Very well said, Rhonda ~ very well said!
Very well said, Rhonda ~ very well said!
You came to us for help, assistance, knowledge ~ so here's my stab in the dark at it! Don't jump all over me ~ your not going to hear what you want to hear. And, you're probally aren't going to like a lot of it ~ let alone agree with it.
Wow! This is already harder than I thought! LOL!
In part, because its really reaching into an very inner, secret part of myself, that I generally don't share with anyone ~ and with the one or two that I have ~ has resulted in disatrious results. (Short verison I'm 0 for 2 in the long term relationship department)
Me? I've had all kind of theries thrown at me ~ as to why I crossdress. In my childhood (age 4-5) I was dressed by my older sister and one of friends ~ as a joke. I was also sexually molested at about this age by a GG 1st cousin. I cannot really say that I was mentally, emotionally traumatized by either event.
When I was 14, my older sister moved back in ~ and in my reasoning and youthful logic ~ or I should say adolescent logic ~ reasoned that to understand girls ~ women, I should "wear their shoes" so to speak. So I tried on a pair of my sisters panties and it rapidly took off from there. First there was the panties, and then a bra, and then makeup, and then, and then to the point of ad nausem.
And yes in my adolsecence it did involve self abuse ~ but at that age ~ for most boys ~ that's pretty much happens regardless. Boys are interested in girls ~ they're a mystery to us at the age, (Heck, they're still a mystery!) and girls are interested in boys. We kiss, we hold hands, we date, we go steady ~ but back in my day sex just wasn't happening all that much ~ either that are I was running with the wrong crowd. It got better and easier once ~ I got a car! But not much! I was raised in the South ~ where there's a Church on every corner. There were girls that did ~and there were girls that didn't ~ and those that did far out-numbered the ones that didn't ~ or so I thought at the time!
And, yes I felt guilt about it, shame about it, remorse about it! I knew that the general population at large would not be recepetive to it, of it. And, at first it was a panty fetish,................at first. And, at first, once I got to traveling down this merry road ~ it became cyclical. Adolesnce arousal, don panties ~ self abuse ~ remorse ~ gulit, ~ shame! Couldn't get out of those panties fast enough.
But, let me tell you how other boys were handling it! They were having sex with each other. Were they gay ~ no! Bi-sexual ~ again no! They later went on to marry, have wives, families ~ children. They did it because they were adolesent, were sexually frustrated, and needed a outlet. Chaulk it up to so much adolescent expermintation ~ nothing more and nothing less. And in my small rural Alabama town of 700, there were just as many girl with girls going on ~ (fear of pregnacy ~ disease, etc) as vice versa. I know this because I was approached by any number of boys at the time ~ and I turned them all down ~ although not in a judgemental way ~ I just told them that wasn't my cup of tea.
At 18, I couldn't get out of that "Dead Man's" town quick enough. I KNEW there wasn't a future there for me ~and coming from a long line of poor Southern dirt farmers, (and I do mean poor) I joined the Marine Corps at age 18.
In part to put that town behind me! In part to validate my masculinity~ in part to prove and earn my masculinity. (Such the thinking of an 18 year old)
I did four years, and got out of the Corps ~ and was out for all of 96 days. Ran back to recuriters office, begging to get back in ~ because there wasn't - and still aren't a lot of opportunies here. Even if you have a college degree.
Meet a girl, got married during a "pepper sprout" tried living down my CD desires. Tried being the husband, the father to her daughter from another man. Talked the talk ~ walked the walk as a career Marine, as a husband, as father to her daughter! A long come my daughter~ the race is on! The pressure is on! A few short years later ~ along comes my son. I'm on the drill field ~that's right a United States Marine Corps Drill Instructor ~ Parris Island, South Carolina.
I'm so stressed out, I'm 28 years old laying in bed with chest pains ~ STRESS!
A couple of month's later ~ I grow a knot on my forehead ~ half the size oof a golfball ~ again ~ STRESS! I'm running daily 6 or more miles a day ~ and I'm stressed out!
Guess who comes visiting? Dana! Hello! At that particular point in time ~ yes ~it was most definately an escape thing ~ a de-stress thing! At that point in time ~I most definately was thinking that if I had been born a woman, been a woman ~ that I wouldn't have been going through all the crap that I was going through. I was going through the mud, the blood, and the beer along with the tears! Thing is, I hadn't seen "nuthing" yet!
Gernada, Beruit, Panama, the first Gulf War. Stress? At Parris Island, I didn't have a freaking clue!
So, I retired from the Corps! I'm thinking I'm on easy street! I've just arrive. Little did I know~! I'm back out here in the real world! The day to day! I've not a clue! I really don't! I stumbling and fumbling thorugh the goal post of life, just trying to make a first down! Forget a touchdown!
Why do I crossdress ~ or at least desire to do so! "D" answere ~ all the above! I'm envious of women's choices in and with most everything. Women have the option of being weak~ I don't! Women have the option of being in-ept! I don't! Women can be pampered, romanced, sought after, desired, appreciated, pursued ~ what man has ever experienced that? Women have the option of being "fickle" ~ I don't!
I've got to be the guy that has all the answers to all of the questions ~ the solutions to all of the problems! I've got to make the firs move ~ with you as a woman. I've got to walk this walk, and talk this talk. And on and on, and on~! I've got to play this role!
I hear you ~and you shouldn't be complacient in DEMANDING that your DH fullfill YOUR wants, needs of and as a woman! Being with a guy that dresses in women's clothing, and masturbating to the effect ~ is NOT one of your Top 10 fantasies!
That does NOT make him a bad guy!
Youl (IMHO) say to him ~ this is workable! This is do"able! But, I've got needs and wantS, and desires as a WOMAN! I TOO have wants, needs, and desires as a WOMAN!
Brina:
He is still the same person you fell in love with, if you chose, over time you will either accept his dressing or you will reject it, chances are that you will both find a common ground and move on.
I can say this, he LOVES you allot, yes he may have not told you first off, maybe he was scared of losing you...........
I cannot explain my desires to dress, I have been doing so since I was little, I am married and yes she knows and is accepting of it.
For me it seems that I get into this zone, kinda like getting a craving for something sweet to eat, I just HAVE to dress, I do go out to "girls nites out" every month (where 40~50 of US show up) to hang out, dance and BS.
I can say that I have NO interest in men, dressed or otherwise, I LOVE women....and their clothes....hehehehhehe I am strong as a man and as Mistress Tara....funny huh?
I know it is hard but put yourself in his shoes..er um heels.....he has told you his deepest inner secret.....he could have kept silent but this came out and doing so exposed himself to you...
In closing:
Humans are really amazing, we can lose loved ones to death and in time we learn to overcome.......
Tara
OK, my 2 cents.
Brina has asked "why" several times. And the responses to "why" have been varied but mostly followed the theme of "born with it." While that is certainly a dominant theme here, there are other possibilities.
One is based in Learning Theory. One possibility why some men find wearing women's clothes so exciting has been explained using the Pavlovian Conditioning theory. If you recall, Pavlov was the scientist who discovered that he could make dogs salivate when he rang a bell if he paired the bell ringing with placing meat powder on the dogs tongue. It was the pairing of the the two stimuli, (bell and meat powder), that did the trick. The dogs began to associate the sound of the bell with the taste of the meat.
It is just as possible to pair something that would not ordinarily be sexually stimulating with sexual stimulations derived from "normal" sexual contact.
Are you still with me?
In our culture it is very common to have female underwear paired with sexual stimulation. Since, it is common to have physical contact with female underwear during foreplay. And, as it happens, many boys had much of their early masturbatory experiences exposed to lingerie, either through magazines, movies, or the home laundry basket. And, since mom's or sister's drawers or laundry allows a more intimate experience with the underwear than just looking at it, many boys learn that wearing it provides a very satisfying stimulation.
Like it or not, this is a perfectly normal, (psychologically speaking), way to establish our early sexual stimulation criteria.
(I know I guy who had a fetish for white cotton panties. It developed while he was going through purbety. He had a paper route that had him delivering the morning paper to a womans house at the same time that she was dressing in front of an open window each morning. It was just coincidence that he was going through that stage of puberty at the same time as his exposure to his customers morning show, but it followed him through his life.)
In fact, this early conditioning exposure to women's underwear is so common that it has sparked a huge lingerie industry among the allegedly "normal".
Some of us have taken it a lot further. Since our generation did not have the easy access to actual sex at an early age that the kids of today enjoy, many of us developed a pretty involved masturbatory regimen. Using what ever stimulation was available.
Which brings us to the transvestic fetishist. Someone who has learned that wearing womens clothes is sexually stimulating. This learning usual takes place in the early years where intercourse is not available, but access to the stimulation of women's clothes is. This Pavlovian Conditioning is a powerful thing, and in the absence of serious motivation to change, not going away easily.
Oddly, enough, crossdressing is much like alcoholism in that CDing, like the bottle, is a reliable friend. It is much easier to predict the result of a sexual CDing event than it is to predict the outcome of a date. CDing does not desert you over some misunderstood comment, poor body hygiene, or change in financial status.
However, in the area of transvestic fetishists, it can be changed. It needs two things. One, is motivation. The motivation to abandon a life long friend that can be relied on to make us feel good when we feel bad, give us sexual satisfaction when we can't get a date to save our lives, and to give us an identity that, for good or bad, tells us we exist in this world as a unique individual. And, two, change requires the same kind of Pavlovian Conditioning experience that set it up in the first place. To see this in action I recommend you rent the movie 'Clockwork Orange".
Actually, Clockwork Orange shows the use of Conditioning to change someone who wasn't really all that motivated.
The good news for Briana, and other wives faced with a fetishist, is the description above for motivation. If a wife can meet that criteria and become the "lifelong friend" in place of the CDing, over time the CDing can fade into the background. But, of course, being a human, there may be a slip up occasional. In those instances, a resurgence of CDing behavior may reappear. In one sense, the husband and wife can see this as a sign that the relationship could use a bit of tweaking. Or that the wife is tired of playing to his needs all the time, and is happy to let the CDing meet his needs for a while so she can rest. An astute CDing husband will note that he has the responsibility to be the same person for his wife that he expects her to be for him. And, as the CDing returns, he needs to insure that, as his needs are being met outside the relationship by CDing, if he doesn't want her to look outside the relationship as well, he had better be extra attentive to her needs during this time.
Good grief! This turned out a lot longer than I had anticipated. But it is a complicated area, and I didn't want to be too simplistic. There is, of course, a lot more to this. And since we haven't heard from her husband, we are all speculating more than I'm comfortable with. (I also like the theory that some of us are into it as a sort of reverse Penis envy. Women, after all, have a sort of power men can never achieve. But that is a whole different thread.)
Good luck.
Girls She don't care what you say. She's on Her own road " ranting " and She's correct and everyone else is wrong.
I'd say close this thred Tamara!
Please Please Please!
Tammy and many more on here have tried to help guide this Girl to what is wrong in her relationship. Like telling family secrets etc. She evidently don't care. So that is why I said close this thred!
Briana has all the answers, and if She chooses not to use them, then its on her.
I wasn't going to come back to this thred. But, I did see the number count go up big time. So I had to read them. (( Wooo )) It's more of the same actually in most cases.
We all can't be wrong!
Bri is not listening, She's reading just to rant back at us. Oh, and then She's out there, I mean out there. What woman in Her right mind, would do the things to someone they love, like She's done. I would bet some of what She's said to her Husband, will never be repaired. Once you say something it really never is earased. It's in the other persons mind forever, even after you say your sorry and all.
I'm not addressing Briana, But my Sisters on here. If you say anymore to this ((Girl)), your wasting your breath unless She starts to admit She's been wrong. On many issues!
Hi Vicky.. Wow! Time well spent.... A superb piece!!!
Haley... There's a bit more to this than whether it's right or wrong to "Out" someone, and you're sounding like you enjoy a bone to pick. Vicky has shown that there is much to be gained from looking at all angles, and allowing a little time and space for another viewpoint.
Your bitterness and anger at your loss seems to be bubbling here, but time spent working all hours to bring home the bacon, is an error I've been guilty of, when all the family wanted was quality time with me and I couldn't see it. Fortunately I didn't suffer the outcome you and others have done, but it was my mistake all the same.
Maybe we can't all agree, but we can learn if we keep an open mind. Innit?
Ommmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm
I just found out about my husband 1 week ago today. I have been on the internet searching info on many sights but this is the first forum I have accessed looking for support . How amazing the first thread I find is yours which has provided me with so much insight by everyone's reply's. I can Identify with the anger you expressed when you found out about your Husbands cd In my case though, I did make it clear to my husband that I was not mad at him but I did have alot of anger I had to resolve. Part of the grieving process I guess. Fortunately I did work through the anger fairly quickly. Afterall I can't change the way things are only the way I feel about them but yet I have emotionalized internally to the point of feeling sick. So many things to figure out and accept. The feeling of Isolation and not being able to share this one thing with my Best friend who I know would understand. The worry that someone would know something was bothering me and and it might come pouring out. Happy for my husband that he has a burden lifted from him but now I have one on me. So many questions and not enough answers. ETC. ETC. I would describe myself as a high maintenace women. I take care of myself, go to the gym, do the makeup hair and clothes and take pride in my appearance. I want to look good for my own feelings of self esteam and hope to think it means something to my husband that I try to look good. Like wise I want my man to look handsome and after 33 years together I think it's great that I still find him handsome and when I see him in Uniform with a badge and gun it is a turn on for me. That right I'm married to a cop a really macho guy. So one of my fears was that I would lose my "man" and our sex life would suffer because somehow if he was En Fem it would make me somehow feel like a Lesbian even though I felt totally open to him wearing articles of female attire in bed if he wanted to. He has been so wonderful to me since this has all come out and I feel such deep love and compassion for him and what this has put him through so being the passionate person I am I want to make love to him all the time now. The love making also helps to aliviate my fears of loss of his masculinity. The sex bonds us and it gives me the assurance that nothing has really changed, he is still the man I love I am not losing that. He is totally leaving it up to me as to how I want to handle things. He will keep his female side to himself if I so wish but I don't because it is part of him and I'm trying to understand it. So far he hasn't done anything different cause he doesn't want to rush me even though I told him I was ready for him wear some sexy female clothes in bed. He does have a female personna that I am nervous to meet but I have decided I want to be part of helping "her" with putting herself together clothes, hair makeup etc. We figure if he does it, it will be too much of a shock for me and we both know it will quite frankly most likely look kinda of silly and I don't want my reaction to make him feel bad. I will also be an act of love on my part which will be meaningful to both of us. I don't know how I'm gonna feel when I see "Her" but I am gonna have an open mind and just see how it goes. Even though I was very understanding from the start. I am feeling much better about things now than a week ago. This thing has made me look at myself and my preconcieved Ideas and really helped me grow as a person. I know it's still gonna be a difficult adjustment but I am gonna try me best. Something I read in a pamplet my husband gave was a bible verse that I have found very helpful Love is patient, love is kind. It does not envy, it does not boast, it is not proud. It is not rude, it is not self-seeking, it is not easily angered, it keeps no record of wrongs. Love does not delight in evil but rejoices with the truth. It always protects, always trusts, always hopes, always perseveres. Love never fails. (I Corinthians 13:4-8) I guess I should have made my first post in the introduction area and started a new thread but this one has helped me alot cause we are kinda going through the same thing at the same time so I hope maybe we've helped each other and next time we can meet up in the GG section which is where I plan on going next for some support. Best of luck to both of us!!
I do not know now.
Much earlier today I replied to Brina remarking that it was good to know what she meant by the "YUK" of femininity.
I slept on that. Woke to the thought that a cheerleader etc is a female flaunting femininity and depending on the circs, sex.
Given that there is also her belief that the female body is off putting to her. Is such a body and display not generally considered as a sex object or as a role model ? What does Brinna consider it as ?
If either or both then there we have the tomboy inhabiting a physical body that is unloved by its owner. A person that is doing nothing to produce the appearance of a caring wife of her husband, let alone a cared for female body. that alone is a contradiction and there are too many contradictions in this character.
Does anybody remember that a crossdressing discovery started this epic and the outing of her husband ?
Is this somebody who wants help, or is it somebody who wants attention ?
Let me second that!!!! and send a big welcome Glenda. :thumbsup:Quote:
Originally Posted by Glenda Grant
Just 1 week !!! Some wives never get this far, never get over having "found out" and the shock it can bring to the relationship. Posted in this thread it just reinforces how different personalities deal with the realities of life. We can't expect to know how others would react, surprises are so normal!
I'm delighted that two GGs are newly here working at finding out how they will deal with this severe "curve-ball". I hope you both find what you are seeking, and you bring your partners along soon.
Hugs Ellaine :)
WELCOME and GOOD LUCK!!!!:DQuote:
Originally Posted by Glenda Grant
Brina,
I am simply overcome by your utter lack of wisdom or intellect. Your writing style alone gives it away. My guess is you are an immature 12 year old if not you act that way. I've just read page after page of excellent advice. Real wisdom that was given freely in an effort to help. Was it worth while for cross-dressers yes, for you not at all.
You have shown us how careless you are, how dishonest you are and you revel in you're own self disdain. You have made claims which are wholly untrue. So just how many lies about your past have you told him, is it hundreds or thousands. I know, I know "but those don't count".
I know I'm not "macho" enough for you even after six years in the Special Forces and owning a construction company. I'm certainly not rich enough since I make a paltry $125.00 per hour. Even though I'm quite active in the BDSM community as a dominant that just is not controlling enough either. It's sad that no man will ever be good enough for you.
If only you could find a "real" man that doesn't cry. I do that to. What a pitiful excuse of a man I am. When I bailed hay on my parents farm and rode bulls with my dad, I wasn't a man. I was just pretending. I only have an I.Q. of 198, I sure wish I were smarter. I'm in the genius range but still I'm not good enough.
You're obviously more of a man than I could ever be. You lie, and hate women. You're vindictive and spiteful. All qualities that a well rounded person should aspire to have. I wish I could be as intolerant as you are. Would that make me a man Brina? Probably not.
That must be why you're last husband left. He just wasn't good enough either. Did he not drink enough or not beat you up as often as you wanted while you were "large and in charge" or was it your insistence on dressing like a man that drove him away.
Over and over you've told how "manly" you are. Do you even own a dress? Of course you don't. A woman own a dress that just would not be proper. How dare someone shatter you're vision of womanhood. High heels, you must be kidding, makeup heavens no. Girls don't wear that.
Perhaps it was you veiled insults or demeaning tone that did it. Hey that's what guys do right? You are the authority on the subject. A self proclaimed "bitch". Now that's impressive, just what every guy want's. Before I met my current and wonderful SO that's what I looked for in a mate. Uncaring, delusional, needy and above all so selfless it made Jesus look like a slacker. Golly I wish I could be like you. I really pity you Brina. I really do.
It saddens me that you will never know and understand trust or love. I wish you could enjoy sex which I know you don't. It must be painful to be so uptight all the time. Never being able to relax and enjoy life. Most of all I feel sorry for the children who will be emotionally detached just like you. With the examples of disdain and intolerance you're setting how could they not be.
I hope you leave him, so he can find someone who is worthy of his love and affection. You certainly are not.
Normally, I would heavily edit posts like some of the ones I have been reading, for there has been an awful lot of inflammatory things being written(to say the least). But since this thread was created and repeatedly stoked by a troll I have relaxed my vigilance.
My tolerance, however, has come to an end in regards to the heavy passion this fraud has provoked and any further posting is just adding kindling to the fire. Everything that can be said has been said many times, at least until the author of this piece of fiction ups the ante once again.
And as for you Brina -- sell your story elsewhere.