I copied my subject line from today's headlines. I didn't read the story for they get so evasive on the policies and all. So all I did was grin as I read it and I had this thought: what if I walked into a recrutiers office looking just as I do in my avatar and said, hey I'm here to join the marines. Does your camos come in pink? And do you all have government issued panties?? If so, I want mine with the lace and if it's not too much to ask, could I get "Tara Rose" inscribed on my M-16???
You can only ask !! LOLQuote:
Originally Posted by Tara1967
Love Gina x
Openly gay, not openly crossdresser.
Seriously, if the military must recognize and accommodate openly gay members, how about those who are otherwise transgendered? Must the military allow a member to wear a female uniform if the member identifies and prefers to present as feminine? And not get their hair buzzed? etc etc
If a transgendered member chooses not to bunk with straight males, can straight males choose not to bunk with the transgendered? Just wondering.
Saw It, This was coming. I worked in the uniform dept. at the MCSS at Ft L---- until Dec 09. The Army was not kicking out openly G L soldiers and they were really open about it. At the time they needed every body and still do. Even saw some crossdressers at Halloween come in. Nothing was said.
Saw it all
Good to see you guys are finally catching up, been in the UK forces and openly gay for over 10 years now. If you are actually transitioning and living as a female, you will be in female accom. Most places have single rooms now, so that doesn't tend to be an issue. There will always be bigots and it does happen occasionally, but there is a succesful MTF pilot here and various others around the UK.
Yes, you could ask that. But of course the answer would be no. You wear what they tell you, do what they tell you... ( tangent: the "Bruno" movie is priceless )
Back to the subject, this period will be evidence that the military doesn't fall apart when gay people serve openly.
Transexuals are not allowed in the US military. And the transgendered thing is like the don't ask don't tell policy, if your caught or you tell someone, they will kick you out.Quote:
Originally Posted by NicoleScott
My guess is that the only thing that will change for now with crossdressing will be that you wont be kicked out if your caught doing it on your own time. On duty the uniform requirements will stand.
i am glad i am not in the army. sorry if this get people hurt. but i would not be very happy having to bunk with a guy getting his rocks off in the shower looking at me. or if he was to give blood, or have it spill on me. the homosexual group is the largest (in numbers. and most likely) to have aids.
sure some people do not care, some do. and having to split up the troops like this, men here, women there, men who like men over there, women who like women down there, men in dresses across the street, women who dress like men down the block, those who believe they are in the wrong body on the second floor. etc,etc. how many ways to divide us as a people. this is why the term g-i-joe (government issued joe)came about.
now i know this law by a judge (judges can not make law as per the US Constitution, only congress has been authorized to do this)(article 1 section 9, article 3 section 1 and 2, amendment 10, maybe 11, ) is only the opening of a sore, and all this has already been in the service...but now a wedge will be splitting the people in service apart.
just my thoughts.with this said i have noting ageist those not like me. if i did i would be at odds with the whole world.
there will be problems in the services..not like they are not there now...just gives the bad seeds more reason to do such.
.
Hi sisters, I wrote this thread as being a light hearted and hopefully humurous thread. I was sort of looking for something like a saturday night live skit or something like that. I just feel good tonight and was looking for humor tonight on this thread. I know you all mean well, but I know that once you sign the dotted line, you belong to them and if they want your opinion, they will give it to you. Lighten up my sisters, if you walked up to the recruiter, totally en femm, what would you request? Would it be something like private benjimen?????.........................love everyone...Tara
Lol, I actually like not being in the military. So when a recruiter asks if I want to sign up, I just say no thanks. Now if uncle sam decided to say that I am going to sign up, I would be like "Do you really want to go there?" Because I would have no problems showing up to MEPS as my other half, lol. Kind of reminds me of all the movies where the two dudes try to get out by saying they are gay.
So you want it light hearted Tara, how about this. Its not about CDing per say but when dealing with the Marines of my time there wasnt enough thought process to distinguish gay from crossdresser.Quote:
Originally Posted by rosuto
So back in the day, ( can you tell I love to watch Pawn Stars) There were always those who talked about ways of getting out of the USMC. Claiming you were gay was a common one. The problem was we all figured that as luck would have it we would get an officer who would want proof and proceed to unzip. So the consensus was, unless you were ready to kneel and open wide, that there were better ways to get out of the Corps.
Having been in the service long before "Don't Ask Dont Tell", I can assure you that there always have been gay people in the military. So, with or w/o the policy (btw, it's not in the Consitution), all of these things you've mentioned were potentially present....just as they are at the locker room at Lifetime Fitness, etc. Oddly enough, the rest of the modern world has been able to openly include gay people without any signficant problems.Quote:
Originally Posted by Loni
Thought the uk learned that back in the 50's through 60's lol . I think it makes more sense to have troops open about it. i said this b4 somewhere. but if your open you cant be blackmailed with it :)Quote:
Originally Posted by Beth Wilde
thinks back to the gang of 5 ;)
Yeah, I get that the OP ment this thread as light hearted. :)
FWIW.. "Openly gay" in the context at hand simply means that you do not have to hide the fact if you are gay.
You still have to meet the standard recruting criteria and show that you show good miltary potenial.
That is very ignorant. First, they shouldn't let in HIV-positive people no matter what their sexual orientation. Secondly, gay people don't "get their rocks off" in the shower, they same way that crossdressers don't "get their rocks off" using the womens restroom. There ARE gay people in the US Army now, and they function just as well as heterosexuals. When you are in combat, nobody is thinking about sex.Quote:
Originally Posted by Loni
On a more humorous note: When I was in the Army, I brought pink toilet paper to the field; then nobody would steal it from me.
Unfortunately uniforms are pretty much standard.:)
Having just retired from the Army I can tell you that there are a lot of people that are not too happy about this and some will not be accomodating at all. The other side of this, for those who are gay, is that the ones that are not accepting will either learn to tolerate or just leave the service. Gays have been serving in the military for years and most probably for centuries and my personal opinon (for what it's worth) is that I would have cared less just as long as it isn't a distraction or interferes with the mission. Just because a soldier is gay doesn't mean he is going to attack you and rape you or anything because you are you. I would hope most will keep their senses about them and realize that during duty hours is not the time for such behavior. If not they will be dealt with like any other soldier who breaks the rules.
Jeannie
The Log Cabin Republicans are a branch of the Republican Party. I was not sure if many people are aware of that. They are affiliated with the Republicans so this law suit might have recieved party funds to support their position. I bring this up because this not something that most people would affiliate that party with. Its possible that many small people who are registered as Republicans are even aware that the LCR's have been around a while. At least for 20 years and always sending representatives and giving presentation at the party state conventions.
However, the 9th circuit has cut short the celebration: they ruled in favor of a stay and are allowing the military to go back to enforcing DADT.
I have a great friend at the church I belong to who was a drop dead gorgeous female impersonator during WW2. The Special Services (no pun intended) had several unofficially recognized but government sanctioned entertainment groups that included several FIs. They were not well publicized BUT he has the pics and documentation as proof of the sanctioned and organized existence of these groups.
On the gay soldier front, first I doubt there is anyone -gay man or lesbian- actively seeking enlistment for the purpose of having a tryst with another soldier. When anyone is wounded they bleed red -gay or straight. I am appalled at anyone making jokes about military service, especially now.
In its rampant homophobia, the military and fed government discharged over 1,500 specially trained and certified Arabic and Farsi interpreters that were trained by our gov because they were supposedly gay and therefore a possible target for blackmail by foreign governments. This action of course pales in comparison IMO to promoting a militant muslim officer with access to patient medical records and a known terrorist leaning to a position of authority and then allowing him access to weapons when the American born soldiers around him were prohibited from carrying weapons on post.
Openly gay or lesbian soldiers deserve our thanks and appreciation just the same as police, firemen, medical personnel or anyone else volunteering to put their lives on the line. Jokes or patently stupid and totally uninformed comments about this are thoroughly inappropriate.
I think jokes are always OK if not intended to insult. It started as self-humor about crossdressing, which is perfectly acceptable. The sad part is that subsequent posts show some homophobia even here. I can understand reservations about undressing in front of gay men, but almost everyone here has already done so at some point.Quote:
Originally Posted by Christinedreamer
The really stupid part of "don't ask, don't tell" is that it really does put homosexuals in a position to be blackmailed, which is the only legitimate fear. It is much better if they can be open about it.
I am appalled to read this, although in one respect I do appreciate you being brutally honest as to how you feel about this - as clearly it's an attitude that still exists with some people, and no doubt with some people serving in the armed forces.Quote:
Originally Posted by Loni
The problem is that it's an ignorant attitude to have. Firstly, people who give blood are HIV-tested, so there's no danger there, be the donor gay or straight. Secondly, HIV only survives for a short time outside of the body, so the chance of environmental infection (blood spillage being exactly that) is extremely remote - the spilled blood would have to immediately (with as little exposure to the air as possible) get inside your own blood stream in order for there to be a chance of you becoming infected. Thirdly, I doubt any solder (gay or straight) would indulge in such a personal act ("getting his rocks off") in a public arena (i.e. in front of anyone), and if one was to do such a thing, then I think the act itself would be offensive enough before we even begin to consider what (or rather who) is running through the mind of the person indulging in it.
Finally, the "split" that you talk about is only possible because of the attitudes of people such as yourself. Thus it is people who hold similar views to yourself who have to change so as to avoid the scenario of "having to split up the troops". Using the negative attitude towards crossdressers that still exists within society as an analogy, wouldn't you agree that it is the attitude of those who harbour such a negative view towards the transgendered community that has to change, or would you say crossdressers should just willfully hide in a closet so as not to offend their sensitivities?
Well, I'm not gay, but I would think that a gay male, just as a straight male, would not have sex with just anyone, so refusing to "kneel and open wide" would not prove anything about your sexual prefference.Quote:
Originally Posted by CharleneCD
What a load of homophobic crap. You might as well lock your door and never leave the house again, because there are Gays everywhere, and we aren't going away. If you have ever been in a locker room at school or at the gym, chances are there was a Gay man there at some point. I bet he wasn't getting his rocks off in the shower either. There is no difference between a Gay man being open about himself and who he loves and a straight man doing the same. Quite frankly, it gets old having to listen to the straights talking about their wife/girlfriend all the time. If a Gay man is not allowed to be open about who he loves, the same rule should apply to straight people as well. Face it, some dudes marry dudes, and some chicks marry chicks...get over it...it's not going away.Quote:
Originally Posted by Loni
You might have started this thread with the intent of keeping it light, but the issue that you yourself had as a subject header "Military recruiters told they can accept openly gay applicants" is a serious topic for many in our communinity.Quote:
Originally Posted by Tara1967
Sometimes we must step aside and realize that some things are bigger than us.
Well everyone, I'm sorry I was just trying to be humorous and yes it is a serious topic. I have never been in the military, but if I was, I wouldn't have a problem with a fellow soldier being gay. If he stuck to the rules then there would be no problem for me personally. It was just upon reading that headline on a news site, I just had the thought, what about crossdressers in the milltary. After all, not all cd's are gay, maybe some. I do wonder what would be the military stance on straight crossdresser? Yes I know they would have to wear government issued fatigues and all. But would they release from the military if a soldier was found to be a cd and went home to his wife and children everyday? Would they implore the steriotypical views that the "so much of society" have and oust him for being a CD?
I didn't mean for anyone to get offended, but I am a little surprised that some CD's here are homphobic but are not CD phobic. I mean it's like a straight CD saying I want acceptance from society, then at the same time objects or is unaccepting of gays!Some on here are that way, it really does baffle me.....Tara
Well it looks like the Pentagon got its "Stay" on the original ruling in the appeal hearing, so DADT is back in full swing. I hope nobody outed themselves thinking it was safe.
I misread it at first,
Thought it said "Military recruiters told they can accept only gay applicants"
I think DADT's days are numbered even with the stay. But realistically I think this is going to be the single biggest change that will improve societies perception of the LGBT community. When people see that the military doesn't turn into some weird pink orgy (akin to Loni's perspective) they will see that it isn't a big deal. The integration of African Americans into the Armed Forces helped to make huge strides in equal rights, and I honestly think the same will happen with homosexuality.
I can see many more people aspiring to wear the "pinks and greens" of the US Army Officer Corps(now obsolete).
I was in the Navy long before DADT. It was also long before women on ships. The militay fought against women in combat areas and the Navy fought against women on ships. That has all changed now and the military is still able to do its job. The first women in these roles took a lot of cr@p and many still do.
DADT will be history some time in the near future and the military will survive this as well. And yes, the first openly gay folks will get a lot of cr@p and there will be some courts-martial about some of the things that will happen.
I am not gay and I know many of my old Navy shipmates who aren't gay and actively support the end of DADT. The guys I know ralize that it is an asinine policy and that it is time to end it.
Hey Pat. "Pink and Greens" went out pretty much with the end of WWII as I remember. We Cadet Officers wore them in the Junior ROTC in high school for at least 17 years afterward. They were so cool.Quote:
Originally Posted by Alberta_Pat
Makes today's Army uniforms seem way too drab. The efforts of the military to create a more attractive uniform with colored backgrounds and shoulder cords for the branch of the Army and the berets has always struck me a pretty lame. I'd much rather have something I actually earned decorating my uniform rather than some stuff deemed by the beaurocracy necessary to make the uniform look appealing. I always loved the airborne glider patch and bloused boots and jump wings associated with graduation from jump school. Hell, that was an achievement! Especially for a skinny kid who was way too tall but could run all day.
You could sew a silver dollar or was it a half dollar under that glider patch and use it like a mace in case of trouble. The peace time Army is just a bunch of soldiers who really have no need to trust one another. It's just sort of like thousands of guys looking out for number one. In battle, things are different. You need to trust the guy behind you to cover your rear. The key word here is trust. If he is gay and you are young and unsure of your own sexuality and a homophobe to boot there is bound to be some tension here. DADT was about as good a policy as the military and our politicians could come up with at the time, and I personnally think it is still a good policy for men and women at arms. Sometimes it's just better that we don't know about each other's fantasies.