Do you hate the "Gay" Label?

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Originally Posted by deja true

Is this freekin' thread still alive? Sheesh!

Well...I guess it has to be...or be replaced by another one on the very same topic.

We get so many new members each week that many of the same questions have to be answered over and over again. That's okay I guess.

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Bbbut... Does it really make sense, to keep on reinventing the wheel, over and over again? Yes, it allows newcomers to start a conversation, but the same topics repeat so very predictably - and surely when they realise that, it could actually be embarrassing?

Couldn't we somehow have some threads which stay open - or encourage people to use the search functionality? At the moment, it does feel like there is wisdom, here, but it is so very fleeting - it's never grasped and built upon? :strugglin

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Originally Posted by Nicki B

Bbbut...
Couldn't we somehow have some threads which stay open - or encourage people to use the search functionality? At the moment, it does feel like there is wisdom, here, but it is so very fleeting - it's never grasped and built upon? :strugglin

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Don't see why not!

If there can be a permanent thread on the art of tucking, for gosh sakes...

then there should be a permanent thread on a subject that causes such unnecessary grief and soul-searching to so many.

The best place to start, I think might be with DDs thread "The Final Say on the Gay Issue" ...

http://www.crossdressers.com/forums/...ad.php?t=78960

or this one...

:) :<3: :)

...and yeah, we've all gotta make more use of the Search function...AND the new TAGS function!

its a forum for goodness sakes. if you dont like a thread tittle, or are bored with the subject....dont read it.
you could apply the repeated content to just about any thread that appears here.

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Originally Posted by tvbeckytv

its a forum for goodness sakes. if you dont like a thread tittle, or are bored with the subject....dont read it.
you could apply the repeated content to just about any thread that appears here.

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But becky, we just get to 'first base' over and over again - how could we not lose some of the wisdom and then build on it, to advance all of our understanding? Or don't you think we could, or should? :strugglin

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Originally Posted by Nicki B

But becky, we just get to 'first base' over and over again - how could we not lose some of the wisdom and then build on it, to advance all of our understanding? ... :strugglin

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Yup! and we have to keep reading and commenting in the new threads with old subjects that interest us.

New ideas and new takes on old subjects, especially as important as this one, need to be constantly built on, not just re-hashed all the time.

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Originally Posted by Nicki B

But becky, we just get to 'first base' over and over again - how could we not lose some of the wisdom and then build on it, to advance all of our understanding? Or don't you think we could, or should? :strugglin

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i think perhaps you shouldnt try. you see, the real point is that the questions and replies indicate "where we are" both in the TG community and the real world. if you try to shift the perception here, you may if you very lucky change one or two peoples view (although very unlikely), but it wont be reflected anywhere else.
Besides which, im not entirely sure there are any rights and wrongs. if people wish to be homophobic, to a degree i think that is their right. as a practicing queer (you can never get enough practice), i quite like to see their irrational hypocritical ramblings outted.
No two peoples psyche are precisely alike...thats the only absolute. everything else is just opinion...including my own

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Originally Posted by Nicki B

But becky, we just get to 'first base' over and over again - how could we not lose some of the wisdom and then build on it, to advance all of our understanding? Or don't you think we could, or should? :strugglin

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For us who have been here awhile it does get repetitive and we seem to be walking through glue. I know too that when you get to a board for the first time you have to feel your way through to see where everybody is at on a topic.

I think when it comes to threads like these it would be cool if we could like vote on the different posts, a sort of here here, I agree. That way the people that don't wish to post but do read could have an anonymous say in it.

I like the idea of a sticky for these main themes too.

Love, Tracy :hugs:

From being on sites that are not just for crossdressers,Ive seen that a lot of people just assume your gay because you dress like this.I have nothing against someones preference of sexuality and it doesnt bother me to be thought of a different way.I know who I am and my friends are the ones who see me for who I am.I dont give anyone the power to bring me down with their words.It really doesnt matter to me what they say.People will always have something to say about you but its whether you allow power over you or not.

as much as i would like to say it doesn't bother me, i'm secure with my sexuality..

it's just annoying. you see a guy wearing tight girl's jeans, you automatically assume he's gay. i eat at dinner at hooters occasionally, and the busboy [who is gay, but that's besides the point] wears tight girl pants, and my friends [or even cousins] always seem to make fun of it. bothers me that a fair pecentage of society thinks this way.

:2c:

[SIZE=4]The first thing several people asked me when I told them I was transgendered and would live as a woman for the rest of my life was: "Are you gay?" (my son was one of them!)

I have absolutely nothing against gay people, and like all of them that I know.

It's just that people in general outside of the communities, have no idea of the difference between a gay male, a CD male, a CD-Gay male, and a tg woman.[/SIZE]

[SIZE=4]The attitude of many is ( and I have changed the minds of some of them!) is that if you have a penis you are male, period.[/SIZE]

It's just that people in general outside of the communities, have no idea of the difference between a gay male, a CD male, a CD-Gay male, and a tg woman.

The attitude of many is ( and I have changed the minds of some of them!) is that if you have a penis you are male, period. I am secure in my straight sexuality enough to know that if I was a bull rider I'd step in bull s**t all day and it wouldn't bother me one bit, but instead I am a CDer and as I leared it comes with many labels includeing bull s**t!

The whole crossdresser group is lumped together with everyone else that does fit in the typical hetro mold. Do I like it, Not even a little bit. I am a totally hetro male, that just happens to like to play dressup some times. It does not make me gay. Just as it does not nmake every gay person a crossdresser. But unless you are ready to step up to the plate and fight for the cause, then you just have to grin and bear it.

I am a transsexual woman living over five and a half years full-time.

The reason crossdressers get lumped in with gays and even transsexuals is the selfishness of the gay agenda.

Transsexuals are related to as third gender genderqueers who are now mocked because of the mispresumed association with gays.

The gay community is trying to push the image that crossdressers, she-males, and transsexuals are all one of the same.; that one eventually graduates to the next level. This is such bigoted non-sense.

Heterosexual coss-dressers have to suffer from this to. They cannot have the same range of expression as their female equivalent; the tomboy, due to mispresumed association with gays.

A petition to the gay media image group GLAAD ( Gays and Lesbian Alliance Against Defamation) to remove transsexuals from the transgender umbrella is available for signing at the webpage pasted below:

http://www.thepetitionsite.com/2/tra...ot-an-umbrella

A petiton can also be created for crossdressers to be removed from the transgender umbrella as well.

Wish you all the best with this.

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Originally Posted by polargirl541

I am a transsexual woman living over five and a half years full-time.

The reason crossdressers get lumped in with gays and even transsexuals is the selfishness of the gay agenda.

Transsexuals are related to as third gender genderqueers who are now mocked because of the mispresumed association with gays.

The gay community is trying to push the image that crossdressers, she-males, and transsexuals are all one of the same.; that one eventually graduates to the next level. This is such bigoted non-sense.

Heterosexual coss-dressers have to suffer from this to. They cannot have the same range of expression as their female equivalent; the tomboy, due to mispresumed association with gays.

A petition to the gay media image group GLAAD ( Gays and Lesbian Alliance Against Defamation) to remove transsexuals from the transgender umbrella is available for signing at the webpage pasted below:

http://www.thepetitionsite.com/2/tra...ot-an-umbrella

A petiton can also be created for crossdressers to be removed from the transgender umbrella as well.

Wish you all the best with this.

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But what I have found is that gays need just as much education as the lay public about gender identity. It does us no good to battle with them, we would be stronger if we were allies with them, and not enemies. I belong to the GLBT at work and we both need to understand each other better. Also, we don't have to reinvent the wheel as we try and get our message out, the gays have blazed the trail for us, we just don't have to do the things they've done to set them back.

We must not forget the Stonewall Riots in 1966 when gays came to the defense of crossdressers. I have a great deal of respect for the gay community. If anything, the CD community has not stepped up to the plate. I include myself in this by the way, I'm not a 100% out.

Now answer this truthfully: How many CD's come to the defense of other TG/TS/CD folk as well as Gay/Lesbian and Bi-sexuals in their day to day conversations with their friends, family and co-workers? Or do we chime in with them so as to not expose ourselves? It would be better not to chime in but even better if we stood up for them. In that way we would be helping ourselves and educating others.

And sorry, I do see myself under the transgender umbrella, we have more in common than we don't.

-Tracy

Good Lord! Someone wants to actually shed us of the only moderately powerful allies we've got? That's crazy!

Sure, you may not feel like a gay man, but neither does a lesbian...or a genderqueer...

We are all related, though, in a common fight against gender based discrimination.

We tend to think that there are a lot of us, because we think about us all the time. But in reality, there's are probably not enough to win a primary election in a medium sized state, even if we did all vote the same way!

D'ja ever hear this? "The enemy of my enemy is my friend."

That's the place we're in now. Without the "umbrella" of the greater LGBT community we'd be a tiny, tiny voice crying in the wilderness... Then who would we get for allies? The shoe making and lingerie making lobbies?

LikeTracy says, we gotta educate our allies so they don't do us any more injury like the "collateral damage" of the ENDA debacle. It's a pragmatic choice, until we're all ready to get dressed and get out in the streets to fight our own battles without help.

You see that happening any time soon? Me neither!

I went to a fancy dress party last year and had to walk from someone's house to the venue (with my girlfriend and her friend). A car with four teenage boys stopped and one said I looked gay.

Did I find this offensive? Yes, but only because I hate it when people don't engage their brains. I know I'm not gay, so what they thought is irrelevant. If the truth be told, at their age I would have probably mocked a bloke if I saw him walking along the street in a dress. (All the while wishing it was me wearing it :heehee:.)

Clarissa

Takes a crude and mindless person to consider it "open season" on ones sexuality,I think people are way to complex for a few cheap labels.

Yes, I do. But I'm quick with a comeback. Given that I expect this sort of thing I often come prepared with some sort of witty riposte although, given the type of people who say such things, my comeback just confuses them. Which gives me time to move on.

Considering the original question...

Out of all the nasty and hateful words that could be used, I think Gay is a very good choice. It is less clinical than homosexual etc, and the very word itself carries a positive tone, it is also single syllable so straight and to the point. I cannot personally think of a better word.

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Originally Posted by polargirl541

I am a transsexual woman living over five and a half years full-time.

The reason crossdressers get lumped in with gays and even transsexuals is the selfishness of the gay agenda.

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I'm a post-op trans female with quite a few years of experience full-time myself. I'm also a gay woman (i.e. lesbian), and I've found that for the most part, the only people who use the phrase "the gay agenda" are homophobes. There is no "gay agenda" per se, anymore than there is a secret Jewish plot to rule the world. We do wish equal rights and equal protections, but that's hardly a unique agenda -- most demographic groups share those goals with us.

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Originally Posted by polargirl541

Transsexuals are related to as third gender genderqueers who are now mocked because of the mispresumed association with gays.

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There are plenty of clueless gay people, just as there are plenty of clueless straight people (and trans people). But I've yet to hear a gay person describe transsexuals as "third gender genderqueers" (and I have lots of gay friends and spend a lot of time in queer women circles). Generalities about the attitudes of any demographic tend to be terribly flawed.

Anyway, the political alliance between gay people and trans people is useful. There have been a lot of gay people make a stand for trans rights within the past few years. I can't fathom why some people are so resentful of being associated with gay people that they want to throw that away.

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Originally Posted by Kehleyr

I can't fathom why some people are so resentful of being associated with gay people that they want to throw that away.

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This divisiveness happens among gays and lesbians as well. I know "lipstick lesbians" that are shunned by other lesbians, only because they don't portray the public's perception of a lesbian. How backward is that? The only issue for me is that someone assumes something about me that is none of their business, be it gay or whatever. My toughest days are when i'm totally in drab and someone asks me if I'm gay just because I have a pair of pink sneakers on. I was wearing a Wonder Woman shirt one day (and it happened to be a man's shirt I might add) and a woman asked me if my gf minded that I was wearing it. What the? I don't know if she was questioning my masculinity, my sexuality or has a thing against Lynda Carter!

I have read comments in other places where other CD's made comments just short of calling a gay person a f**got. Again, what the? (Almost) any group whose majority accepts me is ok by me. In the last year, I have found that many Wiccans are very accepting of me. I'm not Wiccan, but that doesn't mean I won't stand up for them. I had a lot of misconceptions about them, when I got to know them, those misconceptions went away. There are a few in the bunch that don't portray Wiccanism in a nice light and end up on dreadful talk shows, but they are the minority.

If I have to stand on the "straight" side or the "gay" side, I'd stand on the gay side.