View Full Version : Coming Out and An Unexpected Opinion

04-12-2005, 06:09 PM
Ok... I told my ex, J, that I was "gender-confused" and although he was the same way, I knew he didn't really approve. At one point he told me he thought it was "unhealthy". I don't really speak to him anymore.

So I came out to my very best friend (who also happens to be an ex... long story) on Saturday, using the words transgendered and crossdressing for the very first time. I was a little drunk and started crying after a bit. We were together 4 years and I'd just admitted a total departure from the girl he dated. He told me yesterday that he didn't care if I was TG or not, but if I was crying about it, I should seek help. I told him that although I know intellectually that there's nothing wrong with it, I'm still adjusting and having a hard time telling that part of myself that grew up with everyone telling her that TG was absolutely unacceptable that it really is okay. Part of me is still ashamed, but I know it's there and I'm working against it. He couldn't understand why I wasn't utterly okay with it.

For the record, he's a total freak-- there's nothing homophobic about him, he's totally secure in his sexuality, even though he has some odd tastes, it would never occur to him to be ashamed. Of anything. Ever. And he literally cannot understand anyone who is. If he decided he was TS, he'd be signing up for SRS the next day.

These are the only two people I've ever admitted anything to, aside from this forum.

So am I crazy? I mean, I read about purging in the MTF forum, I wouldn't ever do that, but I'm still not totally okay with being a CD. I mean I am... but not completely. Is this normal?

04-12-2005, 09:31 PM
follow your heart but as everyone here says you can't ever be the same again maybe you just need to be happy with yourself and find some friends who accept you

04-13-2005, 12:09 AM
Shoot, girl. You worry way too much. ><;
Actually, worrying about that sort of stuff is normal. Trust me. I was the exact same way. I was born and raised in a society where being a CD/transgender was utterly wrong and doing so would secure the damning of one's soul. (which they still believe to this day!)
Even now, I feel slightly uncomfortable CDing in public because I can't pull it off completely (damn hair! XP). But I just grit my teeth and bear it since it's only a few more months before I do the cutting of the hair.

As for the guy who's a "freak" w/ no problem about anything related to sexual orientation, let me just say this:

I know of several guys who are the exact same way. There's simply nothing you can do about it. Most men just lack the required empathy needed to understand these situations because, simply, they've always done what they thought was "fun" or "cool" without a second thought, even at the expense of other people's feelings. Whether it made them look like an ass or not.

Now, im not saying that this applies to all men. Just the majority of those I know. It might be different where you live or where others live, so Im just speaking from experience.

Anyways, just give yourself some time. It took me years upon years to finally accept who I was. I always knew I enjoyed wearing mens clothing, even if it meant fighting my parents about it. But I never went all the way, because of them. They were always telling me that it was just a "phase" that I would grow out of, and I tried to believe it was true, too. But deep down I knew it wasn't meant to be. :p
And it took a lot of guts (and for you too) to come out and admit it someone other than a stranger. (Which I've done twice before, to strangers just to wierd them out because they were annoying me. :cool: )

Lately, i've been trying to come out to my mum, but it's not going as smoothly as I had hoped. I'll prob. post this in my own thread I previously posted since it's something else altogether (I think.).

Anyways, sometimes in the end, the only person you can rely on is yourself. So just give it time and trust your gut. You'll know what to do.

Ok, i'll stop babbling like I know what Im talking about. :p

04-13-2005, 01:04 AM
Normal? Yes. We all grow up in a society that shits on our way of living. While we may feel comfortable in men's clothes...we have crap instilled in our heads from growing up that makes us automatically feel ashamed because we are considered freaks and unhealthy sin ridden people.

There are days when I would like to turn off how I am, how I feel, and how I dress and live to the norms of society. I only wish it was that easy. I think we all want acceptance and to be treated like a normal human being. To be told we aren't wrong for being the way we are.

In the end, we just all have to live for ourselves. We can't please everyone. Only people we can please are ourselves.

04-13-2005, 04:11 AM
Eventually, all the "should I do this" ambivalence will go away and turn into "the hell with what others think, I'm doing it" (and it doesn't have to be full-time). Sleep deprivation helps, not that I suggest anyone use this method. :D

Thankfully I'm the spoiled only child of the family. And thankfully having short hair is not so strange in my family. But after a few years of maybe-that-phase-is-gone, I went back to my old ways suddenly, and it did bother my mother a lot. I can't really talk to her about psychology anymore without her hinting that I should find a "solution" to this "problem". In a good way, of course.

but I'm still not totally okay with being a CD. I mean I am... but not completely.
I can relate. Even though I'm all for Eddie's "get ready for being outed in public" attitude, I still secretly cringe whenever friends out me (using "she") in front of people who are "still in the dark". My mother recently outed me to a stranger, and I was more upset than usual. So in a sense, I'm still not comfortable with it. Nevertheless, I cannot impose my preference on others. Strangely enough (or maybe as expected), it's the new friends (all straight) I make nowadays who gladly use the "he" pronoun.

It will take time, trial and error, and a lot of love, I suppose. Take care.

04-13-2005, 01:00 PM
Hey, I just wanted to bitch for a sec and didn't want to start a new thread. I'll respond to all of your wonderfully encouraging posts when I get back from class.

So I went out as Galen today and on a whim, stopped to order a new pair of frames for my glasses. Never been there before, but they were running a special and my current pair is falling the **** apart. I THOUGHT the salesgirl was kinda flirting with me a bit and she made a point of pointing out the men's glasses section. I thought to myself, yes! finally I can tell for sure that I DO pass! But no, when I sat down with my decision, she referred to me as "she" and "her". Grr! So pissed!!!

04-14-2005, 12:59 AM
Well, Pixie...
I personally would have taken that as a good thing (in my mind, since I ultimately would like to be recognised as TG and not male or female).
She obviously recognised that you are CD/TV/TS or something and responded in the way that she felt was appropriate; she noticed you wore mens' clothes but were still female.
So... I would have been happy about it but that's just me. I suppose, with the general public, you take what you can get *shrugs*
Of course, as a transgenderist (my new term for myself) I would prefer people to use male pronouns with me, even if they know/ recognise that I'm female.

04-14-2005, 01:22 AM
Ouch Pixie! Sheesh, I know what you mean. I'd prefer to be recognized as male and not female. Or even TG. I get such an adrenaline rush whenever im referred to as 'he' 'him' or 'sir'. (They used to call me Sir in 7th grade. I've never gotten over it. It just encouraged me to be more guyish than I ever was. ><)

I agree with Gabriel. After a while of worrying about what others think, you just... get tired of it all. Next think you know, you're thinking/saying "Screw it, im doing whatever the hell I want." and you're doing it. Might be a little uncomfortable at first, but trust me, you get comfortable with it after a few run throughs with the new routine.
Kinda like me. Just bought this new military-based-after-designers coat. Deciding it looked best with a tie and slacks, that's what I wore. Got lots of compliments on it. Even guys wanted to take it from me! :p But I had to get used to wearing it. I tend to sweat when I get nervous and I was definetely sweating the first time I wore it. (And it wasn't because I was hot either.)

So yeah, i'll just go away now...

04-14-2005, 05:02 PM
I am wondering... how old are all of you? And do any of you dress daily? How long have you been dressing? If you do dress daily, do you pack? Soft or Hard? These are just things I would like to know before I give my opinion on this subject... Thanks

04-16-2005, 01:28 AM
I dress probably anywhere from 3-4 days out of the week, since my wardrobe has been dwindled down because of *Ahem* a few people who disagree with my dress style and have thrown out basically everything I had.
Don't pack. But i've been thinking about it.
Been dressing ever since elementary school. Got worse in Middle school. Cut back during 9th and 10th grade since mum began to toss out my clothes when I wasn't looking or around. Starting to get back into the habit now.
Also been thinking about getting some shirts from T-Kingdom but using frog bras for now.

04-16-2005, 08:54 PM
I have always been raised that I can be anything I wanted as long as I was secure with the decision, and by being raised this way, I had no drama with who I was/am.
I've been a boy for as long as I can remember, I have never worried about social situations or anything of the sort, as far as most are concerned, I really am a boy. I will never have SRS or even take T, I have a naturally deep voice and I don't want facial hair.
Why does it bother you? Besides the way you were raised, because I was raised in a strictly Christian home with teachers for both parents. What about it makes you feel the way you do? What do YOU think has to happen for you to be "OK" with being a CD? The last time I HAD to dress like a female, I felt like I was a MTF CD, sad, really, but the thing is, and please don't anyone be offended by this, it is MY opinion. I feel that someone who is a female who dresses like a male on occasion is just that, a female who wears mens clothes, there is barely any social stigma about this. On the other hand, our society is so damn closed minded that a MTF CD is an "awful" thing... now, I'm saying this because when I have had to dress in femme clothes, I felt like an MTF CD, except I wasn't enjoying it, and I got nothing but comments, and stares. However, put me back in my boy clothes and everything is ok, no one even looks twice unless I am walking into the women's rest room, which rarely happens.
Sorry if I offended anyone, but as I said before, this is MY opinion only.

Well... okay. I'm going to have to write a lot here, beware. I'm going to start off general. And FYI, I'm using the term "transgendered" as a state of mind, identifying with the opposite sex and "TV", "full-time", etc, to mean a lifestyle where people live daily as the opposite sex.

There's a great many MTFs here that are not full-time and will never be full-time. Yet apparently, I'm the only FTM (except takoyaki, who plans to be full-time when he gets away from home). If not, please speak up. In fact, you're right, for a woman to announce she wears men's clothes the reaction is kinda "yeah... so?"

It's my opinion that MTFs get so much more crap because there's no middle ground for them. An FTM has to be full-time, living as a male, to get the transvestite/crossdresser label, but MTFs get the label for wearing stockings to work. I have male friends now that are wearing girl jeans for the fit, but even that's pushing the line for some people.

So after much thinking, I decided that dress could really be damned. I've got a very masculine personality, always have, always identified with the guys more than the girls, even if I didn't wear the clothes. After much more thinking, reading, and researching, I decided I fell under that middle ground territory of "transgendered". For a girl, that kinda just means you're cool and why the hell make a fuss?

Because MTFs don't have that middle ground. And if FTMs keep on the way they are, it will continue to be okay for girls to xdress, but forbidden for boys. As identifying myself as transgendered, I'm being honest and kind of unconsciously saying "this is what it means for a girl to be TG and while I'd be beaten in Victorian England, I'm pretty average for 21st century America. So why make a fuss over boys doing the same thing?" For me to deny being TG, while, thank you society!, is fine for girls in this day and age, is for me to reap the benefits while sharing none of the issues facing the TG/TS/TV community and leaving the MTFs screwed in a ditch. As a feminist and a human being, I feel I have a responsibility to help them out.

Now that's kind of idealistic and exaggerated. I don't have some kind of guilt complex regarding the gender wars, but I feel if more TG but not fulltime TS/TV women would come out and admit it, the world would be a better place, at least until MTFs enjoy the same "who cares?" social attitude that FTMS enjoy.

So this is totally off topic and ummmm.... yeah, I forgot where I was going with this. If you want to see me as a female who wears boys' clothing sometimes, go ahead. I disagree, but hey, that's me.

This post is huge. I'm starting another one to respond more cohesively and more personally.

04-16-2005, 09:14 PM
Part of me says I should really just let this go, but I am genuinely curious. Damyin, you say at the beginning of your post that you were raised with the attitude that you could be anything you wanted so long as you were secure in that decision, and then go on to say that your home was a strict Christian environment and implied that background is no excuse. ??

As for my own background, the attitude in my house was "everything under the sun is fine.... so long as YOU'RE not the one doing it. But it's cool for *other people*." But I'm skipping the background card for now.

What has to happen for me to be fine with being a CD? Nothing. I need some time to get used to it and to stop thinking of myself as a girl with a shameful secret. And yes, why is it a shameful secret when I just finished writing about how FTMs are widely accepted-- more so than MTFs anyway? Because the term "transgendered" to the none-TG community is a phrase like a loaded gun. By admitting it, I've admitted to an alternative, what my dad would call a deviant lifestyle. It's a label, and I'm sorry, an ugly one at that.

I thought I had a lot more to say and I probably will tomorrow, but for right now, f$%# it.

04-16-2005, 09:21 PM
ok, you keep saying transgendered... are you going to/planning on transitioning?

04-16-2005, 10:25 PM
NO. As far as I understand it, it's usually transsexuals that transition. I like my body the way it is. To me, transgendered means--everything. The whole scope of MTF, FTM, crossdressers, transsexuals, drag queens, transvestites, etc. I usually use it to describe the more minor attitudes-- not full-time, not an everyday "lifestyle".

04-17-2005, 01:29 AM
Well, actually I just want to get the breast reduction surgery. Genital surgery is just wrong, if you ask me. (Who'd want to go through with it anyways? Ouch. Couldn't pee without it stinging for a long time I bet.) Well... I've also thought about having my tubes tied. (I hate saying that. Sounds gross). And yes, I want to live as a full-time FTM... a gay one at that. I even have the whole wrist flick goin. LMAO. Anyways... whatever.

04-17-2005, 04:16 AM
Okay... If you live full time as the opposite sex but you don't want to have SRS or hormones, then you'd be considered a transgenderist.

Just some new terminology I learnt.

04-17-2005, 09:35 AM
I am leaving this forum, just to let you all know... If I don't I know myself and I know I will start fights and probably end up being banned from it, so I will leave on my own. Have fun with your life.

04-17-2005, 11:54 PM
Sorry to see you go, Damyin...

Anyway, as far as me going full- time... I basically do already and stuff. But for now I consider myself a transgenderist. I would do hormones but the risks are too high. If there was a guaranteed "safe way" to do hormones, which would not make me sick, make me lose my hair (not that it necessarily would but it's a possibility), give me full- body acne (yekk), mess up my liver, and (most importantly) wreck my singing voice, I would do it in an instant.

I may end up doing chest surgery, but I haven't had enough time to think about the pros and cons and risks of doing that. Not enough research. Besides that, I can't afford it and I'm not healthy enough to deal with any kind of major surgery. And when I get married... if my husband (or wife, if I marry an MTF) doesn't want me to, or has a major problem with it, I won't do it. Plus I want kids and if I had surgery before kids it wouldn't matter anyway lol

No genital surgery for me, thanks, unless they come up with a procedure that looks real and functions perfectly, just like a real boy's twanger, and is realistically affordable.

04-18-2005, 09:34 PM
I have to agree with Eddie on this one. I'd like to do the horomone thing, but honestly, what Im most afraid of the body acne, loss of hair, facial hair, (and worse off) screwing up my voice to the point of no return.
Im guessing if I did do it, my voice wouldn't drop waaaay down like a lot of american guys do, seeing how my old man doesn't have a super deep voice himself. But I could be wrong.

I haven't really thought about the pros and cons of breast reduction surgery, and all I know is: I want to have it done. I go swimming with shirts on and let me say this... I hate it. Feels like something is weighing me down and causing a lot of drag (which it is). That's not the only reason I want the surgery, just one of them. Another would be to get rid of wearing uncomfortable bras. Gawd... I just loathe bras. Did since I first had to wear them. (I was very upset when my boobs started coming in the first time. Well, more horrified than upset. lol.)

And kids? Well... I can't handle kids. Maybe if they're 8 years old, but any younger than that, I just can't handle them. They drive me insane. I mean, I like little kids, just that I wouldn't want to be around one (or more) for 24/7.
Plus, I think there's a surgery that, while it prevents you from having children, also prevents you from going through your period, or something. Not sure. All I know is that my aunt had something like that done after her first 2 kids and hasn't had a bloody mess since. (Pun intended.)
Also... Child bearing looks extremely painful. Call me a weeny if you will, but pain is not something that I like (or most people, I would hope, for that matter).
And who wants stretch marks and excess skin around their waist? Not me...

04-19-2005, 01:23 AM
Yeah, so...
As for the voice thing... My voice would go pretty low. I'm not worried about that but I really want to keep my high range. My father has a pretty deep voice. Not super- deep but he can't hit high notes. If I wasn't a singer I wouldn't care.
The other effects... Well, I don't think I'd end up with a ton of body hair (father's not terribly furry either lol) or baldness, necessarily (of course, I have alopecia and my hair doesn't need any more help falling out-- plus MPB is carried on the mother's side and my mum was adopted so I know nothing about her family history).
Of course, the acne is temporary but I have a problem with that (on my face) anyway.
Chest surgery is more than just a mastectomy... They have to reshape the muscles, reposition and occasionally reshape the nipples, to make it look like a male chest.
That, and, with the scars (unless you have really small boobs, where they can just do a "keyhole" surgery), it's pretty noticeable and a lot of people would know what you've done if you went around without a shirt on. I was horrified about boobs too. My mum always had to check to make sure I was wearing a bra when I left for school cos I'd try to sneak off without one.
I've always loved kids and have a lot of patience for them, so I'd be fine with them. But you're right about the pain, stretch marks, etc. I wouldn't be opposed to adopting, but it'd be nice to know that I helped to make a new person, ya know? So I don't know. But anyway I may have endometryosis, which makes it really hard to have kids so I may not be able to have them anyway. It all depends on what happens in the next several years, I suppose.
The surgery you're talking about is a hysterectomy, where they go in and remove all your internal reproductive organs (uterus, ovaries, etc.) There is also a partial hysterectomy, where they only remove some of them.
But getting a hysterectomy when you don't need one, especially at such a young age, can have serious health reprocussions-- most commonly cancer.
So think carefully about that. Also, chest surgery increases your risk of breast cancer (which is odd because some women who have a high risk of breast cancer have pre-emptive mastectomies).
Yeah, just make sure you thoroughly research everything before you decide to do it. Ask people who've had it done, read about it online, and of course, ask the opinions of doctors and surgeons (a second, third, and fourth opinion is a good idea).

04-20-2005, 10:05 PM
Yeah, those big medical terms. I recognize them, but I've always had a hard time remembering what they're called. Took me months just to remember the word 'Liposuction'. How sad is that? ^^;

But yes, I know that they have to reconstruct your chest and reshape and move your nipple. I've read up on it quite a bit a while back. And I never said I was in a hurry to get a hysterectomy. ^^; I was going to wait a while before actually seriously consider it. It's on my list of things to do, but Im not in a hurry to think about it and jump in the wagon, so to say. I've heard of the complications, but like I said, I'd rather not think about it for years to come.
But, it's all very interesting.

Also, I've heard about the scars. Im not really worried about it. Scars fade after several years anyways. They wont go completely away, but I know they fade. (I have plenty of them from being reckless. -_-; ) Plus, they have certain creams out there that help the scar be less noticeable. Oh well, it's not something I can do right now anyways, so I'll think about it thorougly later when I get there. Gotta take baby steps first. (Job... arg... 1st step.)

Katie Ashe
04-21-2005, 10:26 AM
Scars shouldn't be a problem, A new product called colortration is probly the best product on the market. check it out...


04-21-2005, 12:11 PM
All I can say is that it's taken me decades to get to where I totally accept myself,but I did get there. Someday it will happen for you. If you think you need help then get it.I did years ago and it's helped a great deal. Don't bother to purge because you'll just replace it all eventually.I know it's rough, we've all been there before. You have to learn to love yourself, that's the key. I was raised in a jewish home so I knoww all about the guilt thing. You'll get over that too. I'm at a point in my life where I really don't give a damn about what people think about me because i feel that I paid my dues and now it's my turn. I go out dressed, and if I'm made I don't recoil in horror about it I have myself a good laugh because I probably made thier day.So stop beating yourself up about it and enjoy life instead. I've lost a lot of years doing the guilt thing that I'll never get back. We,re all behind you sister.

Katie Ashe
04-29-2005, 09:59 AM
I was refering to anyone whom wants surgery or was wanting to cover up something else, refering to a coment by Abraxas, Chest Surgery comment. The product is good for hiding things that's all. Just tring to be helpfull...