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Isn't that a bit selfish?Quote:
Originally Posted by Shy Aubrey
I told my now wife soon after we started dating and everything was fine and is still fine with my dressing.
It was a risk, but I figured that we had established enough of a relationship that we needed to expose all our secrets and make sure that we could both be comfortable with them before the relationship got too far along.
Paula, my heart goes out to you, and I wish you and her all the strength and luck you can find. It's great to see so many come to your aid here, with advice or similar tales to let you know your'e not alone. What is happening in this conversation, even the dissagreements, is exactly what this forum is all about. Very well said, Karen.
Before I married my ex-wife, I told her I was a crossdresser, but that it was something I could live without. So I did lie to her, but at the time, I believed what I was saying. So it was not a bald faced lie. While we were married, she would occasionally indulge my needs, ie; allow me to wear lingerie and such to bed or while we were making love. This lead me to believe that maybe someday she would come around to full crossdressing.I could not have been more wrong. She, I think, believed that by allowing me to wear feminine clothing in her presence sometimes, she was giving me a chance to indulge my fantasies, so that I would not feel the need to fully crossdress. She could not have been more wrong. It is amazing that two intelligent people who have an otherwise strong connection and love for one another, can be thinking so oppositely.
The rules were never clearly set out by her until the first time she came home and caught me fully dressed. After that, she caught me several times. Never actually saw me, But me in the shower, furiously washing off makeup, and women's clothing strewn all about the bathroom pretty much told the story. She made it clear that she did not "want a husband that wears high heels, dresses, and makeup". Every time, I would be sorry, promise to stop, and usually discard all I had bought.
My ex is an intelligent woman, and fairly open minded. She never asked me if I was gay, and I don't think she believes crossdressers are perverts or sickos. It is simply something she did not want as a part of her life. One has to respect that. However, I believe she was being unreasonable in insisting that I never do it, Even when she wasn't around.
At that time in my life, I was not as articulate about the subject as I am today. And resources such as this did not quite yet exist, or at least I was not aware of them. And I was still carrying around alot of confusion, embarrassment and shame. So I thought she was right. And I had to be doing something wrong. When we split up, it was mostly for reasons that had nothing to do with crossdressing. But cding certainly wasn't a strength in our relationship that we could fall back on. Maybe today, assuming we could have worked through our other problems, it may have been. We are friends now, and she is very happy that I have found someone who accepts all of me. But still says that it is something she could not deal with.That is ok. It's not for everyone. We were both devestatingly broken hearted when we split up. But now agree that even though we had a real connection, and a real love for eachother, that it was, in the long run, for the best.
It certainly freed me (after another relationship that was a disaster, classic rebound stuff) to find the path to accepting and loving all of me.
I know none of this is easy. And I never had kids. For those of you with children, especially young ones, I realise that makes it all the more complicated. Only the individual can decide whether what cding does for them outweighs the partnership they are in. Living a life of suppression and denial is something I cannot even fathom now. But back then, I was willing to do it, for love. All I can say is that personally, for me, my life is better than it has ever been. And I can trace many of my previous struggles with success and happiness to not being me. All of me. But at the time, it is often hard to see the forest for the trees.
Again, my heart goes out to all of you who are struggling with these issues. There is never one easy answer for everyone. It makes me happy to be able to be a part of this forum, and hopefully, be there for whoever needs an empathetic friend who has been there. My PM box is always open. I have gained so much from being here and am so grateful to all of you who have been here for me. I would be honored to give back, in any way.
All the strength and luck in the world to everyone. And all my love.
Hugs,
Melissa :)
Geez, I hate being technologically illiterate! Why the big red thumbs down on my post? I tried to edit it out, but cannot figure out how. What gives?!?
Hugs,
Melissa :)
Melissa,
Your post is wonderful.
You made an important point...is the cross dressing more important than the relationship? The jury is still out on that one.
You also said something:
"Living a life of suppression and denial is something I cannot even fathom now. But back then, I was willing to do it, for love. All I can say is that personally, for me, my life is better than it has ever been. And I can trace many of my previous struggles with success and happiness to not being me. All of me. But at the time, it is often hard to see the forest for the trees."
That makes me wonder many of the non-cross dressing related difficulties I am struggling (an overall unsettled feeling, an unhappiness with life, an inability to excel much of the time or feel much joy anymore) stem from that unresolved issue. It has been so long I don't know anymore. You have given me some introspective homework to do in any case.
We are funny creatures we humans. We think that we can push aside who we are and yet somehow it bubbles back to the surface and pokes us with a stick. Your statement above has certainly given me pause. I guess that is why reading these posts is so important and helpful.
Thanks for your insights.
Melissa (confusing eh!) - Perhaps I should sign - Melissa Eh! or Melissa From The Great White North - or Melissa From The Land Of Back Bacon
Click on the edit button on that post and your post will open up for you to edit. At the bottom of the post it says 'Post Icons' just click 'no icon' and save it. It should remove it :DQuote:
Originally Posted by Melissa A.
Tamara x
Hi Melissa,
Thank you for your kind words. If my experiences can make anything clearer to you, in any way, that makes me happy.
I think you hit the nail on the head. Not being who you really are, or suppressing important parts of yourself affects every single area of your life. Not only are you denying yourself something that makes you feel whole, but you are doing it under someone else's rules. That cannot be good, in any way.
Having said that, I have some sympathy for her confusion and fear of the issue. It is never easy for the wife in these situations, and care needs to be taken. It's not all about you, or her. It's about you both, and if 2 people are committed to staying together, working through it, and coming to some compromises, they really need to listen to eachother.
However, this does not completely sound like your situation. If she refuses to even discuss the issue, or listen to your side, I believe that is wrong. And is completely unhealthy. People who are truly in love care about their partner's struggles and feelings. Not just their own reaction to something that is different-and scares them. Please understand that I am not telling you what you should do. I am not telling you that you should leave her. Only you can decide that, and if the pain and consequences are worth it.
You said, "it has been so long, I dont even know anymore". I think it is more like, "it has been TOO long since I had the courage or the freedom to be who I am, and I don't think this is fair anymore." I could be wrong, but that's my opinion. It is not an accident that you are here, looking for a sympathetic ear and the company of like minded people. There is a part of you that is so unhappy with the fact that you are not free to be who you are, that it is starting to express itself. The general unhappiness, lack of success, unsettleness, they are symptoms of a bigger problem. And a part of you is seeking a cure. I can say this because I lived it.
The only thing I can definitively tell you to do is this: Come to believe, REALLY believe and know to your core, that as a crossdresser, you are doing nothing wrong. You are doing nothing illegal, and you are not out to hurt anyone. This, believe it or not, is much easier to say than to really, really believe. A lifetime of social conditioning tells us it's not so. Once you do, much courage can stem from it.
And then it will get harder! Hate to be so cheery, but it's true. But you seem quite intelligent to me, so you probably know that whatever you do or don't do, it will not be easy. People here have seen me write this here before: Unfortunately, as humans, we sometimes need to go through some bad, painful stuff in order to become who we really are, or before we are ready to.
I really want to know how you are doing, Melissa, no matter what you do. Please stay here and let us know how you are doing, and feeling. You can pm me anytime. I work alot, and wierd hours, so you may not hear back right away.
Wishing you all the best.
Hugs,
Melissa :)
PS Paula- I am so sorry if we seem to have hijacked your thread. It was not intentional. And much of what I have said here applies to you, too. And I hope some of it helps. I am thinking of you, too, and hope you keep us updated. I am here to listen to you as well, anytime, if you want.
Thanks Tamara! much appreciated!
Hugs,
Melissa :)
Thanks Paula for raising this issue because it resonates with me and I also apologize for highjacking this thread but hope that these insights will help you as well.
Thanks Melissa for your kind words and your kind offer. You have given me much to ponder and hopefully Paula as well.
I may take you up on your PM offer. I work weird hours too but the store and serve nature of internet technologies makes this not a problem if nobody answers at the time of the message :)
Melissacd and Melissa A,
Not a problem and thank you for your contributions. This thread is too important to stake a claim.
Melissacd: Hang in there. I know how you must feel...yes, it is difficult...the longing and desires of dressing as a woman are SO strong. And, yes, we all know deep down inside, those urges to dress will never go away. I find the desire to dress enfemme too irresistable and the associated euphoria very very addictive. I marvel at your strength. Whatever you decide and choose for you and your wife will be the best. Only you can make that decision.
Melissa A: How insightful and communicative you are. Thank you for sharing your thoughts, experiences, and views with me. More importantly, thank you for your unflapping support. It really helps me to see what needs to be done and also what lies ahead for my wife and I. At a later time, I will re-read your post and add more comments and thoughts.
Lastly, Oh, the weekend. For most, the weekend brings more time to dress enfemme and enjoyment to explore/express our femininie side. For me, weekends are exactly the opposite. Family members at home...less opportunity to be alone, be dressed in a relaxed and comfy mode. But make looking forward to the weekdays something to wait for.
Enjoy the weekend ladies...and thank you again.
Paula J
Wow, RachelDenise, like, doesn't everyone love lingerie?
Wish my wife would catch me dressed then my hidding would be over.
This exchange between the two Melissas does make me wonder about the degree of love that exists in many marriages/relationships. True love is all about sharing and compromising between two people. True love is not about when one person dictates to another - that is an abusive behavoir that denies the other partner the freedom of expression and makes them feel unhappy and rejected.
I realize that when a wife discovers her husband is a cd, for many this is an unwelcoming, unsettling complication, however I would expect her to overcome her socially conditioned thoughts and emotions and make reasonable adjustments to her life to accommodate the new reality.
As a comparison, look at what happens when a couple have a disabled baby. Gone are the dreams of having a healthy, normal bouncing baby and in its place is a realization and acceptance that the parents will have to make substantial changes to their lifestyle to look after their disabled child. There is no hesistation or doubt from the parents that they will do so because their love for the baby is unconditional even though their lifestyle changes can be daunting.
However, this was not always the case. Up until very recently it was socially acceptable and common for parents to abandon disabled babies and leave them outside to die. Today this practice appears cruel and heartless and would never be allowed.
So it appears that love is not that absolute, that its boundaries relies on what is socially acceptable at the time. Today CDing is not socially acceptable so many women find it repulsive and see no reason why they should accommodate it in their relationship. This is not unconditional love, it is socially conditioned love.
I agree with MelissaA, living a life of self-denial is not something I personally could ever consider doing again. Living with someone whose love is conditional is not something I would accept either.
Susan,
I can empathize with you. In many ways, I feel a big burden has been lifted from my shoulders now that my wife has seen me dressed and wearing women's lingerie.
However, with the removal of this burden, I now have a new challenge which is to help educate her about transvestism, in general, and, hopefully, either gain her acceptance or at least establishing some ground rules that will allow me to continue dressing. Of course, there is also that outside chance that she will find my crossdressing totally unacceptable. At this stage, I don't know which way this process will go.
To everyone who finds themselves in a similar situation as myself or Susan, we all need to commit to sharing our experiences, knowledge, and views with one another. But what I believe is critical to aiding all of us is for those with supportive wives, SO's, and girlfriends is to encourage them (SO's, girlfriends, and spouses) to join in on this discussion. Please help us and give us your insights, thoughts, feelings, etc. about what you believe is important to address, when, why, and what. Your perspectives as a GG about which aspects are important and how we, the crossdressers, should approach this discussion with our respective SO's, girlfriends, and spouses are sorely needed. As many like Helana and others have stated, there are societal barriers to overcome and the process will be long. Having GG's providing advice and counsel will help each of us avoid the landmines and smooth the road ahead.
Thank you again all...you will never know how helpful my postings here are for me in facing this challenge.
Paula J.
Hi girls,
Getting caught dressing or being up front with your wife, a dilemia indeed!!!!
Unless a miracle comes along.
I have been CDing on and off for thirty years and was doing so prior to getting married. Unfortunately, I'm one of life's proverbial cowards and so I never had the courage to tell my wife of my secret desires. So much of my married life was spent in that dark closet.
I too had over the years wrestled with the notion of leaving my wife, too pursue a life that I so desperately wanted to for fill and I had written my wife off, without even even giving her a chance to air her views on the subject. That now with hindsight, is something I deeply regret.
Luckily for me common sense prevailed, because what was I faced with was perhaps, a life time spent sad and alone, if I could not find someone who'd except for what I am. But more importantly, I would loose a friend and soul mate, the woman I love and for what?
And so up until a few weeks ago, I was posting on this site and a few others, on how I felt my wife would not except a husband who wanted to explore his 'femme' side.
Anyway, whilst on holiday a week ago, I went shopping with my wife and the up shot of it was (I will not bore you with the details), but I now have a draw full of panties (wife threw out my boxers) and I'm the proud owner of several pairs of girlie jeans. It's a great start!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Talks have been adjourned on dressing fully, BUT they are not dead in the water.
My point being is that miracles can happen. :) And my stress levels have dropped considerably. Who said dressing can be relaxing. :)
Samantha xx
I bet you're feeling on top of the world Charlotte, but I've seen many posts urging us to resist pushing this issue too quickly. Faced with the discovery that their husbands are CDers, our SOs can take an incredibly long time to come to terms with it, so the advice is to consolidate the ground you have gained, and take a long time before you try to push the boundaries any further. Some of our wives may never accept it, which seems to be MelissaCD's situation, and even Melissa A's with her ex. I can identify with them both, because that's exactly where I am right now. I chickened out of telling my wife when we married 35 years ago. I thought my CD feelings would wither with the freely available sex in my new relationship, but as I know now from my own experience and what I've read here and elsewhere, the desire never goes away. Anyway, I told her about 15 years ago, and her reaction was much like your wife MelissaCD. She "didn't want to know" about it, and wondered whether she could continue to live with me. I'm glad to say, we're still enjoying life and planning our retirement together, and although the subject has been broached once or twice in the meantime, the response has been the same, but without the arguaments and emotion that went with it the first time.
Since I found this site earlier this year, I have come to understand myself better (though I still don't know why I feel excited wearing sexy lingerie!), and I've decided to try one more time. I've seen advice to others to get "My Husband Betty" by Helen Boyd, read it (at least the first 4 chapters), get your wife to read it chapter by chapter, discussing issues as they come up. Well, that implies a willingness to have a discussion in the first place, but my copy was delivered on Saturday, I'll read it while my wife is at work this week, and then comes the big test. Will I get her to read it and discuss her fears? Who knows, and who knows what the outcome will be? I'll keep you posted on progress! I know that ultimately, I will put my wife way above my need to CD, and I will continue to enjoy my marriage whatever, but she may never know how much more I will enjoy it if she could come to accept all of me.
I've decided that if I choose a femme name it will be Melissa. We seem to be the ones who are fated to have SOs who cannot accept our CDing!
Tony
Men are from mars women are from Venus!
That is such a cliche.
Because it is a societal definition of normality.
Not a clear fact of establishment.
One can never appease another where one has to sacrifice
a need for the others wants.
your lingerie should not be in the garage,it should be in your dresser.
If you are compelled to wear them then do so at your comfort.
I have read many posts regarding the fear of the significant other in discovery the only secret they may not have shared throughout their relationship.
Then when they either are discovered,or they come out to their loved ones,nearly all react the same way.
While it is a throw me off type deal,the simple cope out is always why couldnt you trust me?
Well it really hasnt anything to do with trust.....
Neither does it have anything to do with honesty....
It is a secret that society has in nearly every instance definend as abnormal,if a man shares the same intrest in a book,or a movie,or a meal its ok,but throw in the complicated entanglement of a males affection of being feminine even for a moment,they are dishonest,and trust plays a role in condemnation.
Your spouse needs to realise that youve been dressing throughout your marriage,and answer herself has it harmnd your relationship?
If not then dont let it interfer with what really matters.
For the struggle of her mate to survive.
Good luck!
Profound thoughts Kirsti. I'll remember your final comments when I try to talk to my wife again on this subject.
Thanks,
Tony
I also concur that to those of you who are considering to out themselves to their SO's or have or have recently been caught, Helen Boyd's "My Husband Betty" is a must.
I just recieved my copy last week and just finished the first chapter last night, w/wife right next to me. She asked me what it was about and why I got it. To learn more about me and to help us (was my answer). It is a smart move.
Helen Boyd is a GG, married to a CD. She wrote the book to understand more about we crossdressers (TG's etc. included), and to help SO's of CD's. Not sugar coated, nor negative. After the first chapter and browsing other sections, I give it 2 thumbs up.
It was suggested to me to read the book once over myself, then a chapter a time w/the wife, highlighting and asking questions before moving onto the next chapter. The latter half of the book deals w/TS issues, so tread accordingly.
My advice, get all the help you can.
Aloha,
Dana
I caught my boyfriend dressed in some of my clothes, although I already knew that he secretly wore my panties. I didn’t have much of a problem with this, we had a very serious discussion, and I told him quite bluntly that if he wanted to wear girly clothes, then he needed some training.
He wasn’t altogether happy with this, but he did eventually agree and we bought some really girly clothes. As a girl he’s very passable, he’s got a great figure and a lovely face, especially with make up.
I wanted him to actually go out as a girl, so with my help he dressed in a lovely top and mini skirt and a jacket, shoes with a small heel and when it was just getting dark off we went.
I think it was a great success and we’ve progressed from there, I got a great sister and he can enjoy what he wants with no secrecy.
Suzie
[email protected]
Tate,
Bravo! You are a terrific person and your boyfriend is lucky as well...maybe luckier! How pleasant it must be to find yet another activity to enjoy and share as a couple...whether as man and wife, sisters, or girlfriends. I envy him and I admire you.
In a previous posting within this thread, I mentioned that contributions from supportive GGs like yourself are very important to helping crossdressers deal with the myriad of issues of coming out to our spouses, girlfriends, and significant others. Whatever you can share that will help us find the appropriate paths through this potential minefield will be greatly appreciated.
Lastly, thank you for sharing your and your boyfriend's crossdressing experiences with us. Please post more and often.
Hugs,
Paula J
Well,
Following from my earlier post, I've read most of "My Husband Betty" now, and I think I understand my wife and her response to my original revelation about 15 years ago a lot better now. That's how long the subject has been taboo between us! We're having a few days away from home this week, and I asked her if we could read the early chapters of this book while we're away; it'll be a quiet few days while I'm still on my crutches. Her initial response was not good, "It will not change my attitude. I want a proper man, not one who wants to dress as a woman". I decided not to start the discussion until we read the book, take it real slowly. I've already marked the passages I can identify myself with, and some where she may need some discussion, and I hope she'll really want to ask a load of questions. If her mind is closed, it isn't going to be productive, but I'll hope she's curious enough to want to know, but if not, then I'll have to think of another approach, I'm not going to ram it down her throat if it upsets her. The last thing I want to do is break up our relationship, so I'm not going to put that at risk, not for anything, and I'll tell her that 1000 times if I have to.
Wish me luck, but if any of you decide to offer me some advice for this week, I'm sorry, but I won't see it; we're off tomorrow morning, and I won't have computer access again until next Sunday, then there'll be millions of posts to catch up on.
See you all again soon,
Tony
Good luck Dragster. Hopefully she will read it and open up at least a little.
Good luck with all this.Now that the secret is out, you can never lie or deceive again, and she will keep an eye out for those signs. I lied and hid my life from my wife for 12 years, now I have to re-build trust all over again. I'm still glad I told her about it. Tell her if society didn't think of us as the worst of perverts we wouldn't have to lie in the first place.
GypsyKaren
I admire all of you who are giving it a try. I am too afraid to go through the hell that I went through the last time. I am afraid to even go near the subject. My thinking at this moment, if I can last that long, is to wait for another 5 years until my youngest is age of majority and then possibly approach her again. While it is my hope that I can find a way to make it work, as I read through much of what is on this site and realize that it is okay for me to want to cross dress and realize that part of myself and that I should express that part of myself.
So...as much as I love her, if I give it another college try and really try and help her along with this, if she is still totally against the idea then I may just have to accept that while I love her she does not love me enough to accept who I am and either I just do it and put up with her anger or I move on...
I have spent too much of my life hiding and denying and feeling guilty about this and I want to have a few last years of my life where I can accept who I am and be what I was meant to be.
Melissa Eh!
Melissa,
Our lives have always been risky! As crossdressers, from the very first moment we dared to pull on that memorable article of feminine clothing, we were taking a risk. Every minute we take to adorn ourselves and enjoy our second selves, we are taking a risk whether we like it or not. Unfortunately, risk is an inherent part of a crossdressers life and, in general, everyone's life. Since we all know the chances are highly unlikely that we can change who and what we are, we just need to learn how to manage the risks.
In fact, unknowingly, we all manage risk in one way or another in our daily lives. Some things, we have experience with and, therefore, don't give it much thought, such as crossing the street or driving a car. But when in a foreign country, like the UK, where cars are driven on the opposite side of the street, we need to exercise more caution. We do this because the risks are higher due to our unfamiliarity and we must operate at an elevated level of caution...the situation requires that we simply put more thought and attention into what we're doing. Bottomline, we can't eliminate risk...just recognize risk and manage the situation.
As for your waiting another 5 years before reengaging your wife on the topic of crossdressing, that's a decision which only you can make since you know your wife and your situation the best. One caution is to be mindful of the risk associated with trust; be mindful that trust in your relationship is NOT totally ruined by continuing to dress and hiding. BUT, if that is the only option available, then that's what Mellissa needs to do.
Since we are in somewhat similar situations, good luck as you pursue the best approach and solution to a very common dilemma within our sisterhood and community.
Dragster:
Hopefully, your time of solitude together with your wife was positive and fruitful.
If I may, I would like to ask one favor. As there are many of us who do not have access and likely can't readily get our hands on a copy of the book "My Husband Betty", could you share with us a summary...sort of like a book report...of those points that you feel are the most important. Basically, it would be sort of like a descriptive list of tips and suggestions (maybe more like Rules of Engagement) that the author is recommending. That way, those of us, myself in particular, can get a headstart while we try to get a copy for our library. I believe that would be very helpful.
Lastly, thank you for sharing your thoughts and experiences with us. The best thing about this site, we can all learn from one another!
Hugs,
Paula J