seeking advice

[kendallsan]

Hello everyone

I apologize in advance for what will be a somewhat lengthy post. I am seeking help, advice and support. I am married to a wonderful man who is a crossdresser. I am fully supportive of this – I buy most of his clothes and usually pick out his outfits for him. We have been together for almost eleven years, married for nearly six now. His crossdressing is just a part of him, something I don’t think much about being different anymore – it’s just the way he is, and I love him. He cannot even come close to passing – he has a beard and is not interested in changing that. It’s not about that for him. He feels somewhat excluded from everyone because of that – the population at large is generally unaccepting of crossdressing, but many crossdressers don’t understand him – if he isn’t trying to play the part fully, they don’t get it and have made him feel uncomfortable or unwelcome. For that and other reasons, he can get down and frustrated. He can tell me anything, of course, but he is tired of hiding who he is, and would like to find a safe place where he can just be honest about who he is without fear of retribution. I completely empathize – I can’t discuss our life with just anyone, either.

However, this frustration has led to him cheating on me – not physically, but he had a brief phone and email fling with another woman. He says he just needed to be able to be honest about who he is with someone else, and while I understand that, we both know he did it in a completely unacceptable way. We are working through it, but obviously it’s a big enough problem that I want to help him find a safe haven that won’t lead to a divorce.

I am hoping to find people he/we can meet and hang out with who will accept him for who he is, allow him to just be free with himself and not have to hide things, even if it’s just once in a while. We live in Northern Virginia, and he has a job that would be in jeopardy if he was “outed” so as I’m sure you all can understand, we have to be careful.

Any suggestions out there? I love my husband with all my heart, and I want to help him, make this better for both of us.

Thanks in advance
Kim’s wife

[Amy Hepker]

Hi,

You are very welcome here and will be accepted as will your SO (Special Other). This may be a great place for him to find other in your area.

I am not sure where you are, but there is a national club called Tri-Ess, they have loacl meetings all over the USA. Just look it up on the web, it will give you contact information. If you can tell us where you live in what big town you are close to I am sure someone can tell you of a local group. As you can see here there are thousands of us and we all want to help each other. You are a Great Lady and he surely would not want to lose you as there are so many that would like to know you. Myself I believe there are more like Millions of us out there to afraid to come out. I would suggest that he does get rid of any facial hair though as a lot of groups do not want to see a man in a dress, they want to see another CDer. There is no way to many people will want him around with a beard and a dress on. I myself wear Bras under my t-shirts all the time and my B Cups show up real good and no one says anything about it. I have no facial hair.

[Shannen]

Hi, glad that you found this forum and posted. I know that you can find every type of crossdresser here, so Kim should be able to find support here. Has she created an account yet? She can lurk around for awhile just to get a feel for it.

But I have to ask you something... Are you willing to let Kim develop relationships here? I was very impressed with your introduction, but it took a hard turn with the cheating thing. Most of us have thoughts we don't want to discuss with our wives, so I understand that part.

There is a forum here called "Loved Ones" specifically for those in your situation, and there is a "Private GM Forum" where Kim could discuss things and you would not be allowed to go there and read.

Most of all I'm glad that you two seem to communicate well and are determined to work through this.

:hugs:

[kendallsan]

Hi Shannen -

The cheating thing was not just him talking things over with her - it involved phone sex and cybersex. Believe me, it was a hard turn for me as well.

He is more than welcome to have any relationship he wants with someone as a friend - I have always encouraged him to seek out others and make friends, especially if they will help him feel more comfortable. But when that line is crossed - well, I don't think anyone should have to deal with that, regardless of the reason.

I don't use the term cheating lightly - friends don't bother me in the least - sex with others, in person or not - does.

Thanks for asking - sorry I wasn't clearer. :)
Kim's wife

[kendallsan]

Hi Amy -

I appreciate the nice things you said, but I am a little disturbed by something you said. I have a very difficult time understanding how a group of people who experience such difficulty with acceptance can be unaccepting themselves. My husband is a crossdresser, and he does it in his own way, the way he feels most comfortable and most fitting for himself. That includes leaving his beard in place and not attempting to pass. Yet other CDs are unaccepting of this and - as you said - don't want to see it. I find that hypocritical and very difficult to understand. Asking him to get rid of his beard to make other CDs more comfortable is the same as asking other CDs not to wear women's clothes to make the general population more comfortable. He is dressing and acting in a manner he is happy with - I wouldn't ask anything less of him, or of anyone else. I was hoping to find a little more empathy here, and was a tad depressed that the very first response I got was similar to the way he has been treated in the past.

I hope there are others out there who feel as I do, and who can lend us their support.

Sorry to be a downer on my first day here, but this is rough.
Thanks
Kim's wife

[justmetoo]

There seem to be plenty of CDs who expect men who want to wear dresses or other feminine clothing to go full femme when wearing a dress or other women's garments and try to look and act like a woman. I think those expectations are unfair. We don't expect women who wear jeans (even if the jeans are men's jeans), for example, to act like men and take on a male persona. I have nothing against those who want (or need) to take on a female persona, just don't tell me I'm wrong if I don't. We should each feel free to express ourselves in the ways that suit us at any given time (with the usual caveats of not hurting others and such). It comes down to mutual respect and the golden rule. (stepping down off my soap box) :2c:

I don't condone cheating in any way, but hopefully you and Kim can deal with that and get past it. And hopefully Kim can find a healthy way to deal with his frustration.

[Amy Hepker]

Well, I hope I have not upset you or anything, this is the way the group I was with in Iowa was. You could go to the meetings with a beard, but they asked that you did not dress. I myself will not be upset if he keeps his beard. I guess it really all depends on the CDer. I had a mustach for many years to hide the fact that I was a CDer, and my then wife would not let me shave it off, but I did anyway, well, we did divorse years later, but there was a lot more to it, like she was addicted to Crystal Meth.

Anyway, not all local clubs are the same, so he and or you could check it out.

I am also sure that he/she will find many friends here and I would be one of them. If you have seen many pictures here, a lot do not even show their heads or in their Avatars, they may not show a picture at all. You are both welcome here and I will gladly be friends to both of you.

[Sandra]

I do hope you can work through this cheating :hugs:

It's a shame he's been treated like this, how he presents himself is up to him and if he wants to keep the beard then so be it. It has nothing to do with other cders and they should mind their own business.

I can't help with groups in your area as I'm in the UK but I do hope you can find some where were he can go and be himself.

[carhill2mn]

Hi "Kim's wife",
You are correct to wonder why people in the "T" community are not more accepting and understanding about others. Unfortunately, it just happens that there are this type of people in the "T" community just like in the rest of the world. There are many CDs that "dress" only a few times a year. Some of us CD nearly every day. Some CDers never dress totally, others always dress fully.
My advice is for your SO (and you) to learn what is comfortable and pleasant for her and to accept that and to not worry what others may think or say. A main reason that one CDs is that it is pleasurable. Therefore, whatever feels good is probably right for that person and it is nobody else's business!
It is wonderful that you are able and willing to assist your SO. Many spouses cannot do this.
Good luck!

[AnnaMaria]

Kendallsan,

First off let me say welcome to the group. It does my heart good to know that there are other cds who have supportive family members, especially a spouse. I think that our lives as cds is much easier when we know that we have at least one person who we know we can lean on when things get really bad. So long as we are there for that person or people when they need us.

It sounds to me like she has met some of the community who is just as resentful of diversity as the ones that we are in a continuous battle with for our own freedom. Of course personally it doesn't make sense for anyone of the community to reject anyone for any reason but I do know that there are those of us who do just that simply because that person is not acting or presenting the way "they are suppose to". Just keep in mind that we are all human and we all make mistakes.

I really think that you should try to get her to join the group here and if you like I know a couple of other groups that you and she can both join that are much the same as this one. Personally I have found that this network of friends has been invaluable to me simply if for no other reason than the fact that I know that I am not alone, and it sounds to me like your spouse could use some of that right now.

Why should it matter how she presents as long as she is comfortable with who she is and you are comfortable with the whole package.

I would be more than happy to chat with her any time she and I both have the time and she wants to. I have come to the realization that one of the most important things that we can do for each other is simply to be there for each other in times of need. And with so many cds living in so many different places, not only geographacly but also emotionally, professionally, and economically there is always someone who might be able to give some piece of advice no matter what the situation is.

No I don't understand why a cd would want to have a beard, but it doesn't matter because I still see her as a sister no matter what.

I hope something of what I have said makes some kind of sense either to you or to her. And if I can help in any way don't hesitate to shoot me an email.

Huggs

Anna

[Tina Dixon]

Well it sounds like your mate is at loose ends and confused to where he belongs, being a crossdresser you don't need to be or should I say go all the way, there are people here that dress in many stages, some the same as your husband, get him to join and read of others problems and victories, also we have much your to offer here, mean while hang in there for you found some new friends:hugs:

[darla_g]

my personal feeling is that if he wants to dress he can do it and certainly doesn't need anyone else's approval to do so. Online this is my only social CD connection, I'm not much for going out and I dress basically for myself and have been doing so for years. If he wants to keep his beard then good for him.

[Jolene]

my personal feeling is that if he wants to dress he can do it and certainly doesn't need anyone else's approval to do so. Online this is my only social CD connection, I'm not much for going out and I dress basically for myself and have been doing so for years. If he wants to keep his beard then good for him.

I agree with you Darla. It seems to me the goal of many here is to go out in public and pass. I am not putting anyone down for wanting that but I am not one of them. I dress for myself and do not care if anyone else ever sees me. Sure I would like to dress in some nice fem clothes and go out as myself but the world is not accepting that way. It is not worth the grief it would bring down.
Sorry for the rant.
Jolene

[kendallsan]

I really appreciate all the support - and no, Amy, you have not upset me.

I will talk to my husband about signing up here, and hope it will be helpful for him. Thanks to everyone for the support and offers of direct email.

About the cheating - we're okay, our relationship is stronger than that, although it was a big shock to me. I understand how tough it is for him sometimes, and although I am not going to be a doormat, I have forgiven him. We all make mistakes.

Thanks again, everyone, this is exactly what I was hoping to find. I'll be around, look forward to sharing with everyone.
Thanks again!
Kim's wife

[docrobbysherry]

Hi Amy -

I appreciate the nice things you said, but I am a little disturbed by something you said. I have a very difficult time understanding how a group of people who experience such difficulty with acceptance can be unaccepting themselves. My husband is a crossdresser, and he does it in his own way, the way he feels most comfortable and most fitting for himself. That includes leaving his beard in place and not attempting to pass. Yet other CDs are unaccepting of this and - as you said - don't want to see it. wife

You've just learned the horrible truth about CDs! We're human!:eek:

[sandra-leigh]

Unfortunately you are correct that a lot of CD'ers have trouble with CD'ers who have facial hair.

The local social club that I go to is fairly relaxed about such things, during the regular meetings and at the private parties. We have a public dinner outing once a year; I haven't heard of any pressures being applied about facial hair with respect to that dinner, but I wouldn't necessarily hear. One of our members (who is a member here) has a full beard most of the year, as a family compromise; it isn't a problem at our meetings. What we want to know is just that a new member is sincere about being a cross-dresser, in the sense of not being someone attending to spy on us or to "hit" on our members, and that is an assessment we make by talking to the person, not by checking out the length of their beard.

On the other hand, our group maintains connections with another group in another city. That group has a rule that,



APPEARANCE: We dress at {group name} activities so as to blend in with the setting and the other people present. We do not dress for shock value at group events. Furthermore, when at a group event we appear and present ourselves as either one sex or another. We do not dress to shock, offend or titillate. The operative word is to blend. Each member and guest must practice good physical hygiene so they will not be offensive to others.


Notice that bit about "either one sex or another", which rules out "men in skirts", "gender-bending", androgyne, and (I would interpret) having more than a trace of facial hair while dressed. The introduction to the rules gives a bit of context:



Because there are so many misconceptions about transgender lifestyles, we need to be especially careful of our behavior in public. We have adopted this code of conduct to guide our behavior to insure that we overcome misconceptions and ill-will. In particular, we wish to be welcome in reputable public places, jointly and severally, and have learned that to be welcome, we must fit in. With education comes understanding; with understanding comes acceptance.


Now, I can vaguely see the point if they were out at a restaurant (for example), and are concerned about "getting read" because there is a woman with a beard sitting with them -- but I've met a number of the members of that group, and frankly most of them are going to be "read" at a glance no matter who they are with. That group's by-laws are framed in terms of "transgender", not in terms of "cross-dresser", but they discriminate against those who do not polarize as visibly one gender or another. When I challenged that group's president on this issue, the president didn't even know that the group was officially a transgender group: the group president's had not even read the group's own by-laws! And said president is not interested in discussing the matter :sad:

I don't mean here to pick upon that particular group: I am using them as an example of how even established CD social clubs can be insensitive to those who do not polarize. I am fortunate in that our local group is not that way: most of the more active members in our local groups are "misfits" in terms of the rules of groups such as Tri-Ess (which doesn't exist here in Canada.)

I wouldn't have any trouble being seen in public in the company of a cross-dresser with a beard. But to be honest, when I first started cross-dressing, I was concerned about "passing" and wanting others to believe me to be biologically female. But for what-ever reason, no matter how I dress up, no matter what wig or makeup, most people who have seen me before recognize me fairly easily (in dim light, across a room), and the great majority of them accept me any way, whether I'm fully dressed, or "a guy in a dress" or stealth-dressed. Somewhere along the way I realized that I am most comfortable "somewhere in between". I don't spend my time feeling disappointed that "I'm not femme enough", that my walk isn't right, that I don't have a femme voice, that my butt isn't cute enough, whatever: I spend my time being comfortable with what I am -- which, as far as I am concerned, is what it's all about.

Your husband is comfortable dressing with a beard? Cool! Being comfortable within himself is what's important.

[bah-bah-bobbie]

Kendallsan, while we try to provide advice and support to all, it would be helpful to know what kind of advice to give. Does your husband want to go out and about in public en femme, or is CD'ing something he only does at home. If it's a private thing for him then why worry about a beard? I have a fu-manchu mustache, and a soul patch that I've never shaved even from peach fuzz stage, and I'm not going to get rid of them now for anything or anyone, f**k the club rules. Thats why I don't join clubs. I say he keeps the beard, no flack form anyone, that way you can truely have the best of both worlds, often at the same time.

[Joanne f]

When it come`s to Cding i have this thing about what anyone can or can`t tell me what to wear i dress on my terms not on some groups terms that is why i will not join a group as they have their idea how i should dress so they steer clear of me and i of them , if you husband wants to dress and keep his beard then good for him , it is about what you want and what he wants not what anyone else wants, support to me means exactly that and not do it my way or forget it .
Now as far as cheating is concerned i do not agree with it at all , but saying that i would not be to worried about a phone call/ chat as a part of Cding is to let other people know that you do it , it is sort of like a buzz and an unloading of perisher all at the same time




joanne


I did not put that thumbs down singe up there

[Bev06 GG]

You've just learned the horrible truth about CDs! We're human!:eek:

Hi Kendallsen,
Unfortunately human beings are very discriminatory even if they belong to minority groups themselves.. You will find that CDs are no different to the rest of us.
Bev

[Holly]

Hi, Kendallsen. Well I'm glad you're here and I do hope your husband will join us as well. Perfect we are not, but we do try hard. I hope both of you will give us a chance. FWIW, you sound like a great lady... your hubby is a lucky person.

[Joni T]

Hi Kendallsan,
My wife loves my beard. My mother hates all facial hair. Soooooooooooooooo, what to do? 6 months of the year I keep a naked face for my mother and the other 6 I keep it furry for my wife. I keep it furry in the summer when it's too hot to dress anyway and shave in the cooler months when I dress and go out regularly. I've got a full-on "Grizzly Adam's" type beard as this is being written. When was the last time I dressed fully? Last night, with my wife. You know what they say don't you? "The man, not the clothes, make the man". The club I belong to likes me either way. I just don't dress for the meetings when I'm bearded.
Welcome to the forum. I personally think you two will do just fine in your relationship. You've already overcome 2 pretty large hurdles. Hang in there, mes amis.
Joni

[Butterfly Bill]

I have found that there exist people who are actually turned on by seeing a man with a beard in a dress. They like the honesty, and not the over-made up trying to pass and appear to be something you ain't look.

[TxKimberly]

I have found that there exist people who are actually turned on by seeing a man with a beard in a dress. They like the honesty, and not the over-made up trying to pass and appear to be something you ain't look.

Welcome to the forum! As Holy and others have said, we ain't perfect but we DO try and be understanding and accepting of all.

There I was trying to remember Bill's exact name here when his post magically appears! As you can see by Bill's avatar, your husband would not be the only one here.

[Jonianne]

I have found that there exist people who are actually turned on by seeing a man with a beard in a dress. They like the honesty, and not the over-made up trying to pass and appear to be something you ain't look.

Yea, Butterfly Bill is back! I love it. Just in time.

Welcome Kendallsan! As you can see, We are a little more diverse here than other places. You sound like an awesome wife. Hopefully you can get your hubby signed up so we can have another sister here. Crossdressing is an expression of the heart, not how passable we are.

I wish both of you the best!

[Jilmac]

Dear Kendallsan, First I would like to welcome you to the forum and praise you for your undying love, and support for your husband. I know first hand what it's like to be a crossdresser and sport a beard. I wore a dress and panties for the very first time at age 7 on a dare. I experimented with the clothes of my three older sisters and at age 15 when my second sister died in a freak accident, I started on my crossdressing journey by wearing her clothes to be with her in spirit.

I have been dressing for 48 years and wore a full beard for 37 years. I stayed in the closet most of my crossdressing life because my wife was non supportive and I felt the need to hide from her when I dressed. I had learned about Tri Ess from a Dear Abby letter but when I inquired I was told there wasn't a chapter in the Milwaukee area. However there is a support group Called The Gemini Gender Group and about 12 years ago I attended a couple of their meetings dressed en femme but still sporting my beard. I was accepted by the group as a whole but there was one person who was transitioning who told me I should lose the beard.

My wife passed away last year and I have come out to several people including my new SO who is supportive (with one limitation). I chose to shave my beard after having it as my identity for 37 years but I would have no problem knowing another dresser who chose to keep his. I hope you will be able to find a support group near you who would be accepting of your husband beard and all. A suggestion from me would be for you and your husband to start with all the sisters on this forum and try to meet other dressers around your area. Perhaps you could invite them to meet your husband and get to know him/her, and if Kim felt comfortable entertaining them at home, you both might be happy sharing with fellow dressers.

I know the difficulties of dressing, keeping a beard, and keeping a secret from family and friends. It can be very disconcerting feeling the need to be with others and not having an outlet or source of support. I sincerely hope that my suggestion and the suggestions of the other sisters here have been a helpful source for you and Kim to find that outlet. Please keep us updated on both of your progress.

[Tina B.]

Sometimes I wear a beard, sometimes I am clean shaven, but at all times I am a crossdresser! I just shaved my beard off, because I I felt the need to get back in to make-up, and that is hard to wear with a full beard.
While his avatar does not show it right now, Butterfly Bill looks very nice in a dress, and I have never seen a picture of him with out the beard!
Tina B.