Proud but not loud?

Whats the point?

For me its part of who I am and dressing up in the mirror is great practice for getting the look and being at one with myself. But I hate being a prisoner in the mirror. I went out for the first time a few nights ago and decided to walk through town rather than get a taxi. Yes I knew it was going to be scary and wasn't going to pass, but its practice for a new skill set which is nailing the subtleties and confidence, i spent most of the time looking down at the ground, but it may have been because i was trying to hide my face, was nervous or had to check what the ground was doing in my heels so I wouldnt fall.

I am not trying to make a massive statement, Tara is a woman, and generally don't want to stand out and its harder if your 6ft to blend in. As for human interaction, walking past someone and being glanced at is human interaction and down to how you react to it. And the voice is a major give away and that makes much socialising and normalisation hard to achieve and for me there is nothing worse than failing to pass as it just zaps you completely.

But why bother?

A: I don't want to be in the news in years to come for being accused of locking up a beautiful woman in my room for all those years, holding her prisoner. I've done that in my head for too long lol

I go out because I have this internal need to express my feminine side. For me it's best done dressed and just interacting with others as a woman. I do my best to present a good image and carry myself in a way that expresses my femininity.
I know that not everyone will see me as a woman, but not everyone will see me as anything but that. I don't do this for them, I do it for me.

I'm not the "loud and proud" type. I leave that in-your-face stuff to others. Perhaps my just being there will aid all and someday help gain more acceptance for myself and my sisters.

The missus as you can see its not a question that is easily answered.
Many have their reasons for blending into the crowd for me its blending as best I can.
Do people read me? Oh sure I'm clocked a lot but a good majority people don't notice me as a man in womens clothes.They see the clothes,accessories and the hair they assume I am female at first glance and its all good.
I think letting go of your fears and getting out in public and interacting with people is a good thing for the cause.
Looking nice and presenting proudly and not being in ones face is a positive thing for the TG/CD portion of society.
Activism is OK and I believe I am being an ambassador for trans rights in my own way.I don't need to shout it out on every street corner and demand people accept me.
It boils down to the individual and trying to put things in a box never seems to work.
Why does some one do this or that? It doesn't really matter they just do.
Maybe you need to let go a little and quit trying to compartmentalize everything.
You seem like a really sweet lady and I commend you for being a part of this forum we need you here.

When I go out I am on stage - it is a performance. At home I do not bother with make up or wig. I wear a nice outfit, smell nice, and walk well, but there is nlo denying that rush of adrenalin when you open the car door, swivel the legs out in parallel, and make contact with the world. It is nicer to try on clothes fully dressed, and I interact with the shop owners/staff and with beauticians and staff in catering establishments. No, I don't want my friends, family and colleagues to know about it, but I am not hiding when I go out. And feedback on how I look from GGs is wonderful.

For me, it's about presenting and being a woman while dressed, rather than being obviously a guy wearing a skirt. Sorry if that wasn't really coherent, but I have trouble understanding it myself....[/QUOTE]

I know this is not an answer but the feeling of being in public and counted as a woman (blending) when interaction (speaking) usually will expose your presentation as male is the closest many of us can get -- and it's very rewarding ? - makes me feel whole -- making since of it all ain't go'nna happen.......................Debra

Thanks, Missus. Good question. i don't know why. It is sort of asking, "Why do I look at myself in the mirror? "Why does anybody look in a mirror?
I ask myself when I go out, "What do I want to happen? What do I want to avoid?"

Mainly I think, I am looking for acceptance--validation perhaps. That I look OK. Perhaps even pretty.

I can oly speak for myself and no one else. I go out dressed and do interact with the "muggles". I dress appropiate for the occasion or maybe just a little nicer.
Do I blend or pass? I don't think so especially when I open my mouth. But I am expressing a part of myself and try to project CDing in a positive light. All I look for is to be treated with the same respect I extend to others. I just feel more comfortable going all out dressed rather than a "man in a dress". People seem more confused with a half & half presentation rather than a "complete" image.

I think a lot just feel self conscious.

Blending/passing to have no one look at you could be for a variety of reasons. One may be shy, wants to go out dressed as a woman and explore life, or just a part of that life, whenever they can without being noticed. I think part of that reason to remain anonymous in the crowd is to avoid negative reactions that they so much fear and which have kept them from going out much sooner in their crossdressing career. Another may just be the type that does not want to be noticed as a male nor a female.

I think you also need to look at what we do and how we do it as a spectrum which is moved along as we gain experience in dressing, makeup, female mannerisms, voice, going out to "T" friendly places to going mainstream. Maybe a lot of these shy ones that want to go out but do not, or maybe do not very often, will increase the frequency of their outings and the accompanying enjoyment over time and their need to blend into the background will change over time.

I think that the pride that someone shares with us here when they go out for that first time or after one of the rare appearances, is not so much the pride of being invisible but more one of, "Look everyone. I did it and I am here alive with no battle scars!". To go out "loud and proud" takes confidence in who and what you are and that you know that you will survive to do it again. That confidence is gained over time and helps move that person over that experience and confidence spectrum.

My first goal when I started dressing was to go out into the real world and go to the type of restaurants, bars and venues where I would go in male mode. I wanted to enjoy those same places dressed differently. I have done that quite successfully and a lot of that initial joy has now turned into a very different and very enjoyable life style, which also may have its own unique spectrum. I am a very social and extroverted person and I have made Allie an important part of that person, and I truly do love it all.

I am a man who enjoys wearing female clothing and all the accoutrements that go along with that. I do not feel like I am a woman or that I am expressing anything about my self or my identity, other than some element of my personality that makes this activity enjoyable to me. I am a private person, and am not one to broadcast to one and all about any of my personal enjoyments, unless I am in conversation with a like-minded individual about such pursuits. For that reason, my crossdressing is primarily in house as it is nobody's business or concern how I prefer to dress on any given day. As I have been retired for a long time now, I have the freedom to dress as I please most days.

However, I do not suffer from agoraphobia, and I have a somewhat restless nature that makes me want to come and go as I please. In male mode, I can do just that but when I dress in female clothing this restless nature collides with my private nature. I have no desire to make any statements about my right to dress as I please, and while it would be easier to be able to come and go in either mode, doing so in female clothing would send a message to those I know who would see me that I am possibly something that they do not understand; a crossdresser. But that is none of their business. Living the rest of my life unsure of what my friends and neighbours think about me and my wife over this otherwise private matter is not something I wish to do, so I take the time to change before leaving the house.

That does not imply that I do not have any desire to be out fully crossdressed. What is the point to being all dressed up complete with makeup and accessories if you are just going to sit around the house? That is not something that people normally do. For that reason, my in-house dressing is usually a few casual items, but that can become very dull and routine after a while, and I go for lengthy periods of time when I do not crossdress at all. Also, dressing casually when out and about the way most modern women do has little appeal to me, since that is how I usually crossdress around the house anyway.

For me, the ultimate crossdressing experience then is to be fully dressed in the same manner as a woman who is having a night out dining in a fine restaurant, or working as an executive in an upscale office, or attending a gala of some sort, and to actually be out there doing just that. I want to mingle with people who do not know me, except as a man they have just met who happens to be dressed as a woman. The opportunities for such a scenario are very limited, but they have happened and the experience has always been extremely exhilarating. Sitting around the house in my best cocktail dress cannot achieve that same feeling of satisfying this desire to dress up and experience life situations in the same manner as the female half of the population.

This is not exactly "out and proud" as these people do not know who I am. Nor is it passing or going unnoticed. The human interaction is not with people already in the know unless they remember meeting me at a previous event. The desire to go out, despite all the difficulties, is different for everybody, but for me it is simply to make the crossdressing experience as complete as possible, without sacrificing my desire for the secrecy of my private inclinations among those I know. Knowing something about myself that those closest to me are unaware of, is a bit of a rush in itself.

Veronica

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Originally Posted by AllieSF

Blending/passing to have no one look at you could be for a variety of reasons. One may be shy, wants to go out dressed as a woman and explore life, or just a part of that life, whenever they can without being noticed. I think part of that reason to remain anonymous in the crowd is to avoid negative reactions that they so much fear and which have kept them from going out much sooner in their crossdressing career. Another may just be the type that does not want to be noticed as a male nor a female.

I think you also need to look at what we do and how we do it as a spectrum which is moved along as we gain experience in dressing, makeup, female mannerisms, voice, going out to "T" friendly places to going mainstream. Maybe a lot of these shy ones that want to go out but do not, or maybe do not very often, will increase the frequency of their outings and the accompanying enjoyment over time and their need to blend into the background will change over time.

I think that the pride that someone shares with us here when they go out for that first time or after one of the rare appearances, is not so much the pride of being invisible but more one of, "Look everyone. I did it and I am here alive with no battle scars!". To go out "loud and proud" takes confidence in who and what you are and that you know that you will survive to do it again. That confidence is gained over time and helps move that person over that experience and confidence spectrum.

My first goal when I started dressing was to go out into the real world and go to the type of restaurants, bars and venues where I would go in male mode. I wanted to enjoy those same places dressed differently. I have done that quite successfully and a lot of that initial joy has now turned into a very different and very enjoyable life style, which also may have its own unique spectrum. I am a very social and extroverted person and I have made Allie an important part of that person, and I truly do love it all.

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I feel the same way. Allie has helped me reach that goal of being in the mainstream. She just goes out there and is herself. She has given me such a gift! If you have that desire find someone to do it with you. You will be so happy that you did!
Suzanne

I do not go out "loud and proud". I go out presenting myself as a woman because I enjoy looking like a woman, acting and being treated as a lady.

The reason many of us want to go out but not interact is the same reason we underdress. At least for me it's all about how it makes me feel. I don't need to interact to get "the high".

Perhaps I can explain what happens when I go out. I have found that people treat men and women very differently. When I go OUT as Sally, women interact with me on a different level. Even if they don't see me as female, they mostly treat me as one. That in itself is huge. We comment on each others clothes or just exchange a smile in passing. It's not much, but just a taste of what living as a women would be. Sometimes that's enough.

Presentation and the degree of 'loudness' is for me very much related to being confident being seen as a man in a dress, even though I always present fully femme. Out dressed 4 or so days a week builds confidence and a style - in my case making up on missing my femme younger days. Stylish but often age inappropriate according to the rule book.

Passing and blending are IMO overrated but there are times though such as using female restrooms that passing is important.

So Missus I'm proud to be out engaging presenting as femme but not often concerned to blend.

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Originally Posted by Sally24

Perhaps I can explain what happens when I go out. I have found that people treat men and women very differently. When I go OUT as Sally, women interact with me on a different level. Even if they don't see me as female, they mostly treat me as one. That in itself is huge. We comment on each others clothes or just exchange a smile in passing. It's not much, but just a taste of what living as a women would be.

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Very very true Sally.

It's bad enough trying to explain to your wife why you like to wear women's clothing. Try to explain it to somebody who does not know who you really are when you can't explain it to yourself-very challenging. Am I proud of my cross dressing? Not any more or less than any other aspect of my inner self? Society still does not understand or appreciate people who are not carbon copies of themselves. If I were to walk down to the mailbox en femme and observed by all my neighbors, am I to bear the negativity alone. No! My wife will have to deal with it also. Before retirement I had to think about gainful employment and paying the bills. Would have my kids been bullied?

So, I do enjoy immensely my private time in my DADT marriage. I accomplish a lot at home en femme a la June Cleaver. All dolled up in a pretty dress, heels and all the proper undergarments I get to do the domestic chores. And, I do have the privacy of my backyard.

I have taken drives and evening strolls and I found them to be rather boring. Just to walk the streets without a destination or goal? No sense it that! If my wife were to pass away, maybe, I would be more adventurous because I would not subject her to any societal negativity. For now I'm more than content to be Stephanie on occasion.

And, my personal reason for becoming Stephanie-very therapeutic for resolving PTSD issues. Cross dressing is a better choice over drugs and alcohol. At least I think so!

I agree, if we want to blend with everyone else what is the point of doing it? I have never, and will never, see the point of wearing jeans and a tshirt and trying to present female when I can wear the same things and present male. Your a lot safer in your home, you don't have to face the chuckles, fears, or being attacked and My SO doesn't mind one whether I stay in or go out......

BUT there is an incredible sensation to being outside and feeling the wind across your hosed legs and across your toes that you just don't get in the house. That is the one thing I have always envied about women, they can wear whatever they chose and I think it's taken for granted most of the time. To be outside, fully femme, is beyond any words that I can come up with to even begin to describe it.

Yes it would be a lot safer in the house but what fun would that be?

"I agree, if we want to blend with everyone else what is the point of doing it?"

Because it makes us feel good or comfortable?

Deedee

Missus

Lots of very valid reasons already expressed. I disagree with your assumption that all CD's are going to be "read" once they walk out the door. Honestly to be frank in my experience very few CD's are "read" or probably more to the point noticed until they do socially interact.Personally for me, "passing" enables me to overcome certain inherent appearance judgements that people make so that I can get to the point of social interaction. At that point there is no doubt that I am read as a CD however by that point the focus of the interaction is typically not appearance but those other subtleties of social interaction like politeness, charm etc.

For a lot of CD's it is important to get validation of their gender expression from others. The way we get this validation is through others seeing us as not repulsive but maybe just unusual. This validation then gives us self confidence to be ourselves. Personally I think that every CD goes through a phase of being self conscious about passing. The best analogy is possibly a teenager as they transition from being so and so's child in a social situation to being independent socially. I think that most CD's if they go out regularly get to a point where they don't particularly obsess about passing per se. Some are then quite happy to trumpet it from the rooftops (e.g. Eddie Izzard, Jane Anders, James Franco, David Williams, Dennis Rodman) where as many are just happy going about their business. If you are in a busy shopping centre or theatre or whatever in a large city I suspect there are probably a number of CD's in the crowd that you had no idea about.

I don't have a lot of offer as I have been out and interacting publicly a grand total of three times (once went bad, twice was neutral). Firstly, I live my life "en male" Originally, I thought I would be content with an indoor existence, but as I began to explore Isha (and she can be a force of nature sometimes), I felt it wasn't fair to deny her the daylight which my male side takes for granted. So I went out. Was I going to be read "most likely" would I blend "probably".

For me it was about acceptance. I have come to accept this side of me and I could not fully embrace that acceptance until I put Isha out there. Would she be accepted by everyone? Not likely as people are what they are. Would she be able to interact with others without getting read? Not in a million years. Was I loud an proud? Not really in the fact I did not waltz up down the isles at Wal-Mart screaming "cross dresser here". However, those who read me knew so in a way was loud and proud.

I remember driving home after my last outing which was my first solo (no wife) and one in which I engaged in everyday activities. I interacted with the public, got read, go rude stares, got nice comments and got ignored. For me that one small moment in time justified my acceptance of Isha into my life. I smiled internally and am still doing it. So why to I go out even though I am just a CDer . . . to coin a corny movie phrase "Because it completes me" :)

Hugs

Isha

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Originally Posted by TheMissus

So why not go out loud and proud and get noticed for what you are?

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That's exactly what I do, and I have a fabulous time doing it! Stepping out is both terrifying and a thrill for first-timers though. It was against the law in many places until the late '60's, so there's some natural apprehension that quickly fades.

Whatever women do, or are, I just want to be a part of it. I spend too much time thinking I wish I was that woman over there. She dresses cool, she wears cool shoes, she has nice curves.
I did something about it, and acted on it, and now I live it, and I am happy and glad I did.

First...try it and you will know why. The first reason is freedom and feeling board. Second reason is to prove to yourself you can do it. Third reason is enjoyment. Fourth reason is that its practical. When you are at home and pull down the shades, you feel trapped in your own house so going out you can do whatever you want and no neighbors will be watching you. Just because you think you look good, doesn't mean you can make it in the real world...its a whole other challenge to actually dress down, to look natural and to act correctly to blend in. Interacting with people is scary at first, but many times very uplifting and it is a whole lot easier shopping when you look the part and have the correct body shape. The real question should be, why not do it?

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Originally Posted by Sally24

Perhaps I can explain what happens when I go out. I have found that people treat men and women very differently. When I go OUT as Sally, women interact with me on a different level. Even if they don't see me as female, they mostly treat me as one. That in itself is huge. We comment on each others clothes or just exchange a smile in passing. It's not much, but just a taste of what living as a women would be. Sometimes that's enough.

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Sally got it spot on. I can wear clothing and do my makeup at home, and enjoy the feel of the clothes (and I do!). But only when I go out in public do I have even a scintilla of an idea of how the world looks - and feels - to a woman. In some ways it feels good (the realization that, after the cowboy steps aside to let me pass and tips his hat to me in broad daylight, he's checking me out from behind as I walk on). In some ways it is frightening - most men are bigger and stronger than I am, and could seriously hurt me if they chose to. Third, and surprisingly, the way I interact with people is expected to be different when I am out and living as a woman. As a woman I need to be friendly to guys and gentle as I carefully shunt aside their expressions of interest; and grown-up women tend to be quite accepting, as though they recognize I may not have all the same physical parts, still I treasure and want to share their life experience in a profound way that is generally unavailable to "regular guys.".
When I enter the world as a woman, I see all of life in a way I simply cannot experience any other way; and it is a warm, sharing, wise and mostly happy world that, as best I can tell, mere men simply know nothing about.

Missus Try dressing as a man sometime I mean go all out and see how you feel.
Let your SO be the woman and you be the man.
Tell me how you would dress? To blend and go unnoticed for the most part or dress like Liberace?
I think once you feel what we feel doing just the opposite you might have a better understanding of how hard it really is.
Having both genders within your personality and dealing with the urges is something that takes a strong person to deal with.