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I have to agree Tracii. While the backwoods and small towns are going to be less accepting, that's true everywhere. Midwest cities like Des Moines Iowa are very progressive, not to mention college towns like Ames and Iowa City are just like any other college town.
When word started to get out that I am CD one friend who I went to great pains to explain how and why we tick asked me this very question " are you gay" I replied no I am not I just like to dress in womens clothes he acepted this explanation completely his wife even more so her reply was " you're still a great guy" this is how it should be but if I was confronted with homophobic hate directly at me I would find out who they were, where he/she lived and take them to court! for gender discrimination end of.
This was my wife's biggest issue when she found out, she thought it meant I was gay and I had to keep reassuring her I wasn't. She still worries other's will think I am gay due to my dressing questioning our relationship.
I don't care what they think.
Stevie,
That is a very odd comparison you make , personally I prefer it the other way round AGP is part of what makes me tick , I've now come to terms with it but I will say you have some odd assumptions and conclusions about it . Besides to really put the spanner in the works a gay person could also have AGP .
No matter how you dress if you have a relationship with another guy it is gay .
Rhonda ,
I'm not sure if I agree with your statistics , I honestly don't think it crosses their minds in many cases anymore , I feel they relate it more to wanting to transition .
Some of us are Gay. My sexuality and gender Identity are two seperate things, I love Men, and Identify as one, but I also love femininity.
The problem with being perceived as gay, is that it pretty much eliminates a very large percentage of the female population from considering you a potential mate.Quote:
Originally Posted by Shelly Preston
If you're already married or have a GF that knows and accepts your crossdressing, it doesn't matter all that much.
But if you're trying to FIND a mate, ever since the HIV scare, women are especially afraid of a guy who has EVER had gay sex. So making ourselves considered much more likely to have done so, simply gives women another reason to avoid us. All things being equal, it's just so much simpler for them to choose a non-crossdresser to date, especially with the long term potential consequences for her. My own ex wife accused me of marrying her, knowing that I was ruining her life. She said that I had 'stolen her best years', and now it was too late to find another man and start a family. And I think that pretty much would reflect a lot of other women's feelings if they had 'wasted' years trying to 'catch' a suitable man to marry. Despite this being the 21st century and all, many women still work very hard to find a guy and then work very hard to get him to 'commit' his life to her. We are still looked upon as meal tickets, money, shelter, and food providers for a woman who wants those things for herself and her offspring without necessarily having to work for them all by herself. To the vast majority of women, getting married is still the primary goal. Sure, they might want a great career, but by percentage, there are probably very, very few who idealize being single their entire life.
It also can upset the attraction dynamic. Thinking of her date wearing clothing typical of a female, or thinking of him potentially behaving like a female, can easily throw a wrench in her daydreams and fantasies of being romantically involved with him, again eliminating him from consideration. Men in healthcare who are anything other than doctors, dentists or physical therapists, are pretty much automatically assumed to be likely gay by much of the population. Numerous men over the years have asked me when I was going to get 'a real man's job'. Women, OTOH, having had to go to school and know how difficult it can be, aren't as bad, but they still find say, cops and firemen more attractive than a guy who works in fields predominantly occupied by women. Men who are secretaries, administrative assistants, sales folks, clerks, hairdressers, dental hygienists, nurses, servers (especially if the rest at that restaurant are all female), all have to deal with the 'less than masculine' assumption about us, by much of the rest of the world.
So basically what I'm saying, is it's hard enough to find a mate. Why intentionally make it more difficult?
Sherry, to be honest that thinking actually helped me overcome any reasons for not going out. When I’m out now knowing
full well I don’t pass, I think some will think I’m either in transition or I’m a fem guy who likes to be girly and then I’m prob
gay. It actually made me at ease thinking that most will then think nothing of my appearance.
So yes it’s all in our heads just get out there ladies
I'm not sure what odd assumptions and conclusions you're referring to but as far as being gay and having AGP, yes it's possible. Despite Dr. Blanchard's typology that divides TSs into "homosexual" and "non homosexual", these are not mutually exclusive categories. Blanchard's own data shows that a significant portion of the "homosexual" TSs have experienced AGP. And a significant portion of the "non homosexual" TSs experienced AGP in ways that can only be described as trivial or vanishingly insignificant. The way I would interpret the data is to say that there are two main clusters: one cluster is mostly exclusively androphilic and doesn't experience AGP and one cluster that is mostly not exclusively androphilic and does experience AGP at least sometimes. But I don't really care about that one way or another because I'm not even TG let alone TS. My AGP is sans the transgender psychology. I don't experience any significant desire to be female or feminine outside of an erotic context. I'm just your basic AGP that is more related to transvestic fetishism although I'm not even much of a crossdresser these days. However, I can't seem to have a sexual thought without AGP nudging it's way into the mix.Quote:
Originally Posted by Teresa
I am amazed that you don't have a better understanding of gender... So,I hope you are only hunting gay women for your hopes of a new relationship !Quote:
Originally Posted by Teresa
I think there might also be an element of trying to make oneself appear more palatable for public acceptance:
"Hey, look, I'm only 'this'. I'm not 'that' as well!"
A similar mechanism operates here regarding the 'correct way of dressing', where a divergence from what is thought to be ideal is perceived as being detrimental to the community's probability of public acceptance ( e.g. NB-presentations ( even though the ones here have repeatedly demonstrated achieving amazing success on their own merits ) ).
Acceptance does not happen over tea and scones. Women's rights, race, L, G & B were all messy. Us trying to find our place in our communities is most likely going to be messy too. Probably better not to celebrate distancing ourselves from groups that are better understood than us.
:2c:.
- Lydianne.
Stevie,
I mustn't sidetrack this thread too much with AGP but Blanchard has been left far behind . The other point is I have been in touch with some acknowledge people in this field and questioned the issue of AGP with TGs rather than TSs and it was quite an eye opener how much information is available , there is far more than the fetish angle associated with it .
Rogina ,
I know you got my drift without me having to explain my words and split hairs .
Lydianne,
That's a tricky debate , I know some aren't happy as TGs being tagged in with the lesbian/ gay community because the claim not to be gay . Some do prefer using the TG flag rather than the LGBTQ one . The question is are we better under that umbrella or going our separate ways as the TG community . I guess the answer is , " There's no pleasing everybody !"
In everyday life most of this doesn't matter , I find acceptance isn't a problem . Activists are a help and an hinderance , if they push the community too hard they undo the good work already achieved . I love my tea and scones , I think we can win many over by sitting round that particular table . I do mean that literally , I often think just sitting having coffee with TG friends is a simple and effective way of putting our message across , to onlookers it is normal behaviour .
Rogina,
I don't understand your comment to Teresa at all. I agree with Teresa, so I guess I don't have a good understanding of gender, either.
I was married for a long time. My wife and I had straight sex. Sometimes I was dressed. Still straight sex. After the divorce I've been with a few men. I was almost always dressed. That was gay sex. I don't think it makes it any less gay that if I was dressed as a woman, "felt" like I was a woman, imagined myself to be a woman, or performed like a woman.
Well, I believe a lot of people who know me also think I'm gay, because I don't have a wife and children or even a serious relationship with a woman. But I don't care. Being gay is kind of ok these days. Most of the people don't think that's bad, at least here in Europe. But most of the people still consider crossdressing a taboo and as something deviant. So it's better for me if others think that I'm gay than know that I'm a crossdresser.
Teresa mentioned "transitioned TS's" as friends...Pre op or post op ? Is it gay sex ? Now,what about F to M guys? How do you two see that ?Quote:
Originally Posted by Rhonda Jean
I would like to think that I have reached the stage of my life where I don't really care if someone thinks I am gay or not.
That makes a big difference to me, Rogina. Altho I'm old, I still feel sex is a big part of any relationship I'm in. So, attraction is critical! I have been, and am NOW, attracted to some pre op TS friends. But, would never come on to them because below the waist my attraction to them STOPS!:thumbsdn:Quote:
Originally Posted by Rogina B
Doc,In a sense you are contributing to the non acceptance of transgender women...Think "pansexual" and who that matters is judging you as a human...I just can't accept the idea that you or others here can't accept the sexual attraction...because she was born with a penis,like you. Your gender is male,hers is not...
I totally accept your, and anyone's, LEGAL sexual attraction to anyone u like, Rogina. It appears u don't accept mine? I'm not sure how your sex parts work nor do I care. But, at my age my soldier only stands up and salutes someone very special!:battingeyelashes:
My days of him saluting any woman in the room at a moments notice r long gone!:sad:
The men I had sex with know I'm not gay. I was RUBBISH in bed! Lmao
I couldn't give a fig what others think of me. Which my wife hates about me. ☺️ That's why I'd go out en femme tomorrow were it not for her (pretty irrational) katagelophobia. There's your word for today. 😜
I have no problem with people thinking I’m gay because society has evolved to a point where there’s general agreement that being gay is not a bad thing.
And arguing that there are more hate crimes in the coasts without acknowledging the greater population density (not to mention the greater diversity) makes for a bit of a hollow argument, imo.
it bothers me because it's not true and it's ignorant to assume that. I have to inform people all the time that No I Am Not Gay. "Well then why do you wear women's clothes?" That is an ignorant question plain and simple. I had that exact exchange in a bar the other day. I was sitting alone at my regular bar when a man approached and asked if he could sit next to me, I said sure. I get hit on pretty regularly and am prepared. I got around to asking him why he came all the way over here to sit by me, he replied that he thought that I was sexy and , well you know. I then informed him that I liked girls and then he hit me with the question, well then why do you dress like that and why I said he could sit by me. First it's a free country, you can sit anywhere you want, second I'm friendly and I crave attention. He then said Well I guess I'm not gonna get anywhere with you, I said NO, only in your dreams big boy. Conversation died at that point and he left the bar soon after. Some might call me a **** tease but I am always upfront about my sexuality.
I know quite a few women that don't wear traditional women's clothes, only men's style and they are not gay.
You know what happens when you Assume?
I think that you "enjoy hanging with the cool kids" at the HM parties but in fact you aren't so accepting of them. What about if one of the girls that you found attracted to revealed,when you asked about her genitals,that she had been castrated a while back....Because she only has "one hole" is she then still off the table for you? She has "no soldier" to stand with yours,lives as a woman...So,is she undesirable to you ? Who knows who has what in their panties ? You have been around the community long enough to know that..Quote:
Originally Posted by docrobbysherry
Lot's of people think I'm gay or bi when in drab, so no difference for me.
Rogina,
I know a couple in that tricky situation , they lived for years in a male to male sitaution now one has fully transitioned , they've stayed together but the male partner is now as confused as hell .
To me a TS is post op , same applies to F/M people .
OK there is no denying gender and sexuality can become very blurred , it really is up to the individuals , if they are happy with their situation and it harms no one else it really doesn't matter .
There r so many wrong assumptions and misstatements in your post I don't know where to start, Rogina? But, u obviously have your panties ruffled about me for some reason? And, that's ok. I don't expect everyone to like me. :straightface:Quote:
Originally Posted by Rogina B
But, I'm concerned you may worry other dressers with your misstatements. I've met 100's of dressers of every ilk and manner over the years but I've NEVER ONCE asked them what was in their panties nor have they asked about mine!:Angry3:
In fact, I could count the number of conversations I've had regarding SEX OF ANY KIND on the fingers of one hand! I can assure everyone sex is NOT a normal topic of conversation at the many T gatherings I've been to!:thumbsdn: