I'm all man all the time, no matter what I wear.Quote:
Originally Posted by Lacyfem
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I'm all man all the time, no matter what I wear.Quote:
Originally Posted by Lacyfem
Men are yuchhy....I don't want anything to do with that!
I agree with some of the other posts here - I feel like when I'm dressing I'm certainly doing my best to improve/increase my femininity however that doesn't lower or reduce my masculinity when I'm not dressing.
Very interesting topic...good thread!!
Not at all Nikki. I all man at work or with friends.But when I'm home well I feel all woman.:hugs:
Angie
As society defines manhood? Of course.
But I also think Crossdressing makes me more of a full human being. I really dont care for many of our society's social norms/rules anyway.
It actually makes you more of a man. You have to be strong to stand up against everyone that disapproves our lifestyle.
OMG!!! there are some who disapprove?
Yes if it means less of a man defined by feminity-suppressed person, which implies more of a feminity-enhanced man.
Society as it is right now will tell you you're less of a man, but they have it wrong, wrong wrong. I have discovered I am a more complete human being because of my crossdressing. My personality is a mix of both male and female (I usually say 60% female) and to deny either side is not healthy for me. My guess is that everyone in this forum is a mix of both in any proportion ranging from 10% to 99% femme and we're all beautiful people (speaking only my own case, it's just inner beauty)
It makes me more of the man I want to be, meaning a more balanced individual. You can’t listen or subscribe to other people’s notions of what “being a man” entails. Most men are insecure, and they are on guard against any intrusions into their fortress of masculinity. Interesting men do not bother with such made-up nonsense. They (meaning we) take what they have and see what they can do with it. It takes courage to crossdress, drop the injurious vestiges of “male,” and become more of a man than any other man could possibly imagine. Just imagine your “self” and make it happen…Quote:
Originally Posted by Nikki Rich
:battingeyelashes:
Beauty, and 'manliness', is in the eyes of the beholder. Sadly, this winds up meaning that to most women, we are 'less of a man'. That means it's not a big problem if you're interested in having sex with men, and expect to have a male life partner, because there are men out there who are interested in having sex with a reasonably attractive mtf crossdresser. But women? Very, very few. You're more likely to win the lottery than find a woman who is attracted to a mtf crossdresser.
That's funny.I don't see a man at all in your avitar:)Quote:
Originally Posted by IngeInCO
Yes, I agree. Looks like a pretty girl to me.Quote:
Originally Posted by CarolynO
It levels me out, otherwise I'm a raging ahole :-(
Of course it makes you less of a man.... But then again, that's the whole point!
I'd equate this to a question like "does eating a steak make you less of a vegetarian"
In a humorous way, my wife said, "Well, no, but having Tinkerbelle as your avatar might." :) (No insult actually intended)
Yes, it makes me less of a man and more of a girl. Which is exactly the way I like it!! If only I could make it 100% girl and 0% man!!
There's some great answers here, but I would expect no less from such a neat group of people.
So, my answer...
In the time that I have been crossdressing, my male persona, behaviors and interests have not changed that much at all. Such that you can see, anyway. What has changed internally is that I have just about given up the notion of having to make my masculinity bulletproof to the point where no one would question it. All my life I have invested an extraordinary amount of energy in this, but what I have finally realized is that it has NO POINT. Once I started to relax about that, a sense of relief comes not unlike outing yourself to someone. Basically you come to understand that some things can just be given up and you don't have to carry that burden anymore.
As men, we carry of lot of B/S that society has given us. Stuff like "Be a man.", "Don't cry.", "Don't act like a sissy." and many other similar verbal daggers. It can make us feel that any sort of tenderness and compassion just shouldn't happen. As I said, B/S.
So, it may well be that some of us feel less than a man sometimes. If that works for you, fine. Don't let anyone tell you any different. Conversely, don't say that you think you are not less of a man because that's what you think you should say...
Ms Laura tell your wife she's too funny :) , I really love the diversity of this group , as a I originally said I don't think I'm less of a man than I've e ever been. I now just allowing a side of me show that's always been there , I've come to realize that trying to supress this part of me makes me a asshole which does more damage to my relationship with my wife than crossdresseing could ever do. I've been out to my wife about 4 months now , so we are still navigating these uncharted waters.
In my opinion, yes it does. Both in the eyes of others and in regards to ourselves. The majority, if not all, of the members of this site for example will refer to each other using a female pronoun, and there are many threads which discuss not only our desire to look like women, but also expressing how we want to feel like women. And when dressing in public, numerous members talk about how enjoyable it is for them to be treated as a woman.Quote:
Originally Posted by Nikki Rich
In regards to others, our dressing will result in questions about our masculinity and, much to the annoyance of the straight cd's, our sexuality. While one shouldn't necessarily confuse the idea of being masculine with the the notion of being a man, as masculinity and femininity are a little more fluid than our actual gender stipulates, they are nevertheless terms which work as signifiers in terms of how others view us, and indeed how we present ourselves. An effeminate man may not necessarily be gay, but just like many crossdressers have experienced, it will result in others questioning their sexual orientation. For some, such questions are justified by the answer given - that is, some crossdressers are gay, just as some effeminate men are.
But I digress. Personally, I do regard myself as less of a man. I am effeminate, I am gay, and I do crossdress. It doesn't bother me in the slightest that others would regard me as less of a man than an "average Joe", because that's exactly how I regard myself. For other cd's however, it may be as simple as turning on and off a switch - when they present themselves as male, to others they wouldn't be regarded as any less of a man than any other man. But there nevertheless remains a part of them (which is a part that makes up their whole) which does align more to the notion of femininity, the idea of being a woman, and that part (which makes up their whole) is far removed from what being a man encompasses. And it's on that level that I believe your question should be addressed. Not the job we do, or the truck we drive. Anybody, be they male or female can do jobs that are traditionally/socially more commonly associated with the opposite gender. It's from inside ourselves where your question should be answered. When you dress, do you feel like a man, or desire to feel like a woman? At the risk of being presumptious, I would say the latter. And the clothes, the make-up, the external presentation of ourselves when dressing is simply a means in order for us to be able to embrace our feminine side.
Shania Twain once sang "Man. I feel like a woman" Sums it up for me.
Less of a Man??....................What is a Man??
There are many things in life we don't understand and crossdressing is just one of those many things. It doesn't change what I feel in my heart just softens the blows I recieve from the world and its rigid society.
Oh My Gawd, we're all getting in touch with our FEELINGS. We are NOT supposed to do that. Says so right here, on Page 9 Paragraphs 18 and 19, in the Guy's All-Star Shoe Band Guy's Handbook.
Read'em and weep. Whoops. We aren't supposed to do that either...
Yes, it make one less of a man in the stereotypical sense. After all, we love these strictly female sensations
However, the question should be if it make you less of a person which is of course no.
ABSOLUTELY NOT! It makes me somewhat angry when people say it does. When I told my mother about it, my wife was with me. She said, even though I dress, I'm still all man, except for this little part of me.
I couldn't agree more.Quote:
Originally Posted by Shibumi
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Originally Posted by Shibumi
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Originally Posted by Natalie Wood
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Originally Posted by IngeInCO
I agree with all three of these individual's. Getting my inner girlie on does not make me more of a man nor does it make me less. BTW Women can do almost anything a man can do. The things that women can't do or perhaps not does as well or feats of strength. That is just physiology nothing more. When it comes to the mind neither is better then the other.
Cheers
So a little part of you is not a man. Then, it follows that it makes you a "little" less of a man.:)Quote:
.......... I'm still all man, except for this little part of me.......
I would not say that crossdressing makes me any less of a man, I still do all the manly stuff all week long,
I work as a mechanic all week long, I just happen o like the finer womens clothes when I get the chance.
Isnt that the point? :)
I think for the longest time my cross dressing was perplexing to my wife. My personalty that attracted her really has not changed at all over forty plus years. My cross dressing was not a premarital secret. It developed along the way. I did nothing to try to compensate for my cross dressing. I did not become boorish. I did not become a "man's man" to conceal my cross dressing. I worked hard all my life. I supported my family. Everyone went to college on my dime. I served my time in the military doing the ultimate 'manly' things. What's between my legs has not defined me.
Quote:
Originally Posted by KatieGG
What an excellent question, for me personally I don't feel less of a man, I used to do when I was younger but not now, but I am sure my wife sees my girlie side as me being less of a man to the one she married, I am happy with me and as someone else said, I don't harm anyone, this is something for me
Quote:
Originally Posted by Shibumi
i'm like that and it still puzzles me at times how the machoest of of some men opt to dress up en femme whatever their reason is.
it makes me feel more understanding to women and how much time and effort they put in to make themselves lovely. i understand why they hate wearing pantyhose because of how it feels and its bothersome to put on. i understand why they take so much time to put makeup on, why fixing their hair takes several minutes, and why they get bored with their clothes (i wanna get a new dress too!) :D
No. the answer is no in any way. Its just a feminine side of me living the momento.
When I am dressed, I am the same man as when not dressed. I never consider myself a "woman" because I am not. Clothing, it would seem, does NOT make the man or woman. Now, there is also no question in my mind that cross dressing and the archetype of "man" do not go together. So, if that is the comparison, then yes, I am less a man than the male archetype. But then, all women are less feminine than the female archetype. My wife doesn't think of me as less "male" and that is all I care about.
It's a given that were are the same person whether "dressed" or not. That is not the issue.
The OP asked if being a CD made one less of a man. As someone asked, is that not the point? :)
Actually I think we first have to open the can of worms labeled "what is a man"? ;)
Sometimes the shortest answer is the best, as in this case.Quote:
Originally Posted by cdxmatty
I'm an occasional dresser, but when I transform, it's the whole nine yards.
I am 100% man, except for those occasional times when I'm en femme.
Then, while living out my fantasy, I'm not 100% man.
So, my answer is that crossdressing makes me less of a man.
And that's the point of my crossdressing.
Heck no! I am not manly at all anyways but I still feel like a man.
In my case,the woman has pretty much taken over. I don't go into guy mode until I absolutely have to. My job requires me to appear manly,and sometimes stay that way for 2 or 3 weeks at a time. During these periods,I adjust and feel as much a man as ever. But emotionally,the feminine side is dominant.
Well, it makes me feel more like a woman.
Jenni, I like your answer. It certainly covers how I feel...less of a man. Definitely.Quote:
Originally Posted by jenni_xx
There is no one answer here because everyone first had to define, operationally, a number of concepts such as "man", what being "less" of a man is, etc.
From my perspective, Nicole has it right. When I transform to Tina, the idea is to allow Tina to come to the fore, so the male side is left behind. When I transform back to being male, there is no Tina present. So, from the time perspective, the time that I'm Tina diminishes the time that I'm in drab.
Emotionally one could argue that for the last 7 years I've been able to separate and identify my two gendered selves whereas before that I was just "me". That would make me more of a "man" when I am in drab.
Hmmmm, maybe we should discuss how many angels can dance on the head of a pin :)
Personally, I feel I've been there, done that, and earned my "man card" several times over. I have a state high school football record, done the "jump out of planes/go to war/get shot at/lead others in combat" thing with the Army, hunt, fish and established myself as an Olympic class sharpshooter years ago. For me, it's not about being less of a man, but a more complete PERSON. The more I embrace this side of me, the better I feel, and honestly my wife is starting to embrace her too. I'm not saying she loves it, but I think we're both happier together since I've admitted to myself who I am. Actually, I'd say that I try harder to be more supportive and understanding of her, do things for her, and make it a point to love her more and better than I used to.
I think it has made me compromise more and be a better spouse, and if that means less of a man, well, then I'm less of a man!
crossdressing has made me more a woman than ever!!!
Gender is a purely social thing as far as I'm concerned. I have typically macho guy friends who drop that act completely when not around their male friends or trying to hook up with women. I also have very girly female friends who live in heels and glitter, yet will happily don camo overalls, gun, get caked in mud and swear like a truck driver when out paintballing. Both will revert back to their stereotypical gender roles afterwards. In my experience, there is really very little difference between biological males and females in terms of gender personality. The majority of people behave in a way that we feel will impress others and obtain social benefit. Our current society dictates that certain behaviour is labelled as feminine or masculine and that biological males or females are only allowed to pick from their designated list. So, if you mean, does crossdressing make a biological male less of one, then I would answer no. However, it would (deliberately) make you less of a male gender in the eyes of mainstream society.
I agree it absolutely does not make you any less if a man. I'm a combat vet, father and husband. And I look good in heels and lipstick. The definition of a man is taking responsibility for your actions, putting the needs of others above your own. On a biological level it's more often you see men inclined to be the provider and women inclined to be a care taker it just come from evolution. In today's society we don't have to live by it. Either way if you prefer traditional gender roles you can still be the MAN and dress. Or you can take on a new role as still be a man.
The botton line is simply this...Who is doing the and how do you define and what is a man?
There many ways to define the word "man". Many of those definitions are subjective and involve parameters loosely defined by the traditional "Manly Virtues". Crossdressing has no effect on some of those virtues (courage, martial honor, the ability to find reverse in an old 4-speed stick). But making a serious effort to have yummy cleavage and wearing a wig, makeup and pink satin panties does raise One's girliness score thereby lower One's subjective masculinity. At least I hope so. For me that's the point.
I really appreciate all of the thoughts and opinions that have been expressed in this thread. That being said, it kinda seems like being "manly" is like beauty, it's in the eyes of the beholder.