Appreciated for not being a "real man"

[sybercom11]

I have read some messages about wives being upset because their husband was not a "real man."

My wife knew when she met me that I was not a "real man." She was attracted to my gentleness and how I treated her and other people. She was also just coming off a relationship where one of these "real men" or "macho men" tried to control her life. I frankly was surprised when she said she would go out with me of all people.

She certainly does not get that from me. She is a beautiful but confident and assertive woman. She did not appreciate a "real man" trying to micro-manage her life. She certainly does not get that from me.

At the very least, we are equal partners. I even prefer that much of the time she is the one who is in control and makes the decisions. And she prefers to be the dominant partner as well. I prefer to be submissive. So were are well-matched.

My brother is a "real man." He and his wife got divorced. My sister is married to a "real man." They fight all the time and she is depressed. A lot of my co-workes and friends are "real men" and they are divorced too.

My wife and I have our disagreements, but it is not over my not being a "real man" and how I act feminine. I don't hunt or golf or go to Steelers games or go out to bars with the "real men."

I spend my time off work taking care of her needs and those of our kids. I help her clean the house and shop. I volunteer at the kids' schools and take them to the doctor during the day. They are older now but I was the one who got them ready for school and yes, I changed diapers.

I give my wife massages and bathe her and paint her nails. And yes I pleasure her.

My wife has it nice because I am not a "real man" and she really loves it that way. I know I am an exception and so very lucky.

If the unaccepting wives and girlfriends knew what they were missing, they might change their minds about us who are not "real men."

[Toni_Lynn]

Well -- I wouldn't use the term 'real man', I do appreciate the fact that you placed in quotation marks. Reason being that a real man loves, cherishes and protects his wife, and defends her (anbd the family) against all evils. And that I do, and it matters not one bit that I have lace on my underwear!

That said -- my wife loves me because I am not a macho muscular a-hole who has to hang out with guys drinking beer and watching sport all day on TV. Her first husband was everything that gives having a penis (or is it being 'negatively-vaginated' :confused:) a bad name!

She loves my caring and loving nature. She loves my softness. And I love her with all my heart and soul.

Huggles

Toni-Lynn

[tommi]

Well stated ,I find it funny when my wife spends a night out with the girls
how she acts when she comes home.
She knows my interest in dressing is one of the reason I so willingly do house work as well.
There are benefits to being involved with someone with issues such as ours but there not always recognized while we're together.

[sybercom11]

I put the words in quotes because that is the term that people throw around.

But like you described, I am a better man and husband and father than most out there because of the things I do for my wife and kids, and yes I also mean the non-macho things. And much of the way I act comes from the fact that I am indeed transgendered.

[Karren H]

Omg!!! I don't care if your a man or a woman... Not going to Steelers games??? You need to seek out help fast!! Don't let your neighbors find out!! Your not really from Cleveland are you? That's worse than being a pervert around here!! Hahaha

Iv actually never been to a Steelers game.. I'd rather watch it at home and not have some drunk spill beer on me!! But I love the Penguins!! And I play ice hockey every week.. Yeah... So I don't know if that makes me a real man.. Or what.. The way I see it I'm caught between two genders.. Not quite passing fully in either.. My wife loves me for who I am.. Though she hates my hobby.. Sigh..

Your a lucky "unreal man" in my humble opinion.

[Kate Simmons]

The definition of being a "real man" or a "real woman" is relative really and mostly in the eye of the beholder. Being a "real person", however, is really something.:)

[Laura Evans]

I can say that not being "macho" is what attracted my current gf. She has told me on many occasions that I was "not like other men" she has known. She knows about Laura, loves it and has told me on more than one occasion she does not see any difference between my feminin or masculin side.:battingeyelashes:

[Toni_Lynn]

Omg!!! I don't care if your a man or a woman... Not going to Steelers games??? You need to seek out help fast!! Don't let your neighbors find out!! Your not really from Cleveland are you?

I can honestly say that I have never been to a pro football game -- let alone a Steelers game, you can count the number of Pirates games I've been to on the painted toenails of both my feet and still have a few toes left over, and the same goes for --- sorry Karen -- the Pens!

I have no idea who won the World Series or the Super Bowl, and not sure who won the Stanley Cup.

But ask me if a slip should be worn under a certain dress, or if a ceratin lipstick and nail colour goes with an outfit -- and I'm your man -- er, girl. :heehee:

Huggles

Toni-Lynn

[AmandaM]

My wife has a dad who is an aggressive large man. Her brother played college football. She was expected to be her mom's helpmate in the house, be girly, she was a college cheerleader, etc., etc. She enjoys being fem, but for some reason, didn't really like the tough guys like her dad and brother. They were kinda mean I guess. Typical stereotype of American males, obnoxious. Then I come along, seemingly macho, but then, I was very kind. When I finally told her about my crossdressing, she didn't care! I was a nice person.

[Karren H]

Hahaha... Your the only one in the Burgh that's been to a pirates game, Toni-lynn!! And you don't know who won lord Stanley's cup?? You should be stripped of your Canadian flag!! :D.

There's more girls going to ice hockey than guys here... Cause they love Sid Crosbey! Lol. To me sports and being girls are not mutually exclusive... ....... Ahhhhhh.......

Sorry I lost my train of thought... Listening to NHL home ice on XM radio.. :)

[goofus]

My wife has a dad who is an aggressive large man. Her brother played college football. She was expected to be her mom's helpmate in the house, be girly, she was a college cheerleader, etc., etc. She enjoys being fem, but for some reason, didn't really like the tough guys like her dad and brother. They were kinda mean I guess. Typical stereotype of American males, obnoxious. Then I come along, seemingly macho, but then, I was very kind. When I finally told her about my crossdressing, she didn't care! I was a nice person.

Gee I always thought the cheerleader types went for the very macho guys...not always I guess :)

[Ashlyee Paige]

I have never even watched a football game in my life LOL Superbowls are good for commercials though :>~ hope I dont get flamed too bad :> Lifetime Movie Network forever! lol and why did they take stanleys cup? now what does he drink from? lol

[Toni_Lynn]

And you don't know who won lord Stanley's cup?? You should be stripped of your Canadian flag!!

Okay okay -- I will admit this -- I think that Hayley Wickenheiser who brought home the gold in Women's Hockey for Team Canada is great and I'd love to have a jersey with her number on it!

And then there is curling -- if only cause it sound like something we do to out hair! Hurry hard!


I have never even watched a football game in my life LOL Superbowls are good for commercials though :>~ hope I dont get flamed too bad :> Lifetime Movie Network forever! lol

I usually try to find a good chick-flick DVD for when its on!

Hmm -- We seem to have lost the plot here -- we now return you to what this thread was originally about!

Huggles

Toni-Lynn

[trisha59]

Iv actually never been to a Steelers game.. I'd rather watch it at home and not have some drunk spill beer on me!!

How many times do I have to apologize for that.:lol: Seriously I have always thought that we make the best partners in any type of relationship.

[Schatten Lupus]

My girlfriend says she knew something was different about me when we first met. When I came out to her, she had braced herself for me telling her I was really gay.

[DAWNB]

I guess that I was lucky. My dad never raised his voice to my mother. He did run the house (olden days) but always worked with mom on things. I was raised to respect people in general. I realized that women had a tough time of it and would have liked many times to have punched out a few of the husbands because of their "real man" attitudes. I have been married over 52 years and can honestly say that I have never treated my wife like she was subordinate to me. I do a good part of the housework (we are both retired), shopping, and other things that tose "real men" would say is women's work. She could have left me in the early 90's when she found my female clothing but didn't. She, for a lack of other words, is putting up with my Dawn and I appreciate it.

[Sammy777]

Well I have never been to a football game.
I can take it or leave it really.

Love Hockey & the fact that the Red Wings & Devils have won 7 of the last 13.
Haven't been to game & probably never will.
Devils tickets are disgustingly expensive.

Who won the world series? I could care less........
The Mets season ended Sept 28th, again. :doh:

My sister is just as big of a hockey & baseball fan as I am.
We have spent many a day/night knocking back beers together watching or being at Mets games.:drink::drink:

I really don't see liking or not liking sports as a guy or girl thing.

So what was the question again? lol

[sybercom11]

Hey Karren and Toni-Lynn: I do indeed like the Steelers, and Pens and I am a long-suffering Pirates fan. I like Pitt football and basketball more than anything though.

I know women go to those games and all types of males. I guess what I meant to say was I would rather stay home and do homemaking-type things. And I spend my "hobby money" on buying girlie things for me instead of those expensive sports tickets.

Also, all lot of times my wife schedules things for us and I have elected to go along with that as I am submissive. So I pretty much don't plan a lot things for me.

[sybercom11]

The definition of being a "real man" or a "real woman" is relative really and mostly in the eye of the beholder. Being a "real person", however, is really something.:)

That is so well said and I wish more people understood that. I try to be a good person. And I think the fact that I feel feminine inside has a lot to do with that.

For instance, when my kids were in preschool and grade school, a lot of the moms would volunteer during the day with various activitives. There was one male who was always there and guess who that was?

When the principals or teachers would thank the moms for helping, everyone would get a chuckle over how I was one of the moms. But no one was forcing me to be one of the moms. My maternal instincts led me there.

[Michelle8]

As a western pa. girl I agree with you sybercom.
I have a lot of the femine traits you have also.
I prefer it that way.But I am a huge Pittsburgh
sports fan too.I would love to be a cheerleader
for the Steelers if they ever decide to have some

[Satrana]

The way I look at it, CDs are the only real men out there because we are the only ones who appreciate and want to show off our feminine side. All other men are too scared to do so which means they are fakes.

So when you hear wives saying they want a real man, in effect what they want is a scared, incomplete half-man more concerned about his macho status than her.

[Ronni Seymour]

You are more of a 'real man' than those who think they are. If you got to their core, you'd find an insecure, little boy not knowing who to really be. That's why you'll find the dysfunctional relationships, because they aren't really happy with themselves.

[morgan51]

I'm also very submissive My wife wouldn't have it any other way..We are very happy with me being the submissive one and her the dominate. Morgan

[Jess_cd32]

Omg!!! I don't care if your a man or a woman... Not going to Steelers games??? You need to seek out help fast!! Don't let your neighbors find out!! Your not really from Cleveland are you?...........

Ah ha, penalty flag thrown for Karren!!! 'unsportsman like conduct for insulting Clevelanders':heehee: 5 post penalty!:sad:

Kidding aside, what really makes a "real man"? that debate will last till the end of time.

To me, one that can cry when a tragic situation happens or watching a sad movie and tearing up, sticking up for someone weaker that is being bullied rather then just ignore it and follow the crowd mentality.

The 'real men' when it comes down to brass tacks rarely pass the true tests in life.

[Sasha Anne Meadows]

My wife always says she married me for my mind.

[sybercom11]

I'm also very submissive My wife wouldn't have it any other way..We are very happy with me being the submissive one and her the dominate. Morgan



I believe there a probably many, many women out there who would want to be the dominant partner. (Of course, many others are just like us and want to be submissive.)

Being dominant suits my wife, not being submissive. She heads a department at work and is used to being assertive and in charge of things and directing things the way she wants them to be. That is house things are in our household as well.

Sure my wife and I talk things over, but she ends up having it her way. I don't cause any trouble by disputing her. And I am happy to be this way.

[Toni_Lynn]

On the topic of being dominant or submissive, I have extreme difficulty with use of these terms. One of the primary reasons is because far too many CDers are quick to equate their femininity (and femininity in other males) as being submissive. In doing so, a grave injustice is done to those of us who steadfastly stayed true to ourselves when abused by parents, schoolmates, or SOs because we are CDers.

In our marriage, neither my wife or I are dominant or submissive. We are equal partners filled with love and respect for each other needs and wants and opinions. She will defend me to the ends of the earth when I am attacked in any way, she will stand by me when I down or sad. Likewise, I will do the same for her. Neither one of us wants to either dominate or be submissive to the other. We can go to each other with any problem and we know that the other will always be there.

One promise we made to each other when we were dating is that neither of us would try to change the other. We could make this promise because we each were truthful and honest about who we are and could see that we were a perect match.

Huggles

Toni-Lynn

[Alice Torn]

Almost every woman I dated was the dominant one. Grew up in Northern Illinois farm area. Started liking sports age 13- Cubs, Sox, Bulls, especially Blackhawks!!! Bobby Hull, Stan Mikita,Dennis Hull, and the boys! Only went to one Cub game. Went to many Mariners games at the old Kingdome in Seattle, several Sonics games, back in the 80's. I may have a better chance at finding a SO, or wife, than the Blackhawks have, of winning Stanley's Cup!!! I have been rejected by women, because i was either coming on too strong, or too shy, too agressive or too gentle. My older twin brothers, always came on strong, aggressive, so, i always try to be gentle, though i am always nervous, and try not to let my rough country boy harsh side come out. I have never had financially security to offer a lady, so, i am always considered just a friend, no more. Being manic-depressive doesn't help, with no healthy family or relatives anywhere! A lot of gals still go for the tough, macho guys, mean guys, controllers, though. At dances, I will defer to the other gent, sometimes, when we both ask a gal to dance. Some guys could not care less, about being gentlemen, and care about the other fellow. Real men, or real women. Real people, like Ariana said.

[Angie G]

I Think they would change their minds if they know how good it could be. I also help around the house and we enjoy a shopping trip now and then. She's known for almost 3 years of the 40 years we've been married.:hugs:
Angie

[gennee]

A lot of times I wonder what "real man" means. I don't go to bars, drink or do a lot of many things but I enjoy being with my family. I'm more of a cerebral type. I like to read, write, cook, go out dressed in public, and other things. It's wonderful that you're spouse is accepting. Mine is though se's not overly thrilled about it. The most important thing is that she knows that I love her.

Gennee


:)

[ReineD]

I have read some messages about wives being upset because their husband was not a "real man."

My wife knew when she met me that I was not a "real man." She was attracted to my gentleness and how I treated her and other people. She was also just coming off a relationship where one of these "real men" or "macho men" tried to control her life. I frankly was surprised when she said she would go out with me of all people.

She certainly does not get that from me. She is a beautiful but confident and assertive woman. She did not appreciate a "real man" trying to micro-manage her life. She certainly does not get that from me.

At the very least, we are equal partners. I even prefer that much of the time she is the one who is in control and makes the decisions. And she prefers to be the dominant partner as well. I prefer to be submissive. So were are well-matched.

My brother is a "real man." He and his wife got divorced. My sister is married to a "real man." They fight all the time and she is depressed. A lot of my co-workes and friends are "real men" and they are divorced too.

My wife and I have our disagreements, but it is not over my not being a "real man" and how I act feminine. I don't hunt or golf or go to Steelers games or go out to bars with the "real men."

I spend my time off work taking care of her needs and those of our kids. I help her clean the house and shop. I volunteer at the kids' schools and take them to the doctor during the day. They are older now but I was the one who got them ready for school and yes, I changed diapers.

I give my wife massages and bathe her and paint her nails. And yes I pleasure her.

My wife has it nice because I am not a "real man" and she really loves it that way. I know I am an exception and so very lucky.

If the unaccepting wives and girlfriends knew what they were missing, they might change their minds about us who are not "real men."

Ditto for my current SO, my controlling ex, and what I appreciate in my current relationship. Except I wouldn't categorize my SO as a real or not so real man vs. a real or not so real woman, nor do I think about the merits and shortcomings of TG vs. non TG. (My brother is also as you describe yourself and he is not TG).

I prefer to think of my SO as an emotionally healthy, connected, and responsible human being. (Not to mention, kind, compassionate, brilliant, sexy, with gorgeous blue eyes and that killer smile). :<3:

[sybercom11]

Almost every woman I dated was the dominant one. Grew up in Northern Illinois farm area. Started liking sports age 13- Cubs, Sox, Bulls, especially Blackhawks!!! Bobby Hull, Stan Mikita,Dennis Hull, and the boys! Only went to one Cub game. Went to many Mariners games at the old Kingdome in Seattle, several Sonics games, back in the 80's. I may have a better chance at finding a SO, or wife, than the Blackhawks have, of winning Stanley's Cup!!! .

Sorry to hear about the passiing of Pit Martin. I remember the MPH line because Tony Esposito was one of my sports heroes.

And yes, I followed sports as a kid as well as played with dolls and dressed up girlie!

[victoriamwilliams1]

those "real men" I see all the time and I just want to at times tell them to get a grip and calm down! To tell you the truth those guys bug me! I believe some of them are struggling with their own identity as even some of us was that guy at one time. We as men at one time was afraid to show any weakness and told boy don't cry and a strong man holds in his pain (and he will die from it!) and swallows his pride and keeps going.

I could say more thats my .03 cents

[sybercom11]

I know some guys who think they are tough guys -- "real manly men" -- but they are really just jerks. I don't know why their wives like them that way, except for the fact that they must be great in bed.

But out of the bedroom, I can't see why some women like guys like this. A lot of these marriages end up in divorce court.

Now, I am biased here, but when a wife accepts the fact that her husband is CD or transgendered, that has got to be a better marriage than being married to some tough jerky guy.

What do you think?