Ever go to Drag clubs?

[wannabie]

I know a lot of you go to CD meetups but I was wondering if anyone ever frequent drag clubs.
I'm weening myself back little by little to get back into fully dressing and I find myself in more and more drag clubs. It's becomming my afterwork activity. after 5:00 its down to the drag bars to hang out with the girls. I would take some co-workers with me but seeing as I work with a 95% male environment I don't think they will be into it.

[Bethany_Anne_Fae]

When i first started out I did so that i would have like-minded people around me, but once the jealousy factor kicked in...lets just say I dont go at all anymore and have found other, more productive people to be around.

Note: This is MY experience only and not indicative of many places and people whom I am positive are much nicer people than the ones I met in Downtown Dallas (circa 2000).

Zara

[obsessedwithpantyhose]

i used to go till the place i was going to turnd into a meat market and the other girls stoped going

[Bethany_Anne_Fae]

i used to go till the place i was going to turnd into a meat market and the other girls stoped going


Ah yes! That too! I forgot about the "meat-market" aspect.

Zara

[tricia_uktv]

Why worry about it? Take your time and explore, its getting you out and about in a comfortable place after all. Enjoy it

[wannabie]

Ah yes! That too! I forgot about the "meat-market" aspect.

Zara

What is the meat market aspect?

[Eugenie]

I've never been to a Drag Club. I don't think that I would enjoy the experience.

Personally, I prefer to go to ordinary restaurants and bars when I am "en femme".

It must be fun to go to Drag Clubs if you like dansing and loud music :heehee:

But I may have a distorted view of the athmosphere in these clubs...

Let us know how it went after you will have had that experience...

:hugs:
Eugenie

[heidi99]

... the jealousy factor ...

Zara, what do you mean by jeolousy factor? Or the clothes? Just wondering, dear. ;)

[MJ]

the jealousy factor? for me is were some people were upset that i look better than them in there eyes .. i don't play those games ..

meat-market well .. ever had guys or other t-girls try to pick you up take you home and well ....i am sure you can figure it out ..

there are more productive people to be around. than that . just for the record i mean no disrespect to anyone but give me a decent restaurant or coffee shop anytime . and sisters who can appreciate good food good whine and a good coffee , and a good chat

[Nicole Erin]

I've never been to a Drag Club. I don't think that I would enjoy the experience.

Personally, I prefer to go to ordinary restaurants and bars when I am "en femme". A moins c'est un pub pour les motards. Personne ne doit y aller!

It must be fun to go to Drag Clubs if you like dansing and loud music :heehee:Ehh oui si on pense que c'est amusant pour écouter la musique TROP TROP haute! pas moi... Et aussi, fumes-tu? Il y a assez de fumée des cigarettes, alors, on n'a pas besoin de fumer là.

But I may have a distorted view of the athmosphere in these clubs...Non madame, tu as raison.

Let us know how it went after you will have had that experience...

:hugs:
Eugenie

other -
I have been to drag shows yes and it is cool. They bust their butts to entertain the people and I appreciate that. However, I am not REAL fond of the crowded loud clubs. And sometimes our creepy "admirers" like to follow us around.

[Stargirl]

I don't like rowdy clubs, but I have been to small lounges with Drag queens and Kings entertaining for a benefit to raise money. I stayed just long enough to have fun, and get in a couple of dances. When the smoke gets too thick, and the patron's beer lands on the floor, it's time for my beauty sleep. I do enjoy the variety of people present. Most are just out to socialize, and unwind. I don't like a club that is packed like sardines. I need room to spin, and look at the others. I am not quite the Lawrence Welk type. Now, wouldn't he have looked nice in a sequined gown, and wig ? Champagne bubbles flying past his head ? Well, mybe in another lifetime.

[trannie T]

Last Halloween I had a drag queen, Anna, do my makeup. I looked great and I had a wonderful time with the other queens. As I will never pass I might as well take things to the extreme.

[Carrie]

I've only been to a drag club once; the night I met my CD friend, My Girl. It is a gay bar with a restaurant in the back. We had dinner there and then saw the drag queens perform. All of the girls there were nice. It didn't get rowdy at all. It was the first time I had ever been to a gay bar or a drag show.

It was exciting for me! Besides me, there was only one other GG there. It was great - no one hit on me at all (except the lovely girl that I was with). :happy:

Did I mention that My Girl is a Drag Queen? I saw her perform that night. She was fantastic!!!

~C

[Bethany_Anne_Fae]

Zara, what do you mean by jeolousy factor? Or the clothes? Just wondering, dear. ;)

Essentially it boils down to the pretty-passing factor. I frequented a couple of clubs when I first got to dallas and a few of the 'girls" didn't like the fact that I blended so well. Plain and simply put they were jealous. Period.

Enough so that one of them stuck gum in my hair.

The meat market to me, is the type of men that go to these clubs that 'assume" they can get away with more when it comes to us cds than they would ever dare on a biological woman.

I want to go to watch the talent, maybe make some friends, mingle and have fun. Not to asked out, be pawed by creeps that couldnt get a date if they paid for it.

As for the clothes.... no idea what you are talking about.

Zara

[Bethany_Anne_Fae]

the jealousy factor? for me is were some people were upset that i look better than them in there eyes .. i don't play those games ..

meat-market well .. ever had guys or other t-girls try to pick you up take you home and well ....i am sure you can figure it out ..

there are more productive people to be around. than that . just for the record i mean no disrespect to anyone but give me a decent restaurant or coffee shop anytime . and sisters who can appreciate good food good whine and a good coffee , and a good chat

You got it!

*hugs*
Zara

[Samantha B L]

There aren't any drag bars near any of the places I've lived and I've moved almost 20 times in my life. In a couple of the towns there were gay bars but the very idea of a drag bar sounds like a whole lot of fun. But some of you say it isn't all it's cracked up to be(?) I like loud music,actually. A couple of hours of that is fine but not for like 5 hours,though. I know all about those "admirers" of m to f CD'rs. I don't like to stereotype but there was this guy I had been freinds with for years who was sort of a hard hat and checked shirt type with a pickup truck. I told him on the phone one day that I CD'd and I thought he'd really give me the business. On the contrary, he was pleased with his new"find". He expected me to do certain things. Really,I was forced to run him off. I'd have never told him in the first place but he had a tendency to brag about big money deals he'd been involved in and I thought I'd come out and hit him up to buy me some clothes. Actually,I'm getting carried away and the thread is about drag clubs. I think they sound like a real blast but the jealousie thing would be annoying and discouraging.

[obsessedwithpantyhose]

cant smoke in bars anymore......

i found a nice neighborhood tavern to go to,, and they did try the drag show but it got to cost effective,,maybe they will try again this year and not do it every week....those girls sure do work their butts off,,:D

[Niya W]

Been to drag shows , done drag. I would say out here its more female impersonators, except some of the performers can not pass for a guy any more , an some are TS.

[Stormgirl]

Can't say that I have, I tend to avoid them.

[Sedona]

Every now and then, with my girlfriend, or others. Always in drab, and we have a good time just getting a few drinks and enjoying the show.

[jennifer41356]

I went once or twice years ago, I find them a bit boring actually, some drag queens can be too over the top for me..:2c:

[JaytoJillian]

Hmmmm, the weekend drag shows are the main attraction at the club I frequent. But it has a good mix of people from all walks. Yeah, the "str8" guys hit on me and the lesbians are really friendly. What's not to love about the attention as long as you go home alone when the party's over?

[girlyj]

No drag clubs for me. Always sounds like fun, tho.

[heidi99]

Enough so that one of them stuck gum in my hair.

The meat market to me, is the type of men that go to these clubs that 'assume" they can get away with more when it comes to us cds than they would ever dare on a biological woman.

My name is Heidi99, but my middle name (I guess) is naive. OMG, I had no idea such things go on. I had been mulling over my next big outing. Kind of makes me think that going there with someone you know (in itself, a challenge) - safety in numbers.

I'm so sorry that this kind of thing happens! :(

[cindybarnes]

I have been to several clubs with "drag" shows and always enjoyed myself. My wife has gone with a couple times and had fun also. I guess it may depend on who you go with and the club itself.
We would usually get a group together for dinner at a TG friendly resturant then hit a few clubs . Some had better shows than others.
I have not been hit on while out but did have a GG ask about a hundred questions about being a cd "she may have been a little drunk :) "
I dont like the smoke tho and loud music makes it hard to chat so its nice to find a place to just relax with a drink and chat with friends too.
Cindy

[Bethany_Anne_Fae]

My name is Heidi99, but my middle name (I guess) is naive. OMG, I had no idea such things go on. I had been mulling over my next big outing. Kind of makes me think that going there with someone you know (in itself, a challenge) - safety in numbers.

I'm so sorry that this kind of thing happens! :(

Heidi,

Please don't take MY couple of bad experiences as good advice. I was merely pointing out what had happened to me. I know for a fact that this is NOT the norm in most drag clubs. I just happened to pick the two nights where things decided to happen. One performer who was upset that i took first place in the singing competition as Stevie Nicks tossed gum in my hair and been jealous of me from previous visits. Another was a guy who insisted on reaching up my skirt inappropriately after being told to not touch me rather insistently. He didn't listen and after the third time I ended up breaking two of his fingers. His buddy kept trying to kiss me on top of that. It was downright awful.

When I lived in New Orleans, I went to the drag clubs a lot without a single problem, and I migrated from there to Biloxi back and forth for three years. No problems from either set of clubs.
The girls were fantastic performers, the people nice and I really had fun.

Just wanted to clarify that before people think that ALL clubs are bad.

Get out there, give em a try and if it doesn't suit your fancy... try a different club.

You'll have fun!

*hugs*

Zara

[Raquel June]

I frequent a small-ish drag club in Dayton.

http://www.celebritydayton.com/

It's a pretty friendly place. All of the regulars are very nice people. It's not a very big place -- one level, one bar, a small stage, and maybe 20 tables and 3 couches, but they still get a really good show. They have a sort of amateur-ish show on Thursdays, and a regular show on Saturdays. They even have an open-mic drag show on Wednesday that's sort of like karaoke where they'll give anyone a wig and let them sing. On show nights, they have four sets of shows starting at 11pm and ending around 1:30am. I don't dance much, but kinda like loud music. I usually end up hanging out till they close at 2:30, and then sometimes I'll go party or go to Steak n' Shake with some of the people afterwards.

People there are really nice to me. Saturday there were about 15 queens and 3 kings performing, but I was the only CD who showed up (that's not usually the case). Two of the really nice queens would hang out with me between sets, and most of the people there I was comfortable just talking to.

There are certainly less friendly clubs, but I know there's at least one other good one in the area. The only problem is that I've gone there in guy mode a few times, and now a lot of the gay folks seem to think it's a real shame that I dress up like a girl. :)



Hmmmm, the weekend drag shows are the main attraction at the club I frequent. But it has a good mix of people from all walks. Yeah, the "str8" guys hit on me and the lesbians are really friendly. What's not to love about the attention as long as you go home alone when the party's over?

Exactly!


I guess maybe I'm more comfortable because I know I could beat the crap out of anyone there, except maybe a friend of mine who's a 6'4" 300 lb. CD, but I'm not so worried about her.

[Renee_B]

Totally been, totally love them! We used to have this great one in DC called Zeigfields and there's still two good ones to go to out here. I haven't done drag at any of them, but they're great fun to dance and put all cares aside!

[shauna 9]

No drag clubs for me.

[yms]

Essentially it boils down to the pretty-passing factor. I frequented a couple of clubs when I first got to dallas and a few of the 'girls" didn't like the fact that I blended so well. Plain and simply put they were jealous. Period.

Enough so that one of them stuck gum in my hair.

The meat market to me, is the type of men that go to these clubs that 'assume" they can get away with more when it comes to us cds than they would ever dare on a biological woman.

I want to go to watch the talent, maybe make some friends, mingle and have fun. Not to asked out, be pawed by creeps that couldnt get a date if they paid for it.

As for the clothes.... no idea what you are talking about.

Zara


Ah yes. The Jealously Factor. I like it. I had the same problem: drama-queen crossdressers who thought that expressing their feminine side meant acting like eighth-grade adolescent girls. That's why I decided to find better ways to spend my time.

[KimberlyS]

I started my out and about CDing by jumping in with both feet in to the general public. I have been to some TG Friendly Clubs most to meet or go with other CDers that would not go out in public. But I am very comfortable being out in the general public, even though I do not pass. I just blend well. And besides being out in public is mostly self acceptance and attitude.

[LA CINDY LOVE]

Most of the clubs I go to have A drag show but thy are not drag clubs, at these club I may be the only CD in the whole club and the people are very nice to me and love to dance, talk to me an by me a drink I never had a bad time at these clubs and most of the people are gay, bi, lesbian and straight.

In Los Angeles we do have some TG clubs were you will find lots of Cd's and ts in the clubs along with a few men and lesbian, and yes I have been to a lesbian club and they just love us........they are so sweet to us.


LA CINDY LOVE

[JoAnnDallas]

Many years ago, I used to go to this one club that would have drag shows. It was the first time I every saw a CDer in public. I remember wishing I could be so brave. Now I am. LOL

[chrissietoo]

I've never been, but then I don't go to any other clubs, either....

...I remember very clearly my parents taking friends to a famous drag club, excuse me, "female impersonators" and not understanding what all the fuss and humor was about. I felt a little jealous, I think...:drink:

[renee k]

In Detroit, GIGI's is the place too be. TGirls and dancing upstairs and a drag show downstairs.

Renee

[TxKimberly]

I've been to lots of them. As I've said on previous posts, I'm not real big on most drag shows except the comedy ones. I love to see a good comedy show but really don't care for lip syncing. But in my travels around the US, I try to meet other tgirls and they will often want to check these places out.
Jacques in Boston has improved since my first time there. I was there a few months ago and they had a great comedy act. It also didn't hurt that there were 4 bachelorett parties going on so the place was full of gorgous and rowdy GG's.
Talbot Street in Indy has an impressive show too.

[Bobby Anne]

Yes, we are not drag queens and have nothing in common with them, however they seem to be the port for our ship in the storm. After years of frequenting D bars I finally said enough. My favorite way to party was a a private home of someone who is a CDer and enjoys our company.

Even Gays do not understand us nor wish to socialize with us. They are better at tolerating us than our own str8 world.

So its home alone on a quiet night that I dress in the comfort and security of my own castle.

[chrissietoo]

This is kind o on the subject...I just happened across this interview with kd lang on Dame Edna's show in Australia.
kd is one of my favorite people, a very sweet, genuine person, and Dame Edna is a genius at comedy. It's a great clip! Hope you all enjoy it. :hugs:

http://youtube.com/watch?v=BxyuVs0SK9s&feature=related

chrissie

ps anyone from Canada (kd's homeland) will get a special kick out of this.

[Cai]

There's a great gay/TG club right near where I go to school. All of my friends (mostly straight GG's) hang out there, because it's where they feel safe. I was there last week, and I had a blast! They had a great drag show, and the crowd seemed pretty evenly split straight/gay/crossdressed (surprising numbers of FtMs, which pleased me). One of my friends did get followed around by one creepy guy, but we managed to shake him off.

The only thing that I'm sure would turn some of you off was that it was definitely a younger crowd. Nearly everyone there was in their early 20's.

[obsessedwithpantyhose]

interesting point about the "gays" not liking cds,,,i find that to be totaly wrong at the bar i go to,,,they luv us cds and tgs there :D,,even the lesbians get along with us all :D and the drunker they get........................

[Jilmac]

I don't think it's the same thing you are referring to but in 1965 while I was in the navy, I attended a drag show at a club in NYC with a bunch of other sailors from my ship. Because of my situation (being with other sailors) I didn't want to let on how much I was enjoying the show and how I envied those performers in all their feminine finery, glitz and glitter. Between performances there would be a lot of table talk about the performers, and most of it was derogatory.

One particular sailor (a redneck from a southern state) mentioned that if he had a brother or relative who dressed like that and got up on stage in public to show off as a girl, he would " just as soon shoot him and put him out of our misery". I had all I could do to keep my mouth shut and keep my cool. But I did tell the redneck that the performer probably made more in wages and tips in one year than he would ever see in his entire navy career. That managed to shut him up for a while and I was able to enjoy the rest of the show.

I know this is probably unrelated to your original thread but it's the only time i've been to a "drag club". Luv and:hugs: Jill

[Raquel June]

Most of the clubs I go to have A drag show but thy are not drag clubs, at these club I may be the only CD in the whole club and the people are very nice to me and love to dance, talk to me an by me a drink I never had a bad time at these clubs and most of the people are gay, bi, lesbian and straight.

I know a couple places like that. When there are other CDs in the club, you always get a sort of "strength in numbers" feeling. When I was the only CD at a club a couple weeks ago and everybody was still nice to me, I just felt so happy and honored and impressed and wonderful.




Yes, we are not drag queens and have nothing in common with them, however they seem to be the port for our ship in the storm. After years of frequenting D bars I finally said enough. My favorite way to party was a a private home of someone who is a CDer and enjoys our company.

Even Gays do not understand us nor wish to socialize with us. They are better at tolerating us than our own str8 world.

"Gays" are a pretty large group, and that's quite a generalization. Clubs can go either way.

You don't speak for everybody when you say "we are not queens." Queens and CDs and TGs are not mutually exclusive groups. I know queens who are doing it for comedy and are very masculine guys. I know queens who are kinda effeminate gays but have no CD/TG aspirations. I know queens who are CDs, no questions about it. And I know TG queens who would love to be able to afford a total reassignment/transformation.




One particular sailor (a redneck from a southern state) mentioned that if he had a brother or relative who dressed like that and got up on stage in public to show off as a girl, he would " just as soon shoot him and put him out of our misery". I had all I could do to keep my mouth shut and keep my cool. But I did tell the redneck that the performer probably made more in wages and tips in one year than he would ever see in his entire navy career. That managed to shut him up for a while and I was able to enjoy the rest of the show.

I'm intrigued by your thought process. Do you mention "from a southern state" because being a jerk and speaking your mind is more typical of people from southern states? I don't think your redneck-slamming story of how you stood up for queens is quite as heartwarming as you think.

I'll bet there are some black guys from Harlem who also speak disparagingly about queens. I wonder how you would've recounted such a story.

I guess you're lucky all the southern belles on here are polite ladies.

[Samantha43]

I have been to one.......never again! I had to leave.....too many guys that wouldn't take NO for an answer. I was very uncomfortable.

[Dalece]

I go to a gay, lesbian friendly club in Ohio. The owner CDs and the bar attendents are either gay or lesbian. They have accepted my as a girl . When I'm there dressed i'm one of the girls. They have Drag Queen shows there but I'm no Drag Queen. I have been working with them to become a Hostess, Female Comic when the shows come around. I feel relaxed up there. Even been invited out to dinner.

[Samantha43]

Where in Ohio?

[ann stef]

What is the meat market aspect?

Picking up for one night stands, sex

[Bobby Anne]

interesting point about the "gays" not liking cds,,,i find that to be totaly wrong at the bar i go to,,,they luv us cds and tgs there :D,,even the lesbians get along with us all :D and the drunker they get........................

Yes, OBSESSEDWITHPANTYHOSE, my point exactly, they need to be drunk in order to tolerate us. Don't think for a moment that we are loved. If we never showed up at their bar they would be just as happy.

Giving that world credit though, they do know the true understanding of the word tolerant.


In private we are a subject of ridicule whether in a Gay , Lesbian or Str8 conversation group.
I have personally made that observation over my 50 years of socializing with the other life.

If you look closely you will notice even crossdressers need to be inebriated to stand themselves. Alcohol is so much part of our life and once was considered the cause of transvestism. So many of us have trouble accepting who we are because we really don't know.

[Raquel June]

Yes, OBSESSEDWITHPANTYHOSE, my point exactly, they need to be drunk in order to tolerate us. Don't think for a moment that we are loved. If we never showed up at their bar they would be just as happy.

...

In private we are a subject of ridicule whether in a Gay , Lesbian or Str8 conversation group.

...

If you look closely you will notice even crossdressers need to be inebriated to stand themselves.


Your statements are gross overgeneralizations.

If you're one of those CDs who doesn't know how to do your makeup and puts on a huge outdated dress and goes to a gay bar and sits in the corner and doesn't talk to anybody, then yeah, you may be the subject of ridicule (usually not to your face), and they may be just as happy if you didn't show up.

There are different types of clubs. There are those that tend more towards the stereotypes you describe, and those are the ones that CDs avoid. There are also plenty places with genuinely nice people. If you go out as a CD to a drag club, you will likely encounter some people who don't like you (but will probably be tolerant). You will likely encounter some perverts. But that doesn't mean that there aren't nice people out there. There are some queens who are very standoffish/catty. They don't like the CDs, but they really don't like many of the other queens, either, and they think they're "all that" when dealing with most other people. But there are also great people who are great to just have a conversation with at these clubs, and it makes me very happy to be able to act so normal and be myself when I'm wearing a skirt.

When I go to a drag club, whether it's in guy mode or girl mode, people are very friendly. The queens talk to me between sets. If I look bored they ask me if I wanna come in the dressing room and hang out. Lesbians are nice to me. GGs are nice to me. Gay guys are usually very nice to me. It's the straight guys that don't know how to deal with a CD, but if they're already in a drag club they're usually pretty cool with it.

You sound very self-loathing. You should become more comfortable in your own skin before you start speculating on what other people really feel inside about you. Maybe you've just had bad experiences and I've had good ones...

[Bobby Anne]

Your statements are gross overgeneralizations.

If you're one of those CDs who doesn't know how to do your makeup and puts on a huge outdated dress and goes to a gay bar and sits in the corner and doesn't talk to anybody, then yeah, you may be the subject of ridicule (usually not to your face), and they may be just as happy if you didn't show up.

There are different types of clubs. There are those that tend more towards the stereotypes you describe, and those are the ones that CDs avoid. There are also plenty places with genuinely nice people. If you go out as a CD to a drag club, you will likely encounter some people who don't like you (but will probably be tolerant). You will likely encounter some perverts. But that doesn't mean that there aren't nice people out there. There are some queens who are very standoffish/catty. They don't like the CDs, but they really don't like many of the other queens, either, and they think they're "all that" when dealing with most other people. But there are also great people who are great to just have a conversation with at these clubs, and it makes me very happy to be able to act so normal and be myself when I'm wearing a skirt.

When I go to a drag club, whether it's in guy mode or girl mode, people are very friendly. The queens talk to me between sets. If I look bored they ask me if I wanna come in the dressing room and hang out. Lesbians are nice to me. GGs are nice to me. Gay guys are usually very nice to me. It's the straight guys that don't know how to deal with a CD, but if they're already in a drag club they're usually pretty cool with it.

You sound very self-loathing. You should become more comfortable in your own skin before you start speculating on what other people really feel inside about you. Maybe you've just had bad experiences and I've had good ones...

Girlie....... I have more experience in clubs En Femme that you will ever have. I have done professional DRAG, passed in the general public, so don't think you can presume generalize me and who I am.

I am giving you my opinion based on years of going out dresses.

You can remain in DENIAL if you like.
Everyone is nice to you in queer bar.

[chrissietoo]

I'm reluctant to step into this....:D

I've never found generalizations very helpful, especially when it comes to human experience. I think you could go to any ordinary club or bar, and you would find some people sitting lonely in a corner, some having a good time, and everything in between.

Gay guys are supposed to not like CD's, but a couple of gay guys are my best and most supportive friends. Lesbians, too...and I have friends who don't merely tolerate me, they are real friends.

We each have our own experiences, and attract different people into our lives. I think it's wise to have some reserve, perhaps to hold in mind that some, or even many, people might not like us. And at the same time, know that it isn't necessarily true, or real, or lasting. People change.

:hugs: chrissie

[Raquel June]

Girlie....... I have more experience in clubs En Femme that you will ever have. I have done professional DRAG, passed in the general public, so don't think you can presume generalize me and who I am.

I am giving you my opinion based on years of going out dresses.

You can remain in DENIAL if you like.
Everyone is nice to you in queer bar.

Let me get this straight.

You think that the people in drag clubs don't like you and need to be drunk to tolerate you. You have had bad experiences in these clubs, yet for some reason you continued to go so often that you are confident in saying that you have more experience in said clubs than I will ever have.

If the people there are so terrible, why on earth did you go back a second, third, forth, two-hundred thirty-ninth time?

How could a single thing you say possibly be correct?

And what's this new stuff you're bringing up? Is this some kind of competition? What's it matter how much you've gone out or how passable you are? If you're so passable, how did they even know you were a CD?

Yeah. That's right. I'm in denial. Everybody secretly hates me yet acts very nice to me to patronize me. That sucks! Buying me drinks... Asking for my number... Calling me in the middle of the week... Picking me up on the way out to the club... Inviting me out after the club closes... Letting me crash at their place... IM'ing me every night...

How long do these evil drag clubbers usually let this game of theirs go till they spring their trap? Apparently it's more than 6 months. That's really gonna ruin my day when they tell me their true feelings. Maybe I'll turn the tables on them. Next time I go out I'll say, "Hey everybody! I actually hate gay people! Thanks for the drinks, suckaz!"

Is that what happened to you? You were a drag performer for 15 years then in the 16th year they all came up to you and said, "Haha! We actually hate you because you're a CD! We make fun of you when you're not here! Now get out!"

:tongueout

[Bobby Anne]

Let me get this straight.

You think that the people in drag clubs don't like you and need to be drunk to tolerate you. You have had bad experiences in these clubs, yet for some reason you continued to go so often that you are confident in saying that you have more experience in said clubs than I will ever have.

If the people there are so terrible, why on earth did you go back a second, third, forth, two-hundred thirty-ninth time?

How could a single thing you say possibly be correct?

And what's this new stuff you're bringing up? Is this some kind of competition? What's it matter how much you've gone out or how passable you are? If you're so passable, how did they even know you were a CD?

Yeah. That's right. I'm in denial. Everybody secretly hates me yet acts very nice to me to patronize me. That sucks! Buying me drinks... Asking for my number... Calling me in the middle of the week... Picking me up on the way out to the club... Inviting me out after the club closes... Letting me crash at their place... IM'ing me every night...

How long do these evil drag clubbers usually let this game of theirs go till they spring their trap? Apparently it's more than 6 months. That's really gonna ruin my day when they tell me their true feelings. Maybe I'll turn the tables on them. Next time I go out I'll say, "Hey everybody! I actually hate gay people! Thanks for the drinks, suckaz!"

Is that what happened to you? You were a drag performer for 15 years then in the 16th year they all came up to you and said, "Haha! We actually hate you because you're a CD! We make fun of you when you're not here! Now get out!"

:tongueout

Quit looking in a mirror!
You don't have a clue about very much. Live in NEVERLAND IF YOU CHOOSE.

[chrissietoo]

:Angry3: Girls, girls! If you don't stop fighting, Mom's going to ground you both and take away your lipstick! :Angry3:

Bobby's giving some motherly advice: don't believe everything someone tells you in a bar...they're only interested in one thing! Bobby's felt the pain of disappointment, and she doesn't want you to be hurt, Racquel....

Racquel feels the pain, too, Bobby. She just doesn't want to hear about it, not that way, or right now, at least.

:love: so girls, we all want to be happy, and all want to help each other, and all want to soothe our pains. be nice. :hugs:

chrissie

[Cara Allen]

In Detroit, GIGI's is the place too be. TGirls and dancing upstairs and a drag show downstairs.

Renee

Yes, for SURE! I love GiGi's! Glad someone brought it up! It's very TG friendly, and they even guard the parking lot, and will escort you to your car if you need them to.

[Raquel June]

:Angry3: Girls, girls! If you don't stop fighting, Mom's going to ground you both and take away your lipstick! :Angry3:

Bobby's giving some motherly advice: don't believe everything someone tells you in a bar...they're only interested in one thing! Bobby's felt the pain of disappointment, and she doesn't want you to be hurt, Racquel....

Mom can have my lipstick when she pries it from my cold dead acrylic nails!

I'm usually the cynical one, and you need to be prepared to have your feelings hurt before you expose a personal side of yourself... but Bobby's comments are ridiculous. I would actually agree with most of what she was saying if it weren't for the absurd prejudice she's showing.

Do you think all gays hate CDs? Do you think all drag clubs are full of people who would care less if CDs never showed up? Do you think all these people secretly make fun of CDs?

"Don't think for a moment that we are loved" is such a terrible thing to say.

I could maybe believe that it was just overly-pessimistic motherly advice to keep others from getting their feelings hurt, but Bobby seems to have other extremely negative posts, too.

[Bethany_Anne_Fae]

If you look closely you will notice even crossdressers need to be inebriated to stand themselves. Alcohol is so much part of our life and once was considered the cause of transvestism. So many of us have trouble accepting who we are because we really don't know.


I've looked closely at many people in this realm, including myself and have NEVER come to a conclusion as absurd as this.

Where have you been going that you have experienced such things?

Oh, and I accept myself and others in my circle of friends without hesitation, or the need for alcohol.

Maybe you need to find a better circle in which to hang out in order to really enjoy yourself and perhaps learn about this life we travel in.

My two cents

Zarabeth

[TxKimberly]

I've looked closely at many people in this realm, including myself and have NEVER come to a conclusion as absurd as this.

Where have you been going that you have experienced such things?

Oh, and I accept myself and others in my circle of friends without hesitation, or the need for alcohol.

Maybe you need to find a better circle in which to hang out in order to really enjoy yourself and perhaps learn about this life we travel in.

My two cents

Zarabeth


If you look closely you will notice even crossdressers need to be inebriated to stand themselves. Alcohol is so much part of our life and once was considered the cause of transvestism. So many of us have trouble accepting who we are because we really don't know.


Much as I hate to say it, I'm gonna have to agree with Bobby Anne to a certain extent about this. As a lot of you know from my posts, I travel all over the country for my job and have met a LOT of Tgirls. Most of the ladies I have met in person were just that - ladies. They did not / do not drink to excess. Of course most of the ladies I have met in person have moved well beyond the "I am ashamed of being CD" phase and reasonably pleased with who and what they are or they probably would not have met with me.

The bad news though, is that I have also gone to a fair number of bars as well and would have to agree with Bobby that very few of the Tgirls I have seen there drink in moderation. What their reasons are for this I can't speak to. Is it depression, self loathing, shame - I dunno, but a lot of us DO appear to drink more than we should.

[Raquel June]

The bad news though, is that I have also gone to a fair number of bars as well and would have to agree with Bobby that very few of the Tgirls I have seen there drink in moderation. What their reasons are for this I can't speak to. Is it depression, self loathing, shame - I dunno, but a lot of us DO appear to drink more than we should.

That's true, but I don't find it to be very far out of line with the bar scene in general. I mean, of the CDs I know who go to bars every weekend, it could be said of half of them that they drink too much -- one or two that they're an alcoholic, but certainly there are plenty non-CD alcoholics in bars, too.

I mean, I do see that CDs tend to drink a little more, but I also know CDs who hang out at bars and don't drink at all, and I don't think it's enough of a trend to be considered a rule that "crossdressers need to be inebriated to stand themselves."

[Kate Simmons]

Everything is what you make of it really but it's best to have no expectations although others may still have expectations of me sometimes. I am very unpretentious and don't take myself that seriously and people respect that. Although I made my "debut" at the club some 4 years ago as my femme self, I've since grown as a person and am now able to do things as my guy self that would have been unthinkable back then. By this I mean talking to and meeting people, making friends, dancing and having fun. Do they talk about me? Probably but I've never gotten any negative feedback one way or the other and the way some of these folks gossip, I'm sure I would have heard something by now.:heehee: Besides, who doesn't talk when they are drinking? In any case, I've come to be accepted by my LGBT friends as both Sal and Rich.

My point is that I don't sit in the corner and cringe and sulk, I take the iniative to meet and talk to people and make friends. We talk here about CD life and sometimes bemoan and waffle about how everyone downs the poor crossdresser, even gay people. Most do very little about that though. I actually get to know gay guys, lesbians, Bi Folks, B & D folks, "Little girls", the list goes on. By doing that, CDing gets de-mystified a little and they come to realize that there is a person in that dress just as real as they are, and just as friendly. You have to look beyond the outside package to find the real people and that is the reality.:happy:

[Bobby Anne]

I've looked closely at many people in this realm, including myself and have NEVER come to a conclusion as absurd as this.

Where have you been going that you have experienced such things?

Oh, and I accept myself and others in my circle of friends without hesitation, or the need for alcohol.

Maybe you need to find a better circle in which to hang out in order to really enjoy yourself and perhaps learn about this life we travel in.

My two cents

Zarabeth

I have been everywhere hear on the East coast over the last 50 years. Top that Tweeny.

Same here I don't need the alcohol, that was Racquel's statement

Maybe you better mind your own business. I do enjoy myself.

It's all matter of facing the truth, which most cross dressers seldom ever do.

Oh you need a better wiggy!

[Bobby Anne]

Everything is what you make of it really but it's best to have no expectations although others may still have expectations of me sometimes. I am very unpretentious and don't take myself that seriously and people respect that. Although I made my "debut" at the club some 4 years ago as my femme self, I've since grown as a person and am now able to do things as my guy self that would have been unthinkable back then. By this I mean talking to and meeting people, making friends, dancing and having fun. Do they talk about me? Probably but I've never gotten any negative feedback one way or the other and the way some of these folks gossip, I'm sure I would have heard something by now.:heehee: Besides, who doesn't talk when they are drinking? In any case, I've come to be accepted by my LGBT friends as both Sal and Rich.

My point is that I don't sit in the corner and cringe and sulk, I take the iniative to meet and talk to people and make friends. We talk here about CD life and sometimes bemoan and waffle about how everyone downs the poor crossdresser, even gay people. Most do very little about that though. I actually get to know gay guys, lesbians, Bi Folks, B & D folks, "Little girls", the list goes on. By doing that, CDing gets de-mystified a little and they come to realize that there is a person in that dress just as real as they are, and just as friendly. You have to look beyond the outside package to find the real people and that is the reality.:happy:

Salandra, yes they do talk about you as they do me.
It's not necessarily mean though, but it can be.
I am sure You have heard the stories about Erin.
I was always in the mix of things and that how it all gets started. You soon get to believe what they say. I hold no grudges, it's just how it is.

[Kate Simmons]

Understood Bobby Anne, no hard feelings from me either after I flatten 'em. I may be easy going but not that easy.:heehee:

[Bobby Anne]

Twice in the last year I had experiences where I was in a bar, both Str8 and Gay. I was not En Femme and no one knew me. Just another fag hangin around so to speak. The bar was mixed with men and women, Gay Str8 and what have you. In comes a gorgeous looking girl who later out turned out to be one of us. I was blown away. Never in my life did I ever look that good. In fact at first I did not know that she was not a female. As I went about my business and it was my turn to sing at Karaoke, Standing by the Mic I noticed her more closely. Something was very familiar? Naaah I said can't be. So I sang my song, and when the song was over she clapped, that's what gave her away to me at least. Then I really could not take my eyes off her, wondering who she was and did I know her, she looked familiar. Several walked over to h er and struck up a conversation. I was within earshot. She was pleasant, polite and articulate. A rather enjoyable young lady to meet I thought. I studied her closely, she was not young, somewhere in her pate 40's I'd say. No one was rude to her, then one by one I noticed other patron nodding to each other and tossing their eyes her way. One at a time smirks and smiles jotted across their faces.

She stayed about an hour , left a nice tip and quietly walked out. I was Okay with all this, after all I have done this a thousand times. Upon her departure the jibes and wisecracks about her and what she could do for the world at large began. I was horrified. No one had the courage to say it to her face. The bar tender picked up her generous tip and tossed it in the tip jar like it was tainted. Then he took the glass she drank from an threw it in the trash. He saw the look of astonishment on my face and turned to say, "Wouldn't want anyone to get aids from that".

My heart was broken for this CD, here she thought she either fooled the world or proved people were just as nice to anyone. Then at the end of the bar I heard two toughs make lewd comments and suggested they go roll her for sex. My heart was pounding for her now and only hoped she was far away and safe. I never saw her again nor did I ever go back to that bar. The people disgusted me. In fact Since that day I have never entered a bar, gay or Str8 while En Femme. Now while this did happen in a Str8 bar there were gay patrons present too who took verbal shots at her after she left too. I knew these folks from the area and no one else knew them to be Gay or Lesbian. Yes, this was one incident, however there have been others. When I am out I listen closely and intently, after a nice compliment I can hear insult in a low whisper. So not everyone loves or even likes us, I am not saying hates us, but it might as well be in my mind.

Prior to al this I had a successful career impersonating females in public, however now in my declining years I wonder ...was it really?

Sorry fore the long winded sermom. Please excuse any typos.

[Bethany_Anne_Fae]

I have been everywhere hear on the East coast over the last 50 years. Top that Tweeny.

Same here I don't need the alcohol, that was Racquel's statement

Maybe you better mind your own business. I do enjoy myself.

It's all matter of facing the truth, which most cross dressers seldom ever do.

Oh you need a better wiggy!


I see, so based on your VAST experiences that are obviously FAR superior to everyone else's you result to insults.

Perhaps you should come down off of that pedestal and take a long look in the mirror before saying some of the things you have.

[Sandra]

I suggest you get back to the topic in question which isn't throwing insults around. Your grown ups not children

[Bethany_Anne_Fae]

Prior to al this I had a successful career impersonating females in public, however now in my declining years I wonder ...was it really?
.

After reading the entire post, I would offer the opinion of ... yes. If you considered yourself succesful, don't let the more recent experiences dampen those things that made you happy.
All of us have people talking about us when we leave the room. You were lucky in that you could be the fly on the wall in the girl's absense. If she went home happy and not aware of what you saw/heard, then she is non the wiser.
I think if we could actually hear everything said about us we'd spend an awful lot of time being unhappy and not appreciating the good we experience.

Zara

[Fab Karen]

Drag shows & T-girl clubs are two different things ( at least here in the big city).

edit: reading the "bar scene is evil" nonsense, I agree with Racquel:
"I mean, I do see that CDs tend to drink a little more, but I also know CDs who hang out at bars and don't drink at all, and I don't think it's enough of a trend to be considered a rule that "crossdressers need to be inebriated to stand themselves." "
I am completely sober wherever I go, and I now of other girls who are also, out on the scene. I also know plenty who drink in moderation ( trust me, I have a Masters Degree in drinking). It shouldn't be shocking to see some percentage of people in a bar drinking heavily, regardless of being a CD.
Same as any group of people, there are gay people who hate us, there are gay people who love us, & there are some who are neutral.
And as Zarabeth said "Get out there, give em a try and if it doesn't suit your fancy... try a different club."

[TxKimberly]

That's true, but I don't find it to be very far out of line with the bar scene in general. I mean, of the CDs I know who go to bars every weekend, it could be said of half of them that they drink too much -- one or two that they're an alcoholic, but certainly there are plenty non-CD alcoholics in bars, too.

I mean, I do see that CDs tend to drink a little more, but I also know CDs who hang out at bars and don't drink at all, and I don't think it's enough of a trend to be considered a rule that "crossdressers need to be inebriated to stand themselves."

And THAT is an excellent point I would have to admit I'm ashamed hadn't occured to me. There's the irony - imagine meeting people that drink too much in a bar! lol

OK, so on another note - anyone else notice how this thread has turned hostile, with people attacking one another for their opinions? We all go to great lengths to emualte women, so how about we try here to emulate the some of the best traits they have to offer like patience, understanding, and empathy for others. Let's ACT like ladies instead of just trying to look like them. If your one of the folks that is proud to be male and just like pretty dresses, then let's try and act like gentlemen then. We can dissagree with out getting rude or hostile

[Raquel June]

If you look closely you will notice even crossdressers need to be inebriated to stand themselves. Alcohol is so much part of our life and once was considered the cause of transvestism. So many of us have trouble accepting who we are because we really don't know.


Oh, and I accept myself and others in my circle of friends without hesitation, or the need for alcohol.


Same here I don't need the alcohol, that was Racquel's statement

Excuse me? Care to explain that last statement?



The bar tender picked up her generous tip and tossed it in the tip jar like it was tainted. Then he took the glass she drank from an threw it in the trash. He saw the look of astonishment on my face and turned to say, "Wouldn't want anyone to get aids from that".

I find that extremely hard to believe. I've been to some pretty rough bars, and I have never in my life met a single bartender who would have done such a thing. Even if he hated CDs, he's simply not going to make that kind of AIDS-related comment at an establishment with any kind of a gay clientelle to speak of. You imply that maybe you and the gay people you knew there were all in the closet -- just going out to sing on karaoke night, and nobody suspected any of the clients were gay, but that's also highly unlikely. If your story is true, you (and the people you knew) should be ashamed of yourselves for not standing up for that girl. At the very least you should've made some kind of comment that the AIDS remark was nonsensical/unnecessary/mean/whatever.

Just look at the things you're saying. Nobody here shares your opnion.

Actually, that's not true. Lady Zarabeth and TxKimberly do share your opinions to some degree, but they certainly don't share your attitude. They're wonderful and everybody likes them. No matter what you say about how much experience you have, there are girls here who didn't buy a pair of panties till last week that are much more ladylike than you are. I suppose it's a "chick on the egg" problem, but I'm sure it's no coincidence that you have a bad attitude and you've had bad expereinces.

Maybe you actually have gone out more times than I ever will, but if you add up all the experiences of the people who disagree with you, you will see that you are in fact in the minority. If things were as bad as you say, you surely would've been stabbed to death on the way to your car at the end of the evening at some point during those 50 years.

Your experiences are certainly in the exception, and your attitude is bitter and depressing. You aren't helping anyone.

I think I'm a pretty understanding person, but you're a troll. I saw another thread where someone wanted advice on mascara and all you could say was that mascara made people look stupid and she shouldn't wear any.

[Wendy me]

know what??? enough of this ..... if this is the way this thread is going it's done .... i am closing this now... enough is enough.......