How would you handle this?

[cdjenny20]

I wanted to run this by the people here and see what(if anything) I should do. Keep in mind that I live and work in West Virginia and that the people I work with aren't what you would describe as being open minded.

At work there was one of those joke emails being circulated around that was very derogatory to crossdressers. I'd like to say something to the person who sent it but also don't want to out myself either. Is there a good way to accomplish both of these tasks?

[tricia_uktv]

I'd laugh at it but you could try to join crossdressers with other minorities and reply that way?

[Niya W]

Well you could try embarrassment.

[Natalia]

That'll teach 'em!:heehee:

[jackie_p]

You might try suggesting that any "jokes" of this type could
be considered sexual harrassment and that sending them leaves
not only the person doing the sending but the company in
jeopardy should someone take offense. My :2c:

If that doesn't work, then scratch his eyes out! LOL

Jackie

[Deborah Jane]

Kneecap him :devil:

Sorry, my guy side crept in then...Oops!!

[Amy Hepker]

Find out what he likes and knock it. I should not say that as I am a nice girl.

[sandra-leigh]

At work there was one of those joke emails being circulated around that was very derogatory to crossdressers. I'd like to say something to the person who sent it but also don't want to out myself either. Is there a good way to accomplish both of these tasks?

It would depend in part on what kind of workplace you are in. If you are in a workplace big enough that you get contracts from the federal government (and possibly the state government) then in signing those contracts your workplace probably become required to confirm to various provisions of the Human Rights Act, one of which is (I believe) a requirement to not provide a "hostile workplace environment". In which case you would just forward a copy of the jokes to your local HR (Human Resources) critter, say that jokes that put people down make you feel uncomfortable and that you don't believe they have any place in the workplace environment and that you want them to stop. You don't say they make you feel uncomfortable because you are a member of what-ever minority: the fact that people are being put down is enough; play the "Who next?" card -- is your workplace going to stand back and do nothing if the jokes start putting down ethnic groups or religions?

The "federal funding" aspect is a Big Stick: companies that have even only modest contracts can end up with big fines for violating civil rights, and can end up being barred for several years from federal contracts.

Even if there are no federal or state contracts involved, if your company is big enough to have a Human Resources department (not just Joe the guy who sends the paperwork on new hires to the outsourced payroll company), then there may already be an official policy against the use of company equipment for those kinds of purposes.

I would not recommend personally talking to the person who sent the particular email, not unless you yourself are a supervisor -- a supervisor of anyone. If you supervise anyone, then chances are in Canada or the USA you have a legal duty to take action ("action" can sometimes be passing the buck up the line) to step in and stomp on discrimination from anyone to anyone. In Canada, every supervisor is personally liable for permitting discrimination (that they are aware of). As in huge fines and potential jail terms. And that applies whether the supervisor is "management" or not. If you are a supervisor, speak to the person in your role as a supervisor, responsible for protecting not just the people you supervise but the contract staff (e.g., cleaners) and the staff not under your supervision who might not have dared to speak up. And if you do not supervise anyone, notify any supervisor (doesn't have to be your own) or notify HR that you don't appreciate derogatory jokes being sent around in company email.

If the business is very small (less than about 10 people, probably varies with jurisdiction) then it might be exempt from enforcing non-discrimination and so on; sorry, I've never looked in to the rules for very small businesses.

[Nicole Erin]

If it is a one-time incident than probably blow it off. If it becomes a habit to send GLBT jokes, you might ask him what his fascination is with it. That will probably stop the jokes about it.

[SandyR]

I have been there. It's a tough call. I just looked them in the eye and said "he is a good hard working employee, so do we really care what goes on at home"

Sandy

[Babette]

If this happened to me, I would first ask myself if it was worth spending my time trying to change the attitude of the coworkers. Do you really think they would change for the better? Then I would ask myself if the insensitive joke was really doing much harm to me.

I hear a lot of insensitive comments about many subjects that are usually steeped in bigotry and ignorance. Sure, I get a little put off by them. After I smooth my hackles down, I end up feeling sorry for people suffering with dim viewpoints.

It is important to remember to choose your battles.

Babette

[AmandaM]

Well, I suspect I've lost one job cause of perceived transvestism. I would say ignore it, laugh with it, etc. Or just put your hand on your hip and say, "Oh, you're such a bitch!". LOL

[Sapphire]

You might try suggesting that any "jokes" of this type could
be considered sexual harrassment and that sending them leaves
not only the person doing the sending but the company in
jeopardy should someone take offense. My :2c:

If that doesn't work, then scratch his eyes out! LOL

Jackie

I thinks Jackie is right - except for the bit about the eyes. Seriously though, this really is inappropriate use of email and does expose the sender and the company to censure. The sooner it is stopped the better. Also there may others in your organization who share your condemnation of such emails.

[Nicole Erin]

If a law suit was threatened, the original sender within the company might be shaking in HIS panties ;)

[AmandaM]

You could put a tranny magazine on his desk for all to see when you know he ain't comin' in to work!

[Billie Renee]

I've had 5 employees fired for things like this but I'm out to the company and they really don't want to lose me there because of my experience in my field. I've been a tow truck driver for 34 years and it is hard to find anyone with that type of experience these days. I do under dress at work but can't wear make-up or polish my nails (other than clear polish)but I still get along with everyone and am well respected by my employer. So yes go to your HR and file a complaint that it is sexual harassment and know one knows who is of glbt there.:2c:

[Karren H]

Hey... I've lived in Beckley and work in WV all the time.. And I crossdress there all the time.. So maybe they were talking about me? Lol. But if asked I usually say something positive about crossdressing.. Not like "god I love crossdressers" but subtle... like "sure but he does look kinda cute". Lol. Or "hey, maybe you'd look cute in a skirt too?". And if you say it in a slightly comedic way you an get buy with....

[marny]

What other derogatory and discriminating jokes does this jerk circulate? Maybe it wasn't sent at you.

[victoriamwilliams1]

Find out what he likes and knock it. I should not say that as I am a nice girl.


I am nice too and I say the same thing!

[uknowhoo]

Hit him over the head with your purse!! :devil:

Sorry, couldn't resist :o


I know it's hard to stand up in that kind of environment, and you shouldn't blame yourself for not doing so. If it's a one-time thing, I'd prolly let it slide as well. I it persists, it's HR time.

Good luck. :hugs:

[RobynP]

If it was only one crossdressing joke, I'd let it go... If there are a number of offensive jokes and the behavior is ongoing, both the employee and the employer could be putting themselves in a position for a huge sexual harassment lawsuit.

A few years ago the salesman I worked with and I were on our way to one of our clients. We weren't talking about anything in particular that I recall and out of the blue the salesman tells me a joke about crossdressing. (It wasn't offensive and I'm not going to repeat it because you've probably heard it anyway.) Well, when she said the punch line, I had about half a second before my brain kicked into gear and I thought to myself, "Better laugh real good at this one otherwise she's going to instanly figure out why you don't find this joke funny." So a forced a good laugh and told her that it was a very funny joke.

I really hated being put on the spot like that. She wasn't being mean. She was just trying to be funny... But I certainly wasn't going to come out to her...

Peace,

Robyn

[Alan]

A lot of people don't understand that a joke isn't funny to everyone for whatever reason. I hit three out of the five letters in GBLTQ, but I DO find GBLTQ jokes funny -- mainly because I tend to be laughing at myself. However, total side note right there.

There are a lot of ways to handle it. The more time you let pass, the worse it gets, btw. So if you say three weeks later, 'hey, remember that joke...' it's REALLY clear you've been stewing over it... Don't do that. No faster way to raise suspicion.

If it's creating a hostile environment, go to your supervisor and say that those jokes make you uncomfortable. You don't have to come out, and your supervisor is *legally* obligated to do something about it -- as people have already said. If he doesn't/if he has an issue with doing so, he faces legal issues.

If you're good at joking, passing it off with a joke works always -- like saying, "How nice you can joke about it, being one." It works better if you have a rep as a funny guy.

I would, however, avoid asking him to search his feelings about how it would make him feel, because that would most likely make him very uncomfortable, and most guys get aggressive and continue with the behavior.

Oh. And I like the tranny mag idea, except that can also be considered creating a hostile work environment, and the excuse that he started really doesn't work.

[DanaR]

If this happened to me, I would first ask myself if it was worth spending my time trying to change the attitude of the coworkers. Do you really think they would change for the better? Then I would ask myself if the insensitive joke was really doing much harm to me.

I hear a lot of insensitive comments about many subjects that are usually steeped in bigotry and ignorance. Sure, I get a little put off by them. After I smooth my hackles down, I end up feeling sorry for people suffering with dim viewpoints.

It is important to remember to choose your battles.

Babette

I agree with Babette and would probably blow it off. Anything you say, could out yourself.

[Alan]

Damn, knew I forgot something (/facepalm).

Are you sure that the joke wasn't mean to be just that? Like I said, I do find gbltq jokes funny, but I don't consider them anti-gbltq (unless they're BLATANTLY so). I don't want to suggest in any way that you're overreacting, but a lot of people who don't know any GBLTQ people don't realize that it's a sensitive topic.

[sterling12]

How to handle this situation is very dependent on your position. If your in management, I would bring it to the attention of upper management, You might just get a "gold star" because you brought it to their attention. Frivolous use of computers circulating jokes of questionable taste, possible ramifications of a lawsuit for making fun of ANY minority, wasted company time, wasted company resources. All of these things are not things that most company's care to deal with.

If your in upper management, you are already a policymaker or at least helping to formulate policy; I would be pushing to get formal policies in place that would prohibit these types of dangerous activities.

If your " a worker bee," I think I would let it go for the time being. you might want to consider joining one of those committee's that some company's have; the ones that are dedicated to workplace diversity and support GLBT efforts. Then, you can work from within to get important items and policies changed.

Peace and Love, Joanie

[Bev06 GG]

You might try suggesting that any "jokes" of this type could
be considered sexual harrassment and that sending them leaves
not only the person doing the sending but the company in
jeopardy should someone take offense. My :2c:

If that doesn't work, then scratch his eyes out! LOL

Jackie

Wow very good answer you beat me to it. In todays climate of equality of opportunity and anti discrimatory practice something like this that is actually in writing could get some one into serious trouble. I know in some cases it seems ridiculous but someone where I work got hauled over the coals for sending a pretty inocent joke around via email about Black people. They actually got a written warning for it and were told that there was no place for her in our office if she continued to act in this manner. I suppose somewhere along the line we have to strike a balance. There have been lots of dumb jokes go around about women too and we tend to turn the other cheek and laugh at ourselves which in some cases defuses any bad feeling. At the end of the day I suppose common sense should prevail and it depends how derogatory the joke was and were you being a tad over sensitive. If you feel that it was OTT and you feel strongly enough about it then mention it to the management. The thing is you were offended by it and how many others in your office CD or have a partner who CDs. There could be some SO sat there inwardly crying because she feels that her partner is the butt of everyones jokes.
Bev

[rian]

I would not even make any point of responding to this note at work because you will always find somebody who hate our guts , this life some people are supportives others are assholes...so keep going sis....

[CD Susan]

It would depend in part on what kind of workplace you are in. If you are in a workplace big enough that you get contracts from the federal government (and possibly the state government) then in signing those contracts your workplace probably become required to confirm to various provisions of the Human Rights Act, one of which is (I believe) a requirement to not provide a "hostile workplace environment". In which case you would just forward a copy of the jokes to your local HR (Human Resources) critter, say that jokes that put people down make you feel uncomfortable and that you don't believe they have any place in the workplace environment and that you want them to stop. You don't say they make you feel uncomfortable because you are a member of what-ever minority: the fact that people are being put down is enough; play the "Who next?" card -- is your workplace going to stand back and do nothing if the jokes start putting down ethnic groups or religions?

The "federal funding" aspect is a Big Stick: companies that have even only modest contracts can end up with big fines for violating civil rights, and can end up being barred for several years from federal contracts.

Even if there are no federal or state contracts involved, if your company is big enough to have a Human Resources department (not just Joe the guy who sends the paperwork on new hires to the outsourced payroll company), then there may already be an official policy against the use of company equipment for those kinds of purposes.

I would not recommend personally talking to the person who sent the particular email, not unless you yourself are a supervisor -- a supervisor of anyone. If you supervise anyone, then chances are in Canada or the USA you have a legal duty to take action ("action" can sometimes be passing the buck up the line) to step in and stomp on discrimination from anyone to anyone. In Canada, every supervisor is personally liable for permitting discrimination (that they are aware of). As in huge fines and potential jail terms. And that applies whether the supervisor is "management" or not. If you are a supervisor, speak to the person in your role as a supervisor, responsible for protecting not just the people you supervise but the contract staff (e.g., cleaners) and the staff not under your supervision who might not have dared to speak up. And if you do not supervise anyone, notify any supervisor (doesn't have to be your own) or notify HR that you don't appreciate derogatory jokes being sent around in company email.

If the business is very small (less than about 10 people, probably varies with jurisdiction) then it might be exempt from enforcing non-discrimination and so on; sorry, I've never looked in to the rules for very small businesses.

I agree 100% with this. I am not as accepting of this kind of insensitive behaviour as some of the others here. I recently retired from a company that would not tolerate this type of behaviour. This would have grounds for termination and rightly so.

[jennCD]

Not sure, but I think my first reaction is: if it were funny, I'd laugh,.. if it were not funny, I'd make a better joke about it....

I'm actually very politically incorrect in almost every aspect of life... it helps me to not be offended by anything around me.

:)
jenn

[AmandaM]

Walk by and say, "Hey Joe, your slip is showing.". LOL, seriously, get witty back.

[Maria2222]

That'll teach 'em!:heehee:

Good one Natalia. That gave me my laugh for the day.

[Emily Anderson]

I say that in general it depends if the joke is funny or not, in the sense of whether its inclusive or not (i.e. can be laughed at by everyone, including those who may be targeted by the joke).

For example, many Irish people like Irish jokes, and don't have a problem with a bit of teasing. Many a blond will laugh at blond jokes. Why? Simply because they know it's not the truth, even though the tale was funny.

In this case, you state that it was derogatory toward crossdressers. However, I urge you to read it again, and even post it here for inspection... It may be funny and it may be offensive. Just bear in mind that jokes about crossdressers can also be funny to crossdressers.

If it really was offensive, you should let this person know that you don't appreciate jokes that could be offensive to any group of people.

[Nicki B]

Ummm - how d'you feel about blonde jokes??

Most jokes are derogatory to someone.. I'd say it depends if it's a one-off, or a pattern?

[DeeDeeB]

Personally, I generally enjoy a good joke at my expense, as long as it isn't too offensive or mean. I try not to take myself too seriously.

I did, however, have a service tech banned from the computer room I managed because he would spend the end of the day telling very offensive ethnic jokes. At first I would just walk out of the room, but after a few times it became intolerable, so I called his company and told them not to send the jerk back. This was twenty years ago before the PC police started watching our every move.

Anyhow, my advice is to let one or two go, just consider the source, but do save a copy. If it becomes more of an issue than that, send the copies to HR.

Dee :fairy1:

[AnnMorgan]

Maybe try,"Is that the best ya' got?"