What is lingerie?

I'll throw in my definition here, just to get things started. Hopefully others will reply to this thread. No. I'm not trying to start a debate here, but rather I just want to bring out the richness of diversity that I believe exists in this community. (Even though I've been a member here less than a week,I've been watching this site off-and-on for several months so I'm rather familiar with it).

The following is a quote from my auto-bio in the section titled "clothing preferences": "Lingerie is a French word meaning underwear, independent of gender assignment. However my definition of that term also includes sleepwear.

Just so that you know, my gender assignment to all clothing regardless of fabric or color or style or how it is advertised or displayed for sale, is based on the following:

1) I call all clothing gender neutral, until it is actually being worn by someone.
2) I call all clothing gender specific (men's clothing or women's clothing) only while it
is actually being worn by a specific man or woman. As an example, if a guy wears a
dress (some men occasionally do), then I call it a guy's dress. And if a woman would
wear the exact same dress, then I'd call it a woman's dress.
3) What the advertisers / sellers say about their clothing is merely an opinion, as opposed to fact. Their opinion(s) of course they have a right to express." End
quote.

I like the way you think.

"They're not women's clothes.They're my clothes. I bought them." - Eddie Izzard

How does that all work out when you do to a multistory department store and you're looking for a particular garment to wear? Most societies, if not all, establish some norms and expectations of behavior. Of course, anyone is free to ignore those boundaries. If there were no boundaries, then a site like this would not exist. You're free to call any garment whatever you want.

Your characterization of a dress is confusing. If a dress were to be worn by either a male or female under a societal norm, then it would be just a dress and nothing more or less. A teenage boy could wear a floor length evening gown to his prom, and, his date could wear a tuxedo if she so chose, Or, they both could wear evening gowns and nothing more would be said either. Or both wear tuxes.

Doesn't work for me. If I want a dress or lingerie? I want to be able to find them in one place in a store or online.

It makes no sense to me to have look in both the men's and women's sections for those articles.:doh:

As far as what u call them, Linda? I could care less if think of lingerie as male wear or macaroni!:heehee:

I think the operative word in Stephanie47's reply is "societal norm". As to my feelings about that, let me say that I'm a challenger of the status quo, or of social conventions, rather than a defender of same. Always have been, always will be.

Some however will try to label me as a "rebel". I say that there can be no rebellion, hence no rebels, unless there is legitimate authority in place to rebel against. By "legitimate authority" I mean such as: Your employer if you're on company time, your parents if you're living at their home, your teachers if you're on school property, the officer who pulls you over for doing 60 in a 50, your CO if you're in the military, and so on. My beef isn't with "legitimate authority", but rather with ersatz authority known as the status quo or social conventions. Perhaps "maverick" instead of "rebel" is a more accurate description of my personality. Although most people treat the status quo and all of its "social conventions" as legitimate authority in their lives, I do not. I've chosen the "road less traveled" and moreover I totally embrace that place. If you the reader regard yourself as one loyal to the status quo or to social conventions, then let's not let our differences stand in the way of our friendship.

hello Linda,
you are right - it is originally the French word for underwear.
in the UK it seems to be used for the luxury end of the female underwear market - silky & lacy things rather than everyday cotton garments
luv J

Lingerie has always been a female label , I usually associate it with underwear first and then sleepwear ( nighties ) . The old department stores always had a lingerie section and that's where the big mystique starts for many of us , just venturing into them pretending you were lost , I must admit when I was younger it was like stepping into a little bit of heaven .

I'm not interested in the fact men may have an entitlement to wear them , to me they are feminine .

Oh great. Now I need to worry about mis-gendering my underwear!

I don't worry about. If it came out of the women's section it must be women's. I can still wear it if I want to.

I’m confused about this post... “what is lingerie?” Is a very simple question to answer. It has a finite definition in English: women’s undergarments and sleepwear. Great that that arrangement of letters forms a word with is different meaning in a different language, but there are a lot of words like that.

And what they say about clothing is NOT just an opinion. Those garments for different sexes are cut and tailored in different ways to accommodate different body shapes. You can wear a dress and call it a men’s dress, but unless it was specifically constructed to fit a man, that’s a women’s garment. I can drive a subcompact fast and call it a sports car, but that doesn’t make it a sports car. If you want to imgaine that those garments are made for everyone to wear, then you have that right, bit it doesn’t make you correct.

I always have a giggle when I see a sign in a department store that says, "Women's Dresses". So where are the men's dresses?
Likewise "Women's Lingerie".
Pronounced oddly, " Long ger Aye".

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by lindapantyboy

1) I call all clothing gender neutral, until it is actually being worn by someone.
2) I call all clothing gender specific (men's clothing or women's clothing) only while it
is actually being worn by a specific man or woman.
3) What the advertisers / sellers say about their clothing is merely an opinion, as opposed to fact. Their opinion(s) of course they have a right to express." End
quote.

---

You are expressing your opinion and ignoring these facts.

1. Genetic Male and Female bodies are different
2. The difference is more than breasts and genitals, that's only the beginning.
3. The differences include muscle mass, fat distribution, average height/weight ratio, and goes all the way down to the bone structure.

Some clothing is designed to fit one gender or the other. Like a long sleeve, fitted, button down woman's blouse that otherwise fits, sleeves will often be too short on a GM. Because a GM's shoulder to arm ratio is different than a GG's.

Now that low-rise is out of style you might notice that jeans designed for women have a higher rise and are cut bigger in the hips and thighs than the same brand, style, and size range of men's. Because a genetic female waist to hip ratio is different than a GM's

I could go on all day about the differences between GM's and GG's and why most (not all) clothes are gender specific.

If lingerie isn't for women and in your eyes unisex then whats the point of wearing clothes of the opposite gender which is what CDing is.
What a futile exercise this is.

Once again Tracii G, you have hit the nail good and straight on the head.

Words have meaning in a language, because the speakers of that language agree to the terms, in order to communicate effectively.

If I say "TREE", you may picture a pine, a maple, an oak, palm, or banyan, depending on your personal feelings, but we all know what the word represents. Substituting one's own definition of a word, for the accepted definition, only makes an imprecise language even more so.

George Carlin did a magnificent bit on language, tracing the term 'shell shock' all the way to 'post traumatic stress disorder', illustrating how changing the terms doesn't change the thing being discussed.

You folks are like a slip........over my head.

Linda, "What is lingerie?" Heaven. I'm not really sure what else you are getting at in your post.

I have an 32A-25-33 figure. I used to hate shopping for clothes. Nothing fit. I needed a belt to hold up my pants.

Now that I wear women's clothes just about everything fits. XS is form fitting and X is a little loose. :) Most women's clothes look great if you have an hourglass figure.
Very few guys have hourglass figures.

To me, lingerie is pretty but not not necessarily durable. And comfort is all over the map. Super soft sleepshirts are really comfortable while thongs are not.

Marion

I love women's lingerie, have always been attracted to it. So when I dress as a woman it works for me. And when I wear it under my "Mens wardrobe" I still love it. I love how it looks and I love that it is made for women and men are welcome to wear it as well! Women are welcome to wear clothes designed for men as well. It is about what makes you happy! More than just clothes.

I just got an email from HerRoom and today is National Lingerie Day. They have a 30% off sale.

I felt a whole treatise on logic and semantics coming on, and then I thought, "Nah, it's Saturday morning in Aotearoa. It's also ANZAC Day. Let it go."

Enjoy your weekend in lockdown, everyone, whatever you may be wearing. :nz::aus: