Seriously, how can people think we're not women while out dressed

[1950sclothes]

I have been out for the first time in the morning dressed. Usual skirt, blouse, blonde wig but flatties.

It was weird walking around in the sunlight. It felt odd because when I passed a man I thought he might say something like 'you queer.'

But since I dress down, albeit I am in a skirt, I can't see anyone guessing I am male. I cover my beard well. But what exactly is a man's face? There ar some ugly real women out there. I think it helps if a man is oveweight. He can get away with it more.

What you think? BTW, I was out for an hour dressed. Still felt weird, but I need to do it.

[Robertacd]

I

It was weird walking around in the sunlight. It felt odd because when I passed a man I thought he might say something like 'you queer.'


I think in general people just don't care. They may say to there self "That was a guy" and chuckle a bit inside, maybe tell their wife and coworkers what they saw. Unless they are real asshats:heehee: they would not say anything to your face.

[1950sclothes]

Yeah, but who's to say I am a guy anyway. :) No one will know for sure. :P

[Sheila]

There ar some ugly real women out there.

WTF .............. judge not, less u be judged yourself :Angry3::Angry3::Angry3: ...... we may be ugly but we are, what you can only dream of being :Angry3::Angry3:

[Joy Carter]

WTF .............. judge not, less u be judged yourself :Angry3::Angry3::Angry3: ...... we may be ugly but we are, what you can on dream of being :Angry3::Angry3:


OMG ! :eek: By all means bann the word ugly. :brolleyes:

[Drucilla]

Next time you are out and about, take a real hard look at ALL the women you see--not just the cute ones you wish you could look like. A lot of them are butt ugly !!! A lot of them are more masculine looking and more masculine dressed than most of the girls I see on this board. Some of them have more facial hair than some of us . On and on I could go. But I think the key as has been said many times before here is BLEND IN !! None of them are wearing 6 inch heels with sequined mini dresses at the mall in the morning !! None of their makeup looks like Tammy Fay on the way to a ball, etc. As much as it pains me to think it --we need to look average most of the time. If you look average---and average is not too high a standard these days ---you have a good chance of not beign noticed.

[ColleenW]

OMG ! :eek: By all means bann the word ugly. :brolleyes:

Right on Joy!! Ugly is a state of mind, not an appearance.

[JoAnnDallas]

That is what I try to do. I try to BLEND IN. That way most of the people I meet don't take much notice of me and the end result is I pass as a woman. I will admit that I have somethings going for me that does help.

1. I'm 5'8"
2. Size 12/14 dress
3. Size 9 heel
4. No adams apple.
5. Part native american, so don't have a lot of body hair.
6. I'm not that muscular.

I have a CD sister that would look like a man-in-a-dress, but does have breasts due to medication she takes. So she always wears low cut tops, blouses, dresses when she is out. She told me that both GG's and GM's will look at her face, then her boobs, and then away. She believes that showing cleavage puts enough doubt into the other person's mind that they believe she is a female and thus she passes.

[Megan (VA)]

. . .I think the key as has been said many times before here is BLEND IN !! None of them are wearing 6 inch heels with sequined mini dresses at the mall in the morning !! None of their makeup looks like Tammy Fay on the way to a ball, etc. As much as it pains me to think it --we need to look average most of the time. If you look average---and average is not too high a standard these days ---you have a good chance of not beign noticed.

YES! What you wear and how you wear it is what people will notice first, if they notice anything at all. Study GGs who are your approximate age, who live where you live, shop where you shop, etc. and see how they put themselves together for a given occasion.

Also, don't forget smell - men and GGs smell differently, with or without perfume. It doesn't hurt to use a little perfume to camoflauge those male phermones as best as possible.

As has been mentioned before, how you walk will influence how others see you, so I won't go any more into that.

In a store you might notice that many women browse and they touch things to see how they feel.

If you are in a resturant take a look at what women typically order as compared to men. You might see the difference in what and how they eat. (Most of my GFs actually chew their food and we rarely clean our plates.) How you are dressed can infleunce this.

Passing is about confidence and presentation, but I feel being mindful of the details can go a long way.

[Julie York]

WTF .............. judge not, less u be judged yourself :Angry3::Angry3::Angry3: ...... we may be ugly but we are, what you can only dream of being :Angry3::Angry3:


Hahahahahahahahaha.

It's the use of "WE" that cracked me up. Brilliant!


LOL:D


Anyway some of my best friends are ugly women.

[Shelly Preston]

There ar some ugly real women out there. I think it helps if a man is oveweight. He can get away with it more.


:OMG:

I think this might be one of the most insulting things I have read on here :Angry3:

I have to say who decides what is ugly ?

( I presume your in the supermodel category :brolleyes:)

Beauty is in the eye of the beholder

You also seem to be suggesting women are overweight or should be :eek:

I can see why some women think men are insensitive given your comments :2c:

[Sheila]

Hahahahahahahahaha.

It's the use of "WE" that cracked me up. Brilliant!


LOL:D

That is the Royal we Julie :D:D

[Tina Dixon]

LOL, this is wild thread, but when I go out some day it I will be with others like me, I'm 6'3" 250, women just aren't normally thats size so people will look, and I don't want a bunch of finger pointing and people saying "OMG thats a man".

[Julie York]

I know a few folk are getting all airated about someone daring to suggest that all women are not beautiful (golly gosh, surely not!), but let's not let all this PC stupidity infiltrate the forum.

There ARE some ugly women. FACT.
The more manly they look the less conventionally pretty they look. FACT.
Fat CDs look more facially feminine that bean pole guys. FACT.

Therefore: A CD can often pass as an unattractive overweight woman quite successfully.

Can't see any reason to get all PC about it. It's bloody obvious.

[jessielee]

well,
if its dark enough, or bundled up enough
or alone out in the woods,
like my first time.
no, seriously,
if we shape our perceptions first and our attitudes to match or exced our outer layers,
we are female.
so they see female.
(until we speak,
kididing.)
let us dance upon air
so that they perceive we float.

airhead,
jessie

[Sharon]

Next time you are out and about, take a real hard look at ALL the women you see--not just the cute ones you wish you could look like. A lot of them are butt ugly !!! A lot of them are more masculine looking and more masculine dressed than most of the girls I see on this board. Some of them have more facial hair than some of us . On and on I could go.......


Wow -- you have won the post of the day!!! Congratulations!!!! :cheers:

And, yeah, I am being very sarcastic. :Angry3:

[Wendy me]

ugly?????? might i remind you we are here for support as well as to give it .... saying you pass because of ugly women is not nice ......we all have feelings ... lets not forget that ..... all women are beautiful ......

[brendaisagirl]

Congratulations, you managed to insult all of the girls here in one post, born girls and choosing to be girls.
And as far as ugly goes, I think it is on the inside, you have to look hard or be in the negative to find it. I choose to see the beauty in others, both born girl and choosing to be. Please try and look harder and see the beauty.
Brenda

[Deborah Jane]

There ar some ugly real women out there.

Subtlety isn,t exactly your strong point is it:doh:
And at the end of the day, ugly or not, they are still women and will always have that something extra they we can,t quite achieve!!

[Tina Dixon]

LOL, there all pretty at closing time:beer:

[Deborah Jane]

LOL, there all pretty at closing time:beer:

True...62989

[secretlypsycho]

But since I dress down, albeit I am in a skirt, I can't see anyone guessing I am male. I cover my beard well. But what exactly is a man's face? There ar some ugly real women out there. I think it helps if a man is oveweight. He can get away with it more.

:lol: your comment and attitude are so shallow and judgemental that it's not even offensive, it's just laughable. As I've said before, it amazes me that as a group of people who seek acceptance from others, some crossdressers can be so incredibly judgemental of others :thumbsdn:

'ugly' is not generally a word I'd use to describe someone's appearance... but it certainly is one I would use to describe people's words, thoughts or judgements... :sad:

and given that I've never looked at all the photos on here, all I've got to go on is your perception of what you look like... and while there may well be some unattractive women out there, there are also some crossdressers who just *do* look like a man in a dress, and for all I know, you could well be one of them :idontknow:

[1950sclothes]

OK, I don't mean to offend. We all know that some women are less attractive than others. It's a fact. No need to insult me. There ARE ugly women. So what. And I am an ugly man.

But I can pass off as a woman. All I am saying is that once dressd, who knows for sure I am not a woman. I'm an ugly woman but I don't mind anyone knowing.:)

I think a lot of the people who were 'insulted' by my comment over-reacted. And when I said being fat which I am, helps, I MEAN I HAVE MAN BOOBS.

So I don't need to fill my bra. Simples as.

[shirley1]

like so many have said to me its all about confidence and how you carry yourself - i dont have the confidence yet it amazes me how some can just go out for the first time in daylite on their own and not have a panic attack ! saying that on the few occasions i have so far of a nite time once your out you do relax a bit - i think the worst part is just gettin out the door - but yeh i see plenty of manly looking women when i'm out i'm always looking to see if theyre a cder !

[Seville]

...If you look average---and average is not too high a standard these days ---you have a good chance of not being noticed.

Good one!!! But who wants to be average?

[Dalece]

Beauty is in the eye of the beholder, or beauty is only skin deep. There are times even a very pretty real gg may not look her best.

[PatriciaT]

There ar some ugly real women out there.
What you think? BTW,

Don’t kid yourself about passing all of the time. Even though some women may be a bit masculine in appearance, they all have an air of femininity about them which we cannot imitate completely. So often I see a person from the rear dressed in a way which could easily be considered masculine yet somehow there is something odd there that is not masculine. When I can check the face, the person is obviously a female.
If we dress well, and behave as closely as we can as a female a lot of people will just give us a glance and consider us female. People are just too busy to care. Yet there is something about the human face which cries out masculine or feminine and it’s hard to hide this.
Most people are not out to discover the CDs in a crowd. They might notice that you are bit masculine looking and take a good hard look at you. They could wind up confused or feeling that you are a man in a dress.

You noted:

But what exactly is a man's face?

As for what constitutes a masculine face, a scowl or angry glance is almost sure to strengthen masculine features and to give you away. A pleasant smile works the opposite way. There are times when I wear a certain outfit, manage a pleasant facial expression and have no problem. I can wear the same out fit, but be tired or tense and notice the difference in my facial expression when I check in the mirror. On those days, a get a lot of disapproving stares and even overhear comments like, “Look, it’s a guy!”
Unless they confront you directly and make a remark indicating they have read you, you cannot really know what the other person is really thinking, even if he treats you as lady.

Judging from this comment

I was out for an hour dressed. Still felt weird, but I need to do it.

..you are indeed a CD like most of the people on this forum, although very new at this. Don't worry! :happy: Go out and about en femme dressed and behave as well as and as pleasantly as you can, and you will have very little trouble. You will be read at times but don’t let that get you down. Most of the time you will just be one of the crowd and be able to enjoy experiencing your feminine aspect. Very early on you'll stop feeling its weird and find being out and about en femme just as natural as being in drab.

Wishing you all the very best.

Patricia

[Carly D.]

OK, I don't mean to offend. We all know that some women are less attractive than others. It's a fact. No need to insult me. There ARE ugly women. So what. And I am an ugly man.

But I can pass off as a woman. All I am saying is that once dressd, who knows for sure I am not a woman. I'm an ugly woman but I don't mind anyone knowing.:)

I think a lot of the people who were 'insulted' by my comment over-reacted. And when I said being fat which I am, helps, I MEAN I HAVE MAN BOOBS.

So I don't need to fill my bra. Simples as.

I think so as well... ok I'm not a raving beauty either, the mirror doesn't lie and I can't twist it's arm to make it so.. I have all but given up the notion that I could pass off passing.. but I have seen women that could have been men.. they look like they could tear a hole in the defensive line "follow me boys"... but aside from a lot of these actual womens size they also have that "beaten with an ugly stick" look to them.. I admire women, I really do.. but there are a few that could pass for man(ly), the offensive lineman on the local flag football team..

[Kate Simmons]

I think a lot of it may have to do with what we are trying to accomplish by going out dressed to begin with.:)

[Chari]

Whether female or male, it is all about the outside packaging, but inside we have the beauty and confidence to be comfortable in who we are!

Live the life you love, Chari

[Joy Carter]

This is just totally laughable, the responses of others in this thread. It's getting to the point, that no one can make a statement, with out being pummeled, just for their choice of words/topic. I was told here recently that I was being "demeaning" for telling another girl, that it was time to put her big girl panties on. In other words, grow up. Just where will it end, the control of others and their speech ? You/I have our own sense of right and wrong. I don't think we have the right to tell others what to say or think. And don't get me started on the right to be offended.

Rocks will be on sale in the lobby, if you wish to throw them at me. :brolleyes:
BTW, ignor the tittle. I was being mean to tongues everywhere.

[DemonicDaughter]

Well, I'm an ugly woman and I'm not insulted. I think that if you need to compete with "ugly" that's pretty scary. lol

[Julie York]

Well, I'm an ugly woman and I'm not insulted. I think that if you need to compete with "ugly" that's pretty scary. lol


Aw you're not ugly.


Scary maybe...but not ugly.






:D:D

[DemonicDaughter]

Aw you're not ugly.


Scary maybe...but not ugly.


:D:D

Exactly... scary looking :D

You've never seen me in the morning, pre-coffee, pre-makeup, mid-hair-on-the-rise, don't-talk-to-me-don't-look-at-me-don't-think-of-me expression and wearing "frumpy" like its the new red... which was the old black... or is that visa versa? And which one is the pink? The old olive green?

But if you did see me then... you'd be scared alright!!!!

[docrobbysherry]

Isn't the bottom line what we think about ourselves?

Without my masks, I KNOW I'm an unbelievably homely woman! Nothing anyone else can say will convince me otherwise!

On the other hand, if U think u r attractive as a woman, then U R!
It's really as simple as that, isn't it?

Except for u DD. U really r attractive, whatever u think!

[Nicki B]

Isn't the bottom line what we think about ourselves?

Well yes... But if the only way you can feel good about yourself is by disparaging others, then it's pretty sad? :sad:

How many of us (DD ;) ) look our best when we've just dragged ourselves out of bed? But would we all be happy to be belittled in this way? :strugglin



Beauty and ugliness isn't just on the outside - it's in our view of the world, the way we treat others, not just how we look?

[DemonicDaughter]

Isn't the bottom line what we think about ourselves?

Without my masks, I KNOW I'm an unbelievably homely woman! Nothing anyone else can say will convince me otherwise!

On the other hand, if U think u r attractive as a woman, then U R!
It's really as simple as that, isn't it?

Except for u DD. U really r attractive, whatever u think!

Aw.. :o


Well yes... But if the only way you can feel good about yourself is by disparaging others, then it's pretty sad? :sad:

How many of us (DD ;) ) look our best when we've just dragged ourselves out of bed? But would we all be happy to be belittled in this way? :strugglin



Beauty and ugliness isn't just on the outside - it's in our view of the world, the way we treat others, not just how we look?

I think there is a reason my SO wakes me up in the morning without turning the light on! :D

(Just teasing hunnie, I know its because you are thoughtful about me being light-sensitive.)

[MarinaTwelve200]

How many women do YOU see and suspect are men?----Likely hardly NONE, and WE CDers would likely be more aleart to the possibility. For regular folks they usually accept what they see is "as advertized". Unless the 'woman' in question looks Really, really strange (and in a certian 'masculine' way) the idea of questioning the gender of people met on the street NEVER even crosses their minds.---I DO beleive thats the truth.

Us CDers, being aware of the concept, are more open to the possibility and might make more of a deliberate effort to spot other CDers, but for most folks its "out of mind, out of sight" ;)

[Kelsy]

I think there is a reason my SO wakes me up in the morning without turning the light on! :D

I think not DD You're a pretty woman!! Now I fell from the top of the ugly tree and hit every branch on the way down:eek:

Kelsy:battingeyelashes:

[DemonicDaughter]

I think not DD You're a pretty woman!! Now I fell from the top of the ugly tree and hit every branch on the way down:eek:

Kelsy:battingeyelashes:

You are only allowed to call yourself ugly if I can call myself ugly!

[MJ]

Well, I'm an ugly woman and I'm not insulted. I think that if you need to compete with "ugly" that's pretty scary. lol


Exactly... scary looking :D

You've never seen me in the morning, pre-coffee, pre-makeup, mid-hair-on-the-rise, don't-talk-to-me-don't-look-at-me-don't-think-of-me expression and wearing "frumpy" like its the new red... which was the old black... or is that visa versa? And which one is the pink? The old olive green?

But if you did see me then... you'd be scared alright!!!!

HEY DD you are not ugly at all.. god i wish i look half as good as you :love:
and we are here for support not to put down in anyway anyone love and respect :hugs:

[DemonicDaughter]

HEY DD you are not ugly at all.. god i wish i look half as good as you :love:
and we are here for support not to put down in anyway anyone love and respect :hugs:

That is very sweet, but this isn't about my looks good or bad. I was only making a statement regarding self image and the image of others.

Most people feel they are not good looking when others find them absolutely beautiful. Some claim not to think they are good looking just to get compliments. And some know they are good looking and have no problems letting you know either. (Or some think they are ok looking but post that they are ugly to prove a point. I believe in a positive attitude about myself.)

And what one person finds ugly, another finds beautiful. One man's disgust is another man's fetish. I'm sure there are a few on the site who would say I'm plain or ugly or whatever because I'm not their type/taste/whatever. And that's fine. And even though some of us are not as pretty as others, to say "ugly" has such cruel implications.

I say... "not as pretty". Or "of more homely features". Just give a bit of thought about general statements. Keep the flames from rising but keeping in mind we are all sensitive about one thing or another.

[Nicki B]

You are only allowed to call yourself ugly if I can call myself ugly!

You can call yourself what you like - we don't have to believe you? ;)

It is possible to get a 'feel' for someone who posts a lot - you can't put a 'front' on forever without letting it slip, sometimes - and ugliness is something, like real beauty, that comes from inside? :strugglin

[karynspanties]

1950sclothes.......sorry, but when I look at your picture/avatar.....I see a man. I have been to GiGi's in Detroit and there are some girls that can pass. But for the most part, you can tell it's a man. I think maybe you need a reality check. Just my:2c:

[Bravesoul]

OK, I don't mean to offend. We all know that some women are less attractive than others. It's a fact. No need to insult me. There ARE ugly women. So what. And I am an ugly man.



I might resemble that remark.

You go girl.


This is just totally laughable, the responses of others in this thread. It's getting to the point, that no one can make a statement, with out being pummeled, just for their choice of words/topic. I was told here recently that I was being "demeaning" for telling another girl, that it was time to put her big girl panties on. In other words, grow up. Just where will it end, the control of others and their speech ? You/I have our own sense of right and wrong. I don't think we have the right to tell others what to say or think. And don't get me started on the right to be offended.

Rocks will be on sale in the lobby, if you wish to throw them at me. :brolleyes:
BTW, ignor the tittle. I was being mean to tongues everywhere.


Joy, you are so right. This is the second thread today like this. It must be the changing seasons.

[DemonicDaughter]

You can call yourself what you like - we don't have to believe you? ;)

It is possible to get a 'feel' for someone who posts a lot - you can't put a 'front' on forever without letting it slip, sometimes - and ugliness is something, like real beauty, that comes from inside? :strugglin

Okay, true, you don't have to believe me but I did post my pic on my profile and am certain some will like it and some won't. Mostly those that won't will think, "What is that THING in her lip?!" LOL!

And you are right there too. Beauty comes in all forms and nothing hides it to those who genuine look for it. Thank you for looking. I happen to find you quite a beautiful person as well. :D

[victoriamwilliams1]

:thumbsup:
Next time you are out and about, take a real hard look at ALL the women you see--not just the cute ones you wish you could look like. A lot of them are butt ugly !!! A lot of them are more masculine looking and more masculine dressed than most of the girls I see on this board. Some of them have more facial hair than some of us . On and on I could go. But I think the key as has been said many times before here is BLEND IN !! None of them are wearing 6 inch heels with sequined mini dresses at the mall in the morning !! None of their makeup looks like Tammy Fay on the way to a ball, etc. As much as it pains me to think it --we need to look average most of the time. If you look average---and average is not too high a standard these days ---you have a good chance of not beign noticed.

This is the thing I did. I tend to be very conservative in my dress anyway.

[crunchysoda]

..I just keep wondering if the T-girl I saw walking in downtown Roswell posts here!?!?!

Seriously. It was last summer in July.

I consider myself pretty perceptive, sensitive (as in I notice details, and things get to me, tact is something I don't always possess lol), and well nosy but it depends on my mood (I am a moody one doncha know lol)too.
In general though as arrogant as it may sound I think I would notice a CD'er shopping (obviously not all but quite a few) w/me at Target. Would I say anything? Hell no. I'd just smile and keep pushing my buggy, and maybe a little giggle to myself once I was on another aisle.

Most people just keep to themselves, they dont want to make a scene regardless. I think most of us don't want to be noticed, (I know big assumption, some people want/crave/need the attention)we like living in our anon lil bubble, even while shopping for a cheap toaster oven.

:2c:

[Julie York]

I think there is a reason my SO wakes me up in the morning without turning the light on! :D



How does he wake you up?:eek:

(Explain slowly......then speed up towards the end.:D)

[crunchysoda]

:heehee:

[DemonicDaughter]

How does he wake you up?:eek:

(Explain slowly......then speed up towards the end.:D)

By



not



turning



the


lights


on!!!!! :tongueout:

[Julie York]

By



not



turning



the


lights


on!!!!! :tongueout:


Phew..

Need a cigarette now.

[DemonicDaughter]

Phew..

Need a cigarette now.

Was it as good for you as it was for me? :battingeyelashes: