OYY....Stop GG bashing!!!!

[Deborah Jane]

Why do some of people here insist on "GG bashing"?

I,ve noticed in the past and i,ve noticed it started happening again, that whenever a GG gives an opinion, someone takes a "pop" at her!!

Why?

The GGs on this forum are often very supportive and at least trying to understand us, why "kick her in teeth" when she says something you don,t agree with?

They are entitled to their opinion the same as any of us!!

For some of us the only GG input we get is here and i for one appreciate it

So let them have their say, it,s valid whether you like it or not!!

Ok...Rant over, lets play nice now :hugs:

[KandisTX]

AMEN SISTER.

Too many times I see posts on here like "Why can't I find an accepting GG", or "How do I find an accepting GG"? and there are quite a few of them RIGHT HERE on this forum, and we (myself included) have been guilty of posting something that in some way offends them. These are the women we want in our lives because they do accept us, and they want to be a part of our lives.

Kandis:love::rose2:

[Julogden]

Guess I missed it, what happened? I mainly hang around the Lounge so I'm not up on what's happening in the other forums so much any more.

Carol

[MJ]

i also value and respect there input .just remember you get more bees with honey. play real nice :hugs:

[GypsyKaren]

If you would be so kind as to PM me any links to such posts, I will be more than happy to remove them and see that it's not repeated by that member.

Karen Starlene :star:

[PamelaTX]

Great comment, I agree completely.

Being nice is hard sometimes, but it's always worth it!

[Angie G]

Some people just can't understand the other people have opinions that my not be the the same as theres. Or maybe it's that thay can't be A girl at home. I for one love the GG's here And love there posts. All you GG's rock.:hugs:
Angie

[Kate Simmons]

The fine women here are shining examples of what we all could be like if we take the time to listen. Empathy and interpersonal skills are sometimes not easy for guys to grasp and some, unfortunately, never "get it". I, for one, enjoy listening to what these women have to say and there is indeed much to be gained from their wisdom.:)

[Annaliese]

I agree with you the GG here are trying to understand us. I for one hope they can because I can't, have tried for 55 years. Now I just enjoy being me.

Annaliese

[Always Susan]

I'm with you Deborah Jane! Any GG who is kind enough to try to understand us should be treated with kindness and respect.

[az_azeel]

Well said debs... although its a shame it needs to be said... .. the last thing we want is all the GG's to dissapear into there own section and ignore us... there opinion is as valued as the next...

[Karren H]

Yeah... It's a pretty stupid thing to do for sure.....

[Fab Karen]

No doubt they're the same CD's who'd be easily pointed to who act stereotypically male- sitting with legs spread wide in a dress, not washing hands in the restroom etc.

[Mya Summers]

Well said Deborah, The GG's do not deserve to get treated the way they do sometimes on here. Alot of them come here for advice on their SO/GF that is a Cd'er and when another CD'er bashes that SO/GF quess what the first thing is that comes to that SO/GF's mind? (hwy these CD'ers are rude) and that is the last thing us CD'ers need b/c alot "not all" of the natural world doesn't accept our ways of life. So the next time another CD'er wants to bash a GG for something stop and think about it first before you do!!! B/c if the GG's make thier own personal area and don't say anything to us it will hurt us tremendously.

Mya

[Sharon]

You see that little icon there below the avatar of the post writer, the little upside down triangle thingee? Click on it for any posts that you feel are out of line for any reason and someone on staff will respond.

[charlie]

We are so lucky to get a true woman's unvarnished point of view. I hope the few stupid comments that are made is not enough to drive the wonderful GG's from this forum. The comments are truly not from the majority.

[Alice Torn]

I totally agree with the post. I, also may have written somethings, not good, or advisable, in the past, about gg's. We ought to be really glad some are on here. With all due respect, however, sometimes any of us can be overly sensitive, me included. Sometimes, current fashions, and trends can be legitimately criticized, because this is a free country, and I served in its military, to help preserve these rights. There is a good old adage, that it is healthy to not take ourselves too seriously, and to laugh at ourselves, is a key to happiness.The walking on eggshells all of the time, makes for misery, as, I have lived with people where I had to walk on eggshells. Yes, we must not pick on our gg sisters, and support them, appreciate their input, highly value it. Sometimes we make the dumb mistake, of foolish comments, insensitivity to their dignity. We all do it sometimes, and need to be tolerant, and forgive, also.

[Greg]

There shouldnt be any bashing of any kind!!!!!!!!

[Tracii G]

This should be a no bashing zone.I for one am glad the GG's are here helping us in our quest.Thanks all you GG's I love you all.

[pinkeverything]

I'd love to have an accepting GG in my life, even just as a friend.

[Jilmac]

Deborah, I wholeheartedly agree with you. Supportive GGs are our lifeline, let's treat them with the respect they deserve.

[docrobbysherry]

We must post so many things here that offend them indirectly, I have a hard time believing anyone would intentionally take a shot at any of them!:eek:

TO EVERY GG HERE;
WE NEED U AND WE LOVE THAT U PUT UP WITH US! PLEASE DON'T GO!:hugs:

[Jess_cd32]

OK, time to ask the really stupid question, what does GG stand for?
I'm new here and not familiar w/it. I know what it means at least, SO of a CDer.
I got the feeling the answer will make me say duhhhhh,lol, but don't ask, don't learn.

edit: I agree, nobody should be bashing anyone.

[Greg]

Genetic Girl jess

[sterling12]

But, before you all go any further; you had better define "bashing." I have seen differences of opinion around here, I have heard commentary by BOTH sexes about "perceptions" of the opposite sex. But I personally can't define that as "Bashing." "Generalizing" about the opposite sex is exactly that.....generalizing.

I also haven't seen any personal attacks....would that be "bashing?" And, I am serious about this. I think it's a ambivalent term quite subjective, that doesn't have a true definition, it's just what an individual defines it to be.

So, if it's not asking too much, can someone please give me a definition and some type of concrete examples? If we all can't agree as to what it is, and be able to identify it, accusing someone of "bashing" becomes just like accusing someone of being a "racist." Undefined, it just allows someone to muzzle any thought they find objectionable...,. it becomes tyranny!

Peace and Love, Joanie

[Greg]

Cant we all just get along..Hell i get the old shoulder because im a man,but im not whining and crying about it

[Anna the Dub]

I have nothing but respect for all the GGs that are on this site (and the vast majority of GGs in general). I think that they are all wonderful to be so accepting of their husbands/boyfriends, in a situation which the vast majority of them did not sign up for. The fact that so many of them go to the trouble of trying to help their partners come to terms with themselves, and improve their lives enormously, tells me that these GGs are very special people. My best friend is a GG, and I know for a fact that I would not have made it, in any way, without her love and support. When I have been at my lowest point, she was there beside me, stopping me from doing anything foolish. As I head towards transition, I know she will be standing beside me all the way. Love her to bits. So, never any GG bashing from me. Ever.

[DAVIDA]

In the time that I have been a member of this forum, I have seen the disappearance of several female members. It is sad for me to think that some people have had such a bad experience on here that they no longer are a part of this "family"! Those women were some of the most accepting GGs around and had some very sage advice that could benefit everyone. I really miss them. Please, let's try not to run off any more of our wonderful GG family members! OK?

[Nicki B]

Where and what happened, to prompt this thread? :strugglin


I'm still of the opinion that there's often too much segregation, here - FTMs, MTFs, GGs.. Why on earth should it matter, we're first and foremost all people, with similar fears, problems and needs for respect and love.

Try not pigeon holing people according to a label (particularly if you don't want people to do it to you) and treat everyone as you would like to be treated, yourself - with respect?

[TxKimberly]

This is the second or third thread I've seen lately talking about GG bashing. Have I missed something becuase I don't recall seeing any threads that would qualify in quite a long time?

[Satrana]

So where are the examples?

Can we get this clear. If someone disagrees with another person's viewpoint, this is called a discussion. If the other person happens to be a GG then this does not make it "bashing". It seems to me this is a sexist idea that you cannot disagree with a GG without it being referred to as bashing.

I would define bashing as attacking the member's character and not discussing the points of view contained in the thread. Lets try and avoid victimhood mentality, it does nobody any favors.

[Stormgirl]

They stink


jk :hugs:

[battybattybats]

I'm still of the opinion that there's often too much segregation, here - FTMs, MTFs, GGs.. Why on earth should it matter, we're first and foremost all people, with similar fears, problems and needs for respect and love.



Smaller groups discussions can get swamped by the larger groups, hence why sometimes having seperate areas is important, but i think there needs to be more inclusive discussion. An area for crossdressing/transgender etc topical discussions between everyone. A general on-topic section in other words. Otherwise many of those smaller group issues get isolated only to the specialist areas and the people in the larger groups end up ignorant of the other groups and their issues.

The FtM blokes are a good example where they often get left out of MtF peoples consideration or MtF people make remarks that are offensive to them.

We'd need to work out some way to stop the more numerous MtF crossdressing folk from swamping the discussions there though.

There needs to be more exposure to everyone of each others issues needs and experiences. That way we all can learn more and understand more.

[dancinginthedark]

I believe this one (http://www.crossdressers.com/forums/search.php?searchid=2398909) is a pretty good example of GG bashing.

The pejorative bashing (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bashing_%28pejorative%29) implies excessive or unwarranted criticism on a subject, group or individual.

[justmetoo]

I believe this one (http://www.crossdressers.com/forums/search.php?searchid=2398909) is a pretty good example of GG bashing.


I get a "Sorry - no matches. Please try some different terms." with that link.

[janelle]

OH THIS MAKES ME SICK!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


We all here owe alot to these ladies. I for one have chatted with some that have helped me thru some really tough times. Some here have no one to ask for help & these ladies do the best they can from where ever in the world the live. Its not like they live next door to all us so this is the best place for them to help.

I guess I will shut up now but will leave you with this thought:

If your a basher would you like to be treated that way? I think not.

Janelle

Ps, thank you all you beautiful GG that gives us wonderful help.

[KATIE TV]

Thank you Jess, I don't understand most of the abreviations either, maybe it's because I'm English or stupid (or both) I don't know what SO means, could someone do a list of them all please, I was fright'nd to ask til you did,
Love you all, KatieX





OK, time to ask the really stupid question, what does GG stand for?
I'm new here and not familiar w/it. I know what it means at least, SO of a CDer.
I got the feeling the answer will make me say duhhhhh,lol, but don't ask, don't learn.

edit: I agree, nobody should be bashing anyone.

[Nicole Erin]

Deborah, I wholeheartedly agree with you. Supportive GGs are our lifeline, let's treat them with the respect they deserve.

Absolutely, the *supportive* ones are. First one that comes to mind is DemonicDaughter. Way cool lady. :battingeyelashes:
Anyways -
People don't like to mention it for fear of catching hell but sometimes a GG will want to "put us in our place" or whatever. And they seem to be able to do so without actually violating any rules.

The sad thing is when other CDs jump in and agree. OK fine GGs have a hard time with this and that is understandable, as long as they are not giving us CDs a hard time. But when it is from a CD jumping in and saying "Yeah I agree" that is about wrong.

I have had a couple CD friends who seem to love to agree whenever another Cd is being raked over the coals, and I do not associate with them.
We don;t have many places to go where we can feel safe, real life web or whatever, and we don't need to catch more crap, especially from other CDs.

[suzy cool]

I believe this one (http://www.crossdressers.com/forums/search.php?searchid=2398909) is a pretty good example of GG bashing.

.

Your link doesn't work.:sad:

[dancinginthedark]

I get a "Sorry - no matches. Please try some different terms." with that link.


Your link doesn't work.:sad:


I did a copy and paste of the post that some saw as "GG bashing" Is it bashing? I believe it is. IMHO how hurtful or intense an attack is perceived is relative, and varies by individual. Staff does make every attempt to keep these things under control by following some guide lines.

This may help a bit:
Respect and Tolerance of Other Forum Members (http://www.crossdressers.com/forums/faq.php?faq=main_rules#faq_respect)

This was posted after 1/2 dozen or more CD's suggested the same thing, tell your wife. We could assume all day why the GG comment was so much more offensive, but I think we all understand the reasoning to a certain degree already. She is a new member looking for sympathy and support not reminders on how any of the current upset could have been her own fault, especially when that reminder comes from the other side of the coin. There will always be at least two sides of the story folks. The secret? Respecting them.

Sometimes a thread is just a need for some "I understand" or "that sucks" fellowship. Life and reality are all around us everyday..... some times life calls for a little time out. Can't blame a person for that. On the other hand sometimes life calls for a little wake up call :kickbutt:



*****: thanks for your comments! They would be welcome if my thread was about "Whether or not I should tell my wife, and the morality thereof". But instead you decide to peruse the forums to find someone hiding something and crap on their thread. Guess what, it's a crossdressing forum; there's going to be people hiding stuff. Your job as a GG on these boards should be to comfort other GGs who are trying to understand why their SO dresses not to condemn someone whose situation is unlike your own.

Again IMHO to get an accurate feel I would suggest reading the entire thread and not a single post.

Had to leave my stash behind :cry: (http://www.crossdressers.com/forums/showthread.php?t=90125)




Kind regards,
dancinginthedark

As always please take what you can from my words and leave the rest behind.

[justmetoo]

Okay, I read the whole thread and I agree with you, Dancing. That was uncalled for. Someone (GG, MtF, FtM, whatever/whoever) makes a well-written reasoned post and gets jumped on. :rasp: That's not right! But there are options for dealing with that, right?

But for each one who says dumb things or acts rude there are dozens of people (GG, FtM, MtF, whatever/whoever) who are supportive, intelligent, caring, or at least humorous. I hope everyone realizes that probably the majority of folks here value the wide variety of viewpoints represented in this community.

So I say 3 cheers for the members of the community! :cheer::cheer::cheer:

[GypsyKaren]

So where are the examples?

Can we get this clear. If someone disagrees with another person's viewpoint, this is called a discussion. If the other person happens to be a GG then this does not make it "bashing". It seems to me this is a sexist idea that you cannot disagree with a GG without it being referred to as bashing.

I would define bashing as attacking the member's character and not discussing the points of view contained in the thread. Lets try and avoid victimhood mentality, it does nobody any favors.

Allow me to explain a few things to all of you, perhaps then you'll understand. Us staff members see a lot more here than any of you because everything that's posted on this forum gets checked by at least one of us, but you still wouldn't see it because we delete it. Everyone wants us to show examples, but we don't have the luxury of time to do that. All of us devote several hours every day to the operation of this forum, so we're lucky if we're able to post at all in things that interest us, let alone go through outdated posts in order to satisfy someone's curiosity.

We added GG bashing to the rules not because we didn't have anything better to do that day and were bored, we did it because it was becoming a constant problem. No one cares if people disagree on issues and that's not what I'm talking about, it's that too many were doing so by personally attacking others as an individual or as a group.

I can also tell you that there's a significant amount of members here who feel that this should be a crossdressing site for crossdressers only, that they feel that GG's and transsexuals (especially the guys) don't belong and have no business being here, especially on staff, and they have no problem with letting us know that. Like I said, you don't see everything that goes on here, but we do, so you can either take my word for it or not.

Karen Starlene :star:

[PhillyGuy2Girl]

We should never bash anyone,especailly GG's,even if we might disagree with on certain issues. As CDers,we need GG's and as someone said earlier,they are our lifeline. I'm especailly thankful for my wife who supports me CDing and helped me to bring out my femme side.We should as guys be thankful for GG's because if GG's weren't around,we would all be S.O.L.


Felicity :)

[suzy cool]

That isn't 'bashing'. Viewed in context and not as an isolated sound bite, the poster was pointing out that the reply was both off topic and self indulgent. The thread was not about whether anyone should tell their SO or not, and it was worded as a rebuke from someone with an axe to grind, not as a bit of friendly advice.

[DemonicDaughter]

That isn't 'bashing'. Viewed in context and not as an isolated sound bite, the poster was pointing out that the reply was both off topic and self indulgent. The thread was not about whether anyone should tell their SO or not, and it was worded as a rebuke from someone with an axe to grind, not as a bit of friendly advice.

Then why was nothing said to any of the cders that replied saying the same thing, to tell the wife?

[suzy cool]

Then why was nothing said to any of the cders that replied saying the same thing, to tell the wife?

I haven't read the thread recently but as I remember it in its full version, the replies from CDs firstly suggested solutions to the problem and so were on topic. Then they suggested that the problem would have not been one if she has been open with her SO and so on.
But the reply from the GG was actually a lecture from someone who was obviously dealing with their own personal issues with regard to honesty and was very angry about it. It was off topic and more of a 'telling off' than anything else. Assuming it is still there, have a read and you will see that there is no mention of the original topic, but more like someone having a right good rip into a CD about a subject that had nothing to do with the topic because she was pissed off about something personal to do with trust.

People expect to be given varying points of view when they start a thread, and some of them might not be be palatable, but I don't think the CD section of the forum should be regarded as a form of therapy for people with their own issues who want to have a go at a CD. No-one would get away with ripping into a GG, off topic, in the Loved Ones section just because he was having a bad day with his girlfriend. No-one would live very long giving a morals lecture, off topic, in the Transmen section just because they were having a bad day.
The CD section should be no different regardless of whether the GG's husband is an untrustworthy ******* or not.

So when read in context the original poster's reply can be seen as more of a defence than an attack.

[GypsyKaren]

I had absolutely no problem with secretlypsycho's remarks, and I didn't see them as off topic at all, just her opinion on the problem. I also didn't see any "anger", "lecturing", or "telling off", but I did see unfair remarks in return about crapping on a thread and what her role should be on this forum. Now if someone has a problem with a poster to their thread, all you have to do is contact a moderator and we'll look into it, because what I saw instead just isn't going to fly here.

Karen Starlene :star:

[Mary Morgan]

Deborah Jane, I absolutely agree. I wish we had more participation from the GGs and yes, I would even like to hear the not so flattering things. We need them to keep us centered, to keep us thinking, to keep us honest. I certainly read things here once in a while that I don't like, but they may come from the TGs or the GGs. I also find inspiration from all here. There is plenty of room here for all ideas, comments, and opinions.

I say we should celebrate the inclusion, support, and critism we receive from these fine people.

[secretlypsycho]

and people deciding they knew what I was thinking without actually bothering to ask me... I think I'm starting to remember why it was I left this place for the last few months!


The thread was not about whether anyone should tell their SO or not, and it was worded as a rebuke from someone with an axe to grind, not as a bit of friendly advice.

You are correct, the thread was not started that way. But the resulting conversation did turn that way, and my comment was in reply to something that had been said earlier. I certainly didn't turn the conversation by myself, just carried it on further. And I'd love to know what this axe is that I have to grind? Because I'm quite blissfully unaware of it, lol.



But the reply from the GG was actually a lecture from someone who was obviously dealing with their own personal issues with regard to honesty and was very angry about it. It was off topic and more of a 'telling off' than anything else. Assuming it is still there, have a read and you will see that there is no mention of the original topic, but more like someone having a right good rip into a CD about a subject that had nothing to do with the topic because she was pissed off about something personal to do with trust.

Wrong, wrong, wrong. You know what they say about assumptions don't you? Well, that saying well & truly applies in this case. I was not "very angry", nor was I "pissed off about something personal to do with trust". I was simply replying to something someone else wrote - it's called an opinion, and instead of trying to read between the lines some hidden meaning that's not there, you should perhaps try just accepting it as it's written.



The CD section should be no different regardless of whether the GG's husband is an untrustworthy ******* or not.

Now to follow my own advice, I'm not going to assume anything here - but would like to know whether this was in fact directed at me? If it was, then all I will say is that my husband is certainly not untrustworthy in any way. And that is all I'll say.


GypsyKaren, thank you - you have clearly read my post as it was intended to read, without putting your own spin or interpretation on it. :thumbsup:

[justmetoo]

"I can also tell you that there's a significant amount of members here who feel that this should be a crossdressing site for crossdressers only, that they feel that GG's and transsexuals (especially the guys) don't belong and have no business being here, especially on staff, and they have no problem with letting us know that."

I'm surprised, dismayed and saddened by that attitude. If it weren't for the GGs, and the transsexuals (especially the guys) I wouldn't be here and I certainly wouldn't stay here! I find their input to be highly valuable. :hugs:





"I wish we had more participation from the GGs and yes, I would even like to hear the not so flattering things. We need them to keep us centered, to keep us thinking, to keep us honest. I certainly read things here once in a while that I don't like, but they may come from the TGs or the GGs. I also find inspiration from all here. There is plenty of room here for all ideas, comments, and opinions.

I say we should celebrate the inclusion, support, and critism we receive from these fine people."

Absolutely! Well-said! :cheer: