I would say yes we are more accepted. Certainly by teens and adults.
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I would say yes we are more accepted. Certainly by teens and adults.
I think it's partly a matter of where you live. A more conservative community or someplace in the "Bible belt" will clearly not be as tolerant as others. The other part is, do you attempt to pass, or are you just presenting as a man in a dress. I think people will have more acceptance for someone who is truly transgender, (thanks to the recent awareness efforts) than they will from someone who seems to be just dressing up for some weekend kicks.
My community is mildly conservative. I work in my local mall at a kiosk. I have one of the best sales records of anyone at my store. I dress to "pass" and if I'm getting read, I can count on one hand (and have fingers left over) the number of times someone let on...
We have a doctor in town that lists LGBTQ medicine as one of her specialties!
Things have improved out of all recognition here at least, although I do tend to agree that it's more an acceptance of trans people than of crossdressing as such.
But in the end of the day, if some randomer thinks you're trans and you're not - who cares? If they're nice to you and respectful and let you enjoy your day and go about your business, then what's the problem?
I do agree that in principle it would be better it they understood that CD is a thing in its own right and not odd or better or worse than anything else. But if this thread is about the ability to go out into the world and be yourself - whoever that might be and whyever - then I do think that has improved a lot. My 2c.
Quote:
Originally Posted by VeronicaMoonlit
Insulting me doesn't make your position any more valid. Talk about intolerance. And thinking that anyone who doesn't share your point of view is a bigot is the definition of bigotry.
Perhaps you live in the land of lollypops and unicorns, but the situation is very different in Anytown, USA. Men who throw on a wig and a pair of fake boobs and parade around town in a dress are still thought of as weird. And while they may not be physically attacked, they will still get the catcalls and dirty looks.
Okay;
Lets dial it back to the OP and not get personal by anyone. It's not fair to the OP to have the thread closed.
If you feel that someone is commenting on you personally take it to a private conversation , 9 times out of 10 its a misunderstanding of a simple phrase and not a personal attack.
I didn't insult you. All I did was call out those "real" people you mentioned as bigots. So unless you identify WITH those "real" people, you shouldn't have a problem. And You didn't answer my question of "why you think the media is wrong" and "where"Quote:
Originally Posted by Krisi
Share my point of view? What point of view is it you think I have? Being homophobic or transphobic is literal bigotry. You're also basically calling those people who called out religious, racial, ethnic or gender bigotry in the past, bigots. Why on earth would you say that?Quote:
Talk about intolerance. And thinking that anyone who doesn't share your point of view is a bigot is the definition of bigotry.
Oh, You're basically doing that "you big city damnyankees aren't Real Americans" bit on me. Who says I don't live in the Illinois version of Anytown USA.Quote:
Perhaps you live in the land of lollypops and unicorns, but the situation is very different in Anytown, USA.
Perhaps. But how are the public to learn otherwise if they don't interact with them.Quote:
Men who throw on a wig and a pair of fake boobs and parade around town in a dress are still thought of as weird.
Catcalls and dirty looks are RUDE. As I said, perhaps you need to find better people who don't do that.Quote:
And while they may not be physically attacked, they will still get the catcalls and dirty looks.
Veronica
Krisi,
It's very sad and possibly insulting to resort to that description , it means far more to me and many others here to desribe it in those terms . Also the described reaction is so far from the truth , I've been out full time for a year now and not had any sort of reaction at all , I just go about my business , chatting to people , having a laugh , it really is very normal , honestly no BS !
Every time I post about being out and about without major incident (im not out every day perhaps once a month)the usual suspects argue my view,.Im not saying I live in some utopian society,believe me the West of Scotland certainly ain't that,but neither am I blowing smoke up anyone's *** believe me if I thought I was being ridiculed at every turn I wouldn't step out the door.
As long as you are conscious about your surroundings,and don't take unnecessary risks,actually in the same way you would even if not out dressed,I mean there's some places I'd think twice about venturing near if It was the male me,you should be able to go about your day without worrying that your going to get catcalled or even attacked, sure some ppl will double take etc but hell they are in your consciousness for what,a second and quickly forgot about,I mean in today's fast paced world most folk are just happy getting on with their day,rather than wasting time clocking every person passing them by or even giving a toss if it happens to be a CD
Im wondering if Perhaps not having experience in another country,colours some people's judgements maybe it's completely different in your part of the world
Sophie
Mod here.
Everyone will have a different experience depending on when and where they go out. It’s their experience and their opinion whether it’s a good or bad outing, No “right or wrong” Please respect others opinions and no more bickering.
I think there is more acceptance. Obviously different areas have different levels of acceptance, but what I see is that the overall trend is that most places are becoming more and more accepting.
Maybe on the coasts. Not so much in the middle or in the South. I think it's getting worse given our current political landscape.
As a European, German person, I feel extremely sorry for the USA and the current political landscape. Having lived in the USA, having travelled to the USA 10 times from 2008 - 2014, I wonder why there is no more protest on the streets.Quote:
Originally Posted by ReineD
I hope the country will move on to something better.
I wish you alle the best....
Faltenrock,
I have to agree with you it's much easier for us in the UK , dare I ask the dreaded question , will it all change after Brexit ?
yes , agree, I go shopping, in the past i got the odd glimps, but now, nobody bothers, peeps even interact and talk, lets face it , we arnt a threat
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we arnt breaking the law, if i was in trouble shouting and atractinting attention would be the last thing they wanted, so remember that when you you out dressed, you aint breaking any laws, dressing is not a crime !!!!!!
It certainly seems that way, but what's really happening is that the radical fringe of racist, xenophobic, homophobic and transphobic haters have been emboldened by a cynical few who wield the populist message that these groups of "the other" are a threat. Meanwhile the bulk of society has indeed become progressively more accepting and understanding. Society has become more polarized.Quote:
Originally Posted by ReineD
I don’t know if it is acceptance or tolerance. For anyone who has held a job in the last 30 years, we have all been subjected to anti harassment training. You can’t discriminate on the basis of race, religion, gender, national origin, handicap, etc, etc. and inevitably, cross dressing falls closely to gender.
So, whatever people’s private feelings, most people have learned to at the very least to keep their mouths shut and mind their own business. However, I do agree that in most metropolitan areas, crossdressing is just not a huge deal.
More acceptance? Let's ask the members here who have to hide their crossdressing from their wives or SOs. You know, the ones who keep their clothing and wigs in a box in the basement or attic or in a shed in the back yard. Let's ask the members who are in a DADT situation where their wives "allow" them do dress as long as they don't see it or hear about it. Let's ask those who dress up and go out for walks in the middle of the night in deserted parks or streets because they are afraid to be seen. And let's ask those who have been threatened or actually chased or attacked by strangers. Or maybe just some dirty ot threatening looks.
More acceptance is a myth.
So let's limit the sample population to the known set of "unaccepting", imply that this represents the entire population, and blithely pronounce "acceptance is a myth".Quote:
Originally Posted by Krisi
That is just patently absurd.
Well Billy Porter just wore a big foofy frock to the Oscars and was generally commended for it in the mainstream press.
He wasn’t crossdressing as much as trying to push the aesthetic space allowed to men, but the fact that he and quite a few other prominent and fashionable men are claiming that space with very little resistance is also reflected in greater tolerance for actual cross dressers?
Please remember no one has all the answers or maybe we do
This is a worldwide forum we a have a lot of wide and varied views.
I live in Scotland an have never had any real issues.
Now If i lived in Jamaica or some African countries I would be in fear of my life.
Any answer you read is based on personal experience so take that in to account and keep it civil.
Krisi,
If only it was as simple as that !
It's easy to fall into the trap of thinking evryone's circumstances mirrors their own, the plain truth is they don't . We have georaphical differences , cultural differences the list could go on . Whe then have to consider the individual needs of the CDer/TG person, we are all on different parts of the TG spectrum , from the occasional dresser right through to transition , beyond that it becomes a different ball game . Now add to this mix the individual access /permission or whatever you choose to call the restrictions either self induced or from outside agencies . The point is some need more acceptance than others , yes that does come at a price for some more than others .
The problem of needing and achieveing acceptance is often not what the RW thinks but from the people on your own doorstep , acceptance is not a myth , it's something some of us have to work very hard for but it's achievable , once you get to that stage the World really does become your oyster because the RW really doesn't care .
I've been out full time for a year now without a single problem , no threatening looks , not been chased down the street , I get on fine with everyone I come into contact with , I've not been misgengered by anyone .
It possibly has nothing to do with being accepted as a TG but more to do with being accepted as a decent, open , friendly person .
One question for you Krisi , why do you feel you need to go out with your wife's support , does she enjoy it or is it a burden to her , or are you showing people you a have her acceptance and permission ?
Shelly is so right. Western nations,there is mostly tolerance, but many attitudes. In some other nations, it is very dangerous to one's life to CD.
What about the youtube video someone made of a CD walking down the street with a friend walking behind? The friend walking behind heard remarks and saw reactions of people that the CD didn't see or hear.
If you could only read the minds of people passing by! Some here aren't even accepting unless a crossdresser passes certain criteria of blending.
Ressie,
Question , if you saw a person walking down the street CDer or not with someone following her taking a video would you not take a second look out of curiosity ?
Of course it's all to do with blending , I call it integrating because I converse with people as well . The lesson I've learned is stop looking for a reaction , if you don't look for one then you you won't get one . The other point is people may take a second look because they like your outfit , reactions aren't always bad .
Cams don't have to be visible now days. Yes you can stop looking for a reaction that's good.
One place I see problems with acceptance is when someone decides to transition at their job. I personally know a couple of transwomen that are having major problems at work.
"Now.. as apposed to when exactly?
There was a time, not too ago when a male cross dressing in public was illegal in most places in the US.. It's no longer illegal but, IMO, the public's attitude of male cross dresser has no really changed that much,
The general public still views a male cross dresser as just a gay man... or some other sort of a male pervert. .
Its nolonger being illegal has helped a bit, but not that much.
No, it does not. The actual percentage of the population in a given area who think that way will vary, but it is false to suggest that everyone does. And I am here to tell you that in the areas I frequent, acceptance is the predominant attitude. There are always the smirkers and scowlers, but they are a small minority. Many more are initially wary, but will reveal that they are decent human beings as soon as they realize this TG person is just another decent human being. And some, bless their hearts, go out of their way to interact positively.Quote:
Originally Posted by Barbara Jo
Yes, I live in a large metropolitan community and enjoy the existence of a more progressive populace, but still, Houston is not NYC or San Francisco, where there would be no gapers at all. And I could drive 90 miles east and have a rather different experience, but even then, it would not be what some here seem to think it is.
One more thing to consider... I am one transsexual in a city of 6.5 million people, but every person whom I can take from wary to at least comfortable makes my world that tiny bit better. And I don't even bake.
I don't have any thoughts of transitioning, but If I were to start wearing high heels and skirts to work I an certain I would be looking for a new job shortly. I might not get fired because of it, but they would find some issue to use as an excuse.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ressie
I do believe that in general the public is more accepting, or at least tolerant, but there still is a few radical conservative males that find anyone that does not fit the typical macho male mold an enemy. I work with a few guys and the mention of gays just gets them going. Those that are out, be careful out there!
We all have individual experiences about real world people accepting, sometimes tolerating others dressed as the opposite of their birth gender. The looks and thoughts when someone sees us are the same whether CD, NB or TS, because they are only looking at a stranger and making their own decisions about who we are. I have been out hundreds of times and am now full time. My experiences are in San Francisco and the suburbs, Sacramento, the State's capital, Monterey and Carmel, California, Detroit, Michigan to the Detroit Institute of Art and a couple to LGBT friendly bars, Las Vegas, traveling en femme, and Kansas City to attend a wedding where I spent the whole time shopping, drinking and eating, plus attending the wedding, and including the air flights en femme. In those locations I have never, NEVER, have any negative experience.
I have read many posts from members all over our great Nation, Canada and the UK and EU, who have gone out during the day and night to "T" friendly venues and just out in the real world for shopping, coffee, dining or drinks or whatever ales there is to do, which is a lot, and "almost" all had a great time and had no negative experiences. Yes, a few have had some issues, most minor, but just a few. These members here have done this in large metropolitan areas and small rural areas in some of the traditional stereotypical very conservative areas.
So, first, if you want you can find safe areas everywhere to go out, hopefully one can find a sidekick/partner/friend or acquaintance to go out with to enjoy the sites. Second, the idea that the real world is mostly made up of haters and those that would do us harm is negative fantasy fears and should be discarded. Third, the majority of our population have some knowledge that transgender (umbrella term) people exist and do go out everywhere. Most do not really care. Yes, some may snicker and even make sarcastic comments occasionally. Last, acceptance may be hard for a lot of people, so they probably tolerate all of us, whether they understand us or not. We are different and they see that most of the time. However, they have so many other things in their own minds and activities, including the reasons they may be someplace where they see us. So, they see us, may think about what they saw, may stare to get a better look, comment to someone and then they move on and forget about us. If you interact with them in any way in a nice way you will see they really do not care and most times they will be friendly back to you. Go to the rough side of town and that may not be the case. However, most towns' rough sides are small compared to the whole.
I ask all those that state that the majority of real world people do not like us to please provide some solid proof that it truly is that way. Do each of you get out a lot, or just once in a while when the stars align and the SO or work provides you with the opportunity? Are the people who go out and always describe there good times wrong or not telling the truth? I would like to better understand why you think the way you do and how do you back up your claims. Thanks in advance if you can help me.