Surgery

[janelle]

Hi all;
My ? for the night is this, can one get surgery with out being on hormones?

I ask this as I feel I am ready & so does 1 of my therapists. The Dr. that wrote the scirpt. for the hormones has said if I put on any more weight she would have to stop them. I am trying very hard to maintain or lose but we all know how tough a battle that is. I know there are wonderful benes from being on them & I do want to go on yet I am very happy that I have made the change over to the real me. I guess I am saying that the hormones are the icing on the cake & I think I could live with out them as long as I can get the proper part between my legs(just hate that skin tag thats there now).

I plan on talking with the rest of the people taking care of me at my next appointment in July. I am hoping for the best yet know very well I could be shot down, so that is why I ask. I will be some what prepared for what they could say.
Thank you all for your help. This is one beautiful family we have here & everyone is so helpful. May the weather be great so you can all enjoy the summer.
Hugs & Kisses,
Janelle

[GypsyKaren]

I would imagine that you could, but you would have to find a surgeon who wasn't so strict about following the standards of care, and I believe that requires one year on HRT and one doing the RLE. I know Brassard requires it, I also know you can get it done in Thailand without, I'd say start emailing doctors you're interested in and ask.

GK :star:

[Jenna1561]

While it may be possible to have surgery without being on HRT, I am under the impression that HRT would be required after surgery - please correct me if I'm mistaken. But I thought that once the testicles were removed the body stopped producing significant amounts of testosterone and that a hormone, either testosterone or estrogen was needed in the body.


Jenna

[Kieron Andrew]

While it may be possible to have surgery without being on HRT, I am under the impression that HRT would be required after surgery - please correct me if I'm mistaken. But I thought that once the testicles were removed the body stopped producing significant amounts of testosterone and that a hormone, either testosterone or estrogen was needed in the body.


Jennacorrect, if you get rid one type of hormone you need to suppliment it with another...otherwise your endocrine system will shut down (which isnt good, as The endocrine system is instrumental in regulating metabolism, growth, development and puberty, tissue function), no matter which hormone you still need a healthy dose of something

[Denise Robinson]

i might be wrong here as i am no doctor but im pretty sure that the body produces both hormones???? its just that testosterone cancels out estrogen in a male body etc.....

please correct me if im wrong.

Hugs Hannah

[Kieron Andrew]

i might be wrong here as i am no doctor but im pretty sure that the body produces both hormones???? its just that testosterone cancels out estrogen in a male body etc.....

please correct me if im wrong.

Hugs Hannah

yes the body does produce both sets of hormones, the levels of each are determined by which hormone is being induced/produced more of

[ZenFrost]

If you want to know about options for surgery sans hormones, I suggest you read the Harry Benjamin Standards of Care (http://www.genderpsychology.org/transsexual/hbsoc_2001.html).


i might be wrong here as i am no doctor but im pretty sure that the body produces both hormones???? its just that testosterone cancels out estrogen in a male body etc.....

please correct me if im wrong.

Hugs Hannah

It's not that they can cancel each other out, it's just that different levels cause different effects. This (http://www.crossdressers.com/forums/showthread.php?t=81402) has more info.

[Kimberley]

The HBSOC doesnt allow for it. So the official answer is no. There are exceptions though and WPATH do make allowances for conditions where hormone therapy prior to SRS would be a danger to health. Still the RLE would have to be met.

Are there surgeons who would do it? Probably but why would you want to? You need to have either E or T in your system in appropriate amounts for health reasons to begin with. It certainly isnt a risk I would take unless a last resort.

:hugs:
Kimberley

[helenr]

Interesting subject. I wonder about my testosterone. Since I have been on spiro for about 18 months-200 mg daily- I wonder if I still produce testosterone? Watching my wording, I don't perceive its presence in any minimal ejaculant. I believe my natural estrogen is 'taking charge' as I have modest A cup breasts developing, finer body hair, and minimal perspiration. Maybe this 'sex related' aspect of testosterone is hibernating, but the other purposes of it are still working? Anyone know how this works? thanks, Helenr

[DianaGomez]

While it may be possible to have surgery without being on HRT, I am under the impression that HRT would be required after surgery - please correct me if I'm mistaken. But I thought that once the testicles were removed the body stopped producing significant amounts of testosterone and that a hormone, either testosterone or estrogen was needed in the body.


Jenna
Not necesarily. Otherwise the those who were made eunuchs over the ages (and there were plenty of them) would have died out in 2 or 3 years. There are more hormone producing structures in the body than just the ovaries/testicles!

[Lisa Rose]

Not necesarily. Otherwise the those who were made eunuchs over the ages (and there were plenty of them) would have died out in 2 or 3 years. There are more hormone producing structures in the body than just the ovaries/testicles!

Thanks Diana, I wonder about that after I read Jenna's post. First thought was about eunuchs, second thought was about men as they get older and stop producing testoterone. I'm considering castration but don't want to get caught up in a pill regiment. I suppose some supplement will be necessary but don't want it to be heavy doses.

LR

[Jenna1561]

While the loss of the testes and resulting lowering of natural Testosterone levels in the body may not be life threatening, there are certainly some health risks associated with the lowering of hormone levels in the body.

OSTEOPOROSIS and reduced bone density should be of primary concern. With reduced bone density, the risk of fractures and breaks increases. The male body converts some testosterone to estrogen which is necessary for healthy bone structure. By reducing the amount of testosterone, the amount of estrogen produced is also reduced and the risk of osteoporosis increases. This is one of the reasons that as females age and their natural estrogen level diminishes, their risk for fractures and breaks from reduced bone density and osteoporosis increases.

While this may not be life threatening, it should be of concern. Replacement hormone therapy and the addidtion of calcium to the diet may offset the risk of osteoporosis. Other possible effects normally considered "adverse" are possibly desired by transgendered individuals; these include


decreased muscle mass
loss of libido
impotence
minor development of breast tissue


Other not so welcome effects may include


occasional hot flashes
poor ability to concentrate


I am NOT a physician and these are merely my thoughts and opinions and are the assumptions that I live with. Castration, or the loss of testes produces effects similar, if not identical to hypogonadism. But please do the research yourself and ask your physician about the results, effects, and risks of such a planned surgery without HRT. Janelle, Let us know what you discover and please keep us posted on your plans and progress.


Jenna

[Priss]

Jenna is right.

While the bodies of both genders actually produces all three hormones, it's the gonads that are the major producers. Eunichs, would have suffered from the consequences of losing them, like osteoporosis etc...

It may however be possible. Before surgery, a TS is usually on extremely high doses of estrogen. After, only a small maintenance dose is required. My surgeon had me stop the HRT, one month prior to surgery. I don't remember what the exact reason was, but I know there was a good one. You might check out some of the surgeons websites and check into it. I went to Dr Meltzer myself. Last time I checked he had quite a bit of info on his site.

[Lisa Rose]

Thanks Jenna and Priss. That's good information.

[janelle]

Thank you all. Guess I have my work cut out for me.

Hugs,
Janelle