Something In-between: A GG Perspective on Partial Dressing

Something In-between: A GG Perspective on Partial Dressing

“My husband is beautiful as a man or a woman,
but unbelievably beautiful when he’s something in-between.”
--Helen Boyd, My Husband Betty

I have heard many crossdressers say that being fully en femme is the only experience that truly satisfies them. Their desire is to appear as a woman—with a wig, makeup, breast forms, and perhaps even a corset and padding to complete the feminine image. Some feel so strongly about this that they prefer to dress completely or not all; they find no comfort in wearing a pair of panties and a bra under their male clothing, or adding a few girly details to their masculine appearance for an androgynous look, or simply being a man in a dress. When they look in the mirror, they want to see the illusion of a woman looking back at them, not a man in women’s clothes. When they dress, they want to become someone feminine, someone beautiful--in short, someone else.

Well, each to his—or her—own. There is no call for the antagonism that seems to exist within our community between partial dressers and the “all or nothing” crowd. I understand that some are disturbed by images of crossdressers who make no effort to look female, but I don’t personally share their distaste – and neither do most of the wives and girlfriends I know. In fact, the majority of SOs find it easier to relate to their partner as a guy in girls’ clothes than as a “complete” woman.

Very few of us genuinely perceive our partners as women anyway, even when they are fully dressed. For us, the illusion of femininity that crossdressers see when they look at themselves is invariably undermined by the familiar features and gestures of the man we know so well underneath the clothes. In other words, as far as your wife is concerned, you don’t pass. Does that make you less appealing to her? Probably not. It is your male self she is attracted to, after all. As Kathy GG said about her husband in a recent post, “I don't think of him as a woman and I doubt I ever will. I find him sexy and attractive regardless of what he has on. There is not one version of him which I find 'better', I love all that he is equally.”

I do understand that there is a special thrill in “going all the way.” Angel loves the experience of being fully en femme, and I love to help him achieve a womanly appearance. Assisting him with clothing, jewelry, accessories, and makeup is something I take great pleasure in. Spending time with Angel en femme, whether we go out or have a “girl’s night in,” is very special and rewarding for me. But both of us agree on one point: no matter what Angel is wearing, he—or she—is always the same person. True, when fully dressed, Angel’s feminine characteristics are more obvious and exaggerated. But Angel’s femininity is always present, even without the clothes. It is simply expressed in different ways and to different degrees depending on the circumstances. When Angel is en femme, she is still Angel. There is no “third person” in our marriage.

Perhaps it is because we don’t see Angel as having two distinct identities that we both enjoy seeing him dressed in a way that blurs traditional gender lines. You can call it partial crossdressing, androgyny, gender blending, or any other name you like, but it amounts to being an obvious genetic male dressed in women’s clothes. For example, it is common for Angel to wear women’s jeans, tennis shoes with pink accents, satin-trimmed t-shirts, and women’s cardigans as his normal, everyday clothes. He wears a bra and panties every day, as well as various other undergarments such as camisoles and pantyhose. He may also wear a necklace and earrings, a ladies’ watch, perfume, subtle makeup, and pale nail polish.

However, there is no way he could be mistaken for a woman when wearing these outfits. He appears as what he is: a feminized male, or as I affectionately call him, a girly boy. At home he often wears a blouse and skirt without making any attempt at a complete transformation, and I don’t think it looks silly at all. It may not be what most of us are used to seeing, but if the clothes look attractive on a woman, why can’t they look attractive on a man? Granted there are limits on what a man can wear in public without creating a stir, but that has very little to do with what looks inherently good or bad. It is, rather, a reflection of Western society’s insistence on a rigidly bi-gendered world.

There are some crossdressers who wouldn’t dream of displaying their femininity without simultaneously hiding their maleness, and I respect their preference. But I see it as a wonderful thing that Angel can show on the outside what he is on the inside, even when in male mode. I have always encouraged him to integrate his femininity into his male persona, and the mixed-gender style of dressing is an obvious way to do that. Nearly all of Angel’s clothes are women’s, but some are conspicuously feminine while others--including the ones he wears to work--are more gender neutral. This gives him a lot of freedom regarding his day-to-day appearance, which spans the entire continuum from drab to drag. The only thing he never looks like is a manly man. Ask him and he will tell you that he would rather die than wear a plaid flannel shirt.

I’d like to think that my acceptance has helped Angel to feel more comfortable with mixing masculine and feminine signals. Besides the fact that it seems psychologically healthy to strive for the integration of both genders into one’s identity, I also happen to find it attractive. Very attractive. Okay, downright irresistible. Ever since I can remember, I have been drawn to effeminate men. In my teenage years, those 80’s New Wave icons with their arched eyebrows, ruffled blouses and lipstick used to make me weak in the knees. I have an aversion to rugged masculinity and actually feel disgusted by body hair, big muscles, and tough guy attitudes. On the other hand, I am not a lesbian and don’t feel attracted to members of my own sex. What I like is being able to see, simultaneously, the man within the woman and the woman within the man. It reminds me that I am married to a guy who is delightfully different. I hope Angel knows that I love him whether he looks male or female…..but I’m glad he also feels free to be something in-between.

Brilliant piece Marla. As usual.:thumbsup:

;) I couldn't have said it better!!!

BTW...may I print it out and show my wife????

lol... sorry... but I forgot to say...


THANK YOY! Very nice article...well written...and it is so true... so very true:)

What a deep and thoughtful perspective. You and Angel are very lucky to have eachother.

Amy

I love what you are saying and I also blend my femine side with my male side . I wear a bra and panties every day even to work but I have to wear a uniform at work and wish they had more femine tops as for the pants I bought me some womens jeans

very well said i love to wear my bra and panties everyday makes me fell good about myself. i wish that my wife had the same feeling as you. the two of you are very lucky to have each other

fantastic piece Marla!!!!

it reminds me of a piece i posted a few weeks ago, i think its very relevant here so ill give you the link to the thread:

http://www.crossdressers.com/forums/...ad.php?t=17235

things are still good here....in fcat theyre getting better!!

paula x

Marla, I have no idea how you do it, But you did it again. Fantastic post. :thumbsup: :thumbsup:

Marla,
Well said! Angel is a lucky "girly boy". :)

It's a lovely, and extremely well thought out piece, Marla, and I agree with you wholeheartedly!

Although I almost always "go all out" and try to effiminatize (is that a word? :eek: ) myself as much as possible, I allow for the fact that there are many degrees of transgenderism and crossdressing in our society and on the forum.

But just as there are prejudices in the rest of society, there are also prejudices within the forum itself, and it makes me wonder where people's heads are. Who cares what someone else wears? I don't want people to judge me for looking the way I do, and I try to give others the same respect.

Anyway -- it's a brilliant piece and thank you!

A very well written and thoughtful piece.

What I tend to forget is that I am seeing myself with the perspective of a straight guy, looking at an image of a 'pretend' female. I like women. I don't like men sexually. I do not like the image of a guy in a frock. It makes me cringe. And the more it is an image of a guy in a frock the more uncomfortable it makes me because I see myself in it and think "Am I THAT revolting?" And yet straight women like men. It obvious and so stupid now I think about it that they see all the man signals, and they are the very ones that make me uncomfortable when dressed.

It's a fascinating subject.

Once again you have done a brilliant & very thoughtful thread, your views are always welcomed

:)

Marla you are a very special person and we thank you and Angel for being able to share your thoughts.

Everyone here is an individual and expresses them selves very differently with in a spectrum of dressing en femme. As those before me have expressed, you have put it in words about Angel very elegantly!

As I sit here and type this in my plaid flannel shirt. LOL, I am not kidding. I am not sure why we have such problems with prejudice on this issue on the forum. I have even heard there is alot of it between the TG and TS comunities here in Michigan, with the TS's acussing S/O's of CD's of holding them back from transitioning. I just dont get it. We are all a very unaccepted segment of the world, we should stick together. Whether we dress for sexual reasons, to express a fem side of our personalities, or because we were born the wrong gender, we are all alike in that wearing womens clothes satisfies our needs. Basicly we all crossdress to some extent, even the TS's until they transform. There is also a common bond of not generaly fitting in with society. Even those who do fit in generaly have to work a bit harder.

I can understand a litttle separation between the groups in the threads. I mean I just dont get the idea of getting off just by putting pantyhose on, and the idea of taking hormones and cutting the equipment off gives me the shivers. But I respect the positions of the people that those thing work for. They are my sisters and I will defend their right and need to do it.

This was a good topic Marla. We get enough crap from the rest of the world. We need to ask ourselves why we want to give more to some of our own.

I've got to hand it to you again Marla, fantastic post, incredible insight, and a superb command of the english/american language! Like many others here, we wish our own wives/GFs shared your attitude to our desires, but I suppose it's not too easy for most women to see their husbands in female clothing and be as comfortable with it as you are, and I guess if we're fully dressed, made up, wigged and heeled, it may be even more difficult, at least at first.
As you know, I'm still trying to get my wife to at least talk about her feelings with regard to my CDing (no progress at all for the last 2 months!), so I'm still in the closet. I don't have the full kit yet, but I've smuggled in heels and a proper corset this year, but when I look at myself in the mirror, I'm still not satisfied with the "partial" look; I do want the wig and make-up to complete the picture. However, if I make some progress with my wife, I'll take what I can get, and if it gets into the bedroom, I'd only want the lingerie anyway, the rest would get in the way. Well, perhaps I'd keep the stockings, and maybe the heels for a while, then I'd be a "man-tart"! I've no idea what my wife will ultimately want, or even accept, but I'm trying to find out before I get too old to enjoy it!
You two are an inspiration to us all. Keep up your superb posts; we can all learn a lot from you.

Thanks also to you Paula and Jane for sharing your experiences with us, I missed it first time around. What a great voyage of discovery you've been on! I'll be saving bath these posts for the discussion with my own wife, if I can only get her past first base!

All the best,
Tony

Another excellent post Marla....so well thought out and stated! I always enjoy reading posts from both you and Angel...you are so much in love and obviously made for each other!;)

Hi Marla!

Brilliant as always. ^_^ Thanks for your essay!

I go partial very little because of my situation. Yet I tend to wear nylons, shorts, and polo shirts to work on Saturdays in the summer. The look to me is perfect. It isn't male, isn't female, it's just good. To me that's how I look best. If I could I'd be partial most of the time.

Having CD's all my life over the last few years I've come to enjoy myself as just me. Not really sure if there is a third sex, or if it's just some males can enjoy femininity. Perhaps if we lived in another world where anyone could express themselves as they wanted, this board wouldn't exist. Men wouldn't have to feel guilty, shamed or confused. Being a CD is a huge burden to carry for a lifetime. Why the heck is it such a major social crime for a guy to put on lip stick?

Your insight into the mind of a CD is pretty good. It's almost scary.

I admire confidence.

I think "guys in skirts" who could care less what anyone thinks are pretty sexy.

Loads of high fashion designers have been trying to get men in skirt-like wear for years-- even decades. I'm all for it! It doesn't mean Cds won't have a place anymore-- these guys aren't trying to be femme. They're just adding more choices to their wardrobe. Men around the world wear skirt-like garments every day, and have throughout history.

http://i14.photobucket.com/albums/a3...1045-large.jpg

What I don't find sexually attractive is a frumpy look, or a look that is way too young looking, or if it just doesn't look "right".

I do think, however, someone should wear what makes them feel their best, inside and outside. Since you can't ever please everyone, please yourself!

Nothing is more attractive than confidence. :)

Personally, if robes, skirts, dresses, etc... were socially acceptable norms, I'd wear them all the time. I find Western men's clothing very uncomfortable.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by JennyCD

I find Western men's clothing very uncomfortable.

---

Not to mention boring and repressed! :D

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by susandrea

Not to mention boring and repressed! :D

---

That too :)

Kudos to you, Marla. Thanks for sharing your thoughts. Quite refreshing!

that is a sweet Marla. i hope to let my wife know about bobbie soon, i just hope she is half as accepting as you, angel is very lucky for sure. i am reading my husband betty right now, it is a real eye opener. love bobbie

Angel is a lucky "girly boy" .Marla and Angel has an Ideal relationship and has created a world around each other that works for both of you. And that’s wonderful.

For most of us the real world prevails we have two choices say pass or fail and be subject to snickering or public ridicule and potential harassment.

All of us when we post pics are looking for validation on our efforts, but I’m wondering whether we should be making statements to differentiate whether a girl looks good or is dressing appropriate to head out to face the world.

I’m looking for comments.

Diann
:)

Thank you Marla for an enlightned look at crossdressing. This is an insightful post which I hope will open up people's eyes to think about other possibilities.

Although I am as guilty as anyone else in dressing up to the nines and staring at myself in a mirror, I have come realise that this activity is very narcisstic and ultimately a dead end. Escapism is a wonderful thing but has no grounding in reality. How can a SO become actively involved and find enjoyment in somebody else's self-absorbed fantasy?

Moreover what exactly does this type of behavior have to do with being transgendered? Transgendered means having a mixture of male and female. By trying to emulate woman we are still in essence trying to conform to society's bi-polarization by becoming 100% female. This is as much a lie as trying to pretend we are 100% male.

I cannot deny the rush I get from a complete transformation but I now see this as a game which I now only do when going out in public so that others are not threatened by an unfamilar sight of something inbetween genders. At home I want to be comfortable so no make-up, no jewelry, no corsets, no padding etc. I am just myself but feeling good in some nice clothes.

With regard to our SOs, I agree that they never see us as women at all. That may deflate some people's egos thinking their SOs want to get involved in some hot lesbian action, but it is simply not the case. The reason why there are so much unacceptance from wives is because they always see us as the men they love, never as women. So dressing up to the nines looks terrible, as if we are trying to become another person, not their husbands. How could a wife be comfortable with a stranger? My SO thinks I look sexy in a satin nightie but is standoffish when I am in full drag. The more of me which shows through, the easier it is to accept.

My advice to others is in your home just put on practical, comfortable clothes and leave all the wigs, makeup, heels and all the other sexy items and trickery for the fun nights out when we become our own version of a drag queen.

I also agree with you Marla that we should not think of our other selves as a third person, there is no alter ego. It is far healthier to integrate our feminine feelings into our everyday lifestyle than to keep them separate. By doing so we will also get a realistic grip on our transgenderism and will stop indulging in wishful fantasies and hopefully unrealitic wardrobes! and focus on the important things in life like our relationships.

Of course, much of this progress does rely on our SOs being reasonable in their acceptance. Unaccepting partners will keep the CDer imprisoned in their own self-imposed closet with little hope of advancement and self-acceptance.
This is one of the great tragedies of crossdressing. We CDers can help matters though by being more realistic in how we portray ourselves as transgendered individuals.

Personally I have no problem being seen as a man in a dress, I see no shame or guilt in that whatsoever. My work prevents me from any sort of obvious gender blending and my SO still has a big complex over social embarrassment so I could never do what Angel does. But I see gender blending becoming more mainstream so the option will be increasingly open for others.

Being Scottish I can tell you that Scottish girls love to see their men in kilts, they find it very sexy. There is no reason why this would not be replicated throughout all Western countries. Women do find men in skirts attractive because it is still a man on display!

The OP and Helana

Both of you have great insites on crossdressing and other forms of expression. I personally do not see myself as female or male; I am an emagimated mix of male or female both physically and mentally. Even as I transistion I will always feel a little "male", but society makes it easier to express a dual role as a female. It is really all about finding your own comfort zone and sticking with that.

I have written a very interesting essay along these simular lines in regards to transsexual individuals and their relationships to intersex, etc. It is actually part of my book I am writting on this subject. When I am able to get to my computer at home I will share the essay here.

Last time I went completly female I looked in the mirror and while what stared back at me was female I could see the male in me. Likewise when I look in the mirror in male mode I see female. I tell my friends, "it does not matter if I am male or female, I am still the same person that you have know for years, that will never change." For a SO it is rather the same relation to either a TS or CD, we all play along that same gender continium and that is what makes us the same.

If you are willing to step outside the box that that is your right. Just because I have a hard time understanding the needs and desires of a CD does not mean I am any different than anyone else...

Mandy

great article! i also live in nor cal. and life would be wonderful if i could find a woman with your approach and perspectives!

Early in my CD exploration, I stumbled across a remarkable Web site by Pristine Ann Gee. Her original site was entitled Tranvestite Freedom Fighter, but was soon renamed The Art of Not Passing, and is now simply D332 (http://www.d332.com/). She has an extensive photo library on the site, and if you look at the early years you will immediately get a sense of what she was up to. (Warning to you conservative types - Pristine likes short skirts and she's gay, but it would be a mistake to fixate on that and miss the larger point.) I see in her an evolution toward a more wholly feminized appearance and life, but she's still a breath of fresh air to me. Take the time to read her posts on a variety of subjects and you'll find some compelling stuff. This girl is up to something. Anyway, I submit the following excerpt from one of her many posts on passing:


"I have only recently unraveled the modus operandi behind passing among transvestites. A transvestite relies heavily on the returns provided by her mirror when at home. When she goes out in public, a great part of the desire to pass and not be read may be to avoid harassment and commotion. I think there is a more complex event taking place, and it is this: In lieu of the bedroom mirror, bystanders take up the slack and their glances become moving mirrors, which the transvestite passes. No pun intended.

A considerable part of transvestism (as well as several other trans groups, which will hereby remain unnamed) is identity. What makes transvestites more susceptible to identity issues is that they subscribe to a public conception of femininity. The moment one chooses this route, one will always be subservient to public opinion.

Honestly, It has always dumbfounded me how public opinion, derived from an anonymous madding crowd, can hold so much weight over one's idea of the self."

Great post Marla! I think you said this with much more eloquence than I ever could have. :D

I love this side of Amanda and I knew finding a guy who was comfortable with all of who he was could be this fun cool amazing thing, not just for him but for me as well.

Just because I don't view him as a 'female' it take's nothing away from my enthusiasm, acceptance, and overall appreaciation. I love he that he can express how he feels fully without judgement, ridicule, or embarrassment.

And I have enough common sense when we are out in public to always address my husband as Amanda, not his male name. But when we are home and casual or around friends in a small setting I seem to mix and use both names. There is no weirdness or hurt feelings or anything negative. I just can't help but sometimes use the boy name as it is the one that I use 99% of the time. But I am not disrespecting his femme side, and he knows this.

I am glad that my sweety knows that no matter what he is wearing or how he chooses to dress that it takes nothing away from my feelings for who he is as a person. I only wish more people would be as open to a situation where gender expression is not just black and white, but many shades of grey.

Well written Marla.:thumbsup: But you have to remember the majority of people don't think like you do. We live in a very confusing and unaccepting society. March to the tune of a different drummer but God help you if you are different. Step into a women's clothing department and visit the 'menswear' section but don't even think of putting a 'womenswear' section in the men's department. Get rid of the double standards except for the ones you like. No wonder therapists are never out of work.

As I have evolved over the past year & a half I have noticed the need to dress fully has subsided substantially. In fact I'd prefer NOT to wear a wig or breast forms or even a bra. And I never use corsets or hip padding. But we live in a society that has brainwashed us into believing there are men and there are women and nothing in between. We are told you have to be a man. We are told it's sacreligious for a man to emulate a woman in any way, shape or form. We see pictures of men dressed effeminately and are immediately told they are perverted, sick, weird or some other negative description and they are an embarassment to the male population. No matter how hard you try to get this brainwashing reversed, a lot of it still lingers. When we crossdress these images of all male or all female influence our dress.

When I go out I rarely do so without a wig and breast forms. The times I have been out w/o them I wear makeup in a feminine way. Still, I feel a bit uncomfortable when out like that. I like long hair and breasts on a feminine form and I want to feel feminine as possible (usually).

The images that were drilled into my head will forever hamper my ability to be comfortable with my TG personality. Therapy, reading books, self-analysis, applying logic, talking to other TGs, all have done little to change that. It's too deeply ingrained in me. And from the reaction of my mother and most siblings it seems they have that same negative image too. Often times I wish my family and friends never knew.

As far as wives seeing their crosdressing husbands as men no matter how they are dressed, that's not always true. After my ex had seen me dressed several times she started seeing me as a woman more and more. Eventually she viewed me as female no matter how I was dressed. I know many wives' problems stem from the "He looks better than me" syndrome. But I have yet to hear a TG agree with that. Still, there's no question many wives are insecure about their husbands looking better than them. Whether these same women see their husbands as being female is another question.

When it comes to a TG dressing in a manner that makes him/her comfortable I believe having a supportive SO is huge. If you don't have that having someone who you are in close contact with to accept and support you is positive as well. But most of us don't have that. So we are left alone to handle this the best we can. Gauging by all the TGs still in the closet, it seems that's the way the average TG deals with their crossdressing.

Fear of discovery and what might happen can be pretty powerful motivators to stay closeted. (That makes all the accessories even more appealing to those of us who venture past our front door, we're harder to recognize.:rolleyes: ) By staying in the closet it minimizes time for experimenting with partial dress. The images most often seen are ones of TGs in total dress so the thought of partial dress doesn't enter the mind until you tire of all the work that goes into it and the frustration of taking all that time and never leaving your house.

One thing I have learned all too well is this is a very complicated aspect of our personality. There are so many factors involved it's mind boggling. While one way of dealing with it works for some, it doesn't work for others. Dressing in a way that makes you comfortable is about as simply as it can be stated but it conjures up an endless variety of images in the minds of TGs.

What we all need is more acceptance and support for something that is truly harmless, no matter what the mainstream society thinks. That way we can find out where we really are in this spectrum and gain confidence about who we are.

My wife has a hard time seeing me in makeup. The last time was at the TGEA holiday gala. When I came out of the bathroom in full makeup without the wig, she looked at me and visibly shuddered. With the wig, she seemed better.

My wife asked me once why we found it necessary to wear the wig and makeup. Note that I rarely ever do, only when going out with her.

So I answered that some of us don't need to. I told her that I would be perfectly happy just wearing a skirt while out.

Her quick response was, not with me you won't. So, she answered her own question essentially. Even though she doesn't mind my wearing skirts around the house, if outside I have to be fem.

marla great post .........julie always seems to have great insight too.........what a great suport group this forum is

marla,
so eloquently said.i think that what we're all expressing here is
where our comfort zone lies.we all cd,but to what extent depends
on what makes us feel fufilled. i know that for myself it's more of
a feeling of femininity and girlishness rather than a look.just the
thought that i'm wearing some "girls"items is both emotionally and
psychologically rewarding.of course having a supportive partner makes
it all the better.hugs,karen.

Marla, that was a wonderful post!

I partially dress at home myself. I love to wear panties, pantyhose, skirt and mary janes or something and then a simple turtleneck (one of my boys' ones, often without a bra) and sweater on top. I'll usually add a necklace and a ring, too. I'm quite comfortable that way.

I used to feel that I was somewhat taking a shortcut when dressing that way but that was only because I still had the funny (and fallacious) idea in my head that I wasn't being truly feminine unless I dressed with all the accoutrements. But that isn't true, is it? I'm just dressing how I'm comfortable. I suppose one could as easily argue that I'm being lazy when I throw on some jeans and a polo shirt (when in boy mode), but the answer is the same. The true expression of the self lies in dressing according to one's own preferences, not in dressing to someone else's standard or using someone else's checklist to evaluate the completeness or validity of one's own expression.

I think you've got the right idea, Marla. It is truly when one dresses according to one's own comfy mix of the feminine and the masculine that one's true self is authentically presented. The exact ratio of masculine to feminine is immaterial, of course. It's only important that the chosen mixture is true to the self.

I feel that all of the locks within us that keep us repressed have the same key and that key has a name. It's name is Acceptance.

It's been said before and I don't mind saying it again: Angel is one hell of a lucky janegirl! I truly hope that I might one day be so lucky!

Hugs,
Lisa

I would have to say that I am one of the "in betweens". I made a sustained effort to "pass' but found that it was beyond my ability. For a while I was going out dressed but could never get comfy with it so now I just wear my fem things in the comfort of my own home. I no longer try to "pass". I just like wearing fem clothes. I think of myself as a crossdresser but do not apply my definition to anyone else. Oh well, just rambling now so I'll shut up. LOL

"I have only recently unraveled the modus operandi behind passing among transvestites. A transvestite relies heavily on the returns provided by her mirror when at home. When she goes out in public, a great part of the desire to pass and not be read may be to avoid harassment and commotion. I think there is a more complex event taking place, and it is this: In lieu of the bedroom mirror, bystanders take up the slack and their glances become moving mirrors, which the transvestite passes. No pun intended.

A considerable part of transvestism (as well as several other trans groups, which will hereby remain unnamed) is identity. What makes transvestites more susceptible to identity issues is that they subscribe to a public conception of femininity. The moment one chooses this route, one will always be subservient to public opinion.

Honestly, It has always dumbfounded me how public opinion, derived from an anonymous madding crowd, can hold so much weight over one's idea of the self."

Beautifully put. :thumbsup:

Marla, thanks for your incredible post. Yes, Angel is lucky beyond words to be blessed with a partner with your insight and understanding, not to mention the great support and love that you two obviously share. No doubt this is an extremely complicated subject, made more so by the infinite shades of desire, need and attitude as well.

For many years, I was content to dress mostly only in lingerie when I dressed. Passing was not an issue as I could never really imagine leaving the safe confines of my home. In all honesty, it's only been in the last two or three years of this 40 years+ crossdressing journey that I've even contemplated going out dressed en femme. It's only been in the past year that I've acquired a real femme wardrobe of my own; before that it was only an assortment of my wife's cast-offs and thrift store "rags".

After joining this forum and the wonderful community we share here, my evolution as a cd really began to develop. Coming out to my two grown children and receiving their incredible acceptance was like another piece of the puzzle. I can live my life at home dressed largely as I please now and that means that I change out of my drab clothes almost as soon as I get home from work. Olivia's clothes are slowly but surely crowding "his" out of the closet. For the first time in my 29 year marriage to Jackie, her birthday gifts to me last week were all of a femme nature; clothes, shoes, pedicure, etc. That, alone, is a wonderful indication of her growing comfort with my expression of my female side.

I don't think I could ever really pass in public as a female. Does that mean that I don't consider it or that I won't, at some point venture out? No, of course it doesn't. In fact, I fully expect to take that step someday. But, I don't feel the overwhelming need to "go all out" all the time. I'm quite comfortable to dress at home in my femme clothes or even a combination, like a girl top and guy jeans, or just lingerie beneath my male clothes. Often, I'm en femme from head to toe, from skin out. Sometimes I include light makeup, jewelry and a wig, sometimes it's more casual than that. Gradually, I'm realizing that my true comfort zone while at home (where we are all the most comfortable anyway, right?) is a subtle blending of both male and female. It works for me, and for Jackie, and that's enough for me.

I must say that now, at 53, I've reached the most comfortable, reassuring stage of my life as a crossdresser. Sometimes, even that is not enough. But, that's only human; the desire to go a bit further, that is. I can feel a tangible lessening of stress in my life. I can feel that this is the true expression of Olivia. I'm not trying to erase the male me from my life. Why, that would be impossible even if I so desired as long as I work at my chosen profession. I do feel that I am successfully "blending" the two sides though, and in that blending, I don't expect Olivia to conform to a certain standard of crossdressing. It just feels good to finally be comfortable with myself, with who I am. Thanks again Marla for your great post to start this thread. Thanks also to the rest of you girls for your views as well. We are all on the same journey I think. It's the paths that are different. Olivia

Many, many thanks to everyone for your kind words and insightful comments. I feel so lucky to have the support of all my sisters here. Every time I post my thoughts here, I find that my understanding is enriched and my perspective broadened by those of you who take the time to write such thoughtful responses. I love you girls! :<3:

Suzy and Amykins -- Thank you!

Billie Renee -- It's cool that you enjoy dressing in a way that blends male and female. It's nice to know Angel isn't the only one.

Ronda -- Thanks very much!

Paula UK -- Your girlfriend's piece was lovely! I missed it the first time around so thanks for the link. I'm glad to hear that you and she are still happily together and continuing to learn about each other.

Raychel -- Awww! You say the sweetest things.

Miss Pinchy -- Thanks Katrina!

Sharon -- Effiminatize yourself??:D LOL. Thanks for teaching me a new word. And on a more serious note, thanks for always promoting tolerance and respect on this forum. It is very clear to me that they are values you hold dear, and I love you for that. :hugs:

Jenny CD -- I appreciate that! It was actually one of your recent posts that got me thinking about this issue, so it was good to hear from you.

JY -- Ha! Made you think didn't I.....which is what you do best anyway. Thanks for sharing your perspective; you really summed up the difference between the way (many) CDs view themselves and the way (many) GGs view them.

Katiegirl -- What a nice thing to say. Thanks honey.

Freshfrankie -- Jeannie, you are obviously very comfortable with yourself and I find that inspiring! Way to go.

Clarissa3d -- Thank you. I agree, there a lot of differences here, but a lot of common ground too. That's what makes it such a wonderful place.

Charlene -- What a beautiful message. I agree 100%: "We are all a very unaccepted segment of the world, we should stick together." You are someone whom I've admired since the first day I joined the forum, for being brave enough to show the world the world your true self, and generous enough to support others trying to do the same.

Dragster -- LOL Tony! "Man-tart"! Thank you for the lovely compliments and also for continuing to share your experiences with the rest of us. I know it hasn't been an easy road for you and your wife but I have learned a lot from reading your posts and I am sure others have too. I just keep hoping things will get better for you one day. You deserve to be happy.

Chrissie -- Thanks hon! Hugs to you!

Stephanie Brooks -- Interesting! I didn't know that about you. I agree, partial dressing isn't always feasible, and knowing a little bit about your situation I understand how it wouldn't work for you right now. Thanks for the kind words, too.

Shelly2069 -- Scary? Me? LOL. Any insight I have is from reading what you girls post here. I can't take any credit at all! But thank you sweetie.

Susandrea -- Yeah! I completely agree. Confidence is sexy, for women, men, and CDs alike. Does my butt look big in this post? :D

JennyCD -- Yes, the comfort factor figures into Angel's clothing choices too. Good point.

TGMarla and Bobbie Lee -- I'm flattered! Thank you.

Diann -- I do hear what you're saying. Regardless of your own comfort factor, the public tends to judge you "pass or fail." It's one of the toughest problems CDs face. As to your question about how we should comment on pictures that are posted here, that's a huge can of worms. How about starting a new thread on the topic?

Helana -- Wow! I am always at a loss for words to describe how brilliant your posts are. This one is no exception. You are so right; the pursuit of a "100% female" appearance is doomed to fail and ultimately gets in the way of true self-acceptance. I also have to agree wholeheartedly with your assessment of how SOs feel about seeing their partners dressed: "The more of me which shows through, the easier it is to accept." I couldn't have said it better.

MandyTS -- Your perspective is a valuable one. I wish you all the best in finding that magic "comfort zone"....and I look forward to reading your article when you post it!

Cuteybobby -- Thanks!

Sherri -- Very interesting link! I loved the excerpt you posted. The concept of passing in public as a kind of substitute mirror for CDs--a validation of one's internal female image-- is intriguing.

Kathy GG -- What can I say.....you and Amanda have been role models for Angel and me since day 1, and I still find myself agreeing with everything you say. You're my hero!

Julie -- You make some excellent points and as always, you express them so well. What you say about cultural brainwashing is unfortunately true, as are your observations on the problem of going out in public as neither "all male" nor "all female". I know all too well that society doesn't look kindly on gender blending. What I wrote was not so much focused on the pros and cons of going out in public partially dressed, as on the way that GGs tend to view images of men in women's clothing. I had noticed that on the forum, a lot of members seem to find images of partially dressed, non-passable CDs ugly or disturbing, whereas GGs often prefer that image over the illusion of a totally convincing woman -- at least where their partners are concerned.

DonnaT -- Yes, I can see how your wife would find it difficult to go out in public with you not wearing a wig and makeup, regardless of how she prefers to see you at home. About the makeup, it's funny how every woman is different in terms of the specific things she can and can't accept. I have always liked makeup on my partner, but there was a time when I hated breastforms. Other GGs I have talked to are fine with breastforms but hate shaved legs. I guess you can't really make any assumptions....you have to communicate, as you and your wife obviously do.

Ginafaye and KarenMarie -- Thank you very much.

Lisa Meaghan -- Beautiful post! I love your advice....be true to yourself, not someone else's standards. It sounds like you are very comfortable in your own skin.

Lawren -- Even if you don't pass and never go out, you are a crossdresser. "I just like wearing fem clothes" pretty much sums it up!

Olivia -- Thank you so much for sharing your journey with all of us. I think it will give hope to a lot of girls who want to be where you are someday: happily married to an accepting spouse, and satisfied with the level of self-expression you've achieved. I was very moved by your story. And yes, I have to agree: home is where you find your comfort zone.

A very good post with some very valid points made.

I think one of the key points, (which becomes more and more apparent as the entire thread is read) is that of acceptance. It has to start with acceptance of oneself and has to include the realisation that we are not static creatures but we are all dynamic and change all the time. I am not necessarily the person I was yesterday as time has changed, life has changed, my surroundings have changed and so I have changed - life and all that it encompasses is fluid and thus must change.

After accepting ouselves as we are, only then can we begin to accept that others are different. To truly be yourself means accepting that no other in the world is truly like you. Only after accepting that all others are different, can you hope that others will accept you.

Another key point is ignorance and/or fear. People everywhere fear what they do not know. Where there is fear and ignorance there will be prejudice and from this prejudice will come stereotypes of what is 'normal' and 'not normal', and before you know it, these stereotypical views become the truth. Example - how many people believe that if you are homosexual you are also a pedophile? Now we know this not to be true, quite frankly it is a really ignorant assumption, but people believe it to be true. Is it any wonder then, that people are ignorant as to what transgender / transexual / in transition / crossdressing / transvestitism are? Er, not really, no. How do we change it? Information, education and communication.

First, we need to assimilate the information about ourselves and then accept ourselves. When we have accepted ourselves, then we can accept others. For others to accept us, we need to educate them and to do this we need to communicate.

Everyone is different and this is a very good thing. When everyone accepts that everyone else is different, that will be a very great thing. Sound a bit like Ghandi, not so, it was me, a gg living near San Francisco. Enjoy.

Very interesting thread. Great post, Marla! Kudos.

It made me think of what April (my cd) said once. "If I could just cross dress from the waist down I'd be happier." Of course I raised an eyebrow. Then why do you have breast forms? Wigs? Makeup? "Because I need to go all out in order to wear the skirts, hose and heels that I enjoy. I could never be Allen in a skirt and heels at a bar."

Wow. How true. And honestly, that sucks. I gotta admit, before I knew April I would have laughed out loud at a man in a skirt, pantyhose, and high heels having a beer with his buddies at the bar. As I get deeper and deeper into this whole thing I realize that (at least for Allen / April) its not a woman that he wants to be, but a sexy MAN. And men don't have sexy clothes. You can't go to the mens department and find something that will make a mans legs look better. Or bring out his eyes. Or show off that pedicure. Or his cute butt! ;)

As Marla said, there are those that need to go all the way. Heck I think there are as many different levels of crossdressing as there are crossdressers. And reasons for doing it.

For halloween he went as "Half man Half woman" Yep, you guessed it. A golf shirt, nice short skirt, matching hose and heels. He was in heaven. No makeup, no wig, no boobs. It was then I honestly realized that he wasn't making up the 'from the waist down' thing.

And that makes me think. That's bull-hockey! I'd love it if he went to work dressed that way, shopping, wherever. Because he'd be happier. For a minute. Until someone saw him. The old me, for instance, that says she would have laughed out loud at him. I tell ya, this whole crossdressing thing has opened my mind on a lot more things than just crossdressing. Who the heck am I, or anyone else, to judge what someone else is wearing?

I can tell you one thing. He looks better in a skirt and heels than I do. In my opinion. The man has SEXY legs! I love to admire them. But then, I feel a twinge of jealousy. I am a woman - taught to look at models and other women as threats. In the minds eye: Nice heels, great legs, smooth hosiery, short skirt, damn that bit%&#* is hot. Wait. It's a guy. What a relief. Laughter.

Not to mention his friends would unload on him. The poor guy. He's as macho as they get. His friends call him to help them on their projects all the time. His tool box is almost as big as my walk in closet. He's a man's man, who wears jeans and workboots almost every day. (pantyhose underneath, shh! don't tell anyone!) This man wouldn't wear a skirt to replace a roof on a house, but he would to go out on the town for an evening. And for some reason, this isn't allowed. It's male cow manure!

Of course, I have no way of changing societies views. We are forced to go to CD/TG friendly bars so he can be him, and sometimes he can be her. But it seems that April has faded more and more with the admitting of the 'waist down' deal. He has a cute dress that looks like a long polo shirt. With a sport coat, it looks great. He'd love to wear that to dinner.

Sorry to ramble on, and no, I don't have the answers. But I do know that the world is full of closed minded people like me. I am working to open my mind, and accept people for who they are, not what they wear. If that makes any sense.

Good luck to all of you. CD, GG, TG, TS and on and on. No matter what two letter label you give yourself, you are still human, and God's child. And at the end of the day, that's all that matters.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Marla GG

I also happen to find it attractive. Very attractive. Okay, downright irresistible. Ever since I can remember, I have been drawn to effeminate men. In my teenage years, those 80’s New Wave icons with their arched eyebrows, ruffled blouses and lipstick used to make me weak in the knees. I have an aversion to rugged masculinity and actually feel disgusted by body hair, big muscles, and tough guy attitudes.

---

Incredible post Marla. Thank you for putting so much thought into it, and to responding to everyone as well. You are amazing.

Though I only know you through your writing, I can tell that you are a confident, secure woman, and that in Angel you have found your soulmate. Everyone should be so fortunate.

I nearly responded as Suzy did, that I need to show this to my wife... however, I understand that my wife is attracted to rugged masculinity (despite that, she married me!) and body hair--she reminds me often how sexy she finds hairy chests...on men, anyway. Perhaps it is because of insecurity that she demands a knight in her castle, and not another princess.

I wonder what knights wore under their armor... :rolleyes:

Anyway, thanks again for your insight and wisdom!

You instill great hope in me Marla, that I can integrate these traits, enjoy such a variety of things, and yet still have a relationship. Thank you! It is what I am doing now, hoping for the best yet steeling myself for rejection, ridicule or possible solitude.

I am a newbie (to the forum anyway) so first of all - thank all of you for being here!

I like this thread because more than anything else I have read here it helps me to feel that I am not alone.

I am exactly partial - a man in a dress! Partial in terms of frequency of dressing, degree of dressing, partial in terms of the energy I give to this facet of me - this particular passion. As I said in my intro I had been lurking for a while knowing this is likely the best forum there is but still not feeling 'right' about joining.

Near the core of my conflict is the COGATI score thing. I read the scores as posted compared to my score of -390 and thought there must be some place else where I can fit in.

I am heterosexual, I am comfortable being a man, and I do not want to be a woman or look like a woman. I love the esoteric, eroticism of dressing. I also love the Sunday mornings in partial dress sitting by the fireplace reading the Sunday Times.

I find it incredibly interesting and charming that my feelings could be so well articulated by a GG

Thank you Marla

Julie I feel the same! I couldn’t say it better myself. I probably would go out in fem more often if I didn’t have to spend this huge block of time on (the prep work) to complete The Diann image.


Labeled as perverted, sick, and weird is most freighting.

Diann is evolving and this place is a big influence, but I can’t even begin to seriously think I will ever come out the life that supports Diann would fall to pieces. Let’s not ever delude ourselves that we are changing society’s view of CD’s Being pretrade as a comedy prop is the norm on American TV nothing has change since Milton Burl.

MelissaM Love you, love the way you think. April must have found a true angel!
Diann

Very enlightening and insightful. I will need to ask my wife if that is how she see's me.Thank you for sharing a very informative post concerning our enfeminate lifestyle

Hi Marla,

Looking at it from a broad community perspective I agree that partial cross dressing is a valid form of expression and many get a lot of joy from dressing in that way. And others may be helped by adopting aspects of it. Your article is a very positive step in re-enforcing the inclusive nature of this Forum and I congratulate you for that and the way you’ve put forward your thoughts.

I have no animosity towards those who partially dress – but, at the same time, neither am I not totally comfortable being linked to those folks who are exclusively partial dressers as my transgender kith and kin. I think I would cringe if others had a ‘partially dressed’ vision of me when I announce I am transgendered. I would wish that the society perception of transgenders is clearly one of fully transformed people.

Personally, while I don’t find partial dressing distasteful, neither do I embrace it as some kind of an extension for my own gender needs. While I am always in search of some middle lifestyle ways, I have never seen partial dressing or under dressing or even androgynous dressing as part of any answer for me. I recently saw a Guy Pierce interview in which he said he was not a masculine male – but a feminine male – and he felt free to express this through dress, nail polish etc. I have never felt that way I have always been happier with a clear gender divide irrespective of which side I’m on at any time. But I do admire and applaud those who do. And Sierra who posted to my recent thread would be such a person.

I am very much a whole or nothing person. I’ve said this before I know, but for me it’s about self image. I don’t see someone else and I don’t aspire to be someone else. I never talk about ‘Fiona’ in the third person and talk about buying clothes for ‘her’ etc. – no rather, I am Fiona.

I don’t interpret ‘transgendered’ as some mellow kumbya blending of the genders – but rather a clash between the physical being and the mental personna. A clash for which there is no real solution other than band aid treatments.

I accept that the partners of crossdressers always see the man they love beneath the makeup and clothes irrespective of the transformation. I’m not sure that those, who don’t fully accept, see their partners in quite that complete person form…or maybe not in that benign, loving way. There is to some extent – a threatening, alien life form feeling – I know I exaggerate but those partners who know but do not accept seem to resist seeing their partners dressed – and I think that is because they want to cling to male image.
Partial dressing or moving to an androgynous dress mode would simply be perceived as the thin end of an unacceptable wedge.

Fiona xx

...Marla what an amazing post, you really speak sense and as so accepting, It is so refreshing to know girls like you are around, I love to dress up fully (the only better buzz for me is the adrenaline rush from driving or being driven in a fast car), but as day to day I always wear girls jeans and occasionally undies and socks, I also wear boots and shoes when I can get away with it. If i could find a girl like you who would love me for what I am I would be the happiest person alive.
Thanks for being a fantastic person. (There aren’t enough in the world)

Hugs
Amelia xxx

Patsy Stone -- What a beautiful post. I completely agree with your thoughts on both self-acceptance and the need to educate others about TG issues.

MelissaM -- Thanks so much for your input; your open-mindedness is very admirable. I loved reading your thoughts on April's dressing "from the waist down." Of course you are absolutely right that the public is less accepting of a guy in a skirt and heels than a passable CD, and it seems April is not alone in feeling that she needs to present a convincing female image in order to go out, but would be content with partial dressing if it were acceptable.

Dayna -- Thank you for the nice reply. Yes, I know that a lot of women, unlike me, prefer manly men. Even so, I have met quite a few women who felt the way your wife does, and who eventually find that they can accept crossdressing in their marriage as long as they still get to spend time with their husband in male mode. It can be a tricky balancing act sometimes.

Joanna -- Very nice to hear from you. I hope the best for you too.

ShoppR -- Thank you and welcome to the forum. If this thread made you feel more welcome here, I'm glad. As you can see from the responses, you are most definitely not alone.

Joycediane -- I'm glad you enjoyed it. If you do ask your wife, I'd be interested to know what she says. Take care.

FionaAlexis -- I always look forward to reading your posts. I appreciate your honesty and insight. Thanks for the reminder that the members of this forum hold radically different views on what it is to be TG. I was especially struck by your statement "I don’t interpret ‘transgendered’ as some mellow kumbya blending of the genders – but rather a clash between the physical being and the mental personna." I have heard this before, but never so well expressed. I think public perceptions of transgendered people will continue to be shaped primarily by those who are "out," which means that society's image of our community will be most influenced by "fully transformed" individuals who either feel as you do, or at least dress as you do while in public to avoid ridicule. Once again, thanks for your contribution to the discussion -- I found it thought-provoking and valuable.

Amelia -- Your analogy between the rush you get from dressing up fully, and driving a fast car, made me smile. And your compliments made me blush! Thanks for the post.