Should we have to chose to present as either female or male?

I would like to put that question to a vote please. Should we as individuals have to chose to present as either male or female consistently? I am not a cross dresser, but a transsexual, mtf, who has not had surgery and has not taken hormones. I am a genetic male on the outside, but there is definitely a woman residing within this body. I don't always present as a male or a female sometimes I am in this nebulous in between realm that is androgynous. When I am presenting as what I consider male I have been told that I look definitely gay or androgynous. My problem is that some people have told me that I need to make a choice to present as either a man or a woman, but I don't always feel that I am either and consequently the androgynous me appears. In truth I am neither because I am both. I have also been told that people in general are afraid of something they are unsure of and that is why I would be better off making a clear choice so that I fit more neatly into the binary construct that society as a whole adheres to never mind the reality that this construct is flawed because there are more than two genders. I am opposed to that idea and wish that I would be left alone to be simply me whatever it is from day to day or minute to minute. I will admit that it feels good not to get the outside pressure from strangers staring or giving me hostile looks or worse yet ridicule on those occasions when I do make a clear choice to side on either the male or female side of the divide, but again I'd rather not have to stay in one camp or the other all the time. I am giving serious thought to transitioning and obviously at that time I will have made the choice, but in the meantime I would just like to be left alone. What do you all think?

Idealy, we would be free to present ourselves as we please, and the meddling, interferring know-it-all busybodies would be forced to leave us alone. I would love to present male one day and female the next. Never have tried androgany, so I can't comment on that. It's just my nature to be something all the way.

But as a practial matter we live in a world full of people terrified of uncertainty, and unfortunately we have to take their feeling into account. It's true that a day of constant discomfort for us may not be worth sparing them momentary discomfort, but they can in turn make us very uncomfortable. The only solution I have is to try and find a balance. Whether I present as male or female I am presenting part of my true self, but neither one is the whole me.

Are the people "advising" you telling you to be either male or female all the time, or just be consistent with however you are presenting at the moment? In either case, once you have explained to them who you are, be true to yourself while staying safe. Easier said than done, I know.

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Originally Posted by Marcie Close

. . . some people have told me that I need to make a choice to present as either a man or a woman, . . .

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Simply put; They're wrong! You are correct about people fearing what they can't understand or put in the appropriate 'box' however. That is just something that you're going to have to live with.

So, live with and for yourself, not others and their opinions.

Kathi

I agree that you should be able to live and present yourself as you wish. That being said, in the real world where we live and play, most of us also work, and also need to work in order to be able to live and play. So, if one can be themselves at all times and still work, then go for it. If someone needs the work and their changing presentations causes issues associated with that work, then that person needs to make a decision to fight it, adapt as best possible, look for another more tolerant employer, or accept the not so perfect situation until a later date when the decision will be made to live one way or another. So, using Kathi's words in a different way, you can still live with and for yourself, but adapt somewhat during your transition decision time period for the real world associated with an income. If you are not talking about work, but rather social situations, and you are basically out to others of importance to you, then tell all the others to stuff it where the sun doesn't shine. I hope that makes sense.

Honestly, I think you're entitled to present however you choose. Its pointless to try to avoid the disapproval of some people. Narrow minded individuals will find something to bitch about, despite your best efforts. So, be true to yourself and let the rest take care of themselves.

This a lot like a thread that I was going to start, WHY,WHY,WHY is it if a woman puts on a mans suit and dresses like a man she is still accepted as a woman not a lesbian or gay but a woman, but when a man puts on a woman"s clothes he is considered gay and marked that way and not accepted as either male or female ,but ridiculed as wearing women"s clothes.
Millie

Should we have to chose to present as either female or male?
In a word - NOPE !

Take your time to get all the formation you need, years in fact. In the mean time just enjoy who you are, just be you :)
Maybe talk to a professional, they can help you cut through your feelings and emotions quicker then doing by yourself.

'til then I wish you nothing but the best.
v.

There is no universal dress code. There are laws about how much of your body you must cover, but not about what you cover it with!

Of course, there is a concept called "taste"! Even that is in the eye of the beholder, so the only one you have to be "tasteful" for is yourself!

tina

NO, NO, NO!! I present all the time as a male, but a great deal of that same time I am dressed totally feminine. That of course means that I am definitely a man dressed enfemme!! Been going out that way for the last 6 years and have never had any problems!! As others have said, be yourself and do what YOU want to do!! You dress to please yourself, not others!!

short answer...no

we should all express our own gender and be celebrated equally..but we should also have world peace and food on every table...

the gender binary is generally just the way it is, and we can conform to it, or we can choose to be exceptions to the rule... and deal with the consequences, even though its unfair..

...if you are transsexual, what are you accomplishing by be androgynous?

I think you should "present" however you feel like it: male, female, or in between. As for me, I cannot present female (yet) but I am moving to an in between state. I wear softer colors out, jewelry, and now even makeup on weekends and I am both comfortable and happy. I even went so far as to color my hair this past weekend and I loved it but as usual I had to get it cut for work which cut off most of the coloring. I hope you continue to do what you feel comfortable with.

Danni

I seem to remember a story on the news out of Philadelphia. There was a man arrested (and presented on the news) for appearing in public in a women's one piece swimming suit. I don't quite remember what the charges were, but either way, he was arrested. (I think it was indecent exposure).
I have been getting a bit more adventurous...wearing clear mascara, panties 24/7, toenails painted (but covered), and sports bras when I ride my bike to work out. I could never pass, for many reasons, so I have no intention of trying. I do sleep in nighties, and wear yoga pants around the house, and I just got some capris to wear at home.
It's frustrating that I can't always wear what I am comfortable in due to what is viewed as "acceptable".

"WHY is it if a woman puts on a mans suit and dresses like a man she is still accepted as a woman not a lesbian or gay but a woman, but when a man puts on a woman"s clothes he is considered gay and marked that way and not accepted as either male or female ,but ridiculed as wearing women"s clothes.
Millie"

Because our culture, like most others, considers males to be superior to females. Ergo, a male who chooses to present or live like a female is diminishing himself. The converse is a female aspiring to the superior maleness, so it's not so objectionable. Sexism, like racism, dies hard, it seems...

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Originally Posted by Marcie Close

Should we as individuals have to chose to present as either male or female consistently?

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Slightly off topic, some of you might already know that when chinese speak english they often confuse between he and she. In Chinese, there is no word like she or he and every one is referred by a word equivalent to "it". A sample translation would be like this:

Wife: Zing Hu is my best friend. I went with "it" to movie and it paid for the movie tickets too and we went shopping and blah blah
Husband: Is Zing Hu a guy or gal?
Wife: "It" is a girl.

So, gender confusion in language is plus for androgynous persons.

I think people should be forced to wear what ever they want!!

It really has come the point of society telling us how we should or should not present ourselves, not how we would like to be presented.
Just more protection from our selb\ves.
HAAAAAA!

If society accepted that all clothing was no longer related to either gender, then crossdressing would cease to exist.

I think that androgeny is part of TG/TV/CD. I prefer androgenous appearances when not in total female mode. Popular clothing stores offer very andro/femme shapes in the men's section. I also wear a little bit of makeup on a regular basis only to be femme/fresh looking. Everyone is obviously aloud to pursue whatever presentation they'd like, but androgeny helps to blur the binary between male and female. (it also makes it much easier to go out "En Femme" because you realize how much people really don't care!)

You shouldn't have to, and in fact you don't.

People care much less about what you wear than you think.

I think you should always just be yourself and be true to yourself regardless of which "camp" you seem to be in. If others cannot relate to who you are as a person, then it is their problem and not yours my friend. Most members of what we term "society" really need to look at others as people and not as this, that or the other thing. :)

Hi Marcie, although I choose to present consistently as my gender (not my natal sex), put me down for a no vote.

Please forgive me if I'm misreading your post, but from what you say is it possible that rather than transsexual you are actually either dual-gender or bi-gender? (I must admit I'm not really clear about the distinction between the two). You do not appear to be comfortable with being solely male or solely female so perhaps you are neither and both at the same time.

There are a few members who identify this way and the SO one of the mods is dual gender.

For the practicalities of earning a living, you may well have to conform to the stereotypes during working hours, but why should you not express both genders if that is who you really are?

Transition is not for everyone, most of us who are in transition or have completed it started because we did not have any options left and, as one person put it so well, just felt a dead sick feeling on the inside when we had to present as male. It doesn't seem to me from what I read in your post that you are at that point, so could it be an idea to explore the possibility that you are dual/bi gender rather than necessarily TS?

I wish to present as me... depending on the situation... so I present usually as male... but I get a real buzz out of going walkabout as Kaz. I HAVE NO DESIRE WHATSOEVER to present full time as Kaz, though it is a fantasy. The reality is that I am a guy with a CV who needs to earn... So I'll go with that. But I am in my fifties... Now if I was 21 in today's environment... different choices!

Hi,

As to clothes most womens clothes in the context of fitting are womens not mens unless your body is the same as a woman the tops , are male clothes going to fit a woman no because they dont take in to account of breasts many women have smaller bodys so then would a females clothes fit a male of same size with out changeing the shape hips breasts shoes a shape of over all body shape .

Jos is smaller than i a size 8 now her clothes wont fit me or shoes . her bras size 12 b cup. = 34 in's, skirt = 27 ,1 / 2 in's size 8 waist , hips 32 ,1 / 2 in's .

Mine are far to big for her, bras 16 d = bust 41 in's skirt 16 = 34 1 / 2 in's. waist , hips 38 ,1 / 2 in's. & we look different. i weigh in at 11 stone = 154 lbs Jos at 8 stone = 128 lb's , so clothes have to be tailered for both of us as to shape even tho im a woman as well.

The fabric can be the same not the shape so another difference between male to female when you look at the male shape compared to a female. in the natrual. & there are some male clothes i cant wear because of my body shape & they would look so wrong on me ,

An after thought i could wear male clothes tho dont & no one would care as they know me as a person who is a woman even tho i still do my building & seen in overalls like a woman acrose the road who does while working on her house. orange just like mine are,,,

...noeleena...

I agree with Karren, make dress dress in what ever I want!
Tina B.