Forgive my obliviousness

[Sophia de la luz]

What exactly is the difficulty in accepting someone you love's choices for clothing?

I've heard the women are afraid of losing their man to CDing.
I can imagine all kinds of imagined social consequences/punishment.

Isn't it finally clothing? And does that really change who we are, fundamentally, as people? And why is change a threat? Couldn't it be an adventure, something that makes life interesting?

Is it that our spouses are reflecting our own issues with ourselves?

My spouse is along for the ride. But then, for us, marriage wasn't a set of expectations... it was a journey towards love. I don't recall clothing choices coming up in the vows.

[Karren H]

Well there is no difficulty if it was brought up prior to the nuptuals.. But post 30 years and it can manifest itself as a monster problem!! Just ask my wife!!

[JoAnne Wheeler]

My Spouse does not see it just as clothes - she sees me as another WOMAN

And she is jealous of this other WOMAN

JoAnne Wheeler

[Nigella]

Its not the fact that we wear clothing designed for the female form.

Just look at how we are viewed by society...


GAY, UNDESIREABLE

Part of that outlook is actually re-inforced by our own actions. Remember that this forum is viewable to the general public, and then consider some of the threads that have been started.

Look at how the media portrays a CDer, stereotying.

All that is in her mind if you tell her early in the relationship, ADD mistrust if you tell her much later in the relationship.

And this is only a little indication of WHY !!!

[lauraabdl]

OMG its only clothes, right? Well from my SO's point of view, you could have dropped an atom bomb when she finally asked me what was up and I told her part of what CDing I was doing. She blew a gasket. I now days don't bring up the subject and SO dosen't either.
Now SO is going to theropy but that has not helped me as of yet, I am taking a wait and see attitude.:o
Laura

[Cathytg]

You imply that you did not tell her about your CDing prior to the marriage. If that is so, then it is not hard to see how she might be taken aback. Learning that you just developed a heart condition and dealing with it as a change is not the same as finding out that you have been TG/CDing since before you were married.

On the other hand, if CDing is something you have begun since you were married, then perhaps it would be less difficult for her to accept.

In either case, it is the behavior versus the identity of the person that becomes the issue. Reflect very carefully on who you are and take your newly discovered self to her and work from there. In the meantime, you can be pretty sure that she is reacting to behaviors and real images for now. Try to deal with the person and not the behavior for starters. Eventually the behavior needs to be put on the table but try not to let it get there before you do.

And, really, how many guys do you - or she - see walking around in dresses? I never expect folks to simply ignore that issue. Why should she immediately accept it?

[DemonicDaughter]

What exactly is the difficulty in accepting someone you love's choices for clothing?

That depends...did you meet her in drab or dressed? Don't know what the difference is, how about presenting yourself as one type of person while feeling you are truly another. To many people, that's being deceptive.


I've heard the women are afraid of losing their man to CDing.
I can imagine all kinds of imagined social consequences/punishment.

Of course there are much worse things a partner could do other than cding. Personally, things like cding don't bother me in the least. Its a lot of the other things that seem to go along with it that I could understand someone having a problem with.


Isn't it finally clothing? And does that really change who we are, fundamentally, as people? And why is change a threat? Couldn't it be an adventure, something that makes life interesting?

If it was "just clothes" then it wouldn't matter if they were female or male clothing. You'd wear it because you liked it. But because its SPECIFICALLY feminine clothing that it makes arguments like that completely null and void.

Do you change who you are? So when dressed you are a man in a skirt? Nothing really feminine about you? When you are in drab, you wear makeup and do your nails? I think not. Yes, it DOES change who you are, but mostly to yourself than to another person. You feel you look better, prettier. You feel more yourself, more relaxed. So yeah...in a sense you do change.

Who is this adventure for? If its only clothing then how is it an adventure? An adventure is generally something a partner can and WANTS to participate in. Otherwise, its just YOUR adventure and often leaves partners feeling pushed aside.


Is it that our spouses are reflecting our own issues with ourselves?

Or perhaps issues you don't realize are present.


My spouse is along for the ride. But then, for us, marriage wasn't a set of expectations... it was a journey towards love. I don't recall clothing choices coming up in the vows.

I don't love someone for their gender, clothing, etc. I love them for who they are. But people DEFINE THEMSELVES by their clothing (self expression), gender, etc. So when you meet someone and they present one way, you expect that to be the entire truth. Many partners feel betrayed because ultimately, that original "truth" really wasn't the whole truth.

As for me... well again, I have no problems with it what so ever. I honestly happen to love it and feel that as long as my partner is happy and isn't hurting anyone, I don't care what they do.

[Alice Torn]

Someone asked months ago, about how we would take it, if a wife,or SO, started wearing macho male clothes, stopped shaving legs, underarms, got a butch haircut, etc. Would we like it? For me, if i was married, or had a SO, it would grind on me.

[Joanne f]

The thing is that it is not just clothes, it is clothes designed for females so that has certain connotations, now the thing is do we like the clothes because they are female clothes or do we just like the type of clothes that happen to be designed for females , so you can understand why a SO would think that you want to wear the clothes because they are female clothes and then start to wonder why .:doh:

[curse within]

Its not the fact that we wear clothing designed for the female form.

Just look at how we are viewed by society...


GAY, UNDESIREABLE

Part of that outlook is actually re-inforced by our own actions. Remember that this forum is viewable to the general public, and then consider some of the threads that have been started.

Look at how the media portrays a CDer, stereotying.

All that is in her mind if you tell her early in the relationship, ADD mistrust if you tell her much later in the relationship.

And this is only a little indication of WHY !!!

I needed to touch on this subject ..Thanks for bringing it up:D....

I feel the MEDICAL field has a lot to do with that perception...When crossdressing was first studied ,on record the subjects choosen ( I know I mentioned this in another thread)... In the study subjects were opened dressers, meaning they walked around freely dressed.. IMO...These where not closet dresser they were Trans sexuals that lead to the MEDICAL opinion or findings that crossdressers where gay..Now before you beat me up not all Trans sexuals are GAY but they do attribute traits of becoming a female or born as the wrong sex..

More studies have been done on crossdressing as a whole but I feel VERY LITTLE OR NOTHING HAS BEEN DONE with public perception due to the original conclusion that crossdressers where GAY!! I feel that a petettion should be sent to the AMA addressing this myself for public awareness..

[Gabrielle Hermosa]

What exactly is the difficulty in accepting someone you love's choices for clothing?

We all wonder that, but at the same time I think we all kind of know the answer - we just don't like it.

The bottom line is the ability to understand a reality and one's personal preference. As we all grow up, society embeds a set of "rules" into everyone's minds. I grew up in self-denial about what I am because I was taught it "isn't right", it's a "sickness", and just isn't allowed. My wife grew up also understanding what a wrong thing it is. It was enforced and reinforced to us over and over as we went about our lives. In our case, there was a personal interest in it for both of us. I am a cd, and she's always had an inner curiosity and fascination with mtf cding (which she believed was wrong of her for the longest time).

Now take some people who have no interest in cding. A man who has no desire to cd and a woman who has no desire to see a man dressed or made up as a woman. Zero desire or interest. That personal trait along with society's "rules" embedded strongly in their minds makes for a personality type that may not ever accept cding.

Some people with zero interest may have a very open mind to that which is considered different or social taboo. Even though they may have no interest in cding or being with a cder, they may be accepting and understanding about it to someone they know, care about, or love.

Take someone who has no personal interest or curiosity in cding, has been taught society's "rules" and prefers a man who is very masculine. Why on earth would they accept their man as someone who wants to dress or present them self in feminine form? It may be cold, heartless, rigid, stubborn, or whatever, but if they want one thing and end up with another, one can surmise that they will either try to put an end to behaviors they find intolerable or seek someone else without the intolerable behaviors.

When society's "rules" about cding change, the sad stories we read over and over here will probably happen a lot less. When society grows up and begins to understand and accept differences like this, we'll all be in better shape - cders and non-cders alike. Not that it's news to anyone here, but there you go.

Thank God some of us ended up with open minded SO's and even SO's who share our enthusiasm about it. I pray that everyone who's SO isn't so accepting may find a way to help them understand. And if there is no understanding to be reached, may they find true love in the heart of someone else who will truly appreciate them for who they are. :)

[docrobbysherry]

My Spouse does not see it just as clothes - she sees me as another WOMAN
And she is jealous of this other WOMAN
JoAnne Wheeler

My "other woman" is apparantly jealous of my GG dates! :eek:
She's wants me all to herself! My old college girlfriend, that I hooked up with over the holidays, found that out!:brolleyes:

This CDing thing is, may be a LOT MORE COMPLICATED than just wearing different clothes!:doh:

[sometimes_miss]

If it was only clothes, it wouldn't be such a problem. But the choice of clothes represents to them who we present ourselves to be. Women are sexually attracted to masculine, alpha male characteristics. Female clothing on us, to them, represents the opposite. Women want to feel secure, and sexually desirable to men, not women. When you dress up as a female, that translates subconsciously into insecurity for her, and a whole lot of other things she isn't interested in. While there are some women for whom all this doesn't matter, they are only a small fraction of the total female population. So small, that few crossdressers have accepting and eager mates. I've read estimates that approximately 2.5% of males crossdress; and supposedly 1.25 percent of women are o.k. with that. But when actually presented with their man in female clothing, that percentage is cut nearly in half. makes for a wide disparity of guys who dress, and finding the women who want us.

[Angie G]

My wife has little problem eith it as long as I give her some man time.:hugs:
Angie

[justmetoo]

It's not about clothes. It's about honesty.

[beenherelongtime]

it's not about the clothes to your SO. it is how others perceive us and the reflection on your family. each SO has different reasons for not accepting and only they can tell you what it is. and sometimes they can explain it, just as we can't always explain why we do it.

[Nigella]

it's not about the clothes to your SO. it is how others perceive us and the reflection on your family. each SO has different reasons for not accepting and only they can tell you what it is. and sometimes they can explain it, just as we can't always explain why we do it.

I Like It

Clear and unambiguous (sp)

[Sandra]

. I don't recall clothing choices coming up in the vows.

Answer me this then, is there something that your wife does that you don't particularly like? and was this a choice in your wedding vows?

[Sophia de la luz]

Thanks for the input.

The crossdressing started for me after the marriage and after two kids.

As for our vows, they reflect more of an attitude and approach to life, not delivering on any specific expectations.
So, if my wife started getting violent, not ok.
Most things we would roll with.
I'm sure she'll find something to press a few buttons.

As for the difference between a behavior (clothing choices) and our identity: I really would like to make the case that, yes our behavior can reflect our identity as personal expression, but it's unlikely to change it. Our sense of identity does seem to change overtime, sometimes radically, sometimes very quickly, and why is that such a threat to our partner?
The issue of threat comes from a feeling of being attacked.
Certainly to feel that way, a person is more focused on the benefits of a certain behavior then loving their partner.

This whole conversation for me presupposes that both partners are upfront and honest about crossdressing. The whole suprise them with it after 10 years is really a loaded weapon.

[Kate Simmons]

I would say it has mostly to do with the individuals in the relationship and whether that relationship is based on feelings for each other as people or the implied image that is evident to society.