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True, but my idea is prevention.Quote:
Originally Posted by Katesback
Being transgender is something that has to be put out on the table fairly early on, the consequences of not doing so are tragic and have multiple examples on this very forum.
Unfortunately, if you're straight your dating pool just shrunk by an incredible amount I'd think.
LOL Jess, it was actually amusing to find that you're at most just 7 years younger than Chrismy... while IMO the "how old are you" comment was extremely rude, you did ask for it by looking more like 43 in your avatar. *wink*Quote:
Originally Posted by JessHaust
As for the "should have told her" thing... if only life can be as black and white.
I am so sorry to hear this....I hope this somehow works itself out, it's clear that you love her very much....
Saddens me to hear this. I hope it gets better.
Chrismy, I've been around for a while here, and I'm close to your age, so I do feel entitled to share with you a few things (kindly). I'm a GG.
First, take a deep breath.
Second, tell us what happened exactly. This can wait until tomorrow or the next day, whenever you feel up to typing it all out.
Third, this could be about having made the (wrong) decision to tell your wife, but believe me it could be about other things too. It is worth your while to consider other scenarios if it might help your situation. You won't lose anything by trying.
I looked at your older posts and you had a discussion with your wife last August, 7 months ago when you told her to like to wear nylons and she asked if you wanted to have sex with men. At the time you felt you should go slowly with her so as not to go overboard. And then there were a series of posts where you were (understandably) enthralled over having experienced girlie moments. I can't say as I blame you, having kept a lid on it all these years.
So here's the situation: you're in one place with all of this (nearly exploding) and your wife is in another (reacting in shock because she is discovering a side of you that is quite developed, that she had no idea about or that she might have thought was a harmless little hobby). This is no time for the "you should have told her earlier or not told her at all" blame game. The reality is, you need to deal with the "now" and the unfortunate reality is, you could not keep a lid on it (judging by your posts) and everyone here will understand this after all these years. And your wife feels overwhelmed and she needs time to catch up. It's bad timing.
If things hadn't reached such an explosive stage for her and such an urgent stage for you, I'd recommend talking to her: lots of talk, while putting the nylons, the hairdos, and everything else on a shelf for awhile until she learned more about this. I would have suggested she join this forum and join the private FAB forum to talk to other wives. I would have suggested you both look online together for resources. But most importantly, I would have suggested you let her know your need to do this (it is not a choice) and your need for her cooperation because you don't want to lose her, and also your willingness to work within her boundaries as long as it takes for her to make an honest effort to learn more about this. Genuinely learn more.
Now we all know that often people say things in anger, situations can look hopeless, but given time for things to calm down (and if there are no other marital issues, also the people involved don't have volatile tempers), things can and do improve.
So please, come back and tell us exactly what happened, try to be as objective as you can, try to stay away from "I should have/shouldn't have/she should have/shouldn't have", and don't spare any details. There's a lot of collective wisdom here (except the member who suggests you might become TS) and we may be able to offer you a plan of action that you hadn't thought of.
Chris, this is really sad. Is this a 1st. response, what I mean is......is there a chance that after she calms down maybe she just might be willing to talk just a little about "it" and not just throw everything away so quickly.
I will say a little prayer for you and her and hope that things will calm down and the two of you can stay together.
I can't believe I didn't see notice this before.Quote:
Originally Posted by Jeannie
First, you are in NO WAY qualified to determine whether or not Chrismy's wife is selfish, nor do you know if Chrismy's wife has any friends that she discussed this with. Neither Chrismy nor Chrismy's wife have enlightened us with the particular details that caused the situation. It could be anything.
Second, you are way off base with your broad-brush statement that suggests women are devoid of reason and logic. This is downright insulting, coming from a member who participates in a forum where a significant number of members do their best to get in touch with their inner femininity. Are they all devoid of reason and logic as well?
Last, what makes you believe that GGs who have been raised in environments where men were men and women were women, and who have been subject to the same bias against transgenders that causes the vast majority of CDers to purge repeatedly and stay closeted, especially a GG who discovers after 28 years of marriage that her husband is enthralled with femininity (there doesn't appear to have been a slow build-up to this), that she should say what? "Yes dear I understand and I'm happy for you?" She's allowed to be freaked out, given the exuberance that Chrismy (understandably) experiences over having taken the lid off of a lifetime of repression.
It is totally wrong to blame just the wife here. It is a very unfortunate situation for everyone involved, including their children.
I can relate also after 28 years I told wife, 1st year was supportive and has been downhill since, real bad. For those of us who grew up in 50's & 60's a totally different world. No information or very little available, I also felt this would go away. Whether this is a good or bad thing only you and your family will be able to determine this as time goes on, I certainly can't give any advice but pay attention to Reine, she has some very useful advice, best wishes.
I'm a little bit older than Patty B. I also grew up in the 1950's and 1960's. I first dabbled with wearing my mother's slips, then clothing. There was no information out there to research. There was no Internet. There were normal girls and boys. Everybody else were "faggots." The word gay had not yet been co-opted by the homosexual community. For those who are young I dare you to get into a time machine and return to those days. You would be totally confused as well. How do you tell a girl of the 1950's and 1960's you feel like any other guy looking to score, BUT, you also like to wear women's clothing. You're going to do just like we did- be confused, deny, self loathe, etc. You're not going to have any legal protection in the work place or church or anywhere in society. You're probably going to get your ass kicked by some brother or cousin of your girl friend.
Fast forward to now. Do you really think the vast majority of women are looking to hook up with a cross dresser. Love may make all of us be blind at some point. Then reality sets in.
I did not realize what a cross dresser was until was able to research the issues on the Internet. My wife and I engaged in bedroom play with lingerie. But, when she and I finally discovered I was a cross dresser she cooled really fast to the idea. It took many years of having a good solid marriage to weather the storms of cross dressing which is strictly in a DADT mode. That is fine with me.
My wife once asked me why I did not tell her earlier. That was after she calmed down over the years. I asked her if she remember how she and her cousin whispered at the kitchen table how the cousin's best friend was getting a divorce (They lived six houses away from us) because she found out her husband was a cross dresser. Sure, come out to the wife and watch your entire life disappear? Be scarred for life? Be scared for life that every knowing eye is looking at you?
It seems too many wives are willing to throw away an otherwise good/terrific marriage. Are they concerned over the relationship with their husband? Or are they concerned about what society may say? "Oh, poor dear, she found out she was married to a cross dresser and did not know it!"
It took my wife a long time to realize I was not too much different than the person she first married. Yes, my cross dressing has been kept private. I do not ask her to participate. She is still not accepting. I can only suggest you and your wife have a serious discussion about your cross dressing. Ask her what her true feelings are.
I know I am going to get a lot of heat for it, BUT, I truly believe finding out a husband is a cross dresser is NOT a reason to dissolve an otherwise good thirty year marriage. I just do not buy into the idea the reason for dissolving the marriage is deceit and withholding information for thirty years.
I have to run to a meeting, so I'll finish this later.
I agree with you. If the marriage is otherwise good I also believe it can withstand the knowledge that a husband CDs. But, there are two ways to withhold information. For people like you, Eryn, and others, who struggled with this as well and didn't even have a name for it, it is understandable you could not discuss that which you did not know about yourselves. But, there are also CDers who are there: they know what it is, they've joined online communities, they know what they want, but they minimize or deny it to their wives. Like a CDer, for example, who tells his wife he needs to wear nylons in order to help his leg circulation. We're not talking pre-internet days here since forums such as this one have been around for nearly 10 years. We're talking current times involving a CDer whose needs to express herself are so great as to be actively involved and no longer be able to keep a lid on it. A CDer who has already accepted himself and who cannot come clean to his wife. And yes, I know there are many different, other dynamics that can come into play.Quote:
Originally Posted by Stephanie47
I'm not casting blame on the CDer either, but I can see why some of the wives feel lied to as in my example above. But, if a CDer still feels the need to lie to his wife after he has a full understanding of the CDing, then perhaps the marriage does have other issues (the list of potential issues is long) that would then make it difficult to navigate this. It's a complex situation all around.
I am so sorry you are in this situation. I see that you haven't posted in a while. I hope that means that you and your wife are in some discussions and that she's indicated that shutting down your femme self in all ways is the basis for the beginning of a discussion. In case you are still lurking here I wanted to say that no one here can know the situation you are in, and the only ones who can get close are those who have been rejected once they have opened their hearts only to find rejection.
Life is different now than it was 3 or 4 decades ago, so saying you should have "come clean" (whatever that really means) in the beginning is a bit naive IMHO. One the other side of the coin, the person you are is the same person you were yesterday and the day before that. If your wife doesn't have a religious or moral issue with being transgendered, then there is always hope. If she does have such an issue, then the path is much darker.
There is no good answer here except for getting professional help from a marriage councelor who has knowledge of the details of transgenderism.
My best hopes for both of you!
tina
Perhaps after a cooling off period there may be opportunity for reconciliation. As much as you will be missing her would it not seem fair to believe she will be missing many things about you? That could be the basis for gradually bridging the current distances between you both.
I am so sorry that you and your wife are at an impasse over this.
I am not here to tell you anything, but just a few observations:
What would have happened if you lost a leg in an accident or had cancer or some disfiguring skin disease?
Would she have had the same response to tell you that she was going to split now that you are different than when you were married and you never told me that this may happen to you?
Did you tell her to take a hike when she went through menopause? The life of my wife and myself did a complete change during and after menopause. It was a major ordeal for us. And that was on top of all my medical issues which did not exist when we married.
I just find the above so much worse in life than your wife learning that her husband likes to wear a dress.
I guess it is all about love and priorities.
Others have posted here about maybe this was just the kicker for her to move on. I think they are right and it could have been any major life change so try not to blame yourself.
I have been married 16 years which a a lot less than you and both my wife and I had some days that we both were screaming that we both wanted out, but decided to try to get past the issue (with counseling) and luckily we are still together. Will we stay married till the death do us part? Who the hell knows. We just take it day by day.
I wish the best of luck to the both of you no matter how it goes. And please try to remember that being alone and being lonely are two different things.
Reine,Quote:
Originally Posted by ReineD
You are the most amazing friend in a time of need.
Lovely and loving response to an emotional thread.
I feel very fortunate you are here.
Chrismy,
I am sorry that things are going the way they are for you and your family. Life can be so hard sometimes, can't it? To play a 'what if' game is next to impossible... 'What if i hadn't told her' is followed so closely with 'what if she had discovered it on her own'?
It seems important to me that you phrased your OP with saying the only person you cheated in her with was yourself. Is it you or she who feels like there was cheating? Would a marriage counsellor be able to at least bring some peace and closure?
Jeannie, I saw after I clicked the quote button that Reine has addressed your post. I just want to say that I completely agree with her that what you post is very much unfair to the many GGs who need some time. Chrismy's wife has had months to try to deal with it. Chrismy has had decades, and lives it. OF COURSE they aren't going to be on the same page right away! No one ever said having a TG partner was any easier, but I do believe that two people who have good communication and emotional strength will be able to see the good in each other no matter who they are - if they have the incentive to stay enough to find it.Quote:
Originally Posted by Jeannie
I have done this. I was neither arrested nor killed. I sometimes wore less, or saw other women wearing less. I sometimes wore much more. The clothing was not as important as the showing of respect to the culture I was surrounded by. In travel, in cultures and in life, respect truly is a two-way thing.Quote:
Originally Posted by Treetop Louise
Sorry to hear this. I was divorced after 16 years, certainly less than you, but it is just plain difficult. I think only the people who have been through it know how it feels. I thought of at least a dozen "reasons" my marriage didn't work, but finally realized that I just unfortunately landed in the divorced 50% instead of the married 50%. None of us see it coming, I hope you are okay. The worst for me was the effect it had on my kids, I also hope your kids are okay.
Why are you moving? Don't let her punish you for being honest. If you've been with her for 28 years I imagine you've been dressing a bit longer. She'll threaten you with telling everyone or whatever. So what? They're are strict laws that protect all of us from discrimination. Does she have a job, career? Take all of this into consideration and stand up! Fight for what is yours. Punished for honesty? I have two words for her!
Aylineira ... i have no idea how things went so bad so fast. i am truely astoundsounded
It's always about communication. chrismy, i'm so sorry what's happening, but slow down, talk, get counseling. Together is best, but start with yourself. Some of us, that means me, take a long long time to come to terms and accept ourselves. ReineDs post is a key one, if you truly want assistance from this diverse but caring group. Good luck.
I am heartened by those who are willing to see both sides of this experience we share.
Who are patient, caring and have empathy for each other.
"As already said, our feelings are with you. Life as you well know deals different hands for no apparent reason. You have just been dealt the opportunity to prove to the one you love why you love her and to teach her who you are and that you are not someone to fear. It's an opportunity only you can decide how to address."
I am disheartened when I read how quickly a woman who has no voice is discredited here...
"Why are you moving? Don't let her punish you for being honest. If you've been with her for 28 years I imagine you've been dressing a bit longer. She'll threaten you with telling everyone or whatever. So what? They're are strict laws that protect all of us from discrimination. Does she have a job, career? Take all of this into consideration and stand up! Fight for what is yours. Punished for honesty? I have two words for her!
"So sad that she couldn't see past her selfishness and try to learn more about the why and how to understand how you feel. Women have a tendency to think and act with their emotion first and then what their friends think before acting on knowledge and reason. It sounds to me that telling her from the start would have had the same effect as telling her now."
These are just a couple of examples from one thread.....
Chris, thanks for posting! There's a LESSON HERE for all CDs willing to think about it!
If U R NOT planning to come out of the closet, WHY do u feel the need to TELL ANYONE about your "hobby"? After all, it's a lot like toothpaste you've squeezed out. It's NEVER going back in and things will NEVER be like they were!
I lost a close girlfriend I'd had for over 30 years because of my need to, "Tell someone!" BIG MISTAKE!
many thanks to everyone here for thier opinions. a lot of good stuff from which i will take a lot. ) what a forum with many unique insights... my thanks again ... chris
ps .... took some time out for myself today and had big hair thursday a day early .... 4 hours to make my hair do this .... worth every minute and felt out of this world....
I'm sorry that things turned sour on you. Maybe in time she'll come around and realize the marriage can survive. Then again maybe she won't. Either way, you both have a chance to move forward to a better place, either together or not. I wouldn't throw in the towel just yet though, I remember when I told my wife back when we were dating, she debated leaving me for awhile, but after a lot of soul searching she decided what we had was worth working through, and now she is the epitome of acceptance. Who knows, give her time, give her space, and above all LISTEN to what she has to say.
Good luck to the both of you!
Hey Chrismy,
My wife stumbled upon my stash back in 2005 and it wasn't until recently (a few weeks ago) she decided to go to a PALS meet (support group for women who have a cross dressing husband) and also spoke to a counselor who specializes in gender identity. Once she figured out that it was not her fault and that nothing was wrong with her, she completely did a 180 and has been supportive of me. At the same time I had to open up and be 100% honest with her about my cross dressing, including my purchases, which I gladly do and always wanted to do... it just takes time. She and I are still working on boundaries but she loves me so much that she even bought me a closet, hung my clothes and stored my shoes in it then told me that I should not have to hid my clothes under the basement stairs in a plastic garbage bag. All i could do is hug her and tell her i loved her.... it takes time (7 years in my case)
It's a horrible situation to deal with. My wife discovered my knee length balck suede boots in my suitcase when she was concealing my valentine card earlier this year. She came straight down and challenged me 'Why have you got a pair of high heeled boots in your bag?'. The ultimate in balck comedy...
I had always feared the worst - but she has actually come to terms with it very well and it is now allowing me to express myself more fully in all sorts of ways and I feel that it helps us both move on to better things.
Uncomfortable as it may sound - if the relationship can't take this revelation then it is probably a sign that it wasn't a really worthwhile relationship in the first place and should be seen as an opportunity to move on to develop who you really are and find a relationship with more depth. Not that that is any real solace in the short term - but may be seen more in hindsight.