Fence sitting

[helenr]

I wonder how many out there are stuck in the awkward situation of wishing to go all out on feminization via meds but knowing that social pressures and concerns prevent you from going there? So you stand near the fire, but don't want to jump onto the hot embers. How do others cope with this quandary? Helenr

[Ashlynne]

For me it really wasn't a choice. In spite of going out dressed every chance I got and trying to live as a female I was still just a guy in a dress no matter how good I might have looked. If it wasn't for hormone thearpy, I'm certain I would've gone absolutely insane, (not that I still might be) :heehee:

BTW, Helen you come up with some best thread topics...Thank You :)

[marie rose]

Society has put transgender folk in an untenable position. While gays and lesbians have gained acceptance mainstream still considers TSexuals to be freaks and on some level I understand that because in my younger years when I didn't understand the condition I thought that of myself too.

While all we want is to be able to live our lives as anyone else for many of us that isn't possible. I know in my case because of children I live two lives and try to do the best I can so some days are good and some not so good . Thank God I have a very supportive wife or else I'm sure I wouldn't be here in any form.

[Kimberley]

Helen, I prefer not to think of it as fence sitting, but rather as not yet ready to transition.

I count myself in that group only due to familial relationships that have still to be worked through and secondly, money. I am otherwise ready to go and my pdoc will give the nod in the blink of an eye.

:hugs:
Kimberley

[Sarah...]

Society has put transgender folk in an untenable position. While gays and lesbians have gained acceptance mainstream still considers TSexuals to be freaks and on some level I understand that because in my younger years when I didn't understand the condition I thought that of myself too.

While all we want is to be able to live our lives as anyone else for many of us that isn't possible. I know in my case because of children I live two lives and try to do the best I can so some days are good and some not so good . Thank God I have a very supportive wife or else I'm sure I wouldn't be here in any form.

Ditto. Well said. In addition, I love my wife dearly and can't ever consider not being with her. To risk that by transitioning is anathema to me. I'll take my chances as I am.

Sarah...

[Paula Thomas]

Marie Rose, Kimberley and Sarah - double (triple?) dittos.

If it were not for my supporting wife, who puts up with a lot, and job situation, I would transition considerably.

:2c:

[helenr]

Thanks for the caring, sharing thoughts. I well know the need to keep our GG spouses as the only squaw in the wigwam. I saw a show on TV about a retired airforce pilot (as others know, many who have struggled with transgendered concerns join the military to see if they can 'he man' their way into being full time on the boy's team) .He was married, then had SRS , and it was unclear if his wife could continue in what she might then view as a Lesbian relationship. Gets quite complicated and very hard for the 'traditional' person to accept and cope. Tough all around. best, helenr

[Anna the Dub]

I am not fence sitting as such, although I did for a while, I am building up to transition. I am having electrolysis, and whilst very slow, I am starting to see positive results. Personally, I would find it almost impossible to transition whilst still having to go 2 or 3 days without shaving to facilitate electrolysis. So, I am reaching a compromise, I am ditching all my male clothes, and buying female tomboyish or androgynous clothes. Some of these clothes you couldn't tell they were womens, but I know. When the electrolysis is finished, or as near as, then I will fully transition.

[RachelDenise]

Helen, for many the allure of transition is great. I think about it regularly. However, I love my wife and family. I am not willing to give them up because that is what would happen if I transitioned. As an aside, I love my job and career which also would go in the dumpster. Add in the fact that I'm 6'3" tall and weigh 275 lbs and I give you a recipe for disaster. Now, how do I cope? The stolen and fleeting moments of femininity are enough for me right now to keep me sane. It's not much, but I do so enjoy it. Some day when I'm willing to throw caution to the wind I might think seriously about doing it or even just begin the process.......

[Empress Lainie]

I dont know if this will help, but here it is.

Once I realized I was a female person I would not even think of not going fulltime right away which I did. I still have to shave, I did increase my phyto-estrogen capsules of herbs that promote breast growth. I had no need for counseling, but the tg group is a real resource for me. The information I have found on the internet particularly Carl Bushong's treatise has been helpful. I thought he could have been writing about me.

I was never gay, something people in general seem to think that transgendered people are. I was never into crossdressing prior to my transition, after which I have never worn any male clothes or pants except to work on my cars, and since then I always wear a wig except one day when it was too hot.

I was lucky in that I had nothing in the way of family to prevent, my job was fine with it until the two people that didn't know me complained I introduced myself as a transgendered woman, and the total hater in city hall ordered me fired. that same person has also blackballed me from any other community school where I have applied just to see if she did so I could file a second and third complaint.

So I never had to sit on the fence. I have had it much much easier than most of the transwomen. Not only that but I am so lucky in this body no adams apple, arms and legs that are very feminine looking, and my boobs getting large enough so I am now confident in going out braless and knowing no one is going to think I am a guy in a dress.

I am accepted everywhere as a woman, only the people at the Sun Coast know I am trans since I was there for 7 years before. But they all treat me royally as a woman now.

[Sarah...]

I was never gay, something people in general seem to think that transgendered people are.


This always makes me laugh - though not in a nasty way! Using logic it is easy to see why people would think TG people are gay (in the generally accepted sense of the word).

Taking it logically, if you are TG, you must have been gay at some point in your life or are now. If you are MtF and you live as a female and prefer relationships with a female then you are gay now but weren't before. If you are MtF and you live as a female and prefer relationships with a male then you are not gay now but were before. And if you are sure you are not gay now and were not gay before then you are probably latently bisexual. Or even asexual I suppose. The same idea would be true for our FtM friends.

So, for us here with time to discuss all this, no problem (except for the continual need to use labels). In an everyday context I think it is easy to see why the population at large might think TGs are gay - logically they are or have been.

Anyway - to get back to the point of the thread - yes, I sit on the fence. I have to as my other ramblings in other threads have described.

Hugs

Sarah...

[Empress Lainie]

Sarah it has been my experience that the first question many people ask when you reveal yourself to them is: 'ARE YOU GAY?"

Even believe it or not my son asked that.

I consider myself lesbian (yes its gay) and maybe bisexual.

[Sarah's lover]

Empress Lainie, not that it matters one iota but a couple of posts back you state that "I was never gay". I'm a little confused. Anyway it seems to me that with gender issues one can't help but have either been gay or be gay now! Or bi sexual.

Any way it's splitting hairs and who cares anyway as long as one is happy and any important people in one's life are happy.

R x

[Empress Lainie]

just some more fun and confusion:

tg people aren't like nontg's. unless we are post op
there is the mental (ID) component and the physical (equipment). It is sort of funny to me but

sex between two tgirls: mental lesbian physical male gay.
(you have to work with what you have!)

sex between a tgirl and male: mental heterosexual, physical male gay. (The guys usually think of it that way from much reading of the connections)

sex between a tgirl and a gg: mental lesbial, physical heterosexual.

sex between a transman and a man: mental gay male, physical heterosexual.

sex between a transman and a gg: mental heterosexual physical lesbian

sex between two transmen: mental male gay, physical lesbian.

That should be enough to blow the mind of any non-ts person. No wonder they don't understand us.

[Sarah's lover]

Wow Lainie that took a bit of writing!!!

As long as we're all happy with our own lot - live and let live I say.

But I guess this is why so many gg other halves find it so difficult to get their heads around, especially if they are very closed minded or prudish even about sexual matters.

I rather like it - I get the best of both worlds :heehee:

[helenr]

I think everyone learns to compartmentalize, as the popular expression goes. I have found that it is harder as one reaches the 'autumn' of one's life. You realize that you are mostly likely going to die male. sometimes gurls throw caution to the wind and challenge convention in many ways. My wife knows who and what I am. She knows that nothing will 'cure me'. So long as it isn't 'in her face' , she is tolerant. I feel bad as she has said she can't 'discuss this' with anyone (women seem to need to talk about things to girlfriends). Thus she has the burden to carry,though less than an ounce versus the hundred pound 'monkey on my back' that 55 years of crossdressing and knowing I was out of sync with Society has put on my brain. I take the AAs as they help my bp, help me cope with the nasty T, and keep me calmer. I can't do more as I don't want to lose her and end up alone and lonely. So I fence sit until the end.

[Kimberley]

:iagree:

Helen, reading that was almost like a page out of my diary. The difference with me it that I have pretty much reached the end of the lie and self preservation is becoming more important. I guess being alone is okay but not lonely and in that, a new circle of friends is crucial; both inside and outside of the community.

:hugs::hugs:
Kimberley

[LaurenS.]

If it wasn't for the love of my daughter and wife I would be crashing through the fence! I just can't leave transitioning as my legacy to them. It's what I dream about and think about constantly. I have been so close to going on hormones but just can't bring myself to do it. I wish I could as I think it would bring me the happiness I long for but I think it would be such selfishness on my part. But oh how I long to be a woman.

Lauren

[Valeria]

I wish I could as I think it would bring me the happiness I long for but I think it would be such selfishness on my part.
Transitioning because you are a woman and you need to live your life as such is no more "selfish" than countless things people do all the time to make themselves happy. People routinely decide to go to college (or not), to drop out of college, to switch majors, to move to another state, to live at home with their parents (or not), to allow their children to continue living at home (or not), to marry someone their parents/children/mailman don't like, to have children (or not), to have more children (or not), to switch careers, to sell the family home, to divorce, to remarry, etc., etc. Some of these can actually affect the lives of your children more tangibly than transitioning. Taking a job in another state and relocating your school-age children is huge, for instance. Taking a job where you have to travel a lot, thus depriving your children of time with a parent may be even bigger. Yet people make these sorts of changes in their lives all the time, without feeling selfish or being wracked with guilt over betraying their families.

I think part of the "I can't be that selfish" mentality reflects that some of us have gotten so used to denying ourselves what we want that it seems "wrong" to actually think of ourselves. I think that sometimes it reflects low self-esteem, and in some cases it probably is partially a result of internalized transphobia. But whatever the cause, I think it's unfortunate.

The decision of whether to transition is complicated and multifactorial (just as with all of those other decisions I listed earlier). Maybe you shouldn't transition, I have no idea. Maybe the mere fact that you dismiss transition in this fashion is a signal that it's wrong for you. Maybe this is a coping strategy, because you don't really want to transition (or fear transitioning) for a variety of reasons, but it's emotionally easier for you to deal with telling yourself it's simply not an option rather than admit the real reasons. I can't read your mind, so I've no way of knowing.

But these blanket dismissals of transitioning as selfish seem wrong to me (and I see this sentiment expressed a lot -- my comments are not solely directed at you, by any means).

Anyway, I don't wish to sound judgemental or condescending or harsh. I'm just trying to challenge the meme that transitioning is an overwhelimingly selfish act. Part of what makes it a big deal is the degree to which society is transphobic. Have you ever noticed that mothers of convicted criminals (even murderers) are typically still emotionally supportive of their children, whereas mothers of trans (and gay folk) frequently aren't. You'll see the same effect there too, with tearful mothers saying "how can you do this to me?" to the child they've just evicted, when in reality the adolescent is just trying to live their life to the best of their ability, and it's the parent (in this case) that is being remarkably selfish.

There are certain formative ages for children at which I'd have been reluctant to have transitioned, so I can certainly understand someone saying "I can't transition right now, I need to wait a few years until my child is at a more suitable age" (though children are often more resilient than we give them credit, and they often take this quite well at any age). But to say that "I can never transition because I can't do that to my child" is ultimately, I think, to concede to a transphobic worldview (whether you share it or not). It's to embrace the concept that transitioning is doing something horrible to them.

IMHO, YMMV, etc.

[Note: I had no children pre-transition, my parents died when I was young, and my life partner is lesbian by preference and prefers me female, so this was admittedly a much easier decision for me. But it also means that I'm relatively neutral, in the sense that I did not have any family that would object to my transitioning, so I'm not emotionally invested in justifying my decision to transition (or not).]

[LaurenS.]

Transitioning because you are a woman and you need to live your life as such is no more "selfish" than countless things

Dear Kehleyr,
While I agree with what you have said, I just don't see how I can leave transitioning as my legacy to my daughter. She is 21 and would probably be very understanding but we are a close family and I just don't know if I can do it. It is something I think about daily and it is getting more difficult to resist with each passing day. I am certainly not happy living this way but I'm not sure if transitioning would bring me the happiness I dream of.
I am ready to start low dose hormone therapy and am hoping it will help me to cope mentally with my torment.
Your situation was unique and allowed you to make decisions without reprocussions that many have to consider.
I dream of becoming a woman and being released of this daily torment but I just don't know if I could find happiness while causing such unhappiness in others. I thankyou for your honestly and concern. I hope I can find the best way to live with this.
Lauren

[helenr]

I am moved by the serious sentiments I read. I am not an MD , nor do I play one on TV, but I seriously endorse the use of mild anti androgens -assuming you are in good health, don't have blood pressure issues-spiro seems to lower bp and if yours is too low already, you would need professional guidance. BUT, so much of the stress I feel I was under is now contained. I am not miserable, I do have sadness in one part of me, but I need to exist in this shitty world. Shitty as people almost universally are intolerant of our community. This is very distressful, but I recognize it and work things as I best can. Anti androgens will kill your sex drive and ability, but I can't imagine the typical viewer of this section of Crossdressers wants to be a virile stud if you are a MTF individual. good luck to all and thanks for the excellent input. helenr