Definition of a woman

Not all women wear makeup
Not all women wear lingerie
Not all women women paint their fingernails / toenails
Not all women wear dresses or skirts
Not all women go out shopping
Not all women wear high heels
Not all women have big breasts

There is no all-inclusive definition of what a woman is. Not even what's between her legs. We've proven that one ourselves.

I believe it's up to us to make our own definition of the female aspects of our personalities, without following a guideline. Doing what other women do doesn't make you a woman.. your true gender is however you feel inside.

The best way to feel good about yourself is being yourself and doing things you enjoy without needing anyone to tell you that you are doing the right thing. I would know, it's far too easy to fall into this trap of being dependent on other's opinions. When you're able to cast that aside is when you really discover yourself and what makes you happy.

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Originally Posted by MentalMercury

Not all women wear makeup
Not all women wear lingerie
Not all women women paint their fingernails / toenails
Not all women wear dresses or skirts
Not all women go out shopping
Not all women wear high heels
Not all women have big breasts

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Who said they did dear?

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Not all women wear makeup
Not all women wear lingerie
Not all women women paint their fingernails / toenails
Not all women wear dresses or skirts
Not all women go out shopping
Not all women wear high heels
Not all women have big breasts

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Very true, but the female in me does! Whereas the trappings don't make the person, I have always been very attracted to all of these things. Therefore, when I dress, I naturally gravitate towards wearing dresses, heels, makeup, nails, etc.

But ya gotta be yourself. What's good for the goose ain't good for the ga.....wait, yes it is! :D

This gander loves what's good for the goose!

I do not think that we can ever make ourselves into a woman - but we can

try to make a presentation of a woman/female/girl/lady by using the body and

figure and height and weight as best we can with what we have to work with

that will attempt to satisfy that inner longing of our soul which cries out that

we have to do this because it is so much a part of us - is this our definition

of what we think a woman should look like - I don't think so ! I believe that

what we attempt to create is that sense of femininity that has been deeply

within us from birth - we are just expressing the "girl" within us IF we had

been born as a female - as it is we were born with male and female personas

that are closer to 50-50 that other people - we are just trying to be

ourselves - I know I am - JoAnne is as much a part of me as is my male

persona - I am only trying to deal with both as best I can


JoAnne Wheeler

no all-inclusive definition...
OK, but to the population at large a woman is a person who has a female reproductive tract and can potentially conceive and give birth to children.
I know that doesn't help your point, but that's the trouble with definitions, and labels.
We are what we are.

Well, we can do things in what we think and feel is in the spirit of being a woman but there really is no substitute for the real thing no matter how much we may mimic. Some things are just inherent and intrinsic and cannot be copied. The same thing is true about us as the gals are prone to tell us, but, just like guys, we never listen.:)

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Originally Posted by MentalMercury

The best way to feel good about yourself is being yourself and doing things you enjoy without needing anyone to tell you that you are doing the right thing.

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Absolutely! I remember when I was in the closet it, I didn't get this concept at all. I so wanted to express myself differently from what this bi-gendered world expects of me, yet somehow I just couldn't bring myself to do it. :sad:

I did (and still do) want to dress fully, but what I want to do the most is just "be me" and do the things I like to do, without having to explain myself ... especially if they are things that are considered to be outside of the normal expectations for a guy in this world (i.e. enjoying girly things which includes dressing femininely).

That's the thing that makes me nervous the most when I'm out en femme in regular mainstream places, not so much that people will "read" me, but that they will take offense or maybe not take offense but say something and question me, and then I'll feel like I have to explain myself, and I shouldn't have to do that. I eat a vegan diet, and I sometimes get the same thing when I'm out at dinner with people. I don't want to have to explain why I choose not to eat any animal protein. Why can't I just be different and it be "normal" to have variation? :sad:

Woman - 1) an individual identified by other members of society as being a member of the feminine gender class 2) an individual who identifies as being a member of the feminine gender class 3) an adult female.

From the practical point of view, definition 1 seems to be the day to day functional definition of Woman. Definition 2 seems to be a political definition created by the transgendered community and definition 3 I would call a technical and legal definition but not a practical day to day one.

For me, definition 1 is both real and sufficient.

Marla

The best way to feel good about yourself is being yourself and doing things you enjoy without needing anyone to tell you that you are doing the right thing. I would know, it's far too easy to fall into this trap of being dependent on other's opinions. When you're able to cast that aside is when you really discover yourself and what makes you happy.[/QUOTE]

it just becomes a non issue after a while. I love to dress up and feel pretty and sexy, but I am just as happy in my jeans and tee shirt. When I wake up in the morning i don't even think about being a boy, or being a girl. I am just me. On the weekends I don't feel like I have to put on my make-up. If I do, it's because I want to.. no other reason. IMHO, and we're talking about me here. Once I established myself and began to feel like my ducks were starting to line up,a kind of calm set in. I found a job that accepted who I am.. no issue there. I didn't have a SO win over, or hope would be accepting, no issue there. family and friends either fell on one side of the line or the other, non issue. Things just start to mesh, without having to really think about them.

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Originally Posted by MentalMercury

Not all women wear makeup
Not all women wear lingerie
...
...

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Jolan Tru,

On the other side, not all men wear pants... You stated well-known facts, but the purpose of your thread is still unknown.

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Originally Posted by MentalMercury

Not all women wear makeup
Not all women wear lingerie
Not all women women paint their fingernails / toenails
Not all women wear dresses or skirts
Not all women go out shopping
Not all women wear high heels
Not all women have big breasts

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sounds like a description of a MAN, to me!:doh:

As far as feelings, I never feel like a woman. The best I can HOPE FOR, is to resemble one!:daydreaming:

And I need EVERYTHING you mention, and a LOT MORE, to have ANY CHANCE of succeeding at that!:brolleyes:

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Originally Posted by marla01

Woman - 1) an individual identified by other members of society as being a member of the feminine gender class 2) an individual who identifies as being a member of the feminine gender class 3) an adult female.

From the practical point of view, definition 1 seems to be the day to day functional definition of Woman. Definition 2 seems to be a political definition created by the transgendered community and definition 3 I would call a technical and legal definition but not a practical day to day one.

For me, definition 1 is both real and sufficient.

Marla

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Thanks for the definition. I would cut that to two. 1) A woman is a biological definition and scriptural. 3). Feminine is a cultural difinition whic means the traits that women have. The problem, as I see, it that we mix the two as if it was the same. But then there is a problem. Derived from female refers in all cases as having toe ability to conceive and reproduce.

Si I guess there is no perfect thought. I am just who I am and becoming more androginist all the time. Peace, Jill

I liked reading all of the replies. I just posted that because I've been hearing some pretty ignorant comments from people lately.. my own family for example.

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Originally Posted by TGMarla

Very true, but the female in me does! Whereas the trappings don't make the person, I have always been very attracted to all of these things. Therefore, when I dress, I naturally gravitate towards wearing dresses, heels, makeup, nails, etc.

But ya gotta be yourself. What's good for the goose ain't good for the ga.....wait, yes it is! :D

This gander loves what's good for the goose!

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exactly! you like it, you do it.

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Originally Posted by Ruth

no all-inclusive definition...
OK, but to the population at large a woman is a person who has a female reproductive tract and can potentially conceive and give birth to children.
I know that doesn't help your point, but that's the trouble with definitions, and labels.
We are what we are.

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I find the population's general definition entirely inadequate, I also know it is not humanly possible to do away with labels. That's why I think it's important to educate people when given the chance. It's the only way to break down untrue stereotypes and get people comfortable with TG-ism and help them realize everything is not so black and white.

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Originally Posted by docrobbysherry

sounds like a description of a MAN, to me!:doh:

As far as feelings, I never feel like a woman. The best I can HOPE FOR, is to resemble one!:daydreaming:

And I need EVERYTHING you mention, and a LOT MORE, to have ANY CHANCE of succeeding at that!:brolleyes:

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well what's your goal? to feel like a woman or look like one? or both? looks to me like you do what makes you happy, and that's whats important right?

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Originally Posted by marla01

Woman -
1) an individual identified by other members of society as being a member of the feminine gender class
2) an individual who identifies as being a member of the feminine gender class
3) an adult female.

From the practical point of view, definition 1 seems to be the day to day functional definition of Woman. Definition 2 seems to be a political definition created by the transgendered community and definition 3 I would call a technical and legal definition but not a practical day to day one.

For me, definition 1 is both real and sufficient.

Marla

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My take-
1. "gender is what people label you as" , I'd say it's very true in regards to your social interactions only

2. "gender is what you label yourself as" this is the definiton that takes into account that you experience your gender, I like this one the most, because I don't want to let people tell me what I am or how I should be.

3. that one's just silly

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Originally Posted by MentalMercury

There is no all-inclusive definition of what a woman is.

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Yep. That would be right :)

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Originally Posted by JoAnne Wheeler

1) I do not think that we can ever make ourselves into a woman

2) what we attempt to create is that sense of femininity that has been deeply within us from birth

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1) Given my first point above - yes we can :)
2) You can't "create" a sense of something if you believe it is already "deeply" within you. Notwithstanding the fact that we can't define that sense, you're either a woman or you're not. Each one of us knows if this is the case or not. I am. It seems quite simple really. :)

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Originally Posted by Ruth

...but that's the trouble with definitions

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Yep. They are fraught with difficulties and exceptions. And the absolute killer? You come up with a definition and someone will comes along and mess with your definition, without any difficulty.

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Originally Posted by Arianna Daniels

there really is no substitute for the real thing no matter how much we may mimic. Some things are just inherent and intrinsic and cannot be copied.

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But, given that we can't define the real thing, then who's copying? So, there are about 3 billion "women" on the planet. Give or take a few either way. Bet you there's 3 billion definitions of the term "woman". Last year I added another. It's a definition that is usually just called "Sarah..." :)

Sarah...

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Originally Posted by Sarah...

But, given that we can't define the real thing, then who's copying? So, there are about 3 billion "women" on the planet. Give or take a few either way. Bet you there's 3 billion definitions of the term "woman". Last year I added another. It's a definition that is usually just called "Sarah..." :)

Sarah...

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I love that reply! That is what I feel like I was getting at