought it was something shameful in my past. I thought it must be some kind of sexual perversion.
10 years after getting married, it came back. I still was naive enough to believe that I was the only one in the world. I knew I wasn't gay, what was I? I started slowly again, only on business trips. Should I have told her then? Probably, but now I was more than 10 years into the marriage, with two kids. The best thing I thought I could do was protect the kids and the marriage, by keeping my secret. I never have had any interest in men or even going out. My CDing is private. I don't involve her or anyone else. Am I dishonest with my SO. I guess a case could be made that I am.
In a perfect world I would like to be more open about my "dirty secret", but I still haven't come to grips with it myself. Should I burden her with this secret, and possibly jeopardize our marriage? I don't know. I do know that I do not have the strength and fortitude to come out fully to her. After finding this site about a year and a half ago, I now know that I am not the only one. I am feeling better about myself, and not as ashamed of my compulsion. I am making baby steps to coming out. It is my own struggle. I guess I can't be as honest as Wickanne thinks I should be, but I try.

Jaydee

[Charlotte Cross]

To answer your question, when I first got married, the desire to dress wasn't as strong. I thought I had overcome it somehow, an aberration of my brain cells firing out of order that was now somehow healed. Oh, I still thought about it and fantasized, but didn't go there until the birth of my first child, when I was alone with my wife's clothes. It started again right then, but it was too late to tell her. "Charlotte" wasn't who she married. I couldn't let her or anybody else know-ever.
I held in my feminine side for all my life. It's been painful for me and something I even tried to stop. You all know we can never do that.
I was a jock in school, joined the Marines, fought in Vietnam, got married, went into business, 3 children, 6 grandkids. I was and still am, everything a "man" is expected to be.
But Charlotte lives inside, and we all have to deal with it one way or another.

[Julogden]

Not answering your question and going off on a bit of a tangent here: several years back, there was a self-help guru/author (can't remember his name now, seem to recall an Italian surname) who did some shows for PBS, and the one thing that he said that stuck with me was (essentially, can't remember his exact words) that if you're an apple, don't live your life pretending to be an orange, as you'll only attract people who like oranges.

I think that's REALLY good advice for those who are single. There ARE women out there who would like to know us, so if we go through life totally hiding our real selves, we'll probably never meet them.

Of course, this has to be balanced to a degree, but I think it's a really good idea to at least give off a hint or two of who we really are. And I also feel VERY strongly that it's foolish, at best, to get married or to enter a serious relationship without a full disclosure of our CD status, to do otherwise is just asking for trouble and heartbreak, and it's dishonest and unfair to the other person.

I am also of the opinion that anyone who is involved in any sort of CD/TG activites has no business getting into a serious relationship until they've done some hard work to learn who they are regarding their gender issues. Work out the details of sexual and gender stuff BEFORE getting into a serious relationship, not after. It's not fair to your SO to announce that you've suddenly discovered that you're a TS and need to go on hormones or that you're attracted to men or other CD's. That's the sort of thing that you need to discover while you're single and able to explore them. I also know that sometimes we make foolish decisions and/or, through self-ignorance, end up in relationships that we shouldn't be in, but there are enough resources available to us nowadays that increasingly, there is no excuse for self-ignorance.:2c:

Carol

[KandisTX]

It's not fair to your SO to announce that you've suddenly discovered that you're a TS and need to go on hormones or that you're attracted to men or other CD's. That's the sort of thing that you need to discover while you're single and able to explore them. I also know that sometimes we make foolish decisions and/or, through self-ignorance, end up in relationships that we shouldn't be in, but there are enough resources available to us nowadays that increasingly, there is no excuse for self-ignorance.:2c:

Carol

Carol,

I knew a T-gurl in the past that was exactly like this. Had been married to a wonderful woman for a number of years and within six months went from "I'm a crossdresser". to "I'm a Trans-Sexual and want a sex change NOW". Talk about a shock to the system? I and all our gurl friends were quite shocked and in all honesty turned our back on hur and supported the wife in this matter. To us it was a slap in the face and to her it was a great big "screw you" type of situation. His wife was mortified by this decision and in all honesty, so were all of us. This was a totally and completely selfish choice that he made and did not even once consider his wifes feelings or thoughts, he just decided one day that he was going to become a woman.

Kandis:love:

[Bethany_Anne_Fae]

Carol,

I knew a T-gurl in the past that was exactly like this. Had been married to a wonderful woman for a number of years and within six months went from "I'm a crossdresser". to "I'm a Trans-Sexual and want a sex change NOW"....This was a totally and completely selfish choice that he made and did not even once consider his wifes feelings or thoughts, he just decided one day that he was going to become a woman.

Kandis:love:

Wow, you and I might know this same person as the circumstances sound identical. This happened around 2001 up in Dallas area.
Even though I was not happy (personally) over the choices he made, I'm still his friend. Doing what he did came with a HUGE price as he has children as well.
There are times where he eludes to thinking it would have been better had he kept everything in the closet because even though his SO (on the outside) was saying that she was accepting of his (then) behavior, she was telling my SO a completely different story. When he decided it was time to be all he/she could be, his marriage was essentially over.
It was an awful time watching that train wreck happening, but we still gave them both as much support as was possible.

*Much hugs*
Zara

[KandisTX]

Wow, you and I might know this same person as the circumstances sound identical. This happened around 2001 up in Dallas area.*Much hugs*
Zara

Nope.. this was in SD almost 14 years ago.

Kandis:love:

[xexoticx]

ive been dating my g/f for 2 year now (and a year and 1/2 previously when i was in highschool) and im 22. she doesnt know that ive dresser since i was like 14 but has found some pics of me on my computer and when i had the chance to tell her i cheickened out at the time and said it was just experimental. but since then ive baught way more clothing, make up and accessories and sort of sitting on the fence of making a transition and feel flustered about it all. its not really worrying about telling her she is really open and understanding but i know my parents would not like it one bit (very stubern and oppinionated at least) and would be a rought go at work although i already get picked on as being the girl on our shift and ive just shrugged it all off and take it all in. i prolly can't pick one thing why i hide it, maybe it all, but there is a few things it prolly could be. might be the fact its a really small town and the fact of not being excepted by people because there is one person that was married with kids and transitioned and all during it was a constant joke behind her back. as for hiding it im still young and know its not to late to just come out, i just need to get enought nerve to come out. i would love to be able to live a normal life the way ive dreamed it

*hugs*

[Stacye Rose]

"Wow, you and I might know this same person as the circumstances sound identical. This happened around 2001 up in Dallas area."

Zarabeth, This must be more common than it seems. I had someone I knew who experienced this very sort of sudden transition in the metroplex in 1998. She went from dressing one day to transitioning the next. This individual was extremely selfish about the entire ordeal and left a very devoted SO with an extremely bad opinion of anyone remotely connected to the TG community. It's entirely possible to take the "to thine own self be true" to far.

[penny74]

I keep my secret out of fear. I suspect she knows I wear her clothes and she has seen me in her jeans and an outfit I was going to wear for halloween that was a skirt and top and I wore her bikini bottoms while on our honeymoon in Jamaica. She does know and accept that I wear only panties and no mens undies. Funny thing, she made a comment one night last week about me being more "girly than manly, but in a good way". She explained that I have an unusual appreciation for her shoes and clothes and well, that I wear panties ( she does buy the cutest shoes ! ) . I asked if that bothered her and she said not in the least. Maybe that was my chance to drop the hint. I almost confessed , but chickened out. I do plan to tell her, when the time right.

[L.A.Dawn]

(please note --I'm a relative newbie to forum etiquette and tech, so I can't get this into quotes, although I think it could be my old browser...:)

JiFem911 wrote:
Her reaction was disgust and when she talked about it she refered to it as "my problem" so I still hid and dressed. She never caught me dressed, but at times I would get careless and leave evidence. whenever she found evidence and confronted me it would be another guilt trip and a whole load of shame. I wondered if being up front with her had been in my best interest. I didn't want to lie but hiding was the only alternative if I were to continue dressing.

I divorced her after 10 years and when I started dating the woman who would be my second wife, I wanted to be truthful with her so again, I told her that I enjoyed dressing. Her reaction was sadness and she was convinced that dressing would turn me gay. I also felt guilt and shame with her and I kept it hidden. It seemed that every time I tried to be honest and open, I suffered the consequences.

My second wife was never mean or vindictive, she just couldn't understand how a heterosexual loving husband and father could want to "be a woman". My frustration kept me in the closet and I still had to sneak to dress and kept on living a lie. So for me, telling my so twice only caused me to be more decietful. I lost her to breast cancer in August but now I still have family that doesn't undrestand so I'm still hiding.




Ji, I am so sorry that dressing has been so painful for you, and I hope and pray that your new SO is open and loving about it -- you need and deserve, as do we all. So many of us encounter shame as we go through life for a variety of issues, I'm so glad that this site is here to provide love and support.

I think Ji's experience shows the GIGANTIC generational and cultural gap that I at least am witnessing here in L.A. between the new generation(s) open acceptance of cross-sexual lifestyles, and those of us from the "old school", which has a lot of great things to say for it, but Crossdressing acceptance is not usually one of them.
I realize that L.A. is eons from some areas when it comes to acceptance, but we all need to find the community that supports us, be it within a strictly Christian community or a more open-minded city.

I myself could not be more supportive for heterosexual dressers and their spouses, despite the fact that dressing takes me to a very bi-sexual place.

As for "coming out", my closest friends already know, but my hesitation is more due to my appearance at this time than my fear of losing friends or family (point me to the make-up section - lol!)

Again, thank goodness for sites like this --we all need to know that we are not alone.

[Nicki B]

Is there really nothing you're not proud of that you've maybe 'forgotten', or glossed over?


Since I am 47, it would take me 47 years to tell someone everything. My experience is, so far, that most men just don't want to hear it. Most have been so caught up in their own lives that they are not interested in my past...

I believe you've answered the question - yes, there are things you gloss over.... I rather think that makes you human.



PS - Dawn - to simply quote somebody, use the 'Quote' button on the bottom RHS of their post? :)

[Melora]

OK, I am sure that I am just repeating here, BUT.. For me..
I did not tell her before I married because I "Feared" rejection, (Iwish I did it all differently). Why I am not "out" now?, Because I live in a Real "Hick" Community, and I am quite "known", if you know what I mean, = I might be beat to a pulp, (already have), or Die I fear.. A "small" rural community I am afraid is soo much different than a city, But soo much more "free", only in a way..
Melora

[julia ann]

In my case I "knew' I could quit at any time when I found that right person. Well, maybe that was just a presumtion on my part. My wife found out and went through the roof, I went into therapy to "cure my problem". After talking many years to my therapist and learning that there are many of us and the discovery of the internet I have come to the conclusion that this is who I am and while I still need to hide it from her[Ithink she still suspects] it is who I am and must be to be whole. It would be alot easier if she could understand.

[Jilmac]

The truth is black-and-white...it's either true or not true...grey is for excuses and partials truths.

I have always been honest about my past. It goes back to, does a person want to hear it. Since I am 47, it would take me 47 years to tell someone everything. My experience is, so far, that most men just don't want to hear it. Most have been so caught up in their own lives that they are not interested in my past...they just dump their stuff on me and look for me to help solve their problems, stroke their egos...blah, blah, blah. It's just the type of personality that I attract. I am guessing that I attract them because I am open-minded and honest - say what they need to hear and not what they want to hear. Granted, there are many men who do not like my style and it doesn't bother me in the slightest...I am not on this planet to live their life for them nor for them to live mine for me.



You knew how they felt yet you married them anyway. Have you ever asked yourself why? Is it about having the woman that you want? Is it about staying, emotionally, unavailable? Are you addicted to rejection of your crossdressing? I can think of so many questions. Maybe some of your answers may be the answers to this thread topic.

No, hiding wasn’t your only alternative. Not getting married in the first place, when you knew how she felt, was your alternative.



Perfect! And it’s that living the life of something else that one creates the lies to hide the truth. So why do people hide things…that list is endless but the truth of the matter is that when one wants an orange one will act like an orange for as long as one can pull it off. No one is being done any favours by hiding who you are, least of all yourself.

:love:
Wickanne

Wickanne: It's easy for you to say I shouldn't have married the women I did. Do you think I should have stayed single all my life? When a person is in love with another person is he supposed to turn his back on her because she doesn't understand his compulsion? You seem to forget that marriage was their choice as well as mine. Should we have forsaken each other and gone our separate ways?

I had twenty six wonderful years with my second wife. I chose to hide my dressing from her because of her insecurity about my masculinity and my sexuality. She had a gay brother who was also a transvestite in his community. She loved her brother, and even though she accepted his gay lifestyle, she still had difficulty understanding it. The same held true with my dressing, she was not able to undrestand my reasons for doing it.

We took a vow for better or for worse. That meant us for each other, not just her for me or me for her. Yes I felt a great deal of shame and guilt because I didn't want to be deceptive in our relationship. If you think I was being selfish by still dressing and hiding it from her of my first wife, then you've got a twisted sense of perception. Nobody is perfect in this life, and marriage is give and take. I did my best to be a good husband and father in spite of my dressing.

I chose to hide it from my wife and family to avoid shame and embarassment on them, and now that my wife is deceased and my family is away from home, nobody will be embarassed. I have a new love interest and I intend to tell her of my dressing. If she is willing to accept me in spite of it, it will be a win win for both of us. However, if she has difficulty understanding, then I will choose to hide it from her as well.:2c: Jill

[bEEb]

Hi Girls!
Newbie here. I (was) VERY excited to read this thread....
"It is merely to know more about your mindset, not to judge, ridicule, or ".....
Geesh, what happened?

[melissacd]

I realize that some feel that what Wickanne is saying seems too black and white, however, there is great wisdom in what she says.

We can come up with all sorts of reasons why it is that we can justify hiding this part of ourselves, especially from the ones that we proclaim to love, but in fact I realize that that is just plain wrong. How are we ever to have complete and honest relationships if we do not speak our truth right up front. I am so guilty of believing that I can introduce truths later and love will save the day, but that is, as my ex kept saying to me, not fair.

In as much as we may want acceptance and say it is just clothes, the reality is that some people really have huge difficulty with cross dressing and no amount of anything will change their mind on this. We have to give them the choice by telling them the truth. We have to accept that by telling them the truth they may walk away.

The major reason that my spouse of 25 years walked away from me after I revealed the truth was because she felt betrayed, she felt that I had taken an important choice away from her, a choice that was not mine to make. You know what, she was right. She did not like nor would she ever have accepted the dressing but the big thorn was the betrayal.

I know that had I told her I was a cross dresser at the beginning that she would have walked away right then and there, but that was her choice to make, not mine, I took that choice away from her by hiding the truth. It is not up to me to decide whether or not she can/will accept this in time, that is her choice and I took that away from her until so much time had passed that the eventual revelation, to sooth my guilty conscience, was total devastation for her.

The plain and simple fact is you have to tell the truth right at the start, there really is no excuse for withholding it. You have to give them the opportunity to choose from the beginning. A potential partner must be able to make an informed choice because it affects their lives too. To not say anything is a very selfish act on our part and I see that so clearly now.

[Nicki B]

..how is that glossing over something? Since you do not know me, I would expect your assumption to be wrong.

Well, didn't you just 'gloss over' an answer to my question - again? :strugglin

My point being one of stones and glass houses..

[Angie G]

I wasnot big into it then my wife has known for almost 3 years now and my dressing has gone to biger and better things :hugs:
Angie

[immike]

Hi again, girls...

Hers is another of those "UH-OH! Zara's doin too much thinking again" posts.

I've been involved with this for over 10 years now. Small potatoes based on what I've read in these forums recently, but in that time, I've come to learn and grow as an individual because of what I've experienced, witnessed and read. Maybe its the Psychology student in me.. but I'm always curious.

So many threads about having to tell ones S/O about their secret. So much pain that I see people endure either before, during, or after their revelation to those around them.

This question is particularly for the MARRIED/or about to BE, and CLOSETED Crossdressers. It is merely to know more about your mindset, not to judge, ridicule, or to put you on the spot. It is presented in the past tense as well as future tense.

When you go about your days as a single person and exploring your femme side, you KNOW that it is possible that you will someday meet the right person to (presumably) share the rest of your life with. Knowing that you are already a crossdresser... why won't you/why didn't you tell them before you get/got married?
My future wife would be freaked out thinking I was wearing her clothes,which I would,
secretly.I am a closet CD&I am secretly entering mothers closet,when she is not home&
dressing in her good wardrobe&outfits,especially her short mini skirts&silk blouses.I order
pantyhose out of her womens catalogs&wear them when I try on her outfits with heels.

[PeggySue]

Hmm, seeing a definite pattern in these posts:

1. Introverted young man gets into crossdressing, thinks it's a sexual practice, a "coping strategy" for not having a GG in his life.

2. Finding that special GG at last, he figures, that's it, I can throw out my girl clothes, draw a line in the sand and move on. And, having a real GG to play with is a lot of fun, and for a while, all's well.

3. Time passes. Calendar pages fall off.

4. He finds that crossdressing is not only, or not truly, a sexual practice -- it's more basic to his wiring than that. Sooner or later, the pressure gets too great to resist. But, its years later, he didn't tell her early on, because he didn't think he was going back. He's stuck with the "why didn't you tell me" problem.

I also married at a time, and to a girl, that would have made discussion of my crossdressing passion totally impossible. I'm really stuck. But I do strongly encourage others to realize, as has been said many times here, it's not going away, and wot th'ell, she might actually enjoy having you as her sometime girlfriend! Tell her!

Hugs,
Susie

I couldn't have said it better! This is basically my story too. It is only the down hill movement of my marriage that got me to wear I am now in my CDing. Basically, I'm out in public part-time, but not to anyone I know. Terrible way to have to live, but the Cding makes it all worth it.

Hugs and Merry Christmas

[Celeste]

Like melissacd- My ex would have freaked and walked had I told her. Even though my dressing was sporadic, almost non existent before our marriage,I made a mistake in not being honest. Her idea of a cd was a 400 pd guy with a shadow trying to market his body in the red light district. So with there being little or nothing available to change these stereotypes at that time,I tried to make the best decision for that period and remained quiet.

I do feel dishonest and have still never confided ,even after our divorce,she probably would get violent and try to terminate my visitation rights.Our divorce was a result of things unrelated to CDing and I only attempted to dress 1 time in our 11 year marriage, when she was away and out of town. Having grown over the years I think I would have been honest and let her go her own way.
I believe theres no justification for being dishonest in the past and can,t change it. I certainly would inform any new partner on probably the 2nd or 3rd date. Times change and we change with them.