I now wear skirts & tights... In public... In guy-mode...

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Originally Posted by Patience

Nice to see you're making progress (and friends) closer to home.

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Yeah, it's weird. One could argue that I've kinda been transitioning *socially*, anyway. Been here a couple times earlier in my life... Though each era is a bit different (older more-experienced self, new environment with new people, cultural/social shifts re: LGBT, etc.).

Definitely a much-needed & even long-overdue inclusion into a part of society that previously was a bit more off-limits to me, rightfully so. The GG's in my neighborhood have been absolutely wonderful... And I'm even starting to feel more comfortable around certain men.


Anyway, yes, I remember MarkB. I can see why he would do what he does, but just not for me personally. I will say that what he does? Takes steel ones, I assure you. :eek:

However, he's not the chap I was originally thinking of, who pre-dated Mark here by years.



Now, where were we? Ah, yes... Skirts & tights, in guy-mode! :GD:


My first & only outfit of the day, since early this morning, is the skirt/tights/flats thing. Hoodie, winter hat, long femmy winter coat, etc.

I've gone out to my car multiple times to enjoy my, ummm... Morning/afternoon "cups of tea." Hey, legal in my state, anyway? :heehee:


At some point, I was like, I can't do this. Skirt & tights in guy-mode in broad daylight is too tough. And more & more people are starting to mill about. :sad:


Then I told myself: Tough noogies, girl! You intentionally & voluntarily chose your outfit this morning. You didn't have to go this route. Yet, you couldn't resist. You thought you could just back out anytime. Nope! Not in my house, young lady! :roflmao:

And then she made me keep the skirt & tights & flats on, indefinitely. What a total bitch! :lol:


Well, what has helped me keep going, was seeing two GG's wearing skirts, as well, throughout the day so far. Guess I'm in good company! :thumbsup:


BTW, that's something else to consider: Do the GG's in your neck of the woods tend to wear skirts/dresses more often during certain days of the week, time of year, maybe changes in weather?

Others seeing yet another someone else (you!) wearing a skirt on any given day, the same day that GG's may be more likely to wear one? That would help you blend that much better, otherwise. Yeah? Definitely makes things easier, doing things together with others. ;)


Easier said than done, but have confidence, ladies. Stop caring. Do it well & just own it! :battingeyelashes:

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Originally Posted by Jillian Faith

Like Kris I either present 100% male or 100% female. As for my friends they just wouldn't understand why any male would dress enfemme.

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Jillian,

This is one of the problems that we face. It is our duty to educate them as to why men would wear feminine items. You can do this by wearing feminine items while otherwise presenting as a male or non-binary. It is how women won their fashion freedom to wear anything! They simply wore whatever they wanted to wear without attempting to emulate a man. So why not put on a skirt and and some girl shoes and just be yourself? There is no reason why not. I have found that the fear really exists in our own minds. Airlines are even allowing flight attendants and pilot choice and the ability to mix up items from the female and male uniforms. In other words, a flight attendant or pilot could wear a male suit with women's shoes or a women's suit with male shoes. That is just one example. Let's make strides together and have the courage that women had years ago that allowed them to earn their fashion freedom. Are we as courageous at those women? I think it's time to put on your Big Girl Panties and other clothing and get out there and show that world that we are fine with appearing as a feminine male.

Oh, GG's & transwomen (and people like us! :wave2: ) I feel *continue* to earn, every day, our fashion freedom.


I mean, is there really any other way? :strugglin Nature of the beast, I suppose. And that's fine.


Also, our duty to educate? Suppose someone doesn't want any education, for whatever reason(s), valid or otherwise? I mean, we should always be open to offer it. But personally, anyway? I don't feel like I'm on any crusade or anything, ya know?

Just doing me, going about my life. Make of it what you will. :)



BTW, never be afraid to push yourself every now & then. Silly little case-in-point....?


I had just finished up in my car, gearing up to head back inside my apartment. Know what happens sometimes? I wear only "women's things" as much as possible outside of work. It's my default these days. I can handle presenting 100%-guy for work, at least... But anything more than that just ain't happening! :laughing:


So, sometimes I "forget" how I'm dressed... You know, because I've been doing it for so long now on basically a daily basis, that it just feels normal & natural, that I'm just wearing "my clothes."

Then I'm like: Oh, yeah... I may feel comfortable, but how might *others* feel? Good, bad, indifferent? Will they hate it & want to avoid me? Will a GG absolutely gush over me, LOL? (Yes, it happens from time to time. :battingeyelashes: ) Will a "straight" guy start checking me out, being extra nice to me? OMG, this is kinda crazy, if you stop & think about it!! :roflmao:

Obviously I need a moment to compose myself, ha!


And that's when it happens, totally out of the blue: Random Amazon delivery driver pulls up to my building. That's my cue to head inside. Immediately. :devil:

Yeah, I could feel his eyes on me. Sitting in his van, inbetween deliveries, watching what apparently is a GG ( :heehee: ) walking directly past him. Oh, what a little treat during this otherwise God-awful job! he thinks to himself.

Just when I'm about out of range, I turn around... Yep, he's looking at me, confirmed! :confused2:

(Think it was the skirt & tights, perhaps?)


But, I did it. You gotta face your fears sometimes. Just some Amazon delivery guy that I may see once or twice more, if we're lucky, before he quits & we never see each other ever again! :p

So, who cares, really? It's good practice, is all. Anyone can do it.

And this just doesn't apply to only "guy-moding" it... If someone feels the need to go out in public en femme? Then just do it. If you get "read," but nothing comes of it, then does it really matter? They shrugged, you shrugged, life went on. Maybe made their day a little more interesting?


Finally, does Mr. Amazon realize what he was actually looking at a few moments ago? Suppose he did? Suppose he didn't? No harm, no foul.


This is one way to build some confidence, yeah? :)

Making a conscious effort to challenge yourself is how you grow & develop into a better person.


Today has so far been the perfect example...

Outfit for the day? The skirt/tights/flats thing again, in guy-mode. A couple days ago I went the whole day in a similar outfit. Wasn't always easy, but by the end, it had been a total nothing-burger.

Will today be a repeat? No, because I do need to run some errands later... And no way am I *not* gonna change first! :roflmao:


Yeah, I'm a chicken. Admitted. :sad:


In the meantime? Up before sunrise. Dressed & then out to my car for some "morning joe." ;)

Just chilling, pretty scenic view of the sunrise. About half an hour later, time to go back inside.

Huh, interesting... Came out in the dark, yet now is waaaay sunnier & more people are out & about. And I'm wearing what again?!? Eek! :confused2:

Not much you can do at that point, except put on your big-girl panties, a happy smile, and go about your way. Oh, well! Challenge accepted. :p


Well, if you've done your job right? People won't bat an eye. Why? Because decent chance they see Skirt/Tights/LongWinterCoat... Oh, just some woman walking across the parking lot on a weekday morning.

In which case, it's no big deal. Even if they see you. You might just be some sort of random "extra" on the set of their life movie, pretty unimportant in the star's eyes (yet still a role, nonetheless!).


There was a time where I would shy away from people, when dressed like this. If I was too nervous or whatever at the time, I used to maybe wait an extra 5-10 seconds so they could leave the vicinity first. Or, maybe use the side entrance instead of the main one, where I would have otherwise had to interact with them.

But by challenging myself sometimes? After a while, you can turn the dreaded "Uh oh, here comes someone, this is gonna suck... :sad: " thingie into a much better, "Ooh, someone's coming my way... Cool, wonder who it is! :yippee: "


Part of what helped get me there? Sometimes that "someone" is not the bogeyman -- but perhaps actually one of your friendliest & most supportive girly-girl GG-neighbors! Thank God it's her! :thumbsup: Umm, what was I so worried about?? :strugglin

And if on the rare occasion it *is* the bogeyman? Well, face your fears. Only thing you can do. Don't instinctively run away in the other direction -- run *towards* it, instead.

I do this now in certain situations when presenting like this around my neighborhood. For example, sometimes I will try to time it by waiting a extra few seconds, so I *do* end up with an opportunity to interact with them! :devil:


And one of the reasons I do? The lure of the rewards. If I hadn't challenged myself with all this, I never would have met my new neighbor-bestie! Seriously, she's really cool with the whole trans thing, even embracing it. Great to have someone like her in my life. Everyone should have that. :)

i don't think strangers would phase me too terribly much were it to decide to just go out in hybrid mode. I've only gone from my car to my therapist's office a few times dressed in hybrid mode including a beard. I encountered a few people in the process and actually felt good about those encounters. But, my wife's acceptance is limited to my being private. So, I keep my therapy outfits between myself and my therapist with my wife knowing that I might dress for the sessions, but not what I wear.

Not to change the subject, but I find it interesting that it is quite universally acceptable for women to go out in men's clothing, so why should it not be universally acceptable for men to go out in women's clothing? Just a thought I have had for quite some time.

Not sure what your definition of Men’s clothes is. Jeans? Pants? Men’s underwear?

Most women buy their clothes in he women’s department and are not trying to emulate a man. Therefore, they are not men’s clothes.

In most places, men are wearing “women’ clothes”. Just look at all of posts here. Nothing to stop you but yourself.

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Originally Posted by char GG

Not sure what your definition of Men?s clothes is. Jeans? Pants? Men?s underwear?

Most women buy their clothes in he women?s department and are not trying to emulate a man. Therefore, they are not men?s clothes.

In most places, men are wearing ?women? clothes?. Just look at all of posts here. Nothing to stop you but yourself.

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I don't emulate a woman. I love being a man and, no matter what I'm wearing, I am wearing with a full beard and prefer it that way.

But, anyone like me is still GOING to face a backlash if he goes out in public. I might be willing to accept that backlash and just consider the source. My wife is definitely not willing to face the external backlash and would definitely give me some extreme backlash of her own.

Men like me are at a stage where women were a hundred years ago when it was still illegal for women to wear pants in public in certain locals. We could storm the walls and face the carnage, but forcing our loved ones to deal with that carnage makes the prospect unappealing.

You are accepting of men like us and we all appreciate you for it. But, there are definitely things external to many/most of us here on the forums that stop us.

Not something I would want to do.
It's one or the other. Most of the time I'm Cheryl these days. Personally I just don't get the MIAD thing.

I'd say in quite a few cases, when GG's are wearing stuff from the men's department? Only 1 or 2 pieces per outfit, mixed in with their GG-clothing. And if they do it right, most people wouldn't even be able to tell/notice.

And it's not exactly like most of them are wearing like a nice suit & dress shoes, ya know? Think of what the equivalent is for a M2F CD'er. ;)


All too easy for a CD'er to push the extremes & dress to the nines. Of course, gotta also have the accompanying wig & make-up & jewelry & nails & perfume and...

One could argue that it's too much. And too much of "the wrong thing" that sends some people perhaps the wrong message, giving them a sour look on M2F CD'ing.


We are natal/biological males. You really have to make it work for you, as best you can, with this undeniable fact. Only way you're gonna be able to do it.

I do it with skirts & tights in guy-mode, of course. Have to be selective of which ones (styles, fabrics, colors, lengths, sheen, denier, etc.) -- and then just as selective with the rest of the outfit.

I suppose I also recognize my strengths & weaknesses, and play off that. For example, I'm 5'9"... Perhaps a bit on the taller side for GG's, but not unreasonable. Put it this way: I have guy-shoes that have higher "heels" than most of what I wear in *women's*! IOW, my height is staying more or less the same, which helps give me that much more of an edge. Another example, my hips are too narrow for my shoulders... Luckily, there are certain things to wear (and to stay away from!) that help give the appearance of balancing that out for a more feminine shape -- without the use of padding/shapewear, mind you.

So, a fit 5'9" in flats, clean-shaven baby-face, hat/hood for "hair," full women's outfit including a *skirt* of all things, with kinda-sorta a profile/silhouette of an adult female? Even if they realize I'm a guy right off the bat, or takes them a bit? I think they're more likely to be like "whatever" about it, because it doesn't look *too* out of whack from the "normalcy" one would expect... That it probably looks more GG than otherwise. So, while they might not be crazy about the general idea of gender-bending, maybe they'll give me a pass.


I suppose it may appear a bit out of sorts to some, as some sort of "contradiction," like if I had a full beard like Bea. In which case, I believe more people may be a bit less forgiving, given everything else with my overall presentation.

*However*... :D

As mentioned earlier, you really have to make it work, tailoring it to your own uniqueness. What kind of things from the women's department would look good with a full beard? Beats me, because I've never had to look into that before as it's never applied to me. But if I had to guess? Gotta be *some* stuff! Solid masculine/neutral colors? Traditional/conservative prints & plaids? Femmy combat boots with thick (women's) socks? I dunno. :strugglin



It's "funny," but I recall a conversation I had with my neighbor-bestie a while back -- who was born & raised in a part of the country where none of this stuff flies particularly well, ya know...?

"So, like, I'd probably get my butt kicked dressed like this there, yeah?"

"Yep."

"Well, I can handle myself pretty well, so there better be more than one."

Her, in 100% seriousness: "Oh, there would be like twenty guys, don't worry."

:confused2:


Places like this still exist. I don't live there, and nor would I want to. (She & her lesbian sister escaped as soon as they could.)

So, try to keep that in mind. It's "easy" for me to do this because of where I am. Good place, good time.

Otherwise, kinda beats the alternative of a couple weeks in the ICU, yeah? ;)

This is an interesting topic as I had the similar thoughts. I had recently got a plain shirtdress and was going to wear it outside in the yard when it gets warmer out with a black miniskirt under it so it might look like shorts from a distance if it comes up a little bit.

I have zero privacy as I can be seen in almost all of the yard by neighbors. They ain't the right kind if you know what I mean.

That is confidence, indeed. I am getting to be very comfortable with going out in public fully dressed en femme, but the idea of going out wearing unambiguously feminine clothing terrifies me.

Interesting thread Ellbee. I very seldom wear men's clothes, BUT I keep it nonbinary (no skirts) in public. Tight women's jeans, leggings, long sweaters, long hoodies and t-shirts (always in "women's colors"). I have alopecia so I have no facial or body hair (yay!) so looking nonbinary is really easy. I also wear scarves on my head sometimes so I think (depending on what I'm wearing) people may be curious about my gender when they see me (not obvious).

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Originally Posted by ellbee

I suppose it may appear a bit out of sorts to some, as some sort of "contradiction," like if I had a full beard like Bea. In which case, I believe more people may be a bit less forgiving, given everything else with my overall presentation.

*However*... :D

As mentioned earlier, you really have to make it work, tailoring it to your own uniqueness. What kind of things from the women's department would look good with a full beard? Beats me, because I've never had to look into that before as it's never applied to me. But if I had to guess? Gotta be *some* stuff! Solid masculine/neutral colors? Traditional/conservative prints & plaids? Femmy combat boots with thick (women's) socks? I dunno. :strugglin

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Your original post is about being dressed in femme clothes while in guy mode. I'm finding that the beard is not much more of a giveaway than a lot of other tells. I've got a hard brow line, broad shoulders and there is nothing feminine about my physique. My beard covers up a misshaped jawline that I hate so the tradeoff is worth it to me. I'd make an ugly woman and, with the beard, my 'man' persona is much better looking.

"Making it work" for me would not be neutral or conservative. I prefer to look like a man who chooses a "pretty" look rather than as a woman. For that reason, I'll probably just stay home...

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Originally Posted by RoxieGrl

Not to change the subject, but I find it interesting that it is quite universally acceptable for women to go out in men's clothing, so why should it not be universally acceptable for men to go out in women's clothing? Just a thought I have had for quite some time.

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The only women I see out in men's clothing are lesbians.

My hat is tipped to you, ellbee, You are boldly going in your own chosen direction. In a kind loving world that I see in my mind, people would wear what they choose and live at peace with their neighbours. Alas that just isn't so, in my neck of the world. I would definitely wear skirts and hosiery all the time as weather permits. Most of your sentiments, I think the same, post # 15 is spot on.

Regarding women who wear "men's" clothing: I think the point is something that I've told many friends about who don't know about my weird hobby. Basically, there is nothing in the man's side of the closet (pretending that there are no size issues) that a woman couldn't put on and wear to Walmart without turning heads. The same is not true for her side of the closet and what he could wear. She can wear pants, men's shirts, even neckties. He can't even wear her t-shirts, forget about her Daisy Dukes or sundress. At least he can't while conforming to social norms, which is what I, for one, wish we could change.

Don't forget that if you are wearing a skirt and are a crossdresser you are a man.

Like a long ago member here, I go for the Iowa farm wife look.

I have got to get my shape back. Had a cold that would not let go this winter and my belly looks full of jelly. I love getting out dressed up and want to try a few stores yet I have a few months of hard working out ahead. In December I was out in heavy black leggings in some what guy mode and no one even noticed.