Cause or Effect???

Hi all,

Recently had a long and interesting conversation with the wife. She varies wildly between acceptance (and fun) and abhorrence / disgust. She is unaccepting of my assurance that I am not transsexual, do not want anything 'chopped off' and am happy and content to occasionally cross dress. There have been a few recent television shows about military transsexuals and their struggles for acceptance and this has affected her judgement. She is convinced I am on a slippery slope to surgery, and for her, divorce and separation, unhappiness and loneliness...

As part of her argument, she brought up the fact that I have less hair in my body than she does. I have none on my legs below mid thigh, none on my chest and wispy hair on my arms. I shave my head due little or no growth and have no hope growing a moustache or beard.

I do not have alopecia, I do not have any medical causes, no ailments offer explanation, it is, according to the doctor, purely genetic. Now I do have about an A cup man boob, the leftover of being extremely fit and muscular, (I was a clearance diver, the Aussie equivalent to a navy seal and swam many, many, many hundreds of miles both under and on the ocean...) but have done nothing to accentuate. I 'loosely' fit a 38a bra and I am more that happy with that. I have no forms and cannot see me buying any.

I had no problems in then bedroom department, fathering three boys without much trial. My wife, however, seems to think that I am genetically predisposed to gender confusion by mere physical evidence alone. I am at a loss for a counter argument.

I am not transsexual, I have not ever had the feeling or belief that I am a woman trapped in a mans body. I do however have difficulty in articulating exactly what I dress for. Thrill, comfort, normalcy, erotica, relaxation, relief, satisfaction, ... none are right, none are wrong... I do not have the gender dysphoria I read about in others but I suffer the 'pink fog'.

I don't 'pass', and doubt I will ever 'pass' and, other than underdressing, do not venture out in anything but drab.

Can anyone offer any assistance??? Is there validity to this claim? Does anyone else have a similar lack of body hair? Can there be a genetic link? Is an innate inability to grow hair an indicator. I think not but can not postulate a credible argument against.

...

Thanks...

Your wife is trying to rationalise the irrational. She, like the rest of the non-crossdressing world, assumes dressing as a woman means you want to be a woman. It doesn't matter that your lips are moving and words are coming out. The proof is all around her - those who wear women's clothing are women. Your lack of hair is just an easy target to get you to 'admit' this. Believe me, I still do this. My H dares to move a foot too daintily (he doesn't, but I'd swear he did!) and I'm informing him that he's walking like a girl, therefore he is.

This doesn't go away easily either. Maybe ever. Sorry to share the harsh truth here, but for some of us GGs, this is harder to live with than Russell Crowe on a boy's night out. It's hell and there's no sugar coating it. Add to this the fact you've had an uber masculine job and been her uber masculine man and you're now wearing dresses and relishing your man boobs (for the record, women loathe man boobs) and to your wife, you're one week short of transition.

And you know, I don't know the answer to this. I still think my H will fall off the deep end one day and go get 'the chop'. It seems a likely solution to what I see as a lifetime problem. Surely he can't enjoy living this way?

And maybe that's what your wife wants to hear? That you DO enjoy things the way they are, exactly as they are now and nothing will ever progress or change. That you are absolutely certain of who you are and that's who you will always be.

But how many here can truthfully say this?

Quote:

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Is an innate inability to grow hair an indicator. I think not but can not postulate a credible argument against.

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There's no known genetic indicator for being transgender and transitioning. There may BE a genetic indicator, but nobody's found it yet. However, nobody really seems to care about finding such an indicator...

A lot of us are really hairy, and face long bouts of laser hair removal and electrolysis. Someone like you would be considered very lucky, as a matter of fact.

Some people are simply not very hairy.

Hi Donna,

Rest assured there is no genetic link between lack of body hair and CDing. I am "wolf man hairy" top to bottom. My dad was like you with minimal almost non-existent body hair. I get the body hair from my mom's side of the family as all my uncles are mountain man hairy.

Hugs

Isha

Tinkerbell hit the nail on the head.
No matter what you say, she's convinced herself. Try talking to a wall. The conversation is the same, except the wall doesn't change expression.
In the meantime, enjoy your lack of body hair. I wish it were me and not the sasquatch that I am.

It is interesting that both your wife and Tinkerbell think that "the chop" is in your future. If that was true, why haven't all the over 65 dressers who are members been to the chopping block? The spectrum of dressing is way to broad for one person regardless of gender to extend their personal experiences to generalizations.

Very hard to do anything but add to Tinkerbell's comprehensive reply.

I have no known diseases or maladies that cause my lack of hair growth on my legs.
I have minimal arm and chest hair also.
I do not suffer from male pattern baldness although it is not as thick and luxuriant as it was when I was twenty.

Rather than trying to convince your wife of anything, encourage her to broaden her sources of reference. One tv show on military transsexuals is hardly a comprehensive study of gender variation.

The only thing that has had any sway with my wife that I will never chop anything off is by pointing out how much I enjoy dressing as both genders. It would be pointless for me to transition as I would then cross dress as a man. The hard thing is that the vast majority of cross dressers never transition, but most people who do transition started off "just" cross dressing. So it does appear to be a slippery slope, but it really isn't. I like being a man, but occasionally I like dressing as a woman. Your lack of body hair does not indicate anything except that I am jealous!

linking body hair to cross dressing is not more valid than linking eye color to cross dressing. It's called coincidence. This reminds me of every search for Noah's arc ever documented. 100% of the time, the arc is found and every time, it is in a different place. Searchers find their answer because they need an answer. Your wife needs an answer and until the gene for cross dressing is identified, those looking for an answer will be stymied.

As another GG, I had to weigh in on this because I could not stomach allowing Tinkerbell to speak for all women.
I am a woman and I am married to a cross dresser, Nadine, with whom I have had a discussion with about this subject. I asked, she confidently told me that she enjoyed being a man who occasionally dresses as a woman. I know my spouse and understand that she spent time really contemplated this and came to a conclusion. I love her and believe she knows herself. I would communicate this to your wife as clearly as possible.
You might want to point her to the internet so she can investigate the truth about body hair and genetics. Maybe real science will help her get over this myth in her head. Good luck! :)
On another note, not all women "loathe man boobs". There is nothing that ALL women do. We are not "the Borg" and do not think as a whole unit with only one opinion.
Take care! Hugs!

Hi Donna, For me , It's just who I am & It's just what I do.

Other than that I'm as normal as the next guy.

Some people don't seem to accept that you can happily be a boy that likes to be a girl sometimes. This annoyed me because one of my SO's friends has this attitude and is convinced the only way forward for me would be surgery and I'll only be happy when I accept it. This caused my SO to start doubting the relationship and our our future but she now realizes it's just something I do. I think she realizes that since I came out to her (Fairly early in the relationship - I think this is key as well) I've been happier around her as Flik at home sometimes and in drab when out.

I guess all alcoholics start drinking but not all drinkers become alcoholics

Hi Donna,

It isn't something you can prove or disprove. It is simply your wife expressing her feelings or fears. Acknowledging her feelings and showing compassion is probably the best response.

My wife has expressed very similar feelings and thoughts about me also. I figure it is sometimes her way of trying to fit things together and rationalise the situation from her perspective, to gauge where she/we may be heading or not. I know she is not always right but then nor am I; however, I do think she opens similar suggestions in regard to transitioning/the chop (for example) simply to put the puzzle together. I'm interested to see where this goes for you both. Cheers.

Hi Donna

First of all I am wildly jealous of your lack of body hair; if there's one thing I've hated about myself for as long as I can remember, it's my body hair! :cry: I joked to my SO the other day that if I won the Lottery the first thing I'd do is have everything below my eyelids lasered off!!!

But the fear your wife is expressing is real, at least to her, and so has to be addressed, calmly, gently, compassionately, and often! Ultimately she has to deal with these fears herself, she's the only one who can put them behind her, but hopefully with your enthusiastic support you can get through this together!

Good luck to you both! :)
Paula

Everyone,

Thanks so much for the commentary, advice, input and totally friendly and constructive support. It is so good to know you are not alone. My wife and I have read through all the posts and I really think it has done a lot... It is difficult to read my wife, but I do believe that she is less convinced and more open minded. Time will be the final judge but I am more confident.

I am forming the opinion that perhaps we need to talk to a third party, perhaps another couple in a similar 'situation'. There is a local group here... Is it time to make that move??? I am currently so far in the closet, I'll need to go through all of Narnia just to find the way out.

There is one thing I probably did not articulate well, that being that I am really two extremes... I am still, as tinkerbell suggests the 'uber male'. I may not be paid now for how far I can swim, how much I can carry and how many bad guys need to be in fear when I arrive. I am still in a 'blue flamer' environment, leading, instructing and passing on my experience in federal law enforcement, kicking in doors, cuffing crims and giving defence lawyers a hard time... We joke that the job has real CDI (Chicks Dig It) value... At home I can fix everything from computers to wiring, I swing hammers in a tool belt building extensions and plumbing new bathrooms, I rebuild classic cars and ride big bikes with a few different (law enforcement or social) biker groups. But under the overalls and leathers there is panties and a bra and toenails are painted pink.

I would really like to be totally passable when dressed only because I do not like to do things in half measures. Perhaps its a military thing, don't matter what you do, be the best at it or die trying!!! I know that can never happen and that is frustrating. At this stage acceptance is a good goal and I am certainly further down that track than before.

I know, I am a psychologists dream!!!!

Anyway thanks everyone...

If your wife won't believe the doctor (about the lack of body hair), she's unlikely to believe anything she reads on a crossdresse forum. If the doctor hasn't told her directly, ask him to.

Just assure your wife that everyday is proof of your intentions. It's sad that you have to prove yourself on a daily basis, but that appears to be your conundrum. Maybe over time, after she sees that you've made no ovations towards transition, she will see that her fears are unfounded. But if you two have not attended gender counseling, then I would suggest it. My self acceptance hit its first peak when i sought out help. I do think that if she were to hear a doctors assessment about where you are on the gender spectrum ,it may increase her understanding. I am lifted by the fact that she is reading this thread with you, and that shows that she has a level of open mindedness, and intent to learn about what makes you tick. I hope she is able to find peace with this aspect of who you are.

Your wife is just trying to rationalize your condition, and since you haven't come up with a more rational explanation, she has her own. Like many others, they think we dress up in women's clothing because we want to be women.... Hummm, seems reasonable on the surface. However I believe it is wrong.

Explain to your wife that you are not going to transition because; (1) you are attracted to women, not men, (2) your brain is male, responds like a male, (see link below), and (3) you value your masculine virtues (you are designed to provide and protect those you love). What makes you different from most men is just a product of synaptogenesis and neural pruning. Cross-dressing is just a form of synesthesia. Synesthesia is a neurological phenomenon in which stimulation of one sensory pathway leads to automatic, involuntary experiences in a second sensory pathway. So while most men can wear women's clothing and not feel anything special, it is different for us. When we wear some women's clothing our brain responds by releasing dopamine, serotonin, oxytocin and a host of other neurotransmitters which produce sensations of well being, pleasure, gratification and bonding. It is just as cross-dressing is interpreted by your brain as actual contact with a female.

I believe that for most of us, this neurological hard-wiring occurs in the first few years of our life. Its as if we are born sensitive little boys who crave their mother's love, and we associate our mother's feel with comfort, bonding, etc. Our brain develops neural connects that associate feminine clothing with our mothers touch. Then when we hit puberty and our testosterone levels go crazy, it produces a different effect. Our cross-dressing is still associated with contact with a female, but that means it becomes sexually stimulating. As we get older and our testosterone levels come back down, our cross-dressing persists, but now it is all about comfort, a sense of well-being, and bonding.

Your wife needs to understand that you cross-dress not because you want to be a woman, but because your brain is releasing pleasurable neurotransmitters. It's just the way your brain was hard-wired from childhood.
http://www.webmd.com/balance/feature...-brains-differ

The reason your wife is so freaked out is because this threatens everything she's felt is most important in her entire life. Women focus on finding a husband, having kids, marriage, family. When they find out anything that can throw a wrench into the works permanently, they often panic, because the vast majority of the time their age prevents them from being in the position of choosing another partner. As women get older, fewer and fewer men EVER approach them, as opposed to say when they are 22 and get hit on 50 times a day. Then add to that the insane media circus of the tabloid shows, Jerry Springer type stuff with nutty TG people, and it's no wonder your wife is going out of her mind. all you can do is keep reassuring her. Becuase remember, lots of CD'ers don't know why they do it, so the slippery slope is always a possibility until you can absolutely positively rule it out by knowing why you're NOT TS.