I want the CD's w/ partners to think about this, what IF?

Kew,

I believe that I get your point - empathy. How would I deal with a revelation from my SO that she had been hiding something from me for many years and that this something was generally regarded as strange and socially unacceptable?

Being a CD/TG I think my empathy for similar situations would be extremely high. I believe I could understand her reluctance to tell me about it and could forgive the deceipt. I believe that I would participate with her in open dialogue on the subject, but upon reflection would probably have some difficulty participating in the activity.

How would I react if she came home from work each day and immediately showered and changed into a diaper and wanted me to feed her a bottle? Probably not well and I would definitely want to put limits on her activity, or at the very least my participation. I definitely would not want our children to know. Would her activities preclude her from completing her responsibilities? Or would she be able to complete them while diapered?

Would I attend a gathering/convention of like-minded individuals? If there was a support group for SO's - definitely. Would I be willing to buy gifts for her to support this activity - I think so. Would I photograph her activities, probably, though I might feel uncomfortable. Would I be willing to take her out in public as "my baby" - NO.

As a side note, I'd like to say that while I have been crossdressing since about 9 or 10, I have also held many conservative views about alternative lifestyles. Since becoming more aware of myself and more accepting of my crossdressing, my views have changed. Where once I might have been considered homphobic, over the years my views have shifted and I am now more accepting. I believe this is directly related to accepting myself and my lifestyle and recognizing the rights of others to pursue their own individuality. The separation of alternative lifestyles from the stereotypical perversions and criminal activities associated with them is the key to acceptance.

In conclusion, I am more aware and tolerant of others' lifestyles and activities because of my crossdressing and my desires to be accepted. While I would most likely be uncomfortable with many aspects of other unusual activities, I believe that I am open to research and discussion on the topic(s). Also, I can understand the reluctance and repulsion some may feel toward such activities such as crossdressing. Walking a mile in someone else's shoes is always an enlightening experience, whether it is alternative lifestyles, medical conditions or physical handicaps.

In my own case, I recently (July 4th) came out to my wife after 20 years of marriage and she is having great difficulty coming to terms with it. I put myself in her place and think that I can somewhat understand what she is experiencing, but not fully.


Jenna

Quote:

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Originally Posted by KewTnCurvy GG

Dear God people! I honestly meant for this to be something that helped some of you step out of your comfort zones and really look at your behaviors. Simply giving you the chance to wear men's clothing and "pretend to be a man" is not a sufficient stretch. But thinking about being a baby would be for most of you I'd guess. As for how I stand. I like/love CD's/TG's. My last partner was a CD'er and I have a housemate who CD's. I'm single and actually CHOOSE to associate with and date CD'ers/TG'ers. So those of you who think I'm not being genuine or have a different angle, think again.

Contiue grrlz, when I get home I'll expect to see more robust responses.
Kew

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You succeded in moving me out of my comfort zone if that was your intention. In fact as much as I would rather think of other things, this thread bothered me all thru my morning routine. And still does. I will grant that there is a point to having empathy and tolereance and acceptance.
What troubles me is your method. I think many of us are pushed out of comfort zone just coming to terms with CDing. In fact many of us come here for that purpose. I,m not sure you've noticed. Tolerance and empathy and acceptance will come from applying those things to ourselves and to others.
Your analogy is unnecessary. Try this,
What if you found out your SO was a _________ ! How would you feel?
Fill in the blank to your hearts content.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Eugenie

According to quite a large number of discussions here, X-dressing is pretty much separated from a sexual fantazy for many x-dressers, so the comparison with "playing baby" which is a sexual fantazy, is not valid, I think. Unless, one is into some kind of exhuberant fetishist transvestism, which would become a major sexual fantazy for which your comparison to wearing baby diapers would hold.

The main difference with a sexual fantazy is that being dressed as a woman, just makes the x-dresser look like an ordinary woman, providing "she" is sufficiently skilled at finding proper clothes and correct makeup style.
For x-dressers who tend to dress like ordinary women, they would go unnoticed in the crowd. While an adult (any gender) wearing diapers and baby clothes would certainly not go unnoticed in any crowd.

However, I get your point. What would be our reaction if our SO came out to us with a very different life style, as different from the female "norm" as our X-dressing "en femme" is from the male "norm"? I don't have a proper example of such a "change", but that would make me think a lot.

Actually, the closest comparison would be if my SO would tell me that all these years she was a FtM X-dresser and didn't dare to tell me. But even then, for this comparison to be valid, I would have not to be myself a MtF X-dresser otherwise I would be biased in my judgement.

So on the principle, I agree with your questionning: We, as X-dressers should try more often to put ourselves into our SO's shoes... But I don't think the comparison with wearoing baby diapers works.

:hugs:
Eugenie

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You couldn't be more incorrect in this assumption. Infantilism or AB's seldom include sex in their dressing. Think about it, babies do NOT engage in sex so this would totally invalidate WIITTD. I know quite a few AB's and for them, it's an escape into innocence, an opportunity to be nurtured instead of being the nurturer.

I had held off on this, but now that I find myself agreeing with Vanya I guess I should sit down and think this through. Anyway she is spot-on. AB is NOT about sex at all, neither is LG.

Thanks for making that clear and accurate point Vanya.

So, here goes.

Well I guess I might be in a unique position to answer this, at least in some ways. First off I have to confess I have a pacifier - not out of infantilism but a souvenir of my past rave events. (Google rave+pacifier if you don't know cause I'm not going to tell you & I think its against the rules to discuss that here anyway.)

But beyond that I got involved with some very special people who run some very special parties here. Not only was i able to use a full range of my skills, and get paid while working in drag - girl has to make her own money ya know, keeps her honest - but I can dress in my best Catholic SchoolGirl in Disgrace outfits and still be far and away the most NORMAL person in there. So I do have some experience in associating with people of differing proclivities shall we say.

The AB crowd is kind of silly, but harmless. (Much like the furry/plush people) Given the range of activities I've been witness to it seems to be on the milder end of the spectrum, and in its own way is indeed very close to what we do - so it was a bit of brilliance to use it here. Unlike the S/M deal, and like CD, it does not necessarily require another person to participate. Lonely is the S w/o the M, and vice-versa.

This is, and I think part of the reason Kute chose it is part of the turn off for so many GGs, because its not like we need them in on this. They don't HAVE to, and few things can get you on the wrong side of a girl as fast as making her an unnecessary luxury and not a requirement. An AB can dress up, suck that pacifier or bottle and watch TeleTubbies all they want, they do not strictly NEED anyone else to participate. And I would imagine that there are far more (percentage wise) ABs in a closet by themselves then CDs - for obvious reasons.

So, would I be GGG (good giving and game) in this situation? Perhaps, the thought does not turn me on, however if she turned me on, and it turned her on ... well, I always say I would try anything once, and twice if I like it. So I could I think put up with it, under the same circumstances that many of the wives put on it. Around the house would be fine, and I guess I could even attend an event or two from time to time, possibly going so far as to be a LG for her at such events, but I would not be a caregiver/mommy - i.e. not active participation in all aspects of it, assuming of course that they wanted ALL aspects of it.

So, to the degree that it was her deal, and all I had to do was "put up with it" - show tolerance - I most likely could handle it. Its not like something like a humiliation trip where I would be put in the position of doing something I feel morally opposed to i.e. humiliating and degrading another human being.

That being said, I have found myself at some of these parties participating in scenes (as the lingo would have it) that I never would have imagined myself ever being a part of - and in some cases, (such is the poverty of my imagination) that I never even imagined occurred. Some were like teenage fantasies come true, far beyond what I ever thought might happen to me, others that would be harder to convinced me to play along with a second time.

The problem here, and one similar to the GGs, is "How come you did not tell me before." To a degree, if the relationship had been going on for a long time I would feel trapped - or tricked at the least - by the RECENT admission. My current GF met me on a board like this, so all the CD stuff was up front to begin with, matter of fact it was the first thing she knew about me. She has no problem with it, but it does nothing sexual for her either. If I want to do that, I put on a suit and tie, or the macho work clothes, jeans, cut sleeve tight shirts, work-boots (hey, we all have our own kinks I guess) and I indulge her on a regular basis.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by GG Vanya

You couldn't be more incorrect in this assumption. Infantilism or AB's seldom include sex in their dressing. Think about it, babies do NOT engage in sex so this would totally invalidate WIITTD. I know quite a few AB's and for them, it's an escape into innocence, an opportunity to be nurtured instead of being the nurturer.

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OK I stand corrected for this wrong assumption about infantilism (note, even though this is out of the subject, that babies do have sexual experiences, albeit uncontrolled, but they exist). I admit that my knowledge about the subject of infantilism is rather limited... :o

My point about the question was that, yes I have empathy for it and accept the fact that we should be more conscious about the feelings of our SOs. I just felt that the comparison with infantilism didn't hold. But I may be wrong here too...
+?
Eugenie

I agree there is alot of negativity in this thread. I feel like this thread is putting down a lot of people.

The CDs that think they are entitled to instant acceptance by their SO's (who still may not even know about their CDing) are living in a fantasy.

I'd like to think most CDs are above that. Most CDs are mature enough know they are asking for alot when they ask for acceptance.

The ones that come online and post something like "WHY CAN"T EVERYBODY ACCEPT ME!!!??? IT"S JUST CLOTHES!!!!" are just beginning to come to terms with their CDing and may not yet realize how it could impact their lives, they just think no one could possibly care about them.

Mature CDs are an empathetic bunch, many are FULLY CAPABLE of seeing the shoe on the other foot, many more suffer from guilt over it.

I feel the response you'd like to hear is OMG, if my SO came over and told me she had secretly been into Infantalism all her life and expected me to be a part of it, I'd give her the boot.....WAIT....OMG....that's like what I did to her!....WOW, I'm a freak AND now a hypocritical being, It's great that my SO is disgusted by me, I should be more like her!

Not all CDs are mature , and not all partners (even the most willing) are able to deal with their SO as a CD or even a TG, get over it.

P.S. You don't EXERCISE empathy. That sounds downright insulting, it's like "Here, let me help you grow a heart you filthy heartless beast". Now I know that isn't what you meant but with the vindictive tone of this thread that's how I took it.

I did not see (or read) anything negative in the question. Matter of fact I thought the comparison was about as good as you could get, and she even gave links so that we could be 100% sure about exactly what she was pointing to.

That being said, I found out in a past career that few things in life are more ill-thought of, more degraded, less welcome and more thankless than attempting to make people think, particularly when you try to get them to think outside of themselves.

And I know its not just me. In the past few years I have seen many of my old friends leave the academy one by one, all for the same basic reason. And people wonder why, with a doctorate I build stages, set up sound systems, and rig light shows. Yeesh.

I've yet to understand where anyone is seeing negativity here on Kew's part.

I think the AB scenario is perfect for comparison. I think the "boot on the other foot" thread was blown off lightly with the males thinking "oh well, she already wears pants, shorts, etc., so what would be the big adjustment?

Accepting a partner's desire for infantilism inherently requires a deeper level of accepting and adjusting one's private life.

I'm making no accusations, just expressing my thoughts and opinions.

I have to agree with Kat on this. I do not see any implied negativity in the original post. I believe Kew is simply attempting to get us to think about ourselves and how we would react to a "life-shattering" revelation.

Personally I see a lot of negativity and defensiveness in many of the replies.

Kew, I applaud you for making a post that is both thought provoking and soul stirring.


Love,


Jenna

I think I know what Kew is getting at, and basically agree with "Yes I am's" response.
CDs should not expect their SOs to just "grin and bear it". That's extremely selfish. If your SO is supportive, or even just tolerant of your CDing, count your blessings. If she's not, you've got some hard choices to make.

Vikki

mmmmmmmmm rock a bye baby on angles lap,i dont know what would be worst the feeding or the changeing:eek: :puke: but luv is strange xxxxxx's

It's disappointing to see so many "my kink is ok but your kink is not" posts, not to mention the ones who are simply making jokes about AB's rather than do the difficult work of actually imagining yourself in the position Kew has described and *thinking* about what your reaction would be, then comparing that feeling to what SO's of CD's feel upon discovery.

Sure, this topic takes you out of your comfort zone, but it also sheds light on how SO's are jerked out of their comfort zones against their will in *reality* instead of imagination.

Vanya,

My wife is overweight by quite a lot. She takes a lot of different medications every day. We are both in our 50s. Every day I worry that I will wake up and she has had a stroke or a heart attack that makes her an invalid where she has to wear diapers, etc. That would be even worse than dealing with someone doing it as a fetish.

Because of my internal assumed weirdness when I was younger, I have always been a bit more empathetic to strangeness, though when younger, I did have a problem with heavy women as possible mates. The women I came into contact with saw my acceptance of all as a trait that turned them off, they prefering the macho, slap them around, big jock, father figure personality.

My wife today is not the person I married 20 years ago. She never told me about her food fetish, but a few months before our wedding, she threatened to call off the wedding if I ever came between her and her food. Since then she has gained 100 pounds and outweighs me by 90 pounds (during the same time I gained 25 pounds).

But I will not leave her. It took me 15 years of dating and asking out over 60 women and going out with over 30, before I found her. God meant for me to marry her. I am terrified she will become bed ridden and I will have to take care of her, and I do not know if I will be able to do it.

So whats a little crossdressing?

Dee

I'd be disappointed that she didn't tell me in the early stages as I did about the CD thing. Beyond that, I understand that there is comfort and a "letting go" which happens when I dress, so rather than empathy, I could relate on some level. Dressing is comforting. It is as far removed from the things I "do" in my daily life and allows me to reconnect with "being". This would be how I would understand the desire for AB. The desire for comfort and nurturing (which in some ways is what we CD's do for ourselves by dressing) would seem to be the force which drives this desire.

It might be uncomfortable, and even feel silly, but understanding the need of my partner for reassuring comfort is something I would hope to provide in this scenario as I attempt do in our day-to-day life anyway. Like any activity partners share, I would expect that each was afforded the respect of their personal limits, and see a unique opportunity for intimacy.

I personally think this was a fine exercise as it allowed me to address how comfortable I am with myself, my Bride and my life circumstance.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Anima-87-388

P.S. You don't EXERCISE empathy. That sounds downright insulting, it's like "Here, let me help you grow a heart you filthy heartless beast". Now I know that isn't what you meant but with the vindictive tone of this thread that's how I took it.

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I'm a licensed psychotherapist and YES, you can exercise empathy. It's a skill and quality that can be cultivated. So, I disagree.

As for the vindictive tone, I'm perplexed/confused by your statement.
Did you not hear that I love and like CD's/TG's. That they are my friends and have been a partner of mine. And, I would like to pursue a relationship again and not with a plain genetic male but a CD/TG male. So I don't get how my tone could be construed as vindictive. My intent was to get CD's/TG's in relationships out of their comfort zone and try to imagine, if their partner had some secret about their being that was not widely accepted and that they themselves might not accept--how would that feel? Would it be so easy to accept them? Would it make you question what you thought you knew of them? Would it change your relationship with them?

Again, I'm only trying to encourage thought and reflection. Several of you have done a stupendous job. Some very insightful comments and reflections!

Thank you,
Kew

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Fallen Angel

mmmmmmmmm rock a bye baby on angles lap,i dont know what would be worst the feeding or the changeing:eek: :puke: but luv is strange xxxxxx's

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Ummm, she might want to breastfeed!
Kew

You made a fatal mistake in your exercise. You tried to get us to think outside of the box with an example that unconsciously, to many, directly compares cding to abing. Alluding to their equality in shock-value. That's why others asked the point of why not asking about mtf/ftm. You missed a direct comparison. What you asked is akin to asking us, "Your wife says she likes to spank fish" or "she wants to howl at the moon". Apples and oranges. This is borne out by the varied responses that do not lead to definitive conclusions.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by KewTnCurvy GG

However, sorely disappointed with the responses here!! Now, some of you got it and took it to task. I'm not COMPARING CD'ing to infantalism. I'm simply trying to create a situation that asks you--and I'm assuming for most of you this to be true--step out of your comfort zone and TRULY PUT YOURSELF IN YOUR PARTNER"S SHOES. As I said before, this is an excerise in EMPATHY.

---

BTW, if I was not a cding male, and my gf said she was ftm, I would not accept it for myself, I'd want a regular chick.

I can only speak for myself, I will not presume to speak for others here or elsewhere.

Kew's attempt to make people 'move out of their comfort zone' is admirable, but I'm not sure that it applies to all here.

In my case, my wife (of 239 months :D ) is aware of Jodie-Lynn. She has expressed her feelings as "It doesn't really bother me, do it if you want", as long as our friends, family, and daughter don't find out. And while I would love her to accept Jodie into our life, buying or just shopping for her, girls nite, etc, I can understand and empathize with her unwillingness to do so, and I have kept the interaction between Jodie and her to a minimum. Clothing and accessories are sparingly bought, and on the cheap so as not to drain family funds with my "hobby". I give her no excuse or reason to become actively displeased with CD-ing/TG-ism. I accept her acceptance.

I have to admit that I have seen some posters on these boards with the "Why can't she fully integrate my alter ego into our lives" threads, and had to shake my head in wonder. It seems it isn't enough that a CD's spouse tolerates it, but the CD wants enthusiastic support and involvement. But it is understandable, in that we all wish for support and acceptance from our loved ones.

For some, they have a seemingly "golden" life where their spouse not only accepts, but participates and even encourages.

I think that the reason many CD's choose to conceal their behavior, is partly due to an empathy for how their spouse will react, and the spouses wellbeing as well.

I cannot say that Kews posts were negative, but the first post in this thread did strike me as containing somewhat of a "well how would you feel" anger to it. I'm sure that is not the tone she wished to express, but that is, I think, how many received it.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by amandachick

You made a fatal mistake in your exercise. You tried to get us to think outside of the box with an example that unconsciously, to many, directly compares cding to abing. Alluding to their equality in shock-value. That's why others asked the point of why not asking about mtf/ftm. You missed a direct comparison. What you asked is akin to asking us, "Your wife says she likes to spank fish" or "she wants to howl at the moon". Apples and oranges. This is borne out by the varied responses that do not lead to definitive conclusions.



BTW, if I was not a cding male, and my gf said she was ftm, I would not accept it for myself, I'd want a regular chick.

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Amanda,

Someone tried the direct comparison in the "boot on the other foot" thread.
As I stated previously, most just blew it off, presumably because CDs seem to feel that their SO's already crossdress when they wear pants, etc. It wasn't a "stretch" for CDs to consider their wives as F2M in that regard.

I really don't view it as equal to spanking fish. AB's "crossdress" in their own way. They cross from adult apparel to infant apparel. When in the infant apparel, ABs assume the mannerisms of an infant, just as genetic males assume mannerisms of a female when wearing feminine attire.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by amandachick

You made a fatal mistake in your exercise. You tried to get us to think outside of the box with an example that unconsciously, to many, directly compares cding to abing. Alluding to their equality in shock-value. That's why others asked the point of why not asking about mtf/ftm. You missed a direct comparison. What you asked is akin to asking us,"Your wife says she likes to spank fish" or "she wants to howl at the moon". Apples and oranges. This is borne out by the varied responses that do not lead to definitive conclusions.



BTW, if I was not a cding male, and my gf said she was ftm, I would not accept it for myself, I'd want a regular chick.

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Fatal? How so? It doesn't appear fatal at all.
Disturbing, thought provoking, yes, but fatal no.

Shock value is not my aim but to get folks to step outside their comfort level. This could not be accomplished by asking genetic males to think of how they might feel if their SO wanted to dress and act as a male.

Your analogy that my asking CD's to think/consider if their SO came out as an AB is equivalent to ,"Your wife says she likes to spank fish" or "she wants to howl at the moon". is ludicris and terribly faulty reasoning on your part. An AB wants to don clothing and assume behaviors that is similar to a CD wanting to don clothing and assume behaviors. That is not the case when you say, "your wife says she likes to spank fish". That does not involve clothing--which CDing does and it is about a specific behavior and not the essence of something, i.e., to be like a baby, to be like a woman.

Kew
*goes and gets some bandages for her wounds*
Geeeeeeeez folks, truly not trying to offend, just to get you to think!

I have heard about this and if that's your thing then fine with me.
My question is did you just want to ask a question or is this somthing that happen to you? or are you the one that is a baby?
I'm sure somewhere on the net they have a post for you...This one is for transgender people...And acting like a baby is not transgender...unless he is a baby boy who wants to wear pink diapers, then just maybe:)

Quote:

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Originally Posted by KewTnCurvy GG

I'm a licensed psychotherapist and YES, you can exercise empathy. It's a skill and quality that can be cultivated. So, I disagree.

As for the vindictive tone, I'm perplexed/confused by your statement.
Did you not hear that I love and like CD's/TG's. That they are my friends and have been a partner of mine. And, I would like to pursue a relationship again and not with a plain genetic male but a CD/TG male. So I don't get how my tone could be construed as vindictive. My intent was to get CD's/TG's in relationships out of their comfort zone and try to imagine, if their partner had some secret about their being that was not widely accepted and that they themselves might not accept--how would that feel? Would it be so easy to accept them? Would it make you question what you thought you knew of them? Would it change your relationship with them?

Again, I'm only trying to encourage thought and reflection. Several of you have done a stupendous job. Some very insightful comments and reflections!

Thank you,
Kew

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Kew,

I for one appreciated this question, I don't see where some have gotten anything negative out of it. Some didn't get the fact that you just used the comparison that you used (out of the blue) just to give an example. I think that sometimes we as CD's are somewhat selfish in that, we only think of what we want and desire. That our better half has put up with some of the things we have done out of love, and we sometimes abuse that love and never think anything of it. I think that being CD has made me a more open-minded person. I can remember when an old g/f made a comment that she wanted something sexual that I thought was kinda weird, that I made some smart comment and made fun of it. I would hope that I would be more open-minded now, and would try my best to give my wife as much support as possible. I am one of the lucky ones, in that, my wife knows and has bought several things for me. If I were to make fun of or act selfish about something she enjoyed or even wanted to try, would be unthinkable.
Niki:2c:

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Dee 1062

I have heard about this and if that's your thing then fine with me.
My question is did you just want to ask a question or is this somthing that happen to you? or are you the one that is a baby?
I'm sure somewhere on the net they have a post for you...This one is for transgender people...And acting like a baby is not transgender...unless he is a baby boy who wants to wear pink diapers, then just maybe:)

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Oh dear, dear me!

Did not happen to me ever.

Have always had a thing for boiz in makeup and have tried making up some of my ex-b/f's to their chagrin!

Dated a cd'er and am actively seeking a cd'er/tg as a partner.

I don't want to dress or act like a baby and tho am rather quite tolerant of differences in ppl, this would totally turn me off if my partner engaged in this activity.

Kew

I here this issue a LOT! Why can't we be accepted? Why can't my wife understand (fill in the blank). Why can she where boiz clothes and it's not okay for me? WHy WHY WHY!? So, it seemed trying to approach this from an angle that could truly get ppl to think, might help.

Hey Kew, You done good.
Thanks for the thread.
:love:

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Roberta Lynn

Hey Kew, You done good.
Thanks for the thread.
:love:

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You're welcome!

You'd think I"m the devil incarnate!

Nothing like biting the hand that feeds you!
Kew

Hi Kew,

An interesting question, and not easy to answer, as actually being in that situation is probably a lot different than sitting here pecking away at the keys while trying to imagine what it would be like.

What follows is strictly my opinion/s.

That said, if that was the only thing "wrong" with a spouse that I loved, I'd like to think I'd do my best to accept her and help her with her infantilism. If she needed to do that in public, I would probably do my best to dissuade her. If someone outside the relationship found out and had a problem with it, I'd back her up 100%. I don't have to understand her reasons for doing it, but if I love her, I'll help her do it to the best of my abilities and still love her.

However, this feels to me as if you're equating a theoretical infantile wife with "normal" wives trying to accept, or at least tolerate, a CD'ing husband. That is not quite the same thing, IMO, especially if the TG husband is dressing due to a feminine gender identity, but I can see why some wives who don't really understand TG issues might think it's essentially the same thing. Fetishistic CD'ing might be a bit closer to infantilism in they are both paraphilias. Of course, accepting it may not be any easier though.

Regardless, they are both basically harmless behaviors, as long as balance is maintained and the needs of both partners are taken care of.

OK, up on my soap box now, off on a sort of related tangent.

In my opinion, anyone who has gender identity issues should explore those issues, be honest with themselves and figure out who they are as early in life as they possibly can, before getting into a serious relationship with anyone. And a full honest disclosure early on in any relationship is a must too. It's the only fair thing for both parties.:2c:

I think I sort of gave an answer to your question somewhere in there. Thanks for the mental exercise!:happy:

Carol:hugs:

Quote:

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Originally Posted by bgirl

I agree that this thread has an uncomfortable feel about it.
It doesn't seem to have a point, just pissy.

Why you try to use the comparison technique your using here is quite literally a load of crap.

Wht not use plain english and ask how we would feel if the situation was reversed?

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Because the obvious, and honest answer every CDer would give if they found out their SO was cross dressing is "I'd be fine with it".

It is totally impossible for someone who does cross dress, and who has come to terms with that idea in their own mind, to answer any other way.

Once you have come to terms with the concept of "I simply like/enjoy wearing clothes of the opposite sex" and build up all the usual valid arguments like "it's just clothes" then it can be hard to fully appreciate what a shock it is to a partner - I know, I'm going through this now.

There are lots of other things, fetishes or otherwise, that you could start this thread with but I would guess that they maybe easier to accept, e.g. if you wear a basque and stockings having the former made of PVC/rubber probably isn't a huge leap so probably acceptable.

Going for something rather more out of 'normality' is just to show how extreme a reaction an SO can have. And again, trust me, I am on the receiving end of such a reaction at the moment.

Anyway, it's just worth bearing in mind how the other person can feel - everyone has a limit to their acceptance, try to understand this if/when you come out to an SO.

Quote:

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but the first post in this thread did strike me as containing somewhat of a "well how would you feel" anger to it. I'm sure that is not the tone she wished to express, but that is, I think, how many received it.

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Yes, this is all I was getting at. It sometimes also just seems to be assumed in threads like these that a CD has NO IDEA how it feels to be in the other person's shoes even though I imagine most of us would feel the same way in situations like these, this is what I find negative.

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I here this issue a LOT! Why can't we be accepted? Why can't my wife understand (fill in the blank). Why can she where boiz clothes and it's not okay for me? WHy WHY WHY!? So, it seemed trying to approach this from an angle that could truly get ppl to think, might help.

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The problem is these people just don't understand that any relationship is a two way street etc. A mature CD can answer all of the above and the above example could be applied to people with any fetish or abnormal behavior who just can't figure out why they aren't accepted even though they find their behavior harmless.

I'm single but if I was in a relationship with someone who revealed herself to be an AB only after a long amount of time, I would react as most GG's do when their SO tells them they are a CD :eek:, I just thought people already knew that...then again I also thought people knew that when a woman wears pants it really isn't the same as crossdressing :o

My thoughtful thread gets two stars, hmmmmm.

Let's see what does get 5 stars here:

Listed by thread title
Desirable image

Girls have more fun? ( 1 2)

You know you're married to a crossdresser if.....

Breastform Adhesive!! ( 1 2)

I was only trying to be helpful for the few who might have felt they benefited from such an exercise.

Now, let me ask my critics; why would you bite one of the hands that feed you?

Curious!
Kew

Well, if you save up the stars you can get a great set of steak knifes!

And I would never bite the hand that feeds me without deep frying it first in a delicious batter with a little ketsup on the side. And I hear that the Napa Wine Company's, 2005 Sauvignon Blanc is great with 'the hand that feeds you' too.

Yum.

you mean you wouldn't like me if i wore diapers? even if they were nylon diapers? Under a satiny blue dress with full petticoats?
*just kidding!*

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Originally Posted by tekla west

Well, if you save up the stars you can get a great set of steak knifes!

And I would never bite the hand that feeds me without deep frying it first in a delicious batter with a little ketsup on the side. And I hear that the Napa Wine Company's, 2005 Sauvignon Blanc is great with 'the hand that feeds you' too.

Yum.

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he he
Love your sense of humor! FUN!
Kew

what are these "stars" you speak of?

Did I miss another memo?

And, just for the record Kew, I AM enjoying this discussion. But, the only comfort zone you got me out of, is the one where I feel I'm imposing on my wifes good nature. Now I'll be fretting even more....

I'm just a wee neurotic about that..........
:(

Hun, one thing. I'm already to those years that the Wife wears adult diapers when we go some places. Thats old age. LOL:( :2c:

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Originally Posted by HaleyPink2000

Hun, one thing. I'm already to those years that the Wife wears adult diapers when we go some places. Thats old age. LOL:( :2c:

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I'm not talking that kind of wearing diapers and I'm sorry to hear that Haley. Hugs,
Kew

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Originally Posted by Jodie-Lynn

what are these "stars" you speak of?

Did I miss another memo?

And, just for the record Kew, I AM enjoying this discussion. But, the only comfort zone you got me out of, is the one where I feel I'm imposing on my wifes good nature. Now I'll be fretting even more....

I'm just a wee neurotic about that..........
:(

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Awwww, truly not trying to make anyone feel bad, just to think.
Hugs grrl,
Kew

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Originally Posted by ashlycal

you mean you wouldn't like me if i wore diapers? even if they were nylon diapers? Under a satiny blue dress with full petticoats?
*just kidding!*

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Only if they have pink flowers too!

And, where's my coffee?!
Kew

Lack of thinking is NOT one of my (many) problems :D :D :D

I think I think too much. I think.

I've been following this thread for a bit, and here's my pov.

I live with a bisexual Domme F/F couple, and unfortunately, I have more skirts, and heels than the both of them. Not much surprises me in our relationship, and if one wanted to wear diapers, and act as a child, she would be accepted here, thou it does nothing for me personally. I've come to the point in my life where I've realized that you have a short time on this Earth, so you should enjoy it to the fullest extent.

If your needs aren't harmful to others, by all means enjoy yourself, and if you are fortunate enough to find a S/O who accepts you for who you are, and you accept them for who they are, you are one of the blessed few.

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Originally Posted by GG Vanya

Amanda,

AB's "crossdress" in their own way. They cross from adult apparel to infant apparel. When in the infant apparel, ABs assume the mannerisms of an infant, just as genetic males assume mannerisms of a female when wearing feminine attire.

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Yes and don't forget some males dress as girls and some as boys. the same is true for the girls. And KEW, as a Licensed ... you know the ANR group would not mind the coment on your earlier post.

I really don' know how to respond to this thread. I knew about rosie's dressing before we became a couple and so I made my decision to enter into the relationship with full knowledge.

I don't hink I would like any secret in our relationship that would make me feel excluded in a huge part of his life but then again how does it hurt me?

People are going to come out in their own way and in their own time. I can well understand the fear of rejection as well as the lose of life as they know it by coming out. The reaction of others could well change their life forever.

I would say if in doubt do not share it. But also that I hope that they one day would because I believe it frees a Man to be able to share it with one he loves.

peace

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Originally Posted by DeeInGeorgia

Vanya,

My wife today is not the person I married 20 years ago. She never told me about her food fetish, but a few months before our wedding, she threatened to call off the wedding if I ever came between her and her food. Since then she has gained 100 pounds and outweighs me by 90 pounds (during the same time I gained 25 pounds).

But I will not leave her. It took me 15 years of dating and asking out over 60 women and going out with over 30, before I found her. God meant for me to marry her. I am terrified she will become bed ridden and I will have to take care of her, and I do not know if I will be able to do it.

So whats a little crossdressing?

Dee

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You most probably will take care of her. My wedding vows meant something to me and after my wifes 2 CHF's I have done many things for her that are outside the normal. Careing for ones liftime partner is easy once you have to do it. it is the thinking about "Waht if" that is the hardest part. Hugs Tiffany

LOL sorry Kew. LOLOL:)

Yeah I knew what you were saying. :heehee:

Ok, to the subject. Nahh, It would not bother me much. I'd get used to it, as I have all the other things our life together has thrown at us. Lets say if she had that as a fetish. It would be at least something to level the playing field around here.

Lets see, diaper changing, I'd have a little problem with that some. I’d kind of like the powdering her bottom though. But I might be doing that someday anyway when we get older. LOL:heehee:

Lets see the sucking on a pacifier. Hmmm. Nahh, they do that now as those are the rage here for candy. You see even adults running around with those little candy ones. It's no worse than cigarettes to look at. But I'd much rather the people next to me be sucking on pacifiers than cigarettes. The smoke from cigarettes I can’t take.

Her wearing baby dolls most of the time, Hmmm? Lets see, would I like that? Yeah, that would be really cute. Baby strollers would not apply though. They have those real cool electric mobility chairs in the malls.

She already wears bonnets around the farm, doing work in the sun. Also to re-enactments that we go play music at. So a baby doll hat or bonnet would not be a bother to me either.

Lets see, tantrums and misbehaving. Now that happens raising a child. If she wants to throw a tantrum, I am not the one that’s going to stop her now. She is stronger than I am. I'd have to call her brother over. LOLOL:D

Sorry, just a light attemp at some humor!:heehee: :tongueout :love: :p

You know, I rarely get involved in contentious threads like this, but I really have to say something here.

Those of you who are pointing out that crossdressing and infantalism are not the same thing, are completely missing the point. Of course they are not the same. That's why adult babies have their own discussion forums and we have ours. But are the two things equivalent for the hypothetical exercise that Kew proposed? Yes, absolutely. Because this exercise was not about how you, as a CD/TG individual, view yourself. Whatever your angle is, whether crossdressing is about fetishism or identity or clothing rights for you, that is not what Kew's question was about. It was about getting you to consider how your wife or girlfriend, someone with no prior understanding of crossdressing, might feel upon learning that her genetic male partner likes to (or needs to) wear women's clothing.

I can see why the comparison made you uncomfortable. It is because you think that an adult dressing and acting like an infant is disgusting, silly, sick, shameful, wrong, and perverted, whereas what you do is none of those things. And incidentally, I happen to feel that crossdressing can be anything from a harmless kink or "hobby" to a beautiful expression of your gender-giftedness and a way of displaying on the outside who you are on the inside. It is certainly never, ever, something to be ashamed of. But again, that is not the point.

To be blunt, the point is that regardless of how positively you view yourself, for your wife or girlfriend who encounters this side of you for the first time, the level of shock and discomfort IS similar to finding out that your partner is a closeted adult baby. I know that this isn't a nice thing to think about, particularly since many of you are still struggling with your own lifelong guilt issues, and you don't come to this forum to feel worse about yourself. I am sorry that the subject came up, but here we are, so we may as well deal with it.

I have been involved in this community for a long time and have gotten to know many partners of crossdressers and trans gals, and believe me, when they first learn that their man sometimes likes to dress as a woman, most of them do not think "Oh, no big deal, that's the same as me wearing pants." Some are super-cool with it, especially if they are comfortable with alternative lifestyles or have known TG folks before, but your average woman is initially going to find the idea just as odd, alien, scary, and revolting as the idea of adults wearing diapers and drinking from bottles. No wonder we freak out when you tell us! That is why it takes a lot of education, a lot of communication, and a lot of work-- not to mention a lot of love -- for SOs to get to place of acceptance. The good news is that it can, and does, happen.

So to reiterate: no one is calling you a fetishist or putting you on the same "level" with infantalists, okay? All Kew was doing was trying to get you to see that for your partner, your crossdressing might be just as difficult to accept as it would be for you to accept her need to role-play at being a baby, if the shoe was on the other foot. Is that so hard to understand?

Love,
Marla xx

To be flippant: Hey, I'd join her!!

They really ought to try and finish the list of sexual deviance I seem to have...

*Looks around*

So I guess I'm one of a minority here... kk - I'll just go and crawl back into my batcave. :sorry:


EDIT: And can people stop bashing infantalism? It's a valid alternative lifestyle choice - just as you have yours. Honestly -- stop the bitchy-ness and start the empathy. xx

Oh, and to be real serious!

We had our Uncle live with us till just before he died. He was an elderly man in his 80’s. We did everything for him from changing the bed covers to getting him in and out of the tub. Helping and even changing his adult diapers etc. Feeding him when needed also. Finally for medical reasons we could not do it anymore.

I could do no less for my own wife.:2c:

Haley

I didn't notice the links when I 1st saw it. I thought the concept was purely hypothetical on your part until I realized from other replies that this was real. I couldn't believe people did this, I went to the links, while I reading them I felt ill, I forced myself to continue reading, my mind felt like it was disassociating with realty. I knew my wife "felt". Now I know "how" it felt.
I'm crying.

Kew I think your thread was a really great idea....sadly alot of cd's are not ready for an excercise like this. Out of their comfort zone?....you bet. Empathy a hard pill to swallow? Absolutely!!

Marla thanks for clarifying what seemd to me a very simple idea, but seemd to have morphed into something it was never intended to be.

Again...gee, I hate that I have to keep repeating myself on this forum....second time this week I have had to defend a gg being 'into' cd's.....

But most gg's who are on this forum enjoy this aspect of their partner. Most of us dig it and find being with a tg partner to be fullfilling.

As I have stated many times past, gg's who hate crossdressing and hate cd's and want to change cd's...dont' come to places like this or if they do come here - post a few hate filled threads- and then leave.

long time gg posters and members are here to help those who are struggeling and are finding problems upon disclosure.

Since comparing cd's to other things is rather difficult, Kew used an example which I thought illustrated a very good point.

She did not do this to make others feel bad, or o make one feel even more guilt, but to give an insight into how a woman finding out *might* feel.

The more tools given which show cd's how it feels for a wife...isn't that better to see a different view point?

For those *thinking* about coming out or in the process of coming out need all the tools to help them see how/why their wife is feeling negativity.

It is not a black and white issue, Kew used an example of something most people on here admitted to finding uncomfortable or woudl have no turn on for. That might give a clue as to how one's wife feels uncomfortable with cding.

And to thsoe doubting her authenticity, sorry numbers don't lie, and we have a pretty good gg population in here which like or looked to date a cd. When are the doubters going to start believing that we are real, we are here to help and we are not here to make anyone feel bad?

If one cannot at least listen to us gg's which are *pro-crossdressing* with an open mind....god help those of you who have to deal with gg's {or the general public} who are *anti-cding*.....

Sorry, I have to rant a bit.

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Originally Posted by Marla GG

Those of you who are pointing out that crossdressing and infantalism are not the same thing, are completely missing the point. Of course they are not the same. That's why adult babies have their own discussion forums and we have ours. But are the two things equivalent for the hypothetical exercise that Kew proposed? Yes, absolutely. [..]
It was about getting you to consider how your wife or girlfriend, someone with no prior understanding of crossdressing, might feel upon learning that her genetic male partner likes to (or needs to) wear women's clothing.

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If this is the point: Generaly speaking, how does one feel to be confronted with something that is out of the norms, we don't have to discuss about infantilism. There are far more "every day" examples, that cover the acceptance problem and the how to deal with it far better IMO as CDing is nothing special in this sense.

How about:

Being married to someone of a different ethnics (Blacks still have problems in the USA and Europe and sometimes it really causes trouble with the family).

Being married to someone of a different religion (has been a huge problem in the past and still is in some areas.)

Being married to someone with heavy overweight (those people got moked once in a while)

Having a handicapted baby (parents have to face a lot of "public trouble". Especially some fathers just run away cause they can stand it or feel hemmed.)

Being hadicapped oneself ( Resentments, stares, mocking etc.)

etc.

So what we are talking about ?

Some deviation from norms or a sexual ("embarassing") deviation ?

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To be blunt, the point is that regardless of how positively you view yourself, for your wife or girlfriend who encounters this side of you for the first time, the level of shock and discomfort IS similar to finding out that your partner is a closeted adult baby. I know that this isn't a nice thing to think about, particularly since many of you are still struggling with your own lifelong guilt issues, and you don't come to this forum to feel worse about yourself. I am sorry that the subject came up, but here we are, so we may as well deal with it.

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Of course it is troublesome and even a shock for our SOs. I think every single CDer is somehow aware of it. Otherwise we wouldn't have been in the closet for most of our life, trying to hide it from our parents, family , SO, children.
I admit though, that an egocentric behavior easily can develop when you have the fear of being rejected, being a failure and you have to deal with this alone.

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Some are super-cool with it, especially if they are comfortable with alternative lifestyles or have known TG folks before, but your average woman is initially going to find the idea just as odd, alien, scary, and revolting as the idea of adults wearing diapers and drinking from bottles. No wonder we freak out when you tell us!

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I absolutaly agree, but than we discuss about sexual deviations (perversions in the eye of the SO) and it is legtime to see if TG and infantilism are comparable or not.

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That is why it takes a lot of education, a lot of communication, and a lot of work -- not to mention a lot of love --

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This is the way to go.

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... for SOs to get to place of acceptance.

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I'd rather be respected for what I am.

I have often observed that one of the reasons that people don't like to think outside of themselves is that such exercises tend to show the true colors of a person much better because they are not being allowed to just keep up with their tried and true act. It forces them to step away from the carefully constructed public persona and show the real person underneath. People hate that.

One of the points here is to get people to try to understand what a sudden revelation might be like from the other point of view. And almost no-one wrote about the aspect of that person concealing such a thing from their lover for so long a time. Which - as any reading of the posts will tell you - is problem number one for a lot of the SOs. That they have been put in this position unwillingly. Tragically I think that many of those SO MIGHT have gone along with it, had they known from the get-go, if they had in the worlds of the law, "Informed Choice." They are now stuck with no choice, and rather than being informed, they were in fact deliberately kept in the dark and lied to. Small wonder that upon hearing this revelation their first reaction is "I'm outa here."

I think that if they had been given the opportunity to ease into it, to play their way into it, to gradually embrace it many would. But, now it comes full weight out of nowhere, like Athena springing from the head of Zeus. And that is hard to handle.

But I think underneath that, and designed into the original proposition was another issue, which was how many people would be, in the worlds - or letters - of Dan Savage, GGG. Good, Giving, and Game. How far would you go to indulge your partner with something that did not necessarily turn you on - or perhaps, went so far as to turn you off? Could you get over yourself long enough to indulge someone you loved? Because if we want partners that are GGG, should we not be the same in return? As it turn out, a whole lot of people who EXPECT the other to be GGG are themselves NNN. (Nohow, Noway, Not Ever!) Thought that hardly surprises me, it does sadden me. In the words of Nat Henthoff, its all about "Freedom for me but not for thee." Such sentiments are sad no matter where they are encountered.